Would you consider this as "Dating?"

[Iceee]

Salaam.
Would you consider this dating or just a friendship?

Last year I went to Tim Hortons to grab a coffee and was looking for a place to sit when I realized all the tables were taken. I looked around and then a elderly woman gave me a "come here" hand gesture and motioned for me to sit down across her. We talked, I made jokes, told her about school, exams, studying, friends, religion also and more stuff. She listened and I listened to her talk as well:

She is 67 (or in her late 60's) years old. Alhumdulillah.
Widow with no children.
Lives alone in a house, nothing to do so she comes to drink coffee.

She told me to come again to the coffee shop. I told her I don't have money for food, I rarely ever eat/drink outside food. She said she would pay... I like when people pay for me (movies, food, drinks) so I decided to come again and again. The two of us would talk during my lunch break from school. We talk about a new topic everyday. She would always pay for my lunch and that is why I would come and talk to her. (even though I bring lunch from home).

This has been going on for 2 months, 5 times a week.
I never was actually "alone" with her, we're always inside the store.
However she did ask if I wanted a ride to school since I don't have my own car or if I wanted to come see her home. I say no.

[Iceee]

Salaam.

Ja'Zakullah for allowing me to post.

[Alpha Dude]

Didn't your mother tell you not to talk to strangers? :skeleton:

Dating involves being romantically attached. So, unless you both have romantic feelings, it's just a unique friendship.

[Muezzin]

If someone decides this is considered 'dating', you do realise you would be doing this activity with a 67 year old woman, right?

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[Insaanah]

:sl:

Dating involves being romantically attached. So, unless you both have romantic feelings, it's just a unique friendship.

The question is, is dating the bottom line of what's not allowed in Islam, or is there more to it than that? For example, we know that it is disallowed for a man and woman who are not mahrams, to be alone together, regardless of whether there are romantic feelings. Simply, it is that seclusion or being alone together which isn't allowed.

In effect, you're meeting a non-mahram female, without any real necessity. While for older (Muslim) women, the Qur'an says they can opt not to wear the outer covering garment they'd wear over their clothes, it says that it's better to refrain (24:60). Her age here makes no difference though to being alone with a non-mahram male, as the verses and ahadeeth on hijaab and intergender relations take no account of age, other than pre-puberty.

Also, you're taking unnecessary favours from her (e.g. her paying for your food). Never take unnecessary favours from anyone. They can backfire on you. She may ask you a favour you're uncomfortable doing, but because she's paid for your food, you'll feel an obligation. You could be steering yourself into a corner there.

Even if you are in a public place, doesn't make it much better. There's no one else that's party to your conversation. Imagine if a Muslim girl went out and met a 67 year old non-mahram man, every day, even in a public place. It wouldn't be right or acceptable. And if you swap the genders in that situation, the same applies.

And Allah knows best.

[Ali_008]

:wasalamex

Even if you are in a public place, doesn't make it much better. There's no one else that's party to your conversation. Imagine if a Muslim girl went out and met a 67 year old non-mahram man, every day, even in a public place. It wouldn't be right or acceptable. And if you swap the genders in that situation, the same applies.

That sums it up pretty well.

[Iceee]

:sl:



The question is, is dating the bottom line of what's not allowed in Islam, or is there more to it than that? For example, we know that it is disallowed for a man and woman who are not mahrams, to be alone together, regardless of whether there are romantic feelings. Simply, it is that seclusion or being alone together which isn't allowed.

In effect, you're meeting a non-mahram female, without any real necessity. While for older (Muslim) women, the Qur'an says they can opt not to wear the outer covering garment they'd wear over their clothes, it says that it's better to refrain (24:60). Her age here makes no difference though to being alone with a non-mahram male, as the verses and ahadeeth on hijaab and intergender relations take no account of age, other than pre-puberty.

Also, you're taking unnecessary favours from her (e.g. her paying for your food). Never take unnecessary favours from anyone. They can backfire on you. She may ask you a favour you're uncomfortable doing, but because she's paid for your food, you'll feel an obligation. You could be steering yourself into a corner there.

Even if you are in a public place, doesn't make it much better. There's no one else that's party to your conversation. Imagine if a Muslim girl went out and met a 67 year old non-mahram man, every day, even in a public place. It wouldn't be right or acceptable. And if you swap the genders in that situation, the same applies.

And Allah knows best.

Salaam.

Your comment is true.
She I guess just wanted to talk to someone, maybe that's why she paid for me. (I'll tell her to date someone)
I accept everything given to me for free... That's probably a bad thing in this case.

I secured myself a job so now I guess I can pay for the lunch for myself. But I'll choose to save up for a car. I shall not talk to this elderly woman again... May Allah Subhanahuwatallah forgive me for my sins.

Salaam. Ja'Zakullah once again.

[Abdul Fattah]

Aselam aleykum
I hope regardless of your decision, that you are diplomatic about it. We don't want her thinking that Islam doesn't allow giving the elder company do we? So best be carefull how you explain yourself. If this woman was really lonely, for all you know these meetings were her high-point of the week. Obviosly I'm not suggesting that you shouldn lie about your reasons, just that if you decide to explain, that you undertand the emotions which might be involved and make sure you explain everything properly.

[May Ayob]

:sl:

She is 67 years old,widow,with no children and lives alone. Maybe she feels lonely? and she thought you were an interesting person that's why she talks with you. I think you shouldn't be taking favors from her or from anyone because you never know what they will ask you to do in return of that favor and sometimes it's hard to turn them down because there will be emotional blackmailing going on. I don't think you should immediately cut her off but how about telling her about your mom or some women in the local masjid and then you can introduce her to your mother and she can take over from there?. But if she disagrees and doesn't show any interest in meeting your mother then I'd advise you to keep your gaurds up and be more carefull, also keep in mind that in the end you have to pay her back before you completely stop your interaction with her, maybe getting a job and collecting enough money to pay her back by paying for her lunch just as much as she did for yours if you can't keep track ofthe amount of money she spent on your lunches then how about buying her a gift that costs as much as the estimated value, then you can politely tell her that you can't meet with her regualrly like you used to please don't give her the cold shoulder you don't really know her intentions anyway please be kind and polite with her, and hopefully everything turns out good.