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View Full Version : West training Syrian rebels in Jordan Exclusive: UK and French instructors involved
سيف الله
03-08-2013, 05:21 PM
Salaam
Looks like Western powers are becoming more overt in their desire to manipulate the outcome of the Syrian conflict.
UK and French instructors involved in US-led effort to strengthen secular elements in Syria's opposition, say sources
Western training of Syrian rebels is under way in Jordan in an effort to strengthen secular elements in the opposition as a bulwark against Islamic extremism, and to begin building security forces to maintain order in the event of Bashar al-Assad's fall.
Jordanian security sources say the training effort is led by the US, but involves British and French instructors. The UK Ministry of Defence denied any British soldiers were providing direct military training to the rebels, though a small number of personnel, including special forces teams, have been in the country training the Jordanian military.
But the Guardian has been told that UK intelligence teams are giving the rebels logistical and other advice in some form.
British officials have made it clear that they believe new EU rules have now given the UK the green light to start providing military training for rebel fighters with the aim of containing the spread of chaos and extremism in areas outside the Syrian regime's control. According to European and Jordanian sources the western training in Jordan has been going on since last year and is focused on senior Syrian army officers who defected.
"As is normal, before any major decision is taken on this issue, the preparations are made so that when that decision is taken, everything is in place for it to go smoothly. That is what these groups [special forces] do. They go in in advance," a European diplomat said.
A Jordanian source familiar with the training operations said: "It's the Americans, Brits and French with some of the Syrian generals who defected. But we're not talking about a huge operation."
He added that there had so far been no "green light" for the rebel forces being trained to be sent into Syria. But they would be deployed if there were signs of a complete collapse of public services in the southern Syrian city of Daraa, which could trigger a million more Syrians seeking refuge in Jordan, which is reeling under the strain of accommodating the 320,000 who have already sought shelter there. The aim of sending western-trained rebels over the border would be to create a safe area for refugees on the Syrian side of the border, to prevent chaos and to provide a counterweight to al-Qaida-linked extremists who have become a powerful force in the north.
British officials say new European guidelines on the Syrian arms embargo, formally adopted by the EU at the beginning of March, allow military training as long as the ultimate aim of that training is "the protection of civilians".
Paris takes an identical view of the EU rules.
Officials in Brussels say the language of the guidelines is less than clear-cut. "It's deliberately hazy," said one. "When it comes to technical assistance, what it means in practice depends on who you ask. The Brits and the French, for example, are much more forward-leaning than others. The principle is that the assistance should be for the protection of civilians, but as we saw in Libya, that can be interpreted in different ways."
British officials argue that training of Syrian forces to fill the security vacuum as the Assad regime collapses would be help safeguard civilian lives. William Hague, the foreign minister, outlined the goals of such training on Wednesday.
"Such technical assistance can include assistance, advice and training on how to maintain security in areas no longer controlled by the regime, on co-ordination between civilian and military councils, on how to protect civilians and minimise the risks to them, and how to maintain security during a transition," he told parliament. "We will now provide such assistance, advice and training."
A Foreign Office spokesman said: "It's not the sort of thing we are going into too much detail on right now. We are big on the transition picture, because at some point Assad is going to fall, and the opposition are going to need help to provide governance in areas they control, and that of course includes security. But security doesn't just mean fighting, it also means basic law and order, and policing."
The Pentagon said last October that a small group of US special forces and military planners had been to Jordan during the summer to help the country prepare for the possibility of Syrian use of chemical weapons and train selected rebel fighters.
That planning cell, which was housed at the King Abdullah II Special Operations Training Centre in the north of the capital, Amman, has since been expanded to co-ordinate a more ambitious training programme. But Jordanian sources said the actual training was being carried out at more remote sites, with recent US reports saying it was being led by the CIA. For the first two years of the Syrian civil war, Jordan has sought to stay out of the fray, fearing a backlash from Damascus and an influx of extremists that would destabilise the precariously balanced kingdom.
"What has happened of late is that there has been a tactical shift," said Julien Barnes-Dacey, a Middle East expert at the European Council on Foreign Relations thinktank. "Islamist forces have been gaining steam in the north and Jordan is keen to avoid that in the south. Having been very hands-off, they now see that they have to do something in the south."
He added: "There is a feeling that Jordan simply can't handle a huge new influx of refugees so the idea would be to create a safe zone inside Syria. For them it's a no-win scenario. Everything they had been seeking to avoid has come to pass."
For western and Saudi backers of the opposition, Jordan has become a preferable option through which to channel aid than Turkey. Ankara has been criticised for allowing extremist groups, such as the al-Nusra Front, become dominant on the northern front while it focused on what it sees as the growing threat of Kurdish secessionism.
"The Americans now trust us more than the Turks, because with the Turks everything is about gaining leverage for action against the Kurds," said a Jordanian source familiar with official thinking in Amman.
The US has announced an extra $60m (£40.2m) in direct aid to the rebels, including military rations and medical kits. Asked on Tuesday whether assistance included military training, the US state department spokesman Pat Ventrell replied: "I really don't have anything for you on that. Our policy has been non-lethal assistance."
Earlier this week, the US secretary of state, John Kerry, said Washington was now confident that arms supplies to the rebels would not be diverted to extremists. "There is a very clear ability now in the Syrian opposition to make certain that what goes to the moderate, legitimate opposition is, in fact, getting to them, and the indication is that they are increasing their pressure as a result of that," he said.
Syrian rebels have said that in the past few months there had been a relaxation of the previously strict US rules on what kinds of weapons were allowed across the border, and that portable anti-aircraft missiles had been released from Turkish warehouses where they had been impounded. Matt Schroeder, who tracks the spread of such weapons for the Federation of American Scientists, said the recent appearance of modern, sophisticated anti-aircraft missiles in the hands of such fragmented rebel groups was deeply troubling in view of their capacity to bring down civilian airlines.
"This is a step above anything we've seen before in the hands of non-state actors," he said. "This is a new and unfortunate chapter in recent manpad [man-portable air-defence] proliferation."
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2013/mar/08/west-training-syrian-rebels-jordan
ReplyLooks like Western powers are becoming more overt in their desire to manipulate the outcome of the Syrian conflict.
UK and French instructors involved in US-led effort to strengthen secular elements in Syria's opposition, say sources
Western training of Syrian rebels is under way in Jordan in an effort to strengthen secular elements in the opposition as a bulwark against Islamic extremism, and to begin building security forces to maintain order in the event of Bashar al-Assad's fall.
Jordanian security sources say the training effort is led by the US, but involves British and French instructors. The UK Ministry of Defence denied any British soldiers were providing direct military training to the rebels, though a small number of personnel, including special forces teams, have been in the country training the Jordanian military.
But the Guardian has been told that UK intelligence teams are giving the rebels logistical and other advice in some form.
British officials have made it clear that they believe new EU rules have now given the UK the green light to start providing military training for rebel fighters with the aim of containing the spread of chaos and extremism in areas outside the Syrian regime's control. According to European and Jordanian sources the western training in Jordan has been going on since last year and is focused on senior Syrian army officers who defected.
"As is normal, before any major decision is taken on this issue, the preparations are made so that when that decision is taken, everything is in place for it to go smoothly. That is what these groups [special forces] do. They go in in advance," a European diplomat said.
A Jordanian source familiar with the training operations said: "It's the Americans, Brits and French with some of the Syrian generals who defected. But we're not talking about a huge operation."
He added that there had so far been no "green light" for the rebel forces being trained to be sent into Syria. But they would be deployed if there were signs of a complete collapse of public services in the southern Syrian city of Daraa, which could trigger a million more Syrians seeking refuge in Jordan, which is reeling under the strain of accommodating the 320,000 who have already sought shelter there. The aim of sending western-trained rebels over the border would be to create a safe area for refugees on the Syrian side of the border, to prevent chaos and to provide a counterweight to al-Qaida-linked extremists who have become a powerful force in the north.
British officials say new European guidelines on the Syrian arms embargo, formally adopted by the EU at the beginning of March, allow military training as long as the ultimate aim of that training is "the protection of civilians".
Paris takes an identical view of the EU rules.
Officials in Brussels say the language of the guidelines is less than clear-cut. "It's deliberately hazy," said one. "When it comes to technical assistance, what it means in practice depends on who you ask. The Brits and the French, for example, are much more forward-leaning than others. The principle is that the assistance should be for the protection of civilians, but as we saw in Libya, that can be interpreted in different ways."
British officials argue that training of Syrian forces to fill the security vacuum as the Assad regime collapses would be help safeguard civilian lives. William Hague, the foreign minister, outlined the goals of such training on Wednesday.
"Such technical assistance can include assistance, advice and training on how to maintain security in areas no longer controlled by the regime, on co-ordination between civilian and military councils, on how to protect civilians and minimise the risks to them, and how to maintain security during a transition," he told parliament. "We will now provide such assistance, advice and training."
A Foreign Office spokesman said: "It's not the sort of thing we are going into too much detail on right now. We are big on the transition picture, because at some point Assad is going to fall, and the opposition are going to need help to provide governance in areas they control, and that of course includes security. But security doesn't just mean fighting, it also means basic law and order, and policing."
The Pentagon said last October that a small group of US special forces and military planners had been to Jordan during the summer to help the country prepare for the possibility of Syrian use of chemical weapons and train selected rebel fighters.
That planning cell, which was housed at the King Abdullah II Special Operations Training Centre in the north of the capital, Amman, has since been expanded to co-ordinate a more ambitious training programme. But Jordanian sources said the actual training was being carried out at more remote sites, with recent US reports saying it was being led by the CIA. For the first two years of the Syrian civil war, Jordan has sought to stay out of the fray, fearing a backlash from Damascus and an influx of extremists that would destabilise the precariously balanced kingdom.
"What has happened of late is that there has been a tactical shift," said Julien Barnes-Dacey, a Middle East expert at the European Council on Foreign Relations thinktank. "Islamist forces have been gaining steam in the north and Jordan is keen to avoid that in the south. Having been very hands-off, they now see that they have to do something in the south."
He added: "There is a feeling that Jordan simply can't handle a huge new influx of refugees so the idea would be to create a safe zone inside Syria. For them it's a no-win scenario. Everything they had been seeking to avoid has come to pass."
For western and Saudi backers of the opposition, Jordan has become a preferable option through which to channel aid than Turkey. Ankara has been criticised for allowing extremist groups, such as the al-Nusra Front, become dominant on the northern front while it focused on what it sees as the growing threat of Kurdish secessionism.
"The Americans now trust us more than the Turks, because with the Turks everything is about gaining leverage for action against the Kurds," said a Jordanian source familiar with official thinking in Amman.
The US has announced an extra $60m (£40.2m) in direct aid to the rebels, including military rations and medical kits. Asked on Tuesday whether assistance included military training, the US state department spokesman Pat Ventrell replied: "I really don't have anything for you on that. Our policy has been non-lethal assistance."
Earlier this week, the US secretary of state, John Kerry, said Washington was now confident that arms supplies to the rebels would not be diverted to extremists. "There is a very clear ability now in the Syrian opposition to make certain that what goes to the moderate, legitimate opposition is, in fact, getting to them, and the indication is that they are increasing their pressure as a result of that," he said.
Syrian rebels have said that in the past few months there had been a relaxation of the previously strict US rules on what kinds of weapons were allowed across the border, and that portable anti-aircraft missiles had been released from Turkish warehouses where they had been impounded. Matt Schroeder, who tracks the spread of such weapons for the Federation of American Scientists, said the recent appearance of modern, sophisticated anti-aircraft missiles in the hands of such fragmented rebel groups was deeply troubling in view of their capacity to bring down civilian airlines.
"This is a step above anything we've seen before in the hands of non-state actors," he said. "This is a new and unfortunate chapter in recent manpad [man-portable air-defence] proliferation."
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2013/mar/08/west-training-syrian-rebels-jordan
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Independent
03-08-2013, 05:48 PM
جوري
03-08-2013, 06:48 PM
Junon isn't a Sunni Muslim why would he want them to be helped? in Fact no one wants them helped hence the 2 year intense genocide!
the west is only going in now after the rebels secured almost half the country with the primitive weapons they've of course they don't want anything like jabhat an'nusra in power- that would spell disaster wouldn't it, especially that it is the civilians that have now become well trained soldiers.
Not to worry though everyone sees through the transparency of this charade.
We know who the enemies are east and west!
Replythe west is only going in now after the rebels secured almost half the country with the primitive weapons they've of course they don't want anything like jabhat an'nusra in power- that would spell disaster wouldn't it, especially that it is the civilians that have now become well trained soldiers.
Not to worry though everyone sees through the transparency of this charade.
We know who the enemies are east and west!
Jedi_Mindset
03-08-2013, 06:51 PM
Its a sign though, for what they are planning to do for syria. Just like what they did in yugoslavia, the dividing into pieces of states. The Yinon-plan going in full swing, syria will be divided just like iraq. Who is to blame? Us. our lack of support and unification.
Ofcourse they would give the secular, more nationalist syrians power. they will prevent any islamic government at all cost, and i assure you they will succeed this time again, because its of our lack of support as we are busy complaining about mobile phones and neglecting our duties. I hope the best but...and i may get bad replies on my comments but i see how it is. M60's, m79's have already appeared in vids by the FSA. Most likely provided by the gulf states.
when the west starts to control the main body of FSA in which they almost are succeeding to do it will be bad for the ones who want islamic shariah, justice.
Remember this is just my view, i dont support Assad he is a secular dictator. I say how it is now, because i dont look into the future, because only Allah knows the future.
ReplyOfcourse they would give the secular, more nationalist syrians power. they will prevent any islamic government at all cost, and i assure you they will succeed this time again, because its of our lack of support as we are busy complaining about mobile phones and neglecting our duties. I hope the best but...and i may get bad replies on my comments but i see how it is. M60's, m79's have already appeared in vids by the FSA. Most likely provided by the gulf states.
when the west starts to control the main body of FSA in which they almost are succeeding to do it will be bad for the ones who want islamic shariah, justice.
Remember this is just my view, i dont support Assad he is a secular dictator. I say how it is now, because i dont look into the future, because only Allah knows the future.
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جوري
03-09-2013, 02:34 AM
Go on please applaud Iran for backing the Bashar regime and supplying his sons of mut3a rafidis with cluster bombs to rain down on children.. and yes please in the west sit in your stately rooms in your Armani suits and clean water debating whether or not to arm the rebels or label them terrorists two years in.
:ia: :Allah: :swt: will cure this burning in our hearts and grant us victory over his enemies the spawn of the devil of the east & west.
7asbona :Allah: wa ni3ma alwakeel!
Jedi_Mindset
03-09-2013, 08:23 AM
to who was that directed? I am not backing Iran. And if you read my comment it doesnt state so.
Syria already had cluster bombs in his stockpile, old soviet bombs it recieved from the USSR. Iran and iraq are supplying with militias and men.
But the western weapons in hands of the opposition should not be ignored, i think at a later stage the west is going to use them against iran. This might be a upocming prophecy also, sis i think you know what i mean. Listen i am not anti-FSa or atleast some groups fighting syria, but to completely deny of western support is a sign of ignorance.
Dont mind the title of this vid:
Its true that GCC and NATO have a common interest to counter russian-sino-shiite influence hence their arming of syrian rebels but secretly they want the shiites to make a huge alliance with the israelis.
Dont misunderstand me, all sides are controlled by the same guys. There are zionist deep states in saudi arabia, qatar, russia, USA, Iran, turkey and Syria.
ReplySyria already had cluster bombs in his stockpile, old soviet bombs it recieved from the USSR. Iran and iraq are supplying with militias and men.
But the western weapons in hands of the opposition should not be ignored, i think at a later stage the west is going to use them against iran. This might be a upocming prophecy also, sis i think you know what i mean. Listen i am not anti-FSa or atleast some groups fighting syria, but to completely deny of western support is a sign of ignorance.
Dont mind the title of this vid:
Its true that GCC and NATO have a common interest to counter russian-sino-shiite influence hence their arming of syrian rebels but secretly they want the shiites to make a huge alliance with the israelis.
Dont misunderstand me, all sides are controlled by the same guys. There are zionist deep states in saudi arabia, qatar, russia, USA, Iran, turkey and Syria.
Independent
03-09-2013, 09:56 AM
This thread is a really good example of how the West will get blamed here no matter what course of action gets taken. Junon thinks the west is intervening but shouldn't. Shaden thinks the west is deliberately not intervening and is only getting involved now when it's too late. And Jedi has a complicated theory to do with attacking Iran that is not at all clear but probably involves a more detailed reading of that thread about neck-eating worms (surely the best named thread yet).
These 3 ideas completely contradict each other as usual.
The simple and obvious explanation is that Syria is a Russian client state and this dominates international reaction. Russia/China block anything at the UN so the west is limited in what it can do. Also, after bad experiences arming rebels in Afghanistan and Libya, western policymakers will wonder if it's worth the risk of it here. That's pretty much it.
ReplyThese 3 ideas completely contradict each other as usual.
The simple and obvious explanation is that Syria is a Russian client state and this dominates international reaction. Russia/China block anything at the UN so the west is limited in what it can do. Also, after bad experiences arming rebels in Afghanistan and Libya, western policymakers will wonder if it's worth the risk of it here. That's pretty much it.
Jedi_Mindset
03-09-2013, 11:08 AM
ofcourse the west gets blamed, and its legimate because first of all Assad was a friend of them, france placed his family in power after they left. West will not interverne yes, but the west supports the GCC which is anti-iran influence, this comes also in favour of israel for a while. Israel will most likely steer them away from its border by luring them against shiite targets like hizbullah. So will the west. Israel will not attack iran, the GCC will do, not via armies, but they pay mujahideen to do the job, US already removed the MKO from its of terrorist organization, although the MKO is secular and baathist it will come in favor of the war against Iran.
But true is that the north of 'israel' will be a turbulent region for a very while, it will have oppertunities for them but also many negative sides for them, not for us. Independent groups in syria can easily launch attacks on the zionists. As long the groups will fight the shiites, israel can have more time to prepare and steer them towards Iran. I have read political PDF's made by zionists, one of them from 1982 outlines the yinon plan, which speaks about the dividing of syria, libya and iraq in little states. Also egypt will suffer the same. Hence the civil war in syria is a oppertunity for them to divide it
ReplyBut true is that the north of 'israel' will be a turbulent region for a very while, it will have oppertunities for them but also many negative sides for them, not for us. Independent groups in syria can easily launch attacks on the zionists. As long the groups will fight the shiites, israel can have more time to prepare and steer them towards Iran. I have read political PDF's made by zionists, one of them from 1982 outlines the yinon plan, which speaks about the dividing of syria, libya and iraq in little states. Also egypt will suffer the same. Hence the civil war in syria is a oppertunity for them to divide it
Independent
03-09-2013, 11:37 AM
I don't mind which line you guys pick, but just pick one.
Some of the rest of your post I'd agree with. Syria is now totally unstable and although there are many countries who would have no love for Assad, the current situation could go in any direction.
ReplySome of the rest of your post I'd agree with. Syria is now totally unstable and although there are many countries who would have no love for Assad, the current situation could go in any direction.
جوري
03-09-2013, 01:23 PM
Independent:
You often read what you want in people's posts and not what is written!
I don't think the west isn't intervening or not doing enough I know they're sneaky sons of devils who will come in at the eleventh hour to reclaim the glory and see what else they can do by war of thievery for the cockroach state.
If your understanding is limited to your education don't extend that limitation to how others think or analyze.
Jedi I am familiar with your earlier view so it doesn't matter what's written now. I'd rather people stand their grounds than color what's written with a new flavor or misconstrue what's written all together.
Bottom line is rebels have secured half the country with what little they've and soon the rest and it will be a cold day in hell if the west thinks they can come in pretending to be allies and we already know exactly what the sons of mut3a are all about we've always known and since the assassination of Omar Ibn ilkhataab :ra:
ReplyYou often read what you want in people's posts and not what is written!
I don't think the west isn't intervening or not doing enough I know they're sneaky sons of devils who will come in at the eleventh hour to reclaim the glory and see what else they can do by war of thievery for the cockroach state.
If your understanding is limited to your education don't extend that limitation to how others think or analyze.
Jedi I am familiar with your earlier view so it doesn't matter what's written now. I'd rather people stand their grounds than color what's written with a new flavor or misconstrue what's written all together.
Bottom line is rebels have secured half the country with what little they've and soon the rest and it will be a cold day in hell if the west thinks they can come in pretending to be allies and we already know exactly what the sons of mut3a are all about we've always known and since the assassination of Omar Ibn ilkhataab :ra:
Jedi_Mindset
03-09-2013, 01:35 PM
As long we respect each other's view, and dont fight each other again about a conflict, you know we dont know everything about :D Unity needs to be achieved and fights should be avoided about some disagreements.
I am just not taking sides, i will wait for the outcome, if a islamic state emerges in syria, it will get my support.
ReplyI am just not taking sides, i will wait for the outcome, if a islamic state emerges in syria, it will get my support.
جوري
03-09-2013, 02:00 PM
There's no unity with the sons of mut3a. They're nothing more than Zionists with a different flavor and their sect initiated by 'AbduAllah ibn Sabaa' who was a Jew trying to do for Islam what Paul/Saul did for Christianity al7mdullilah that it didn't work save on people who had no desire to accept Islam to begin with but had to submit to it so they submitted on their deranged terms. There's no reason to accept that just because many want them to count as Muslims. Especially when what they're doing is systematic eradication of Muslims, and many have already given in numbers the HizbuAllah freaks along with forces from Iran/Iraq to fight on behalf of Bashar and heavily armed by Russia & China and certainly with their approval. The west will do what it does best come in to reclaim the booty and have a camera moment as to how they came to save the day like they did in Bosnia.. they'd of course rather the two teams wipe each other clean as is and then they can still have their desired system of governance new face same ****!
ReplyJedi_Mindset
03-09-2013, 02:06 PM
I dont mean regarding sects sis, just between us and you know that i am not a shia :P
I know about iran and iraq arming syria and pro-gov militias there, they are the other side of the coin controlled by the same people who control the US, Russia et cetera.
My view is that the US has support through the GCC who arm the syrian opposition, the GCC is anti-Iran so thats why it will somehow be good for the US to counter mainly chinese influence. But their succes will not be for long.
ReplyI know about iran and iraq arming syria and pro-gov militias there, they are the other side of the coin controlled by the same people who control the US, Russia et cetera.
My view is that the US has support through the GCC who arm the syrian opposition, the GCC is anti-Iran so thats why it will somehow be good for the US to counter mainly chinese influence. But their succes will not be for long.
جوري
03-09-2013, 02:18 PM
U.S & Iran are bed fellows don't buy into the crap they brainwash you with on TV.
Treacherous Alliance:
The Secret Dealings of Israel, Iran, and the United States
Trita Parsi
14 Reviews
Yale University Press, 2007 -
ReplyTreacherous Alliance:
The Secret Dealings of Israel, Iran, and the United States
Trita Parsi
14 Reviews
Yale University Press, 2007 -
IslamicRevival
03-09-2013, 02:34 PM
The Syrians have to decide whether they want to be ruled over by NATO stooges 'Free Syrian Army' or Assad and either way its a lose lose scenario in my opinion. Both sides have committed awful crimes, Assad is butchering his own people and FSA are indiscriminately targeting and killing in the name of 'Freedom'
They're essentially cut from the same cloth and supporting either side is a crime in itself as they are both inheritely evil, I think its better to support the people of Syria who are caught in the middle of all this and pray for Khilfah to be established in the blessed lands by TRUE men of Allah.
Allah knows best
ReplyThey're essentially cut from the same cloth and supporting either side is a crime in itself as they are both inheritely evil, I think its better to support the people of Syria who are caught in the middle of all this and pray for Khilfah to be established in the blessed lands by TRUE men of Allah.
Allah knows best
Jedi_Mindset
03-09-2013, 02:45 PM
As i said the west wont intervene in these matters, but will use the arabs for this. Hence that what is happening will eventually spread to iran. Divide and conquer is by controlling both sides ;)
And to enflame these kind of wars they will be the ones who will run the guns and armsflow.
Iraq-iran war both sides got armed by the same people (US, Uk, israel)
ReplyAnd to enflame these kind of wars they will be the ones who will run the guns and armsflow.
Iraq-iran war both sides got armed by the same people (US, Uk, israel)
Independent
03-09-2013, 04:20 PM
Realistically, most of the arms on the rebel side right now will have been supplied through Muslim sources, wherever they were manufactured.
You give the west way too much 'credit' for influence. The main drivers in this conflict are Syrian born, Syrian made. And the single biggest non-national influencer for many years has been Iran. Iran has played a highly destabilising game across the whole region but especially in Lebanon and Iraq. They may have got what they wanted in Iraq but in Syria and Lebanon their whole strategy looks like it could backfire.
ReplyYou give the west way too much 'credit' for influence. The main drivers in this conflict are Syrian born, Syrian made. And the single biggest non-national influencer for many years has been Iran. Iran has played a highly destabilising game across the whole region but especially in Lebanon and Iraq. They may have got what they wanted in Iraq but in Syria and Lebanon their whole strategy looks like it could backfire.
Jedi_Mindset
03-09-2013, 04:28 PM
Finally a sensible comment from you. I know, iran is not the 'hero' of the middle east as it potrays it to be. But there are other powers who just do the same, like the US and israel.
ReplyJedi_Mindset
03-09-2013, 04:50 PM
Its a political game and its for the middle eastern resources. Atleast one of the many obvious reasons, they're demonizing muslims because they want to destroy islam.
But we muslims will be victorious, wether the non-muslims will like it or not.
Mujahideen entering syria, mainly syrian themselves:
http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=8ee_1362853010
ReplyBut we muslims will be victorious, wether the non-muslims will like it or not.
Mujahideen entering syria, mainly syrian themselves:
http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=8ee_1362853010
sister herb
03-09-2013, 09:25 PM
Is that so big deal? Even I have contact to Syrian "rebellions". I have sended help to Syrian civilians (food and medicines - not guns).
:nervous: And I am just as normal westener.
Reply:nervous: And I am just as normal westener.
جوري
03-09-2013, 09:42 PM
Neither options is acceptable hence the revolt and hence the black list by the west and the cluster bombs and airplanes by Asad!
A little too late in the game to play Lenny don't you think? The west is more like a cancer, works its way to the DNA and ruins it from within.
foods & medicines are not reaching them unfortunately- we can ask the UN forces why they go in under guise of peaceful mediators to arm Bashar forces.
:w:
ReplyA little too late in the game to play Lenny don't you think? The west is more like a cancer, works its way to the DNA and ruins it from within.
foods & medicines are not reaching them unfortunately- we can ask the UN forces why they go in under guise of peaceful mediators to arm Bashar forces.
:w:
IslamicRevival
03-09-2013, 11:39 PM
NATO forces are more likely to be arming the FSA, they've already done it in Libya where they armed thugs to destabilise the entire region and ended up invading and bombing the country.
The invasion in Libya is their blueprint and they're trying to do the exact same in Syria, Allah knows best
ReplyThe invasion in Libya is their blueprint and they're trying to do the exact same in Syria, Allah knows best
جوري
03-09-2013, 11:45 PM
Nothing NATO did in Libya was any more or any less bad than what the colonel did with his own hands. Including the billions squandered on bull we're not gonna touch on the genocides there either.
There's no reason to believe that Syria will run the same course in fact each place that has seen a revolt has seen a different course. I don't think anything is worse than Bashar the rafidi, Alawite pig.. The answer lies in the resolve, faith & tenacity of the free army and if :Allah::swt: accepts it from them not in what Bashar or NATO does, both their days are numbered :ia:
ReplyThere's no reason to believe that Syria will run the same course in fact each place that has seen a revolt has seen a different course. I don't think anything is worse than Bashar the rafidi, Alawite pig.. The answer lies in the resolve, faith & tenacity of the free army and if :Allah::swt: accepts it from them not in what Bashar or NATO does, both their days are numbered :ia:
Independent
03-10-2013, 12:33 AM
Yes, and the prime factor in that is how each different ruling regime reacted to the Arab Spring pressure. Gaddafi and Assad chose to fight to the death, whereas Mubarak stood aside reasonably quickly. If armed revolt is the only way then weapons saturate the society, revenge follows on revenge. Civil wars are often the most bloody.
In effect we are getting to see in Syria what would have happened in Libya if the west hadn't got involved - ie a much more protracted war that does more damage. In Libya, when Russia unexpectedly stood aside, the west neutralised Gaddafi's airpower. Whereas in Syria, Russia won't be fooled again so Assad rules the skies. He'll probably still lose in the end but it's a much more destructive fight.
When you remove dictators who have been in place for many decades then all the tensions that have been suppressed for so many years come to the surface at once.
ReplyIn effect we are getting to see in Syria what would have happened in Libya if the west hadn't got involved - ie a much more protracted war that does more damage. In Libya, when Russia unexpectedly stood aside, the west neutralised Gaddafi's airpower. Whereas in Syria, Russia won't be fooled again so Assad rules the skies. He'll probably still lose in the end but it's a much more destructive fight.
When you remove dictators who have been in place for many decades then all the tensions that have been suppressed for so many years come to the surface at once.
جوري
03-10-2013, 12:53 AM
There's only one reason for the west to be involved and we all know what that is. The west/spawn of Satan whether east or west is also behind most if not all the civil wars. They incite it so they can come in and say see how much we're needed.
Study history a little. See how for instance the Brits played it when they were doing their divide and conquer thing giving for instance a large triangular wedge out of Egypt to Sudan to justify their presence there in case a 'civil war' broke out... They have perfected that game and everyone is on to it. What worked 70 yrs ago and on that old debuached generation is not working on this one. We've all evolved from the days of 'Lawrence of Arabia'
People who have lived at peace with each other side by side for millenniums don't all of a sudden want to have at their neighbor for no reason.
Do read Robert Fisk's 'the world through Syrian lens'
It is too bad for you we're not all as dumb as all that so I am not sure why you keep trying!
best,
ReplyStudy history a little. See how for instance the Brits played it when they were doing their divide and conquer thing giving for instance a large triangular wedge out of Egypt to Sudan to justify their presence there in case a 'civil war' broke out... They have perfected that game and everyone is on to it. What worked 70 yrs ago and on that old debuached generation is not working on this one. We've all evolved from the days of 'Lawrence of Arabia'
People who have lived at peace with each other side by side for millenniums don't all of a sudden want to have at their neighbor for no reason.
Do read Robert Fisk's 'the world through Syrian lens'
It is too bad for you we're not all as dumb as all that so I am not sure why you keep trying!
best,
Independent
03-10-2013, 10:07 AM
Laughable.
Whatever did the world do for a war before you invented western devils? Must have been an amazingly peaceful place.
You'd blame the west if you spilt your coffee.
ReplyWhatever did the world do for a war before you invented western devils? Must have been an amazingly peaceful place.
You'd blame the west if you spilt your coffee.
Jedi_Mindset
03-10-2013, 10:18 AM
Thats what i was explaining to you all the time, however due to my poor english i cant describe it better than you do. They only give the rebels a few MANPADs and guns who dont work against bashar's airforce and army. But they wont intervene.
They're trying to enflame the civil war more and more by this, but Insha'Allah their plots will fail. though, i think it should be a bit guessed that the uprising itself had some CIA involvement. NSF which started their protest against bashar has some links with the CIA. :)
btw:
http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=648_1362894493
ReplyThey're trying to enflame the civil war more and more by this, but Insha'Allah their plots will fail. though, i think it should be a bit guessed that the uprising itself had some CIA involvement. NSF which started their protest against bashar has some links with the CIA. :)
btw:
http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=648_1362894493
جوري
03-10-2013, 10:44 AM
Guess the poor fellow ran out of facts and is resorting to his usual tantrums!
ReplyIndependent
03-10-2013, 11:03 AM
There are enough facts in plain sight to understand this.
We know that they aren't supplying proper weapons because...they told us!
And we know why....because Russia and China won't agree to it.
So unless you think Russia and China's UN veto is itself organised by the west, to block their own support, then you need to look at Russian/Chinese motivations, not the US.
And then you need to explain why Russia allowed support to Libyan rebels, but not Syrian ones.
You're going to get yourself horribly dizzy and none of it will make much sense. Or, you could get Occam's Razor out right now and finally give yourself a proper shave (metaphorically speaking).
ReplyWe know that they aren't supplying proper weapons because...they told us!
And we know why....because Russia and China won't agree to it.
So unless you think Russia and China's UN veto is itself organised by the west, to block their own support, then you need to look at Russian/Chinese motivations, not the US.
And then you need to explain why Russia allowed support to Libyan rebels, but not Syrian ones.
You're going to get yourself horribly dizzy and none of it will make much sense. Or, you could get Occam's Razor out right now and finally give yourself a proper shave (metaphorically speaking).
Jedi_Mindset
03-10-2013, 11:07 AM
Did i mentioned that in my posts? Dont bring up assumptions or things to make up. US cooperates with russia regarding this with what you have said, only the media wants you to believe in divisions.
Libya was not really in their interests anymore and not close to their border. Infact the oil fields which are now occupied by the BP, shell will most likely benefit russia also in some way with oil dealings.
No way, i dont want to look like a prettyboy.
ReplyLibya was not really in their interests anymore and not close to their border. Infact the oil fields which are now occupied by the BP, shell will most likely benefit russia also in some way with oil dealings.
No way, i dont want to look like a prettyboy.
Independent
03-10-2013, 11:12 AM
You can say anything you like but, given that the reason the west don't supply proper weapons to Syria is the UN veto, then it's a waste of time looking for other mysterious motivations until you've accounted for that one.
i can assure you Russia strongly regrets losing their Libyan ally and they most certainly did not expect it to happen. They feel that the west used its limited permission to offer humanitarian help, protect civilians etc and turned it into major military support. Which i think is true (although they still stopped short of offering much help on the ground). The longer the war went on, and the less likely it looked the rebels would win, the more the west helped.
In fact this example shows plainly that the west is not always seeking to extend chaos or prolong wars, as is often said here. They expected the rebels to win easily, and when it didn't happen, they intervened more and more until it did.
Replyi can assure you Russia strongly regrets losing their Libyan ally and they most certainly did not expect it to happen. They feel that the west used its limited permission to offer humanitarian help, protect civilians etc and turned it into major military support. Which i think is true (although they still stopped short of offering much help on the ground). The longer the war went on, and the less likely it looked the rebels would win, the more the west helped.
In fact this example shows plainly that the west is not always seeking to extend chaos or prolong wars, as is often said here. They expected the rebels to win easily, and when it didn't happen, they intervened more and more until it did.
Jedi_Mindset
03-10-2013, 11:21 AM
Its not that really, they want to prevent the hardcore weapons falling into the hands of the 'islamists'. So the most hardcore weapons go to the more secular wings of the FSA. They have already being supplied with M60's, m79 rocket launchers and other anti-tank weapons.
NATO didnt really do it for ''humantarian'' help lol, they just wanted to have the oil. Ofcourse they expected it that Gadaffi would fall at some moment, so will Assad even if it takes a decade. Assad though has some major allies in the region like iraq and iran. Iraq has already cooperated with the syrian army to take some border posts. Plus both iran and iraq are sending militias into syria. The reason why the west does this is to undermine sino influence, just like they do it in Africa.
Russia is not really their problem, china is.
When both sides arm the conflict it will only go worse and worse. Especially russia's arm trade like fighter jets and helicopters.
ReplyNATO didnt really do it for ''humantarian'' help lol, they just wanted to have the oil. Ofcourse they expected it that Gadaffi would fall at some moment, so will Assad even if it takes a decade. Assad though has some major allies in the region like iraq and iran. Iraq has already cooperated with the syrian army to take some border posts. Plus both iran and iraq are sending militias into syria. The reason why the west does this is to undermine sino influence, just like they do it in Africa.
Russia is not really their problem, china is.
When both sides arm the conflict it will only go worse and worse. Especially russia's arm trade like fighter jets and helicopters.
Independent
03-10-2013, 11:55 AM
Ironically, by the time Gaddafi fell he had far better relations with the west and oil deals were opening up anyway. From a strictly oil point of view, it would have been better to have left him in power.
I think the rebellion took everyone by surprise including the west. Although they wouldn't have sought it at that point, and if anything it was counterproductive to their economic interests, the west felt obliged to support the rebels against a manifest dictator whom they had condemned for decades.
Also, I think they (correctly) calculated that his time was up, just as they have done with Mubarack and Assad.
Yes - again, they say this explicitly! For the west these are very tricky situations. If they do nothing, or if they do something, either way it could end up hurting them. It's pretty much guesswork.
The main complicating factor for the west is the extreme anti-western sentiment across so much of the Muslim world (as exhibited here also) which means that whatever course of action they take will always be condemned as the worst, even if it's what everyone was asking for beforehand.
For this reason i personally think the west should disengage entirely from the whole middle east region and do nothing for any side, except for its declared allies. More like a Chinese approach. The real divisions are within the Muslim world and the only thing that can unite them right now is hatred of the west. So, the west needs to stop being stupid enough to play that role.
China is following a wholly selfish foreign policy, doesn't care how nasty the regimes it deals with are, benefits as much from the free trade that the west fights for, yet doesn't have to get involved and never gets blamed for anything. I'd call that a very successful policy.
ReplyI think the rebellion took everyone by surprise including the west. Although they wouldn't have sought it at that point, and if anything it was counterproductive to their economic interests, the west felt obliged to support the rebels against a manifest dictator whom they had condemned for decades.
Also, I think they (correctly) calculated that his time was up, just as they have done with Mubarack and Assad.
Yes - again, they say this explicitly! For the west these are very tricky situations. If they do nothing, or if they do something, either way it could end up hurting them. It's pretty much guesswork.
The main complicating factor for the west is the extreme anti-western sentiment across so much of the Muslim world (as exhibited here also) which means that whatever course of action they take will always be condemned as the worst, even if it's what everyone was asking for beforehand.
For this reason i personally think the west should disengage entirely from the whole middle east region and do nothing for any side, except for its declared allies. More like a Chinese approach. The real divisions are within the Muslim world and the only thing that can unite them right now is hatred of the west. So, the west needs to stop being stupid enough to play that role.
China is following a wholly selfish foreign policy, doesn't care how nasty the regimes it deals with are, benefits as much from the free trade that the west fights for, yet doesn't have to get involved and never gets blamed for anything. I'd call that a very successful policy.
جوري
03-10-2013, 12:08 PM
he was their bed buddy- what's your point?
he was also a little unstable so when his bed buddies abandoned him toward the end he was a ticking time bomb they'd to rid of him.. that outwighs their oil needs!
the rest of the crap is just drivel although we're impressed with your points system!
best,
Replyhe was also a little unstable so when his bed buddies abandoned him toward the end he was a ticking time bomb they'd to rid of him.. that outwighs their oil needs!
the rest of the crap is just drivel although we're impressed with your points system!
best,
Independent
03-10-2013, 12:17 PM
جوري
03-10-2013, 12:19 PM
We've always known you to over dramatize and concoct all sorts of bulls **** but how is this related to the topic? complete bankruptcy in your dossier of ready made 'facts' perhaps?
ReplyIndependent
03-10-2013, 12:23 PM
You often speak in the plural - signs of schizophrenia?
Although I think Tourette's has to play a part somewhere.
ReplyAlthough I think Tourette's has to play a part somewhere.
جوري
03-10-2013, 12:30 PM
It is a 'Royal we' and if you want to read into it with all your insta dossier expert training, it is how small and nonexistent I view you!
hope they color your folder with schizoid, schizotypal, schizophreniform, schizoaffective, schizophrenia differentiation, you know for your credibility' sake =)
back to Syria or you want an all out catharsis?
Replyhope they color your folder with schizoid, schizotypal, schizophreniform, schizoaffective, schizophrenia differentiation, you know for your credibility' sake =)
back to Syria or you want an all out catharsis?
سيف الله
03-11-2013, 01:21 AM
Salaam
Oh dear .
You really believe that Western powers want to 'help' the people of Syria achieve liberation. Given their past record can you perhaps understand why some may come to a rather different conclusion
Wow, wow, wow, hold on there, I am most definitely a Sunni Muslim. (Hanafi school).
For the record I am for the liberation of Syria, no lover of Assad given his horrendous record and want him and his inner circle to leave. So I’m not against armed resistance.
Having said that given what happened in Iraq and Afghanistan I think efforts must be focused on trying to achieve a peace settlement that the Syrian people will want and will agree to.
Asking help from Western powers is a dangerous game to play. It’s like making a Faustian Pact. Sure they will help you but they will demand a price.
Are the Syrian people willing to pay that price?
ReplyOh dear .
You really believe that Western powers want to 'help' the people of Syria achieve liberation. Given their past record can you perhaps understand why some may come to a rather different conclusion
Wow, wow, wow, hold on there, I am most definitely a Sunni Muslim. (Hanafi school).
For the record I am for the liberation of Syria, no lover of Assad given his horrendous record and want him and his inner circle to leave. So I’m not against armed resistance.
Having said that given what happened in Iraq and Afghanistan I think efforts must be focused on trying to achieve a peace settlement that the Syrian people will want and will agree to.
Asking help from Western powers is a dangerous game to play. It’s like making a Faustian Pact. Sure they will help you but they will demand a price.
Are the Syrian people willing to pay that price?
جوري
03-11-2013, 01:33 AM
Ok :alhamd:
Glad to hear of it!
كُتِبَ عَلَيْكُمُ الْقِتَالُ وَهُوَ كُرْهٌ لَكُمْ ۖ وَعَسَىٰ أَنْ تَكْرَهُوا شَيْئًا وَهُوَ خَيْرٌ لَكُمْ ۖ وَعَسَىٰ أَنْ تُحِبُّوا شَيْئًا وَهُوَ شَرٌّ لَكُمْ ۗ وَاللَّهُ يَعْلَمُ وَأَنْتُمْ لَا تَعْلَمُونَ {216}
[Pickthal 2:216] Warfare is ordained for you, though it is hateful unto you; but it may happen that ye hate a thing which is good for you, and it may happen that ye love a thing which is bad for you. Allah knoweth, ye know not.
That's not something the free army has asked for and for that precise reason the U.S has put them on their extremist **** list!
they already are no?
Al-Imran (The Family of Imran)[3:179]
ReplyGlad to hear of it!
كُتِبَ عَلَيْكُمُ الْقِتَالُ وَهُوَ كُرْهٌ لَكُمْ ۖ وَعَسَىٰ أَنْ تَكْرَهُوا شَيْئًا وَهُوَ خَيْرٌ لَكُمْ ۖ وَعَسَىٰ أَنْ تُحِبُّوا شَيْئًا وَهُوَ شَرٌّ لَكُمْ ۗ وَاللَّهُ يَعْلَمُ وَأَنْتُمْ لَا تَعْلَمُونَ {216}
[Pickthal 2:216] Warfare is ordained for you, though it is hateful unto you; but it may happen that ye hate a thing which is good for you, and it may happen that ye love a thing which is bad for you. Allah knoweth, ye know not.
That's not something the free army has asked for and for that precise reason the U.S has put them on their extremist **** list!
they already are no?
Al-Imran (The Family of Imran)[3:179]
Ma kana Allahu liyathara almumineena AAala ma antum AAalayhi hatta yameeza alkhabeetha mina alttayyibi wama kana Allahu liyutliAAakum AAala alghaybi walakinna Allaha yajtabee min rusulihi man yashao faaminoo biAllahi warusulihi wain tuminoo watattaqoo falakum ajrun AAatheemun
Jedi_Mindset
03-11-2013, 02:03 PM
Oh those poor zionists must be sucking their thumbs now:
In online video, Syrian rebels operating near Israeli border criticize
Assad regime for not fighting Israel in recent decades • Israel: The
‘Somalization’ of Syria is a great concern • Red Cross told Israel:
Syrian refugees refused aid from Jewish state.
Syrian rebels
operating in the region near the border with Israel threatened on Sunday
to fight to regain the Golan Heights from Israel following the toppling
of Syrian President Bashar Assad.
In a video published online, a rebel fighter,
filmed against the backdrop of the Golan Heights, said "we are in the
occupied Golan Heights, which the traitor Hafez Assad sold to Israel 40
years ago. These lands are blessed and the despicable Assad family
promised to liberate them, but for 40 years the Syrian army did not fire
a single bullet. We will open a military campaign against Israel. We
will fire the bullets that Assad did not and we will liberate the
Golan."
The Israel-Syria border has been mostly quiet since 1974.
A spokesman for the Foreign Ministry has
voiced his concerns about the potential for radical Sunni elements to
take power in a post-Assad Syria.
"There is a great concern that uncontrolled
elements at the service of extremist ideas will manage to take over
smaller or bigger separate territories inside the Syrian borders,” Yigal
Palmor told the Turkish Hürriyet Daily News in an interview in
Jerusalem.
"The ‘Somalization’ of Syria is a great
concern. We hope that this war ends as quickly as possible, with a
central power emerging that will rule all Syria,” he said.
"We don’t have any pretext to [militarily]
intervene in what is going on in Syria. Nobody wants us to do that and
we don’t want to do that. We stay on the sidelines, except where our
vital security interests are threatened. We reserve our right to limited
intervention," Palmor said.
In the interview with the Turkish newspaper,
Palmor revealed that Israel had coordinated with the Red Cross to send
humanitarian aid into Syria, but Israel was told that the refugees
refused to receive aid from Israel. Private aid organizations in Israel
are already working with Jordan for human assistance to Syrian refugees,
Palmor said, adding, "this shows that the Israeli public wants to help
Syrians no matter what politics dictates."
In July 2012, Israel Defense Forces Director
of Military Intelligence Maj. Gen. Aviv Kochavi warned that global
jihadists have moved into Syrian territory bordering the Golan Heights
and could soon use the area to stage attacks on Israel. In a briefing to
the Knesset Foreign Affairs and Defense Committee, Kochavi said that
Islamic terrorists have taken advantage of the chaos created by the
Syrian civil war to approach the Golan area. Kochavi told lawmakers that
a power vacuum has created a possible arena in the Golan Heights for
anti-Israel operations, similar to what was happening in Egypt's Sinai
region, where the government in Cairo is finding it hard to impose its
authority on the desert peninsula.
"The Golan area is liable to become an arena
of operations against Israel in much the same way the Sinai is today,
and that's a result of the increasing entrenchment of global jihad in
Syria," he said.
In Dec. 2012 a senior Israeli intelligence
official told Channel 2 TV that global jihad groups have been preparing
near the border with Israel, and are "stockpiling huge amounts of lethal
weapons for a fight with Israel."
"The main problem is not the local rebel
groups but fighters coming from outside Syria. Hundreds of fighters have
begun streaming into Syria from Jordan and Iraq. They come from
countries like Saudi Arabia, Iraq, Libya, and many other countries.
We're talking about very dangerous people with experience fighting the
U.S. army in Iraq as well as fighting the regime in Libya. We estimate
that there are between 3,000 to 4,000 rebel fighters belonging to
radical Salafist groups who all belong under the al-Qaida umbrella," the
official said.
"We expect these rebels to stockpile a large
amount of rockets, a situation which will return the northern Israeli
communities into the line of fire. We assess that once the foreign
rebels have finished fighting Assad's army they will all turn their
attention to the border with Israel. There is no question about it. Once
the Assad regime falls, we will start seeing incidents on our border. I
assess that it will start with a trickle of incidents, like we see on
the Egyptian border, and further down the line we'll start seeing the
firing of anti-tank missiles at IDF vehicles, roadside bombs against
patrols, and these are only the incidents I can reveal. I believe we
will see much worse things," the official said.
Meanwhile, the German Der Spiegel magazine
reported on Sunday that the United States is secretly providing military
training in Jordan to Syrian rebels. According to the report, some 200
rebel fighters have already received training in recent months and there
are future plans to train a total of 1,200 members of the Free Syrian
Army at two camps in southern and eastern Jordan. The U.S. State
Department declined to comment on the report.
Arab media on Sunday reported fierce, ongoing
battles between rebels and the Syrian military throughout the country.
More than 150 people were reportedly killed over the past day.
U.N. High Commissioner for Refugees Antonio
Guterres warned on Sunday that there could be three million Syrian
refugees by the end of 2013, if the violence in the country continues.
According to reports on Al-Arabiya and
Al-Jazeera, Free Syrian Army fighters captured a Syrian military aerial
defense base in the Deir el-Zour region of northeastern Syria near the
Iraqi border. Rebels flaunted a large cache of anti-aircraft missiles
taken from the base and accused the Iraqi military of helping Assad's
forces.
Also on Sunday, the deputy head of Hezbollah,
Sheikh Naim Qassem, said in an interview with a Kuwaiti newspaper that
the Assad regime has the situation under control in Syria and is close
to subduing the rebels.
Qassem denied reports that he was recently injured in a Syrian rebel ambush of a convoy travelling from Beirut to Damascus.
Qassem also warned Israel not to attack Lebanon, saying,
"the Israelis grossly violate Lebanese sovereignty and penetrate
Lebanon via the air, sea and land. We reserve the right to respond to
any Israeli action in Lebanon as we see fit."
http://www.israelhayom.com/site/newsletter_article.php?id=7883
ReplyIn online video, Syrian rebels operating near Israeli border criticize
Assad regime for not fighting Israel in recent decades • Israel: The
‘Somalization’ of Syria is a great concern • Red Cross told Israel:
Syrian refugees refused aid from Jewish state.
Syrian rebels
operating in the region near the border with Israel threatened on Sunday
to fight to regain the Golan Heights from Israel following the toppling
of Syrian President Bashar Assad.
In a video published online, a rebel fighter,
filmed against the backdrop of the Golan Heights, said "we are in the
occupied Golan Heights, which the traitor Hafez Assad sold to Israel 40
years ago. These lands are blessed and the despicable Assad family
promised to liberate them, but for 40 years the Syrian army did not fire
a single bullet. We will open a military campaign against Israel. We
will fire the bullets that Assad did not and we will liberate the
Golan."
The Israel-Syria border has been mostly quiet since 1974.
A spokesman for the Foreign Ministry has
voiced his concerns about the potential for radical Sunni elements to
take power in a post-Assad Syria.
"There is a great concern that uncontrolled
elements at the service of extremist ideas will manage to take over
smaller or bigger separate territories inside the Syrian borders,” Yigal
Palmor told the Turkish Hürriyet Daily News in an interview in
Jerusalem.
"The ‘Somalization’ of Syria is a great
concern. We hope that this war ends as quickly as possible, with a
central power emerging that will rule all Syria,” he said.
"We don’t have any pretext to [militarily]
intervene in what is going on in Syria. Nobody wants us to do that and
we don’t want to do that. We stay on the sidelines, except where our
vital security interests are threatened. We reserve our right to limited
intervention," Palmor said.
In the interview with the Turkish newspaper,
Palmor revealed that Israel had coordinated with the Red Cross to send
humanitarian aid into Syria, but Israel was told that the refugees
refused to receive aid from Israel. Private aid organizations in Israel
are already working with Jordan for human assistance to Syrian refugees,
Palmor said, adding, "this shows that the Israeli public wants to help
Syrians no matter what politics dictates."
In July 2012, Israel Defense Forces Director
of Military Intelligence Maj. Gen. Aviv Kochavi warned that global
jihadists have moved into Syrian territory bordering the Golan Heights
and could soon use the area to stage attacks on Israel. In a briefing to
the Knesset Foreign Affairs and Defense Committee, Kochavi said that
Islamic terrorists have taken advantage of the chaos created by the
Syrian civil war to approach the Golan area. Kochavi told lawmakers that
a power vacuum has created a possible arena in the Golan Heights for
anti-Israel operations, similar to what was happening in Egypt's Sinai
region, where the government in Cairo is finding it hard to impose its
authority on the desert peninsula.
"The Golan area is liable to become an arena
of operations against Israel in much the same way the Sinai is today,
and that's a result of the increasing entrenchment of global jihad in
Syria," he said.
In Dec. 2012 a senior Israeli intelligence
official told Channel 2 TV that global jihad groups have been preparing
near the border with Israel, and are "stockpiling huge amounts of lethal
weapons for a fight with Israel."
"The main problem is not the local rebel
groups but fighters coming from outside Syria. Hundreds of fighters have
begun streaming into Syria from Jordan and Iraq. They come from
countries like Saudi Arabia, Iraq, Libya, and many other countries.
We're talking about very dangerous people with experience fighting the
U.S. army in Iraq as well as fighting the regime in Libya. We estimate
that there are between 3,000 to 4,000 rebel fighters belonging to
radical Salafist groups who all belong under the al-Qaida umbrella," the
official said.
"We expect these rebels to stockpile a large
amount of rockets, a situation which will return the northern Israeli
communities into the line of fire. We assess that once the foreign
rebels have finished fighting Assad's army they will all turn their
attention to the border with Israel. There is no question about it. Once
the Assad regime falls, we will start seeing incidents on our border. I
assess that it will start with a trickle of incidents, like we see on
the Egyptian border, and further down the line we'll start seeing the
firing of anti-tank missiles at IDF vehicles, roadside bombs against
patrols, and these are only the incidents I can reveal. I believe we
will see much worse things," the official said.
Meanwhile, the German Der Spiegel magazine
reported on Sunday that the United States is secretly providing military
training in Jordan to Syrian rebels. According to the report, some 200
rebel fighters have already received training in recent months and there
are future plans to train a total of 1,200 members of the Free Syrian
Army at two camps in southern and eastern Jordan. The U.S. State
Department declined to comment on the report.
Arab media on Sunday reported fierce, ongoing
battles between rebels and the Syrian military throughout the country.
More than 150 people were reportedly killed over the past day.
U.N. High Commissioner for Refugees Antonio
Guterres warned on Sunday that there could be three million Syrian
refugees by the end of 2013, if the violence in the country continues.
According to reports on Al-Arabiya and
Al-Jazeera, Free Syrian Army fighters captured a Syrian military aerial
defense base in the Deir el-Zour region of northeastern Syria near the
Iraqi border. Rebels flaunted a large cache of anti-aircraft missiles
taken from the base and accused the Iraqi military of helping Assad's
forces.
Also on Sunday, the deputy head of Hezbollah,
Sheikh Naim Qassem, said in an interview with a Kuwaiti newspaper that
the Assad regime has the situation under control in Syria and is close
to subduing the rebels.
Qassem denied reports that he was recently injured in a Syrian rebel ambush of a convoy travelling from Beirut to Damascus.
Qassem also warned Israel not to attack Lebanon, saying,
"the Israelis grossly violate Lebanese sovereignty and penetrate
Lebanon via the air, sea and land. We reserve the right to respond to
any Israeli action in Lebanon as we see fit."
http://www.israelhayom.com/site/newsletter_article.php?id=7883
Jedi_Mindset
03-16-2013, 03:02 PM
Drone strikes in Syria? CIA ‘boosting’ intelligence force to ‘size up’ Syrian extremists
The CIA may be preparing for lethal drone strikes in Syria, as it is extending its intelligence-gathering on Islamic radicals in the country, US media has reported. At the same time, US officials are pressing for the supplying arms to rebels.
“The CIA has stepped up secret contingency planning to protect the United States and its allies as the turmoil expands in Syria, including collecting intelligence on Islamic extremists for the first time for possible lethal drone strikes,” according to current and former US officials, reported in the LA Times.
The agency’s counterterrorism center has recently transferred an unspecified number of targeting officers to the area. The center is notorious for its previous drone campaigns in Yemen and Pakistan.
Targeting officers are responsible for the compilation of large packages of information on specific zones. Those working on Syria are currently based at the organization’s headquarters in Langley, Virginia, as not many US operatives have been deployed to the area.
The increased focus on identifying threats in Syria carries the implication that the agency is preparing plans for counter-action – both violent and nonviolent – against potential militants, the Los Angeles Times reported.
“If we do this, why don't we start droning people in Hezbollah?” a former CIA officer with experience in Iraq told the Los Angeles Times. “It opens the door for a lot of other things.”
In a trend apparently countering the CIA’s alleged security efforts, a US lawmaker is set to propose a bill on Monday in support of providing arms and training to Syrian opposition forces, as well as economic backing. Should the arms be delivered, they could easily fall into the hands of the same militants they seek to suppress.
Rep. Eliot Engel, the top Democrat on the House Foreign Affairs Committee, wrote a letter to his house colleagues seeking their support for a bill to provide arms and training to Syrian rebels, applying pressure to the Obama’s administration.
"US training and arming of carefully vetted Syrian opposition forces offer many potential benefits, but two stand out above all: Bringing the humanitarian disaster to an end as soon as possible and helping ensure that the US has a constructive relationship with a successor government in Damascus,” said the letter obtained by AP.
The idea is supported by officials from both parties – last month, Republican Sen. Marco Rubio suggested providing the Syrian opposition with ammunition, and Secretary of State John Kerry announced a package of ‘nonlethal assistance.'
European media reported that the US, UK and France are already training rebels in Jordan, while Paris and London are both attempting to bring forward an EU meeting to lift the arms embargo on Syria. Planned for May, the two countries are pressing for it to take place before the end of March.
If the union does not end the embargo, the two nations will still arm the Syrian rebels, France said.
However, this course of action could come with its own problems: “Weapons are in high demand by all rebel factions and there is little means to effectively prevent arms from gravitating toward hardcore Al-Qaeda fighters,” political analyst Nile Bowie told RT.
On Saturday, European Union foreign policy chief Catherine Ashton said the EU must think “very carefully” about lifting the arms embargo, as it could make a political settlement to the Syrian conflict more difficult.
"Would putting weapons into the field make it more or less likely that others will do the same? What would be the response of Assad based on what we know about his response so far? Would it stop people being killed or would it kill people faster?" AP quoted her as saying.
On Wednesday, Russian Foreign Minister Sergey Lavrov said that any arming of the opposition in Syria would be a violation of international law.
On Friday, Syria witnessed the second anniversary of the uprising from which the conflict sprouted, with many saying they feared for the country’s future.
The US Department of the Treasury has allowed the country’s citizens, companies and banks to transfer funds and provide services to the Syrian opposition. At the same time, all transactions with forces loyal to President Assad are prohibited.
"The United States is committed to supporting the Syrian people's aspirations for a Syrian-led political transition to a democratic, inclusive, and peaceful Syria," the Treasury said in a statement on Friday. “The Syrian government has sacrificed all legitimacy in its violent attempts to cling to power."
"Export, re-export, sell or supply, directly or indirectly" are now authorized to the National Coalition for Syrian Revolutionary and Opposition Forces, who are the “sole legitimate representative of the Syrian people,” the Treasury said.
Washington officially recognized the Syrian opposition in December last year, having already provided the Coalition with nearly $500 million in non-military aid.
http://www.russiatoday.com/news/syria-usa-rebel-drone-356/
ReplyThe CIA may be preparing for lethal drone strikes in Syria, as it is extending its intelligence-gathering on Islamic radicals in the country, US media has reported. At the same time, US officials are pressing for the supplying arms to rebels.
“The CIA has stepped up secret contingency planning to protect the United States and its allies as the turmoil expands in Syria, including collecting intelligence on Islamic extremists for the first time for possible lethal drone strikes,” according to current and former US officials, reported in the LA Times.
The agency’s counterterrorism center has recently transferred an unspecified number of targeting officers to the area. The center is notorious for its previous drone campaigns in Yemen and Pakistan.
Targeting officers are responsible for the compilation of large packages of information on specific zones. Those working on Syria are currently based at the organization’s headquarters in Langley, Virginia, as not many US operatives have been deployed to the area.
The increased focus on identifying threats in Syria carries the implication that the agency is preparing plans for counter-action – both violent and nonviolent – against potential militants, the Los Angeles Times reported.
“If we do this, why don't we start droning people in Hezbollah?” a former CIA officer with experience in Iraq told the Los Angeles Times. “It opens the door for a lot of other things.”
In a trend apparently countering the CIA’s alleged security efforts, a US lawmaker is set to propose a bill on Monday in support of providing arms and training to Syrian opposition forces, as well as economic backing. Should the arms be delivered, they could easily fall into the hands of the same militants they seek to suppress.
Rep. Eliot Engel, the top Democrat on the House Foreign Affairs Committee, wrote a letter to his house colleagues seeking their support for a bill to provide arms and training to Syrian rebels, applying pressure to the Obama’s administration.
"US training and arming of carefully vetted Syrian opposition forces offer many potential benefits, but two stand out above all: Bringing the humanitarian disaster to an end as soon as possible and helping ensure that the US has a constructive relationship with a successor government in Damascus,” said the letter obtained by AP.
The idea is supported by officials from both parties – last month, Republican Sen. Marco Rubio suggested providing the Syrian opposition with ammunition, and Secretary of State John Kerry announced a package of ‘nonlethal assistance.'
European media reported that the US, UK and France are already training rebels in Jordan, while Paris and London are both attempting to bring forward an EU meeting to lift the arms embargo on Syria. Planned for May, the two countries are pressing for it to take place before the end of March.
If the union does not end the embargo, the two nations will still arm the Syrian rebels, France said.
However, this course of action could come with its own problems: “Weapons are in high demand by all rebel factions and there is little means to effectively prevent arms from gravitating toward hardcore Al-Qaeda fighters,” political analyst Nile Bowie told RT.
On Saturday, European Union foreign policy chief Catherine Ashton said the EU must think “very carefully” about lifting the arms embargo, as it could make a political settlement to the Syrian conflict more difficult.
"Would putting weapons into the field make it more or less likely that others will do the same? What would be the response of Assad based on what we know about his response so far? Would it stop people being killed or would it kill people faster?" AP quoted her as saying.
On Wednesday, Russian Foreign Minister Sergey Lavrov said that any arming of the opposition in Syria would be a violation of international law.
On Friday, Syria witnessed the second anniversary of the uprising from which the conflict sprouted, with many saying they feared for the country’s future.
The US Department of the Treasury has allowed the country’s citizens, companies and banks to transfer funds and provide services to the Syrian opposition. At the same time, all transactions with forces loyal to President Assad are prohibited.
"The United States is committed to supporting the Syrian people's aspirations for a Syrian-led political transition to a democratic, inclusive, and peaceful Syria," the Treasury said in a statement on Friday. “The Syrian government has sacrificed all legitimacy in its violent attempts to cling to power."
"Export, re-export, sell or supply, directly or indirectly" are now authorized to the National Coalition for Syrian Revolutionary and Opposition Forces, who are the “sole legitimate representative of the Syrian people,” the Treasury said.
Washington officially recognized the Syrian opposition in December last year, having already provided the Coalition with nearly $500 million in non-military aid.
http://www.russiatoday.com/news/syria-usa-rebel-drone-356/
GuestFellow
03-20-2013, 09:21 PM
Truly an inspiring post. Made my skin shiver! *shivers* I'm so flabbergasted. It's all our fault. :cry:
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