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alya1
08-03-2013, 05:19 AM
Assalamualikum,
I'm an F&B high school student. I have to practice a lot at cooking. Once in awhile, i have to make sauce which is required red wine as one of its ingredients. I forced myself not to taste it even a lick. But at the end, i have to taste it because i want to get a good score.
So, how is it? Is it halal or haram? I think that i did a big sin. I'm afraid and worried too if someday i'll have to make dish with red wine as the ingredient anymore. Can someone give me the answer?
Thank you in advance. :)

Wassalam
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sister herb
08-03-2013, 05:50 AM
Salam alaykum

I am not scholar of islam but next time you could find some ways to replace red wine when cooking. Here is one:

Red wine: chicken or beef broth, grape juice mixed with a water or tomato juice.

May Allah forgives you if you did something haram.

(I am muslim cook. :thankyou:)
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Scimitar
08-03-2013, 05:53 AM
you know sister - google is your friend? :)

Here is what google can do for you:

Fatwa: Questions and Answers on Vinegar

http://www.islamonline.net
Question: I have a very important question to me because it make me crazy. Please can you tell me is brandy vinegar HALAL or HARAM? That is because it is in ketchup mustard, mayonnaise and someone told me that in bred in all juices (apple or orange) there is alcohol content from 0,1% - 0,5%. Is it now haram when I drink apple juice or eating bread? Baraka Allahu fikum!
Answer: The juristic rule of istihlak states that any substance that is so INSIGNIFICANT because of its quantity as mixed with an overriding halal substance(s), then it is forgiven. If we apply this rule to your question, we would say what experts have concluded in this regard, that any quantity of alcohol that does not exceed the amount of 0.5% is not intoxicating, and therefore it would not render juice or bread haram when mixed with them. The same applies to ketchup, mustard, etc.
People who misunderstand this rule are often confused with the interpretation of the hadith “whatever intoxicates in big quantity, a small amount of it is haram.” However, the hadith is only talking about the “intoxicating substance” that is not mixed with others. For example, a Muslim is not allowed to take little drops of wine and drinks them under the pretext that he won’t get drunk. But when the alcohol is mixed with other substance to the effect that it has become irrelevant (up to 0.5%) then it has become another substance that falls under the rules of either istihlak or istihalah (transformation).



You might find this guide on evaporation of alcohol quite useful for you sister:

Amount of Alcohol Retained During Cooking
Source: USDA (United States Department of Agriculture)
Process Used
Evaporation
Retention
Alcohol added to boiling liquid, then removed from heat
85%
15%
Alcohol flamed
70%
30%
No heat, stored overnight
75%
25%


Many people believe that because alcohol is sensitive to heat, it is eliminated with cooking. However, not all the alcohol content of alcoholic drinks is removed with heat; it depends on the type and time of cooking.

For instance if you add beer or wine to boiling liquid, then immediately remove it from the heat, 85 per cent of the alcohol content will remain. If you light the alcohol, as in flambé dishes, 75 per cent will remain. Even after simmering the dish for one and a half hours, it will still have 20 per cent of the original alcohol content.

It is only if you simmer the mixture for two or more hours, (as you would with a wine-based beef casserole), that as much as five to 10 per cent of the original alcohol content still remains.


Alcohol Retention During Cooking
Source: USDA
Process Used
Time
Evaporated
Amount Retained
Baked - not stirred into mixture
25 min
55%
45%
Baked, simmered or stirred into mixture:
15 min
60%
40%
"
30 min
65%
35%
"
1 hour
75%
25%
"
1.5 hours
80%
20%
"
2 hours
90%
10%
"
2.5 hours
95%
5%



This means that you won't hit the 0.5% bar of safety until you've cooked for about 25 hours lol. So it can't be halal then can it?

Scimi

EDIT:

Originally Posted by sister herb
Red wine: chicken or beef broth, grape juice mixed with a water or tomato juice.
Now that is something I might have to try one day :)
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sister herb
08-03-2013, 06:06 AM
Salam alaykum

Sometimes, just sometimes I think that we should stop to wonder all the time this haram- thing. Several foods we eat might have ingredients from the the fermentation process like bread or sweet buns with yeast.

:omg:
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sister herb
08-03-2013, 06:12 AM
Originally Posted by Scimitar
Now that is something I might have to try one day :)
Salam alaykum

Sometimes (when needed) I work in one halal restaurant as cook/chief. All our foods are 100% halal. You are welcome if you come here some day.

(Was this commercial?)

:embarrass
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alya1
08-03-2013, 01:49 PM
Originally Posted by sister herb
Salam alaykum

I am not scholar of islam but next time you could find some ways to replace red wine when cooking. Here is one:

Red wine: chicken or beef broth, grape juice mixed with a water or tomato juice.

May Allah forgives you if you did something haram.

(I am muslim cook. :thankyou:)
Waalaikum salam,
I use chicken and (or) beef broth together with red wine hehe
Aameen :)

How nice, i wish to be one just like you :D
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alya1
08-03-2013, 01:59 PM
Originally Posted by Scimitar
you know sister - google is your friend? :)
Yes brother, i know. But there are lots of different answers on google (positive and negative). Just making sure, which answer is right.

Thanks for the help :D
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alya1
08-03-2013, 02:03 PM
Originally Posted by sister herb
Salam alaykum

Sometimes, just sometimes I think that we should stop to wonder all the time this haram- thing. Several foods we eat might have ingredients from the the fermentation process like bread or sweet buns with yeast.

:omg:
Waalaikum salam,

Exactly, but since my country is a muslim-majority country i don't really worry about the haram thing. Almost every foods have the halal logo, even the imported one. So, when this haram thing comes, i worry too much hehe :hiding:
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Kâsva
08-03-2013, 04:05 PM
Most intoxicating, less part where Haram is not it?
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ardianto
08-03-2013, 04:23 PM
Originally Posted by sister herb
Several foods we eat might have ingredients from the the fermentation process like bread or sweet buns with yeast.
No one drunk because bread or sweet buns. So, these are not "khamr" (intoxicants).
Reply

greenhill
08-03-2013, 07:27 PM
...and no one has gotten drunk from eating from eating foods cooked with alcohol, have they?

Originally Posted by Scimitar
This means that you won't hit the 0.5% bar of safety until you've cooked for about 25 hours lol. So it can't be halal then can it?
When specifics come in like 0.5%, means in what context? total volume of ingredients? If x ml of wine/brandy/whatever constitutes 1% of the ingredient, then the actual alcohol content is a lot less even before cooking and is rendered insignificant after cooking or a day later.

To me, the point is, why the need to have it in there in the first place? To find ingenious ways to make it ok? To bend the laws somehow? Does it significantly improve the taste or soften the meat or other aspects? I am told coca cola works well as a meat tenderizer!

Tough call.

Irish coffee, anyone? ;D

Sorry, bad joke!
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alya1
08-04-2013, 10:16 AM
Originally Posted by Kâsva
Most intoxicating, less part where Haram is not it?
Yes brother :)
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alya1
08-04-2013, 10:22 AM
Originally Posted by greenhill

To me, the point is, why the need to have it in there in the first place? To find ingenious ways to make it ok? To bend the laws somehow? Does it significantly improve the taste or soften the meat or other aspects? I am told coca cola works well as a meat tenderizer!

Tough call.

Irish coffee, anyone? ;D

Sorry, bad joke!
Salaam,
I think it's improve the taste. Fresher, increase the appetite. I think... :)
Reply

Kâsva
08-04-2013, 02:23 PM
:) It is not so important when the rates CONSEQUENTIAL HARAM HARAM
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عابر سبيل
08-04-2013, 02:58 PM
وعليكم السلام ورحمة الله وبركاته

It is forbidden to use alcohol according to this source:

http : //islamqa . info/en/103881

Relevant parts include:

This prohibition is general and applies to all manners of using alcohol, whether in food or in drink. It is not permissible to use it in food or drink in any way whatsoever.

And:

The one who cooks meat with alcohol and consumes the juice is to be subjected to the hadd punishment, because the essence of the alcohol is still present. The same applies to making dough with it and eating it. This was stated by the Shaafa’is and Hanbalis. End quote.

And:

If he makes dough with flour and alcohol, then bakes it, it is makrooh (i.e., haraam) to eat it, because the flour becomes impure from the alcohol and the impure dough cannot be purified by baking, so it is not permissible to eat it. end quote.

The evidences for these rulings can be found in the source.

Lastly, we have this hadith:

In Sunan Abi Dawood (3189) it is narrated that Ibn ‘Umar (may Allaah be pleased with him) said: The Messenger of Allaah (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “Allaah has cursed alcohol, the one who drinks it, the one who pours it, the one who sells it, the one who buys it, the one squeezes (the grapes, etc), the one for whom it is squeezed, the one who carries it and the one to whom it is carried.” Classed as saheeh by al-Albaani as stated in Saheeh Abi Dawood, 2/700.

And so even just looking at this hadith alone, you can see it's impossible to deal with it without falling into at least one of these categories.

So we see it's a serious matter. If one did not know, they can ask for forgiveness and not fall into the sin again.
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alya1
08-04-2013, 03:11 PM
Originally Posted by Kâsva
:) It is not so important when the rates CONSEQUENTIAL HARAM HARAM
:) :) :)
Reply

alya1
08-04-2013, 03:21 PM
Originally Posted by عابر سبيل
وعليكم السلام ورحمة الله وبركاته


If he makes dough with flour and alcohol, then bakes it, it is makrooh (i.e., haraam) to eat it, because the flour becomes impure from the alcohol and the impure dough cannot be purified by baking, so it is not permissible to eat it. end quote.
Salaam,

Astagfirullah Hal'adzim. I hope i'm not fall to this sin again :(
But i think makrooh isn't haraam, brother.

islamqa. com/en/ref/9084

"In the terminology of sharee’ah it means that which the Lawgiver asks us not to do, but not in a definitive manner. It may be said that it means that for which the person who does not do it out of obedience will be rewarded, but the one who does it will not be punished."
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Hasan Ibn Omer
08-04-2013, 04:00 PM
assalamualaikum warahmatullahi wabarakatuh. its a good question and its good you have such Iman to feel this way.

Allas says:

"O you who have believed, indeed, intoxicants, gambling, [sacrificing on] stone alters [to other than Allah ], and divining arrows are but defilement from the work of Satan, so avoid it that you may be successful."


"Satan only wants to cause between you animosity and hatred through intoxicants and gambling and to avert you from the remembrance of Allah and from prayer. So will you not desist?"






(surat al-mā'idah verse 90 and 91)

and in a Hadith the Prophet Muhammad (Sallallahu Alaihi Wasallam - Peace be upon him) said:

"Avoid wine, it is the mother of abominations"
(Ad-Darqutni, An-Nasa'i and Al-Baihaqi).

Therefore, if anyone does not avoid it, he then disobeys Allah and His Messenger and thus entails punishment.

and Allah say:

"And whoever disobeys Allah and His Messenger and transgresses His limits - He will put him into the Fire to abide eternally therein, and he will have a humiliating punishment."


(an-nisa verse 14).

Abdullah Ibn Amr held that, "Wine is the worst of the major sins."
(Al-Hakim in Mustadrak)


my dear Brother you must make sincere repentance to Allah for what you've done and it is authentic that when a drop of wine touches the tongue that all good deeds you do for 40 days are not accepted by Allah.
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Hasan Ibn Omer
08-04-2013, 04:03 PM
sorry didn't mean to say my dear brother meant to say SISTER! sorry for the typo.
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habib al-almass
08-05-2013, 02:34 AM
“Thank those who correct you. It is through them that the Almighty chose to help you by highlighting your error” :cry:
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alya1
08-05-2013, 03:54 PM
Originally Posted by Hasan Ibn Omer
sorry didn't mean to say my dear brother meant to say SISTER! sorry for the typo.
Astagfirullah, thank you for the answer. InshaAllah i will make a sincere repentance to Allah for what i've done..
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alya1
08-05-2013, 03:55 PM
Originally Posted by habib al-almass
“Thank those who correct you. It is through them that the Almighty chose to help you by highlighting your error” :cry:
Thank you brother :)
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