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سيف الله
02-05-2014, 12:04 PM
Salaam

How depressing

Ukip MEP says British Muslims should sign charter rejecting violence

Gerard Batten, Ukip's immigration spokesman, proposed ban on new European mosques and says Qur'an needs updating


A Ukip MEP believes that British Muslims should sign a special code of conduct and warns that it was a big mistake for Europe to allow "an explosion of mosques across their land". Gerard Batten, who represents London and is member of the party's executive, told the Guardian on Tuesdaythat he stood by a "charter of Muslim understanding", which he commissioned in 2006. The document asks Muslims to sign a declaration rejecting violence and says parts of the Qur'an that promote "violent physical Jihad" should be regarded as "inapplicable, invalid and non-Islamic".


Critics said his comments represent the "ugliest side of Ukip" and "overlap with the far-right", in spite of the efforts of party leader Nigel Farage to create a disciplined election machine ahead of the European elections.

Asked on Tuesday about the charter, Batten told the Guardian he had written it with a friend, who is an Islamic scholar, and could not see why "any reasonable, normal person" would object to signing it.

Batten also repeated his view that some Muslim texts need updating, claiming some say "kill Jews wherever you find them and various things like that".

"If that represents the thinking of modern people, there's something wrong, in which case maybe they need to revise their thinking. If they say they can't revise their thinking on those issues, then who's got the problem – us or them?" he added.



Asked why Muslims have been singled out, rather than followers of other faiths, Batten said: "Christians aren't blowing people up at the moment, are they? Are there any bombs going off round the world claimed by Christian organisations? I don't think so."

In a separate video interview from 2010, Batten also proposed a ban on new mosques across Europe, suggested Muslim countries should not be "appeased" and warned of the threats of having "two incompatible systems living in the same place at the same time".

Farage's effort to rid the party of "Walter Mitty" types comes after a stream of controversies, including the party's suspension of a councillor for blaming flooding on gay marriage and the ejection of MEP Godfrey Bloom following comments about women and sending foreign aid to "bongo-bongo land".

With Ukip hoping to top the polls in May's European elections, Batten is top of the party's MEP candidate list for London, having passed a round of psychometric testing to make sure his views were acceptable.

However, Batten – Ukip's spokesman on immigration and a former candidate for London mayor – appears to have held some controversial positions on Islam for some time. His "proposed charter of Muslim understanding" was written in 2006 by Sam Solomon, a former Muslim who converted to Christianity, with a foreword by the MEP himself.

In a press release from the time, published on Ukip's website, Batten calls on Muslims to sign a five-point affirmation, in which they would promise to accept equality, reject violence in the name of religion, and accept a need to "re-examine and address the meaning and application of certain Islamic texts and doctrines".

Asked on Tuesday whether he still believed Muslims should sign the charter, Batten said: "I don't suppose the pope would disagree with it or the archbishop of Canterbury or anybody else. So why should they feel aggrieved that they might be asked to sign. They don't have to. If they don't believe in those five points, they don't have to sign it."

In the 2010 interview, Batten suggests a ban on new mosques in "our cities" and warns it was wrong to have allowed so many already.

"They don't allow Christian churches or Hindu temples to be built or any kind of non-Muslim place of worship in many of their countries and certainly not in the heartland of their religion," he said.

"Well, if they don't allow it, why can they expect to see their religion tolerated somewhere else?

Asked about his views on the building of mosques, Batten told the Guardian: "Why do we allow the wholesale building of mosques by a religion that refuses in its heartland to acknowledge other people's right to worship a different religion?"

And pressed on whether he was confusing individual Muslims with the actions of some Muslim states, he said: "They should be protesting about people being arrested in Saudi Arabia for carrying a Bible. Maybe that's what they should be getting upset about and protesting about. Showing they are in the same mindset as the rest of us."

Rehman Chishti, the Conservative MP for Gillingham and Rainham, said Batten's position was "shocking", particularly the "charter of understanding" suggestion that parts of the Qur'an should be rendered "inapplicable". "If Nigel Farage had any credibility, he would quite clearly not allow this individual to stand for office in Ukip," he said.

Sadiq Khan, Labour's shadow London minister, also said he was "appalled at the ignorance that Gerard Batten appears to have shown when speaking about the faith that I and hundreds of thousands of British Muslims practice".

Mary Honeyball, a Labour MEP for London, said that Batten "represents the ugliest side of Ukip". "Batten's views overlap with the far-right. The idea that Muslims should be singled out in the way he suggests is a relic from a darker, more prejudiced time," she said.

Some of Batten's other controversial views include bringing back the death penalty for certain crimes. He has also sought to highlight the issue of powerful politicians attending the secretive Bilderberg conference and immigration of Romanians and Bulgarians.

In a statement to the Guardian, Batten later said: "I would expect the fundamentalists to agree with me that democracy is incompatible with fundamentalist Islam. Moderate Muslims have to decide which side of the argument they are on.

"Who is in favour of jihad? Apart from the jihadists of course? I was, and still am, happy to speak out against it. It is amusing that the Guardian equates being opposed to extremism and jihadism as 'overlapping with the far-right'. So are left-wing liberals in favour of jihad? If not, do they overlap too?"

It comes the day after Ukip distanced the party from Mujeeb ur Rehman Bhutto, its former Commonwealth spokesman, who was revealed by BBC Newsnight to have once been part of a kidnapping gang.

http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2014/feb/04/ukip-mep-gerard-batten-muslims-sign-charter-rejecting-violence
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crimsontide06
02-05-2014, 05:15 PM
Does this mean someone needs to make all men/women sign a pact that they will not kill,rape,steal???????


What do you think would happen if someone were to suggest that black people needed to sign something saying they won't rape white girls?? All heck would break loose....protesters would be in the streets going nuts over such racial profiling.
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Muezzin
02-05-2014, 07:11 PM
I wonder if Mr Batten would sign a charter rejecting the wearing of bright pink suits during EU meetings.
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'Abd-al Latif
02-05-2014, 07:43 PM
Ukip just can't stop being on the headlines for the wrong reasons. They previously suspended David Silvester for stating that the floods and natural disasters in UK is because of David Camron legalising homosexuality.

Ukip clearly aren't tolerant of any religion, even their own. Hopefully this ignoramus gets suspended too.
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'Abd-al Latif
02-05-2014, 07:58 PM
Nigel Farage distances himself from MEP over 'Muslim code of conduct'
Ukip leader says Gerard Batten's proposed charter was private publication and has never been party policy



Nigel Farage has said he is trying to rid Ukip of 'Walter Mitty' types after a string of controversies. Photograph: John Stillwell/PA

The Ukip leader, Nigel Farage, has distanced himself from the views of his own immigration spokesman, Gerard Batten, after the London MEP proposed a special code of conduct for Muslims.

Ukip stressed that asking Muslims to sign such a document had never been one of its policies, even though the launch of Batten's "proposed charter of Muslim understanding" used to be promoted on the party's website.

Batten, who was on Wednesday campaigning for Ukip in the Wythenshawe and Sale East byelection, told the Guardian this week that he could not see how any "reasonable, normal person" could object to signing the charter, which calls on Muslims to accept equality, reject violence and accept the need to modify the Qur'an.

In a separate video interview from 2010, Batten also proposed a ban on new mosques across Europe, suggested Muslim countries should not be "appeased" and warned of the threats of having "two incompatible systems living in the same place at the same time".

A number of MPs and MEPs condemned Batten's comments, with Robert Halfon, a Tory MP, accusing him of taking an "unbelievably sinister" position comparable to asking members of the faith to wear a yellow star.

Halfon, who is Jewish and has spoken out repeatedly against Islamic extremism, said he considered Batten's views frightening.

He tweeted: "Big difference [between lawful] Muslims & extreme Islamists. UKIP MEP Batten's statement a 1st step to wearing a Yellow Star."

Sarah Ludford, a Liberal Democrat MEP for London, also criticised the comments, saying they "rip apart Ukip's pretence" that it treats everybody equally.

"His offensive blanket stereotyping of Muslims as jihadists speaks volumes about Ukip's extremism and should warn voters that voting Ukip means associating with hatred and Islamophobia," she said.

Two prominent Muslim MPs, Sadiq Khan and Rehman Chishti, condemned the "offensive" idea of a charter for Muslims. Chishti said Batten, who is Ukip's immigration spokesman, should not be allowed to stand again as an MEP.

Meanwhile, Syed Kamall, the Conservative leader in the European parliament, who is a Muslim, left a letter on Batten's empty seat at the parliament chamber in Strasbourg, offering him a guarantee that he had no intention to commit acts of violence or promote extremism.

"Do you have a form I can sign already?" asked Kamall. "I am anxious to assure you that I have no intention of mounting any attacks on unsuspecting infidels, nor of attempting to radicalise you or anyone else.

"If the forms aren't ready yet, perhaps you would take this note as my guarantee? My wife and family would be most reassured to know you will allow me to stay in Britain, especially since I was born here. Please feel free to drop into my office to discuss this over a cup of tea. I promise you will be entirely safe."

Mohammed Shafiq, the chief executive of Muslim thinktank the Ramadhan Foundation, said asking one particular community to sign a "loyalty pledge" against violence was "offensive and an insult to all decent people".

In response to Batten's comments, Farage said in a statement: "This was a private publication from Gerard Batten in 2006 and its contents are not and never have been Ukip policy. No such policy proposals would have been accepted by Ukip in any case. Ukip believes in treating people equally."

It comes as Farage tries to rid the party of "Walter Mitty" types after a stream of controversies. These include the party's suspension of a councillor for blaming flooding on gay marriage and the ejection of the MEP Godfrey Bloom following comments about women and sending foreign aid to "bongo-bongo land".

It also comes the day after Ukip distanced the party from Mujeeb ur Rehman Bhutto, its former Commonwealth spokesman, who was revealed by BBC Newsnight to have once been part of a kidnapping gang.

With Ukip hoping to top the polls in May's European elections, Batten is top of the party's MEP candidate list for London, having passed a round of psychometric testing to make sure his views were acceptable.

Batten told the Guardian he had written the charter in 2006 with a friend, who is an Islamic scholar. Asked on Tuesday whether he still believed Muslims should sign the charter, Batten said: "I don't suppose the pope would disagree with it or the archbishop of Canterbury or anybody else. So why should they feel aggrieved that they might be asked to sign? They don't have to. If they don't believe in those five points, they don't have to sign it."

In a press release from the time, published on Ukip's website, Batten calls on Muslims to sign a five-point affirmation, in which they would promise to accept equality, reject violence in the name of religion, and accept a need to "re-examine and address the meaning and application of certain Islamic texts and doctrines".

Asked why Muslims had been singled out, rather than followers of other faiths, Batten said: "Christians aren't blowing people up at the moment, are they? Are there any bombs going off round the world claimed by Christian organisations? I don't think so."

In a statement to the Guardian, Batten later said: "I would expect the fundamentalists to agree with me that democracy is incompatible with fundamentalist Islam. Moderate Muslims have to decide which side of the argument they are on.

"Who is in favour of jihad? Apart from the jihadists of course? I was, and still am, happy to speak out against it. It is amusing that the Guardian equates being opposed to extremism and jihadism as 'overlapping with the far-right'. So are leftwing liberals in favour of jihad? If not, do they overlap too?"


http://www.theguardian.com/politics/...m-code-conduct
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M.I.A.
02-05-2014, 08:26 PM
in other party related news.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-26019668



imo any party can say what they like.

its the peoples responsibility not to lose there minds and jump on the bandwagon.


luckily its not a non-muslim petition.


..but iv counted like ten mosques within a mile of each other where i live.

probably a similar number of synagogues and churches.... not kidding


i think its a case of another out of touch politician, but he's talking about a bigger stage so i count for very little.
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Ahmad H
02-06-2014, 03:10 AM
This man just needs someone to properly explain the concept of Jihad to him. If he insists on the opposing view despite a scholar of Islam explaining and clarifying every point to him, then he should be considered ignorant of Islamic teachings and unable to comprehend them, and thus have no say on the matter. He needs reformation by having his views changed to understand the Holy Qur'an. It is better not to condemn him right away. If he is still lost after explaining things to him, then leave him to his own device. Allah will deal with him on the Day of Judgment and he won't have any excuses left. What excuse is there after he rejects the true message?
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glo
02-06-2014, 10:32 AM
Stupid suggestion. Even the UKIP leader thinks so!

Ukip leader says Gerard Batten's proposed charter was private publication and has never been party policy
http://www.theguardian.com/politics/...m-code-conduct
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sister herb
02-06-2014, 10:58 AM
Should also British Christians, Hindus, Jews, Atheists etc. sign same? I think they should. ^o)
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Karl
02-07-2014, 02:11 AM
Any publicity is good publicity. He must be aiming at the mindless bigot vote. Plenty of those in Britain. LOL
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