I need help

[zzz1234]

Hello.

A number of weeks ago I made a thread asking for a few questions on Islam to be answered, and the response was excellent, so thanks to everyone who helped.

Over the past few weeks it has been my intention to convert to Islam, I share the same beliefs that it teaches, although, unfortunately, I still am nowhere near educated enough in the religion to make a full commitment.

My father is a strict Christian, and after telling him of my desire to convert, he insisted in talking to me about faith and religion. He came up with questions about Islam I could not answer, and I am hoping that some of you may be able to answer these questions for me.

1. Obviously the area of the crucifixion of Jesus between Islam and Christianity is a very touchy subject. Islam believes that Jesus was not crucified. Why was it made to believe that he was? Was it to trick the enemy? What then happened after Jesus "escaped" being crucified, was it an instant ascension into heaven?

2. Jesus didn't die before he was ascended into heaven. Muhammad was killed. Does that not make Jesus a more "god-like" human? The fact that he couldn't be killed?

3. Jesus represented complete love and compassion. He never attacked anyone, never drove anyone to war, or killed in the name of God. Why would a Muhammad then have wars in the name of God, when this went completely against what Jesus was teaching?

4. Has the Qur'an really been completely preserved? I have been reading a few websites myself and noticed that some passages may have been taking out over the years.

5. God constantly acted through Jesus, whereas he didn't with any other prophet. Surely then Jesus was superior to a prophet, he was God in human form, that Jesus was the Son of God?

6. When Jesus rose to heaven, the apostles spread the same message Jesus taught them, and had no contradictions. My dad said that the four people close to Muhammad had different views and opinions on Muhammads word and taught them differently. Why would this happen to Muhammad and not Jesus?

I am sorry if any offence has been taken by anyone after reading this, it was not my intention. I have no doubt my dad will bombard me with more questions, and undoubtedly I will have some myself, but I would greatly appreciate if anyone could help me out with this.

Thank you.

[Alpha Dude]

Hey zzz1234,

The Prophet Jesus is in the heavens but every soul must taste death as per the Quraan. He will return later during the end times and will go on to die a natural death.

[jkekeis]

As a new muslim myself, I know it can be quite difficult to pick up on the plethora of information that constitutes this religion. I know that I won't be able to answer all of these questions, but I'll start with the one about Jesus. Simply put, Jesus had a beginning and an end, which Allah does not, therefore by that logic, he is not God, nor is he God-like, because he had no direct power to create any life form or change the universe. Example on that is the case of the bird, where he sculpted one out of clay, then breathed life into it, but the bird came to life only by the permission of Allah. To further the point there, let us suppose that Jesus was crucified (which Islam teaches us that it was just a man who was similar in appearance). If Jesus were Allah, the son of Allah, or God-like, then it would follow reasoning that he would not have died, nor could he have been killed, because the very nature of Allah says that He has no beginning or end.

As for the companions of the Prophet (SAW) having different opinions, we are all human. Some of us remember things better or worse, and in different perspectives. The Qur'an is the absolute guide to Islam, nothing there is debatable in terms of the message because it is the Word of Allah (SWT). The ahadith are the traditions of the Prophet (SAW) and as I said, we all see things in different ways. Ask a group of 10 persons to remember an event, they may not remember the same things.

I'll let the other brothers and sisters try to fill in, or if I am wrong, correct me. If I find any information, I will be pleased to pass it along.

[zzz1234]

Thanks for the response.

More help with the above questions is appreciated, but after longer talks with my dad, I have a few more. Please note that the questions are in my dad's words, not mine.

7. It seems like for Islam to succeed, it must kill off the crucifixion, as if it agrees with the crucifixion, it agrees with Christianity. Why would God trick people for 600 years (until God spoke to Muhammad) about the death of Jesus, why would he have them believe that Jesus died on the cross, and then 600 years later, say that he hadn't?

8. Why would a prophet of God run away from the Romans who are trying to crucify him? Why would he lead the apostles to believe he was crucified, and then appear to them saying he wasn't, and then the apostles go out and spread the word that Jesus HAD been crucified.

9. Why would Muhammad ask his cousins to divorce his wife so that he could marry her?

10. Muhammad used his power, Jesus never did. Muhammad had palaces, as much wives as he wanted, had all the riches, whereas Jesus always put others before him. Why would God send a greedy prophet after a kind one?

Again, I hope no one has taken any offence, but I would really appreciate it if people could give me answers on this as soon as possible, it would mean the world to me.

Thanks and God bless.

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[syed_z]

Greetings ...

. Why would Muhammad ask his cousins to divorce his wife so that he could marry her?

Are you referring to the divorce of Zaid Ibn Harith, he was not the cousin of Prophet (saw) but regarded him as a son, was not his actual son.

It seems like for Islam to succeed, it must kill off the crucifixion, as if it agrees with the crucifixion, it agrees with Christianity. Why would God trick people for 600 years (until God spoke to Muhammad) about the death of Jesus, why would he have them believe that Jesus died on the cross, and then 600 years later, say that he hadn't?

The Christians believe Jesus (a.s) to be the Messiah and believed him to be sent by the heavens, him and his mother Virgin Mary (a.s) and so does the Muslims. The only ones who rejected him were the Children of Israel, the jews, they rejected him as a Messiah, who was prophesied by several Prophets who came before him. They said that he was not the Messiah as prophesied in the Torah. So Allah (swt) in His Divine Wisdom chose a Prophet to deliver the truth to them in Madinah in Arabia where they were settled waiting for a last Prophet to appear as Prophesied in their scriptures (Book of Genesis, Book of Solomon, Book of Deuteronomy). Allah (swt) in His Mercy turned to them once again to inform them of this truth that Jesus (a.s) was the actual Messiah and that their ancestors were wrong in trying to crucify him:

(4:157) and their saying: 'We slew the Messiah, Jesus, son of Mary', the Messenger of Allah - whereas in fact they (The Jews) had neither slain him nor crucified him but the matter was made dubious to them - and those (the Christians) who differed about it too were in a state of doubt!

So Allah (swt) corrected both, the Jews and Christians by sending His Final Prophet to entire mankind. The Christians He corrected them by reminding them of the true followers of Jesus (a.s) the Unitarians (the ones who believed in Monotheism like Muslims) and did not have any of such sort of beliefs as the Trinitarians do today. So it is actually incorrect to say that Allah (swt) waited 600 years, He actually reminded the Trinitarians of the truth that existed from the time of Jesus (a.s).

[zzz1234]

Hi syed_z, thanks for your response.

I can see where you're coming from, but why would Allah allow thousands of people following fake beliefs for 600 years? If Jesus was sent to the Jews to fix the corruption in their religion, and then corruption followed after Jesus, surely, from an Islamic point of view, Jesus' time on Earth was a waste?

[syed_z]

Hi syed_z, thanks for your response.

I can see where you're coming from, but why would Allah allow thousands of people following fake beliefs for 600 years? If Jesus was sent to the Jews to fix the corruption in their religion, and then corruption followed after Jesus, surely, from an Islamic point of view, Jesus' time on Earth was a waste?

Your most welcome....

Allah (swt) sends His Prophets to deliver the Message and then those who corrupt the teachings (who are usually influential people like leaders and religious leaders) misguide many due to them being in power and holding influence. However the truthful ones do continue to follow the truth and are persecuted and face hardships for doing so, and Allah (swt) rewards his true followers and this way the misguided are separated from the guided One's on earth and will be on Judgment Day. So among the thousands, there were also thousands who believed that Jesus (a.s) was not the son of God, was just a righteous Prophet and they were persecuted for doing so (the Unitarians) but continued to hold on to the truth.

There is a Quran Verse which says.... Surah An Nahl 16:101

And Now that We replace one message by another....

Allah (swt) delivered His Messages and Teachings through thousands of His Prophets before the advent of Muhammad (Saw) but did not preserve those scriptures because he tested those nations to see if who would hold on to the truth and who would corrupt them for worldly benefits. But then he replaced them with a final Message for all mankind, the Quran and promised its Divine protection (Surah Al Hijr Verse 9) as there would be no new revelation after this one till Judgment Day.

Consider the following Verse of Surah Maidah where Allah (swt) explicitly informs that He gave those books to see how each nation deals with it, do they follow its Good and hold on to it or corrupt it for worldly pursuits:


(5:48)And unto you (O Prophet) have We vouchsafed this divine writ, setting forth the truth, confirming the truth of whatever there still remains of earlier revelations and determining what is true therein ... Unto Every One of you We appointed a (different) Law and a way of life. And if God had so willed. he would surely have made you all one single community: but (He willed it otherwise) in order to test you by means of what He has vouchsafed unto you. Vie, then, with one another in doing good works! Unto God you all must return: and then He will make you truly understand all that on which you used to differ.

[zzz1234]

Thanks again syed_z.

Before Muhammad, you said there were Christians who rejected the idea of a trinity. Where there any who rejected Jesus being the son of God? Where there any who agreed that it was someone else who was crucified?

Could I also ask if there are any online pdf's you would recommend so that I can further my knowledge of Muhammad and Islam? I do know a fair bit about them both, but I'm eager to learn more, Islam seems a beautiful religion, and I hope that all my questions can eventually be answered, as I feel as it is only a matter of time before I convert.

[zzz1234]

I am also confused over whether Muhammad was illiterate or not. It seems like he was portrayed as being literate, but after reading some articles, some people suggest he became literate after recieving the first revelation. Also, an article pointed out about how he used to be a merchant, so obviously he would be dealing with numbers. But numbers did not exist at that time, letters of the alphabet were used instead, so how could he be a successful merchant yet be illiterate?

In 25:2 in the Quran, it says: "These are the tales from the past that he wrote down. They are being dictated to him day and night". Surely this says that he wrote down what was being revealed to him?

Thanks.

[Insaanah]

Greetings zzz1234

On the one hand you say you believe in the beautiful religion of Islam, and you're virtually ready to convert, but on the other hand, your questions are related to facts that are generally falsely stated on anti-Islamic sites. Or by people who perhaps might not want you to become Muslim. You could carry on reading these on the internet, or speaking to people who put questions to create doubt in your mind, and you could go around in circles forever, with more and more things you feel need clarifying, as you will find endless false accusations, rebuttals etc. But what will happen of your faith in the meantime? I would advise you to stop reading these sites, if you believe that:

There is only One God. He alone should be worshipped. He is our Creator, Sustainer, and Lord.

He does not beget, nor is He begotten. He has no sons, daughters, spouses, siblings, parents, cousins, or relatives of any sort.

He is eternal and does not die. He does not depend on anyone/anything yet we all depend on Him. He is free of all want and need.

There is nothing like Him. He is all Hearing, all Seeing, all Knowing, all Powerful, Incomparable, the Creator of the Universe.

He did not/does not, become flesh, dwell in human or animal bodies, nor are there any incarnations of Him. He is not mixed up in His creation in any way.

He is not composed of persons, nor a trinity. There are no secondary, lesser, greater, equal, or multiple gods, nor any intermediaries. And no denying of God's existence either.

There are no sharers, associates, persons or parts whatsoever in His exclusive Divinity. Simply, He is One, in every sense.

Islam encourages reflecting, pondering, considering, thinking, asking people of knowledge when we're not sure about a matter. However, if one goes to anti-Islamic sites, and gets endless doubts created in their mind, then are they using their time usefully? Are they likely to find guidance that way, or just get more misunderstandings?

I see you've also previously been advised:

Stay away from shady books and websites and stick to the Quran and Hadith, those allegations are there to make people like you question their belief.

If you know Islam to be the truth, you are under no duty to have the knowledge to answer all your fathers "questions". There are sites out there that have such questions/allegations/rebuttals etc which he can look at. Until then, tell him that once you're firm in your faith, and have learnt more, then you'll help him in understanding Islam.For now, you'd be well advised to get firmer grounding in the core concepts of Islam, and once you have, then you can start looking into answering such issues. But do not let yourself waiver from the truth, or be distracted by such "issues" and before you know it, you've been misled off the staight path into a never ending quandary.

With regards to:

In 25:2 in the Quran, it says: "These are the tales from the past that he wrote down. They are being dictated to him day and night". Surely this says that he wrote down what was being revealed to him?

The verse you've quoted above, has the reference 25:5, not 25:2, but also, you have missed out the beginning of the verse, which is "And they say:". In other words, it was an accusation made against the Prophet (peace be upon him) by people - it is not Allah stating a fact. This is a prime example of how going to such sites creates confusion, doubt and misunderstandings in your mind.

The only point I'm going to address in this post, is not one you asked here, but in your previous thread, because it's an issue on which the whole of Christianity hinges, and the one that is the most important to you:

Despite wanting to join Islam, as a Christian believing Jesus was crucified and resurrected my whole life is something very hard to quit believing in.

In Christianity, God did not forgive Adam (peace be upon him) for eating from the tree, and not only Adam, but all subsequent generations have to bear a punishment from God, and fell out of grace with God, their relationship with God was severed, and they are born into a state of sin. Because humans are imperfect (partly because of the aforementioned sin), thus to atone for our imperfection and to reconcile people to God and repair the severed relationship, and to forgive (but in reality atone) people's sins, the sacrifice of an innocent man (who also happens to be God) and his slow, bloody, painful and humiliating death comes into play.

With Allah forgiving Adam (peace be upon him) and honouring him and guiding him, as per Islam, none of the above is needed.

Then his Lord chose him and turned to him in forgiveness and guided [him].(Qur'an 20:122)

Simple. In Islam, while guidance and the right way has been shown to us, we, as humans, have the freedom to choose, to err, and to repent sincerely, and should we do so, we will find Allah Kind & Forgiving, forgiving freely and abundantly with just His will, no sacrifice needed, because it is truly forgiveness rather than atonement. For all and any in the posterity of Adam, the door of returning to the right path is always open, prior to death. We give Christians and all non-Muslims an invitation to return to this right path, the path of all the Prophets.

Nobody else is responsible for our sins or carries them away. No innocent person is made to suffer or die for other's sins. Babies are not born in a state of sin, but a state of innocence and purity. There is no concept of original sin, nor of God expecting perfection which cannot be achieved, nor of a broken relationship with God that requires reconciling, nor of ****ation requiring a saviour. Forgiveness is directly from God. Prayer is directly to God. God is the God of all, even of those who don't believe in Him.

None of us can say, "We are saved". This is what the day of judgement is for. We strive with faith and deeds and obedience to God, do our best, and trust in His Promise, and His Justice, and hoping for His Mercy.

For Christians, this may be hard. They believe that by accepting Jesus (peace be upon him) as their saviour they have an assurance of salvation, and view the Islamic position on salvation as being one of uncertainty. As a rough (not exact) analogy, the Christian position, is like one sitting an exam, but somebody has said they'll take all your bad marks for you, and if you let them do that, you'll pass. In the world, this would be viewed as cheating and as unjust. Injustice cannot be ascribed to God. The Islamic position is that of one sitting an exam, doing their best, and then awaiting their results, based on what they've done, and of course hoping for the mercy of God and trusting in His Promise.

We strive, and hope for God's Mercy and trust in Him, for none is more trustworthy than He, but for Christians, it is as though they must have a guarantee from God. We need no such guarantee, and do not feel in any way compromised by not having one, which is a key point where, as demonstrated, they try to catch Muslims. None of us would have a guarantee of passing an exam until we got our results, and this is no different. What greater thing is there than Gods Mercy? We try our best and hope for His Mercy and trust in His Promise, no guarantees needed, as He is not a human who will let us down, or be unjust, on the contrary we will not be wronged by even the spot on a date stone.

Muslims love and respect Jesus (peace be upon him) and believe in him as he was; one of the most noble and purest of humanity to ever walk the earth, and one of the greatest messengers of Allah, sent to the Children of Israel. We do not go to the extreme of rejecting him (as Jews do), nor do we go to the other opposite extreme of deifying him (as Christians do). Neither he, nor any other messenger, was divine, ever claimed divinity, or to be God's son. We believe he was born miraculously of the noble virgin Mary (peace be on her), and that he is the messiah. We do not however, believe that he died or was crucified. He will return to earth near the end of time.

This is an interesting link to read on the "crucifixion" of Jesus (peace be upon him) with evidence from the Bible: DECONSTRUCTING ISAIAH 53

and if you are interested, a short booklet called Crucifixion or Crucifiction (again, evidenced from the Bible): https://docs.google.com/viewer?url=h...ci-fiction.pdf

You were also given some useful links in the previous thread too on the crucifixion too. It might be worth giving them another read.

This section has some good links on various topics addressing allegations/misconceptions about Islam. I'm pressed for time now but have a read of the posts (first one is a brief index, others give specific titles) and see which ones are most important to you.

http://www.islamicboard.com/clarific...l-threads.html

And lastly, do ask any relevant questions you have, bearing in mind the advice that has been given.

May Allah guide you to the truth. Ameen.

Peace.

[zzz1234]

Hello Insaanah,

Thank you for your detailed response, it has certainly made things clearer for me.

By asking these questions, I am trying to approach Islam from an unbiased view, and looking for questions that may challenge it, as if I convert I want to be completely sure it is the one true religion.

At the moment I agree with Islam more than I do with Christianity, it is just that when my father asked me the above questions, I did not have the answers to them (I'm not very good at debating). Although the research you have supplied seems clear enough that the resurrection did not happen. I will continue with the links you have provided and hopefully I can come to a conclusion about converting soon.

Many thanks, and God bless.

[syed_z]

I am also confused over whether Muhammad was illiterate or not. It seems like he was portrayed as being literate, but after reading some articles, some people suggest he became literate after recieving the first revelation.

The word that we would use is 'Unlettered' and not illiterate I suggest. He was not a man of letters as every other person was in that society, it was a society of poets. He was the one who did not know how to read nor write.

The Quran mentions this a few places including Surah 29:48-51

And you did not recite before it any scripture, nor did you inscribe one with your right hand. Otherwise the falsifiers would have had [cause for] doubt.......But they say, "Why are not signs sent down to him from his Lord?".....And is it not sufficient for them that We revealed to you the Book which is recited to them? Indeed in that is a mercy and reminder for a people who believe.

In this Verse Allah (swt) rhetorically repeats their question of why Muhammad (Saw) doesn't show a miraculous sign, while proving to them that they see the greatest miracle of all that he does not know how to read or write yet hes reciting Verses which is revolutionizing the entire society.

[Scimitar]

Hi syed_z, thanks for your response.

I can see where you're coming from, but why would Allah allow thousands of people following fake beliefs for 600 years? If Jesus was sent to the Jews to fix the corruption in their religion, and then corruption followed after Jesus, surely, from an Islamic point of view, Jesus' time on Earth was a waste?

who says that all Christians were following trinitarian doctrine for 600 years? The coptic Christians who today form a majority in the unitarian church - do not follow the trinitarian doctrine and do not believe that Jesus pbuh was the begotten son of God either... most of these unitarian churches are today in Russia.

God necesstiated the coming of the final prophet when the unitarians started to hold beliefs in saints with no authority to do so... this "following of saints" is rife in Russia today and the theology of unitarian Christianity has been compromised since the late 5th to early 6th century AD - precisely the time when it Muhammad pbuh began to preach in Makkah.

Interesting isn't it? History is a nuanced subject - no linear view of history will ever justify anyones disposition - and further, those who seek "conformation bias" will most definitely find it - but it will be nothing but swiss cheese in their brain - large holes missing and all.

To think that Christianity has always been trinitarian in belief is a fallacy of western born Christians. A lot of Christians in other parts of the world are in stark theological opposition to the trinitarian RCC... I'm sure I don't have to tell you this - but I am mentioning this for a reason.

You see, when you try to argue why Jesus pbuh is greater than so and so, by giving x,y, and z reason - you will always make real historians facepalm on your behalf. Why?

Because what is fitting and necessary for a man of one time, may be different for a man in another time... you cannot make a comparison between prophets to claim who is greater - that knowledge is only with God alone.

Scimi

[zzz1234]

Hi Scimi.

Thanks for your reply. I slightly knew about Christians who do not accept the trinity, but didn't know of any that reject the concept of Jesus being the Son Of God. I don't know if the questions I asked seem like I'm trying to disprove Islam, believe me, I'm not, I actually want to believe that Islam is the true religion, but in order to do so I felt the need to ask such questions.

You have made things clearer for me, and I greatly appreciate that. Thank you.

[Scimitar]

You are welcome bro, sorry if my post came off a little blunt - I'm so used to posting this way that it's become a bad habit lol. No harm intended.

Some other things to consider,

1. Obviously the area of the crucifixion of Jesus between Islam and Christianity is a very touchy subject. Islam believes that Jesus was not crucified. Why was it made to believe that he was? Was it to trick the enemy? What then happened after Jesus "escaped" being crucified, was it an instant ascension into heaven?

The details of the actual ascension are a mystery to Muslims, God tell us in the Quran regarding it:

"And because of their saying: We slew the Messiah Jesus son of Mary, Allah's Messenger -- They slew him not nor crucified, but it appeared so unto them; and lo! those who disagree concerning it are in doubt thereof; they have no knowledge thereof save pursuit of a conjecture; they slew him not for certain, But Allah took him up unto Himself. Allah is ever mighty, wise."

This is all we have to go on - and we understand that to guestimate etc about what actually happened, is a fruitless endeavour because the nature of miracle is unexplainable by scientific means.

Further - we can understand why God let's the Jews think they have killed Jesus pbuh - they Jews were already boasting of the murder, so it mattered not if Jesus pbuh was crucified or not - the Jews were hellbent on killing Jesus pbuh - unrepentant, and severely deluded by their own egotistical need to maintain power in the Jewish court, which is not how things were supposed to be. The Jews had assumed the guilt for the murdering of Jesus pbuh - even though God saved Jesus pbuh, God let's the Jews "think" they did crucify and kill him - a way to condemn the Jews who were guilty of corruptions in the land, so they will have no excuse nor reason on the day of judgement to escape the wrath of God.

By 70 AD, there was not a believer left in the walls of Jerusalem, all were Roman or Jewish - the Christians had to live in secrecy and fear, and so started to move further away from the long arm of the Roman reach... and when that happened, God showed the Jews his disdain for their heinous claims and depravity of religious ideals - God destroyed the 2nd temple.


2. Jesus didn't die before he was ascended into heaven. Muhammad was killed. Does that not make Jesus a more "god-like" human? The fact that he couldn't be killed?

Jesus pbuh didn't fulfil his mission on earth, Muhammad pbuh did - how can a mere human being out perform a man-god? ever think about it that way?

Or how about - who is defined to be greater according to Christian theology? Adam or Jesus (peace upon them both)

Jesus was born without a human father - thus Christians believe he is the son of God... bu Adam, was actually created by God, without a human mother or father - so by that comparison, who is the greater man-god? Adam or Jesus?

You see, if I explain that this simple theological comparison gives all trinitarian Christians a hard time - you don't have to work out why. It becomes painfully obvious that throughout history, God has always sent the same message over and over again:

that there is only 1 God, no others - to worship HIM alone, without partner, HE is above any human need, we do not worship HIM because HE needs it - no - we worship HIM because it is better for our soul.

When the Constantine doctrine of sol invictus was pragmatically and interchangebale woven into the fabric of early Christianity, utilising the might of the worlds most powerful empire at that time, which happened to be pagan - what we ended up with was trinity. When we examine the trinity in detail, we find that it is an alien concept in monotheism, and doesn't sit with it - but opposite it, in the naughty chair...

3. Jesus represented complete love and compassion. He never attacked anyone, never drove anyone to war, or killed in the name of God. Why would a Muhammad then have wars in the name of God, when this went completely against what Jesus was teaching?

This question makes absolutely no sense given that all prophets and messengers of God had to fight some kind of war or another... just look at the old testament.

If anything, some theologists would argue that Jesus pbuh didn't succeed in his ministry because he didn't fight wars against the Jewish elite - and his pacifism was ultimately his failure. I would disagree strongly with that - but you can see where the sword has two edges here right?

Basically, what I am saying is that, the question is badly thought out.

4. Has the Qur'an really been completely preserved? I have been reading a few websites myself and noticed that some passages may have been taking out over the years.

baseless claims on the internet - try and find two "versions" of the Quran in Arabic :) they don't exist. Only one version does. God's challenge still stands.

5. God constantly acted through Jesus, whereas he didn't with any other prophet. Surely then Jesus was superior to a prophet, he was God in human form, that Jesus was the Son of God?

Nope... in your own scriptures it foretells of Muhammad in many places, and in one place - even by name in Psalms 5:16...

anyway, Look:

18 I will raise up for them a prophet (Prophet) from among their brethren like you, and will put My words in his mouth; and he shall speak to them all that I command him. 19 And whoever will not hearken to My words which he shall speak in My name, I Myself will require it of him. 20 But the prophet who presumes to speak a word in My name which I have not commanded him to speak, or who speaks in the name of other gods, that same prophet shall die. —Deuteronomy 18:18-20

I will raise them up a prophet from among their brethren like you - obviously refers to prophet Muhammad pbuh
He shall speak to them what I command him - The Quran was revealed to Muhammad from God through the arch angel Gabriel, and thus it was revealed as a perfected scripture which has withstood the test of time and proven itself to be the penultimate word of God as revealed to Muhammad pbuh.
Muhammad pbuh was the final prophet and messenger of God and he completed his mission given to him by God, and thus completes the seal of Prophethood.

"He said,
“The Lord came from Sinai and dawned from Seir upon us;
he shone forth from Mount Paran; he came from the ten thousand of holy ones, with flaming fire at his right hand." Deuteronomy 33:2

Samau-al al Maghribi (A Jewish mathematician who converted to Islam) referred to this verse in his book as a prophecy of Muhammad pbuh. He said that Mount Sinai refers to Moses, Mount Seir refers to Jesus, and Mount Paran refers to Muhammad peace be upon them. Some contemporary Muslim scholars have also pointed to the similarity between Deuteronomy 33:2 and Qur'an 95:1-3 where "the Fig and the Olive" refers to Jesus, "Mount Sinai" refers to Moses, and "Mecca" refers to Muhammad.
"the ten thousand of holy ones" are the ten thousand Companions of Prophet Muhammad pbuh.

"Behold! My Servant, whom I uphold; My Elect One, in whom My soul delights! I have put My Spirit upon Him; He will bring forth justice to the Gentiles. He shall not cry out, nor raise His voice, nor cause His voice to be heard in the street. A bruised reed shall He not break, and smoking flax shall He not quench. In truth He shall bring forth justice. He shall not fail nor be discouraged, till He has established justice in the earth; and the islands shall wait for His law." —Isaiah 42:1

Muhammad is believed by Muslims to be the Chosen Servant of God and his Light, while Christians believe that Jesus was the begotten God of God, not the servant of God. Thus, Christians have no right, argue some Muslim writers, to call Isaiah 42 a prophecy of Jesus. Qur'an 3:159, Qur'an 9:128 and Qur'an 68:4 shed a light on the gentle character of Muhammad, and from the time they knew him, Muslims looked at Muhammad as the mercy sent by God to all the creation. He did not cut down trees and made it law that cutting down trees during times of conquest was to be made illegal.

Sing unto the Lord a new song, and His praise from the ends of the earth, you who go down to the sea, and all that is therein, the islands, and the inhabitants thereof! Let the wilderness and its cities lift up their voice, the villages that Kedar inhabits. Let the inhabitants of Sela sing, let them shout from the top of the mountains. Let them give glory to the Lord, and declare His praise in the islands. The Lord shall go forth like a mighty man; He shall stir up jealousy like a man of war: He shall cry, yea, roar; He shall prevail against His enemies. —Isaiah 42:10

Isaiah 42:13 is believed to be a prophecy of the Muslim conquests. "the new song" is often interpreted as a reference to the Arabic Qur'an or to the Adhan "the Islamic call to prayer". The Islands could be a reference to Indonesia and Malaysia - housing the largest populous of Muslims in the world.
The mention of Mount Sela, "the mountain of Medina" and the mention of Kedar "the forefather of Muhammad", in verse 11, is also considered by Muslims to be a proof.

"Sing, O Barren, You who have not borne! Break ye forth into singing and cry aloud, You who have not laboured with child! For more are the children of the desolate Than the children of the married woman," says the Lord. - Isaiah 54:1

The "Barren One" is Mecca, since no prophet was born to it before Muhammad pbuh.

"Have not labored with child" means "have not received a prophet".
According to theologists - "Desolate woman" refers to Hagar and "Married woman" refers to Sarah
"Enlarge the place of your tent, Stretch your Curtains wide, do not hold back; lengthen your cords, strengthen your stakes, for you will spread out to the right and to the left"
This passage refers to the Muslim conquests.

The voice of one crying in the wilderness:
"Prepare the way of the Lord; Make straight in the desert
A highway for our God. - Isaiah 40:3

Isaiah 40:3-5 as a prophecy of Muhammad is also common among Muslims. The Kaaba is the direction all Muslims face in prayer and we make the pilgrimage to it once in a lifetime if possible. The Kaaba is in Mecca, a city built in a desert valley, surrounded by deserts.
God will come from the south, and the holy one from mount Pharan: His glory covered the heavens, and the earth is full of his praise. - Habakkuk 3:3
Since there is no connection between Jesus pbuh and Mount Paran "the Mount of Ishmael", the "holy one" in this verse is Muhammad pbuh.

So, Muhammad spoke what God commanded him to speak, and the result of it was the Quran - the book which is read much like the way the Psalms is read - with note, beautifully, sung almost - you see? There's plenty more verses from the old scriptures, i only copied a few here.

But read them again.

6. When Jesus rose to heaven, the apostles spread the same message Jesus taught them, and had no contradictions. My dad said that the four people close to Muhammad had different views and opinions on Muhammads word and taught them differently. Why would this happen to Muhammad and not Jesus?

This is a common misconception from church leaders, which has been often regurgitated even though debunked.

First of all, it is common knowledge that the NT itself is available in many widely differing versions... how did that happen did the early companions of Jesus pbuh preached the same message? The question you have to ask your father is "if this is true - why do we not have a universal message in Christianity? why do our versions differ on core theological pretexts?" - and even if you don't want to ask him that - just think honestly, even if Muhammad pbuh's closests companions differed amongst themselves - was it their version of Islam that was being pushed? Or was the Sunnah always priority in these matters? and there - you will find a stunning answer which will let you see how great God really is :)

May The God be with you,

Scimi

[MuslimInshallah]

2. Jesus didn't die before he was ascended into heaven. Muhammad was killed. Does that not make Jesus a more "god-like" human? The fact that he couldn't be killed?

Just a couple of points: Muhammad (PBYH) was not killed. He died a natural death. Which he chose (God offered him life in this world). There are various ahadith on this. Like Bukhari Book 8, #455, Muslim Book 31, Hadith 5990).

The Prophet Elijah also didn't die before going to Heaven. Does this make Elijah God-like? Or does it not just show that God can Do whatever He Wills with His servants?

Incidentally, this point seems to throw off the whole "Jesus (PBUH) had to die on the cross so that humans could go to paradise" argument.

May God Bless you for your efforts in searching for Him.

[zzz1234]

Thanks for another reply Scimi. Although I do not understand the point you made about the caliphs version of Islam being pushed/was Sunnah always priority. Could you please explain this?

[Good brother]

3. Jesus represented complete love and compassion. He never attacked anyone, never drove anyone to war, or killed in the name of God. Why would a Muhammad then have wars in the name of God, when this went completely against what Jesus was teaching?

welcome to the forum
May Allah guide us all to the straight path.

There are many Christian apologists that often like to say that Jesus, unlike Muhammad (peace be upon them both) never raised the sword, that Jesus unlike Muhammad (pbub) never went into battle, and never participated in wars. And without really elaborating more, they conclude that due to this, this makes Jesus more superior than Muhammad (pbub) and somehow more truthful and worthy of being followed.

Now as mentioned, they don’t really give a coherent reason for coming to such a conclusion, after all, there is no set criteria, that states that if someone is a pacifist and hasn’t taken part in war, is more superior-truthful than someone who has. In fact no set criteria even exists according to the Bible, so Christian apologists have merely invented this themselves, and this alone is enough to ignore their argument.

If we were to follow the set criteria, then their own God Yahweh, and major biblical figures and prophets, such as Moses, David, and so on all stand condemned. Moses and David, under the orders of their God Yahweh (the God these same Christian apologists believe in) went into several battles and wars. In fact their battles and wars were far more extreme and brutal than anything the Prophet Muhammad (pbuh) and his Muslim community took part in. In the biblical wars, entire towns and cities are slaughtered by the sword, with the women, children, and the elderly all being shown no mercy. So if we are to use the standard of these Christian apologists, then their own book stands condemned, and is therefore less true, and less superior to pacifist figures.

Now back to the main point at hand, is someone superior than somebody else because the former hasn’t lifted a sword or taken part in wars and battles? Off course not, again, there is no such set criteria that exists anywhere, Christian apologists have merely invented such a criteria. In the case of the Prophet Muhammad (pbuh) and the early Muslim community, they were fully justified and well within their rights to raise the sword, and to take part in war.

For 13 years, the Muslims and the Prophet Muhammad (pbuh) did not lift a sword, they took their oppression with patience, this oppression included having Muslims killed, tortured, abused (physically-verbally), and forced to emigrate because of the oppression against them at the hands of the pagans. Eventually, after 13 years of enduring this oppression, on account of their faith, the Muslims were finally given the right to fight back. How is this wrong? The Muslim community were defending themselves, against their oppressors, who had oppressed the Muslims on account of their faith.

Nobody looks at the oppressed, and then says ‘oh how evil they are for fighting their oppressors’, so this doesn’t in anyway make the Prophet Muhammad (pbuh) lesser or less truthful, or less worthy of being followed than Jesus (pbuh).

Now as we had mentioned, when the Prophet Muhammad (pbuh) did go to war, his methods were nowhere near as brutal or extreme as what we find in the Bible, so how can Christian apologists condemned the Prophet Muhammad (pbuh) for his wars, and yet stand and praise/believe in their God who ordered Moses and others to annihilate entire towns and cities, putting everybody (including women and children) to the sword?

To the rational mind, this makes no sense whatsoever, and simply exposes the intellectual bankruptcy of such Christian apologists. They won’t even flinch at the verses in the Bible that talk about putting everybody to the sword, but when the Prophet Muhammad (pbuh) finally decides to fight back after 13 years of oppression, and fights in a way that doesn’t even come close to what we find in the Bible, they suddenly lose their minds and act like the Prophet Muhammad (pbuh) has committed the most heinous act you can think of.

On to the point of Jesus and violence, while Jesus didn’t lift a sword during his ministry, which only lasted 3 years after it was ended by force, which makes it quite a stretch to try and argue he was a complete pacifist, he was never in a position to raise the sword. But nonetheless, while Jesus didn’t raise the sword during his lifetime, it certainly isn’t going to be that way when he returns, something all Christian apologists believe in, known as Jesus’ second coming. When Jesus does return, coming in the clouds, he will certainly not be a pacifist, and will come with a sword, bringing destruction and death upon those who opposed (i.e. those who aren’t his followers) him.

So Christian apologists are being very deceptive and sly when they only talk about the pacifist Jesus who was preaching for 3 years (and didn’t have the opportunity to raise the sword and fight). That’s not the complete picture or story, it continues with his return, and when he returns, one can say it’s no more Mr. nice guy. So by their own invented standards and criteria, Jesus isn’t worthy of being followed, because he’s going to use acts of violence when he returns, but as we mentioned, these Christian apologists are intellectually bankrupt, so expect to hear them come up with every excuse in the book to try and justify Jesus’ violence during his second coming.
Is Jesus (pbuh) superior to Muhammad (pbuh) because he didn’t lift a sword?

[Scimitar]

Thanks for another reply Scimi. Although I do not understand the point you made about the caliphs version of Islam being pushed/was Sunnah always priority. Could you please explain this?

Sure, the companions of the prophet pbuh were many - and they didn't always see eye to eye on matters (but this was rare) and s, would instead, decide to bring the issues to more fruitful discussions so they can get closure on certain issues - the way they did this was to reach a consensus. In Arabic, this is called "Ijma".

It's really that simple - if a consensus is reached on a matter - then everyone is happy and there is no further reason to be at odds with each other.

Usually when a consensus was reached, it was done so using knowledge of Quran and Sunnah - Sunnah meaning, the practice and narrated sayings of the prophet pbuh etc.

Scimi

[zzz1234]

Ok, thanks for clearing that up Scimi :)

[zzz1234]

Sorry for ANOTHER question, it's one my dad won't stop asking me. Why did Jesus allow another man to die in his place? If Jesus preached about God and love for so long why would he let someone else die for him so he could run off? Why couldn't he have been raised into heaven without any death on anyone?

Thanks, and God bless.

[greenhill]

10. Muhammad used his power, Jesus never did. Muhammad had palaces, as much wives as he wanted, had all the riches, whereas Jesus always put others before him. Why would God send a greedy prophet after a kind one?

Running through the posts I see many of your questions answered, not so sure if this was ...

Prophet Muhammad s.a.w. never had palaces. He lived in an annexed room of the masjid. Slept on palm leaves and would offer his own food to others. Although he was a merchant, and a fairly successful one at that by the time he became a prophet, he preached and by his death he had spent all and was left with nothing.

About his wives, it should be remembered that when he was married to his true love, his first wife, he had no other wives. Only after her death did he re-marry. He married his companions daughters in order to strengthen the relationship between them as an extended family, and others in either free slaves or to unite territories (very much like the old Kings marrying the conquered territories in order to unite the nations). It was not out of lust.

On question 9) The marriage you quoted was not compatible between the two due to their different backgrounds (one was from a high ranking family and the other (the male) was from a poorer background. The prophet (if I am not mistaken) was told to marry her. This was to make clear the laws of marriage. What is considered legal and what is not.


Peace :shade:

[Muhaba]

2. Jesus didn't die before he was ascended into heaven. Muhammad was killed. Does that not make Jesus a more "god-like" human? The fact that he couldn't be killed?

First of all, Prophet Muhammad (SAW) wasn't killed. Second, the fact that Jesus wasn't killed or captured doesn't make him super human. He didn't escape his enemies through his own powers. Rather, God assisted him and protected him, raising him up. So, everything happened according to God's plan. It doesn't make Jesus any more special.
Another thing is that Jesus wasn't the only one who went up to heaven. Prophet Muhammad (SAW) also went up on the night of Miraj (ascension to Heaven).
A third thing is that, all of these (Jesus, Mohammad, Moses, etc) were Prophets and Messengers of God. We hold them all in high regard and we are not supposed to make distinctions among them.

[Muhaba]

1. Obviously the area of the crucifixion of Jesus between Islam and Christianity is a very touchy subject. Islam believes that Jesus was not crucified. Why was it made to believe that he was? Was it to trick the enemy? What then happened after Jesus "escaped" being crucified, was it an instant ascension into heaven?

If you read history of Christianity, you will come to know that for a long time after Jesus, the majority of people didn't believe in the Trinity. Later, I think in the third century, the belief in Trinity was made the only acceptable belief for political reasons.

[Muhaba]

Sorry for ANOTHER question, it's one my dad won't stop asking me. Why did Jesus allow another man to die in his place? If Jesus preached about God and love for so long why would he let someone else die for him so he could run off? Why couldn't he have been raised into heaven without any death on anyone?

Thanks, and God bless.

The man who died was a traitor. He was one of the disciples and he led the enemies of Jesus to where Jesus was staying. Why was the traitor killed? I am unsure what history says. It may be that when th enemies searched for Jesus and didn't find him, they may have gotten angry and killed the traitor in anger. Note that (according to Christianity) Jesus had told his disciples that one of them would betray him. This was on the day of the last feast. Also, God has told us in the Quran that when the disciples asked for table spread with food from heaven, God said He would bring it down but if anyone became astray after that, God would punish him in a manner like never before. (The meal from heaven was a great Sign and when people go astray after getting such clear Signs, they are punished terribly.)

[And remember] when the disciples said, "O Jesus, Son of Mary, can your Lord send down to us a table [spread with food] from the heaven? [Jesus] said," Fear Allah , if you should be believers."

They said, "We wish to eat from it and let our hearts be reassured and know that you have been truthful to us and be among its witnesses."

Said Jesus, the son of Mary, "O Allah , our Lord, send down to us a table [spread with food] from the heaven to be for us a festival for the first of us and the last of us and a sign from You. And provide for us, and You are the best of providers."

Allah said, "Indeed, I will sent it down to you, but whoever disbelieves afterwards from among you - then indeed will I punish him with a punishment by which I have not punished anyone among the worlds."
(5: 112- 115)

[Saja]

I’m a Muslim and I’m learning from this thread! Really good questions and answers.

I think if I can put it nicely the difference between Jesus (AS) and Muhammad (SAW) is we can follow and not worship Muhammad (SAW)as an example as he was a father, husband, friend, brother, leader… unlike Jesus (AS) who was being worshiped for being perfect human.

Excuse my English.

[Scimitar]

Sorry for ANOTHER question, it's one my dad won't stop asking me. Why did Jesus allow another man to die in his place? If Jesus preached about God and love for so long why would he let someone else die for him so he could run off? Why couldn't he have been raised into heaven without any death on anyone?

Thanks, and God bless.

nice to read you again,

those who were actually crucified - were not innocents - they were criminals... on that premise, the question isn't so well thought out is it? :)

Allah did not let Isa ibn Maryam AS (Jesus pbuh) suffer the same fate as criminals... let's not forget, only the worst criminals were subjected to crucifixion.

God bless you,

Scimi

[Insaanah]

unlike Jesus (AS) who was being worshiped for being perfect human.

You've touched on a key point here sis.

As mentioned in my previous post, Christians believe that because of Adam (peace be upon him) eating from the tree, mankind's relationship with God was severed, humans became imperfect, and not only Adam (peace be upon him), but all subsequent generations have to bear a punishment from God, and fell out of grace with God, and they are born into a state of sin.

The only thing, according to them, that can rectify all of that, is a perfect sacrifice, i.e. the sacrifice of what they perceive to be a perfect man. Through what they perceive to be his death and resurrection, they believe that that broken relationship is repaired and that man is reconciled with God. Salvation and reconciliation with God can only be achieved through the crucifixion and acceptance of Jesus (peace be upon him) as their saviour, who they believe died for their sins.

The favourite Christian line from the bible, "For God so loved the world..." when scrutinized, if you take it right back to why "...He gave his only son...", doesn't add up though.

Which one shows more love?

A God who will not forgive, punishes other people for a sin they didn't commit, cuts off his relationship with them, makes them fall out of His grace, and makes them born into a state of sin, and then has an innocent man (who actually is him) killed in a torturous death to repair all of that

OR

A God who forgave Adam (peace be upon him), and guided him, and guides us all, and can forgive us all, freely, when we repent sincerely and ask sincerely, and does not expect perfection from us, but simply for us to do our very best in obeying Him and the messengers He sent? His Mercy opening the doors to salvation and paradise.

I know which one I see as more Kind, Loving, Forgiving, Clement, and Merciful. All praise be to Allah.

[Insaanah]

Muhammad had palaces, as much wives as he wanted, had all the riches, whereas Jesus always put others before him. Why would God send a greedy prophet after a kind one?

To learn, you need to think and question if the wrong things you're hearing about Islam are true, rather than just hearing a fact about Islam from a non-Muslim who doesn't know much about it, taking it as true, and then asking why did Muhammad (peace be upon him) or Jesus (peace be upon him) do xyz.

It is better if you phrase this question, as, "Is it true that Muhammad (peace be upon him) had palaces?" etc, rather than assuming that what you're hearing is true. Apart from early after his first marriage, much of his life was spent in poverty, and he was always putting others before him.

See this post:

http://www.islamicboard.com/clarific...ml#post1479857

Just for your information, as Muslims, for us to refer to any prophet in derogatory terms, with adjectives such as greedy, is not allowed, and is a big sin. The prophets and messengers were the purest and noblest of humanity, known for their upright conduct and high moral characters, sent by Allah to people throughout the ages, to convey His message to them, and with guidance to show people how He wants them to live and worship Him.

Why did Jesus allow another man to die in his place?

Jesus (peace be upon him) did not allow anybody to do anything of his own volition, nor did he ever do what he had no right to - he only did what he was commanded to by God. Read the following verses from the Qur'an:

And [beware the Day] when Allah will say, "O Jesus, Son of Mary, did you say to the people, 'Take me and my mother as deities besides Allah'?" He will say, "Exalted are You! It was not for me to say that to which I have no right. If I had said it, You would have known it. You know what is within myself, and I do not know what is within Yourself. Indeed, it is You who is Knower of the unseen.

I said not to them except what You commanded me: "Worship Allah, my Lord and your Lord". And I was a witness over them as long as I was among them; but when You took me up, You were the Observer over them, and You are, over all things, Witness.

If You should punish them - indeed they are Your servants; but if You forgive them - indeed it is You who is the Exalted in Might, the Wise. (5:116-118)

You see, Jesus preached the same thing that all the messengers preached since the beginning of humanity. To submit wholeheartedly to Allah and worship Him and Him alone, without any associates in, or parts to, His Exclusive Divinity, and to obey the prophet. They taught that people should be under no misperception that they can commit themselves to Allah as their Lord, and then combine this with accepting others as their Lord, or associating others in His Divinity, in whatever way. They taught that we should strive hard to translate our belief in the One True God into practice, by obeying Allah and the messengers He sent, who were also role models and examples for us, showing us practically how to put the guidance they were sent with into practice in our daily lives, explaining the scriptures, warning against wrong-doing, giving good tidings, and giving additional legislation from Allah.

So Islam is not a new faith, but is the same ultimate universal truth that God revealed to all the prophets, including Noah, Abraham, Moses and Jesus (peace be on them), and the same thing they all taught. Thus Islam is not named after a specific person (like Christianity, Buddhism), nor after a certain race or place (like Judaism, Hinduism), but is named by God Himself, the meaning loosely translating as 'submission to God', which is what every Prophet and their righteous followers did, from amongst all times, places and peoples. That in itself is one fraction of the evidence that it was the way of all the Prophets from the beginning.

With time, the message got forgotten or corrupted. So people started worshipping other gods along with Him, made idols, said that God begot a son, said that certain people were incarnations of God, some rejected belief in God altogether, while others elevated the status of some prophets to divine, or at the other end, rejected or blasphemed some of the prophets. Whenever God's message got distorted by people, or forgotten, a new messenger was sent, not with any new or changed message, but reinforcing the actual message that God sent all the messengers with, the actual core beliefs that people were taught from the beginning of humanity, confirming the true parts of previous teachings and scriptures, and correcting wrong beliefs and misconceptions that had crept in. God required that whenever He sent a new messenger, that messenger should be followed along with any new scripture given to him. This chain of messengers culminates in prophet Muhammad (peace on him), who is the last and final prophet and messenger. Since his prophethood, God's message is available unchanged and unadulterated, for the entire world, until the end of time. He wasn't sent as prophet and messenger for a specific group of people and specific time (e.g. as Moses and Jesus were to the Children of Israel), but he was sent for all the world, for all time, until the Day of Judgement. Thus he is the last, not first, prophet of Islam; a messenger to all mankind, for now, and for all time to come. He is the messenger who must now be followed.

Peace.