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Moshy
12-14-2015, 10:48 AM
https://vimeo.com/148857052
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saif-uddin
12-14-2015, 01:25 PM
Christians claim Jesus was God in flesh and died for our Sins,

The funny thing is he blamed God for abandoning him, leaving him in the lurch according to the Bible,

Lol
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popsthebuilder
12-14-2015, 01:46 PM
He was man fully of the will of God, and predestined as such. He should be likened to Moses or Elias. He taught that sacrifice of self and own direction to follow the direction of God was the only form of sacrifice acceptable. How can you sacrifice an innocent thing for your sins? You cannot. Jesus of Christ showed the way to unity and salvation wholly under God, and taught the manner of which holy men are to live. Not for show, or reward, but for the sake of existence as a whole, under God.

Many Christians feel very strongly that Jesus was literally God in the flesh. To say that he was is difficult for me at times. To say that he was not limits what God can do. Since we cannot clearly perceive any limit to the will of God, to say otherwise just doesn't seem right to me.

Unfortunately, the majority of Christians are confuse on quite a few things due to greed and curruot doctrine. The scripture, much like that of the Quran, is pure and obviouse in its directions, man through time and greed have lead many of the path. We will unite under God peaceably for the sake of man.

no offence

Peace,
All praise, and thanks is to GOD.
Reply

popsthebuilder
12-14-2015, 02:03 PM
Sorry for typos.
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saif-uddin
12-14-2015, 08:11 PM
This Christian got a taste of his medicine, when I reminded him, when Jesus pooped himself,

Are you saying "God" pooped?

نعوذ بالله من ذلك

He got all flustered and said I was blaspheming,

Lol,

He's the one telling me Jesus is God in the flesh,

نعوذ بالله من ذلك
Reply

Insaanah
12-15-2015, 09:43 PM
:salam:

:jz: for sharing.

I see one flaw in the first part of the video. It defines sacrifice, as to give up something you want to keep in order to get or do something else. And the rest of that part is based around that premise, that you sacrifice to get a reward, or something in return. Lets say an atheist sacrifices some of their wealth to help a poor person. Or sacrifices their time to help at an orphanage. They don't believe in God, so aren't expecting to get anything for it or to get any reward. Therefore, if the definition of sacrifice isn't quite right, or actually is wider than that, then the argument made on that point using the limited definition in the video, can't stand strongly, ie the question is asked in the video, was God expecting a reward from Himself?
Reply

Malik719
12-15-2015, 11:16 PM
This one here was an eye opener for me. It was especially striking to me how Evangelists influenced Muslims believes, that now many Muslims make a distinction between prophets and think of Jesus as the savior.

muslimjesus.org/misconception-resurrection-or-ascension/
Reply

popsthebuilder
12-26-2015, 05:23 PM
We are all to sacrifice ourselves(greed, and if need be life) for the will of God and the sake of existence.

Peace
Reply

greenhill
12-27-2015, 09:33 AM
format_quote Originally Posted by popsthebuilder
Many Christians feel very strongly that Jesus was literally God in the flesh. To say that he was is difficult for me at times. To say that he was not limits what God can do. Since we cannot clearly perceive any limit to the will of God, to say otherwise just doesn't seem right to me.
Why would Jesus not being God be regarded as as 'limiting' what God can do?

Why do we have to try define with our limited understanding of what is God's powers from the position of Jesus and his miracle birth? God already created man from clay and his companion, Eve, from his rib. Nothing impossible for God to create another man without a father.

:peace:
Reply

keiv
12-27-2015, 04:15 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by popsthebuilder
He was man fully of the will of God, and predestined as such. He should be likened to Moses or Elias. He taught that sacrifice of self and own direction to follow the direction of God was the only form of sacrifice acceptable. How can you sacrifice an innocent thing for your sins? You cannot. Jesus of Christ showed the way to unity and salvation wholly under God, and taught the manner of which holy men are to live. Not for show, or reward, but for the sake of existence as a whole, under God.

Many Christians feel very strongly that Jesus was literally God in the flesh. To say that he was is difficult for me at times. To say that he was not limits what God can do. Since we cannot clearly perceive any limit to the will of God, to say otherwise just doesn't seem right to me.

Unfortunately, the majority of Christians are confuse on quite a few things due to greed and curruot doctrine. The scripture, much like that of the Quran, is pure and obviouse in its directions, man through time and greed have lead many of the path. We will unite under God peaceably for the sake of man.

no offence

Peace,
All praise, and thanks is to GOD.
If God has to become part of his own creation and allow the very things he created to kill him, that in itself seems pretty limiting to God's capabilities, I would think.
Reply

saif-uddin
03-19-2016, 03:11 PM
If God became creation, he'd no longer be God
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saif-uddin
03-19-2016, 03:15 PM
Stupid Christian "Logic"

God is Uncreated

Man is Created

They are opposites,

Christians just don't seem to get the absurdities of trying apply opposite natures to God All-mighty,

The presence of one negates the other.

Alhumdulillah, Allah tala saved us
from this Shirk,
Reply

anatolian
03-19-2016, 03:56 PM
Salam brother. We should be careful with the words we are using about other religions.
Reply

saif-uddin
03-19-2016, 03:58 PM
وعليكم السلام والرحمة الله وبركاته
Reply

saif-uddin
03-19-2016, 03:59 PM
Lol, what?

Which word should I be careful about?
Reply

saif-uddin
03-19-2016, 04:00 PM
There's stuff in the Bible which is beyond stupidity,

Insane would probably be more appropriate
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Serinity
03-19-2016, 05:00 PM
For God to became man, God would no longer be God, because becoming creation, negates the creator.

The power of Allaah – which is undoubtedly absolute and unlimited – is connected to things that are rationally possible, not things that are rationally impossible. No matter how absolute and limitless His power, it must still remain within the bounds of possibility, and it is not connected to irrationalities. This is not a limitation of it. In order to clarify this point we will give some examples: We ask all of these bishops and theologians: Can God create another god like Him? If they say yes, we say to them: How can this created being be a god if he is created? How can he be like God when he has a beginning, whereas God exists from eternity? In fact the phrase “creating a god” is a sophism or false argument, and is a contradiction in terms, because the mere fact that something is created means that it cannot be a god. This question is like asking could God create “a god who is not a god”? it is self-evident that the answer can only be: The power of Allaah has nothing to do with that, because the idea that something can be a god and not a god is illogical and is irrational, and the power of Allaah has nothing to do with irrationalities.

And May Allah forgive me if I said any wrong. Ameen.

Read this:

https://islamqa.info/en/39679

Read Al-Ikhlas..

God does not beget, nor is He begotten, nor is there to Him any equivalent.
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Serinity
03-19-2016, 05:07 PM
.. read the site..
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saif-uddin
03-19-2016, 05:44 PM
Shirk has always been derogatory to the human Intellect,
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saif-uddin
03-19-2016, 05:45 PM
Shirk never made any reasonable sense,
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saif-uddin
03-19-2016, 05:45 PM
Akhi Serenity,

True,

جزاك الله خيرا
Reply

The-Deist
03-19-2016, 06:46 PM
Saif-uddin.

Ever heard of making a single post?
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popsthebuilder
03-19-2016, 07:28 PM
I must comment though I do not hold to the traditianal coequal trinity doctrine, that to say that GOD couldn't take human form if it was indeed it's will is limiting the power of God based on he limited understanding of man.

Peace
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saif-uddin
03-20-2016, 03:49 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by StrivingforDeen
Saif-uddin.

Ever heard of making a single post?
Yes akhi I heard that. But I also heard that most people have short attention span, so I didn't want to make a lengthy post.

Also sometimes I make a post and I remember something else that ought to be added, which necessitates and other post. [emoji27]

جزاك الله خيرا
Reply

saif-uddin
03-20-2016, 03:52 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by popsthebuilder
I must comment though I do not hold to the traditianal coequal trinity doctrine, that to say that GOD couldn't take human form if it was indeed it's will is limiting the power of God based on he limited understanding of man.

Peace
Peace be upon those who receive guidance!

Another self refuting argument.

Claiming God took Human form is of itself a limitation.

Human beings are limited by nature.

If you refer back to your Bible, whichever version your following, you will see several limitations attributed to Jesus,

This proves he never took Human form.

Regards
Reply

The-Deist
03-20-2016, 06:50 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by saif-uddin
Yes akhi I heard that. But I also heard that most people have short attention span, so I didn't want to make a lengthy post.

Also sometimes I make a post and I remember something else that ought to be added, which necessitates and other post. [emoji27]

جزاك الله خيرا
Next time you can edit your post to add more points.
Reply

Sojourn
03-20-2016, 08:53 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Moshy
Can you summarize what points you like about the vid? That's more meaningful than dumping a link on us :)

Jesus' suffering for our sins was prophesied by several Old Testament prophets, what do Muslims make of Isiaih chapter 53. Here is a snippet:

4 Surely he took up our pain
and bore our suffering,
yet we considered him punished by God,
stricken by him, and afflicted.
5 But he was pierced for our transgressions,
he was crushed for our iniquities;
the punishment that brought us peace was on him,
and by his wounds we are healed.

...

12 Therefore I will give him a portion among the great,[g]
and he will divide the spoils with the strong,[h]
because he poured out his life unto death,
and was numbered with the transgressors.
For he bore the sin of many,
and made intercession for the transgressors.


Read the chapter from the Old Testament. My second question is whether Muslims can find as clear a prophecy of Muhammad's coming :)

Cheers

sojourn
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Sojourn
03-20-2016, 09:05 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by saif-uddin
If God became creation, he'd no longer be God
It's easy to create your own understanding of Christian doctrine and attack, but maybe you should at least take the time to understand what we believe so that you can attack us accurately :)

Christians believe Jesus was a Divine person with an assumed human nature. We don't believe he lost His Divine nature during the incarnation. Since He had a human nature he was truly human and was like us in all ways except sin. He breathed, ate, felt pain, and anything else that is associated with human experience.

Now that you know a bit what we actually believe, ask your questions. ;)
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The-Deist
03-20-2016, 09:33 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Sojourn
It's easy to create your own understanding of Christian doctrine and attack, but maybe you should at least take the time to understand what we believe so that you can attack us accurately :)

Christians believe Jesus was a Divine person with an assumed human nature. We don't believe he lost His Divine nature during the incarnation. Since He had a human nature he was truly human and was like us in all ways except sin. He breathed, ate, felt pain, and anything else that is associated with human experience.

Now that you know a bit what we actually believe, ask your questions. ;)
Totally agree, even I was unaware of what Christians believe until I became one myself. I guess we all are ignorant in some ways :).
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Sojourn
03-20-2016, 09:46 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by StrivingforDeen
Totally agree, even I was unaware of what Christians believe until I became one myself. I guess we all are ignorant in some ways :).
Peace be with you my brother in the Lord,

Anyone who wishes to attack our Faith needs to first understand it :)
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The-Deist
03-20-2016, 09:47 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Sojourn
Peace be with you my brother in the Lord,

Anyone who wishes to attack our Faith needs to first understand it :)
Oh sorry, I am an ex-Christian but do respect the faith and people who understand it.
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Sojourn
03-20-2016, 09:49 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by StrivingforDeen
Oh sorry, I am an ex-Christian but do respect the faith and people who understand it.
You're still a brother :). What are you now?
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The-Deist
03-20-2016, 09:50 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Sojourn
You're still a brother :). What are you now?
An agnostic.
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Sojourn
03-20-2016, 09:52 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by StrivingforDeen
An agnostic.
I used to be agnostic :) why are you agnostic now?
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The-Deist
03-20-2016, 09:57 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Sojourn
I used to be agnostic :) why are you agnostic now?
Long story haha.
format_quote Originally Posted by Sojourn
You're still a brother :). What are you now?
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Sojourn
03-20-2016, 09:58 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by StrivingforDeen
Long story haha.
Why are you agnostic and not atheist? Shorter story hopefully :)
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The-Deist
03-20-2016, 09:59 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Sojourn
Why are you agnostic and not atheist? Shorter story hopefully :)
Because I believe in God. I realize that this world or me can't create itself.
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Sojourn
03-20-2016, 10:02 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by StrivingforDeen
Because I believe in God. I realize that this world or me can't create itself.
Then you'd be a deist or theist no? What does agnostic mean to you?
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crookedrib
03-20-2016, 10:03 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Sojourn
Read the chapter from the Old Testament. My second question is whether Muslims can find as clear a prophecy of Muhammad's coming :)

Cheers

sojourn
SAHIH INTERNATIONAL

And [mention] when Jesus, the son of Mary, said, "O children of Israel, indeed I am the messenger of Allah to you confirming what came before me of the Torah and bringing good tidings of a messenger to come after me, whose name is Ahmad." But when he came to them with clear evidences, they said, "This is obvious magic." Qur'aan 61:6

Muhammad :arabic5: is referred to as 'Ahmad' here, they both come from the same root word i believe.

Im not knowledgeable enough to debate in comparative religion but i just wanted to put that out there.
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The-Deist
03-20-2016, 10:03 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Sojourn
Then you'd be a deist or theist no? What does agnostic mean to you?
A person who believes in God but doubts/disbelieves in religion. I am sure it's the wrong definition.
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Sojourn
03-20-2016, 10:07 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by StrivingforDeen
A person who believes in God but doubts/disbelieves in religion. I am sure it's the wrong definition.
You sound more like a deist to me. Deism accepts the existence of God but questions whether God interferes or interacts in human existance. Agnosticism is uncertainty whether there is or isn't a a God.
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Sojourn
03-20-2016, 10:09 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by crookedrib
SAHIH INTERNATIONAL

And [mention] when Jesus, the son of Mary, said, "O children of Israel, indeed I am the messenger of Allah to you confirming what came before me of the Torah and bringing good tidings of a messenger to come after me, whose name is Ahmad." But when he came to them with clear evidences, they said, "This is obvious magic." Qur'aan 61:6

Muhammad :arabic5: is referred to as 'Ahmad' here, they both come from the same root word i believe.

Im not knowledgeable enough to debate in comparative religion but i just wanted to put that out there.
Hi crooked, yes I was referring to a prophecy in the Old Testament as clear as what refers to Jesus in Isaiah 53
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crookedrib
03-20-2016, 10:09 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by saif-uddin
Yes akhi I heard that. But I also heard that most people have short attention span, so I didn't want to make a lengthy post.

Also sometimes I make a post and I remember something else that ought to be added, which necessitates and other post. [emoji27]

جزاك الله خيرا

Akhi, strivingfordeen is no longer muslim, he has become an apostate. I dont think you can say jazaak Allah khair to him.
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Sojourn
03-20-2016, 10:13 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by crookedrib
Akhi, strivingfordeen is no longer muslim, he has become an apostate. I dont think you can say jazaak Allah khair to him.
Interesting
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M.I.A.
03-20-2016, 10:19 PM
As I remember it, read somewhere that people say jazaak Allah..

As a way of saying may Allah swt compensate/recompense you for what you have done..

Could be either good or bad.

Although my Arabic is non existent.. And I'm not searching for the thread again.
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crookedrib
03-20-2016, 10:33 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by M.I.A.
As I remember it, read somewhere that people say jazaak Allah..

As a way of saying may Allah swt compensate/recompense you for what you have done..

Could be either good or bad.

Although my Arabic is non existent.. And I'm not searching for the thread again.
I was referring to 'Jazaak Allah khair', meaning May Allah reward you with goodness.

Allahu 'Alam
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Sojourn
03-21-2016, 01:28 AM
format_quote Originally Posted by saif-uddin
Stupid Christian "Logic"

God is Uncreated

Man is Created

They are opposites,

Christians just don't seem to get the absurdities of trying apply opposite natures to God All-mighty,

The presence of one negates the other.

Alhumdulillah, Allah tala saved us
from this Shirk,
Don't Muslims believe the Quran is uncreated?

But a kitab is created.

Is this dumb Muslim logic?

How ironic.
Reply

Moshy
03-21-2016, 11:39 AM
format_quote Originally Posted by Insaanah
:salam:

:jz: for sharing.

I see one flaw in the first part of the video. It defines sacrifice, as to give up something you want to keep in order to get or do something else. And the rest of that part is based around that premise, that you sacrifice to get a reward, or something in return. Lets say an atheist sacrifices some of their wealth to help a poor person. Or sacrifices their time to help at an orphanage. They don't believe in God, so aren't expecting to get anything for it or to get any reward. Therefore, if the definition of sacrifice isn't quite right, or actually is wider than that, then the argument made on that point using the limited definition in the video, can't stand strongly, ie the question is asked in the video, was God expecting a reward from Himself?
So I see. You are very right [emoji106] [emoji106]
Reply

popsthebuilder
03-21-2016, 03:03 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by saif-uddin
Peace be upon those who receive guidance!

Another self refuting argument.

Claiming God took Human form is of itself a limitation.

Human beings are limited by nature.

If you refer back to your Bible, whichever version your following, you will see several limitations attributed to Jesus,

This proves he never took Human form.

Regards
Again, I am not a traditionalTrinitarian, but my statement is in no way self refuting. God is without limit. If it so chose to take human form, then it could. Just because it could have chosen to suffer as a man in order to guide whom it chooses, that, in itself does not refute the omnipotence of God or limit God.

Peace.

May God guide all towards his will by his mercy and grace and compassion.
format_quote Originally Posted by StrivingforDeen
Oh sorry, I am an ex-Christian but do respect the faith and people who understand it.
Reply

greenhill
03-21-2016, 03:57 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by saif-uddin
Lol, what?

Which word should I be careful about?
I believe br. anatolian was referring to this..

And do not insult those they invoke other than Allah , lest they insult Allah in enmity without knowledge. Thus We have made pleasing to every community their deeds. Then to their Lord is their return, and He will inform them about what they used to do (6:108 Sahih International)



:peace:
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saif-uddin
03-27-2016, 10:44 PM
Greatest Insult to God All-mighty/Allah tala is to claim he has children ...

Surah Maryam, Ayah 88:
وَقَالُوا اتَّخَذَ الرَّحْمَٰنُ وَلَدًا

And they say: "The Most Beneficent (Allah) has begotten a son (or offspring or children) [as the Jews say: 'Uzair (Ezra) is the son of Allah, and the Christians say that He has begotten a son ['Iesa (Christ)], and the pagan Arabs say that He has begotten daughters (angels, etc.)]."

Surah Maryam, Ayah 89:
لَّقَدْ جِئْتُمْ شَيْئًا إِدًّا

Indeed you have brought forth (said) a terrible evil thing.

Surah Maryam, Ayah 90:

تَكَادُ السَّمَاوَاتُ يَتَفَطَّرْنَ مِنْهُ وَتَنشَقُّ الْأَرْضُ وَتَخِرُّ الْجِبَالُ هَدًّا

Whereby the heavens are almost torn, and the earth is split asunder, and the mountains fall in ruins,


نعوذ بالله من ذلك
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Delphi
04-01-2016, 04:26 PM
Re: shirk, ect.

This is not what Christians believe, nor is it what my ancestors have believed for the last 2000 years. I am a rationalist atheist but if I were to find my way back to a more "traditional" belief it would be Christianity. You should not dismiss another's right to believe as they will. It is that multicultural right that grants so many muslim refugees safety, wealth, and sanctuary in the rich Northern democracies, which by in large, are (historically) Christian.
Reply

anatolian
04-02-2016, 12:53 AM
format_quote Originally Posted by Delphi
Re: shirk, ect.

This is not what Christians believe, nor is it what my ancestors have believed for the last 2000 years. I am a rationalist atheist but if I were to find my way back to a more "traditional" belief it would be Christianity. You should not dismiss another's right to believe as they will. It is that multicultural right that grants so many muslim refugees safety, wealth, and sanctuary in the rich Northern democracies, which by in large, are (historically) Christian.
Salam Delphi. Actually we muslims do not dismiss people's rights to believe as they will. Quran teaches us to respect people regarding their religions as stated above

"And do not abuse those whom they call upon besides Allah, lest exceeding the limits they should abuse Allah out of ignorance. Thus have We made fair seeming to every people their deeds; then to their Lord shall be their return, so He will inform them of what they did" (6:108 M.H. Shakir)

"There is no compulsion in religion; truly the right way has become clearly distinct from error; therefore, whoever disbelieves in the Shaitan and believes in Allah he indeed has laid hold on the firmest handle, which shall not break off, and Allah is Hearing, Knowing" (2:256 M.H. Shakir)

And of course all those muslim refugees should respect the countries and peoples who opened their borders to them. Not only Christian ones but Muslims welcomed them also as I know from my country Turkey.

But, this is completely a different topic then what we discuss here. We still believe what Christianity teaches is "Shirk (Associating other things with The God)". If a muslim doesnt believe so, he is not a muslim at all. If you have studied the basic tenets of Christianity and Islam, you can understand this.
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popsthebuilder
04-02-2016, 11:54 AM
format_quote Originally Posted by anatolian
Salam Delphi. Actually we muslims do not dismiss people's rights to believe as they will. Quran teaches us to respect people regarding their religions as stated above

"And do not abuse those whom they call upon besides Allah, lest exceeding the limits they should abuse Allah out of ignorance. Thus have We made fair seeming to every people their deeds; then to their Lord shall be their return, so He will inform them of what they did" (6:108 M.H. Shakir)

"There is no compulsion in religion; truly the right way has become clearly distinct from error; therefore, whoever disbelieves in the Shaitan and believes in Allah he indeed has laid hold on the firmest handle, which shall not break off, and Allah is Hearing, Knowing" (2:256 M.H. Shakir)

And of course all those muslim refugees should respect the countries and peoples who opened their borders to them. Not only Christian ones but Muslims welcomed them also as I know from my country Turkey.

But, this is completely a different topic then what we discuss here. We still believe what Christianity teaches is "Shirk (Associating other things with The God)". If a muslim doesnt believe so, he is not a muslim at all. If you have studied the basic tenets of Christianity and Islam, you can understand this.
I study and have a decent grasp on both. Are you trying to say that to be of Islam one must consider all Christianity to be shirk or associate partners or equals to GOD?
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anatolian
04-02-2016, 12:24 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by popsthebuilder
I study and have a decent grasp on both. Are you trying to say that to be of Islam one must consider all Christianity to be shirk or associate partners or equals to GOD?
Salam friend. Not all Christianity of course. We have many in common. In fact we have more in common than difference. However I am talking about the basic tenet of the mainstream trinitarian Christian belief. If you ask a trinitarian christian which is the majority of christianity for what is the 'basic tenet' of his religion he will tell you that God incarnated as a man on earth and died on the cross for our sins. And this is shirk for us.
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IARLG
09-11-2016, 08:25 PM
http://aljumaareminder.com/books/

Asalaam alykum all, please download the book below from the link above:

THE QURAN CONFIRMS THE TEACHINGS OF JESUS WHO IS A MUSLIM

– by IARLG

– 1st Edition – For Muslims and Non-Muslims

‘The Quran confirms the teachings of Jesus who is a Muslim’ is a book dedicated to revealing who Jesus really is and not how the media portrays him to be. Facts about Jesus have been collected from various sources and compiled in this one book.

Think of this book as a ‘Guinness world record book’ which tried to collect the true facts about Jesus from all over the world instead of listing the world records.

Please find the time to read this book as soon as possible before Jesus comes. It would be best to know the truth about Jesus before he returns to earth.
Reply

jabeady
09-11-2016, 09:51 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by IARLG
Facts about Jesus have been collected from various sources and compiled in this one book
So, how many sources are there, outside of the Bible?
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goodwill
10-26-2016, 11:02 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by jabeady
So, how many sources are there, outside of the Bible?
I'm not familiar with IARLG's material but, according to Frank Turek's book, I Don't Have Enough Faith to be an Atheist, there are ten non-Christian sources that mention Jesus within 150 years of His life: Josephus, Tacitus, Pliny the Younger, Phlegon, Thallus, Suetonius, Lucian, Celsus, Mara Bar-Serapion, and the Talmud. (There are numerous early Christian sources too, of course.) By contrast, over the same 150 years, there are nine non-Christian sources that mention Tiberius Caesar, the Roman emperor at the time of Jesus.
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Al Sultan
10-27-2016, 04:06 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Sojourn
Don't Muslims believe the Quran is uncreated?

But a kitab is created.

Is this dumb Muslim logic?

How ironic.
Stop using words out of context,lol...

First of all,we believe that the Quran was sent down by god through Gabriel (AS) to prophet Mohammed (PBUH)

WE also believe there is nothing like it,its words,its rules,laws,mercy,manners,its not just a book,its a guidebook to life.

"A book is a written or printed work consisting of pages glued or sewn together along one side and bound in covers."

we dont believe the Quran suddenly popped into life from thin air?

its not "dumb muslim logic" the way how you view it is so retarded and silly..

Educate yourself better than talking about things you're not even sure of,because then you'll make yourself look stupid infront of many muslims.

The way how you wrote it made me choke,astakhfirallah..
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Al Sultan
10-27-2016, 04:12 PM
just wow
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Logikon
10-27-2016, 05:20 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by IARLG


......of Jesus who is a Muslim


The Jewish rabbis who preached from say 2,000 BC to 33 AD .... are they considered to be Muslims?

When Jesus broke bread to celebrate the Jewish sabbath, when Jesus practised other Jewish rites, was he considered a Muslim?

When the Arabs were worshipping pagan gods prior to the time of the Muslim prophet Muhammad, were those people considered Muslims?

.
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Al Sultan
10-28-2016, 06:22 AM
format_quote Originally Posted by Logikon
The Jewish rabbis who preached from say 2,000 BC to 33 AD .... are they considered to be Muslims?

When Jesus broke bread to celebrate the Jewish sabbath, when Jesus practised other Jewish rites, was he considered a Muslim?

When the Arabs were worshipping pagan gods prior to the time of the Muslim prophet Muhammad, were those people considered Muslims?

.
Lol you don't even understand what a Muslim is....a Muslim is a person who submits his will to ONE God,Jesus did submit his will to ONE God.So you're understanding it wrong..and also Muhammed did not participate in any religion,he was just a Shepard,when he was in cave hira (mount hira) meditating,Gabriel came and the rest is history.
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