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The-Deist
01-05-2016, 02:48 AM
Peace upon all of you. I am an agnostic now (former Muslim now Christian). So I believe in one God.

I feel like I left Islam too fast and just wanted to fill the emptiness in my heart. But then I realized I had followed somethings I don't agree witg because emotions.
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sfontel
01-05-2016, 02:58 AM
Lol....God bless! You are just confuse....
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The-Deist
01-05-2016, 03:06 AM
Originally Posted by sfontel
Lol....God bless! You are just confuse....
I am just trying to take everything slow. First gotta establish a relationship with god. And then only choose a religion.

If I kerp on making hasty decisions I'll probably try just about every religion.

God bless you too!
Reply

sfontel
01-05-2016, 03:12 AM
Originally Posted by StrivingforDeen
I am just trying to take everything slow. First gotta establish a relationship with god. And then only choose a religion.
I think you said in another thread that you are young....like 13-14...

I am 34...I work with teens at my church for over 13 years....and I know you guys pass trough this questioning as I did...

Like you said....seek God with a clean heart and I am very sure He will present Himself...

Hope the best for you!

God bless!
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The-Deist
01-05-2016, 03:19 AM
Originally Posted by sfontel
I think you said in another thread that you are young....like 13-14...

I am 34...I work with teens at my church for over 13 years....and I know you guys pass trough this questioning as I did...

Like you said....seek God with a clean heart and I am very sure He will present Himself...

Hope the best for you!

God bless!
Thank you so much for your support! Yep I am just trying to start with a clean picture of god, attributing him to positivity. I believe he will show me the light.

And yes I am 13, and will be 14 in less than a month.

God Bless!
Reply

MuslimInshallah
01-05-2016, 03:47 AM
Assalaamu alaikum Striving,


(smile) At your age, I was driving the nuns crazy with questions... and then I moved to Canada, and my life turned upside down. My parents were also from different ethnicities, and I was feeling culture shock, I had to re-learn French (after having blended in finally and learnt perfect English in England!) and then my parents separated, and the in-kids at school were mean to me, and... and... well, a lot of challenges. (smile) So I got pretty angry with God, and thought that God- if He Existed- just couldn't be Good. How could He let innocents suffer?! (smile) The transition to adulthood is a difficult time for everyone. And if then you have identity issues and instability in your family situation... well, it's just that much harder, isn't it?

(smile) So I'd suggest: focus on putting one foot in front of the other. Give yourself time to think. Go for walks in nature. Try to find somewhere to see the stars. Take up a sport. Read books, both fiction and non-fiction. Listen to people when they talk. Listen to a variety of people of different ages. Ask questions. Take time to sleep. Eat good food. (smile) And you will find after a couple of years, that your life will start settling down. And your mind will be clearer, and more focused.

(smile) I listened to Tariq Ramadan speaking once. Did you know, when he was a teen, he wasn't really much into his deen, either? And his mother was Hasan Al-Banna's daughter, and his father was one of Al-Banna's best pupils! But, growing up in Switzerland, he faced some of the same struggles of identity that you and I are facing/have faced. (smile) And then, as he got a little older, he found his faith flowering much stronger and brighter than ever before...

(smile) So, yes. Feeling fluctuations in your faith and having questions and emotions is... well, pretty normal, I'd say.

Anyway, thank you for the gift of sharing your struggles and thoughts with us on this Forum. We all learn from each other, you know.


May Allah, the Source of Peace and Safety, Help us to walk the Path that leads to Him.
Reply

Umm Abed
01-05-2016, 11:15 AM
StrivingForDeen, you have so much knowledge about Islam, why forsake it? You are confused and the satan is definitely grabbing hold of this opportunity of your state of confusion.

I urge you to hold onto your deen for your own sake.There will be no one to help you on day of Qiyamah, so Im warning you with gentleness and love, please do yourself a favour and hold tight onto the deen of Islam. This lifetime is short and just an amusement and illusion. The everlasting is still to come, so be wise.

Always remember to be very conscious of the company you keep. Always stay in the company of good muslims and the righteous. If there are no good company then it is far better to be alone. You can always keep contact with good muslims through the internet etc.
Reply

M.I.A.
01-05-2016, 11:37 AM
an agnostic christian... sounds kewl.


dear dad, after a long time soul searching i have decided i will follow biology rather than chemistry...

dad replies, should have been a doctor son.


biology majors raise flags and chant in your honour.


a collective sigh is heard across ib.




.....i actually have no idea what you have done, but im kinda ok with it.. although im not sure you should label yourself as a "former muslim" or if you should flaunt it.
Reply

sister herb
01-05-2016, 11:51 AM
Originally Posted by M.I.A.
a collective sigh is heard across ib.
;D

This I was thinking too.
Reply

M.I.A.
01-05-2016, 12:24 PM
Meh... there is no compulsion in religion.

And as he said, establishing a relationship with God is a primary goal.

May Allah swt give him better feels.
Reply

The-Deist
01-05-2016, 02:00 PM
Originally Posted by M.I.A.
an agnostic christian... sounds kewl.


dear dad, after a long time soul searching i have decided i will follow biology rather than chemistry...

dad replies, should have been a doctor son.


biology majors raise flags and chant in your honour.


a collective sigh is heard across ib.




.....i actually have no idea what you have done, but im kinda ok with it.. although im not sure you should label yourself as a "former muslim" or if you should flaunt it.
I said former Christian...
Reply

The-Deist
01-05-2016, 02:11 PM
Originally Posted by MuslimInshallah
Assalaamu alaikum Striving,


(smile) At your age, I was driving the nuns crazy with questions... and then I moved to Canada, and my life turned upside down. My parents were also from different ethnicities, and I was feeling culture shock, I had to re-learn French (after having blended in finally and learnt perfect English in England!) and then my parents separated, and the in-kids at school were mean to me, and... and... well, a lot of challenges. (smile) So I got pretty angry with God, and thought that God- if He Existed- just couldn't be Good. How could He let innocents suffer?! (smile) The transition to adulthood is a difficult time for everyone. And if then you have identity issues and instability in your family situation... well, it's just that much harder, isn't it?

(smile) So I'd suggest: focus on putting one foot in front of the other. Give yourself time to think. Go for walks in nature. Try to find somewhere to see the stars. Take up a sport. Read books, both fiction and non-fiction. Listen to people when they talk. Listen to a variety of people of different ages. Ask questions. Take time to sleep. Eat good food. (smile) And you will find after a couple of years, that your life will start settling down. And your mind will be clearer, and more focused.

(smile) I listened to Tariq Ramadan speaking once. Did you know, when he was a teen, he wasn't really much into his deen, either? And his mother was Hasan Al-Banna's daughter, and his father was one of Al-Banna's best pupils! But, growing up in Switzerland, he faced some of the same struggles of identity that you and I are facing/have faced. (smile) And then, as he got a little older, he found his faith flowering much stronger and brighter than ever before...

(smile) So, yes. Feeling fluctuations in your faith and having questions and emotions is... well, pretty normal, I'd say.

Anyway, thank you for the gift of sharing your struggles and thoughts with us on this Forum. We all learn from each other, you know.


May Allah, the Source of Peace and Safety, Help us to walk the Path that leads to Him.
I honestly feel the best as a agnostic spiritually. I feel like I am starting from scratch with God (Praised be he). I learnt alot of things during this little "adventure" of mine.
Reply

The-Deist
01-05-2016, 02:21 PM
Originally Posted by Umm Abed
StrivingForDeen, you have so much knowledge about Islam, why forsake it? You are confused and the satan is definitely grabbing hold of this opportunity of your state of confusion.

I urge you to hold onto your deen for your own sake.There will be no one to help you on day of Qiyamah, so Im warning you with gentleness and love, please do yourself a favour and hold tight onto the deen of Islam. This lifetime is short and just an amusement and illusion. The everlasting is still to come, so be wise.

Always remember to be very conscious of the company you keep. Always stay in the company of good muslims and the righteous. If there are no good company then it is far better to be alone. You can always keep contact with good muslims through the internet etc.
Honestly the question that made me "leave" Islam was why am I Muslim? I was born into Islam and didn't choose it. And I believe just staying within your own religions way of thinking will limit your potential overall. So yes there arw religions I see truth in but I am not going to do anything too fast.
Reply

M.I.A.
01-05-2016, 02:24 PM
...lol...b-b..but the brackets!

Ok well good luck anyway, you have the right to disagree that's for sure..

And I hardly ever win..

Retrial!

...giv us free!!
Reply

The-Deist
01-05-2016, 02:27 PM
Originally Posted by M.I.A.
...lol...b-b..but the brackets!

Ok well good luck anyway, you have the right to disagree that's for sure.
(former Muslim now Christian) meaning I am now also now a former Christian.
Reply

sister herb
01-05-2016, 02:39 PM
Originally Posted by StrivingforDeen
(former Muslim now Christian) meaning I am now also now a former Christian.
I am wondering how this will continues... what might be the next episode... :popcorn:
Reply

The-Deist
01-05-2016, 02:46 PM
Originally Posted by sister herb
I am wondering how this will continues... what might be the next episode... [emoji14]opcorn:
Well. I will take my time. No more hasty decisisions.
Reply

Umm Abed
01-05-2016, 04:11 PM
Originally Posted by StrivingforDeen
Honestly the question that made me "leave" Islam was why am I Muslim? I was born into Islam and didn't choose it. And I believe just staying within your own religions way of thinking will limit your potential overall. So yes there arw religions I see truth in but I am not going to do anything too fast.
Please re-read my post to you a few times, hopefully it will sink in and then you can be saved; but then again as M.I.A said, there is no compulsion in religion, whatever you choose is up to you but what answer are you going to give to Allah swt - your Creator, - for forsaking the truth?

Honestly, brother, you dont have to answer me as I am just giving you advices for your own good, so thats why Im saying read my replies a few times so that you may understand. Most importantly, stay completely away from those who are misleading you onto the wrong path, the path to destruction.
Reply

M.I.A.
01-05-2016, 04:32 PM
limiting your potential is not a problem, those that acknowledge those limits are.

..or is the opposite way around?

...think of it as training.

...training day.
Reply

The-Deist
01-05-2016, 06:07 PM
Originally Posted by Umm Abed
Please re-read my post to you a few times, hopefully it will sink in and then you can be saved; but then again as M.I.A said, there is no compulsion in religion, whatever you choose is up to you but what answer are you going to give to Allah swt - your Creator, - for forsaking the truth?

Honestly, brother, you dont have to answer me as I am just giving you advices for your own good, so thats why Im saying read my replies a few times so that you may understand. Most importantly, stay completely away from those who are misleading you onto the wrong path, the path to destruction.
I read your post like 3 times. I am not going to make any hasty decisions. I believe in a monotheistic god with no partners. I want to establish a connection with him before looking for a religion. BTW what if someone dies believing in one god, but doesnt testify to Muhammeds Prophethood?
Reply

The-Deist
01-05-2016, 06:09 PM
Originally Posted by M.I.A.
limiting your potential is not a problem, those that acknowledge those limits are.

..or is the opposite way around?

...think of it as training.

...training day.
Life is a journey to explore ourselfs, to connect with God. But if you never explore other peoples beliefs, you might be mising out alot. I have learned from non Muslims things I didnt learn from Muslims and vice versa.
Reply

Umm Malik
01-05-2016, 06:50 PM
Originally Posted by StrivingforDeen
Peace upon all of you. I am an agnostic now (former Muslim now Christian). So I believe in one God.

I feel like I left Islam too fast and just wanted to fill the emptiness in my heart. But then I realized I had followed somethings I don't agree witg because emotions.
may allah guide you
connect with him
tell him
O God if islam is the true religion put islam in my heart
the islam is the true
and you will know this here ... or in the hereafter but you will regret if you let your self to satan when you know the true after it's too late
وَقَالَ الشَّيْطَانُ لَمَّا قُضِيَ الأَمْرُ إِنَّ اللّهَ وَعَدَكُمْ وَعْدَ الْحَقِّ وَوَعَدتُّكُمْ فَأَخْلَفْتُكُمْ وَمَا كَانَ لِيَ عَلَيْكُم مِّن سُلْطَانٍ إِلاَّ أَن دَعَوْتُكُمْ فَاسْتَجَبْتُمْ لِي فَلاَ تَلُومُونِي وَلُومُواْ أَنفُسَكُم مَّا أَنَاْ بِمُصْرِخِكُمْ وَمَا أَنتُمْ بِمُصْرِخِيَّ إِنِّي كَفَرْتُ بِمَا أَشْرَكْتُمُونِ مِن قَبْلُ إِنَّ الظَّالِمِينَ لَهُمْ عَذَابٌ أَلِيمٌ
the translating ...
( 22 ) And Satan will say when the matter has been concluded, "Indeed, Allah had promised you the promise of truth. And I promised you, but I betrayed you. But I had no authority over you except that I invited you, and you responded to me. So do not blame me; but blame yourselves. I cannot be called to your aid, nor can you be called to my aid. Indeed, I deny your association of me [with Allah] before. Indeed, for the wrongdoers is a painful punishment."
you can read it from the quran directly if you want to know more ...
http://quran.ksu.edu.sa/index.php?l=...er&trans=en_sh
you can also hear to feel it when you read the translating

i am sure you will be muslim soon inshaallah
so soon

please keep listening to the coran until you will find what you need ....
Reply

Umm Abed
01-05-2016, 07:13 PM
Originally Posted by StrivingforDeen
I read your post like 3 times. I am not going to make any hasty decisions. I believe in a monotheistic god with no partners. I want to establish a connection with him before looking for a religion. BTW what if someone dies believing in one god, but doesnt testify to Muhammeds Prophethood?
Thanks.

The fact is as a born musim, you dont have any decisions to make; consider yourself very fortunate on having Islam. You also mention that you want to 'explore other people's beliefs'. There is danger in that, especially for weak muslims who's faith hang by a thread.

To answer your question, whoever disbelieved in any part of the deen and died in that condition has indeed died as a disbeliever - may Allah protect! You've got to believe in everything Allah and His Messenger :saws: has said.

With extreme concern for you, I therefore urge you to revert back to Islam. There is only one way - and Islam is the ONLY way.
Reply

Insaanah
01-05-2016, 08:22 PM
Originally Posted by StrivingforDeen
I feel like I am starting from scratch with God (Praised be he).
Ibrahim alayhi assalaam knew there was a God, he was looking for His Lord, was looking for guidance, was looking how to worship his Lord. Starting from scratch let's say:

And thus did We show Abraham the realm of the heavens and the earth that he would be among the certain [in faith]
So when the night covered him [with darkness], he saw a star. He said, "This is my lord." But when it set, he said, "I like not those that disappear."
And when he saw the moon rising, he said, "This is my lord." But when it set, he said, "Unless my Lord guides me, I will surely be among the people gone astray."
And when he saw the sun rising, he said, "This is my lord; this is greater." But when it set, he said, "O my people, indeed I am free from what you associate with Allah .
Indeed, I have turned my face toward He who created the heavens and the earth, inclining toward truth, and I am not of those who associate others with Allah ."
And his people argued with him. He said, "Do you argue with me concerning Allah while He has guided me? And I fear not what you associate with Him [and will not be harmed] unless my Lord should will something. My Lord encompasses all things in knowledge; then will you not remember?
And how should I fear what you associate while you do not fear that you have associated with Allah that for which He has not sent down to you any authority? So which of the two parties has more right to security, if you should know?
They who believe and do not mix their belief with injustice - those will have security, and they are [rightly] guided.
And that was Our [conclusive] argument which We gave Abraham against his people. We raise by degrees whom We will. Indeed, your Lord is Wise and Knowing. (6:75-83)

Once the knowledge of the truth came to him, he became firm and steadfast on it, travelled long journeys, left his family, was going to sacrifice his son, all in obedience and love to His Lord. We send blessings on him in our prayer, and he holds a very status special status in Islam. He brought the pagan society of his time to monotheism, and established the hajj that is being performed now.

Our own beloved prophet and messenger, Muhammad :saws: used to retreat to the mountains in solitude, to meditate, the truth having been diluted, corrupted. He received a revelation from Allah, and over 23 years, carried out Allah's command, and became Prophet and messenger to the whole world.

However, now the work has already been done for you. The truth, embodied by these two great men (peace and blessings be on them), is preserved. You need to try and recognise it with an open and clean heart, and to accept and embrace it.

Originally Posted by StrivingforDeen
Honestly the question that made me "leave" Islam was why am I Muslim? I was born into Islam and didn't choose it.
I can see where you're coming from. When we're brought up in a faith, we often don't value it as much as someone who found Islam after not being brought up in it. We don't seem to have the love, and are just taught, recite this, say this, believe this. But that's not a fault of the deen, but our upbringing. Some Muslim children are brought up to love God deeply, and to hold His Prophet :saws: an the sahaabah (may Allah be pleased with them), as role models and something to aspire to. And now, you can look for Islam again, start again, from scratch, and start to develop that true belief, and deep connection.

To obey God, you have to obey the messengers He sent, the messenger for our time being Muhammad :saws:. The messengers conveyed God's message to us, and taught that we should strive hard to translate our belief in the One True God into practice, by obeying Allah and the messengers He sent, who were also role models and examples for us, showing us practically how to put the guidance they were sent with into practice in our daily lives, explaining the scriptures, warning against wrong-doing, giving good tidings, and giving additional legislation from Allah. The messengers conveyed God's message to us, and with guidance to show people how He wants them to live and worship Him.

So Islam is not a new faith, but is the same ultimate universal truth that God revealed to all the prophets, including Noah, Abraham, Moses and Jesus (peace be on them), and the same thing they all taught. Thus Islam is not named after a specific person (like Christianity, Buddhism), nor after a certain race or place (like Judaism, Hinduism), but is named by God Himself, the meaning loosely translating as 'submission to God', which is what every Prophet and their righteous followers did, from amongst all times, places and peoples. That in itself is one fraction of the evidence that it was the way of all the Prophets from the beginning.

If you reject the messenger God sent, in effect it is a kind of rebellion against God, because you're saying, sorry God, I like you but don't like your choice of person you sent with your guidance to guide me. You can't obey God without obeying the guidance of God the messenger brought from God, thus you must obey the messenger.

And I believe just staying within your own religions way of thinking will limit your potential overall. So yes there arw religions I see truth in but I am not going to do anything too fast.
If you think staying within Islam (the truth) limits your potential, what potential do you think you would have without it? It would only be the potential for error and straying off the right path...

If you wanted to get from A to B, but there had been a fire or flood etc along the way, I'd say avoid x route, there's danger, stick to y route, which is safe and will get you there. If you purposely went on x route, the route that had the danger and obstacles, and thought you were broadening your horizons by doing so, people would say you'd lost the plot a bit...

Just some food for thought.

May Allah guide you back to the family of Islam, and back to the right path, ameen.

Please do ask any questions you may have.

Peace.
Reply

Muslimah_
01-05-2016, 08:23 PM
Salams brother,

I recognise you from ummah forum. I've always known you to be knowledgeable and full of Islam - eager to give advise and support for those who are having second thoughts about deen. It was quite shocking for me to come across this, sadly.

Btw an agnostic is one who does not believe in God, so how can you claim yourself as agnostic if you do?

Anyhow, brother i just want you to know that whichever religion you look at, whether it be christianity, judaism, buddhism, hinduism, etc, all have flaws and all are baseless. You have Islam, a religion that has foundation and guidance which no other religion has. Ma shaa Allah, you are very lucky to be born muslim. Others have to go through so much hardship to reach Allah swt, whereas you yourself had it much easier. Take advantage of this brother. The Quran is full of miracles, it is a book of guidance, surely if you have the desire to reach to truth then you will open up and read with a clean mind/heart.

I guess theres not much i can do to convince you, so i leave everything to Allah swt and i ask that He guides you upon the truth and protects you from all deviant beliefs.
Reply

The-Deist
01-05-2016, 08:23 PM
Originally Posted by Umm Abed
Thanks.

The fact is as a born musim, you dont have any decisions to make; consider yourself very fortunate on having Islam. You also mention that you want to 'explore other people's beliefs'. There is danger in that, especially for weak muslims who's faith hang by a thread.

To answer your question, whoever disbelieved in any part of the deen and died in that condition has indeed died as a disbeliever - may Allah protect! You've got to believe in everything Allah and His Messenger :saws: has said.

With extreme concern for you, I therefore urge you to revert back to Islam. There is only one way - and Islam is the ONLY way.
Yes I learn things from different faiths that help me with God.
Reply

The-Deist
01-05-2016, 08:26 PM
Originally Posted by Muslimah_
Salams brother,

I recognise you from ummah forum. I've always known you to be knowledgeable and full of Islam - eager to give advise and support for those who are having second thoughts about deen. It was quite shocking for me to come across this, sadly.

Btw an agnostic is one who does not believe in God, so how can you claim yourself as agnostic if you do?

Anyhow, brother i just want you to know that whichever religion you look at, whether it be christianity, judaism, buddhism, hinduism, etc, all have flaws and all are baseless. You have Islam, a religion that has foundation and guidance which no other religion has. Ma shaa Allah, you are very lucky to be born muslim. Others have to go through so much hardship to reach Allah swt, whereas you yourself had it much easier. Take advantage of this brother. The Quran is full of miracles, it is a book of guidance, surely if you have the desire to reach to truth then you will open up and read with a clean mind/heart.

I guess theres not much i can do to convince you, so i leave everything to Allah swt and i ask that He guides you upon the truth and protects you from all deviant beliefs.
An athiest doesn't believe in any deity while an agnostic does. Of course being agnostic means you are not committed to any religion.
Reply

The-Deist
01-05-2016, 08:31 PM
Originally Posted by Insaanah
Ibrahim alayhi assalaam knew there was a God, he was looking for His Lord, was looking for guidance, was looking how to worship his Lord. Starting from scratch let's say:

And thus did We show Abraham the realm of the heavens and the earth that he would be among the certain [in faith]
So when the night covered him [with darkness], he saw a star. He said, "This is my lord." But when it set, he said, "I like not those that disappear."
And when he saw the moon rising, he said, "This is my lord." But when it set, he said, "Unless my Lord guides me, I will surely be among the people gone astray."
And when he saw the sun rising, he said, "This is my lord; this is greater." But when it set, he said, "O my people, indeed I am free from what you associate with Allah .
Indeed, I have turned my face toward He who created the heavens and the earth, inclining toward truth, and I am not of those who associate others with Allah ."
And his people argued with him. He said, "Do you argue with me concerning Allah while He has guided me? And I fear not what you associate with Him [and will not be harmed] unless my Lord should will something. My Lord encompasses all things in knowledge; then will you not remember?
And how should I fear what you associate while you do not fear that you have associated with Allah that for which He has not sent down to you any authority? So which of the two parties has more right to security, if you should know?
They who believe and do not mix their belief with injustice - those will have security, and they are [rightly] guided.
And that was Our [conclusive] argument which We gave Abraham against his people. We raise by degrees whom We will. Indeed, your Lord is Wise and Knowing. (6:75-83)

Once the knowledge of the truth came to him, he became firm and steadfast on it, travelled long journeys, left his family, was going to sacrifice his son, all in obedience and love to His Lord. We send blessings on him in our prayer, and he holds a very status special status in Islam. He brought the pagan society of his time to monotheism, and established the hajj that is being performed now.

Our own beloved prophet and messenger, Muhammad :saws: used to retreat to the mountains in solitude, to meditate, the truth having been diluted, corrupted. He received a revelation from Allah, and over 23 years, carried out Allah's command, and became Prophet and messenger to the whole world.

However, now the work has already been done for you. The truth, embodied by these two great men (peace and blessings be on them), is preserved. You need to try and recognise it with an open and clean heart, and to accept and embrace it.



I can see where you're coming from. When we're brought up in a faith, we often don't value it as much as someone who found Islam after not being brought up in it. We don't seem to have the love, and are just taught, recite this, say this, believe this. But that's not a fault of the deen, but our upbringing. Some Muslim children are brought up to love God deeply, and to hold His Prophet :saws: an the sahaabah (may Allah be pleased with them), as role models and something to aspire to. And now, you can look for Islam again, start again, from scratch, and start to develop that true belief, and deep connection.

To obey God, you have to obey the messengers He sent, the messenger for our time being Muhammad :saws:. The messengers conveyed God's message to us, and taught that we should strive hard to translate our belief in the One True God into practice, by obeying Allah and the messengers He sent, who were also role models and examples for us, showing us practically how to put the guidance they were sent with into practice in our daily lives, explaining the scriptures, warning against wrong-doing, giving good tidings, and giving additional legislation from Allah. The messengers conveyed God's message to us, and with guidance to show people how He wants them to live and worship Him.

So Islam is not a new faith, but is the same ultimate universal truth that God revealed to all the prophets, including Noah, Abraham, Moses and Jesus (peace be on them), and the same thing they all taught. Thus Islam is not named after a specific person (like Christianity, Buddhism), nor after a certain race or place (like Judaism, Hinduism), but is named by God Himself, the meaning loosely translating as 'submission to God', which is what every Prophet and their righteous followers did, from amongst all times, places and peoples. That in itself is one fraction of the evidence that it was the way of all the Prophets from the beginning.

If you reject the messenger God sent, in effect it is a kind of rebellion against God, because you're saying, sorry God, I like you but don't like your choice of person you sent with your guidance to guide me. You can't obey God without obeying the guidance of God the messenger brought from God, thus you must obey the messenger.



If you think staying within Islam (the truth) limits your potential, what potential do you think you would have without it? It would only be the potential for error and straying off the right path...

If you wanted to get from A to B, but there had been a fire or flood etc along the way, I'd say avoid x route, there's danger, stick to y route, which is safe and will get you there. If you purposely went on x route, the route that had the danger and obstacles, and thought you were broadening your horizons by doing so, people would say you'd lost the plot a bit...

Just some food for thought.

May Allah guide you back to the family of Islam, and back to the right path, ameen.

Please do ask any questions you may have.

Peace.
If I ever do return to Islam, is it wrong that Muhammad is not my "favorite" Prophet/Messanger? Or is it okay?
Reply

InToTheRain
01-05-2016, 08:31 PM
Bro I just hope you live up to you name "StrivingforDeen" :D

Hoping you say "Laa Ilaha Illallah Mohammadur Rasool-ullah" before your last breaths in this short life... hoping this for everyone.
Reply

The-Deist
01-05-2016, 08:37 PM
Originally Posted by maryam muslimah
may allah guide you
connect with him
tell him
O God if islam is the true religion put islam in my heart
the islam is the true
and you will know this here ... or in the hereafter but you will regret if you let your self to satan when you know the true after it's too late
وَقَالَ الشَّيْطَانُ لَمَّا قُضِيَ الأَمْرُ إِنَّ اللّهَ وَعَدَكُمْ وَعْدَ الْحَقِّ وَوَعَدتُّكُمْ فَأَخْلَفْتُكُمْ وَمَا كَانَ لِيَ عَلَيْكُم مِّن سُلْطَانٍ إِلاَّ أَن دَعَوْتُكُمْ فَاسْتَجَبْتُمْ لِي فَلاَ تَلُومُونِي وَلُومُواْ أَنفُسَكُم مَّا أَنَاْ بِمُصْرِخِكُمْ وَمَا أَنتُمْ بِمُصْرِخِيَّ إِنِّي كَفَرْتُ بِمَا أَشْرَكْتُمُونِ مِن قَبْلُ إِنَّ الظَّالِمِينَ لَهُمْ عَذَابٌ أَلِيمٌ
the translating ...
( 22 ) And Satan will say when the matter has been concluded, "Indeed, Allah had promised you the promise of truth. And I promised you, but I betrayed you. But I had no authority over you except that I invited you, and you responded to me. So do not blame me; but blame yourselves. I cannot be called to your aid, nor can you be called to my aid. Indeed, I deny your association of me [with Allah] before. Indeed, for the wrongdoers is a painful punishment."
you can read it from the quran directly if you want to know more ...
http://quran.ksu.edu.sa/index.php?l=...er&trans=en_sh
you can also hear to feel it when you read the translating

i am sure you will be muslim soon inshaallah
so soon
I know that verse. Honestly I don't know if the Quran will effect me in anyway. It doesn't make me feel anything honestly. Also I used to follow Islam only for rewards. I never did it to connect with God. This journey allowed me to realise we have to connect to God too.
Reply

Muslimah_
01-05-2016, 08:38 PM
Originally Posted by StrivingforDeen
An athiest doesn't believe in any deity while an agnostic does. Of course being agnostic means you are not committed to any religion.
An agnostic is someone who neither believes nor disbelieves in the existence of God (50/50) whilst an atheist denies the existence of God 100% Your not either one of them so i still don't understand how your an agnostic.
Reply

The-Deist
01-05-2016, 08:41 PM
Originally Posted by Muslimah_
An agnostic is someone who neither believes nor disbelieves in the existence of God (50/50) whilst an atheist denies the existence of God 100% Your not either one of them so i still don't understand how your an agnostic.
Well I guess I then am a believer in one God.
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Muslimah_
01-05-2016, 08:48 PM
Originally Posted by StrivingforDeen
Well I guess I then am a believer in one God.
Thats better. And no i'm not kittymuslimah.
Reply

Umm Malik
01-05-2016, 08:53 PM
Originally Posted by StrivingforDeen
I know that verse. Honestly I don't know if the Quran will effect me in anyway. It doesn't make me feel anything honestly. Also I used to follow Islam only for rewards. I never did it to connect with God. This journey allowed me to realise we have to connect to God too.
that's good alhamdulillah
may allah guide you to the true
and the true is the Islam
Reply

Umm Malik
01-05-2016, 08:55 PM
Originally Posted by StrivingforDeen
Well I guess I then am a believer in one God.
alhamdulillah so that's will help you a loooot
that's so good for u
one day you will find true
alhamdulillah ....
Reply

The-Deist
01-05-2016, 08:56 PM
What is good? BTW are you from Algeria? I used to live there.
Reply

The-Deist
01-05-2016, 09:11 PM
I think now I am actually aware of God. Before it was just about good deeds bad deeds and desires.
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farhan
01-05-2016, 09:24 PM
Hope your well :).

Can I just ask a question. Sorry if it opens up a can of worms.

Has the rapper Tupac had any influence over your recent decision? His death and the conspiracies surrounding it.
Reply

The-Deist
01-05-2016, 09:30 PM
Originally Posted by فرحان
Hope your well :).

Can I just ask a question. Sorry if it opens up a can of worms.

Has the rapper Tupac had any influence over your recent decision? His death and the conspiracies surrounding it.
Yes, he is someone who inspired me to search and pray to God. Before I was thinkin bout good deeds but forgetting God. Now I believe that if you give god what he wants and talk to him. He will sort out everything for you. Just like the man who prayed for 500 years. So yes it would be worthless to do good deeds and not know God. Then you're doing it for no one with no benefit.
Reply

sister herb
01-05-2016, 09:37 PM
Originally Posted by StrivingforDeen
I think now I am actually aware of God. Before it was just about good deeds bad deeds and desires.
Salam alaykum

I think you are actually in the right path. Keep asking question and looking for answers. Good luck to you brother. :thankyou:
Reply

The-Deist
01-05-2016, 09:45 PM
Originally Posted by sister herb
Salam alaykum

I think you are actually in the right path. Keep asking question and looking for answers. Good luck to you brother. :thankyou:
Is it wrong Muhammad is not my favorite Prophet
Reply

sister herb
01-05-2016, 09:50 PM
Originally Posted by StrivingforDeen
Is it wrong Muhammad is not my favorite Prophet
Do you still believe that Muhammad is the Prophet of Allah? If yes, where´s the problem? If not, I don´t think I am the right person to answer.
Reply

Insaanah
01-05-2016, 10:06 PM
Originally Posted by StrivingforDeen
If I ever do return to Islam, is it wrong that Muhammad is not my "favorite" Prophet/Messanger? Or is it okay?
Depends what you mean by favorite. Islam as revealed to Prophet Muhammad :saws: is what we must follow, as preserved in the Qur'an and sunnah. This supercedes rules/books/teachings given to previous prophets. It is the only way to aim for success in the aakhirah. But if you mean, for example, if some people say that Yusuf alayhissalam is their favorite prophet because of the wonderful story, or Davud alayhissalam because the birds and mountains would praise God with him, these seem to refer to the stories/events involving the Prophets, rather than the Prophets in and of themselves. Of course, we believe, in, love and honour all the righteous prophets of God, and we are the only faith to be the most broadminded in that sense. We don't reject or dishonour or blaspheme any true prophet of God.

We have to acknowledge Prophet Muhammad's :saws: importance in bringing Islam to us, for all mankind, and instill love for him :saws: in our hearts:

These two links might help :ia:

http://www.islamweb.net/en/article/8...nger-of-allaah
https://islamqa.info/en/14250

but let us know if they don't.

Peace.
Reply

The-Deist
01-05-2016, 10:12 PM
Originally Posted by Insaanah
Depends what you mean by favorite. Islam as revealed to Prophet Muhammad :saws: is what we must follow, as preserved in the Qur'an and sunnah. This supercedes rules/books/teachings given to previous prophets. It is the only way to aim for success in the aakhirah. But if you mean, for example, if some people say that Yusuf alayhissalam is their favorite prophet because of the wonderful story, or Davud alayhissalam because the birds and mountains would praise God with him, these seem to refer to the stories/events involving the Prophets, rather than the Prophets in and of themselves. Of course, we believe, in, love and honour all the righteous prophets of God, and we are the only faith to be the most broadminded in that sense. We don't reject or dishonour or blaspheme any true prophet of God.

We have to acknowledge Prophet Muhammad's :saws: importance in bringing Islam to us, for all mankind, and instill love for him :saws: in our hearts:

These two links might help :ia:

http://www.islamweb.net/en/article/8...nger-of-allaah
https://islamqa.info/en/14250

but let us know if they don't.

Peace.
I mean that there are Prophets I love more than Muhammad.
Reply

Umm Malik
01-05-2016, 10:19 PM
Originally Posted by StrivingforDeen
What is good? BTW are you from Algeria? I used to live there.
I meant it's good to believed. In one god
One day you will know the prophet Mohammad salla allahu alayhi wasalam and you will love him so keep asking Allah and he will guide you ... do your best and Allah will do the rest ...
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HappyMuslimaa
01-06-2016, 03:37 AM
May Allah swt guide you in this difficult period of life.
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Zafran
01-06-2016, 03:52 AM
Originally Posted by StrivingforDeen
Well. I will take my time. No more hasty decisisions.
When I was in college (17) I was pretty much an agnostic as well, Saw philosophy as more real way of living life and understanding the world - I saw religion (Islam) like a ancient cultural tradition. It was much later in university when I read the Quran and saw to some lectures, read some books, contemplated, then i realized that this was serious decision to make. To this day the journey continues although now I'm a Muslim by choice.

Its your journey and experiences that are going to lead you to your ultimate destination. The destination we are all going to. Death and beyond.

peace
Reply

The-Deist
01-06-2016, 03:59 AM
Originally Posted by Zafran
When I was in college (17) I was pretty much an agnostic as well, Saw philosophy as more real way of living life and understanding the world - I saw religion (Islam) like a ancient cultural tradition. It was much later in university when I read the Quran and saw to some lectures, read some books, contemplated, then i realized that this was serious decision to make. To this day the journey continues although now I'm a Muslim by choice.

Its your journey and experiences that are going to lead you to your ultimate destination. The destination we are all going to. Death and beyond.

peace
If I come back to Islam there's things I won't give up tho.
Reply

The-Deist
01-06-2016, 04:51 AM
Originally Posted by HappyMuslimaa
May Allah swt guide you in this difficult period of life.
Difficult how?
Reply

Umm Abed
01-06-2016, 07:06 AM
Originally Posted by StrivingforDeen
Yes I learn things from different faiths that help me with God.
Nothing will help you from other faiths with God. Allah has already sent His Prophet :saws: as a Guide and teacher to us. What more could we ask for?

To answer your question regarding love for Rasul:saws:. Yes indeed. It is very important to love him more than our own lives. This love comes naturally on being a muslim, it is part of faith, and is in the heart of every true muslim.
Reply

sister herb
01-06-2016, 09:37 AM
Originally Posted by StrivingforDeen
Difficult how?
Finding your own way at your age is always difficult.
Reply

The-Deist
01-06-2016, 10:54 AM
Originally Posted by sister herb
Finding your own way at your age is always difficult.
Mayyybe, maybe not.
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The-Deist
01-06-2016, 11:35 AM
Originally Posted by Umm Abed
Nothing will help you from other faiths with God. Allah has already sent His Prophet :saws: as a Guide and teacher to us. What more could we ask for?

To answer your question regarding love for Rasul:saws:. Yes indeed. It is very important to love him more than our own lives. This love comes naturally on being a muslim, it is part of faith, and is in the heart of every true muslim.
Yes I have learnt things from people of other faiths.
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greenhill
01-06-2016, 12:10 PM
It's a hard one. I've contemplated on this thread a while now.

Even at 30 plus, when I began to see the manipulation of the world we live in, in contrast to what is actually expected of us as a muslim, it is quite jarring and poles apart. Almost irreconcilable. Br Farhan's post about the 100 commands from Allah gives very clear examples of how society is these days compared to what is asked of us. Very hard to keep up with even half of the it. If we did, most likely we'd get sidelined as those who shouts loudest often gets heard.

So, unless one can feel the truth and understand that Satan's job is to test us to cause us to go astray, we can hold onto the correct path "ihdinahsiratol mustaqeem" and not get shaken.

That's all for now.

:peace:
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InToTheRain
01-06-2016, 02:28 PM
I would advise you to read about the life of the Prophet :saws: and the one below is really comprehensive although it's quite a read. Its covers the geo-political situation and touches on the history of each nations with it's moral degradations before and after his arrival.

http://islam786books.com/index.php?m...roducts_id=203
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Fatal
01-06-2016, 03:10 PM
You have a little confusion.
If you claim to be agnostic you can not believe in God. Your thinking is deist or theist, depending on whether you think this god intervenes or not in the life of people.
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The-Deist
01-06-2016, 08:00 PM
Originally Posted by InToTheRain
I would advise you to read about the life of the Prophet :saws: and the one below is really comprehensive although it's quite a read. Its covers the geo-political situation and touches on the history of each nations with it's moral degradations before and after his arrival.

http://islam786books.com/index.php?m...roducts_id=203
I have read The Sealed Nectar. And of course Hadiths.
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The-Deist
01-06-2016, 08:01 PM
Originally Posted by Fatal
You have a little confusion.
If you claim to be agnostic you can not believe in God. Your thinking is deist or theist, depending on whether you think this god intervenes or not in the life of people.
Yeah, my bad. Wrong choisce of words. I'm a believer in One God (deist?).
Reply

Insaanah
01-06-2016, 08:14 PM
Originally Posted by StrivingforDeen
I mean that there are Prophets I love more than Muhammad.
May I ask, which Prophets, and why?

Originally Posted by StrivingforDeen
If I come back to Islam there's things I won't give up tho.
May I ask what they are, and why?

Just to help us understand.

Peace.
Reply

Fatal
01-06-2016, 08:23 PM
Originally Posted by StrivingforDeen
Yeah, my bad. Wrong choisce of words. I'm a believer in One God (deist?).
It Depends
If you believe in a creator god of the universe, which is beyond any religion, but also think that God is not interested in the fate nor the affairs of men, you're deist.
Reply

The-Deist
01-07-2016, 12:43 AM
Originally Posted by Insaanah
May I ask, which Prophets, and why?



May I ask what they are, and why?

Just to help us understand.

Peace.
I really feel like I like the Prophets Moses and Abraham.
Reply

HappyMuslimaa
01-07-2016, 04:04 AM
Adolescence is a time with many changes.
Best wishes with you :):peace:
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The-Deist
01-07-2016, 04:07 AM
Originally Posted by HappyMuslimaa
Adolescence is a time with many changes.
Best wishes with you :)[emoji14]eace:
Mayyybe, maybe not. I'm just trying regain faith in Muhammad
Reply

HappyMuslimaa
01-07-2016, 04:11 AM
Originally Posted by StrivingforDeen
Mayyybe, maybe not. I'm just trying regain faith in Muhammad
May Allah swt guide you
Reply

The-Deist
01-07-2016, 04:27 AM
Originally Posted by HappyMuslimaa
May Allah swt guide you
What makes you believe in Muhammed?
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HappyMuslimaa
01-07-2016, 04:38 AM
I believe in Muhammad pbuh because he is the Messenger of Allah swt and I fear Allah swt
Reply

The-Deist
01-07-2016, 04:38 AM
Originally Posted by HappyMuslimaa
May Allah swt guide you
Is that all your gonna say?
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HappyMuslimaa
01-07-2016, 04:52 AM
Brother, I did not come here to tantalize you. I only wanted to wish you well on your journey in this deen. It is but a trial.
I am a convert myself, and I spent much of my adolecense and youth trying to find God in my future, so I can understand your stance.
:wa:
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Umm Abed
01-07-2016, 07:58 AM
Originally Posted by StrivingforDeen
Mayyybe, maybe not. I'm just trying regain faith in Muhammad

We were the most humiliated people on earth and Allah gave us honour through Islam. If we ever seek honour through anything else, Allah will humiliate us again.” Quote by Hazrat Umar bin Khattab:ra:.

Renew your kalimah because there will be no honour in leaving your deen.
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sister herb
01-07-2016, 08:59 AM
Originally Posted by HappyMuslimaa
Brother, I did not come here to tantalize you. I only wanted to wish you well on your journey in this deen. It is but a trial.
I am a convert myself, and I spent much of my adolecense and youth trying to find God in my future, so I can understand your stance.
:wa:
Same here. Brother is now doing the same what we reverts did when we were looking for understanding what Islam really is and all that stuff. Good luck brother StrivingforDeen - we know this path as we have walked along of it before. Have a safe journey and hopely you will reach your goal.
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The-Deist
01-07-2016, 12:52 PM
Originally Posted by Umm Abed
We were the most humiliated people on earth and Allah gave us honour through Islam. If we ever seek honour through anything else, Allah will humiliate us again.” Quote by Hazrat Umar bin Khattab:ra:.

Renew your kalimah because there will be no honour in leaving your deen.
That didn't answer my question
Reply

Umm Malik
01-07-2016, 05:09 PM


they may be help you in your question about the prophet Muhammad salla Allahu alayhi wasallam
Reply

InToTheRain
01-07-2016, 05:17 PM
Originally Posted by StrivingforDeen
I have read The Sealed Nectar. And of course Hadiths.
I have read 3 different Seerat Un Nabi :saws: ; some are more informative then others.
Reply

The-Deist
01-07-2016, 05:30 PM
Originally Posted by maryam muslimah



they may be help you in your question about the prophet Muhammad salla Allahu alayhi wasallam
The second one just ignites selfish love.
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aflawedbeing
01-08-2016, 12:50 AM
StrivingForDeen. You will be back insha'Allah!
May Allah swt guide you.
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Zafran
01-08-2016, 01:20 AM
Originally Posted by StrivingforDeen
What makes you believe in Muhammed?
The same reason I believe Jesus, Moses Abraham pbuta etc are prophets. Its pretty clear to me that the prophet Muhammad pbuh was a true prophet - He called for the worship of One God - To enjoin Good and forbid evil and reformed his own society which was harsh and corrupt place. Told people not to worship Idols, Honour women, children and elderly. To establish prayer and charity - to take care of the orphan, windows and the poor. The same message of all the prophets before him.

No complicated theology like the Christians, or a message for a specific people like the Jews. No need of Idols like the Hindus. Not like atheist who tries to make this world heaven when in reality everything is fleeting. Going to one source.

As the prophet said "“Be in this world as though you were a stranger or a wayfarer.”

As the Quran says

“And We will surely test you with something of fear and hunger and a loss of wealth and lives and fruits, but give good tidings to the patient, who, when distress strikes them, say, “Indeed we belong to Allah , and indeed to Him we will return.” Those are the ones upon whom are blessings from their Lord and mercy. And it is those who are the truly guided.” [Qur’an, 2.155-157]



peace.
Reply

Umm Malik
01-08-2016, 03:10 PM
Originally Posted by StrivingforDeen
The second one just ignites selfish love.
i am sorry about that
the quran is the best way to know allah
say to yourself
if the muslims think that the quran is the book of allah i will read it to see what he want me to do
and read it to know him
he will guide you for sure
it's the best way to know him
Reply

Muhaba
01-08-2016, 09:08 PM
Originally Posted by StrivingforDeen
Honestly the question that made me "leave" Islam was why am I Muslim? I was born into Islam and didn't choose it. And I believe just staying within your own religions way of thinking will limit your potential overall. So yes there arw religions I see truth in but I am not going to do anything too fast.
Why am I Muslim? Because Islam is the true religion of God and no other religion is true. Do you doubt that Islam is true? What makes you doubt it? Do you not believe the Quran is the Word of God? What makes you doubt that? You need to look into these issues and clarify them. If you know that the Quran is the Word of God, how can you not believe in Islam then and how can you question why you're a Muslim.

You also need to recite the dua "ya muqalibal quloob sabit qalbi ala deenik" and sincerely ask - no beg - Allah for guidance because Allah has no need for you but you need Allah. You know that if you leave Islam deliberately after knowing it is the truth, Allah will leave you to stray and you'll never find the way back. So repent and Ask Allah for guidance. If you're in doubt about some matters, get knowledge about them while being a Muslim. Why leave Islam when you know that the kafir will be in Hell forever and you can die any time?
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Muhaba
01-08-2016, 09:26 PM
Originally Posted by StrivingforDeen
I mean that there are Prophets I love more than Muhammad.
Why would you love anyone else more than the one :saws1: who went through so much trouble to make Islam available to you?
Reply

Muhaba
01-08-2016, 09:42 PM
Originally Posted by StrivingforDeen
What makes you believe in Muhammed?
One sign that Prophet Muhammad :saw1: was given was the Quran and it is proof of his prophethood. In Surah Al-Qalam, Allah swears on that which is being written down (the Quran) and so the Quran is evidence on the items stated in the verses that follow, including that the Prophet :saw1: was the best of mankind. So, if you look at all the proofs - from the Quran to the work and lifestyle of the Prophet to his excellent character - you'll see that he was the Prophet of God and the best of mankind and worthy of love and adoration.
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crimsontide06
01-09-2016, 03:11 AM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dvKUv2xQYfc

this is a great talk :)

Q&A for the ^ talk . https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WwlawkZcL64
Reply

The-Deist
01-10-2016, 01:20 AM
Originally Posted by crimsontide06
Could you sumarize it
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The-Deist
01-10-2016, 01:22 AM
Originally Posted by Muhaba
One sign that Prophet Muhammad :saw1: was given was the Quran and it is proof of his prophethood. In Surah Al-Qalam, Allah swears on that which is being written down (the Quran) and so the Quran is evidence on the items stated in the verses that follow, including that the Prophet :saw1: was the best of mankind. So, if you look at all the proofs - from the Quran to the work and lifestyle of the Prophet to his excellent character - you'll see that he was the Prophet of God and the best of mankind and worthy of love and adoration.
The Quran doesn't move me
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The-Deist
01-10-2016, 01:27 AM
Originally Posted by Muhaba
Why would you love anyone else more than the one :saws1: who went through so much trouble to make Islam available to you?
Why don't the other Prophets have "Hadiths". I am more interested in them because everything is about Muhammad. Honestly it gets a little boring. Variety. Variety. Variety. They should have had something like Gospels. Like Book of Jesus, Moses etc. A compilation of their life and disciples or followers. Also we don't know anything about companions of other Prophets or Messangers in great numbers.
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The-Deist
01-10-2016, 01:29 AM
Originally Posted by maryam muslimah
i am sorry about that
the quran is the best way to know allah
say to yourself
if the muslims think that the quran is the book of allah i will read it to see what he want me to do
and read it to know him
he will guide you for sure
it's the best way to know him
I am not interested in The Quran. It doesn't make me feel anything. Not happiness nor sadness. Even music does that.
Reply

crimsontide06
01-10-2016, 03:37 AM
Honestly, to get the message of what she is saying you have to listen. No summary would do it justice, ...after watching a couple of years ago, I started praying.

Originally Posted by StrivingforDeen
Could you sumarize it
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The-Deist
01-10-2016, 04:02 AM
Originally Posted by crimsontide06
Honestly, to get the message of what she is saying you have to listen. No summary would do it justice, ...after watching a couple of years ago, I started praying.
I got bored after 15 minutes.
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popsthebuilder
01-10-2016, 04:58 AM
Originally Posted by StrivingforDeen
I got bored after 15 minutes.
You got bored?!

The Qur'an is the truth.
If it doesn't grab you, but other scriptures do, then there must be some sort of comprehension issue. It connected and still rings true to me with striking heart cords. A novel it is not. But if it doesn't reach you on any level then I can't understand how other scriptures are doing much better.

I hope sincerely that you find the truth within yourself that you might discern the word without bias. What proud thing is keeping you from accepting the Qur'an?

Peace
Reply

The-Deist
01-10-2016, 05:00 AM
Originally Posted by popsthebuilder
You got bored?!

The Qur'an is the truth.
If it doesn't grab you, but other scriptures do, then there must be some sort of comprehension issue. It connected and still rings true to me with striking heart cords. A novel it is not. But if it doesn't reach you on any level then I can't understand how other scriptures are doing much better.

I hope sincerely that you find the truth within yourself that you might discern the word without bias. What proud thing is keeping you from accepting the Qur'an?

Peace
There ain't no scripture that can capture me. Plus the lecture ain't about Quran.
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popsthebuilder
01-10-2016, 05:04 AM
You speak of emotion yet seem to dismiss the fact that emotion and the conscience are spoken of and relate to much of scripture in many religions.

What do you think is meant by things being placed on your heart?

Peace
Reply

The-Deist
01-10-2016, 05:52 AM
Originally Posted by popsthebuilder
You speak of emotion yet seem to dismiss the fact that emotion and the conscience are spoken of and relate to much of scripture in many religions.

What do you think is meant by things being placed on your heart?

Peace
People change.
Reply

popsthebuilder
01-10-2016, 05:55 AM
Originally Posted by StrivingforDeen
People change.
Indeed they can.
Reply

BlackSeed
01-10-2016, 08:44 AM
Originally Posted by StrivingforDeen
Peace upon all of you. I am an agnostic now (former Muslim now Christian). So I believe in one God.

I feel like I left Islam too fast and just wanted to fill the emptiness in my heart. But then I realized I had followed somethings I don't agree witg because emotions.
Do you accept the Trinity Doctrine?

How is possible for you to be Agnostic and Christian at the same time?

Agnostic normally means a person who is open to the idea of a higher consciousness yet not interested in being part of an organized religion.
Reply

sister herb
01-10-2016, 09:05 AM
Originally Posted by StrivingforDeen
People change.
People also grow up. Be patient. You may know what you really are something like after 10 years. ;D
Reply

The-Deist
01-10-2016, 10:32 AM
Originally Posted by BlackSeed
Do you accept the Trinity Doctrine?

How is possible for you to be Agnostic and Christian at the same time?

Agnostic normally means a person who is open to the idea of a higher consciousness yet not interested in being part of an organized religion.
As the thread has advanced it says I am a believer in one deity. Even the OP says (former Muslim now Christian).
Reply

Raptor
01-10-2016, 10:50 AM
May Allah guide you to the truth
Reply

BlackSeed
01-10-2016, 11:01 AM
Originally Posted by StrivingforDeen
As the thread has advanced it says I am a believer in one deity. Even the OP says (former Muslim now Christian).
Are you aware that the Bible was written by more than 40 unknown authors in a different language to what Jesus PBUH spoke?

Do you know that the titles of each books such as ''Book of John'' were given later by randomly picking which means John does not identify himself as the author neither does Luke, Mark, Mathew etc. So we dont know even know if John wrote book of John or Luke wrote book of Luke.

Do you know that each unknown author contradict each other?

Lets take Number of women at the tomb noted by each author:


Matthew – 2
Mark – 3
Luke – 5
John – 1


Women disciples visit the tomb and discover Christ missing (Matthew 28:1; Mark 16:1-4; Luke 24:1-3; John 20:1).


This indeed proves that all the unknown authors ''believed'' or ''heard'' the same oral tradition but its very clear that its unlikely to be ''inspired'' by God. In the ancient cultures when some popular or special figure died it was a norm that the people turned him/her in to a God like figure.


Most of these latter scriptures that were added to the bible were based on visions, well if things were based on vision then we know that virgin Mary has appeared to thousands of her followers, as numerous eye witnesses attest: well heck even the pagan cultures had such visions if you study the Roman history, Apollonius of Tyana came to one of his followers after he ascended to the skies/heaven. Dozens of Roman people and senators claimed that king Romulus was taken up-to heaven. People even thought Caesar was a God after he died.
Reply

The-Deist
01-10-2016, 11:20 AM
Originally Posted by BlackSeed
Are you aware that the Bible was written by more than 40 unknown authors in a different language to what Jesus PBUH spoke?

Do you know that the titles of each books such as ''Book of John'' were given later by randomly picking which means John does not identify himself as the author neither does Luke, Mark, Mathew etc. So we dont know even know if John wrote book of John or Luke wrote book of Luke.

Do you know that each unknown author contradict each other?

Lets take Number of women at the tomb noted by each author:


Matthew – 2
Mark – 3
Luke – 5
John – 1


Women disciples visit the tomb and discover Christ missing (Matthew 28:1; Mark 16:1-4; Luke 24:1-3; John 20:1).


This indeed proves that all the unknown authors ''believed'' or ''heard'' the same oral tradition but its very clear that its unlikely to be ''inspired'' by God. In the ancient cultures when some popular or special figure died it was a norm that the people turned him/her in to a God like figure.


Most of these latter scriptures that were added to the bible were based on visions, well if things were based on vision then we know that virgin Mary has appeared to thousands of her followers, as numerous eye witnesses attest: well heck even the pagan cultures had such visions if you study the Roman history, Apollonius of Tyana came to one of his followers after he ascended to the skies/heaven. Dozens of Roman people and senators claimed that king Romulus was taken up-to heaven. People even thought Caesar was a God after he died.
Did you even read the thread?
Reply

BlackSeed
01-10-2016, 11:30 AM
Originally Posted by StrivingforDeen
Did you even read the thread?
unfortunately not, i will go through the full thread when i return home and see whats happening here :hmm:
Reply

The-Deist
01-10-2016, 11:32 AM
Originally Posted by BlackSeed
unfortunately not, i will go through the full thread when i return home and see whats happening here :hmm:
Yes. Because there's alot of stuff in here.
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BlackSeed
01-10-2016, 11:42 AM
Originally Posted by StrivingforDeen
Yes. Because there's alot of stuff in here.
Whatever it is we are with you brother, non of us are perfect

After reading the entire thread i will get back to you Insha-Allah
Reply

sister herb
01-10-2016, 11:56 AM
Originally Posted by BlackSeed
unfortunately not, i will go through the full thread when i return home and see whats happening here :hmm:
You better start reading from the beginning:

http://www.islamicboard.com/advice-a...ight=christian

That´s a long story...
Reply

popsthebuilder
01-10-2016, 01:21 PM
Originally Posted by sister herb
You better start reading from the beginning:

http://www.islamicboard.com/advice-a...ight=christian

That´s a long story...
And note that specific parts that did not align with the general consensus were removed, and/or moved.

Peace
Reply

Umm Malik
01-10-2016, 03:12 PM
Originally Posted by StrivingforDeen
I am not interested in The Quran. It doesn't make me feel anything. Not happiness nor sadness. Even music does that.
no ... if i hear music when i be sad it make more sadness
and if i hear it when i happy it make me more happy
but the quran make me satisfied when i sad and more happy if i am happy
when i'm sad and hear :
( 68 ) يَا عِبَادِ لَا خَوْفٌ عَلَيْكُمُ الْيَوْمَ وَلَا أَنتُمْ تَحْزَنُونَ
( 69 ) الَّذِينَ آمَنُوا بِآيَاتِنَا وَكَانُوا مُسْلِمِينَ
( 70 ) ادْخُلُوا الْجَنَّةَ أَنتُمْ وَأَزْوَاجُكُمْ تُحْبَرُونَ
( 71 ) يُطَافُ عَلَيْهِم بِصِحَافٍ مِّن ذَهَبٍ وَأَكْوَابٍ ۖ وَفِيهَا مَا تَشْتَهِيهِ الْأَنفُسُ وَتَلَذُّ الْأَعْيُنُ ۖ وَأَنتُمْ فِيهَا خَالِدُونَ
( 72 ) وَتِلْكَ الْجَنَّةُ الَّتِي أُورِثْتُمُوهَا بِمَا كُنتُمْ تَعْمَلُونَ

[To whom Allah will say], "O My servants, no fear will there be concerning you this Day, nor will you grieve,
( 69 ) [You] who believed in Our verses and were Muslims.
( 70 ) Enter Paradise, you and your kinds, delighted."
( 71 ) Circulated among them will be plates and vessels of gold. And therein is whatever the souls desire and [what] delights the eyes, and you will abide therein eternally.
( 72 ) And that is Paradise which you are made to inherit for what you used to do.

and when i make sins i hear ( 53 ) ۞ قُلْ يَا عِبَادِيَ الَّذِينَ أَسْرَفُوا عَلَىٰ أَنفُسِهِمْ لَا تَقْنَطُوا مِن رَّحْمَةِ اللَّهِ ۚ إِنَّ اللَّهَ يَغْفِرُ الذُّنُوبَ جَمِيعًا ۚ إِنَّهُ هُوَ الْغَفُورُ الرَّحِيمُ

( 53 ) Say, "O My servants who have transgressed against themselves [by sinning], do not despair of the mercy of Allah. Indeed, Allah forgives all sins. Indeed, it is He who is the Forgiving, the Merciful."

if i have problem ... i read الزمر - الآية 10قُلْ يَا عِبَادِ الَّذِينَ آمَنُوا اتَّقُوا رَبَّكُمْ ۚ لِلَّذِينَ أَحْسَنُوا فِي هَٰذِهِ الدُّنْيَا حَسَنَةٌ ۗ وَأَرْضُ اللَّهِ وَاسِعَةٌ ۗ إِنَّمَا يُوَفَّى الصَّابِرُونَ أَجْرَهُم بِغَيْرِ حِسَابٍ
( 10 ) Say, "O My servants who have believed, fear your Lord. For those who do good in this world is good, and the earth of Allah is spacious. Indeed, the patient will be given their reward without account."


i found in it .... each thing i need
but if you don't feel any thing ... i just ask allah to guide you to the best .. wherever it .... even i know that is in the coran
may allah be with you and give you his help indeed : And it is He who sends down the rain after they had despised and spreads His mercy. And He is the Protector, the Praiseworthy.
if you believe in one god... just one thing i can help you with is to tell you about this remembering ( dhikr ) la ilaha illa allah )
this dhikr will help you to see the signs and you may belive one day in the coran and the prophet muhammad
you have part ... and it is the big part
so one day you will have the rest inshaalllah
wish to can help you
but i just can ask allah to guide you and give you his mercy
thank you ....
Reply

The-Deist
01-10-2016, 05:12 PM
Originally Posted by maryam muslimah
no ... if i hear music when i be sad it make more sadness
and if i hear it when i happy it make me more happy
but the quran make me satisfied when i sad and more happy if i am happy
when i'm sad and hear :
( 68 ) يَا عِبَادِ لَا خَوْفٌ عَلَيْكُمُ الْيَوْمَ وَلَا أَنتُمْ تَحْزَنُونَ
( 69 ) الَّذِينَ آمَنُوا بِآيَاتِنَا وَكَانُوا مُسْلِمِينَ
( 70 ) ادْخُلُوا الْجَنَّةَ أَنتُمْ وَأَزْوَاجُكُمْ تُحْبَرُونَ
( 71 ) يُطَافُ عَلَيْهِم بِصِحَافٍ مِّن ذَهَبٍ وَأَكْوَابٍ ۖ وَفِيهَا مَا تَشْتَهِيهِ الْأَنفُسُ وَتَلَذُّ الْأَعْيُنُ ۖ وَأَنتُمْ فِيهَا خَالِدُونَ
( 72 ) وَتِلْكَ الْجَنَّةُ الَّتِي أُورِثْتُمُوهَا بِمَا كُنتُمْ تَعْمَلُونَ

[To whom Allah will say], "O My servants, no fear will there be concerning you this Day, nor will you grieve,
( 69 ) [You] who believed in Our verses and were Muslims.
( 70 ) Enter Paradise, you and your kinds, delighted."
( 71 ) Circulated among them will be plates and vessels of gold. And therein is whatever the souls desire and [what] delights the eyes, and you will abide therein eternally.
( 72 ) And that is Paradise which you are made to inherit for what you used to do.

and when i make sins i hear ( 53 ) ۞ قُلْ يَا عِبَادِيَ الَّذِينَ أَسْرَفُوا عَلَىٰ أَنفُسِهِمْ لَا تَقْنَطُوا مِن رَّحْمَةِ اللَّهِ ۚ إِنَّ اللَّهَ يَغْفِرُ الذُّنُوبَ جَمِيعًا ۚ إِنَّهُ هُوَ الْغَفُورُ الرَّحِيمُ

( 53 ) Say, "O My servants who have transgressed against themselves [by sinning], do not despair of the mercy of Allah. Indeed, Allah forgives all sins. Indeed, it is He who is the Forgiving, the Merciful."

if i have problem ... i read الزمر - الآية 10قُلْ يَا عِبَادِ الَّذِينَ آمَنُوا اتَّقُوا رَبَّكُمْ ۚ لِلَّذِينَ أَحْسَنُوا فِي هَٰذِهِ الدُّنْيَا حَسَنَةٌ ۗ وَأَرْضُ اللَّهِ وَاسِعَةٌ ۗ إِنَّمَا يُوَفَّى الصَّابِرُونَ أَجْرَهُم بِغَيْرِ حِسَابٍ
( 10 ) Say, "O My servants who have believed, fear your Lord. For those who do good in this world is good, and the earth of Allah is spacious. Indeed, the patient will be given their reward without account."


i found in it .... each thing i need
but if you don't feel any thing ... i just ask allah to guide you to the best .. wherever it .... even i know that is in the coran
may allah be with you and give you his help indeed : And it is He who sends down the rain after they had despised and spreads His mercy. And He is the Protector, the Praiseworthy.
if you believe in one god... just one thing i can help you with is to tell you about this remembering ( dhikr ) la ilaha illa allah )
this dhikr will help you to see the signs and you may belive one day in the coran and the prophet muhammad
you have part ... and it is the big part
so one day you will have the rest inshaalllah
wish to can help you
but i just can ask allah to guide you and give you his mercy
thank you ....
People are different. For me music is a great part of my life since childhood. Do you know how to speak Darija?
Reply

The-Deist
01-10-2016, 07:02 PM
I will leave the forum after this thread has finished
Reply

Insaanah
01-10-2016, 07:06 PM
May I ask why? Please do stick around.
Reply

The-Deist
01-10-2016, 07:25 PM
Originally Posted by Insaanah
May I ask why? Please do stick around.
I feel like it's distracting me from real life. And what do I have to contribute
Reply

sister herb
01-10-2016, 07:29 PM
Living in the real life is a good idea. You need time think and to find yourself. But also we would like to hear your news sometimes.

Take your time, brother. We are here waiting you when you return at some day.
Reply

The-Deist
01-10-2016, 07:30 PM
Originally Posted by sister herb
Living in the real life is a good idea. You need time think and to find yourself. But also we would like to hear your news sometimes.

Take your time, brother. We are here waiting you when you return at some day.
Social media
Reply

The-Deist
01-10-2016, 07:31 PM
Also there's people I know here. If they want to they can update.
Reply

Umm Abed
01-10-2016, 07:55 PM
Originally Posted by StrivingforDeen
I will leave the forum after this thread has finished
No dont leave the forum please do stay on here.
Reply

The-Deist
01-10-2016, 07:56 PM
Originally Posted by Umm Abed
No dont leave the forum please do stay on here.
Why not?
Reply

Umm Abed
01-10-2016, 07:58 PM
Originally Posted by StrivingforDeen
Why not?
There are so much things we can learn on here as well as from each other.
Reply

The-Deist
01-10-2016, 07:59 PM
Originally Posted by Umm Abed
There are so much things we can learn on here as well as from each other.
Such as?
Reply

Umm Abed
01-10-2016, 08:00 PM
Originally Posted by StrivingforDeen
Such as?
Too many to mention. Everything, in general.

You actually have good mannerisms..
Reply

Muhammad
01-10-2016, 08:01 PM
StrivingforDeen,

Originally Posted by StrivingforDeen
The Quran doesn't move me
The Qur'an is among the greatest evidences for the truth of Islam. It deserves to be read and researched in detail as it is full of evidences and signs. If you truly want to benefit from the Qur’an, your heart must be attentive and alert when reciting it or listening to it. Listen to it carefully with presence of mind, paying attention to it as if Allah Himself was speaking to you directly. Understand that this Qur’an is an address directed to you from Allah, Most High, upon the tongue of His Messenger :saws:.

Truly there is a reminder in this for anyone who has a heart, or who listens attentively with presence of mind.” [Qaf (50): 37]


Below are some of the reasons (summarised by Brother Ansar Al-'Adl) as to why the Qur'an is such a special Book. Apologies as some of the links are outdated although I have updated one.

1. The Power of the Qur'anic Message:
-it is universal, unrestricted by time and applicable to any nation/culture. The Qur'an is by far the most widely followed and acted-upon book in the world. As for the Bible, most Christians follow the Church over the Bible, and each denomination has its own bible anyway. The fact that there is no other book in the world that forms the constitution of the lives of billions of followers is itself a sign.
-it is practical and logical, it can be established practically in society and is logically able to address the fundamental questions relating to all aspects of our universe.
-it is comprehensive, addressing all fundamental sectors of human life, be it spritual, physical, mental, social/societal, politcal, environmental, economic, etc.
-it is natural, in concordance with a person's nature and what they feel deep inside to be the truth.
-it is clear and consistent, free of the changes in worldview and understanding that dominate the works of human beings.
-it is deep, having provoked thousands upon thousands of volumes of exegesis, expounding upon its meaning and revealing fascinating details that many people otherwise miss in their reading of the Qur'an.
2. The Power of the Qur'anic Style:
-it is Interactive, the text seems alive as it responds to the very questions that arise in one's mind at that moment. It speaks to the reader and delivers specific yet universal advice.
-it is Inerrant, free from contradictons and discrepancies, or other errors that would normally be found in the works of human beings.
-it is Memorizable; the Qur'an is the only book in the world which is continuously being memorized by millions of people and recited daily. No other book has been committed to memory by so many followers, as though it fits in one's mind as a key in a lock.
-its Language, the Qur'anic arabic is a stunning miracle in itself, its style is powerful and its recitation is melodious. More info here.
3. The Power of the Qur'anic Text:
-it is Preserved, even after fourteen and a half centuries, the Qur'an is recited today exactly as it was first revealed. Thus it was free of the tampering that befell other religious scriptures.
-its other Remarkable features; many Muslims find a striking concordance between many Qur'anic statements and established scientific truths, which could not have been known by any normal human being 14 centuries ago. (see here). Many Muslims have also found the Qur'anic perfection extends even to various mathematical miracles within the text (see here for discussion of word repetitions). As well, there are the Qur'anic Prophecies.
-its Authorship; the context in which the Qur'an was revealed leaves the reader with no other conclusion than the fact that it could only be the word of God.

Here are some more links which go into detail on the various aspects. There are many more, but hopefully this will give you an introduction.

Miracles in general
http://www.whyislam.org/submission/t...-of-the-quran/
http://www.islamic-awareness.org/Quran/
http://www.islamicboard.com/quran/13...racle-god.html
The Miracle and the Challenge of the Qur'an

Challenge of the Qur'an:
The Challenge of the Qur'an
http://www.islamicboard.com/clarific...ml#post1281044
http://www.islamicboard.com/quran/32986-challenge.html

Literary excellence:
http://www.islam21c.com/texts/203-an...e-of-the-quran
http://www.theinimitablequran.com/index.html

Preservation
http://www.islamicboard.com/clarific...tml#post785930
http://www.islamicboard.com/discover...n-changed.html

Prophecies

The amazing Quran - Prophecy of Romans
History Proves the Accuracy of the Qur'an
http://www.islamicboard.com/discover...ut-failed.html

Scientific miracles
http://www.islamreligion.com/category/33/
http://www.islamicboard.com/health-s...les-quran.html
Exploring Islam
http://islampapers.com/embryology-in-the-quran/


What makes you believe in Muhammed?
This is another great evidence for the truth of Islam. Again, it deserves a sincere study in detail and you will find reason after reason to believe.

Let us consider this. If the Prophet :saws: was not a true Prophet, that would mean he was a liar. But we find that his life points to the contrary:
- Is it possible for a liar to claim for a period of 23 years with unwavering certitude that he is a prophet like Abraham, Moses, and Jesus, that there will be no more prophets after him, and that the scripture he has been sent with will remain his lasting miracle till the end of time? A liar will falter sometimes, perhaps with a friend, maybe with his family members, somewhere he will make a mistake. His message, delivered over two decades, will contradict itself sometimes. But what we see in reality is that the scripture he brought declares freedom from internal inconsistencies, his message remained consistent throughout his mission, and even in the midst of a battle, he proclaimed his prophethood!

- His life story is a preserved book open for everyone to read. Before Islam, he was well-known to his own people to be trustworthy and reliable, an honest man, a person of integrity, who did not lie. It was due to this reason they named him "Al-Ameen", or "The Trustworthy" He was strongly opposed to lying and warned against it. Is it possible for him to tell a consistent lie for 23 years, a lie so monstrous that it would make him a social outcast, when he was never known to have lied even once about anything? It’s simply against the psychology of liars.

- If one was to ask why a person would make claim to prophethood and lie, their answer might be one of two:
1) Fame, glory, wealth and status.
2) Moral progress.

If we were to say that Muhammad :saws: claimed prophethood for fame glory and status, we would see that what actually occurred was the exact opposite. Muhammad :saws:, before his claim to Prophethood, enjoyed a high status in all aspects. He was of the most noble of tribes, of the most noble of families, and was known for his truthfulness. After his claim, he became a social outcast. For 13 years in Makkah, he and his followers faced excruciating torture, which led to the death of some of his followers, ridicule, sanctioning, and excommunication from society.

- There were many other ways which a person could gain fame in the society of that time, mainly from valor, and poetry. If Muhammad :saws: had made the claim that he himself authored the Quran, that would have been enough for his name and poetry to be engraved in gold and hung inside the Ka’bah for eternity, people from all over the world hallowing him. Rather, he proclaimed that he was not the author of this revelation, and that it was from the One high above, causing him to be ridiculed in his time until ours.

- The Prophet :saws: was the husband of a wealthy tradeswoman, and he enjoyed the comforts of life available to him at his time. But after his claim of prophethood, he became of the poorest of people. Days passed without stove fire being lit in his house, and at one time, hunger drove him to the mosque in hope of some provision. The leaders of Makkah in his time offered him the riches of the world in order for him to leave his message. As a response to their offer, he recited the verses of the Quran..

- If one were to say that Muhammad :saws: lied and claimed prophethood in order to bring moral and religious reform to a society ridden with ills, this argument is futile in itself, for how can one bring moral reform through a lie. If Muhammad was so keen to uphold and preach upright morals and worship of One God, then could he have lied himself in doing so? If we say that this is not possible, the only answer is that he was speaking the truth.

More info here: http://www.islamreligion.com/article...o-prophethood/


These are just some points to get you thinking. What this shows is that by adopting a logical approach to Islam, you will be left with no other choice than to accept it is the truth. Islam is a religion of clarity and appeals to the human intellect and natural inclination (fitrah). So you need to do your part by researching with an open mind. Nobody is saying you must follow blindly.

Let us know if you have any questions. May Allaah :swt: guide you, Aameen.
Reply

The-Deist
01-10-2016, 08:06 PM
Originally Posted by Umm Abed
Too many to mention. Everything, in general.

You actually have good mannerisms..
Thank you

I honestly want to reduce time online. Especially considering just about everyone of you except one are people I haven't seen live.
Reply

Umm Abed
01-10-2016, 08:09 PM
Originally Posted by StrivingforDeen
Thank you

I honestly want to reduce time online. Especially considering just about everyone of you except one are people I haven't seen live.
Dont worry about spending too much time on here, you'r most welcome to. Who knows, you may stumble upon some friends from here in real life.
Reply

The-Deist
01-10-2016, 08:11 PM
I already know one person in real life from here. There ain't no one else here.

And if there actually was another one. I can just talk to them in person. Not with a keyboard.
Reply

Umm Abed
01-10-2016, 08:14 PM
It is still possible to meet a person you know online, somewhere down life; in any case, just chatting to us here is good too.
Reply

The-Deist
01-10-2016, 08:17 PM
Originally Posted by Umm Abed
It is still possible to meet a person you know online, somewhere down life; in any case, just chatting to us here is good too.
I like to get to know people in real life. There's no one in my area in this forum or the ones I have been on
Reply

Umm Abed
01-10-2016, 08:19 PM
Originally Posted by StrivingforDeen
I like to get to know people in real life. There's no one in my area in this forum or the ones I have been on
I understand, maybe mods can put you through suitable people who can befriend you, would be nice.
Reply

Insaanah
01-10-2016, 08:19 PM
Originally Posted by StrivingforDeen
I really feel like I like the Prophets Moses and Abraham.
In that case, you should know that the prophet mentioned by name the greatest number of times in the Qur'an, is Moses (peace be on him). 136 times to be precise. His various stories, told again and again. The parting of the sea, the magicians, so many stories.

Guess who is the next most mentioned? Abraham (peace be on him), at 69 times by name. He has some amazing stories about him as well.

You say you're not interested in the Qur'an, it doesn't move you, no scripture captures you, yet the book contains exactly what you like. Please don't dismiss it outright, without giving it a chance and without opening your heart and mind.

Originally Posted by StrivingforDeen
The Quran doesn't move me
But can you accept it as a book of guidance and instruction for success in the hereafter? Also see brother Muhammad's post six posts above this, regarding the Qur'an.

Originally Posted by StrivingforDeen
Why don't the other Prophets have "Hadiths". I am more interested in them because everything is about Muhammad. Honestly it gets a little boring. Variety. Variety. Variety. They should have had something like Gospels. Like Book of Jesus, Moses etc. A compilation of their life and disciples or followers. Also we don't know anything about companions of other Prophets or Messangers in great numbers.
The hadeeth are the records of the prophets sunnah; their sayings, actions etc, preserved for the followers. So Jesus (Isa, peace be upon him) had a sunnah that people should follow and so did the previous prophets. Their books have hardly survived, let alone any records of their sunnah, if any were ever preserved.

And when Jesus brought clear proofs, he said, "I have come to you with wisdom and to make clear to you some of that over which you differ, so fear Allah and obey me.(43:63)

Then We sent following their footsteps Our messengers and followed [them] with Jesus, the son of Mary, and gave him the Injeel... (57:27, part)

We know that Allah gave him the injeel, which was Allah's words, so obeying the Prophet meant listening to him explaining Allah's words, and following whatever else he commanded in respect to the deen as inspired by Allah. Christians say that they don't need to obey what Isa (alyhissalaam) himself did because he "fulfilled the covenant" thus saved them from having to follow it.

While the sunnahs of previous prophets have been corrupted and lost (except for what is mentioned of them in the Qur'an and sunnah), the sunnah of our beloved prophet :saws: is preserved down to the minutest detail in the hadeeth, which is only proper if he is the last prophet, sent for the whole of mankind until the end of time, after whom no prophet will come. Therefore, it is vital that details of his life are preserved, and indeed they have been. Otherwise the verse telling us that we have in the Prophets example a beautiful pattern of conduct for us, is meaningless.

Originally Posted by StrivingforDeen
BTW what if someone dies believing in one god, but doesnt testify to Muhammeds Prophethood?
We cannot simply affirm belief in, and testify that Muhammad :saws: was a prophet just like the previous prophets Musa, Isa, Nuh etc, but we have to follow his example, as demonstrated in the sunnah, because he was the teacher Allah sent to teach us His message, for the final time, fully preserved. This is why we have to affirm both parts of the shahadah, and testify that we bear witness that Muhammad :saws: is the slave and messenger of Allah. So we're saying we accept Allah as our Lord and God, and the teacher he sent to convey, explain and teach us His message. Otherwise our relationship with Muhammad :saws: is nothing more than that of the former prophets. It is implying that we have no obligations to follow any of their patterns, for we have none with us. Yet Allah preserved Muhammads :saws: sunnah, precisely so that we should follow it. If we say we believe in and accept One God, but then say we don't accept the teacher He sent to convey his message, it's akin to rejecting God's message and God's teacher, which is a sort of rebellion against God, while saying you believe in and accept God. It just doesn't make sense.

Just some food for thought, which I hope you'll consider with an open mind.

Peace.
Reply

Umm Malik
01-10-2016, 10:08 PM
Originally Posted by StrivingforDeen
People are different. For me music is a great part of my life since childhood. Do you know how to speak Darija?
i meant coran is different
not like music
but when you read it by your heart and for guidance
not just reading ... may allah guide you

why you want to left forum ???

darijah ? ... it mean a arabien dialect ... yes i do
Reply

The-Deist
01-11-2016, 06:04 AM
Originally Posted by maryam muslimah
i meant coran is different
not like music
but when you read it by your heart and for guidance
not just reading ... may allah guide you

why you want to left forum ???

darijah ? ... it mean a arabien dialect ... yes i do
I wanna leave the forum because I feel like I use alot of time on here
Reply

Umm Malik
01-11-2016, 11:10 AM
Originally Posted by StrivingforDeen
I wanna leave the forum because I feel like I use alot of time on here
may allah be with you and put in your way best people and guide you to his path
you can also organize your time .... to get a few minutes if you need ...
Reply

hisnameiszzz
01-11-2016, 12:18 PM
Oh how I wish I did not look at this thread. Have an issue going on with my faith at the moment which is getting the better of me. The more I think about it the more I am thinking like the OP.

Ignore this thread and not think about it!
Reply

The-Deist
01-11-2016, 01:33 PM
Originally Posted by hisnameiszzz
Oh how I wish I did not look at this thread. Have an issue going on with my faith at the moment which is getting the better of me. The more I think about it the more I am thinking like the OP.

Ignore this thread and not think about it!
What are you thinking?
Reply

The-Deist
01-11-2016, 01:34 PM
Originally Posted by maryam muslimah
may allah be with you and put in your way best people and guide you to his path
you can also organize your time .... to get a few minutes if you need ...
I'm gonna leave.
Reply

hisnameiszzz
01-11-2016, 02:00 PM
Originally Posted by StrivingforDeen
What are you thinking?
Where do I start?

Good luck if you leave. Hope peace finds you.
Reply

Insaanah
01-11-2016, 04:06 PM
Originally Posted by StrivingforDeen
I wanna leave the forum because I feel like I use alot of time on here
What if the time you spent here, helped you a little? You just need to get some discipline in how much time you spend here, rather than leaving altogether. Allow yourself a certain amount of time a day, even if its half an hour, and stick to it. Once your time's up, then log out. I think every single one of us has learnt something from here that's benefitted us, even in unexpected ways, and we've got some support etc.

May I ask if these two posts helped at all, even if a little, and do you have any follow up questions or comments from them?

http://www.islamicboard.com/general/...ml#post2869288
http://www.islamicboard.com/general/...ml#post2869299

Peace.
Reply

The-Deist
01-11-2016, 04:48 PM
Originally Posted by Insaanah
What if the time you spent here, helped you a little? You just need to get some discipline in how much time you spend here, rather than leaving altogether. Allow yourself a certain amount of time a day, even if its half an hour, and stick to it. Once your time's up, then log out. I think every single one of us has learnt something from here that's benefitted us, even in unexpected ways, and we've got some support etc.

May I ask if these two posts helped at all, even if a little, and do you have any follow up questions or comments from them?

http://www.islamicboard.com/general/...ml#post2869288
http://www.islamicboard.com/general/...ml#post2869299

Peace.
I don't stay here for other reasons too
Reply

greenhill
01-11-2016, 06:13 PM
Originally Posted by StrivingforDeen
What makes you believe in Muhammed?
A good enough thread starter topic.

If I were to read again his life story, what stands out is his character.

From his dua, his practice, what is said in the Quran about him, that he is sent as a mercy to mankind, I can find no flaws in the inter related 'equation' but only finding it compliments each other. And when I read about him, I can feel for him, and I can totally 'get it' why he did what he did. Almost a perfection of being in a surrendered (to Allah) state. Hence, I can become... if I can feel it, I can become it, there is an inner peace that comes with that.

But of course, developing that over a wide range of daily challenges may be testing.

While nabi (saw) anchored his life in Allah's Hands, we anchor it to our job, bank account etc.

Long way to go..

:peace:
Reply

Muhaba
01-13-2016, 08:59 PM
Originally Posted by Insaanah
In that case, you should know that the prophet mentioned by name the greatest number of times in the Qur'an, is Moses (peace be on him). 136 times to be precise. His various stories, told again and again. The parting of the sea, the magicians, so many stories.

Guess who is the next most mentioned? Abraham (peace be on him), at 69 times by name. He has some amazing stories about him as well.

You say you're not interested in the Qur'an, it doesn't move you, no scripture captures you, yet the book contains exactly what you like. Please don't dismiss it outright, without giving it a chance and without opening your heart and mind.



But can you accept it as a book of guidance and instruction for success in the hereafter? Also see brother Muhammad's post six posts above this, regarding the Qur'an.



The hadeeth are the records of the prophets sunnah; their sayings, actions etc, preserved for the followers. So Jesus (Isa, peace be upon him) had a sunnah that people should follow and so did the previous prophets. Their books have hardly survived, let alone any records of their sunnah, if any were ever preserved.

And when Jesus brought clear proofs, he said, "I have come to you with wisdom and to make clear to you some of that over which you differ, so fear Allah and obey me.(43:63)

Then We sent following their footsteps Our messengers and followed [them] with Jesus, the son of Mary, and gave him the Injeel... (57:27, part)

We know that Allah gave him the injeel, which was Allah's words, so obeying the Prophet meant listening to him explaining Allah's words, and following whatever else he commanded in respect to the deen as inspired by Allah. Christians say that they don't need to obey what Isa (alyhissalaam) himself did because he "fulfilled the covenant" thus saved them from having to follow it.

While the sunnahs of previous prophets have been corrupted and lost (except for what is mentioned of them in the Qur'an and sunnah), the sunnah of our beloved prophet :saws: is preserved down to the minutest detail in the hadeeth, which is only proper if he is the last prophet, sent for the whole of mankind until the end of time, after whom no prophet will come. Therefore, it is vital that details of his life are preserved, and indeed they have been. Otherwise the verse telling us that we have in the Prophets example a beautiful pattern of conduct for us, is meaningless.



We cannot simply affirm belief in, and testify that Muhammad :saws: was a prophet just like the previous prophets Musa, Isa, Nuh etc, but we have to follow his example, as demonstrated in the sunnah, because he was the teacher Allah sent to teach us His message, for the final time, fully preserved. This is why we have to affirm both parts of the shahadah, and testify that we bear witness that Muhammad :saws: is the slave and messenger of Allah. So we're saying we accept Allah as our Lord and God, and the teacher he sent to convey, explain and teach us His message. Otherwise our relationship with Muhammad :saws: is nothing more than that of the former prophets. It is implying that we have no obligations to follow any of their patterns, for we have none with us. Yet Allah preserved Muhammads :saws: sunnah, precisely so that we should follow it. If we say we believe in and accept One God, but then say we don't accept the teacher He sent to convey his message, it's akin to rejecting God's message and God's teacher, which is a sort of rebellion against God, while saying you believe in and accept God. It just doesn't make sense.

Just some food for thought, which I hope you'll consider with an open mind.

Peace.
The stories of the previous Prophets alaihim asalaam are in the Quran and they are very interesting to read. Why look for another source when they are right there in the Quran?
Reply

Muhaba
01-13-2016, 09:04 PM
Originally Posted by hisnameiszzz
Oh how I wish I did not look at this thread. Have an issue going on with my faith at the moment which is getting the better of me. The more I think about it the more I am thinking like the OP.

Ignore this thread and not think about it!
Many issues arise from lack of knowledge or misguidance. The rest is intentional straying. If you're having doubts, you need to get proper knowledge from reliable mainstream Islamic sources (books, scholars, websites ). And ask Allah for guidance because the one whom Allah misguides cannot get guidance from anywhere else.
Reply

The-Deist
01-13-2016, 09:05 PM
Originally Posted by Muhaba
The stories of the previous Prophets alaihim asalaam are in the Quran and they are very interesting to read. Why look for another source when they are right there in the Quran?
Where did I say I am looking for another source? I am just wondering why the other prophets and messangers don't have invidicual books.
Reply

Linkdeutscher
01-13-2016, 09:10 PM
Originally Posted by StrivingforDeen
Where did I say I am looking for another source? I am just wondering why the other prophets and messangers don't have invidicual books.
How is that relevant?
Reply

Muhaba
01-13-2016, 09:13 PM
Originally Posted by StrivingforDeen
Where did I say I am looking for another source? I am just wondering why the other prophets and messangers don't have invidicual books.
You said the Quran doesn't affect you. If you're looking for stories of the Prophets, there is no better place to find them than the Quran - no other source that gives a more accurate and most beautiful versions of their stories than the Islamic sources.
Reply

hisnameiszzz
01-13-2016, 09:17 PM
Originally Posted by Muhaba
Many issues arise from lack of knowledge or misguidance. The rest is intentional straying. If you're having doubts, you need to get proper knowledge from reliable mainstream Islamic sources (books, scholars, websites ). And ask Allah for guidance because the one whom Allah misguides cannot get guidance from anywhere else.
I have looked at books and websites and the fabaroonie people of IB have helped me out tremendously also.

I have tried to get in touch with Aalims, but they go incommunicado if I have contacted them via email or phone and in person they just say they don't have time.

It's not like I haven't tried because I have, and for so long.

I understand I am very weak and I am crazy and stupid and sinful, but I have asked for help so many times and it feels like no one seems interested.

Sorry OP. I have taken over your thread again.
Reply

Muhaba
01-13-2016, 09:38 PM
Originally Posted by hisnameiszzz
I have looked at books and websites and the fabaroonie people of IB have helped me out tremendously also.

I have tried to get in touch with Aalims, but they go incommunicado if I have contacted them via email or phone and in person they just say they don't have time.

It's not like I haven't tried because I have, and for so long.

I understand I am very weak and I am crazy and stupid and sinful, but I have asked for help so many times and it feels like no one seems interested.

Sorry OP. I have taken over your thread again.
Well, if you have specific questions, you can ask and I'm sure someone will provide an answer or a link to a scholar's response . There's lots of information available online, for example on youtube. There are scholars' youtube channels you can listen to and find lectures on topics related to your questions, such as MuftiMenk.
Reply

popsthebuilder
01-14-2016, 12:20 AM
Originally Posted by hisnameiszzz
I have looked at books and websites and the fabaroonie people of IB have helped me out tremendously also.

I have tried to get in touch with Aalims, but they go incommunicado if I have contacted them via email or phone and in person they just say they don't have time.

It's not like I haven't tried because I have, and for so long.

I understand I am very weak and I am crazy and stupid and sinful, but I have asked for help so many times and it feels like no one seems interested.

Sorry OP. I have taken over your thread again.
It is a shame that people do not show interest. Have patience and perseverance in all you know. My advice is also stick to core scriptures.

Peace
Reply

Zafran
01-14-2016, 01:17 AM
Originally Posted by hisnameiszzz
I have looked at books and websites and the fabaroonie people of IB have helped me out tremendously also.

I have tried to get in touch with Aalims, but they go incommunicado if I have contacted them via email or phone and in person they just say they don't have time.

It's not like I haven't tried because I have, and for so long.

I understand I am very weak and I am crazy and stupid and sinful, but I have asked for help so many times and it feels like no one seems interested.

Sorry OP. I have taken over your thread again.
salaam

we all have times of weakness - insh Allah Time will bring us closer to God. Juts keep praying and defend your salah.

peace
Reply

The-Deist
01-14-2016, 04:28 AM
Originally Posted by Muhaba
You said the Quran doesn't affect you. If you're looking for stories of the Prophets, there is no better place to find them than the Quran - no other source that gives a more accurate and most beautiful versions of their stories than the Islamic sources.
I was talking about the Quran on a emotional level.
Reply

eesa the kiwi
01-14-2016, 05:52 AM
Originally Posted by StrivingforDeen
I was talking about the Quran on a emotional level.
then it shows something is wrong with your heart, a spiritual sickness if you like
are you still a muslim because if so there are things the ulema have recomended for softening a hard heart
if not then there isnt much i can do for you except give naseeha and pray for you
Reply

The-Deist
01-14-2016, 02:28 PM
Originally Posted by eesa the kiwi
then it shows something is wrong with your heart, a spiritual sickness if you like
are you still a muslim because if so there are things the ulema have recomended for softening a hard heart
if not then there isnt much i can do for you except give naseeha and pray for you
From the Muslim perspective yes. I am not a Muslim as the title and the entire thread clearly state that.
Reply

eesa the kiwi
01-14-2016, 07:37 PM
Originally Posted by StrivingforDeen
From the Muslim perspective yes. I am not a Muslim as the title and the entire thread clearly state that.
so what were your main reasons for leaving islam
the reason i ask is usually ex muslims cite things about islam that are completely unislamic and not part of the deen (ie honor killings etc) or complete misunderstandings as the reasons why they left the deen
i havent read through the whole thread so i dont know if you have already answered this so bear with me
Reply

The-Deist
01-14-2016, 07:42 PM
Originally Posted by eesa the kiwi
so what were your main reasons for leaving islam
the reason i ask is usually ex muslims cite things about islam that are completely unislamic and not part of the deen (ie honor killings etc) or complete misunderstandings as the reasons why they left the deen
i havent read through the whole thread so i dont know if you have already answered this so bear with me
Lets say simply I left it to search for other religions. By that I mean I am not going to let my mind limit to just the religion I was born. If everyone did that you wouldn't be a Muslim.
Reply

Muhammad
01-14-2016, 08:09 PM
By that I mean I am not going to let my mind limit to just the religion I was born. If everyone did that you wouldn't be a Muslim.
This is an incorrect assumption. If you speak to Muslims, you'll find there are an overwhelming number of reasons to remain a Muslim. And why do you think so many people convert to Islam from other religions?

http://www.islamicboard.com/general/...ts-muslim.html

http://www.islamicboard.com/discover...-yourself.html

http://www.islamicboard.com/new-musl...erts-post.html
Reply

sister herb
01-14-2016, 08:41 PM
Originally Posted by StrivingforDeen
By that I mean I am not going to let my mind limit to just the religion I was born. If everyone did that you wouldn't be a Muslim.
Every of us haven´t been so lucky like to born to Muslim family like you. As you have got something so valuable when born to kind of situation, you haven´t learnt to see its value.

Of course, it might be easier to understand the value of it, when you have to struggle to achieve it - becoming a Muslim.
Reply

eesa the kiwi
01-14-2016, 09:32 PM
Originally Posted by StrivingforDeen
Lets say simply I left it to search for other religions. By that I mean I am not going to let my mind limit to just the religion I was born. If everyone did that you wouldn't be a Muslim.
do you know how much hardships and trials i had to go through to find islam yet here you are born with this precious gift and you throw it away like its rubbish

yeah i left christianity because there was so many holes and flaws in the story i no longer could stick my head in the sand and pretend they didnt exist. i had enough integrity to stand up and say hey something isnt right here rather brushing it under the rug like the rest of my family. do you know my one regret about embracing islam? it is that i didnt do it sooner.
i want to leave you with a verse

(11) And whoever turns away from My remembrance - indeed, he will have a depressed life, and We will gather him on the Day of Resurrection blind." (Taa-Haa: 124)

so when your life becomes hard and depressing (and it will) know that this is a sign given to you by Allah to turn back and repent to him before its too late
Reply

The-Deist
01-15-2016, 01:14 AM
Originally Posted by eesa the kiwi
do you know how much hardships and trials i had to go through to find islam yet here you are born with this precious gift and you throw it away like its rubbish

yeah i left christianity because there was so many holes and flaws in the story i no longer could stick my head in the sand and pretend they didnt exist. i had enough integrity to stand up and say hey something isnt right here rather brushing it under the rug like the rest of my family. do you know my one regret about embracing islam? it is that i didnt do it sooner.
i want to leave you with a verse

(11) And whoever turns away from My remembrance - indeed, he will have a depressed life, and We will gather him on the Day of Resurrection blind." (Taa-Haa: 124)

so when your life becomes hard and depressing (and it will) know that this is a sign given to you by Allah to turn back and repent to him before its too late
Well, I had my reasons. Read the whole thread so you understand for God's sake.
Reply

The-Deist
01-15-2016, 01:27 AM
Tell me, without reading the whole thread. What do you think I believe in?
Reply

eesa the kiwi
01-15-2016, 02:19 AM
Originally Posted by StrivingforDeen
Tell me, without reading the whole thread. What do you think I believe in?
tbh i dont really care what you believe and im not going to read a nine page thread to "understand"
what you believe in now is irrelevant. whether your buddhist christian jewish hindu atheist a jedi or believe in a flying spaghetti monster it will all wind up with you going to one place on the day of judgement. hellfire khalidina feeha
that is of course unless you repent and return to islam
i cbb with this conversation any longer but i just want you to know bro as long as your soul hasnt left your throat or the sun hasnt risen from the west it isnt too late for you to repent

come back to Allah bro make taubah.
dont be yet another casualty of the shaitaan

“Verily, Allah is more delighted with the repentance of His slave than a person who lost his camel in a desert land and then finds it (unexpectedly)”.[Bukhari and Muslim].In another version of Muslim, he said:“Verily, Allah is more pleased with the repentance of His slave than a person who has his camel in a waterless desert carrying his provision of food and drink and it is lost. He, having lost all hopes (to get that back), lies down in shade and is disappointed about his camel; when all of a sudden he finds that camel standing before him. He takes hold of its reins and then out of boundless joy blurts out: 'O Allah, You are my slave and I am Your Rubb'.He commits this mistake out of extreme joy.”
Reply

MuslimInshallah
01-15-2016, 02:32 AM
Assalaamu alaikum,


(mildly) You know, the word Muslim means someone who actively tries to surrender to God's Will. (smile) And this implies that we must seek God and try to understand His Will. (smile) And as we get closer to this harmony with His Will, we feel calm and peaceful inside.

(smile) I actually applaud your efforts, Striving. (smile) Because I do not believe that Muslim is a label you inherit from your ancestors. Islam is not genetically acquired. It is a relationship you choose with the Divine. We talk about born-Muslims and reverts and suchlike. But I do not believe in these. Because we are all born in a state of Islam (in harmony with God's Will). And when we become adults we must all make choices about our relationship with God. (smile) And our whole lives, we make choices.

(smile) Islam is not a static, passive state. It is a continual active struggle.

(meditatively) Personally, I do not like the walls we put between one another. We say this person is Muslim and that person is a kaafir (a person who actively covers their heart to deny and block out God). But who are we to make such pronouncements?! Who amongst us knows the true state of a person's relationship with God? I have read a hadith about some of the first people into the Fire... and they are a scholar who pretended to be studying Islam for the Sake of God and a martyr who pretended to die for God's sake. These are people who labelled themselves as Muslims... but they were not.

No scholar of any note that I am aware of has presumed to say whether those who label themselves as Christian or Jewish are surely going into the Fire. I would suspect that this should be extended to other groups, too. Because within each label-group, you can find people who genuinely appear to be striving to please God to the best of their knowledge and ability. And I say to myself: perhaps they have a better connection and effort than myself? Because I really don't know. Only God Knows.

(smile) So, Striving, if you feel that you need to look around and understand your relationship with God in a more profound way... well, this is your journey. And it sounds rather promising to me, actually.

(smile) I have read (and I continue to read) texts from many label-groups. And I talk with many different people. (smile) And the more I learn, the more I feel closer to God. (smile) Because, you see, God Sent His Messengers and Prophets all through time to all peoples. Which is why you can find echoes of His Will in all cultures. (smile) And this, to me, is a very spiritually invigorating and beautiful thing.

So go for it, Striving... look around. Let go of your sure assumptions and dig into the matter: What is God's Will? How can I know it? What should I do? How can I best accomplish it?

(smile) And I pray you may find what you are looking for.


May God, the Wise, the Compassionate, Guide and Protect all those who sincerely seek Him.
Reply

popsthebuilder
01-15-2016, 02:56 AM
Originally Posted by MuslimInshallah
Assalaamu alaikum,


(mildly) You know, the word Muslim means someone who actively tries to surrender to God's Will. (smile) And this implies that we must seek God and try to understand His Will. (smile) And as we get closer to this harmony with His Will, we feel calm and peaceful inside.

(smile) I actually applaud your efforts, Striving. (smile) Because I do not believe that Muslim is a label you inherit from your ancestors. Islam is not genetically acquired. It is a relationship you choose with the Divine. We talk about born-Muslims and reverts and suchlike. But I do not believe in these. Because we are all born in a state of Islam (in harmony with God's Will). And when we become adults we must all make choices about our relationship with God. (smile) And our whole lives, we make choices.

(smile) Islam is not a static, passive state. It is a continual active struggle.

(meditatively) Personally, I do not like the walls we put between one another. We say this person is Muslim and that person is a kaafir (a person who actively covers their heart to deny and block out God). But who are we to make such pronouncements?! Who amongst us knows the true state of a person's relationship with God? I have read a hadith about some of the first people into the Fire... and they are a scholar who pretended to be studying Islam for the Sake of God and a martyr who pretended to die for God's sake. These are people who labelled themselves as Muslims... but they were not.

No scholar of any note that I am aware of has presumed to say whether those who label themselves as Christian or Jewish are surely going into the Fire. I would suspect that this should be extended to other groups, too. Because within each label-group, you can find people who genuinely appear to be striving to please God to the best of their knowledge and ability. And I say to myself: perhaps they have a better connection and effort than myself? Because I really don't know. Only God Knows.

(smile) So, Striving, if you feel that you need to look around and understand your relationship with God in a more profound way... well, this is your journey. And it sounds rather promising to me, actually.

(smile) I have read (and I continue to read) texts from many label-groups. And I talk with many different people. (smile) And the more I learn, the more I feel closer to God. (smile) Because, you see, God Sent His Messengers and Prophets all through time to all peoples. Which is why you can find echoes of His Will in all cultures. (smile) And this, to me, is a very spiritually invigorating and beautiful thing.

So go for it, Striving... look around. Let go of your sure assumptions and dig into the matter: What is God's Will? How can I know it? What should I do? How can I best accomplish it?

(smile) And I pray you may find what you are looking for.


May God, the Wise, the Compassionate, Guide and Protect all those who sincerely seek Him.
That was beautiful.
Reply

The-Deist
01-15-2016, 04:00 AM
Originally Posted by eesa the kiwi
tbh i dont really care what you believe and im not going to read a nine page thread to "understand"
what you believe in now is irrelevant. whether your buddhist christian jewish hindu atheist a jedi or believe in a flying spaghetti monster it will all wind up with you going to one place on the day of judgement. hellfire khalidina feeha
that is of course unless you repent and return to islam
i cbb with this conversation any longer but i just want you to know bro as long as your soul hasnt left your throat or the sun hasnt risen from the west it isnt too late for you to repent

come back to Allah bro make taubah.
dont be yet another casualty of the shaitaan

“Verily, Allah is more delighted with the repentance of His slave than a person who lost his camel in a desert land and then finds it (unexpectedly)”.[Bukhari and Muslim].In another version of Muslim, he said:“Verily, Allah is more pleased with the repentance of His slave than a person who has his camel in a waterless desert carrying his provision of food and drink and it is lost. He, having lost all hopes (to get that back), lies down in shade and is disappointed about his camel; when all of a sudden he finds that camel standing before him. He takes hold of its reins and then out of boundless joy blurts out: 'O Allah, You are my slave and I am Your Rubb'.He commits this mistake out of extreme joy.”
I am a believer in one God, but I don't label myself as a Muslim.
Reply

The-Deist
01-15-2016, 04:09 AM
Originally Posted by MuslimInshallah
Assalaamu alaikum,


(mildly) You know, the word Muslim means someone who actively tries to surrender to God's Will. (smile) And this implies that we must seek God and try to understand His Will. (smile) And as we get closer to this harmony with His Will, we feel calm and peaceful inside.

(smile) I actually applaud your efforts, Striving. (smile) Because I do not believe that Muslim is a label you inherit from your ancestors. Islam is not genetically acquired. It is a relationship you choose with the Divine. We talk about born-Muslims and reverts and suchlike. But I do not believe in these. Because we are all born in a state of Islam (in harmony with God's Will). And when we become adults we must all make choices about our relationship with God. (smile) And our whole lives, we make choices.

(smile) Islam is not a static, passive state. It is a continual active struggle.

(meditatively) Personally, I do not like the walls we put between one another. We say this person is Muslim and that person is a kaafir (a person who actively covers their heart to deny and block out God). But who are we to make such pronouncements?! Who amongst us knows the true state of a person's relationship with God? I have read a hadith about some of the first people into the Fire... and they are a scholar who pretended to be studying Islam for the Sake of God and a martyr who pretended to die for God's sake. These are people who labelled themselves as Muslims... but they were not.

No scholar of any note that I am aware of has presumed to say whether those who label themselves as Christian or Jewish are surely going into the Fire. I would suspect that this should be extended to other groups, too. Because within each label-group, you can find people who genuinely appear to be striving to please God to the best of their knowledge and ability. And I say to myself: perhaps they have a better connection and effort than myself? Because I really don't know. Only God Knows.

(smile) So, Striving, if you feel that you need to look around and understand your relationship with God in a more profound way... well, this is your journey. And it sounds rather promising to me, actually.

(smile) I have read (and I continue to read) texts from many label-groups. And I talk with many different people. (smile) And the more I learn, the more I feel closer to God. (smile) Because, you see, God Sent His Messengers and Prophets all through time to all peoples. Which is why you can find echoes of His Will in all cultures. (smile) And this, to me, is a very spiritually invigorating and beautiful thing.

So go for it, Striving... look around. Let go of your sure assumptions and dig into the matter: What is God's Will? How can I know it? What should I do? How can I best accomplish it?

(smile) And I pray you may find what you are looking for.


May God, the Wise, the Compassionate, Guide and Protect all those who sincerely seek Him.
That is just beautiful advice.
Reply

Insaanah
01-15-2016, 12:28 PM
We have a genuine concern to see you on the straight path (yes, there is only one), and strive to save you from paths that might lead to the hell fire, just like I mentioned in an earlier post. If you had to go to school and knew there was a raging fire along the way, your parents would say to you, the authorities would say to you, please avoid x route, take y route. If you take x route, you are likely to be harmed.

Similarly, when parents bring up their children, and strive to instil in them morals and manners so they can grow up to be good and decent human beings, do they let the toddler or child investigate bad manners and try them out and come to it's own conclusion as to which is best? No.

I understand that when people are struggling to find God, that many people will and have investigated other religions before coming to Islam. Islam does not tell us to accept it on blind faith, but to think, ponder, consider, reflect. For some, that may include looking at other faiths to see which is true. Know, though, that there is only one truth. There is no pick 'n mix approach that can be taken, eg lets take the best bits from every faith and remain on that and God knows my intentions to see His will so it should be ok.

Allah clearly states in the Qur'an, that whoever brings a religion other than Islam, it will never be accepted of him, and in the hereafter, he will be of the losers. Yet, despite urging people that Islam is the truth and the only way, you've been given freedom to make your own choice. Sure, a person may say, I follow Islam because I am surrendering to the will of God best I can. But what are the definitions of Muslim, in Quran and hadeeth? Well, to become a Muslim, a person cannot declare that there is only one God. That does not make you a Muslim. To enter into the state of being and the way of life known as Islam, you have to believe and declare, that Muhammad :saws:, is the messenger and slave of Allah. Many will be familiar with the famous hadeeth of Jibreel, which was designed to teach Muslims their religion. The Prophet :saws: said in it, that Islam is that you worship Allah and do not associate anything with Him and you establish obligatory prayer and you pay the obligatory poor-rate (Zakat) and you observe the fast of Ramadan. "

Part of a longer hadeeth
Sahih al-Bukhari 50
Sahih Muslim 8e

Belief in the Prophet being automatically assumed as he :saws: is the one telling you all this. So here, it is not only both parts of the shahaadah, but also performing certain actions that demonstrate to God your faith.

Originally Posted by MuslimInshallah
No scholar of any note that I am aware of has presumed to say whether those who label themselves as Christian or Jewish are surely going into the Fire. I would suspect that this should be extended to other groups, too. Because within each label-group, you can find people who genuinely appear to be striving to please God to the best of their knowledge and ability. And I say to myself: perhaps they have a better connection and effort than myself? Because I really don't know. Only God Knows.
Allah has also made certain things Crystal clear in the Qur'an. There is no confusion as to the only acceptable way now. Why should we go for the bare minimum (or that may even fall short of that), and what is dubious, likely dangerous, leaving the straight way that has been laid out clear? Otherwise, our praying many times a day guide us to the straight path, is pointless, if any path might be straight. It doesn't say guide us the straight paths, but the straight path. Just one. If we think that those who say Jesus :as: is God could have a better connection with God, which is what the above implies, then we should know that the connection is not the basis or the foundation on which everything else is built - it is the core belief, the faith, the aqeedah that matters. Everything else is built on that. Many devout polytheists have a strong connection to the supreme God, and the intermediaries and other Gods they associate with Him, but what does Allah say about them in the Qur'an?

Furthermore, regarding the straight path, the path of those whom Allah favored, the path we pray for at least 17 times a day, it is the path of the following:

Those were the ones upon whom Allah bestowed favour from among the prophets of the descendants of Adam and of those We carried [in the ship] with Noah, and of the descendants of Abraham and Israel, and of those whom We guided and chose. When the verses of the Most Merciful were recited to them, they fell in prostration and weeping. (19:58)

The path of Abraham (peace be upon him):

[He was] grateful for His favors. Allah chose him and guided him to a straight path. (16:121)

The path of Moses and Aaron (peace be upon them):

And We guided them both on the straight path. (37:118)

The path Jesus (peace be upon him) called to:

"Indeed, Allah is my Lord and your Lord, so worship Him. That is the straight path." (3:51 , 19:36 and 43:64)

and the guidance given to, and path of, the following:

And We gave to Abraham, Isaac and Jacob - all [of them] We guided. And Noah, We guided before; and among his descendants, David and Solomon and Job and Joseph and Moses and Aaron. Thus do We reward the doers of good.
And Zachariah and John and Jesus and Elias - and all were of the righteous.
And Ishmael and Elisha and Jonah and Lot - and all [of them] We preferred over the worlds.
And [some] among their fathers and their descendants and their brothers - and We chose them and We guided them to a straight path.
That is the guidance of Allah by which He guides whomever He wills of His servants. But if they had associated others with Allah , then worthless for them would be whatever they were doing
Those are the ones to whom We gave the Scripture and authority and prophethood. But if the disbelievers deny it, then We have entrusted it to a people who are not therein disbelievers.
Those are the ones whom Allah has guided, so from their guidance take an example. Say, "I ask of you for this message no payment. It is not but a reminder for the worlds."(6:84-90)

The last word in the passage is significant, that it is a reminder for all the worlds, from, if we look at Surah al-Faatihah, the Lord of all the worlds.

The path we are seeking, is not just a path specific to Muhammad :saws:, because that was not a different path from the others. The path has always been the same, but the other prophets teachings got distorted/corrupted/forgotten. Islam is the culmination of the same Ultimate Universal Truth that all the Prophets, peace be upon them, preached; the same message they all brought, from the same God. Islam is not a new or different religion, but what has always been since the time of Adam (peace be upon him), the only one unchanged, thus the only straight path.

We seek to join all the Prophets mentioned, and their righteous ancestors, descendants and brethren in the guidance given to them. This large company of believers, whom we seek to join in Surah al-Faatihah, is reinforced at the end of the salaat: "Peace be to us and the righteous servants of Allah".

Strivingfordeen, you mention the previous prophets a lot, so please ponder on what you've just read.

We make this dua or request to Allah, referring to ourselves in the plural, even for a Muslim reciting it on his own, showing that he sees himself as part of a brotherhood of believers, and his dua is not just for him, but for all who seek such a way, namely, the straight path.

Originally Posted by MuslimInshallah
smile) So, Striving, if you feel that you need to look around and understand your relationship with God in a more profound way... well, this is your journey. And it sounds rather promising to me, actually.
We hope and pray that he consciously sees Islam as the truth and comes back to the right path.

Originally Posted by MuslimInshallah
smile) I have read (and I continue to read) texts from many label-groups. And I talk with many different people. (smile) And the more I learn, the more I feel closer to God. (smile) Because, you see, God Sent His Messengers and Prophets all through time to all peoples. Which is why you can find echoes of His Will in all cultures. (smile) And this, to me, is a very spiritually invigorating and beautiful thing.
This maybe, but echos are echos. Let us now follow what is loud and clear, here and now. At the time of each respective previous Prophet, there was only one right way, which the prophet of the time taught. Allah tells us:

And when Jesus :as: brought clear proofs, he said, "I have come to you with wisdom and to make clear to you some of that over which you differ, so fear Allah and obey me.(43:63)

He called to that straight path that we pray to be steadfast on:

The Messiah has said, "O Children of Israel, worship Allah , my Lord and your Lord." (5:72, part)

Allah had to be worshipped alone, and Isa alayhissalaam had to be obeyed.

What did Nuh :as: say to his people:

'Worship Allah , fear Him and obey me." (71:3)

You say you are interested in the previous prophets. They all preached the same message. believe in and worship Allah alone without any associate in His Divinity, and obey the Prophet. To follow the previous prophets, you've got to obey the last one, because his preserved message is a confirmation, continuation and culmination, of the previous original scriptures.

Doesn't sound too hard, does it?

Originally Posted by MuslimInshallah
So go for it, Striving... look around. Let go of your sure assumptions and dig into the matter: What is God's Will? How can I know it? What should I do? How can I best accomplish it?
And where is that found? In the Qur'an. The sunnah. In Islam.

Originally Posted by MuslimInshallah
smile) And I pray you may find what you are looking for.
That depends on what someone is looking for, as what they are looking for might inadvertently not actually be the best thing for them. Let us pray he finds and comes back into the fold of Islam, back onto the straight path, ameen.
Reply

The-Deist
01-15-2016, 01:18 PM
Originally Posted by Insaanah
We have a genuine concern to see you on the straight path (yes, there is only one), and strive to save you from paths that might lead to the hell fire, just like I mentioned in an earlier post. If you had to go to school and knew there was a raging fire along the way, your parents would say to you, the authorities would say to you, please avoid x route, take y route. If you take x route, you are likely to be harmed.

Similarly, when parents bring up their children, and strive to instil in them morals and manners so they can grow up to be good and decent human beings, do they let the toddler or child investigate bad manners and try them out and come to it's own conclusion as to which is best? No.

I understand that when people are struggling to find God, that many people will and have investigated other religions before coming to Islam. Islam does not tell us to accept it on blind faith, but to think, ponder, consider, reflect. For some, that may include looking at other faiths to see which is true. Know, though, that there is only one truth. There is no pick 'n mix approach that can be taken, eg lets take the best bits from every faith and remain on that and God knows my intentions to see His will so it should be ok.

Allah clearly states in the Qur'an, that whoever brings a religion other than Islam, it will never be accepted of him, and in the hereafter, he will be of the losers. Yet, despite urging people that Islam is the truth and the only way, you've been given freedom to make your own choice. Sure, a person may say, I follow Islam because I am surrendering to the will of God best I can. But what are the definitions of Muslim, in Quran and hadeeth? Well, to become a Muslim, a person cannot declare that there is only one God. That does not make you a Muslim. To enter into the state of being and the way of life known as Islam, you have to believe and declare, that Muhammad :saws:, is the messenger and slave of Allah. Many will be familiar with the famous hadeeth of Jibreel, which was designed to teach Muslims their religion. The Prophet :saws: said in it, that Islam is that you worship Allah and do not associate anything with Him and you establish obligatory prayer and you pay the obligatory poor-rate (Zakat) and you observe the fast of Ramadan. "

Part of a longer hadeeth
Sahih al-Bukhari 50
Sahih Muslim 8e

Belief in the Prophet being automatically assumed as he :saws: is the one telling you all this. So here, it is not only both parts of the shahaadah, but also performing certain actions that demonstrate to God your faith.



Allah has also made certain things Crystal clear in the Qur'an. There is no confusion as to the only acceptable way now. Why should we go for the bare minimum (or that may even fall short of that), and what is dubious, likely dangerous, leaving the straight way that has been laid out clear? Otherwise, our praying many times a day guide us to the straight path, is pointless, if any path might be straight. It doesn't say guide us the straight paths, but the straight path. Just one. If we think that those who say Jesus :as: is God could have a better connection with God, which is what the above implies, then we should know that the connection is not the basis or the foundation on which everything else is built - it is the core belief, the faith, the aqeedah that matters. Everything else is built on that. Many devout polytheists have a strong connection to the supreme God, and the intermediaries and other Gods they associate with Him, but what does Allah say about them in the Qur'an?

Furthermore, regarding the straight path, the path of those whom Allah favored, the path we pray for at least 17 times a day, it is the path of the following:

Those were the ones upon whom Allah bestowed favour from among the prophets of the descendants of Adam and of those We carried [in the ship] with Noah, and of the descendants of Abraham and Israel, and of those whom We guided and chose. When the verses of the Most Merciful were recited to them, they fell in prostration and weeping. (19:58)

The path of Abraham (peace be upon him):

[He was] grateful for His favors. Allah chose him and guided him to a straight path. (16:121)

The path of Moses and Aaron (peace be upon them):

And We guided them both on the straight path. (37:118)

The path Jesus (peace be upon him) called to:

"Indeed, Allah is my Lord and your Lord, so worship Him. That is the straight path." (3:51 , 19:36 and 43:64)

and the guidance given to, and path of, the following:

And We gave to Abraham, Isaac and Jacob - all [of them] We guided. And Noah, We guided before; and among his descendants, David and Solomon and Job and Joseph and Moses and Aaron. Thus do We reward the doers of good.
And Zachariah and John and Jesus and Elias - and all were of the righteous.
And Ishmael and Elisha and Jonah and Lot - and all [of them] We preferred over the worlds.
And [some] among their fathers and their descendants and their brothers - and We chose them and We guided them to a straight path.
That is the guidance of Allah by which He guides whomever He wills of His servants. But if they had associated others with Allah , then worthless for them would be whatever they were doing
Those are the ones to whom We gave the Scripture and authority and prophethood. But if the disbelievers deny it, then We have entrusted it to a people who are not therein disbelievers.
Those are the ones whom Allah has guided, so from their guidance take an example. Say, "I ask of you for this message no payment. It is not but a reminder for the worlds."(6:84-90)

The last word in the passage is significant, that it is a reminder for all the worlds, from, if we look at Surah al-Faatihah, the Lord of all the worlds.

The path we are seeking, is not just a path specific to Muhammad :saws:, because that was not a different path from the others. The path has always been the same, but the other prophets teachings got distorted/corrupted/forgotten. Islam is the culmination of the same Ultimate Universal Truth that all the Prophets, peace be upon them, preached; the same message they all brought, from the same God. Islam is not a new or different religion, but what has always been since the time of Adam (peace be upon him), the only one unchanged, thus the only straight path.

We seek to join all the Prophets mentioned, and their righteous ancestors, descendants and brethren in the guidance given to them. This large company of believers, whom we seek to join in Surah al-Faatihah, is reinforced at the end of the salaat: "Peace be to us and the righteous servants of Allah".

Strivingfordeen, you mention the previous prophets a lot, so please ponder on what you've just read.

We make this dua or request to Allah, referring to ourselves in the plural, even for a Muslim reciting it on his own, showing that he sees himself as part of a brotherhood of believers, and his dua is not just for him, but for all who seek such a way, namely, the straight path.



We hope and pray that he consciously sees Islam as the truth and comes back to the right path.



This maybe, but echos are echos. Let us now follow what is loud and clear, here and now. At the time of each respective previous Prophet, there was only one right way, which the prophet of the time taught. Allah tells us:

And when Jesus :as: brought clear proofs, he said, "I have come to you with wisdom and to make clear to you some of that over which you differ, so fear Allah and obey me.(43:63)

He called to that straight path that we pray to be steadfast on:

The Messiah has said, "O Children of Israel, worship Allah , my Lord and your Lord." (5:72, part)

Allah had to be worshipped alone, and Isa alayhissalaam had to be obeyed.

What did Nuh :as: say to his people:

'Worship Allah , fear Him and obey me." (71:3)

You say you are interested in the previous prophets. They all preached the same message. believe in and worship Allah alone without any associate in His Divinity, and obey the Prophet. To follow the previous prophets, you've got to obey the last one, because his preserved message is a confirmation, continuation and culmination, of the previous original scriptures.

Doesn't sound too hard, does it?



And where is that found? In the Qur'an. The sunnah. In Islam.



That depends on what someone is looking for, as what they are looking for might inadvertently not actually be the best thing for them. Let us pray he finds and comes back into the fold of Islam, back onto the straight path, ameen.
I said I am interested in their stories. I am waiting for Gods guidance. I will hopefully make the right decision. Yes, Islam sounds convincing but I do not have conviction yet. I
Reply

sister herb
01-15-2016, 01:35 PM
Originally Posted by StrivingforDeen
I said I am interested in their stories. I am waiting for Gods guidance. I will hopefully make the right decision. Yes, Islam sounds convincing but I do not have conviction yet. I
May Allah guide you to the right path. Only what we can do is to trust Him. :statisfie
Reply

Seeker666
01-15-2016, 04:59 PM
In the name of Allah Most Gracious Most Merciful

Hi StrivingForDeen,

Perhaps I can relate to you more than most other people. I was kind of where you are decades ago. I was a strong agnostic/atheist. I gave up my birth religion of Islam as I did not concrete evidence of it being right at that stage. Not just that I realized I did not have much evidence of the existence of God at that stage so I gave up that belief too. You have firm belief in one God. I had no belief in God.

Dont give up and keep searching. Inshallah you will find the truth.

IMHO its not a bad thing to try to find the truth.

As an example you could think yourself to be in the right religion. Die, get up and find out you were in the wrong religion.
Even worse. You die thinking you were a muslim (as an example) , you wake up, and you find out Islam was the right religion and then you find out that Allah does not consider you to have been a muslim. Now you are in real hot water.

An any case finding the path is the key en-devour in ones life.

How do you find it is the key question.

I can give you a few pointers if you wish.

Initially I was trying to find that data which would give me proof of God and/or the true religion. Later i realized it more like a job interview. You need to trigger that which will make the Creator both make you see the sign and then make you understand the signs.

But the key factor after decades of thinking and searching is simply...

قُلْ إِنَّ اللَّهَ يُضِلُّ مَن يَشَآءُ وَيَهْدِى إِلَيْهِ مَنْ أَنَابَ
(Say: "Verily, Allah sends astray whom He wills and guides unto Himself those who turn to Him in repentance.'') meaning, He guides to Him those who repent, turn to Him, beg Him, seek His help and humbly submit to Him [Tafsir Ibn Kathir)
I consider it a falsification test.

Reflect on the following hadith the guidance part:

On the authority of Abu Dharr al-Ghifaree (may Allah be pleased with him) from the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allah be upon him) from his Lord, that He said: O My servants! I have forbidden dhulm (oppression) for Myself, and I have made it forbidden amongst you, so do not oppress one another. O My servants, all of you are astray except those whom I have guided, so seek guidance from Me and I shall guide you. O My servants, all of you are hungry except those whom I have fed, so seek food from Me and I shall feed you. O My servants, all of you are naked except those whom I have clothed, so seek clothing from Me and I shall clothe you. O My servants, you commit sins by day and by night, and I forgive all sins, so seek forgiveness from Me and I shall forgive you. O My servants, you will not attain harming Me so as to harm Me, and you will not attain benefiting Me so as to benefit Me. O My servants, if the first of you and the last of you, and the humans of you and the jinn of you, were all as pious as the most pious heart of any individual amongst you, then this would not increase My Kingdom an iota. O My servants, if the first of you and the last of you, and the humans of you and the jinn of you, were all as wicked as the most wicked heart of any individual amongst you, then this would not decrease My Kingdom an iota. O My servants, if the first of you and the last of you, and the humans of you and the jinn of you, were all to stand together in one place and ask of Me, and I were to give everyone what he requested, then that would not decrease what I Possess, except what is decreased of the ocean when a needle is dipped into it. O My servants, it is but your deeds that I account for you, and then recompense you for. So he who finds good, let him praise Allah, and he who finds other than that, let him blame no one but himself. [Muslim] عَنْ أَبِي ذَرٍّ الْغِفَارِيِّ رَضِيَ اللهُ عَنْهُ عَنْ النَّبِيِّ صلى الله عليه و سلم فِيمَا يَرْوِيهِ عَنْ رَبِّهِ تَبَارَكَ وَتَعَالَى، أَنَّهُ قَالَ: "يَا عِبَادِي: إنِّي حَرَّمْت الظُّلْمَ عَلَى نَفْسِي، وَجَعَلْته بَيْنَكُمْ مُحَرَّمًا؛ فَلَا تَظَالَمُوا. يَا عِبَادِي! كُلُّكُمْ ضَالٌّ إلَّا مَنْ هَدَيْته، فَاسْتَهْدُونِي أَهْدِكُمْ. يَا عِبَادِي! كُلُّكُمْ جَائِعٌ إلَّا مَنْ أَطْعَمْته، فَاسْتَطْعِمُونِي أُطْعِمْكُمْ. يَا عِبَادِي! كُلُّكُمْ عَارٍ إلَّا مَنْ كَسَوْته، فَاسْتَكْسُونِي أَكْسُكُمْ. يَا عِبَادِي! إنَّكُمْ تُخْطِئُونَ بِاللَّيْلِ وَالنَّهَارِ، وَأَنَا أَغْفِرُ الذُّنُوبَ جَمِيعًا؛ فَاسْتَغْفِرُونِي أَغْفِرْ لَكُمْ. يَا عِبَادِي! إنَّكُمْ لَنْ تَبْلُغُوا ضُرِّي فَتَضُرُّونِي، وَلَنْ تَبْلُغُوا نَفْعِي فَتَنْفَعُونِي. يَا عِبَادِي! لَوْ أَنَّ أَوَّلَكُمْ وَآخِرَكُمْ وَإِنْسَكُمْ وَجِنَّكُمْ كَانُوا عَلَى أَتْقَى قَلْبِ رَجُلٍ وَاحِدٍ مِنْكُمْ، مَا زَادَ ذَلِكَ فِي مُلْكِي شَيْئًا. يَا عِبَادِي! لَوْ أَنَّ أَوَّلَكُمْ وَآخِرَكُمْ وَإِنْسَكُمْ وَجِنَّكُمْ كَانُوا عَلَى أَفْجَرِ قَلْبِ رَجُلٍ وَاحِدٍ مِنْكُمْ، مَا نَقَصَ ذَلِكَ مِنْ مُلْكِي شَيْئًا. يَا عِبَادِي! لَوْ أَنَّ أَوَّلَكُمْ وَآخِرَكُمْ وَإِنْسَكُمْ وَجِنَّكُمْ قَامُوا فِي صَعِيدٍ وَاحِدٍ، فَسَأَلُونِي، فَأَعْطَيْت كُلَّ وَاحِدٍ مَسْأَلَته، مَا نَقَصَ ذَلِكَ مِمَّا عِنْدِي إلَّا كَمَا يَنْقُصُ الْمِخْيَطُ إذَا أُدْخِلَ الْبَحْرَ. يَا عِبَادِي! إنَّمَا هِيَ أَعْمَالُكُمْ أُحْصِيهَا لَكُمْ، ثُمَّ أُوَفِّيكُمْ إيَّاهَا؛ فَمَنْ وَجَدَ خَيْرًا فَلْيَحْمَدْ اللَّهَ، وَمَنْ وَجَدَ غَيْرَ ذَلِكَ فَلَا يَلُومَن إلَّا نَفْسَهُ". [رَوَاهُ مُسْلِمٌ]. Reference : 40 Hadith Nawawi 24 English translation : Hadith 24

In a nutshell. Keep asking the creator for forgiveness and guidance with humility. I honestly believe the creator does want you to find him. Believing without good reason is blindness. Seeking eternity blindly is madness.

I am quite meticulous in my thinking and have spent decades seeking the path. I don’t believe in anything without very very careful consideration especially when there is potentially an eternity at stake.

best regards
Reply

greenhill
01-15-2016, 05:34 PM
I have 'followed' this thread. I don't see what it is that's troubling you. You've not really said it. I get only inference, with very well 'choiced' words.

So it seems you have some resistance to the prophet (pbuh). I don't know what aspects.

You mentioned about other prophets (pbuta) but not naming any in particular (I might have missed/ forgotten) again, I can only presume it to be Jesus, which means. . . Christianity. Unless you want to make another branch.. Jesus is not the Saviour. We account for our own deeds and deep down inside we know that it is the fairest and the only way. It is very severe. But we can make it with our own will and choices.

If everything I'm saying above is way off mark, then I put it down to teenage 'waswas'..

Still, it could be a combination.

But then again, these are words of a person, a brother, a father, friend, employee/employer, etc and who is close to being 50, who's read a fair bit in that time, questioned non stop, get frustrated, felt he was being held back, restrictions everywhere.

Then he realised. He really, really realised, that it's all a test. It's there, all there, in the Quran. . Which makes him wonder why do most people (himself too at best of times) still keep the Quran as an ornament?

It is a Miracle, yet we take it lightly.. and the sad part is that you are seeking a miracle somewhere else. You know the answer already.

:peace:
Reply

Insaanah
01-15-2016, 07:15 PM
Originally Posted by StrivingforDeen
I said I am interested in their stories. I am waiting for Gods guidance. I will hopefully make the right decision. Yes, Islam sounds convincing but I do not have conviction yet.
The Qur'an is replete with their stories. The entire Surah Yusuf is a story, that touches on subjects such as jealousy, hatred, hatching plots, love and forgiveness, dreams, patience, trust and hope in Allah, indeed it is not just about a prophet, but a family... Most of us can relate one way or another with some of the things in it. Surah Taha and Surat ul Qasas, are exclusively the story of Musa :as:. From babyhood, when put into the basket in the river, found and brought up by Pharaohs family, but still reunited with his mother, travelling with his family and Allah speaking to him, the miracles he was given etc etc. Throughout the Qur'an there are stories of other prophets too - brief in some places, longer in others. For us to learn lessons from. Everyone likes a good story, and that's one of the modes Allah employs in the Qur'an.

Remember though, that there's a difference between what we want to know, and what we actually need to know. Allah, all-Wise, has told us only what we need to know. Otherwise the Qur'an would be too long. If it was a separate volume, as you might have hinted before, then you'd have Qur'an, sunnah in hadeeth, separate stories of prophets etc and people would complain that it's too much. Allah doesn't overburden us. He is the Most Merciful.

Believing in Prophet Muhammad :saws: doesn't neglect the previous prophets, but confirms it positively and emphatically. Someone once asked, here on the forum, that in the tashahhud in salaat, we bear witness that Muhammad :saws: is the messenger of Allah, but we don't mention the other prophets, and doesn't that discriminate against or neglect them?

We say "peace be upon us and all the righteous servants of Allah", and in those short words we include everyone, even the former prophets. Salaat isn't routinely meant to be long and drawn out (other than the recitation of one's choice if desired), with mention of every single prophet, or every group of righteous people mentioned separately. Muhammad :saws: is a culmination of the same message they all came with, belief in him by default meaning you believe in and honour the others.

Also, look at this ayah:

And whoever obeys Allah and the Messenger - those will be with the ones upon whom Allah has bestowed favor, of the prophets, the steadfast affirmers of truth, the martyrs and the righteous. And excellent are those as companions. (4:69)

Obey Allah, obey the messenger:saws:, reach paradise in shaa Allah, and be with the prophets (peace be on them). Be in their company. Then you can speak to them, pass time with them, you could ask them to tell you all the details of their stories, each and every one of them. What it was like, how they felt. Etc.
Reply

Linkdeutscher
01-15-2016, 07:26 PM
Read a seerah of the Prophet sallallahu alayhi wa alihi wasalam.
Reply

The-Deist
01-15-2016, 08:06 PM
Originally Posted by Linkdeutscher
Read a seerah of the Prophet sallallahu alayhi wa alihi wasalam.
I have.
Reply

Linkdeutscher
01-15-2016, 08:11 PM
Originally Posted by StrivingforDeen
I have.
If a man transforms a land of polytheism into a land of monotheism, surely that means something?
Reply

M.I.A.
01-15-2016, 08:41 PM
https://youtu.be/_YRV_LiHIZU

Couple minutes of your time.
Reply

Aaqib
01-15-2016, 10:41 PM
So apparently adolescent is a hard time or something? I'm about to enter that and I don't want to come out of it as a non muslim.
Reply

The-Deist
01-15-2016, 10:41 PM
Originally Posted by M.I.A.
https://youtu.be/_YRV_LiHIZU

Couple minutes of your time.
Why did you post this.
Reply

The-Deist
01-15-2016, 10:46 PM
Originally Posted by Aaqib
So apparently adolescent is a hard time or something? I'm about to enter that and I don't want to come out of it as a non muslim.
Any time can be hard.
Reply

M.I.A.
01-15-2016, 11:46 PM
Originally Posted by StrivingforDeen
Why did you post this.
It's the answer to someone's question, maybe not yours but its something to think about either way..

It's also how someone found his way which is kinda relevant to your situation I would think.

I have no idea how you percieve the world! Sorry.
Reply

Umm Malik
01-16-2016, 01:24 PM
Originally Posted by StrivingforDeen
I said I am interested in their stories. I am waiting for Gods guidance. I will hopefully make the right decision. Yes, Islam sounds convincing but I do not have conviction yet. I
alhamdulillah ...
keep asking him
may allah help you
Reply

greenhill
01-16-2016, 03:47 PM
Curious user name. A throwback to the past you allude to in your journey?

Welcome to the forum.

Wishing you a great stay.

P/s great that you chose to share that with us as your first post. See you around?

:peace:

Originally Posted by Seeker666
In the name of Allah Most Gracious Most Merciful

Hi StrivingForDeen,

Perhaps I can relate to you more than most other people. I was kind of where you are decades ago. I was a strong agnostic/atheist. I gave up my birth religion of Islam as I did not concrete evidence of it being right at that stage. Not just that I realized I did not have much evidence of the existence of God at that stage so I gave up that belief too. You have firm belief in one God. I had no belief in God.

Dont give up and keep searching. Inshallah you will find the truth.

IMHO its not a bad thing to try to find the truth.

As an example you could think yourself to be in the right religion. Die, get up and find out you were in the wrong religion.
Even worse. You die thinking you were a muslim (as an example) , you wake up, and you find out Islam was the right religion and then you find out that Allah does not consider you to have been a muslim. Now you are in real hot water.

An any case finding the path is the key en-devour in ones life.

How do you find it is the key question.

I can give you a few pointers if you wish.

Initially I was trying to find that data which would give me proof of God and/or the true religion. Later i realized it more like a job interview. You need to trigger that which will make the Creator both make you see the sign and then make you understand the signs.

But the key factor after decades of thinking and searching is simply...

قُلْ إِنَّ اللَّهَ يُضِلُّ مَن يَشَآءُ وَيَهْدِى إِلَيْهِ مَنْ أَنَابَ
(Say: "Verily, Allah sends astray whom He wills and guides unto Himself those who turn to Him in repentance.'') meaning, He guides to Him those who repent, turn to Him, beg Him, seek His help and humbly submit to Him [Tafsir Ibn Kathir)
I consider it a falsification test.

Reflect on the following hadith the guidance part:

On the authority of Abu Dharr al-Ghifaree (may Allah be pleased with him) from the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allah be upon him) from his Lord, that He said: O My servants! I have forbidden dhulm (oppression) for Myself, and I have made it forbidden amongst you, so do not oppress one another. O My servants, all of you are astray except those whom I have guided, so seek guidance from Me and I shall guide you. O My servants, all of you are hungry except those whom I have fed, so seek food from Me and I shall feed you. O My servants, all of you are naked except those whom I have clothed, so seek clothing from Me and I shall clothe you. O My servants, you commit sins by day and by night, and I forgive all sins, so seek forgiveness from Me and I shall forgive you. O My servants, you will not attain harming Me so as to harm Me, and you will not attain benefiting Me so as to benefit Me. O My servants, if the first of you and the last of you, and the humans of you and the jinn of you, were all as pious as the most pious heart of any individual amongst you, then this would not increase My Kingdom an iota. O My servants, if the first of you and the last of you, and the humans of you and the jinn of you, were all as wicked as the most wicked heart of any individual amongst you, then this would not decrease My Kingdom an iota. O My servants, if the first of you and the last of you, and the humans of you and the jinn of you, were all to stand together in one place and ask of Me, and I were to give everyone what he requested, then that would not decrease what I Possess, except what is decreased of the ocean when a needle is dipped into it. O My servants, it is but your deeds that I account for you, and then recompense you for. So he who finds good, let him praise Allah, and he who finds other than that, let him blame no one but himself. [Muslim] عَنْ أَبِي ذَرٍّ الْغِفَارِيِّ رَضِيَ اللهُ عَنْهُ عَنْ النَّبِيِّ صلى الله عليه و سلم فِيمَا يَرْوِيهِ عَنْ رَبِّهِ تَبَارَكَ وَتَعَالَى، أَنَّهُ قَالَ: "يَا عِبَادِي: إنِّي حَرَّمْت الظُّلْمَ عَلَى نَفْسِي، وَجَعَلْته بَيْنَكُمْ مُحَرَّمًا؛ فَلَا تَظَالَمُوا. يَا عِبَادِي! كُلُّكُمْ ضَالٌّ إلَّا مَنْ هَدَيْته، فَاسْتَهْدُونِي أَهْدِكُمْ. يَا عِبَادِي! كُلُّكُمْ جَائِعٌ إلَّا مَنْ أَطْعَمْته، فَاسْتَطْعِمُونِي أُطْعِمْكُمْ. يَا عِبَادِي! كُلُّكُمْ عَارٍ إلَّا مَنْ كَسَوْته، فَاسْتَكْسُونِي أَكْسُكُمْ. يَا عِبَادِي! إنَّكُمْ تُخْطِئُونَ بِاللَّيْلِ وَالنَّهَارِ، وَأَنَا أَغْفِرُ الذُّنُوبَ جَمِيعًا؛ فَاسْتَغْفِرُونِي أَغْفِرْ لَكُمْ. يَا عِبَادِي! إنَّكُمْ لَنْ تَبْلُغُوا ضُرِّي فَتَضُرُّونِي، وَلَنْ تَبْلُغُوا نَفْعِي فَتَنْفَعُونِي. يَا عِبَادِي! لَوْ أَنَّ أَوَّلَكُمْ وَآخِرَكُمْ وَإِنْسَكُمْ وَجِنَّكُمْ كَانُوا عَلَى أَتْقَى قَلْبِ رَجُلٍ وَاحِدٍ مِنْكُمْ، مَا زَادَ ذَلِكَ فِي مُلْكِي شَيْئًا. يَا عِبَادِي! لَوْ أَنَّ أَوَّلَكُمْ وَآخِرَكُمْ وَإِنْسَكُمْ وَجِنَّكُمْ كَانُوا عَلَى أَفْجَرِ قَلْبِ رَجُلٍ وَاحِدٍ مِنْكُمْ، مَا نَقَصَ ذَلِكَ مِنْ مُلْكِي شَيْئًا. يَا عِبَادِي! لَوْ أَنَّ أَوَّلَكُمْ وَآخِرَكُمْ وَإِنْسَكُمْ وَجِنَّكُمْ قَامُوا فِي صَعِيدٍ وَاحِدٍ، فَسَأَلُونِي، فَأَعْطَيْت كُلَّ وَاحِدٍ مَسْأَلَته، مَا نَقَصَ ذَلِكَ مِمَّا عِنْدِي إلَّا كَمَا يَنْقُصُ الْمِخْيَطُ إذَا أُدْخِلَ الْبَحْرَ. يَا عِبَادِي! إنَّمَا هِيَ أَعْمَالُكُمْ أُحْصِيهَا لَكُمْ، ثُمَّ أُوَفِّيكُمْ إيَّاهَا؛ فَمَنْ وَجَدَ خَيْرًا فَلْيَحْمَدْ اللَّهَ، وَمَنْ وَجَدَ غَيْرَ ذَلِكَ فَلَا يَلُومَن إلَّا نَفْسَهُ". [رَوَاهُ مُسْلِمٌ]. Reference : 40 Hadith Nawawi 24 English translation : Hadith 24

In a nutshell. Keep asking the creator for forgiveness and guidance with humility. I honestly believe the creator does want you to find him. Believing without good reason is blindness. Seeking eternity blindly is madness.

I am quite meticulous in my thinking and have spent decades seeking the path. I don’t believe in anything without very very careful consideration especially when there is potentially an eternity at stake.

best regards
Reply

Seeker666
01-16-2016, 05:47 PM
Jazak Allah greenhill,

The name? Yes it does allude to my past. However, the journey continues. I doubt it ever ends. Its a continuous process as we continuously need guidance. That is perhaps why fateha is central part of all prayers.

The seeking continues. The goal gets modified. As my primary goal was seeking proofs of the creator and his religion once, I now seek to find his love and mercy. If he loves me, then I have found the ultimate treasure. And if he does not love me, then I have lost everything. For that I seek to clean up my soul.

Jazak Allah for your kind words and your kind welcome.

Inshallah, I will see how this forum works out.

May Allah bless you and guide you and forgive you and all the muslimeen and all the muslimaat and all the momineen and all the mominaat.

salam




Originally Posted by greenhill
Curious user name. A throwback to the past you allude to in your journey?

Welcome to the forum.

Wishing you a great stay.

P/s great that you chose to share that with us as your first post. See you around?

:peace:
Reply

M.I.A.
01-16-2016, 06:55 PM
You should put your explanation of your username in a signature, people will be less confused.
Reply

Kiro
01-17-2016, 04:22 PM
Ask God for signs. Make sincere dua.
Reply

Seeker666
01-18-2016, 04:02 AM
Surah 40:13


MUHSIN KHAN


It is He, Who shows you His Ayat (proofs, evidences, verses, lessons, signs, revelations, etc.) and sends down (rain with which grows) provision for you from the sky. And none remembers but those who turn (to Allah) in obedience and in repentance (by begging His Pardon and by worshipping and obeying Him Alone and none else).

PICKTHALL

He it is Who showeth you His portents, and sendeth down for you provision from the sky. None payeth heed save him who turneth (unto Him) repentant.

SAHIH INTERNATIONAL

It is He who shows you His signs and sends down to you from the sky, provision. But none will remember except he who turns back [in repentance].

I think the key is what makes one learn lessons from the signs seen or understand the signs. I think this ayat (40:13) says what that criteria is to learn lesson and understand the signs.

Talking about signs. When I read your post a few hours ago, Kiro, I though about the ayat about Allah showing signs in the universe and yourself. I had forgotten which surah it was. As I opened the Quran randomly a little while later. There is was on that same page.. surah 41 ayat 53
MUHSIN KHAN

We will show them Our Signs in the universe, and in their ownselves, until it becomes manifest to them that this (the Quran) is the truth. Is it not sufficient in regard to your Lord that He is a Witness over all things?

Originally Posted by Kiro
Ask God for signs. Make sincere dua.
Reply

The-Deist
01-18-2016, 02:38 PM
Originally Posted by Kiro
Ask God for signs. Make sincere dua.
Tell Serinity to come on Facebook.
Reply

greenhill
01-18-2016, 03:55 PM
Originally Posted by Aaqib
So apparently adolescent is a hard time or something? I'm about to enter that and I don't want to come out of it as a non muslim.
Ha ha!

Adolescent can be a strange thing. It is a growth spurt not just physically, emotionally, mentally and spiritually. That does not as yet include the hormones, intellectual awareness, competition, temptations...

You'll have the unbounded energy of youth but no wisdom of age to guide and it can be like an elephant in a glass shop.

You'll be fine :shade:


:peace:
Reply

The-Deist
01-19-2016, 06:12 AM
Originally Posted by greenhill
Ha ha!

Adolescent can be a strange thing. It is a growth spurt not just physically, emotionally, mentally and spiritually. That does not as yet include the hormones, intellectual awareness, competition, temptations...

You'll have the unbounded energy of youth but no wisdom of age to guide and it can be like an elephant in a glass shop.

You'll be fine :shade:


[emoji14]eace:
It can vary for everyone. Anyways, why hasen't my account been deleted yet?
Reply

greenhill
01-19-2016, 08:22 AM
Yes of course. . .

Why should your account be deleted?


:peace:
Reply

The-Deist
01-19-2016, 08:44 AM
Originally Posted by greenhill
Yes of course. . .

Why should your account be deleted?


[emoji14]eace:
Cuz I'm done with forums for now.
Reply

sister herb
01-19-2016, 08:49 AM
Originally Posted by StrivingforDeen
Cuz I'm done with forums for now.
If so, then why you log in? Lock out, go to live the real life and after years, if you feel so, log in again and visit to say hi to us.
Reply

The-Deist
01-19-2016, 08:51 AM
Originally Posted by sister herb
If so, then why you log in? Lock out, go to live the real life and after years, if you feel so, log in again and visit to say hi to us.
Cuz I wanna remove all the posts qnd threads I made. They might not represwnt me anymore.
Reply

greenhill
01-19-2016, 10:51 AM
But reflect a journey.

Besides, deleting your posts will affect the flow of comments and response.

Peace to you.
Reply

sister herb
01-19-2016, 10:57 AM
Originally Posted by StrivingforDeen
Cuz I wanna remove all the posts qnd threads I made. They might not represwnt me anymore.
I don´t think its a good idea (to remove all the posts - and admins don´t do it anyways). Many people have answered to your posts and then they too will lost their posts - which might be beneficial to others to learn and understand Islam better.

Don´t worry if some posts don´t represent what you are now or will be tomorrow. They tell what you was at the yesterday, nothing else. Be sure that those posts I made at 2006 don´t represent me either very well at 2016 too. But sometimes it´s good to remember your past, even if feeling will be something like :facepalm:
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Seeker666
01-19-2016, 05:14 PM
hmmm....

StrivingForDeen,

I actually joined the forum when I read your post.

Do keep looking and have patience.

Its a pity you choose to leave.

regards
Reply

Seeker666
01-19-2016, 05:22 PM
Something I wrote in the late 90s! Might be of interest to seekers. Remember this was meant for agnostics. This is over a decade and a half old. Since then I think I have figured out the criteria. And the criteria is in my previous posts about turning to Allah in repentance and asking for guidance.

For Atheists and Agnostics to Think about: From a long term ex-Agnostic

Hello All,

Perhaps the following may provide an alternative approach to think about.

I was a disbeliever in God and any religion for most of my adult life. I went through a decade long journey to find what I now know is the truth. The standard of proof that I had when I started my journey, remained the same. At the start of my journey I thought that even if I found evidence of God, I would perhaps have faith to an extent that I would be able to say, I think it likely God exist. I was convinced that there could be no certitude of faith. I do not believe any of my standards of proof have changed, though I now am sure there is such a thing as certainty of faith in God.

Think about the following.

People do not go out of their way to help people not up to a basic criteria. If someone does not come up to your standards, you will not help him in certain things. You perhaps may not want to help a murderer buy a Gun. Those standards do not have to be very high. Point is if you go apply for a job saying I am the brightest of the brightest Wharton has to offer, and you my interviewer are a moron, then expecting a job offer may not be likely. Alternatively if you are a multiple murderer and a MIT 5.0 GPA grad and go apply for a Job, and say I am the best technical person you are going to find hire me, its is again likely that you will get rejected.

I am convinced it’s exactly the same story with finding proof of God/religion. Reason can lead you to proof of God only if God wants you to get there. God has with held certain key factors with himself so that with all your data you will not analyze it in a way to prove his existence to yourself. This I believe is a key way for him giving proof to whom he chooses and withhold proof from who he chooses. What makes him decide who to lead to the right way, that is for you to discover. I believe factors like arrogance, not caring about the truth, not searching for the truth without biases, forcing you own standards on God are perhaps some of the reasons for which God withholds proof. God, I believe, handicaps people for their circumstances.

An Al Mighty holds all the cards If there is a God, It is obvious that God has not provided the understanding of proof of his existence to all people. People do genuinely disbelieve in his existence. Similarly not all people who believe in God, believe in the same religion, this again means that God has not provided the understanding of proof of the true religion to all people.

For an agnostic searching for the truth, whatever it may be. If he uses reason to want to disprove God, God may very likely withhold the proofs from that person. If the person is unbiased, then that person should try to see that if there is a God, what standards should I try to meet which will make God give me proof.

A number of people of Belief, believe they have proof based on reason and through reason they have achieved faith, they could be right, but I think just as crucial is the factor whether they have achieved that basic standard.

Agnosticism is a good starting point. It provides a starting place to find the truth. If you remain completely in blind faith you could be on the wrong path and have no hope of finding the truth. But to use reason alone and not factor in the fact that to get the job its not only your qualifications but also if you fit the Employers standard, can lead you into serious trouble. If by chance you meet this standard, you get hired if you don’t well then..

What this means for an Agnostic.

1. Remain true to your standards, seek the truth aggressively, and make finding the truth a top priority in your life. If God exists, I believe, he will appreciate you making an unbiased search for the truth. You make finding God without any biases a top priority and he may well make you a priority. I am convinced he will not hold any genuine doubts you have. If God chooses he will give you sufficient proof.
2. Do not cop out and accept a religion based on blind faith. Hold on until you have enough proof before committing to a religion. Keep you genuine doubts and expect answers.
3. Try to be unbiased in your opinion about Gods existence. If you do not want him to exist, he will likely convince you of it.
4. Use creative prayers like the following “ God, I do not know you exist, I only want the truth whether I like it or dislike it, if you are there help me find the truth.”
5. Remember that if there is a God, then he has clearly not given proof to all people, try to improve yourself and try to figure out what standards God may use to give proof.
6. Study religion without bias

I believe proofs of God and religion is individualized. You may be given proof different from what other people are given. If you come up to Gods criteria, the proof I believe will be enough to give you certitude of faith.
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Seeker666
01-19-2016, 05:26 PM
The natural inclination of someone like me with western education was an experimental approach to finding God/religion. But the process of finding the truth turns out to be a 2 or multi player game. More akin to a job interview than an experiment. That is not to say you dont need data and evidence to believe. You definitely need it. Without the evidence you are just making a guess. But the question again is how to you get to the point that the creator shows you the evidence and you heart opens up to seeing the evidence.
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Seeker666
01-19-2016, 05:34 PM
Would an Omni-potent one God, allow an imposter to be the biggest recorded blow to Idol Worship? If the intent of God is to keep the search for truth relatively simple what would be the answer. What if he wanted to make it difficult?

My answer to God on the day of judgement if he tell me Muhammad SWAS was not a prophet will be. How come you made him do the best possible deed from a monotheistic point of view? How can you possibly expect me not to believe in him? And even if you did it, then you should have compensated by leaving evidence to compensate for this deed. Where is that evidence?

Seriously, Idolatry is the worst thing according to all Abraham religions. And the Prophet SWAS finished it in Arabia. The Arabs though Abraham was an idol worshiper. The Prophet fixed that record too.

Jesus AS did not claim God hood even in the changed bible. The Prophet was right about that too.
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Seeker666
01-19-2016, 05:48 PM
the prophet SWAS finished female infanticide in Arabia… possibly the single biggest recorded humanitarian act in human history by a single man? I can think of nothing comparable.
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Seeker666
01-19-2016, 05:52 PM
Would an Omni-potent one God, allow an imposter to be the biggest recorded blow to Idol Worship? If the intent of God is to keep the search for truth relatively simple what would be the answer. What if he wanted to make it difficult. Compound this with the fact that the book the impostor has is the only reliable religious book from a historic authenticity point of view. Also the book is easily memorisable, also the book contains stuff that may be regarded a remarkable. Also that a challenge of never being able to replicate its type also lies unfulfilled, also the impostor gave up all kinds of bribes to get away from the religion. Also had patience through a long period of little success and persecution. Also did not care about worldly stuff. Also known as sadiq and amin. Also followed by large segment of world population. Also regarded as most influential man. Also regarded as top reformer, law giver, general. Also the book has economic secrets. Also the book has truths about things ranging from mountains, embryology development stuff. All the corroboration from the bible, old and new testament as to Tauheed. Most compatible with cosmology. Can any one religion claim even half as many good reasons for its truth in current version. Subhan Allah. This would be the ultimate trap to create a religion like Islam with all these arguments and make it false.
Reply

The-Deist
01-19-2016, 06:54 PM
Originally Posted by maryam muslimah
may allah guide you
connect with him
tell him
O God if islam is the true religion put islam in my heart
the islam is the true
and you will know this here ... or in the hereafter but you will regret if you let your self to satan when you know the true after it's too late
وَقَالَ الشَّيْطَانُ لَمَّا قُضِيَ الأَمْرُ إِنَّ اللّهَ وَعَدَكُمْ وَعْدَ الْحَقِّ وَوَعَدتُّكُمْ فَأَخْلَفْتُكُمْ وَمَا كَانَ لِيَ عَلَيْكُم مِّن سُلْطَانٍ إِلاَّ أَن دَعَوْتُكُمْ فَاسْتَجَبْتُمْ لِي فَلاَ تَلُومُونِي وَلُومُواْ أَنفُسَكُم مَّا أَنَاْ بِمُصْرِخِكُمْ وَمَا أَنتُمْ بِمُصْرِخِيَّ إِنِّي كَفَرْتُ بِمَا أَشْرَكْتُمُونِ مِن قَبْلُ إِنَّ الظَّالِمِينَ لَهُمْ عَذَابٌ أَلِيمٌ
the translating ...
( 22 ) And Satan will say when the matter has been concluded, "Indeed, Allah had promised you the promise of truth. And I promised you, but I betrayed you. But I had no authority over you except that I invited you, and you responded to me. So do not blame me; but blame yourselves. I cannot be called to your aid, nor can you be called to my aid. Indeed, I deny your association of me [with Allah] before. Indeed, for the wrongdoers is a painful punishment."
you can read it from the quran directly if you want to know more ...
http://quran.ksu.edu.sa/index.php?l=...er&trans=en_sh
you can also hear to feel it when you read the translating

i am sure you will be muslim soon inshaallah
so soon
If I ever pray to God I shall not ask for any specific religion. That is because I do not hold any commitment to any faith.
Reply

The-Deist
01-19-2016, 07:02 PM
I'm getting bored of searching religion. I don't why God can't just reveal me the truth (if there is one).
Reply

Insaanah
01-19-2016, 07:38 PM
Originally posted by Signor

Reminds me of Abu Bakar Ruben's story:



A Spiritual Night: All I Need is a Sign!
So I asked him if I could take a Quran home, and I said I was going to respect the book. I took it home, and I started reading it. What I found while reading it, it was not as though I was reading a story, it was as though someone was commanding me, you know someone giving me guidance. And one night, I decided I would really try to get the spiritual mood happening, and I’m sure some of you have probably heard this story before, so I apologize.

I lit a candle, I had the window open, I had the curtains drawn, you know I was trying to get that real spiritual feeling, it was a nice summer night in Melbourne, as summer as it can get in Melbourne, and I was sitting there and thinking “this is it, this is the night.” I’ve been investigating all the spiritual proofs, all the scientific proofs about the facts about the mountains are pegs, how the embryo develops inside the woman, … all these amazing proofs, but I still needed that little push, it’s like I was on the edge of a cliff, I was ready to jump, I just needed a push.

So I was sitting there, it was very quiet, I was reading Quran, I stopped, I said: “Allah, this is my moment. This is the time I’m about to jump into Islam. All I need is a sign, just a little sign, nothing huge, maybe a bit of lightning, you know maybe half the house could fall down or something, … something you know just small, small for You. So I sat there, I was waiting for the candle to start lighting up before me, like in the movies… And Subhan Allah, nothing. Absolutely nothing happened.

I was really disappointed to be honest. So I sat there and said “Allah, this is Your chance. I’m here. I will give You another chance. OK, I know You may be busy, I know it’s daytime the other side of the world, there is a whole lot of stuff going on. Maybe this time it could be like a car back-firing, You know, something small. Alright half the house, the candle, let’s forget it. A bird could fart outside, I don’t care just anything, … So I said OK, go. And Subhan Allah, absolutely nothing happened. And I mean I couldn’t even say “that was it, that creek in the wall that was it”. Absolutely nothing. I was really disappointed. I was sitting there thinking this was it, this was my last chance, Islam, and I haven’t found it.

I pulled back the Quran, I turned back to where I was reading, Subhan Allah the very next verse on the next page “for those of you who ask for signs, have We not shown you enough already? Look around you. Look at the stars, look at the suns, look at the water. These are the signs for the people of knowledge.” And Subhan Allah, I threw the duvet over my head, and I pretended I was asleep, I was that scared because I couldn’t believe how arrogant I’d been to want my own specific sign when all the signs had been there for me all along. The fact that we have this world, the fact that there is this creation, these are the signs for all of us.
http://www.islamicboard.com/advice-a...ml#post2847181
Reply

popsthebuilder
01-20-2016, 06:12 AM
Originally Posted by IARLG
Allah[One God]

Muslims often refer to God as Allah. This is a universal name for God and does not refer to an exclusively ‘Islamic’ God. Interestingly, this name is related to the Aramaic and Hebrew names for God, Allaha and Elohim. Therefore, Allah is simply the Arabic name for God which affirms that He is One singular God with no partners or equals. The name Allah cannot be pluralized or limited to a specific gender, which establishes that God is One and that He is unique from everything He creates. Muslims continue to use this original Arabic name for God (Allah) since it perfectly expresses His unique qualities.
God is the Creator and the Sustainer of the universe who created everything for a reason. Muslims believe that He created humankind with a simple purpose – to worship Him. He sent messengers to guide people in fulfilling this purpose.
Some of these messengers include Adam, Noah, Abraham, Moses, Jesus, and Muhammad, peace be upon all of them. They all taught a consistent message about God by affirming His greatness as the Creator and guiding people to worship Him alone. This basic concept has always resonated with people’s natural understanding of God.
When the final prophet, Muhammad, peace be upon him (pbuh), was asked about God, the answer came directly from God in the Qur’an. This is how Allah describes Himself in the Qur’an in Surat Al-Ikhlaas (Qur’an 112:1-4)
Say (O Muhammad (Peace be upon him)): “He is Allah, (the) One. (Qur’an 112:1)
“Allah-us-Samad (The Self-Sufficient Master, Whom all creatures need, He neither eats nor drinks). (Qur’an 112:2)
“He begets not, nor was He begotten; (Qur’an 112:3)
“And there is none co-equal or comparable unto Him.” (Qur’an 112:4)
This is a clear statement by God describing Himself to humanity without any room for confusion. God is One and is exalted above everything He creates and He is capable over all things.
The way Allah describes Himself is so beyond perfect that it is impossible for any so called god(s) to meet any of the four verses/descriptions above in Surat Al-Ikhlaas. Yet only Allah Alone can bear all of these verses/descriptions individually and collectively. As mentioned before, Allah is so beyond the realm of perfect that nothing and no one is even good enough to be His fake.
Monotheism, belief in one God, is the most important and foundational concept in Islam. Muslims believe in one God who created the universe and has power over everything within it.
He (Allah) is unique and exalted above everything He creates, and His greatness cannot be compared to His creation. Furthermore, He is the only one deserving of any worship and the ultimate purpose of all creation is to submit to Him. The Islamic understanding of God is distinct from all other religions and beliefs in various respects since it is based on a pure and clear understanding of monotheism.
He is Allah, beside Whom there is La ilaha illa Huwa (none has the right to be worshipped but He) the All-Knower of the unseen and the seen (open). He is the Most Beneficent, the Most Merciful. He is Allah than Whom there is La ilaha illa Huwa (none has the right to be worshipped but He) the King, the Holy, the One Free from all defects, the Giver of security, the Watcher over His creatures, the All-Mighty, the Compeller, the Supreme. Glory be to Allah! (High is He) above all that they associate as partners with Him. He is Allah, the Creator, the Inventor of all things, the Bestower of forms. To Him belong the Best Names . All that is in the heavens and the earth glorify Him. And He is the All-Mighty, the All-Wise. (Qur’an 59:22-24)
Allah! La ilaha illa Huwa (none has the right to be worshipped but He), the Ever Living, the One Who sustains and protects all that exists. Neither slumber, nor sleep overtake Him. To Him belongs whatever is in the heavens and whatever is on earth. Who is he that can intercede with Him except with His Permission? He knows what happens to them (His creatures) in this world, and what will happen to them in the Hereafter . And they will never compass anything of His Knowledge except that which He wills. His Kursi extends over the heavens and the earth, and He feels no fatigue in guarding and preserving them. And He is the Most High, the Most Great. [This Verse 2:255 is called Ayat-ul-Kursi.] (Qur’an 2:255)
The Believer’s Surrender
In order to be a true believer, one must believe in the absolute oneness of God, as the only Creator, Preserver and Nourisher of everything. However, this belief in the true characteristics of God is not the sole condition of true faith; one must also acknowledge that God is the only one who deserves to be worshipped. His commands and guidelines for how to live one’s life should always take precedence over the commands of anything He created. Indeed, He guides humanity to what is best for them in this life and the hereafter and He is All-Knowing and All-Wise.
Having embraced this understanding of God, one should constantly have faith in Him, and should remain steadfast on the truth. When true faith enters a person’s heart, it positively impacts their outlook and behavior. The Prophet Muhammad (pbuh) said, “Faith is that which resides firmly in the heart and which is proved by actions.”
One of the striking effects of faith is a feeling of gratitude towards God. Believers love God and are grateful to Him for the blessings He gives them. They are aware of the fact that their good deeds will never be equal to His divine favors upon them so they are always striving to please Him. Furthermore, sincere believers in God accept that any hardships they face are part of the greater ‘test of life.’ They are patient through times of difficulty and turn to God for assistance. A beautiful characteristic of the believers is that they accept everything God wills and continuously remember Him in all aspects of life.
Anyone who denies the basic truth of the existence of God is considered ungrateful and a disbeliever. On many occasions in the Quran, God reminds humanity of the disbelievers’ clear misguidance and His complete power over everything:
No doubt! Verily, to Allah belongs whosoever is in the heavens and whosoever is in the earth. And those who worship and invoke others besides Allah, in fact they follow not the (Allah’s so-called) partners, they follow only a conjecture and they only invent lies. (Qur’an 10:66)
Allah, it is He Who has made the night for you that you may rest therein and the day for you to see. Truly, Allah is full of Bounty to mankind, yet most of mankind give no thanks.That is Allah, your Lord, the Creator of all things, La ilaha illa Huwa (none has the right to be worshipped but He), where then you are turning away (from Allah, by worshipping others instead of Him)! (Qur’an 40:61-62)
In the end, we must understand that our belief or disbelief in God does not affect Him in any way. Believing in Him, worshipping Him, and following His commands will only benefit us because we are in need of His blessings, favors and mercy. On the other hand, He does not need us because He is the Self-Sufficient Creator. However, it is never too late for a person to turn back to God, seeking His guidance and forgiveness by submitting to Him.
Say: “O ‘Ibadi (My slaves) who have transgressed against themselves (by committing evil deeds and sins)! Despair not of the Mercy of Allah, verily Allah forgives all sins. Truly, He is Oft-Forgiving, Most Merciful. “And turn in repentance and in obedience with true Faith (Islamic Monotheism) to your Lord and submit to Him, (in Islam), before the torment comes upon you, then you will not be helped. “And follow the best of that which is sent down to you from your
Lord (i.e. this Quran, do what it orders you to do and keep away from what it forbids), before the torment comes on you suddenly while you perceive not!” (Qur’an 39:53-55)
Good post minus some of the added stuff within parenthesis

Peace
Reply

sister herb
01-20-2016, 09:03 AM
Originally Posted by StrivingforDeen
I'm getting bored of searching religion. I don't why God can't just reveal me the truth (if there is one).
Because finding the truth is the life-long journey. Be patient, young brother. ;)
Reply

popsthebuilder
01-20-2016, 01:55 PM
Set aside greed pride and want for self in All you think and do and you will be shown by God's will and your perseverance.

Peace
Reply

Insaanah
01-20-2016, 02:05 PM
Originally Posted by StrivingforDeen
I'm getting bored of searching religion. I don't why God can't just reveal me the truth (if there is one).
He already has, but you need to let it in. You need to open your heart and mind to it. The book, the Qur'an it self, is a sign or rather lots of signs. The fact that there are these people, from different backgrounds, different countries, different languages, who don't know each other, and don't know you, yet are all telling you the same thing, in their own different ways, is a major sign. All out of care and concern for their brother.

Do they await but that Allah should come to them in covers of clouds and the angels [as well] and the matter is [then] decided? And to Allah [all] matters are returned. (2:210)

Allah says in the Quran that He's made the truth clear, and that truth stands distinct from falsehood. And indeed it does. As an example, to illustrate this, lets take the very core of any faith, which is it's concept of God.

Many religions say they believe in One God, but what is truly One God?

Let's take the number 1. That number can be manipulated, by multiplying, dividing, adding or subtracting.

This is what various groups of people have wrongly done over the years with their beliefs about God.

Some have multiplied the number, and believe in many gods.

Others have divided the number, and believe in many gods in one, such as the trinity (or 3 = 1 or 1 = 3)

Some have added, by worshipping God, but then also worshipping and praying to others such as Mary (peace be on her), or saints etc along with Him.

And others, such as atheists, have subtracted, by saying there is no God.

Regardless of this manipulation, the number 1 always remains the number 1 and does not itself change, and cannot itself never not be 1.

So what is the original and true belief without any change or manipulation?

1.

1slam.

The original and true belief in One God, without any associates, in, or parts or persons, to, His Exclusive Divinity.

And that's just one example, where the truth stands manifestly clear.

Is it possible that God could have sent us a human being, with a scripture, to establish that truth?

Now imagine, that a person, a human being, peace, blessings and salutations of God be on him, brings people to that same truth illustrated above, a fact that history bears witness to, and cannot and has never been denied. It follows, then, that person's being sent by God, must also be a truth. If it is consistent with what all the previous prophets preached, then it further confirms that, and indeed it is.

Peace.
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The-Deist
01-22-2016, 04:36 PM
I am losing more and more faith in religion, the more I pray. So is God trying to say there is no true religion?
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sister herb
01-22-2016, 04:45 PM
Originally Posted by StrivingforDeen
I am losing more and more faith in religion, the more I pray. So is God trying to say there is no true religion?
You believe that the God is saying to you what you by yourself are thinking - and want to hear. If you have decided to believe that there is no true religion, you imagine that your thoughts are on God's speech.

Be carefull with your conclusions and be patient. You may have to find the truth for years or decades.
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The-Deist
01-22-2016, 04:58 PM
Originally Posted by sister herb
You believe that the God is saying to you what you by yourself are thinking - and want to hear. If you have decided to believe that there is no true religion, you imagine that your thoughts are on God's speech.

Be carefull with your conclusions and be patient. You may have to find the truth for years or decades.
I don't believe anything right now.
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farhan
01-22-2016, 04:59 PM
Originally Posted by StrivingforDeen
I don't believe anything right now.
What did you see in your dream today?
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The-Deist
01-22-2016, 05:07 PM
Originally Posted by فرحان
What did you see in your dream today?
Why uo do dis to me?
I don't want no interptation for it.
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Kiro
01-22-2016, 05:22 PM
Originally Posted by StrivingforDeen
Why uo do dis to me?
I don't want no interptation for it.
What are things that is keeping you away from Islam? Do you disregard the signs in Islam?
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The-Deist
01-22-2016, 05:26 PM
Originally Posted by Kiro
What are things that is keeping you away from Islam? Do you disregard the signs in Islam?
I don't know why. But I don't see a reason to enter it either.
Reply

Kiro
01-22-2016, 05:48 PM
Originally Posted by StrivingforDeen
I don't know why. But I don't see a reason to enter it either.
Than only you are preventing yourself.
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Insaanah
01-22-2016, 07:43 PM
Originally Posted by StrivingforDeen
I am losing more and more faith in religion, the more I pray. So is God trying to say there is no true religion?
Just a few of questions to get you thinking from a different angle:

Do you believe that Adam, Noah, Abraham, Moses and their brethren in prophethood, were messengers of God? If so, do you believe they all preached the same thing?

Second thing is, you go to school right? Do you believe that there's any benefit in you going to school, either now or for the future?

There was analogy about correct beliefs regarding God that I gave in my previous post. Did that make sense, and if not, were there any questions/comments on it?

Peace.
Reply

The-Deist
01-23-2016, 09:45 AM
Originally Posted by Insaanah
Just a few of questions to get you thinking from a different angle:

Do you believe that Adam, Noah, Abraham, Moses and their brethren in prophethood, were messengers of God? If so, do you believe they all preached the same thing?

Second thing is, you go to school right? Do you believe that there's any benefit in you going to school, either now or for the future?

There was analogy about correct beliefs regarding God that I gave in my previous post. Did that make sense, and if not, were there any questions/comments on it?

Peace.
I guess I believe in them. And yes your previous post made sense.
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Seeker666
01-23-2016, 01:28 PM
I am curious, why do you believe in them?

Originally Posted by StrivingforDeen
I guess I believe in them. And yes your previous post made sense.
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The-Deist
01-23-2016, 02:47 PM
Originally Posted by Seeker666
I am curious, why do you believe in them?
I said I guess. Honestly I am just waiting for my account to be disabled.
Reply

popsthebuilder
01-23-2016, 02:57 PM
Originally Posted by StrivingforDeen
I said I guess. Honestly I am just waiting for my account to be disabled.
I wish you the best on your journey.

Seek the truth. Don't be scared by the words of man. Repent not of good in all you do. God will guide you. Just don't ignore what you come to know by God's will, regardless of if it pertains to you, or others.

Peace
Reply

Scimitar
01-23-2016, 03:03 PM
Originally Posted by StrivingforDeen
I said I guess. Honestly I am just waiting for my account to be disabled.
When you look for things to go wrong, they will go wring - even if in actual fact the world is bending over backwards to make it go right.

why are you wronging yourself like this? You're a little kid who is going through puberty, you don't even know who you are yet and you think you are ready to start making life changing decision, ones that you will have to pay for - and you do not even know at what cost?

I don't think you have what it takes to be a Muslim any, you got no patience, and crumble at lifes smallest hurdles, you're overly emotional and always projecting how you feel wihtout any due care for how another does. Your decision is a slap to your family members and their upbringing of you, because I am sure they are unaware of what you share with us - you're a coward.

So yes, we don't need gutless spineless emo boys in dresses wanting to be Muslim anyway - we just hope for the sake of your family that you do not embarrass them openly with your egotistically misaligned self.

Farewell, kid

Scimi
Reply

sister herb
01-23-2016, 03:29 PM
Originally Posted by Timi Scar
I don't think you have what it takes to be a Muslim any, you got no patience, and crumble at lifes smallest hurdles, you're overly emotional and always projecting how you feel wihtout any due care for how another does.
But this seems to be just what the puberty is. Don´t be too harsh to little guy. ;)
Reply

The-Deist
01-23-2016, 03:41 PM
Originally Posted by Timi Scar
When you look for things to go wrong, they will go wring - even if in actual fact the world is bending over backwards to make it go right.

why are you wronging yourself like this? You're a little kid who is going through puberty, you don't even know who you are yet and you think you are ready to start making life changing decision, ones that you will have to pay for - and you do not even know at what cost?

I don't think you have what it takes to be a Muslim any, you got no patience, and crumble at lifes smallest hurdles, you're overly emotional and always projecting how you feel wihtout any due care for how another does. Your decision is a slap to your family members and their upbringing of you, because I am sure they are unaware of what you share with us - you're a coward.

So yes, we don't need gutless spineless emo boys in dresses wanting to be Muslim anyway - we just hope for the sake of your family that you do not embarrass them openly with your egotistically misaligned self.

Farewell, kid

Scimi
You don't even know my family. Second of all you don't know me personally.
Reply

Futuwwa
01-23-2016, 04:15 PM
When King Gustav II Adolf went forth to intervene in the Thirty Years War, he was reportedly asked: "What would anyone gain by following you?". He replied: "Salvation, perhaps. Hardly any riches or worldly gain."

I have felt much like you. My levels of iman have often been low. But I understand that that doesn't disprove Islam.
Reply

The-Deist
01-23-2016, 04:29 PM
Originally Posted by Futuwwa
When King Gustav II Adolf went forth to intervene in the Thirty Years War, he was reportedly asked: "What would anyone gain by following you?". He replied: "Salvation, perhaps. Hardly any riches or worldly gain."

I have felt much like you. My levels of iman have often been low. But I understand that that doesn't disprove Islam.
Suomiiiiiii!!!
Reply

Scimitar
01-23-2016, 04:57 PM
Originally Posted by StrivingforDeen
You don't even know my family. Second of all you don't know me personally.
I know a coward when he writes. You're a weak puppy who needs molly coddling constantly.

Scimi
Reply

Seeker666
01-23-2016, 04:58 PM
Originally Posted by Ciara1127
I only have one more thing to say and that is that my God loves me (unconditionally) and he loves everyone else even when doing bad. And it's a little hard to comprehend because us humans aren't like that but it's true. Stay blessed my friend.
Something life changing I read in the bible.


Psalm 18:30
As for God, his way is perfect: The LORD's word is flawless; he shields all who take refuge in him.
2 Samuel 22:31
"As for God, his way is perfect: The LORD's word is flawless; he shields all who take refuge in him.
Proverbs 30:5
"Every word of God is flawless; he is a shield to those who take refuge in him.


If you seek the truth, Seek refuge in the Lord of Abraham Moses Samuel and David from Misguidance, from the devil, from his displeasure. Seeking refuge in the Lord is one of the most powerful prayer there is. Since I read this many many years ago, I have regularly seek refuge in the Lord from Misguidance. If your scripture is true anyone who sincerely asks for refuge in the Lord from misguidance will be guided.


Ironic though I hear Christians say the Lord is their refuge, I have never heard anyone actually ask the Lord for his refuge. In essence it is assuming that the Lord is their refuge without actually asking for it.


I would really be surprised if the bible is the word of God and those who seek refuge in the Lord are not protected by him. Ironically a large percentage of muslim prayers are actually seeking refuge in the Lord including the basic aauz which we do multiple times every day in each prayer. Pick up a muslim prayer book like hisnul muslim and see how many daily and other prayers there are which are explicit seeking refuge in the Lord.
Reply

The-Deist
01-23-2016, 05:02 PM
Originally Posted by Timi Scar
I know a coward when he writes. You're a weak puppy who needs molly coddling constantly.

Scimi
You seem to be talking from emotion aren't you?
Reply

Seeker666
01-23-2016, 05:07 PM
Originally Posted by StrivingforDeen
You seem to be talking from emotion aren't you?
Ignore the ridicule, If you are truly seeking you will inshallah find it. It may seem you will never find the answer but inshallah so long as you keep asking with humility you will find the truth. Took me decade, but then again this was before the internet.

regards
Reply

The-Deist
01-23-2016, 05:08 PM
Originally Posted by Seeker666
Ignore the ridicule, If you are truly seeking you will inshallah find it. It may seem you will never find the answer but inshallah so long as you keep asking with humility you will find the truth. Took me decade, but then again this was before the internet.

regards
Of course it doesn't affect me. I am not sure if Scimi has realised it.
Reply

Scimitar
01-23-2016, 07:21 PM
Yet you're emotional investment in your own troubles is somehow ignored lol ohkaay young one, I am wasting my time, confirmed.

Scimi
Reply

ReboundMuslimah
01-23-2016, 07:29 PM
:facepalm::facepalm: No comment!
Reply

Futuwwa
01-24-2016, 11:01 AM
Originally Posted by Timi Scar
I know a coward when he writes. You're a weak puppy who needs molly coddling constantly.

Scimi
And I know an armchair internet psychoanalyst when I see one.
Reply

Insaanah
01-24-2016, 01:10 PM
If you believe in One God, and you believe in the Prophets, then the foundation is all there. I'm not sure if you believe in Prophet Muhammad :saws: as a prophet and messenger and the last one. And whether you believe the Qur'an is a scripture sent by God to guide mankind. If you don't, please let us know, and we can try and explain. Perhaps you do, but you're expecting to feel some sort of emotional wave come over you, or some sign to happen, and then you can say, wow, this is it. I think it doesn't usually happen like that. The signs are all around...

Don't lose or reject Islam on the basis of a feeling or lack of a feeling. If you go to school, some days you don't feel like it. But you know, that it's for your own betterment. You learn things, knowledge and discipline, that will enable you to understand the world in a small way, and to give you a foundation to make something of yourself. Likewise, Islam is for your own benefit.

Say, "O mankind, the truth has come to you from your Lord, so whoever is guided is only guided for [the good of] his soul, and whoever goes astray only goes astray to the detriment of it.." (10:108 part)
Reply

Umm Malik
01-24-2016, 03:29 PM
i just open the book of allah to write a versses to you ... and my eyes see this ayah in this page ... so it may be a massage to you from allah
because you said you didn't have a mushaf . so i do it to as i did to myself one day ...


this is the translation of this ayat ...

( 1 ) Ha, Meem.

( 2 ) The revelation of the Book is from Allah, the Exalted in Might, the Wise.

( 3 ) Indeed, within the heavens and earth are signs for the believers.

( 4 ) And in the creation of yourselves and what He disperses of moving creatures are signs for people who are certain [in faith].

( 5 ) And [in] the alternation of night and day and [in] what Allah sends down from the sky of provision and gives life thereby to the earth after its lifelessness and [in His] directing of the winds are signs for a people who reason.

( 6 ) These are the verses of Allah which We recite to you in truth. Then in what statement after Allah and His verses will they believe?

( 7 ) Woe to every sinful liar

( 8 ) Who hears the verses of Allah recited to him, then persists arrogantly as if he had not heard them. So give him tidings of a painful punishment.

( 9 ) And when he knows anything of Our verses, he takes them in ridicule. Those will have a humiliating punishment.

( 10 ) Before them is Hell, and what they had earned will not avail them at all nor what they had taken besides Allah as allies. And they will have a great punishment.

( 11 ) This [Qur'an] is guidance. And those who have disbelieved in the verses of their Lord will have a painful punishment of foul nature.

( 12 ) It is Allah who subjected to you the sea so that ships may sail upon it by His command and that you may seek of His bounty; and perhaps you will be grateful.

( 13 ) And He has subjected to you whatever is in the heavens and whatever is on the earth - all from Him. Indeed in that are signs for a people who give thought.

this is the next page to complete the context of the ayat




( 14 ) Say, [O Muhammad], to those who have believed that they [should] forgive those who expect not the days of Allah so that He may recompense a people for what they used to earn.

( 15 ) Whoever does a good deed - it is for himself; and whoever does evil - it is against the self. Then to your Lord you will be returned.

( 16 ) And We did certainly give the Children of Israel the Scripture and judgement and prophethood, and We provided them with good things and preferred them over the worlds.

( 17 ) And We gave them clear proofs of the matter [of religion]. And they did not differ except after knowledge had come to them - out of jealous animosity between themselves. Indeed, your Lord will judge between them on the Day of Resurrection concerning that over which they used to differ.

( 18 ) Then We put you, [O Muhammad], on an ordained way concerning the matter [of religion]; so follow it and do not follow the inclinations of those who do not know.

( 19 ) Indeed, they will never avail you against Allah at all. And indeed, the wrongdoers are allies of one another; but Allah is the protector of the righteous.

( 20 ) This [Qur'an] is enlightenment for mankind and guidance and mercy for a people who are certain [in faith].

( 21 ) Or do those who commit evils think We will make them like those who have believed and done righteous deeds - [make them] equal in their life and their death? Evil is that which they judge.

( 22 ) And Allah created the heavens and earth in truth and so that every soul may be recompensed for what it has earned, and they will not be wronged.




please try to relies the massege from allah

(( We are most knowing of what they say, and you are not over them a tyrant. But remind by the Qur'an whoever fears My threat. ))




if you want to hear the surah and see the translating

may allah help you...
and guide you to the best .. amen
assalamo alaykoum wa rahmatu lahi wa barakatuhu
Reply

Seeker666
01-25-2016, 04:01 AM
Hi StivingforDeen,

This is a starting point for those agnostic about religion.
Supposing you only know there is there is some God (since you have figured out that part) and no other information about who or what he is
Thus you are with no information of which God may be the true god.
Consider the Following Statements.
If I say Worship A who is the true god. This statement may or may not be true..
If I say Worship B who is the true god. This statement may or may not be true..
if I say Worship John, the man who is the true god. This statement may or may not be true..
if I say Worship the Sun, the Star who is the true god. This statement may or may not be true..
However if I say Worship the creator the universe, who is the true God. That is a true statement! Since you are specifying God as he who created the universe and not a particular object person.
That is the true God and to worship him is the true religion.
God is specified exactly this way in the Quran including Surah Kahf.
Point is Muhammad SWAS came and basically told us to worship that God. Look the the mulsim prayers and duas, they apply on the creator of the universe. If you mean Allah to mean the creator, then Subhan Allah, Alhamdolillah, Allah o Akbar, La ilaha illalah, La huwal walquwata illah billah. Surah Fatheha. You list them, they are all completely valid prayers for the creator.
Ironically, even if quran was not divinely revealed and Muhammad SWAS was not a prophet, The message of Muhammad SWAS is still the true religion and islam is still the true religion of the monotheistic God.
If you want to explore all those specific Gods A, B etc there is no proof for their being deity including Jesus.
You are left with Judaism and Islam which can claim to worship the creator of the universe.
You can get salvation in Judaism as long as you are adhering to Noahs Noachide Laws. You don’t have to be Jewish. Thus a muslim as a muslim can get salvation according to Judiasm even if islam wrong religion since you can within the parameters of the Noachide Laws as a muslim. However, you cannot get salvation as a jew if islam is the true religion. Thus following islam is logically the right choice even if you did not know it to be true as compared to Judaism.
Lastly and the most critical thing is explore monotheism of all the Abrahamic religions. You will find that the safest monthiesm(ie. Where you associate God in less ways that the others) is islam. As an example, if you say you have to believe in Quality A to belong exclusively to God according to religion A but not to others. Now if religion A is right and then followers of the other religions will become polytheists in that quality. If religion A is wrong and God does not demand exclusivity in that quality, the you could not call the follower of A polytheists, however you could call them ignorant or fools.
Its safer to be a fool than a polytheist.
Belief in Islam is the obvious choice for anyone who believes in God.
Reply

Umm Abed
01-25-2016, 09:18 AM
Originally Posted by StrivingforDeen
Of course it doesn't affect me. I am not sure if Scimi has realised it.
Please dont leave the forum, and know that Scimi has the best interest in mind for you he just wants you to realize your mistake.
Reply

The-Deist
01-25-2016, 09:19 AM
I don't have any reason to stay.
Reply

Umm Abed
01-25-2016, 10:29 AM
Originally Posted by StrivingforDeen
I don't have any reason to stay.
Being on the forum is better than being lonely and lost out there.

Here you have company still.
Reply

The-Deist
01-25-2016, 11:46 AM
Lol wut?
Reply

InToTheRain
01-25-2016, 03:05 PM
It's not possible for someone who knows about the path of Mohammad(SAW) to walk another to get close to Allah Most High. So your love for God is and will remain one way. Only ignorance is an excuse but i'm afraid you are not ignorants hence if you remain on your path you know what your judgement will be tragic as it maybe.

I can only hope you come to your senses before your last breath on Earth.
Reply

The-Deist
01-25-2016, 03:24 PM
I am sure of God. But not as sure of religion.
Reply

InToTheRain
01-25-2016, 03:35 PM
Bro you never practiced enough to be sure, because a Muslim can apostate but a Mu'mins (True believers) never do. Had you practiced and remained patient maybe you would have had the proof you needed. But before even asking for proof how certain are you that even while you were a Muslim you were practicing Islam as you should have been?

It was Mukhtar Holland(RA) who reverted to Islam and upon reverting seeing the various devisions in Islam grew confused as to whether the specific path he walked was the right path to Allah Most High. He later saw a dream, a beatitude and Mohammad(SAW) was in it and all his doubt vanished. So proof isn't only acquired in the Physical realm but also the Metaphysical because the cognitions of the Soul and it's ability to infer is far greater.
Reply

Seeker666
01-25-2016, 04:00 PM
StrivingForDeen,

I am trying to figure out what your thought process is and what your standard of proof is.

How are you sure there is a God? and how are you sure God is one?

I can understand a rational thinker not to understand or know the evidence to disbelieve in something. But I cannot understand how a rational thinker who would reject something to believe in something else without substantial proof of the new thing.

You mentioned you were a Muslim and then you became christian. I can understand you leaving islam not knowing the proof or appreciating it. However, I am curious on what basis you could consider Christianity to be the true religion at that point in your life. I can understand believing blindly. I can understand leaving a religion too. But I want to understand on what bases you reject something for another.

I ask this question to better understand your thought process.

One thing you must very careful about is mixing your likes and dislikes with truth and falsehood. You dont want to believe or disbelieve in something because you like or dislike it. I am curious did you go towards Christianity due to a likes/dislikes at that stage?


Originally Posted by StrivingforDeen
I am sure of God. But not as sure of religion.
Reply

Insaanah
01-25-2016, 04:59 PM
Originally Posted by StrivingforDeen
I am sure of God. But not as sure of religion.
If you believe in God, do you believe that He is Most Just?

If so, would not part of His Justice be, that He lets humans know which way of life is better for them, and which way of life, which beliefs, way of worship etc, is acceptable to Him, rather than leaving them fumbling in the dark, guessing, trying to work it out?

And, if you don't agree He's Most Just, what makes you conclude that?

Peace.
Reply

The-Deist
01-25-2016, 05:10 PM
InToTheRain. I have prayed for qny Prophet or Messanger to show up in my dreams. Nothing happened. I am sure I was practising if I prayed five times a day qnd if I could in the Masjid.
Reply

The-Deist
01-25-2016, 05:12 PM
Seeker666. I am sure at that point in life I felt empty. So I just looked for a way out. That was love of Christ.
Reply

greenhill
01-25-2016, 05:33 PM
There is also the love of Muhammad (saw) for his ummah. That when Allah offered salams to him, he replied for all of us, not just for himself. His first ever meeting with Allah and WE WERE on his mind. "Assalamu'alaina wa'ala'aibadillahi soliheen" and we say it in our prayers daily. That's his love for us.

In his dying moments, he fretted for his ummah.

Follow his way.

Allahumma solli 'alaa Muhammad..


:peace:
Reply

crookedrib
01-25-2016, 11:06 PM
Bismillah


Innaa lillaahi wa Innaa ilayhi raaji'oon; Verily we belong to Allah and to him we shall return.


Wallaahi this has really shocked me. I came across your thread on UF and thought it was someone who hacked your account again. Akhi, you're StrivingforDeen, you're supposed to be STRIVING FOR THE DEEN. But then again, Allah guides whom he wills. A lot of people are saying you're just going through a phase, but this "phase" can cost you your aakhirah, which is TOTALLY NOT WORTH IT. I understand that you want to know the truth. I know that you want answers. But You can and you will (in shaa Allah) find these answers in Islam. You haven't even learned 1/10 of this religion yet you want to go and explore other ones.


I honestly don't get how you can go from Islam TO Christianity when the proof is right there in front of you in the Quran. Christianity is a lie. Go read Surat Maryam and Aali 'Imraan. What's also confusing is you believe in one God and all the prophets and messengers, and you're calling yourself agnostic? That doesn't make any sense.


Also, about loving other prophets more than Muhammad 'alayhissalaatu wassalaam. This man loved you BEFORE you were even born. You dont even know how much love he had for this ummah, for every muslim. How much pain and suffering he went through to spread the message LAA ILAAHA ILLA ALLAH. How much he cried and humiliated himself before Allah for no one but US. WE were his priority, he never stopped thinking about his people, asking Allah to forgive them and have mercy upon them. He is the only prophet who will intercede for his people on yawm al qiyamah, NO ONE but him in shaa Allah. "From amongst the tremendous favors Allah (swt) has granted our beloved Prophet Muhammad (peace and blessings be upon him) is the Major Intercession on the Day of Judgment. It is one of the blessings of distinction and excellence that is the mark of his excellence over the other Prophets and Messengers (peace be upon them all)." Allahumma salli 'ala habibina Muhammad.
Watch this - youtube.com/watch?v=0Y5h6n2b0Mk


You're lost, you don't know what you're doing. Shaytaan has got the better of you and is clearly leading you astray. BUT ITS NOT TOO LATE. Not until you die. You know this. I'm urging you to go back and re learn Islam, you need Allah, Allah doesn't need you.


I thank you for reminding me how blessed we are as muslims, to be honoured and gifted with Islam.
Allahumma yaa muqallibal quloob, thabbit quloobana 'ala deenik; O turner of the hearts, keep our hearts firm on your deen.


May Allah guide you back to the truth.



Reply

The-Deist
01-26-2016, 01:24 PM
I am waiting for true guidance. God knows how much of a dream person I am.
Reply

The-Deist
01-26-2016, 01:26 PM
But also the problem is dreams are not always reliable.
Reply

Kiro
01-26-2016, 01:35 PM
Originally Posted by StrivingforDeen
But also the problem is dreams are not always reliable.
Maybe its because the signs are right in front of you.
Reply

The-Deist
01-26-2016, 01:37 PM
Such as?
Reply

Kiro
01-26-2016, 01:48 PM
Originally Posted by StrivingforDeen
Such as?
Well other signs do you need? IF you know the signs of the Quran than what other signs do you need? Produce one chapter like the Quran and the shortest chapter in the Quran is 10 words with 40 rhetorical devices, no Human being can meet this challenge and hasn't done so in 1400 years ago. Many have tried but failed.

The best can only do product two - three rhetorical devices in just ten words yet the Quran has forty in its original language.

There are many miracles in the Quran and not just this.
Reply

crookedrib
01-26-2016, 05:27 PM
Originally Posted by StrivingforDeen
I am waiting for true guidance. God knows how much of a dream person I am.
Originally Posted by StrivingforDeen
But also the problem is dreams are not always reliable.
Exactly. Get down on your knees, put your forehead on the floor, cry out to your lord and ask him for guidance. Wallaahi you will find guidance if you truly are sincere. “And your Lord says: “Call on to Me; I will answer you.” (Quran 40:60).

Waiting for a dream is foolish. You will only see one if Allah wills.

Im sorry to make an assumption but by the looks of it, you're not really trying. Allahu 'Alam.
Reply

Seeker666
01-26-2016, 05:34 PM
I had intended to raise this point with you LOL

Originally Posted by StrivingforDeen
But also the problem is dreams are not always reliable.
Reply

Seeker666
01-26-2016, 05:38 PM
If there were 50 religions saying worship the creator alone, you would have a choice to make.

Since there are not, so it basically
1. Islam
2. Judiasm
3. Neither

Neither gets you nowhere.

Can you narrow down to at least these choices?

Originally Posted by StrivingforDeen
Such as?
Reply

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