Finding Iman?

[MisterK]

Hello,

I'm not 100% sure this is the correct sub-forum for this, but it does seem the most fitting. Apologies if it isn't, and apologies on the length, I've included a brief synopsis for those less inclined to read the full thing.

TL;DR version:
Lacking faith in most of the Six Pillars of Iman, attracted to societal/cultural aspects of Islam, currently an agnostic atheist and sense of reason won't let me believe despite emotionally wanting to. How can one go about creating faith when head and heart are clashing?

Full version:
Recently I've read the Holy Quran in English, and have been reading a book entitled "The Lawful and the Prohibited in Islam" by Islamic scholar Yusuf al-Qaradawi, and another called "The Essentials of the Islamic Faith" by M. Fethullah Gülen.

As I read the Holy Quran, the further into I moved, I could feel a sort of emotional attraction to it, and found myself liking most of the cultural laws. This attraction to Islam and how it is designed for charity, family, community, health, and so on continues to grow as I read the book by Qatadawi (which tends to draw its conclusions from the Holy Quran and thw Haddiths). Gülen's book is more about the spiritual aspects of Islam, and it too has a certain appeal (some of it reads as things I previously believed, just with Islamic terminology).

So I have all of these reasons to become Muslim, but despite these attractions, I'm lacking in one very important thing; belief in the Six Pillars of Iman.

I'm an agnostic atheist, and as much as I would like to beleive, I find my head and heart will not synchronize on this.

Of the pillars, belief in Al-Qadar is the easiest to obtain, as everything does seem to be preordained in one way or another. By that I mean the events of now are determined reactions based on past events, all the way to the beginning of time. Things happen as they do because as a result of what came before. If things were to happen differently it would be because of different past events. If I could find faith in Allah, it would be a no-brainer that it is all as He willed.

The next easiest is belief in His books and Messenges as the Holy Quran does seem to have some scientific understandings beyond its time, and fixes some of the hard-to-believe aspects of the earlier books (such as Jesus being a prophet, and not both God and God's Son). I'm sure there are arguments against these things, but it isn't difficult to see how the Holy Quran could be divinely revealed, and Prophet Muhammad as one chosen by Allah to be a messenger given how many verses of Holy Quran can be seen as revealing scientific truths ahead of their time.

This leaves belief in the Last Day, angels, and of course, Allah Himself as the trouble spots (so to speak) for me. Of course, if I found faith in Allah, I feel the rest would fall into place. Despite wanting to believe (I recall I was happier, more at peace, before I became an atheist), I have all of these arguments in my head that won't allow for it.

So, once having faith in the concepts of God, angelic forces, the afterlife, and so on, the question is, once lost, how can one go about finding their faith again, even as every bit of their reasoning abilities says that such faith is illogical and wrong?

[Arfa]

Brother,

Firstly,I hope you are able to overcome your doubts regarding logic part just as you stated.What do you think when you look at the Universe around you?Can you not believe in the massive system of the universe is being controlled by a Higher Power from the changing of night into day,the moon cycle to the heart beat inside human existence.It can't be all a coincidence!This whole concept is beyond human perception sometimes because we as Ummah of Prophet Muhammad (P B U H) have absolute faith in principles of Quran and Sunnah.I hope brother your emotional liking to Islam grows stronger and you are able to build faith in shaa Allah.

[muslimah_B]

Hello,

I'm not 100% sure this is the correct sub-forum for this, but it does seem the most fitting. Apologies if it isn't, and apologies on the length, I've included a brief synopsis for those less inclined to read the full thing.

TL;DR version:
Lacking faith in most of the Six Pillars of Iman, attracted to societal/cultural aspects of Islam, currently an agnostic atheist and sense of reason won't let me believe despite emotionally wanting to. How can one go about creating faith when head and heart are clashing?

Full version:
Recently I've read the Holy Quran in English, and have been reading a book entitled "The Lawful and the Prohibited in Islam" by Islamic scholar Yusuf al-Qaradawi, and another called "The Essentials of the Islamic Faith" by M. Fethullah Gülen.

As I read the Holy Quran, the further into I moved, I could feel a sort of emotional attraction to it, and found myself liking most of the cultural laws. This attraction to Islam and how it is designed for charity, family, community, health, and so on continues to grow as I read the book by Qatadawi (which tends to draw its conclusions from the Holy Quran and thw Haddiths). Gülen's book is more about the spiritual aspects of Islam, and it too has a certain appeal (some of it reads as things I previously believed, just with Islamic terminology).

So I have all of these reasons to become Muslim, but despite these attractions, I'm lacking in one very important thing; belief in the Six Pillars of Iman.

I'm an agnostic atheist, and as much as I would like to beleive, I find my head and heart will not synchronize on this.

Of the pillars, belief in Al-Qadar is the easiest to obtain, as everything does seem to be preordained in one way or another. By that I mean the events of now are determined reactions based on past events, all the way to the beginning of time. Things happen as they do because as a result of what came before. If things were to happen differently it would be because of different past events. If I could find faith in Allah, it would be a no-brainer that it is all as He willed.

The next easiest is belief in His books and Messenges as the Holy Quran does seem to have some scientific understandings beyond its time, and fixes some of the hard-to-believe aspects of the earlier books (such as Jesus being a prophet, and not both God and God's Son). I'm sure there are arguments against these things, but it isn't difficult to see how the Holy Quran could be divinely revealed, and Prophet Muhammad as one chosen by Allah to be a messenger given how many verses of Holy Quran can be seen as revealing scientific truths ahead of their time.

This leaves belief in the Last Day, angels, and of course, Allah Himself as the trouble spots (so to speak) for me. Of course, if I found faith in Allah, I feel the rest would fall into place. Despite wanting to believe (I recall I was happier, more at peace, before I became an atheist), I have all of these arguments in my head that won't allow for it.

So, once having faith in the concepts of God, angelic forces, the afterlife, and so on, the question is, once lost, how can one go about finding their faith again, even as every bit of their reasoning abilities says that such faith is illogical and wrong?

Well you are right that once you have faith in Allah that everything does just fall into place :)

If you sincerely want to believe then you can talk to Allah, and ask Allah to guide you to the truth and make your journey easy.

All of us at some point have days of doubt and low faith, this is human nature but having even the smallest amount of faith helps to keep us going and get back up.

I too once had those arguments within myself, but i just reminded myself of who Allah is, what Allah wants from me and why i believe, i understand how hard it is to once have believed in something totally different and lived the complete opposite life of how a muslim should, but believe me once you have your faith it gets better, you feel better and will realise you made the right decision no matter how much you went through to get there, it all becomes worth it

Il post some youtube videos for you that talk about who Allah is in sha Allah (God willing) they may help you and strengthen your faith

https://youtu.be/uu3-Gs11CBg

https://youtu.be/eKyWkl2LLPU

https://youtu.be/I3IJve0vN9g

https://youtu.be/Hjy9HHq4qoA

https://youtu.be/m_N__ufAT_4

https://youtu.be/5pyZkY93B2A

https://youtu.be/Hg4N4tzIVoY

https://youtu.be/H4cuSlWDh-w


If they help and/or you would like more then im more than happy to post more

[greenhill]

Welcome to the forum.

Nice summary.. so 3 things .. Allah, the angels and the last day..

Let's start with the last day... even without it being put in the text, our sciences have found that eventually there will be an end to earth (however far away it seems) so there will be a last day unless we find anothet suitable planet to live on..

His angels.. that is a bit harder and I am not inspired at this hour to give you anything to chew on this...but on Allah, He has left it to the mind and reason to 'see' His existence... without 'Showing' Himself, still billion over people believe.. again, not satisfying answer.. but you already see some truths in the message, it must be linked to Him. It can't be in existence without the Creator..

Wishing you a great stay.


:peace:

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[MisterK]

Brother,

Firstly,I hope you are able to overcome your doubts regarding logic part just as you stated.What do you think when you look at the Universe around you?Can you not believe in the massive system of the universe is being controlled by a Higher Power from the changing of night into day,the moon cycle to the heart beat inside human existence.It can't be all a coincidence!This whole concept is beyond human perception sometimes because we as Ummah of Prophet Muhammad (P B U H) have absolute faith in principles of Quran and Sunnah.I hope brother your emotional liking to Islam grows stronger and you are able to build faith in shaa Allah.

Arfa, thank you for your well wishes.

To answer your question, I can believe a singular Creator created everything, setting it in all into motion, and have done so in the past. However, as I dove more into science and scepticism, I lost my faith and now find it more likely that everything just is without any sort of guiding intelligence behind it. I know the odds seem unlikely on the surface, that something as complex as humanity and the society it created could happen by chances, but given how many billions of stars there are in the universe, how many planets around those stars, and how many moons around those planets, it seems not just probable, but likely, that life, even complex and advanced life, would occur under the right natural conditions.

I can't say for sure there isn't a guiding will behind it all, but as I learned more, I just became less and less likely to me.

[MisterK]

Well you are right that once you have faith in Allah that everything does just fall into place :)

If you sincerely want to believe then you can talk to Allah, and ask Allah to guide you to the truth and make your journey easy.

All of us at some point have days of doubt and low faith, this is human nature but having even the smallest amount of faith helps to keep us going and get back up.

I too once had those arguments within myself, but i just reminded myself of who Allah is, what Allah wants from me and why i believe, i understand how hard it is to once have believed in something totally different and lived the complete opposite life of how a muslim should, but believe me once you have your faith it gets better, you feel better and will realise you made the right decision no matter how much you went through to get there, it all becomes worth it

Il post some youtube videos for you that talk about who Allah is in sha Allah (God willing) they may help you and strengthen your faith

If they help and/or you would like more then im more than happy to post more

muslimah_B, I appreciate the video links. I'll watch them asap and let you know if they help me out. And while I know there have been atheists and sceptics and such that did eventually make their way to Islam, it is comforting to actually communicate with someone who had their doubts and such, and still found their way.

I do feel as though I sincerely want to believe. As for talking to Allah, would this require me to learn certain prayers or positions to do so? I'm not opposed to this if so, but as of right now, the only way I would know how to go about such a thing is basically just talking (sometimes out loud, sometimes mentally) to Allah (before it would be the concept of God I believed in before, which was everywhere and part of all things, speaking to the Universe, basically).

[MisterK]

Welcome to the forum.

Nice summary.. so 3 things .. Allah, the angels and the last day..

Let's start with the last day... even without it being put in the text, our sciences have found that eventually there will be an end to earth (however far away it seems) so there will be a last day unless we find anothet suitable planet to live on..

His angels.. that is a bit harder and I am not inspired at this hour to give you anything to chew on this...but on Allah, He has left it to the mind and reason to 'see' His existence... without 'Showing' Himself, still billion over people believe.. again, not satisfying answer.. but you already see some truths in the message, it must be linked to Him. It can't be in existence without the Creator..

Wishing you a great stay.


:peace:

Greenhill, thank you for the kind words.

Regarding the Last Day, I guess I should have better specified. I meant in the sense of a day of judgement, followed by life after death, and not simply and end of things. I fully understand and accept that at some point in time, the Earth will be no more. Even if life survives until that time, and nothing from space destroys us, the sun going supernova will take care of it.

Regarding your statement of Allah, I can easily see everything your saying, and I feel as though I could accept it all, if I could find my faith. My problem is I can see counter-arguments to what you've said, and so head/heart battle on. Thus far in life, typically, when my head and heart battle, my head usually wins out (for better or worse), even when I don't emotionally want it to.

That said, I plan to stick around here though, browse other threads and sub-forums, so maybe things I read on various discussions will help and reconcile the two.

[greenhill]

The head rules the heart. Then the body will follow..

:peace:

[Arfa]

I can sense brother maybe you are close to building your faith in Islam, which is why you are eager to stay here. I understand that as human beings we have our highs and lows, specially in our tough days when we long to believe in something, we need a stength, some spiritual power to support us and guide us through the tough ordeals of life, yet if our faith is low we just can't seem to believe in anything for that matter and worst even ourselves. So, Try reading Quran online with translation and you will get a fresh amount of wisdom from the Holy Book.If you do get inspired again after reading Quran, then you can talk to Allah about your thoughts and doubts,maybe your mind will be filled with positive beliefs about life and world. Do keep posting about your progress.

[muslimah_B]

muslimah_B, I appreciate the video links. I'll watch them asap and let you know if they help me out. And while I know there have been atheists and sceptics and such that did eventually make their way to Islam, it is comforting to actually communicate with someone who had their doubts and such, and still found their way.

I do feel as though I sincerely want to believe. As for talking to Allah, would this require me to learn certain prayers or positions to do so? I'm not opposed to this if so, but as of right now, the only way I would know how to go about such a thing is basically just talking (sometimes out loud, sometimes mentally) to Allah (before it would be the concept of God I believed in before, which was everywhere and part of all things, speaking to the Universe, basically).

Yes please do let me know if the videos helped you out in someway and if there are any other topics you would like.

No you wouldnt have to learn anything as of yet, as technically you arent muslim so the rules of prayer wont apply to you :)
But if you would like to, you could do wudu (the purifaction process before prayer) and then go into a position called "sujood" which is when your head is on the floor and you are the closest spiritually to Allah and everything is heard directly in the heavens :) and it is the best form of submission. (This is one of the best positions to make dua speak to Allah about our problems, Ask Allah for guidance, so maybe this could help you as it is also showing humbility towards Allah and recognition that Allah IS the creator of everything.

Here is how to do wudu -
In your head or heart make intention that you are purifying yourself to speak to Allah.
- say Bis-me-laah (if your sink is in a room with a toilet say it in your head only)
1. Wash your right hand up to your wrist 3 times
2. Wash your left hand up to your wrist 3 times
3. Cup water into your right hand and rinse your mouth 3 times
4. Cup water into your right hand and sniff gently water into your nose 3 times
5. Cup water into your right hand and wash your face 3 times from ear to ear and forhead to chin, if you have a beard also include this.
6. Using your left hand wash your right arm from the hand up to and including the elbow 3 times
7. Using your right hand wash your left arm from the hand up to and including the elbow 3 times
8.using both hands wipe over the top of your head down to the nape of your neck and also behind your ears
9.using left hand wash your right foot up to and including the ankle 3 times make sure to go inbetween the toes
10.using right hand wash your left foot up to and including the ankles 3 times make sure in between toes

Thats how we do wudu, ofcourse this isnt necessary for you, but after doing this you may feel different :)

Now for the prayer position of sujood :)
Your knees go onto the floor first, then your hands, then your nose, then your head, keep elbows off the floor (would be great if you was facing the kaba:)
Now your in the perfect position to speak to Allah and ritually clean, from here you can speak to Allah and ask him anything,for guidance, for understanding etc etc

^^^ should look like this.

As i said before you DONT have to do any of this BUT i can say myself from experience before i became a muslim doing all these things really helps, you begin to feel the connection inside, i cant really explain it, but you will understand if you try it and really put your heart into it and sincerely want to be guided.

The one turning point that set my heart and i just knew i had to become muslim, was when someone said to me, "if you was to die in the state your in right now without testifying faith youll die as a disbeliever not as a muslim" those words made my heart tremble with fear, as i was like you i still had so many questions, objections, doubts, but i knew i believed and i didn't want to die without faith, so that day later on i spoke with someone else and the devil came back to me and i was literally 50/50 so scared to declare faith with all these doubts that became even more heavy on me, i ended up crying as i was so confused and torn inside, when i spoke to that person they told me shaytan (the devil) would do anything to stop me becoming a muslim and all these doubts are from him, when i heard that i realised she was right, i ended up taking my shahada (testimony of faith) that very day :)
And any revert here will tell you that once you take your shahada you feel like a brand new person, you feel as though every single doubt, worry every bad thing in life that has happend to you is gone, the weight on your shoulders dissappears, it was like the best feeling in the world your so happy you cant stop crying :)

All those doubts that i had they never came back, with the logical doubts about angels & miricles, you wont fully understand untill you believe in Allah, you have to be able to get over the fact that there are things out there that we will never be able to see, touch, smell, or hear this is the argument alot of Atheists have, that if none of their senses can establish it being there then it isnt, right ?

But once you believe, you believe in Allah, youv never seen Him, nor heard Him directly, nor smelt or touched Him, but you still believe He exists and is the creator, because your heart knows this is true, this is what faith is, once that basis is there the angels, prophets, miricles all fall into place, because Allah is telling you they exist, that these things happend and when you have faith you believe everything Allah says and in your heart you know this to be true, you will know that Allah wants the best for you and everything that Allah says in the Quran to be truth, no matter how hard it is for our brains to comprehend, logically how can we comprehend Allah though, How can we comprehend God that created everything this entire universe from the biggest of planets, solar systems other galaxies black holes, the sun, the moon, the stars, earth from the biggest of mamals to the smallest of microbes, everything has its purpose, its movement, everything works so perfectly, we can never beging to imagine the power needed to do this as Allah is above anything that we can comprehend,
To even look at our bodies, bones, muscle, tendons, limbs, veins, arteries, organs, skin, mouth, nose, eyes, ears all so complex but yet so perfect.
Look at the water cycle, from land to sea, it evaporates back into the sky, condensates into clouds then it rains onto the earth, and the process repeats.. how simple yet perfect is this process :)
Look at nature, animals these are all signs of Allahs power, Allahs beautiful creations, everything in this world is a sign of Allahs power that we will never be able to understand but are in awe of :)

[MisterK]

Yes please do let me know if the videos helped you out in someway and if there are any other topics you would like.

No you wouldnt have to learn anything as of yet, as technically you arent muslim so the rules of prayer wont apply to you :)
But if you would like to, you could do wudu (the purifaction process before prayer) and then go into a position called "sujood" which is when your head is on the floor and you are the closest spiritually to Allah and everything is heard directly in the heavens :) and it is the best form of submission. (This is one of the best positions to make dua speak to Allah about our problems, Ask Allah for guidance, so maybe this could help you as it is also showing humbility towards Allah and recognition that Allah IS the creator of everything.

Here is how to do wudu -
In your head or heart make intention that you are purifying yourself to speak to Allah.
- say Bis-me-laah (if your sink is in a room with a toilet say it in your head only)
1. Wash your right hand up to your wrist 3 times
2. Wash your left hand up to your wrist 3 times
3. Cup water into your right hand and rinse your mouth 3 times
4. Cup water into your right hand and sniff gently water into your nose 3 times
5. Cup water into your right hand and wash your face 3 times from ear to ear and forhead to chin, if you have a beard also include this.
6. Using your left hand wash your right arm from the hand up to and including the elbow 3 times
7. Using your right hand wash your left arm from the hand up to and including the elbow 3 times
8.using both hands wipe over the top of your head down to the nape of your neck and also behind your ears
9.using left hand wash your right foot up to and including the ankle 3 times make sure to go inbetween the toes
10.using right hand wash your left foot up to and including the ankles 3 times make sure in between toes

Thats how we do wudu, ofcourse this isnt necessary for you, but after doing this you may feel different :)

Now for the prayer position of sujood :)
Your knees go onto the floor first, then your hands, then your nose, then your head, keep elbows off the floor (would be great if you was facing the kaba:)
Now your in the perfect position to speak to Allah and ritually clean, from here you can speak to Allah and ask him anything,for guidance, for understanding etc etc

^^^ should look like this.

As i said before you DONT have to do any of this BUT i can say myself from experience before i became a muslim doing all these things really helps, you begin to feel the connection inside, i cant really explain it, but you will understand if you try it and really put your heart into it and sincerely want to be guided.

I watched most of the videos so far, haven't had the time for the longer ones yet. The ones I have watched do a good job with explaining the nature of Allah. Thank you again.

Regarding Wudu, I went ahead and performed it. I figured if I was going to try and pray, I may as well do it right. I can say by the end of it, my mind was much more silent and focused than usual. The act of the ritual seemed to be great for centering, and definitely helps maintain focus in prayer. I then went to pray, utilizing sujood. It did have a feeling of... something I'm not quite sure of, more than any past praying has done. Afterwords, rising, I sat on my knees for a few moments in silence. The whole thing felt very solemn, centering, and peaceful.

Then I realized I hadn't been facing the Kaaba, found the direction, moved, went into sujood again, and basically apologized, as I had intended to face it while deciding to pray this way, but then it slipped my mind when I began. Same kneeling, silent aftermath.

The one turning point that set my heart and i just knew i had to become muslim, was when someone said to me, "if you was to die in the state your in right now without testifying faith youll die as a disbeliever not as a muslim" those words made my heart tremble with fear, as i was like you i still had so many questions, objections, doubts, but i knew i believed and i didn't want to die without faith, so that day later on i spoke with someone else and the devil came back to me and i was literally 50/50 so scared to declare faith with all these doubts that became even more heavy on me, i ended up crying as i was so confused and torn inside, when i spoke to that person they told me shaytan (the devil) would do anything to stop me becoming a muslim and all these doubts are from him, when i heard that i realised she was right, i ended up taking my shahada (testimony of faith) that very day :)
And any revert here will tell you that once you take your shahada you feel like a brand new person, you feel as though every single doubt, worry every bad thing in life that has happend to you is gone, the weight on your shoulders dissappears, it was like the best feeling in the world your so happy you cant stop crying :)

All those doubts that i had they never came back, with the logical doubts about angels & miricles, you wont fully understand untill you believe in Allah, you have to be able to get over the fact that there are things out there that we will never be able to see, touch, smell, or hear this is the argument alot of Atheists have, that if none of their senses can establish it being there then it isnt, right ?

I've always had a deep-seated fear of apocalyptic scenarios/judgement day type of things, I figure it is from having a Catholic upbringing. Guilt and feelings of doom are pretty common with that, it seems to be. That said, despite that fear, I now intellectually feel the ideas are far-fetched. And while there is always the notion of "If you don't believe and it is true, then you will be punished, but if I believe and it is wrong, I lose nothing" pops up time and again, I can't help but feel converting to any religion strictly out of fear of torment seems a dishonest reason to believe. If I believe, I want it to be born of genuine faith, and not outright fear.

I've also heard of stories of people who convert to a religion, and basically fake it until they make it. I also kind of find that a dishonest reason to convert. I can, clearly, understand the desire to become a member of a religious community, but as I said, I want to convert out of faith, not to hope I find my faith some day.

But once you believe, you believe in Allah, youv never seen Him, nor heard Him directly, nor smelt or touched Him, but you still believe He exists and is the creator, because your heart knows this is true, this is what faith is, once that basis is there the angels, prophets, miricles all fall into place, because Allah is telling you they exist, that these things happend and when you have faith you believe everything Allah says and in your heart you know this to be true, you will know that Allah wants the best for you and everything that Allah says in the Quran to be truth, no matter how hard it is for our brains to comprehend, logically how can we comprehend Allah though, How can we comprehend God that created everything this entire universe from the biggest of planets, solar systems other galaxies black holes, the sun, the moon, the stars, earth from the biggest of mamals to the smallest of microbes, everything has its purpose, its movement, everything works so perfectly, we can never beging to imagine the power needed to do this as Allah is above anything that we can comprehend,
To even look at our bodies, bones, muscle, tendons, limbs, veins, arteries, organs, skin, mouth, nose, eyes, ears all so complex but yet so perfect.
Look at the water cycle, from land to sea, it evaporates back into the sky, condensates into clouds then it rains onto the earth, and the process repeats.. how simple yet perfect is this process :)
Look at nature, animals these are all signs of Allahs power, Allahs beautiful creations, everything in this world is a sign of Allahs power that we will never be able to understand but are in awe of :)

I can understand this. I remember how I used to feel when I did have faith in a concept of God. I never had much faith, just fear, when I still considered myself Catholic, but eventually found a spiritual path that worked for me for a while. One day, all of my faith and spiritual views I had just disappeared in an instant after a particular moment. I went through a period of outright angry anti-theism for a while, before settling into a much more reasonable skeptical agnostic atheism. The rhetoric from the anti-theist crowd now tends to just get on my nerves more than anything else. Still, despite this transition, I can still recall that I was generally happier, more content, and felt a sense of purpose while being a believer. So getting back to a faith in God seems like it may be beneficial, and of the religions out there, having learned more about Islam, I feel like it would be the most fulfilling one. I know I've said some of this before in the thread, but this is all to get me back around to this next sentence. I hope I can find even a fraction of the faith in Allah that you've displayed here, as it sounds as though it brings with it a sense of peace and serenity.

[Umm Malik]

You told us that the most things you need to accept is the decree and the Angels and the last day
And those things are the unseen which Allah tells us about in surah albakarah
( 1 ) Alif, Lam, Meem.
( 2 ) This is the Book about which there is no doubt, a guidance for those conscious of Allah -
( 3 ) Who believe in the unseen, establish prayer, and spend out of what We have provided for them,
( 4 ) And who believe in what has been revealed to you, [O Muhammad], and what was revealed before you, and of the Hereafter they are certain [in faith].
( 5 ) Those are upon [right] guidance from their Lord, and it is those who are the successful.

And let's imagine if you have friend who ever been honest with you and never told you a lie .. if he tell you about something that you don't know like new invention for example ... will you belive him or no ??
And if somone in 1570 tell the People about speaking with another person from another place in the world with by making a vedio call and see them as he with .. will they belive ??
They won't ... but it happen and by the time we will see a things that we haven't think of before
The same for us ... on the coran we have a lot of proofs which make us sure that this the word of Allah .. and we have also in the lows of Islam and the commandment of God in the coran and sunnah which make our life beautiful and easy all this things led you to know that all this things are from the right one who knows what we need
And if you will be Muslim you won't need to ask about this proof because every thing in your life will proof to you that's my lord is exist and you will see him in everything since you belive him
The best thing will help you is to seek refuge with Allah from the whisper of shaytan(devil) and ask God for guidance and to let the things that you know that as a human being we can't understand all of it
You know for example that there is a microbes and you take a antibiotic when seek even you can't see it ... but because you see what the doctors know and how they make people good by them knowledge you trust them and you take as they told and if they say it have a problems or they invent another things better for you .. you will flow them advices , not because you see those microbes by your eyes ... but because you trust the doctors and you know that they know better than you
Flow your heart and accept your lord's call
And be close to him
Do as sayyiduna Salman have did to know the truth
And Allah says in his book (( And those who strive for Us - We will surely guide them to Our ways. And indeed, Allah is with the doers of good.)) 29:69
May Allah guide you
Life is short intrest in your Islam as you can don't let shaytan take you astray
And ask yourself why I want to live a religious life ? Your heart and your spirit want and your mind want another thing . But you know that not always our mind is correct and prefect

May Allah guide you

[muslimah_B]

I watched most of the videos so far, haven't had the time for the longer ones yet. The ones I have watched do a good job with explaining the nature of Allah. Thank you again.

Regarding Wudu, I went ahead and performed it. I figured if I was going to try and pray, I may as well do it right. I can say by the end of it, my mind was much more silent and focused than usual. The act of the ritual seemed to be great for centering, and definitely helps maintain focus in prayer. I then went to pray, utilizing sujood. It did have a feeling of... something I'm not quite sure of, more than any past praying has done. Afterwords, rising, I sat on my knees for a few moments in silence. The whole thing felt very solemn, centering, and peaceful.

Then I realized I hadn't been facing the Kaaba, found the direction, moved, went into sujood again, and basically apologized, as I had intended to face it while deciding to pray this way, but then it slipped my mind when I began. Same kneeling, silent aftermath.





I've always had a deep-seated fear of apocalyptic scenarios/judgement day type of things, I figure it is from having a Catholic upbringing. Guilt and feelings of doom are pretty common with that, it seems to be. That said, despite that fear, I now intellectually feel the ideas are far-fetched. And while there is always the notion of "If you don't believe and it is true, then you will be punished, but if I believe and it is wrong, I lose nothing" pops up time and again, I can't help but feel converting to any religion strictly out of fear of torment seems a dishonest reason to believe. If I believe, I want it to be born of genuine faith, and not outright fear.

I've also heard of stories of people who convert to a religion, and basically fake it until they make it. I also kind of find that a dishonest reason to convert. I can, clearly, understand the desire to become a member of a religious community, but as I said, I want to convert out of faith, not to hope I find my faith some day.




I can understand this. I remember how I used to feel when I did have faith in a concept of God. I never had much faith, just fear, when I still considered myself Catholic, but eventually found a spiritual path that worked for me for a while. One day, all of my faith and spiritual views I had just disappeared in an instant after a particular moment. I went through a period of outright angry anti-theism for a while, before settling into a much more reasonable skeptical agnostic atheism. The rhetoric from the anti-theist crowd now tends to just get on my nerves more than anything else. Still, despite this transition, I can still recall that I was generally happier, more content, and felt a sense of purpose while being a believer. So getting back to a faith in God seems like it may be beneficial, and of the religions out there, having learned more about Islam, I feel like it would be the most fulfilling one. I know I've said some of this before in the thread, but this is all to get me back around to this next sentence. I hope I can find even a fraction of the faith in Allah that you've displayed here, as it sounds as though it brings with it a sense of peace and serenity.

Its absolutely no problem, please do let me know if you would like any more videos with specific topics such as the othet areas your finding hard to accept ?

Yes that is exactly the feeling i was talking about after wudu & sujood :) though sujood is just one part of the entire prayer but it is very significant, and to me personally it has such a enormous calming effect on me, there have been many times when i would be so upset and when i just stayed in sujood and cryed letting it out, i began to feel better i didnt even have to say anything my heart just slowly began to feel at ease as though it had been hugged :) it honestly is such a beautiful experience when you are fully focused with no distractions

https://youtu.be/W9kTd7q1zjE

https://youtu.be/WKblG-Zoagk

Here are videos on how to do the FULL prayer if you would like to experience it and see how you feel :)

My mums side of the family were very strict catholics and i remember whenever i visited them i was forced to go church
I didn't really understand anything to be honest, mostly due to it being in spanish lol but i never really took to the idea of praying to a man, or another man telling me that i have to speak to him for God to hear me, or the whole idea of confession, i mean how can a man tell me that because i have "confessed" my sins im now forgiven, how does he know this lol that was just a few things that turned me away from catholicism & christianity,
i didnt feel connected to it, but i believed there was a "higher being" that created everything.
I will be honest at first i didnt take to Islam due to my objections which i can look back at and find absolutely silly lol, i was one of those ladies who prided on looking nice, and going out, so covering didnt appeal to me at all, neither did praying, or giving up smoking or drinking, it took nearly 2 years of someone to finally get me to read a pamphlet on women in Islam lol, but as i read it i became intrigued by it.
All the notions i had of Islam wasnt by muslims but by how others viewed it looking inside from the outside... at the time i was with someone muslim and not by my knowledge but i was actually doing these small things as a muslim does, such as eating with my right hand, washing after bathroom, eating halal, watching loads of Islamic stuff etc and slowly my heart started to soften to the idea of Islam and the whole idea of the day of judgement, jinns, angels, Allah, propehts, women covering etc .. it all started to make sense LOL
I went from someone who liked nice clothes & to look nice to someone who covered then to wearing Niqab (face veil), praying, fasting, doing Islamic classes etc Alhamdulilah (All praises are due to Allah)

In Islam the day of judgement is a very big deal and testifying faith is accepting this is true and believing in it... so think of it like this, in this life we are given free will to do anything we want, we can be good or evil.
so when we look at this world there is so much destruction, harm, oppression etc, so much evil in this world, now the day of judgement is the day where all these wrong will be put right by the supreme of All judges Allah himself, even the animals will be able to speak out against oppressors from people to other animals who may have acted unjust, they will be heard and Allah will judge accordingly.
Your own limbs will either speak for your defence or against you, even the Quran can testify to help save you (by learning and applying specific verses, they can save you from certain aspects of the grave & day of judgement) nobody will be able to lie and nobody will be treated unjustly at all, everyone will carry their own sins, except those who started a sin and people follow that sin
"Hadith*no: 203
Narrated / Authority Of:*Mundhir bin Jarir
that his father said: “The Messenger of Allah (saw) said: ‘Whoever introduces a good practice that is followed, he will receive its reward and a reward equivalent to that of those who follow it, without that detracting from their reward in the slightest. And whoever introduces a bad practice that is followed, he will receive its sin and a burden of sin equivalent to that of those who follow it, without that detracting from their burden in the slightest.’” (Sahih)

Fear is good, it keeps you away from sin, it works in your benefit, as muslims we should love & fear Allah so:- we love Allah so much that we do all these things to please Allah and make Allah happy & love us back, like how you love your mum so youll do things that make her happy as you love her, as you want her to be happy with you :)
Fearing Allah helps us stay away from sin, to fear the state we die in, if there was no fear then people would act out and do whatever they wanted with no fear of the consequences they bring. Like how you fear your mum scoulding you or punishing you, so you try your best to stay away from doing naughty things.
So honestly you need to love & fear Allah but also remember that Allah is so mercifull and His mercy outweighs his anger. :)

This life is basically a testing ground, to sift between the believers and dis-believers, who deserves jannah (heaven) & jahhanumm (hell)
To test those who say "i believe" whether they really mean it or if its just words.
So Allah puts us through tests, to break us to mould us into the better people we are meant to be, some people are destined a high place in heaven and in their current state they wont reach there yet, so we are pushed and tested to mould us to make us turn back to Allah, which in turn helps us be better and achieve that spot in heaven we are destined for.

So for most of us our true colours only come out when we are under pressure, when we are hungry when we go through traumatic situations,
how we handle & cope during these situations, do we turn to Allah or do we crumble, fall and blame Allah ? Or do we get up and turn back to Allah the one who created us to ask for help and patience & strength ?

An example would be diamonds, they are formed from emmense pressure & extremely high temperatures deep in the earth, then they form into these beautiful diamonds, so we can say that the emmense pressure and temperature is our tests/trials in order for us come out beautiful and better than before, in essence pushing us to be better and purify ourselves (of course only character wise :) )

Like honestly it may seem like a massive giant step, but it was the best decision iv ever made in my life, it made me the person who i am today, Islam gave me strength, it gave me meaning to life, peace inside when i call on Allah, its just a indescribeable feeling & experience when you become muslim, you begin to look at life different, all those things you once never thought were important and ignorable, they become meaningful to you. You have a different perspective on everything
That feeling you had when you done sujood, when you become muslim in sha Allah (God willing) that feeling will enhance sooooo much it will be priceless to you, it will mean everything to you when you need Allah and you do that sujood.

Dont allow the shaytan (devil) to build conflict in you, or make you doubt your beliefs, that is his job to cause mayhem & mischief & to stop you becoming a muslim, every doubt you had before you, will find them becoming more prominent, you will find yourself thinking more about these doubts than you usually did before, those logical thoughts will start eating away at you, and somehow you will begin to feel stupid that your believing in these things you will never be able to see, touch, hear or smell, once these things start happening, believe me that's shaytan doing everything he can to stop you declaring faith and becoming a muslim, you will then start to feel absolutely torn inside between these things, this is the point where you have to decide to believe in Allah or allow the shaytan to drag you down with him, in this instance say
" Ahhh-ooooo-dhhuuuu bee-la-he min-ash shaytan-ear raa-jeeem"
I seek refuge in Allah from the accursed shaytan.

Please do keep us posted on how its going and if you need any help or any more videos or any questions

May Allah open up your heart and guide you to Islam... ameen

(Sorry its so much to read i honestly dont know how to talk less LOL)

[MisterK]

You told us that the most things you need to accept is the decree and the Angels and the last day
And those things are the unseen which Allah tells us about in surah albakarah
( 1 ) Alif, Lam, Meem.
( 2 ) This is the Book about which there is no doubt, a guidance for those conscious of Allah -
( 3 ) Who believe in the unseen, establish prayer, and spend out of what We have provided for them,
( 4 ) And who believe in what has been revealed to you, [O Muhammad], and what was revealed before you, and of the Hereafter they are certain [in faith].
( 5 ) Those are upon [right] guidance from their Lord, and it is those who are the successful.

Yes, it is absolutely the Unseen that is my biggest problem. Though, as I continue to pray nightly, after performing wudu, I do feel a sort of connectedness and contentness. Of course, my skeptical mind says it is nothing more than what any form of meditation would do at most, and little more than the placebo effect at least. But, I'm working on it.

And let's imagine if you have friend who ever been honest with you and never told you a lie .. if he tell you about something that you don't know like new invention for example ... will you belive him or no ??

Truthfully, at best I'd take it as hearsay until I found out for myself. And the more fantastic the invention, the more skeptical I'd be.

And if somone in 1570 tell the People about speaking with another person from another place in the world with by making a vedio call and see them as he with .. will they belive ??
They won't ... but it happen and by the time we will see a things that we haven't think of before

True.

The same for us ... on the coran we have a lot of proofs which make us sure that this the word of Allah .. and we have also in the lows of Islam and the commandment of God in the coran and sunnah which make our life beautiful and easy all this things led you to know that all this things are from the right one who knows what we need
And if you will be Muslim you won't need to ask about this proof because every thing in your life will proof to you that's my lord is exist and you will see him in everything since you belive him
The best thing will help you is to seek refuge with Allah from the whisper of shaytan(devil) and ask God for guidance and to let the things that you know that as a human being we can't understand all of it

I am praying as though I accept Allah is true and real, even if my head doesn't fully accept yet. I figure if I'm going to pray and ask things and what not, pray from the heart, not the head.

You know for example that there is a microbes and you take a antibiotic when seek even you can't see it ... but because you see what the doctors know and how they make people good by them knowledge you trust them and you take as they told and if they say it have a problems or they invent another things better for you .. you will flow them advices , not because you see those microbes by your eyes ... but because you trust the doctors and you know that they know better than you

To be fair, on this one, while it is true I will take their advice as medical doctors and nurses and such will know more than me, I've also seen bacteria, worked with them, tested various antibiotics on them in lab, as well as other forms of microbial species. So on this, I know microbes exist, and know they can be treated (in most instances) in someway or another. And I can also read studies on new forms of treatment, new experiments and methodologies, and so on.

I do understand your point, though.

Flow your heart and accept your lord's call
And be close to him
Do as sayyiduna Salman have did to know the truth
And Allah says in his book (( And those who strive for Us - We will surely guide them to Our ways. And indeed, Allah is with the doers of good.)) 29:69
May Allah guide you
Life is short intrest in your Islam as you can don't let shaytan take you astray
And ask yourself why I want to live a religious life ? Your heart and your spirit want and your mind want another thing . But you know that not always our mind is correct and prefect

May Allah guide you

True, there have been times in my life where I probably should have listened to my heart more than my head. Missed opportunities, a lot of "what ifs?" and regret from not doing things my heart said do.

I do feel closer to deciding for certain than when I first posted here, but not quite there yet.

Thank you for your input, I very much appreciate it.

You told us that the most things you need to accept is the decree and the Angels and the last day
And those things are the unseen which Allah tells us about in surah albakarah
( 1 ) Alif, Lam, Meem.
( 2 ) This is the Book about which there is no doubt, a guidance for those conscious of Allah -
( 3 ) Who believe in the unseen, establish prayer, and spend out of what We have provided for them,
( 4 ) And who believe in what has been revealed to you, [O Muhammad], and what was revealed before you, and of the Hereafter they are certain [in faith].
( 5 ) Those are upon [right] guidance from their Lord, and it is those who are the successful.

And let's imagine if you have friend who ever been honest with you and never told you a lie .. if he tell you about something that you don't know like new invention for example ... will you belive him or no ??
And if somone in 1570 tell the People about speaking with another person from another place in the world with by making a vedio call and see them as he with .. will they belive ??
They won't ... but it happen and by the time we will see a things that we haven't think of before
The same for us ... on the coran we have a lot of proofs which make us sure that this the word of Allah .. and we have also in the lows of Islam and the commandment of God in the coran and sunnah which make our life beautiful and easy all this things led you to know that all this things are from the right one who knows what we need
And if you will be Muslim you won't need to ask about this proof because every thing in your life will proof to you that's my lord is exist and you will see him in everything since you belive him
The best thing will help you is to seek refuge with Allah from the whisper of shaytan(devil) and ask God for guidance and to let the things that you know that as a human being we can't understand all of it
You know for example that there is a microbes and you take a antibiotic when seek even you can't see it ... but because you see what the doctors know and how they make people good by them knowledge you trust them and you take as they told and if they say it have a problems or they invent another things better for you .. you will flow them advices , not because you see those microbes by your eyes ... but because you trust the doctors and you know that they know better than you
Flow your heart and accept your lord's call
And be close to him
Do as sayyiduna Salman have did to know the truth
And Allah says in his book (( And those who strive for Us - We will surely guide them to Our ways. And indeed, Allah is with the doers of good.)) 29:69
May Allah guide you
Life is short intrest in your Islam as you can don't let shaytan take you astray
And ask yourself why I want to live a religious life ? Your heart and your spirit want and your mind want another thing . But you know that not always our mind is correct and prefect

May Allah guide you

[Umm Malik]

Yes, it is absolutely the Unseen that is my biggest problem. Though, as I continue to pray nightly, after performing wudu, I do feel a sort of connectedness and contentness. Of course, my skeptical mind says it is nothing more than what any form of meditation would do at most, and little more than the placebo effect at least. But, I'm working on it.



Truthfully, at best I'd take it as hearsay until I found out for myself. And the more fantastic the invention, the more skeptical I'd be.



True.



I am praying as though I accept Allah is true and real, even if my head doesn't fully accept yet. I figure if I'm going to pray and ask things and what not, pray from the heart, not the head.



To be fair, on this one, while it is true I will take their advice as medical doctors and nurses and such will know more than me, I've also seen bacteria, worked with them, tested various antibiotics on them in lab, as well as other forms of microbial species. So on this, I know microbes exist, and know they can be treated (in most instances) in someway or another. And I can also read studies on new forms of treatment, new experiments and methodologies, and so on.

I do understand your point, though.



True, there have been times in my life where I probably should have listened to my heart more than my head. Missed opportunities, a lot of "what ifs?" and regret from not doing things my heart said do.

I do feel closer to deciding for certain than when I first posted here, but not quite there yet.

Thank you for your input, I very much appreciate it.

You are welcome brother ...may Allah guide us
And do know that all this effort that you are doing to know the truth .. it fruit will come for sure
Allah will guide just open your heart ( 69 ) And those who strive for Us - We will surely guide them to Our ways. And indeed, Allah is with the doers of good.

[abs]

I would give advice if I thought I was fit to do so.. However Yusha Evans (formerly Joshua evans) explains it perfectly in how he accepted Islam and his reasoning for it, I suggest it is worth watching brother! :) https://youtu.be/IYMKQKSV0bY

[MisterK]

Its absolutely no problem, please do let me know if you would like any more videos with specific topics such as the othet areas your finding hard to accept ?

Will do. I suppose another thing I've been wondering is must the Quran be taken entirely literally, as if 100% factual and true? This doesn't discount the divinity of it or the revelation of Muhammad, but there are some bits of it that also make it hard to believe if needed to be taken as literal (mostly things like the moon being its own light, the Earth being flat, that sort of thing, things which run counter to what is known).

Many Christians, for example, see much of the Bible as divinely inspired symboism, which (for them) reveals higher truths. Is this sort of view mirrored by any in Islam regarding the Quran?

Yes that is exactly the feeling i was talking about after wudu & sujood :) though sujood is just one part of the entire prayer but it is very significant, and to me personally it has such a enormous calming effect on me, there have been many times when i would be so upset and when i just stayed in sujood and cryed letting it out, i began to feel better i didnt even have to say anything my heart just slowly began to feel at ease as though it had been hugged :) it honestly is such a beautiful experience when you are fully focused with no distractions

Here are videos on how to do the FULL prayer if you would like to experience it and see how you feel :)

Thanks for the videos. I'll watch them as soon as I can. I should start learning them. Better to be prepared (just like I have the Shahada memorized {in Arabic and English} for if/when I'm ready to say it) for the potential future need of them.

My mums side of the family were very strict catholics and i remember whenever i visited them i was forced to go church
I didn't really understand anything to be honest, mostly due to it being in spanish lol but i never really took to the idea of praying to a man, or another man telling me that i have to speak to him for God to hear me, or the whole idea of confession, i mean how can a man tell me that because i have "confessed" my sins im now forgiven, how does he know this lol that was just a few things that turned me away from catholicism & christianity,
i didnt feel connected to it, but i believed there was a "higher being" that created everything.

Yeah, I've a lot of issues with Catholicism, a lot of them based around the politicking and power plays within it. I never once felt any real draw or connection to it, not in any good way, and definitely not like the pull I'm feeling towards Islam.

I will be honest at first i didnt take to Islam due to my objections which i can look back at and find absolutely silly lol, i was one of those ladies who prided on looking nice, and going out, so covering didnt appeal to me at all, neither did praying, or giving up smoking or drinking, it took nearly 2 years of someone to finally get me to read a pamphlet on women in Islam lol, but as i read it i became intrigued by it.
All the notions i had of Islam wasnt by muslims but by how others viewed it looking inside from the outside... at the time i was with someone muslim and not by my knowledge but i was actually doing these small things as a muslim does, such as eating with my right hand, washing after bathroom, eating halal, watching loads of Islamic stuff etc and slowly my heart started to soften to the idea of Islam and the whole idea of the day of judgement, jinns, angels, Allah, propehts, women covering etc .. it all started to make sense LOL
I went from someone who liked nice clothes & to look nice to someone who covered then to wearing Niqab (face veil), praying, fasting, doing Islamic classes etc Alhamdulilah (All praises are due to Allah)

For a good while I had a strong anti-theist kick, and had a pretty harsh view of Islam, but as with you, it was purely an outsider view. I've softened in many of my views as I've aged, but especially now, having read a translation of the Quran, it is pretty clear all the "GOTCHA!" verses that get thrown around to "prove" Islam as war-like, violent, sexist, etc, are typically use with no context associated, when, in fact, those verses have very specific context that doesn't mean what is being claimed.

Funny what even a cursory education on a subject can do.

In Islam the day of judgement is a very big deal and testifying faith is accepting this is true and believing in it... so think of it like this, in this life we are given free will to do anything we want, we can be good or evil.
so when we look at this world there is so much destruction, harm, oppression etc, so much evil in this world, now the day of judgement is the day where all these wrong will be put right by the supreme of All judges Allah himself, even the animals will be able to speak out against oppressors from people to other animals who may have acted unjust, they will be heard and Allah will judge accordingly.
Your own limbs will either speak for your defence or against you, even the Quran can testify to help save you (by learning and applying specific verses, they can save you from certain aspects of the grave & day of judgement) nobody will be able to lie and nobody will be treated unjustly at all, everyone will carry their own sins, except those who started a sin and people follow that sin
"Hadith*no: 203
Narrated / Authority Of:*Mundhir bin Jarir
that his father said: “The Messenger of Allah (saw) said: ‘Whoever introduces a good practice that is followed, he will receive its reward and a reward equivalent to that of those who follow it, without that detracting from their reward in the slightest. And whoever introduces a bad practice that is followed, he will receive its sin and a burden of sin equivalent to that of those who follow it, without that detracting from their burden in the slightest.’” (Sahih)

That's fair, and I like the Haddith you cited, as it persuades to do and promote good while equally disuading from doing and promoting the wrong. I still have to come to terms and find faith in Judgment Day, though.

QUOTE=muslimah_B;2916121]
Fear is good, it keeps you away from sin, it works in your benefit, as muslims we should love & fear Allah so:- we love Allah so much that we do all these things to please Allah and make Allah happy & love us back, like how you love your mum so youll do things that make her happy as you love her, as you want her to be happy with you :)
Fearing Allah helps us stay away from sin, to fear the state we die in, if there was no fear then people would act out and do whatever they wanted with no fear of the consequences they bring. Like how you fear your mum scoulding you or punishing you, so you try your best to stay away from doing naughty things.
So honestly you need to love & fear Allah but also remember that Allah is so mercifull and His mercy outweighs his anger. :) [/QUOTE]

I can understand that, but doing something entirely out of fear is, as I see, a terrible way to live. It is one thing to both love your mom and live in fear of doing wrong against her because of threat of punishment, but it is an entirely different thing to live in constant fear and only behave out of fear of abuse/punishment while harboring no love for the punisher.

It is the latter to which I refer in my previous comment, that worshipping and following any religion or tenet strictly from a place of fear seems wrong to me. And that sort of primal, gut-wrenching fear of doomsday prophecies and End Times/Day of Judgment (even if I don't currently have faith in such a thing happening) shouldn't be the sole reason to convert to anything, I feel.

This life is basically a testing ground, to sift between the believers and dis-believers, who deserves jannah (heaven) & jahhanumm (hell)
To test those who say "i believe" whether they really mean it or if its just words.
So Allah puts us through tests, to break us to mould us into the better people we are meant to be, some people are destined a high place in heaven and in their current state they wont reach there yet, so we are pushed and tested to mould us to make us turn back to Allah, which in turn helps us be better and achieve that spot in heaven we are destined for.

So for most of us our true colours only come out when we are under pressure, when we are hungry when we go through traumatic situations,
how we handle & cope during these situations, do we turn to Allah or do we crumble, fall and blame Allah ? Or do we get up and turn back to Allah the one who created us to ask for help and patience & strength ?

An example would be diamonds, they are formed from emmense pressure & extremely high temperatures deep in the earth, then they form into these beautiful diamonds, so we can say that the emmense pressure and temperature is our tests/trials in order for us come out beautiful and better than before, in essence pushing us to be better and purify ourselves (of course only character wise :) )

And I can understand this, and if I found my faith, accept it. But then, that's still part and parcel to my situation in general. Maybe all of this is a test from Allah, trying to guide me to Islam, but the skeptic in me says it's likely more a result of my longing for meaning and community and such. Nothing inherently says the two can't be related (Allah opening my mind to those missing things to lead me to Islam, for example), but my reason side, based what current knowledge and understanding of things says it's just me trying to fill a void with my life, not divine will of a Creator I haven't beleived in for years.

Like honestly it may seem like a massive giant step, but it was the best decision iv ever made in my life, it made me the person who i am today, Islam gave me strength, it gave me meaning to life, peace inside when i call on Allah, its just a indescribeable feeling & experience when you become muslim, you begin to look at life different, all those things you once never thought were important and ignorable, they become meaningful to you. You have a different perspective on everything
That feeling you had when you done sujood, when you become muslim in sha Allah (God willing) that feeling will enhance sooooo much it will be priceless to you, it will mean everything to you when you need Allah and you do that sujood.

Dont allow the shaytan (devil) to build conflict in you, or make you doubt your beliefs, that is his job to cause mayhem & mischief & to stop you becoming a muslim, every doubt you had before you, will find them becoming more prominent, you will find yourself thinking more about these doubts than you usually did before, those logical thoughts will start eating away at you, and somehow you will begin to feel stupid that your believing in these things you will never be able to see, touch, hear or smell, once these things start happening, believe me that's shaytan doing everything he can to stop you declaring faith and becoming a muslim, you will then start to feel absolutely torn inside between these things, this is the point where you have to decide to believe in Allah or allow the shaytan to drag you down with him, in this instance say
" Ahhh-ooooo-dhhuuuu bee-la-he min-ash shaytan-ear raa-jeeem"
I seek refuge in Allah from the accursed shaytan.

And, of course, being aware of this difference in my emotional vs intellectual self is, in itself, disruptive to my general peace and contendedness and mental well-being. Which, as you put it, would be an apt description of Allah or Shaytan as you decribed it.

The thing is, given my current beliefs vs everything I'm striving for per this thread, if I stayed strong in my beliefs, I'd not be here at all, given my skeptical agnosticism. It's more about reforming my beliefs more than it is about retaining them at this point.

Recently there was a point where I just said it wasn't going to happen, I was done. And then that actually made me feel a bit depressed and down, so here I am, still seaeching, still striving.

Please do keep us posted on how its going and if you need any help or any more videos or any questions

May Allah open up your heart and guide you to Islam... ameen

(Sorry its so much to read i honestly dont know how to talk less LOL)

Thank you. And no worries about the length, I've enjoyed any and all feedback and discussion so far. And really, the more personal insights given, the more that may inform my own quest.

[Search]

:bism: (In the Name of God, the Most Beneficent, the Most Merciful)

@MisterK

Hey, welcome to IB! I don't know how I missed this!

I used to be an atheist before I became Muslim; I'd love to be able to guide you through this process. Where exactly are you now in terms of your progress on believing in the unseen? If you need anything, feel free to write here or even we can PM if you'd find that more comfortable.

Wishing you awesomeness, and best wishes of course,

[MisterK]

I would give advice if I thought I was fit to do so.. However Yusha Evans (formerly Joshua evans) explains it perfectly in how he accepted Islam and his reasoning for it, I suggest it is worth watching brother! :)

Thanks, I'll be sure check out the video.

[MisterK]

:bism: (In the Name of God, the Most Beneficent, the Most Merciful)

MisterK

Hey, welcome to IB! I don't know how I missed this!

I used to be an atheist before I became Muslim; I'd love to be able to guide you through this process. Where exactly are you now in terms of your progress on believing in the unseen? If you need anything, feel free to write here or even we can PM if you'd find that more comfortable.

Wishing you awesomeness, and best wishes of course,

Thanks for the kind welcome.

It's pretty much all of the unseen I'm still trying to come to terms with accepting, intellectually, at least. I feel a draw to Islam, and very much find myself appreciating and accepting the cultural rules/laws, especially with their focus on family, community, charity, and health.

I still, intellectually, can't reconcile the faith aspects of Islam with my skeptical, logic-oriented mind, filled with the many vast and varied arguments against such things.

So, being a former athiest, how did you find your faith, if you don't mind me asking?

If you skype, you can find my Skype ID on my profile.

[madihakhan]

I am not able to guide you to the right path but I can see how other members are doing very well , masha Allah !

[Search]

:bism: (In the Name of God, the Most Beneficent, the Most Merciful)

Hey, no problem! Happy to have you here on IB!

So, honestly, there was no one life-altering moment that pushed me from atheism to Islam. It was all of the moments and experiences that had made up my life as a human being in totality that made my transition to Islam happen when I never expected it to so happen as an atheist. Of course, there are incidents and experiences that definitely stand out to me that I recall opening my mind and heart to the possibility of supernatural and then following that the existence of God and then subsequently Islam. So, it's like once incident built open the other without my awareness and led me to Islam as the Truth. What I'll tell you is that no two persons who come to Islam, even if they were former atheists, have the same experiences as every person is of course different and has led different lives.

From what you've revealed, however, the problem seems specifically the unseen. So, I'll specifically deal with the portion of my life when I'd started becoming fascinated with the unseen because maybe that might help. I think one shift was when I'd changed from a regular atheist to what I'd term was a "spiritual" atheist: I'd taken a yoga class which was fine initially and I'd only taken it because it was mandatory part of the liberal arts curriculum at our college. So, we had this yoga teacher give us a meditative/breathing exercise to help the body relax by focusing on different parts of our body and "soul" as we were lying down on our mats and I was of course skeptical of that working as I was a materialist. The first time I did it nothing happened. The second time I did it nothing happened. I was getting frustrated because to be honest the technique that he was talking us through doing in the class instead of relaxing me was stressing me out because I felt absolutely nothing and didn't understand why others seemed to be having a different experience than me and why I was the odd one out. So, the third time, I was doing the same thing and concentrating except something seemed to have changed this time because literally I felt a shift happen because I "connected" with the whatever ("soul") and I felt spiritually uplifted. I wasn't exactly sure what had had happened but something had, and I would from then onward try that technique in my dorm room whenever I felt stressed or to just relax - because it felt really good - so, why not. That was one experience or incident that I'd say opened my mind to the idea of something more, whatever that was, but I didn't frame it of course in my mind at that time as opening me to anything.

Also, ever since I was a child, I'd always had a fascination for ghost stories and stories of witchcraft and magicians and would tell my parents and relatives to tell me stories like that - I don't exactly know why, and I wouldn't really believe it but it sure made me check around the room before I slept at night. I don't think that fascination ever died - it was just lost in the business of life. So, in college, I was an anthropology major and had an opportunity to work with the Department Chair for an year-long independent study project in my junior year. I'd tried to think about what I'd love to study and incidentally my Department Chair herself recommended me to choose a topic on witchcraft as she herself was interested in this subject and wanted to pursue publication in this area. And I didn't oppose it because I remembered my old love for such. So, as I read different books and articles on the concept of witchcraft in different cultures, I realized something very peculiar: Witchcraft had real time effects on people and their lives, which I'd have said as an atheist is impossible because I'd have thought it's nonsense and I didn't believe in what I thought was superstition. But it turns out that I'd have been wrong because the data and anecdotes from different cultures were proving that something does/did happen. So, this opened my mind and heart to the existence of the supernatural, though again I wasn't in mind thinking these things but these things were subconsciously influencing me in a certain direction of which I think I myself had been not quite aware when it was happening.

And of course there are things in the background and in my life and also eventually my study of Islam that led me to become the Muslim I'm today (and that story is really for another day because I can tell this post is already too long!), but those things I haven't mentioned here specifically because they're not relevant to the specific problem you have mentioned with being unable to accept the unseen or still grappling with the notion of it. So, what I'd recommend you to do is for you to read the book E-Squared: Nine Do-It-Yourself Energy Experiments That Prove Your Thoughts Create Your Reality from either your local library or e-library database if you have access to it due to a library card. Now, the reason I recommend this book is because I think it will God-willing open your mind to realizing how consciousness works and open your mind and heart to the idea that consciousness influences the seen. While you're doing the experiments enumerated in the book, I'd also ask you to "talk" to God even if you have to do something like, "Hey, God, I don't know if you exist or not. But here I am wondering if you exist. I don't believe in the unseen. I feel foolish for even talking to you or doing this, but hey, if you exist, it's worth it, right? So, I was thinking please guide me to Yourself, God, if you exist with certainty and have me accept whatever's the true religion. Thank you." I mean of course you don't have to use the words that I did, but basically do it how you would do it, and then believe that if there is a God, God would guide you because presumably God does not reject someone's sincere request.

Also, again, I have given you the really abbreviated version here which doesn't encompass anything but a few incidents of my life dealing with me becoming more open-minded about the unseen. Fast forward, I have to say even after I'd started believing in Islam after studying the religion for some time, I hadn't actually taken that last step as a Muslim because I had been hit with last-minute doubts about God's existence despite everything that had led me to Islam, and I think that's very natural and especially for a person like me who's averse to changes and a bit of a rebel. So, I just kind of had to go back to the basics and rewind and be like, "Okay, so, it's x, y, z. And I know it. But how do I "think" of "God" when I had been so used to thinking of nothing?" Well, the way that I came to this answer is by asking someone close to me who was a theist, and the explanation was exactly what I needed to take that final plunge, and the explanation was, "God can be thought of as a Power with power over everything." Maybe it won't be a life-changing explanation for you but I think for me at that exact moment in time, it was exactly what I needed to hear because it made sense to me since I'd already investigated Islam and felt it was the Truth but I still needed to define in my mind what exactly was this "God" to whom I was going to be pledging my submission.

Wishing you much awesomeness, and please feel welcome to ask anything,

Thanks for the kind welcome.

It's pretty much all of the unseen I'm still trying to come to terms with accepting, intellectually, at least. I feel a draw to Islam, and very much find myself appreciating and accepting the cultural rules/laws, especially with their focus on family, community, charity, and health.

I still, intellectually, can't reconcile the faith aspects of Islam with my skeptical, logic-oriented mind, filled with the many vast and varied arguments against such things.

So, being a former athiest, how did you find your faith, if you don't mind me asking?

If you skype, you can find my Skype ID on my profile.

[MisterK]

:bism: (In the Name of God, the Most Beneficent, the Most Merciful)

Hey, no problem! Happy to have you here on IB!

So, honestly, there was no one life-altering moment that pushed me from atheism to Islam. It was all of the moments and experiences that had made up my life as a human being in totality that made my transition to Islam happen when I never expected it to so happen as an atheist. Of course, there are incidents and experiences that definitely stand out to me that I recall opening my mind and heart to the possibility of supernatural and then following that the existence of God and then subsequently Islam. So, it's like once incident built open the other without my awareness and led me to Islam as the Truth. What I'll tell you is that no two persons who come to Islam, even if they were former atheists, have the same experiences as every person is of course different and has led different lives.

I understand. I mean, my skepticism and agnostic atheism all grew from a series of moments and slowly progressed to what it is. Things kept building up, and eventually one piece of information tipped the scales, and my more pantheistic belief in God was just gone. Literally like a light switch flipped off and it just cut the power to my faith in an instant. So I wouldn't expect a journey to faith to be quick and easy, or be a single event (except, perhaps under an uncommon-but-extreme circumstance). And, of course, as you said, every person is different, so I wouldn't expect any one person's story to be exactly what I needed, it is more a matter of looking for perspective and insight from different heights and paths, basically.

From what you've revealed, however, the problem seems specifically the unseen. So, I'll specifically deal with the portion of my life when I'd started becoming fascinated with the unseen because maybe that might help. I think one shift was when I'd changed from a regular atheist to what I'd term was a "spiritual" atheist: I'd taken a yoga class which was fine initially and I'd only taken it because it was mandatory part of the liberal arts curriculum at our college. So, we had this yoga teacher give us a meditative/breathing exercise to help the body relax by focusing on different parts of our body and "soul" as we were lying down on our mats and I was of course skeptical of that working as I was a materialist. The first time I did it nothing happened. The second time I did it nothing happened. I was getting frustrated because to be honest the technique that he was talking us through doing in the class instead of relaxing me was stressing me out because I felt absolutely nothing and didn't understand why others seemed to be having a different experience than me and why I was the odd one out. So, the third time, I was doing the same thing and concentrating except something seemed to have changed this time because literally I felt a shift happen because I "connected" with the whatever ("soul") and I felt spiritually uplifted. I wasn't exactly sure what had had happened but something had, and I would from then onward try that technique in my dorm room whenever I felt stressed or to just relax - because it felt really good - so, why not. That was one experience or incident that I'd say opened my mind to the idea of something more, whatever that was, but I didn't frame it of course in my mind at that time as opening me to anything.

Another forum member here on this thread suggested to me to pray, and if I wished, to do so in sujood, following wudu. I've been doing so, and doing both, I can feel an emotional sort of peace and connection that somewhat fits with what you describe. However, because of my skeptic nature, I tend to attribute this to prayer basically equally meditation, which is in general a centering/grounding technique, and the effect being no different from any other form of focused meditation/ritual. It hasn't stopped me from continuing to practice this, however. I am having a difficult time separating what may be real vs just wishful thinking/placebo, basically.

Also, ever since I was a child, I'd always had a fascination for ghost stories and stories of witchcraft and magicians and would tell my parents and relatives to tell me stories like that - I don't exactly know why, and I wouldn't really believe it but it sure made me check around the room before I slept at night. I don't think that fascination ever died - it was just lost in the business of life. So, in college, I was an anthropology major and had an opportunity to work with the Department Chair for an year-long independent study project in my junior year. I'd tried to think about what I'd love to study and incidentally my Department Chair herself recommended me to choose a topic on witchcraft as she herself was interested in this subject and wanted to pursue publication in this area. And I didn't oppose it because I remembered my old love for such. So, as I read different books and articles on the concept of witchcraft in different cultures, I realized something very peculiar: Witchcraft had real time effects on people and their lives, which I'd have said as an atheist is impossible because I'd have thought it's nonsense and I didn't believe in what I thought was superstition. But it turns out that I'd have been wrong because the data and anecdotes from different cultures were proving that something does/did happen. So, this opened my mind and heart to the existence of the supernatural, though again I wasn't in mind thinking these things but these things were subconsciously influencing me in a certain direction of which I think I myself had been not quite aware when it was happening.

I've also been attracted to ghost stories, magic, and the supernatural in general, especially lore and stories on angelic forces, both in fiction and mythology. Some of my favourite shows/movies deal with supernatural and/or spiritual themes throughout them, even. At one point on my road to skeptical agnosticism, I even dabbled with Wicca and then more seriously got into the principles and practices of Shamanism (which led to the more pantheistic view of God I mentioned above). On this, my issue would be that anecdotes are typically the poorest form of data, and I see magic and rituals and such serving, at best, as a type of placebo effect. If someone thinks they are cursed, they see more negative things, and subconsciously self-sabotage their life. Someone thinks they're under a spell to bless them, they feel more confident, act more confident, etc. I'd like to point out I'm not trying to be antagonistic or argumentative, just stating where I am, and my thought processes.

And of course there are things in the background and in my life and also eventually my study of Islam that led me to become the Muslim I'm today (and that story is really for another day because I can tell this post is already too long!), but those things I haven't mentioned here specifically because they're not relevant to the specific problem you have mentioned with being unable to accept the unseen or still grappling with the notion of it. So, what I'd recommend you to do is for you to read the book E-Squared: Nine Do-It-Yourself Energy Experiments That Prove Your Thoughts Create Your Reality from either your local library or e-library database if you have access to it due to a library card. Now, the reason I recommend this book is because I think it will God-willing open your mind to realizing how consciousness works and open your mind and heart to the idea that consciousness influences the seen. While you're doing the experiments enumerated in the book, I'd also ask you to "talk" to God even if you have to do something like, "Hey, God, I don't know if you exist or not. But here I am wondering if you exist. I don't believe in the unseen. I feel foolish for even talking to you or doing this, but hey, if you exist, it's worth it, right? So, I was thinking please guide me to Yourself, God, if you exist with certainty and have me accept whatever's the true religion. Thank you." I mean of course you don't have to use the words that I did, but basically do it how you would do it, and then believe that if there is a God, God would guide you because presumably God does not reject someone's sincere request.

Browsing through the (digital) book, I can see a lot of the things being discussed, and how they are being discussed, is actually fairly similar to things I used to believe relating to energy, consciousness, and our ability to channel/manipulate/access it. I've even done energy manipulation experiments that allow me to "feel" energy in my hands. Had moments that seemed to have been, effectively, telepathic, but all of these can also be explained as placebo, coincidence, and the like. That said, I'll still go ahead and do that first 48hr experiment, as for the rest, I'm in the process of reading a few different books on Islam at the moment, so I'll check this book out more thoroughly when I can, and try to go into it open minded. As for talking to God, in the above mentioned prayers I've been doing, I've basically been doing what you described as part of it. My issue is, even if I received a direct, normally unquestionable response, it'd still get filtered through my skepticism and such, and probably get chalked up to, at best, coincidence or bias in thought and just seeing what I want to see. Again, not trying to be contrary or argumentative, just where I'm at intellectually, vs emotionally, which is clearly seeking/searching.

Also, again, I have given you the really abbreviated version here which doesn't encompass anything but a few incidents of my life dealing with me becoming more open-minded about the unseen. Fast forward, I have to say even after I'd started believing in Islam after studying the religion for some time, I hadn't actually taken that last step as a Muslim because I had been hit with last-minute doubts about God's existence despite everything that had led me to Islam, and I think that's very natural and especially for a person like me who's averse to changes and a bit of a rebel. So, I just kind of had to go back to the basics and rewind and be like, "Okay, so, it's x, y, z. And I know it. But how do I "think" of "God" when I had been so used to thinking of nothing?" Well, the way that I came to this answer is by asking someone close to me who was a theist, and the explanation was exactly what I needed to take that final plunge, and the explanation was, "God can be thought of as a Power with power over everything." Maybe it won't be a life-changing explanation for you but I think for me at that exact moment in time, it was exactly what I needed to hear because it made sense to me since I'd already investigated Islam and felt it was the Truth but I still needed to define in my mind what exactly was this "God" to whom I was going to be pledging my submission.

Wishing you much awesomeness, and please feel welcome to ask anything,

My most recent view of God, prior to my agnostic atheism, was pretty much as you friend described. An infinite, sentient (though on a level far beyond our level of sentience), power/energy through which, and from which, all things flowed and came from, which, by default of all things born of it, it also had power over. Effectively I was giving sentience/godhood to the universe itself (hence the pantheism). Nothing that existed was separate from the universe/God, all things came from the same source (energy/God), that sort of thing. It is interesting to me, based on this limited recital of events you've given at least, the reverse parallels I see between us. What led you to theism seems to be similar to the journey that led me to my agnosticism. Now, my heart wants to find faith again, but my head is simply wagging it's finger going, "Nope." And this is even while knowing people much smarter than I, much more logical than I, have faith and/or religion, so I know, despite my own misgivings and arguments against such things, intelligence and logic aren't inherently contrary to such things by any means (I say this like this as, thinking back over the thread, I realise some of what I've said may have come across as, perhaps, patronising or some such, which it was not ever intended to if any of it did), so it seems it is just a matter of seeing the journey through to its end, wherever it may take me.

Thank your for your post, though it does leave me curious about your path to Islam. You've given some basics on how you came to accept the unseen, but what was it that brought to belief in the unseen as set out by Islam?

[muslimah_B]

Will do. I suppose another thing I've been wondering is must the Quran be taken entirely literally, as if 100% factual and true? This doesn't discount the divinity of it or the revelation of Muhammad, but there are some bits of it that also make it hard to believe if needed to be taken as literal (mostly things like the moon being its own light, the Earth being flat, that sort of thing, things which run counter to what is known).

Yes the Quran is meant to be taken as 100% true, but not everything in the Quran is meant to be taken in "literal" there are many metaphorical instances, hypothetical questions, similes for easier to understand comparisons, this is where it comes upon us to learn the Quran Tasfeer from a knowledgeable person, and also having a good command of the arabic language helps to understand how the verses should be interpreted and what the meaning behind it is.

eg1. "O Iblees, what prevented you from prostrating to that which I created with My hands? Were you arrogant [then], or were you [already] among the haughty?" (surah saad : 75)
"Do they not see that We have created for them from what Our hands have made, grazing livestock, and [then] they are their owners?" Surah Yaseen: 71)

so here in these verses Allah is saying He has a hand like us, BUT we don't know if this is metaphorical, or figurative, as Allah is above and beyond us in everything, we can't we can't understand a unlimited being as we are limited beings, we won't know what Allah looks like until we get to Jannah (heaven) in sha Allah (If God wills), so in these types of verses, we leave it as we just don't know.

as for the verses of the earth being flat, here are some answers explaining them (they do a much better job than me lol) https://islamqa.info/en/118698 and https://islamqa.info/en/211655 it basically explains that the earth is indeed round and no scholar disagrees with this, but our perspective of the earth is flat as in to walk on as earth is so massive (but please do read the two links i posted for a better detailed answer.)

Many Christians, for example, see much of the Bible as divinely inspired symboism, which (for them) reveals higher truths. Is this sort of view mirrored by any in Islam regarding the Quran?
Thanks for the videos. I'll watch them as soon as I can. I should start learning them. Better to be prepared (just like I have the Shahada memorized {in Arabic and English} for if/when I'm ready to say it) for the potential future need of them.

Yeah, I've a lot of issues with Catholicism, a lot of them based around the politicking and power plays within it. I never once felt any real draw or connection to it, not in any good way, and definitely not like the pull I'm feeling towards Islam.

i wouldn't say there is any symbolism in Islam or that defines Islam, it more focuses on our connection with the Quran as a guidance for all of mankind, sure we have calligraphy, the colours white & green are mentioned a lot but it doesn't necessarily "inspire" or make them symbols of our religion. the Quran is meant to inspire us, teach us, guide us, its meant to be held in such a high regard as its the direct words of Allah with no alterations etc.

already have the shahada memorised thats a brilliant sign :) just let go of your doubts and say it already :)

For a good while I had a strong anti-theist kick, and had a pretty harsh view of Islam, but as with you, it was purely an outsider view. I've softened in many of my views as I've aged, but especially now, having read a translation of the Quran, it is pretty clear all the "GOTCHA!" verses that get thrown around to "prove" Islam as war-like, violent, sexist, etc, are typically use with no context associated, when, in fact, those verses have very specific context that doesn't mean what is being claimed.

Funny what even a cursory education on a subject can do.

yes that is exactly why we can't cherry pick verses, without having a full understanding of what the verses was referring to, and if there was a specific time the verses was revealed, exactly like all verses about killing, which where all revealed during times of war, and we all know Islam is not a pacifist region and gives us every right to defend ourselves whilst also giving strict laws with regard to this.

That's fair, and I like the Haddith you cited, as it persuades to do and promote good while equally disuading from doing and promoting the wrong. I still have to come to terms and find faith in Judgment Day, though.

ok what do you think happens when we die ? and what do you think happens to all the bad people in this world who die without being punished or having justice done for those they harmed, oppressed, killed ?
do you believe in heaven and hell ?

I can understand that, but doing something entirely out of fear is, as I see, a terrible way to live. It is one thing to both love your mom and live in fear of doing wrong against her because of threat of punishment, but it is an entirely different thing to live in constant fear and only behave out of fear of abuse/punishment while harboring no love for the punisher.

It is the latter to which I refer in my previous comment, that worshipping and following any religion or tenet strictly from a place of fear seems wrong to me. And that sort of primal, gut-wrenching fear of doomsday prophecies and End Times/Day of Judgment (even if I don't currently have faith in such a thing happening) shouldn't be the sole reason to convert to anything, I feel.

what i mean by this is that we have to find a balance between fear and love of Allah, fear enough to not commit sins, love enough to do things that are pleasing to Allah like giving charity, being kind to your parents, helping people, visiting the sick.
fear stops you doing bad things as your scared of being punished, but love makes you do extra things to prove your love for that person, so lets look at it this way. You say you love Allah so how do you prove it ? By sacrificing certain things right, by going above and beyond, by going out of your way, now fear would just keep you doing the bare minimum to stay out of the way of being punished, but the love pushes you even further to prove yourself (voluntary prayers, giving charity randomly, always thanking Allah)
patience can be from both fear and love e.g., you show patience through a trial as your scared of committing a sin and loosing the mercy of Allah, you would be patient because Allah loves those who are patient, and you want to be loved by Allah, so you would try and find the middle and be patient from fear of loosing mercy but also wanting Allah to be pleased with you
i hope this makes sense now :)

And I can understand this, and if I found my faith, accept it. But then, that's still part and parcel to my situation in general. Maybe all of this is a test from Allah, trying to guide me to Islam, but the skeptic in me says it's likely more a result of my longing for meaning and community and such. Nothing inherently says the two can't be related (Allah opening my mind to those missing things to lead me to Islam, for example), but my reason side, based what current knowledge and understanding of things says it's just me trying to fill a void with my life, not divine will of a Creator I haven't beleived in for years.



And, of course, being aware of this difference in my emotional vs intellectual self is, in itself, disruptive to my general peace and contendedness and mental well-being. Which, as you put it, would be an apt description of Allah or Shaytan as you decribed it.

The thing is, given my current beliefs vs everything I'm striving for per this thread, if I stayed strong in my beliefs, I'd not be here at all, given my skeptical agnosticism. It's more about reforming my beliefs more than it is about retaining them at this point.

Recently there was a point where I just said it wasn't going to happen, I was done. And then that actually made me feel a bit depressed and down, so here I am, still seaeching, still striving.



Thank you. And no worries about the length, I've enjoyed any and all feedback and discussion so far. And really, the more personal insights given, the more that may inform my own quest.

like i said before its the tricks of shaytan, he will pull you away from Islam anyway he can, he will continue to make your doubts overpower you if you let them, you have to be strong and find your faith and hold onto it with everything you have.

This is what happened to me with my doubts of the unseen, covering, prophets etc, all of this of course screamed against my logical thinking, that if i can't see, touch, smell, hear, taste then it doesn't exist, and as my journey to Islam became more prominent the more these doubts would creep up on me more and more everyday, but what i done which helped me was i researched on every topic i had doubts on and asked other muslims to explain to me these issues, as i kept defeating these doubts they would slowly begin to be background noise so to to speak, they stopped having such a prominent effect on me and my heart began to accept Islam as the truth no matter how "far fetched" some of it may seem to people who don't believe or have faith

you have to say to yourself "if i can believe in God/Allah which i can't see, touch, hear, smell then why can i not believe that He created other things that i won't be able to see, touch, hear, smell" we as humans have this thing where we always have to try to understand everything, we always have to have a logical explanation to everything, we have to know anything and everything, BUT we can't we are limited, Allah is unlimited beyond comprehension, beyond understanding, and there will be things that we will never have the answer to, why can't we understand that and be humble to the fact we are NOT the most intelligent beings, yes we have intelligence & intellect but it is limited. so it comes to it as if you believe in Allah this is faith, and when you read the Quran this is Allah speaking to us, Allah tells us that there will be things we won't understand and we can't

“Say: “None in the heavens and the earth knows the Ghaib (Unseen) except Allaah, nor can they perceive when they shall be resurrected”[al-Naml 27:65]

“And with Him are the keys of the Ghayb (all that is hidden), none knows them but He. And He knows whatever there is in the land and in the sea; not a leaf falls, but He knows it. There is not a grain in the darkness of the earth nor anything fresh or dry, but is written in a Clear Record” [al-An’aam 6:59]
“Verily, Allaah, with Him (Alone) is the knowledge of the Hour, He sends down the rain, and knows that which is in the wombs. No person knows what he will earn tomorrow, and no person knows in what land he will die. Verily, Allaah is All‑Knower, All‑Aware (of things)”[Luqmaan 31:34]

““(He Alone is) the All‑Knower of the Ghayb (Unseen), and He reveals to none His Ghayb (Unseen)” [al-Jinn 72:26].

"Has he knowledge of the unseen (ghayb) so he can see [the future]?" (53.35)

"Say [O Muhammad!]: “I do not say to you that I have the treasures of Allah nor that I know the unseen (ghayb). And I do not say to you that I am an angel. I only follow what is revealed to me.” Say [O Muhammad!]: “Are the blind and the seeing equal? Do you not think?” (6.50)"Say [O Muhammad!]: “I cannot control any benefit or harm for myself save what Allah wills. Had I known the unseen (ghayb), I would have revelled in good and no harm would have touched me. I am only a warner and announcer of good news for people who believe.” (7.188)

i remember there was always this argument towards people who believe in God by those with no faith at all "prove to me God exists with logic" the person who believed in God would say to them "prove to me God doesn't exist with facts" and this will carry on until the end of time lol

i saw you was into ghost stories and stuff... so am i LOL i still haven't stopped, black magic, curses possession are all possible in Islam, if your interested you can look into this creation called "jinns" another part of the "unseen" a creation before us thats made of smokeless fire, we can't see them, but they can see us, they would be as you describe ghosts except they are not souls of people who have passed away
here is one video if you like then i can post more

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nKuSnFcufkE

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-m7twsfowzg

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SdMvJrvzzWk

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zVJyVVj6ZII

[MisterK]

Yes the Quran is meant to be taken as 100% true, but not everything in the Quran is meant to be taken in "literal" there are many metaphorical instances, hypothetical questions, similes for easier to understand comparisons, this is where it comes upon us to learn the Quran Tasfeer from a knowledgeable person, and also having a good command of the arabic language helps to understand how the verses should be interpreted and what the meaning behind it is.

eg1. "O Iblees, what prevented you from prostrating to that which I created with My hands? Were you arrogant [then], or were you [already] among the haughty?" (surah saad : 75)
"Do they not see that We have created for them from what Our hands have made, grazing livestock, and [then] they are their owners?" Surah Yaseen: 71)

so here in these verses Allah is saying He has a hand like us, BUT we don't know if this is metaphorical, or figurative, as Allah is above and beyond us in everything, we can't we can't understand a unlimited being as we are limited beings, we won't know what Allah looks like until we get to Jannah (heaven) in sha Allah (If God wills), so in these types of verses, we leave it as we just don't know.

as for the verses of the earth being flat, here are some answers explaining them (they do a much better job than me lol) it basically explains that the earth is indeed round and no scholar disagrees with this, but our perspective of the earth is flat as in to walk on as earth is so massive (but please do read the two links i posted for a better detailed answer.)

Okay, that helps clear some things up, then. I know I have a lot more research and studying to do on the matter, but if the Quran was meant to be taken absolutely literal, I don't think I'd be able to do that. Good to know that isn't the case. The links are also useful, thanks.

i wouldn't say there is any symbolism in Islam or that defines Islam, it more focuses on our connection with the Quran as a guidance for all of mankind, sure we have calligraphy, the colours white & green are mentioned a lot but it doesn't necessarily "inspire" or make them symbols of our religion. the Quran is meant to inspire us, teach us, guide us, its meant to be held in such a high regard as its the direct words of Allah with no alterations etc.

Understood, but not quite what I meant. I meant how some Christians accept the Bible as being a divine book, but the stories are symbolic and allegorical, not necessarily meant as having happened, but tales told to relate divine truths (as they see it). Such as, for example, a Christian who believes Noah's story is more a parable than historical. Or how in Judaism, more and more Rabbi's seem to be saying that the Exodus is a story designed to deliver a message/point/purpose, and isn't actually a historical fact. That's what I meant by symbolic.

already have the shahada memorised thats a brilliant sign :) just let go of your doubts and say it already :)

Well, I could, but again, if I do it, I want it done with faith, not hoping I'll find it after the fact.

ok what do you think happens when we die ? and what do you think happens to all the bad people in this world who die without being punished or having justice done for those they harmed, oppressed, killed ?
do you believe in heaven and hell ?

Basically, I think, regardless of good or bad, our bodies die, our consciousness ends with our brain function, our bodies decompose and the natural cycle continues. Lights go out, and you stop existing except as memories and such, or whatever the legacy you may have left behind is. If you were a terrible person, you probably left behind a terrible legacy. No heaven, no hell, and justice, whatever one's concept of it may be, happens in this world, or not at all.

what i mean by this is that we have to find a balance between fear and love of Allah, fear enough to not commit sins, love enough to do things that are pleasing to Allah like giving charity, being kind to your parents, helping people, visiting the sick.
fear stops you doing bad things as your scared of being punished, but love makes you do extra things to prove your love for that person, so lets look at it this way. You say you love Allah so how do you prove it ? By sacrificing certain things right, by going above and beyond, by going out of your way, now fear would just keep you doing the bare minimum to stay out of the way of being punished, but the love pushes you even further to prove yourself (voluntary prayers, giving charity randomly, always thanking Allah)
patience can be from both fear and love e.g., you show patience through a trial as your scared of committing a sin and loosing the mercy of Allah, you would be patient because Allah loves those who are patient, and you want to be loved by Allah, so you would try and find the middle and be patient from fear of loosing mercy but also wanting Allah to be pleased with you
i hope this makes sense now :)

Sorry if I wasn't clear, I understood your point, but I meant despite my primal fear of Judgement Day scenarios, fear alone isn't a reason to worship anything, in my opinion. One does need, at least, that balance you mention.

like i said before its the tricks of shaytan, he will pull you away from Islam anyway he can, he will continue to make your doubts overpower you if you let them, you have to be strong and find your faith and hold onto it with everything you have.

Belief in Shaytan may be even more difficult than a faith in Allah for me, actually. Before being an atheist, I had a belief in my concept of God, but hadn't believed in any sort of devil figure for quite a long while. The existence of such a being just seemed sort of contradictory to me, if God is, in fact, all loving and all good (as I had believed). Ultimately, that said, it all goes back to faith, which, as we well know, is my struggle here.

This is what happened to me with my doubts of the unseen, covering, prophets etc, all of this of course screamed against my logical thinking, that if i can't see, touch, smell, hear, taste then it doesn't exist, and as my journey to Islam became more prominent the more these doubts would creep up on me more and more everyday, but what i done which helped me was i researched on every topic i had doubts on and asked other muslims to explain to me these issues, as i kept defeating these doubts they would slowly begin to be background noise so to to speak, they stopped having such a prominent effect on me and my heart began to accept Islam as the truth no matter how "far fetched" some of it may seem to people who don't believe or have faith

you have to say to yourself "if i can believe in God/Allah which i can't see, touch, hear, smell then why can i not believe that He created other things that i won't be able to see, touch, hear, smell" we as humans have this thing where we always have to try to understand everything, we always have to have a logical explanation to everything, we have to know anything and everything, BUT we can't we are limited, Allah is unlimited beyond comprehension, beyond understanding, and there will be things that we will never have the answer to, why can't we understand that and be humble to the fact we are NOT the most intelligent beings, yes we have intelligence & intellect but it is limited. so it comes to it as if you believe in Allah this is faith, and when you read the Quran this is Allah speaking to us, Allah tells us that there will be things we won't understand and we can't

“Say: “None in the heavens and the earth knows the Ghaib (Unseen) except Allaah, nor can they perceive when they shall be resurrected”[al-Naml 27:65]

“And with Him are the keys of the Ghayb (all that is hidden), none knows them but He. And He knows whatever there is in the land and in the sea; not a leaf falls, but He knows it. There is not a grain in the darkness of the earth nor anything fresh or dry, but is written in a Clear Record” [al-An’aam 6:59]
“Verily, Allaah, with Him (Alone) is the knowledge of the Hour, He sends down the rain, and knows that which is in the wombs. No person knows what he will earn tomorrow, and no person knows in what land he will die. Verily, Allaah is All‑Knower, All‑Aware (of things)”[Luqmaan 31:34]

““(He Alone is) the All‑Knower of the Ghayb (Unseen), and He reveals to none His Ghayb (Unseen)” [al-Jinn 72:26].

"Has he knowledge of the unseen (ghayb) so he can see [the future]?" (53.35)

"Say [O Muhammad!]: “I do not say to you that I have the treasures of Allah nor that I know the unseen (ghayb). And I do not say to you that I am an angel. I only follow what is revealed to me.” Say [O Muhammad!]: “Are the blind and the seeing equal? Do you not think?” (6.50)"Say [O Muhammad!]: “I cannot control any benefit or harm for myself save what Allah wills. Had I known the unseen (ghayb), I would have revelled in good and no harm would have touched me. I am only a warner and announcer of good news for people who believe.” (7.188)

I'll keep working on it. However little, I do seem to be making a bit of progress on the matter.

i remember there was always this argument towards people who believe in God by those with no faith at all "prove to me God exists with logic" the person who believed in God would say to them "prove to me God doesn't exist with facts" and this will carry on until the end of time lol

i saw you was into ghost stories and stuff... so am i LOL i still haven't stopped, black magic, curses possession are all possible in Islam, if your interested you can look into this creation called "jinns" another part of the "unseen" a creation before us thats made of smokeless fire, we can't see them, but they can see us, they would be as you describe ghosts except they are not souls of people who have passed away
here is one video if you like then i can post more

My response to that sort of argument was basically that the one making the claim was the one who needed to provide evidence of their argument. Thus, I never claimed there was no god, just that I don't believe in one, that I don't see any evidence to support the existence of one. I never made the absolute claim that there was no god, thus never put myself in a position to have to prove such a claim. That's how I avoided that sort of back-and-forth.

The Jinn seem interesting, and remind me of what I picked up from my days semi-practising Shamanism, in that all sorts of spirit entities existed, and could take a multitude of forms. One of the books I'm reading on the metaphysics of Islam feels familiar to me, because it reads similar to things I used to believe, just using Islamic terminology.

I'll check out the videos when I can. I should have a lot more free time coming up soon, for a bit, at least, and I hope to catch up on reading and all the videos I've been linked to here. Thanks for them.

[Search]

:bism: (In the Name of God, the Most Beneficent, the Most Merciful)

@MisterK

Hey, that's wonderful and awesome that you and I have parallels in our story except as you said it moved you towards agnosticism while it moved me towards Islam. And please don't apologize for any of your feelings or thoughts or words because I am not taking any umbrage and in fact am so happy to find you trying to find a path to God. So, God-willing I'll update this thread with a more detailed post later so that you have a better idea of what led me to have the belief in the unseen as set out by Islam.

In the meantime, keep doing whatever you think is working for you, and since you sound like such an intelligent and thoughtful person, I'm sure you'll find your way to God. Just be patient with yourself because that's so important in life regardless and always, always, always trust your instincts. Your instincts are that part of you that is an internal compass that will guide you and please be able to distinguish it from doubts, which are always a separate but natural matter that happen to everyone when they take a path in life that is new to them and thereby scary for that reason.

Wishing you much awesomeness,

[greenhill]

Wooowwwww a lot of reading.. got to about post 18 and I'm not even halfway through.. :p will read up later...

Again, I keep recommending the same video, over and over.. (don't think I have recommended any other ^o) .. it is Jeffrey Lang on YouTube "The Purpose of Life" . IT 93 minutes and in 2 parts. As I have also said about it in the past, the intro is a bit long but necessary and the ending is a bit rushed.. I am a muslim and I already had faith. He made it even better.

I see a recurring statement by you and that is your heart rebels and your head sees sense.. at least that is the gyst of my understanding. At least if that is the order, then it is the normal route so to speak. The reason to believe as opposed to the desire to believe.

Desire is the 'nafs' in islam. That has to be managed and control, through humility and charity, even fasting.

The heart's greatest weapon against the mind is to plant seeds of doubts called waswas..

Allah asks you to ponder, reason, and other words I forget off hand and it all uses the mind. Nothing is said of the heart and aspirations.

Hope it helps.. trying to keep it brief..


:peace:

[TafiNami]

Iman is - to fear of ALLAH in your heart. You can recharge your Iman by Reading Quran again and again. And by talking too much about Allah to other.

Source: Small Khadem

[muslimah_B]

Okay, that helps clear some things up, then. I know I have a lot more research and studying to do on the matter, but if the Quran was meant to be taken absolutely literal, I don't think I'd be able to do that. Good to know that isn't the case. The links are also useful, thanks.




Understood, but not quite what I meant. I meant how some Christians accept the Bible as being a divine book, but the stories are symbolic and allegorical, not necessarily meant as having happened, but tales told to relate divine truths (as they see it). Such as, for example, a Christian who believes Noah's story is more a parable than historical. Or how in Judaism, more and more Rabbi's seem to be saying that the Exodus is a story designed to deliver a message/point/purpose, and isn't actually a historical fact. That's what I meant by symbolic.

oh i apologise i thought you meant literal symbols like the cross and images of Jesus p.b.u.h (peace be upon him)
In Islam the stories mentioned in the Quran are all historical facts, as in they did happen and they are being retold to us for a specific reason either to warn us from committing certain actions/sins, or to remind us of the signs of Allahs immense power, certain stories are repeated in the Quran to set in stone the meaning/message Allah is trying to get through to us, i.e Moses p.b.u.h (peace be upon him) struggles with Pharaoh are mentioned numerous times to remind us of what happens to those who oppress people and claim Allah to not be God astagfirllah (May Allah forgive me) but they (pharaoh) thought he was, to remind us of who had such a arrogant nature, and if we was to show signs of arrogance then we would be following the footsteps of pharaoh & shaytan (devil) but it also teaches us that through patience and prayer and sincerity Allahs help will come & Allah is the one and only God of everything, as Moses p.b.u.h (peace be upon him) went through such a testing trial from birth, right through to him p.b.u.h being a man, through the trials with Pharaoh he was patient, still called people to Allah, never gave up faith, even though Pharaoh was such a "scary & powerful" enemy, it shows that we should put trust in Allah and believe that His help will always come, so this story is repeated relating to each different topic.

so yes all stories In the Quran are truth, all prophets/ messengers mentioned are fact and all their stories actually happened.

Well, I could, but again, if I do it, I want it done with faith, not hoping I'll find it after the fact.

sooooo close but yet so far :) in sha Allah (God willing you) will get there, just try to have a open mind when your learning about islam not your logical mind :)

Basically, I think, regardless of good or bad, our bodies die, our consciousness ends with our brain function, our bodies decompose and the natural cycle continues. Lights go out, and you stop existing except as memories and such, or whatever the legacy you may have left behind is. If you were a terrible person, you probably left behind a terrible legacy. No heaven, no hell, and justice, whatever one's concept of it may be, happens in this world, or not at all.

ok in Islam death is just the beginning :). so we know there will be a judgement day right ? but not WHEN, so when somebody dies, as a muslim they are buried as quick as possible, and once they are buried and everyone leaves the cemetery, two angels will question them and depending on their answers is what their resting place will be like

It was narrated that al-Bara’ (may Allaah be pleased with him) said: We went out with the Messenger of Allaah (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) for the funeral of a man from among the Ansaar. We came to the grave and when (the deceased) was placed in the lahd, the Messenger of Allaah (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) sat down and we sat around him, as if there were birds on our heads (i.e., quiet and still). In his hand he had a stick with which he was scratching the ground. Then he raised his head and said, “Seek refuge with Allaah from the torment of the grave”, two or three times. Then he said, “When the believing slave is about to depart this world and enter the Hereafter, there come down to him from heaven angels with white faces like the sun, and they sit around him as far as the eye can see. They bring with them shrouds from Paradise and perfumes from Paradise. Then the Angel of Death comes and sits by his head, and he says, ‘O good soul, come forth to forgiveness from Allaah and His pleasure.’ Then it comes out easily like a drop of water from the the mouth of a waterskin. When he seizes it, they do not leave it in his hand for an instant before they take it and put it in that shroud with that perfume, and there comes from it a fragrance like the finest musk on the face of the earth. Then they ascend and they do not pass by any group of angels but they say, ‘Who is this good soul?’ and they say, ‘It is So and so the son of So and so, calling him by the best names by which he was known in this world, until they reach the lowest heaven. They ask for it to be opened to them and it is opened, and (the soul) is welcomed and accompanied to the next heaven by those who are closest to Allaah, until they reach the seventh heaven. Then Allaah says: ‘Record the book of My slave in ‘Illiyoon in the seventh heaven, and return him to the earth, for from it I created them, to it I will return them and from it I will bring them forth once again.’ So his soul is returned to his body and there come to him two angels who make him sit up and they say to him, ‘Who is your Lord?’ He says, ‘Allaah.’ They say, ‘What is your religion?’ He says, ‘My religion is Islam.’ They say, ‘Who is this man who was sent among you?’ He says, ‘He is the Messenger of Allaah (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him).’ They say, ‘What did you do?’ He says, ‘I read the Book of Allaah and I believed in it.’ Then a voice calls out from heaven, ‘My slave has spoken the truth, so prepare for him a bed from Paradise and clothe him from Paradise, and open for him a gate to Paradise.’ Then there comes to him some of its fragrance, and his grave is made wide, as far as he can see. Then there comes to him a man with a handsome face and handsome clothes, and a good fragrance, who says, ‘Receive the glad tidings that will bring you joy this day.’ He says, ‘Who are you? Your face is a face which brings glad tidings.’ He says, ‘I am your righteous deeds.’ He says, ‘O Lord, hasten the Hour so that I may return to my family and my wealth.’ But when the disbelieving slave is about to depart this world and enter the Hereafter, there come down to him from heaven angels with black faces, bringing sackcloth, and they sit around him as far as the eye can see. Then the Angel of Death comes and sits by his head, and he says, ‘O evil soul, come forth to the wrath of Allaah and His anger.’ Then his soul disperses inside his body, then comes out cutting the veins and nerves, like a skewer passing through wet wool. When he seizes it, they do not leave it in his hand for an instant before they take it and put it in that sackcloth, and there comes from it a stench like the foulest stench of a dead body on the face of the earth. Then they ascend and they do not pass by any group of angels but they say, ‘Who is this evil soul?’ and they say, ‘It is So and so the son of So and so, calling him by the worst names by which he was known in this world, until they reach the lowest heaven. They ask for it to be opened to them and it is not opened.” Then the Messenger of Allaah (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) recited (interpretation of the meaning): “for them the gates of heaven will not be opened, and they will not enter Paradise until the camel goes through the eye of the needle”[al-A’raaf 7:40]

Sorry if I wasn't clear, I understood your point, but I meant despite my primal fear of Judgement Day scenarios, fear alone isn't a reason to worship anything, in my opinion. One does need, at least, that balance you mention.

oh ok sorry lol, but yet balance is needed in everything in life especially as a muslim, so we should be happy and enjoy life, but not so happy that we forget the realities of life such as death, we shouldn't be extreme in our religion,

Prophet (PBUH) once asked one of His companion Abdullah ibn ‘Amr” R.A“Have I heard right that you fast everyday and stand in prayer all night?Abdullah replied:“Yes, O Messenger of God”The Prophet (PBUH) said:“Do not do that. Fast, as well as, eat and drink. Stand in prayer, as well as, sleep. This is because your body has a right upon you, your eyes have a right upon you, your wife has a right upon you, and your guest has a right upon you.” (Bukhari)

“O children of Adam! Wear your beautiful apparel at every time and place of prayer: Eat and drink but waste not by excess, for Allah loveth not the wasters. Say: ‘who hath forbidden the beautiful gifts of Allah which He hath produced for His servants and the things clean and pure (which He hath provided) for sustenance? Say: They are in the life of this world, for those who believe, (and) purely for them on the Day of Judgment. Thus do We explain the signs in detail for those who understand.” (7:31-32)

“Religion is very easy and whoever overburdens himself in his religion will not be able to continue in that way. So you should not be extremists, but aim to be near to perfection and receive the good tidings that you will be rewarded; and gain strength by worshipping in the mornings and the nights.” Saheeh Bukhari 1:2:38

Belief in Shaytan may be even more difficult than a faith in Allah for me, actually. Before being an atheist, I had a belief in my concept of God, but hadn't believed in any sort of devil figure for quite a long while. The existence of such a being just seemed sort of contradictory to me, if God is, in fact, all loving and all good (as I had believed). Ultimately, that said, it all goes back to faith, which, as we well know, is my struggle here.


I'll keep working on it. However little, I do seem to be making a bit of progress on the matter.

yes just keep working on it bit by bit, take slow steps, but whatever you do just keep moving forward, i won't send you any videos on this topic just yet, il wait until you finish the others, i don't want to suddenly overwhelm you with information overload lol, so we can take each topic your finding hard one by one and try and work through them individually, instead of loads of different subjects all at once, it can be quite daunting.

My response to that sort of argument was basically that the one making the claim was the one who needed to provide evidence of their argument. Thus, I never claimed there was no god, just that I don't believe in one, that I don't see any evidence to support the existence of one. I never made the absolute claim that there was no god, thus never put myself in a position to have to prove such a claim. That's how I avoided that sort of back-and-forth.

The Jinn seem interesting, and remind me of what I picked up from my days semi-practising Shamanism, in that all sorts of spirit entities existed, and could take a multitude of forms. One of the books I'm reading on the metaphysics of Islam feels familiar to me, because it reads similar to things I used to believe, just using Islamic terminology.

I'll check out the videos when I can. I should have a lot more free time coming up soon, for a bit, at least, and I hope to catch up on reading and all the videos I've been linked to here. Thanks for them.

lol good way to avoid the back and forth, but unfortunately for this topic its the main issue so it will have to be discussed hopefully with as little back and forth as possible :)

yes jinns are a very interesting topic to study, it does branch out into different sub-topics such as, possession, black magic, magic, hauntings, the different types,

so once you watch all the other videos, then we can go over the doubts you still have and in sha Allah move forward from there, i don't want to keep jumping topics without you actually understanding it properly,
so please do let me know and we will go over one topic at a time to make it easier for you :)

(sorry for my late response but i suffer from severe migraines and had a rather bad migraine attack over the last few days)

[Pygoscelis]

My response to that sort of argument was basically that the one making the claim was the one who needed to provide evidence of their argument. Thus, I never claimed there was no god, just that I don't believe in one, that I don't see any evidence to support the existence of one. I never made the absolute claim that there was no god, thus never put myself in a position to have to prove such a claim. That's how I avoided that sort of back-and-forth.

This exactly. Well put. If you press them, even the most adamant atheists and and-theists will admit that they don't know for sure that Gods don't exist. We simply don't believe that he does, as we see no reason to believe that he does, and so we see him as imaginary, just like Big Foot or the Loch Ness Monster, etc. Such beings COULD exist, and evidence for them could convert us to believers.

[muslimah_B]

This exactly. Well put. If you press them, even the most adamant atheists and and-theists will admit that they don't know for sure that Gods don't exist. We simply don't believe that he does, as we see no reason to believe that he does, and so we see him as imaginary, just like Big Foot or the Loch Ness Monster, etc. Such beings COULD exist, and evidence for them could convert us to believers.

Greetings earthling :)

I understand you dont believe but comparing God to the likes of big foot & loch ness monster & abominable snowman can be seen as extremely offensive, since God is on a totally different level as we worship & pray to God, they are just incomparable i hope you understand :)

So what exactly do you believe in as to how the entire universe was created, all the galaxies, planets and places we dont even know exist.

- how earth was created with the exact amount of gravity to keep us down but not squash us to death, right amount of oxygen, that the trees take our carbon dioxide and re-produce oxygen for us.

- how animals are born with instinct, and just know what they have to do to survive

- water cycle, how simple it is but yet so incredibly important to us.

- human body muscles, tendons, arteries, bones, cartilage, skin, ears, eyes, nose, mouth

These are just small examples i have mentioned that even we as muslims are meant to think about, that prove to us a ultimate being created all of this, it didnt just evolve or begin from nothing.

Do you ever think about these things?
We tend to overlook alot of things and not really place importance on them, but sometimes even the most simplest of things can have such an amazing impact on your outlook of life :)

When muslims are feeling low faith wise, we are told to look to nature, to look at the stars, the skies, animals, etc etc as well as helping rekindle faith it is also meant to have a calming effect and bring us back down to earth

And what sort of evidence are you hoping to find ? Or what sort of evidence would convince you that God does exist ?

[Pygoscelis]

^ Seems like material for another thread. I didn't mean to derail this one. Just wanted to make the above point. Theists appear to be 100% certain. Atheists never are.

[MisterK]

^ Seems like material for another thread. I didn't mean to derail this one. Just wanted to make the above point. Theists appear to be 100% certain. Atheists never are.

If you wish to reply, feel free. Based on your previous post, I figure a lot of your responses would probably match mine, were I to answer.

[muslimah_B]

^ Seems like material for another thread. I didn't mean to derail this one. Just wanted to make the above point. Theists appear to be 100% certain. Atheists never are.

Ok no problem, il be happy to speak to you on this matter if you choose to start another thread on it

Wishing you a awesome day :)

[Serinity]

:salam:

Just keep making dua to Allah :swt: say "Oh God, if you are there, then guide me."

Once you are convinced about the Creator, you'll have no problem believing in the Unseen.

As for the unseen, logically, I think "we didn't create ourselves, and before my existence, I remember nothing, so just like this world existed before me, so must the Unseen, albeit I see it not with my eyes."

As for believing in a Creator, reflect and ponder on creation. Read Qur'an.

I won't go about how and why I believe in the Creator, but I will say this: I believe in Allah, and I know of His existence by His signs in creation.

you can not physically see intelligence, but you know intelligence exists. Because there are indications to its existence. How do you know that I am a real human being, and not a robot? Have you ever seen me? No. How do you know I have intelligence? have you seen my intelligence?

we know Allah exists, not because we see Him, because we don't, but because we recognize His signs in creation.

[MisterK]

:salam:

Just keep making dua to Allah :swt: say "Oh God, if you are there, then guide me."

This is what I have been doing, and intend to continue doing so.

Once you are convinced about the Creator, you'll have no problem believing in the Unseen.

I agree. If I find faith in one, I imagine the others will follow pretty easily.

As for the unseen, logically, I think "we didn't create ourselves, and before my existence, I remember nothing, so just like this world existed before me, so must the Unseen, albeit I see it not with my eyes."

In regarding the "Unseen" as Allah, angels, Jannah, hell, Jinn, and all such things, then I just don't, currently, have the evidence or faith needed to make the jump from "the world existed before me" to "this means the Unseen must also exist."

As for believing in a Creator, reflect and ponder on creation. Read Qur'an.

I have read a translation of he Qur'an, and am about to begin a different translation with better historical explanations and context. Hopefully I find it beneficial.

I won't go about how and why I believe in the Creator, but I will say this: I believe in Allah, and I know of His existence by His signs in creation.

you can not physically see intelligence, but you know intelligence exists. Because there are indications to its existence. How do you know that I am a real human being, and not a robot? Have you ever seen me? No. How do you know I have intelligence? have you seen my intelligence?[/QUOTE]

You're right, I can't physically see intelligence, but I can see intelligence in action through people using it, or by some (definitely not all) choices I make. And you're right, I can't know for sure you are a human, maybe you are just a very well developed chat bot or robot. I find this doubtful, unless, were it the case, your programming uitilized Watson for communication. That said, given the lack of prevalence of artifical intelligence, and none passing the Turing test, I feel justified in safely assuming you are a human.

we know Allah exists, not because we see Him, because we don't, but because we recognize His signs in creation.

And while I don't have evidence that there isn't a Creator behind the functions and laws of the universe, the natural processes that led to life and reality as it currently exists, but I also haven't seen any such evidence suggesting there is. This lack of objective evidence is, I would say, the crux of my problem.

[Serinity]

Don't worry, little at a time.

Whosoever strives in Allah's Cause and in His way, and strives to be guided, Allah :swt: will guide you, as long as you seek it.

Allahu alam.

[muslimah_B]

Maybe you would do better with reading the tasfeer along with the Quran, it may help you to understand things better :)

You can read by tasfeer ibn Kathir on a app called "Quran tasfeer pro"
Or
Illuminating discourses on the Noble Quran tasfeer
Or
Maariful Quran by Mufti Mohhamed Shafi

All of these i use in my courses and are recommended reading material for my Quran classes

[MisterK]

oh i apologise i thought you meant literal symbols like the cross and images of Jesus p.b.u.h (peace be upon him)
In Islam the stories mentioned in the Quran are all historical facts, as in they did happen and they are being retold to us for a specific reason either to warn us from committing certain actions/sins, or to remind us of the signs of Allahs immense power, certain stories are repeated in the Quran to set in stone the meaning/message Allah is trying to get through to us, i.e Moses p.b.u.h (peace be upon him) struggles with Pharaoh are mentioned numerous times to remind us of what happens to those who oppress people and claim Allah to not be God astagfirllah (May Allah forgive me) but they (pharaoh) thought he was, to remind us of who had such a arrogant nature, and if we was to show signs of arrogance then we would be following the footsteps of pharaoh & shaytan (devil) but it also teaches us that through patience and prayer and sincerity Allahs help will come & Allah is the one and only God of everything, as Moses p.b.u.h (peace be upon him) went through such a testing trial from birth, right through to him p.b.u.h being a man, through the trials with Pharaoh he was patient, still called people to Allah, never gave up faith, even though Pharaoh was such a "scary & powerful" enemy, it shows that we should put trust in Allah and believe that His help will always come, so this story is repeated relating to each different topic.

so yes all stories In the Quran are truth, all prophets/ messengers mentioned are fact and all their stories actually happened.

Hmm... then I think this will be another point of conflict for me. For example, there doesn't seem to be any evidence of a global flood as described in scripture, no evidence of the Jews roaming the desert for 40 years, and so on. The lack of evidence supporting a literal view of the Bible is one of the thing that drove me away from it.

sooooo close but yet so far :) in sha Allah (God willing you) will get there, just try to have a open mind when your learning about islam not your logical mind :)

I consider the two one and the same. I am open minded, but generally I need evidence to support a new view or change an existing one. This seeking is about trying, somehow, to find evidence to change my mind.

ok in Islam death is just the beginning :). so we know there will be a judgement day right ? but not WHEN, so when somebody dies, as a muslim they are buried as quick as possible, and once they are buried and everyone leaves the cemetery, two angels will question them and depending on their answers is what their resting place will be like

It was narrated that al-Bara’ (may Allaah be pleased with him) said: We went out with the Messenger of Allaah (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) for the funeral of a man from among the Ansaar. We came to the grave and when (the deceased) was placed in the lahd, the Messenger of Allaah (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) sat down and we sat around him, as if there were birds on our heads (i.e., quiet and still). In his hand he had a stick with which he was scratching the ground. Then he raised his head and said, “Seek refuge with Allaah from the torment of the grave”, two or three times. Then he said, “When the believing slave is about to depart this world and enter the Hereafter, there come down to him from heaven angels with white faces like the sun, and they sit around him as far as the eye can see. They bring with them shrouds from Paradise and perfumes from Paradise. Then the Angel of Death comes and sits by his head, and he says, ‘O good soul, come forth to forgiveness from Allaah and His pleasure.’ Then it comes out easily like a drop of water from the the mouth of a waterskin. When he seizes it, they do not leave it in his hand for an instant before they take it and put it in that shroud with that perfume, and there comes from it a fragrance like the finest musk on the face of the earth. Then they ascend and they do not pass by any group of angels but they say, ‘Who is this good soul?’ and they say, ‘It is So and so the son of So and so, calling him by the best names by which he was known in this world, until they reach the lowest heaven. They ask for it to be opened to them and it is opened, and (the soul) is welcomed and accompanied to the next heaven by those who are closest to Allaah, until they reach the seventh heaven. Then Allaah says: ‘Record the book of My slave in ‘Illiyoon in the seventh heaven, and return him to the earth, for from it I created them, to it I will return them and from it I will bring them forth once again.’ So his soul is returned to his body and there come to him two angels who make him sit up and they say to him, ‘Who is your Lord?’ He says, ‘Allaah.’ They say, ‘What is your religion?’ He says, ‘My religion is Islam.’ They say, ‘Who is this man who was sent among you?’ He says, ‘He is the Messenger of Allaah (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him).’ They say, ‘What did you do?’ He says, ‘I read the Book of Allaah and I believed in it.’ Then a voice calls out from heaven, ‘My slave has spoken the truth, so prepare for him a bed from Paradise and clothe him from Paradise, and open for him a gate to Paradise.’ Then there comes to him some of its fragrance, and his grave is made wide, as far as he can see. Then there comes to him a man with a handsome face and handsome clothes, and a good fragrance, who says, ‘Receive the glad tidings that will bring you joy this day.’ He says, ‘Who are you? Your face is a face which brings glad tidings.’ He says, ‘I am your righteous deeds.’ He says, ‘O Lord, hasten the Hour so that I may return to my family and my wealth.’ But when the disbelieving slave is about to depart this world and enter the Hereafter, there come down to him from heaven angels with black faces, bringing sackcloth, and they sit around him as far as the eye can see. Then the Angel of Death comes and sits by his head, and he says, ‘O evil soul, come forth to the wrath of Allaah and His anger.’ Then his soul disperses inside his body, then comes out cutting the veins and nerves, like a skewer passing through wet wool. When he seizes it, they do not leave it in his hand for an instant before they take it and put it in that sackcloth, and there comes from it a stench like the foulest stench of a dead body on the face of the earth. Then they ascend and they do not pass by any group of angels but they say, ‘Who is this evil soul?’ and they say, ‘It is So and so the son of So and so, calling him by the worst names by which he was known in this world, until they reach the lowest heaven. They ask for it to be opened to them and it is not opened.” Then the Messenger of Allaah (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) recited (interpretation of the meaning): “for them the gates of heaven will not be opened, and they will not enter Paradise until the camel goes through the eye of the needle”[al-A’raaf 7:40]

The idea of life after death is a nice one, and one held in some form or another by most people on the planet. I would love to believe it were true, I would love to believe I'll get to see my loved ones again, especially as I grow older and lose more and more people. It is a much more comforting thought, that we'll be reunited.

oh ok sorry lol, but yet balance is needed in everything in life especially as a muslim, so we should be happy and enjoy life, but not so happy that we forget the realities of life such as death, we shouldn't be extreme in our religion,

Prophet (PBUH) once asked one of His companion Abdullah ibn ‘Amr” R.A“Have I heard right that you fast everyday and stand in prayer all night?Abdullah replied:“Yes, O Messenger of God”The Prophet (PBUH) said:“Do not do that. Fast, as well as, eat and drink. Stand in prayer, as well as, sleep. This is because your body has a right upon you, your eyes have a right upon you, your wife has a right upon you, and your guest has a right upon you.” (Bukhari)

“O children of Adam! Wear your beautiful apparel at every time and place of prayer: Eat and drink but waste not by excess, for Allah loveth not the wasters. Say: ‘who hath forbidden the beautiful gifts of Allah which He hath produced for His servants and the things clean and pure (which He hath provided) for sustenance? Say: They are in the life of this world, for those who believe, (and) purely for them on the Day of Judgment. Thus do We explain the signs in detail for those who understand.” (7:31-32)

“Religion is very easy and whoever overburdens himself in his religion will not be able to continue in that way. So you should not be extremists, but aim to be near to perfection and receive the good tidings that you will be rewarded; and gain strength by worshipping in the mornings and the nights.” Saheeh Bukhari 1:2:38

It is nice seeing a religion incorporate messages of anti-extremism, especially given that, as we all know, humans in general have a habit of taking things too far, all too often.

yes just keep working on it bit by bit, take slow steps, but whatever you do just keep moving forward, i won't send you any videos on this topic just yet, il wait until you finish the others, i don't want to suddenly overwhelm you with information overload lol, so we can take each topic your finding hard one by one and try and work through them individually, instead of loads of different subjects all at once, it can be quite daunting.

Starting tomorrow I'll have ample free time for a few weeks, so I plan to continue my reading and finish the books I've started, get through a more education translation of the Qur'an, and finally catch up on all the videos. Sorry it's taken so long to view them, when you were kind enough to compile them for me in the first place.

lol good way to avoid the back and forth, but unfortunately for this topic its the main issue so it will have to be discussed hopefully with as little back and forth as possible :)

True, true, however, given as I am searching, I don't consider this a debate or formal argument, more a matter of back-and-forth regarding differing views and ways to try and change mine. So even if less-than-minimal back-and-forth, it is for a different reason than such a thing usually happens over.

yes jinns are a very interesting topic to study, it does branch out into different sub-topics such as, possession, black magic, magic, hauntings, the different types,

so once you watch all the other videos, then we can go over the doubts you still have and in sha Allah move forward from there, i don't want to keep jumping topics without you actually understanding it properly,
so please do let me know and we will go over one topic at a time to make it easier for you :)

Back to my issue with the Unseen, I don't really believe in magic, possession, or hauntings and the like. Just like with God and such, I used to, so it'd be more a reversion than conversion on this matter.

(sorry for my late response but i suffer from severe migraines and had a rather bad migraine attack over the last few days)

No worries there. I hope you're feeling better, and that any future ones are few and far between, if they happen at all.


All that said, I find it odd that I'm trying so hard to find faith in something that I have such a hard time believing in, that seems to run counter to much of my current world view. Yet, when I think about just giving up and stopping the search, I actually start feeling bad about considering that quitting, sometimes with actual physical discomfort. And naturally, my current world-view attributes it to, basically, a sort of negative placebo effect.

[MisterK]

Maybe you would do better with reading the tasfeer along with the Quran, it may help you to understand things better :)

You can read by tasfeer ibn Kathir on a app called "Quran tasfeer pro"
Or
Illuminating discourses on the Noble Quran tasfeer
Or
Maariful Quran by Mufti Mohhamed Shafi

All of these i use in my courses and are recommended reading material for my Quran classes

Thanks, I may look into them, but I think I'll start with the different translation I have from my first for my re-read of the Qur'an. The first one I read had around 450 pages, this new one I have has over a thousand pages, and goes much more in-depth in the material.

[Search]

:bism: (In the Name of God, the Most Beneficent, the Most Merciful)

@MisterK

So, I should also mention that I would research different religions in different points of time in the background of my life just out of my own interest, which aligned with wanting to understand cultures and human nature and human history. I didn't research religions with the intention to adopt a religion or because I was searching for a religion. No, that's not it at all. I researched and studied for my own edification, much like a person might Google something like "polyandry" without actually intending to engage in it himself/herself.

In college, I switched majors three times in college - from history to classical studies to anthropology - but stuck with anthropology and also studied communication as a minor. I think I was perhaps in hindsight searching for something but in my mind it wasn't religion, and I certainly would laughed if someone had said I was searching for religion because I wasn't.

Even though I didn't lack for anything and my parents at that point in time were financially stable and I was busy and doing well in college and living in a dorm and had a good social life with nice friends, I did feel something was missing from my life when I was alone sometimes. Gaiety of life couldn't take that intangible feeling in the inner me that something's just...missing. Now, of course, the cynic somewhere might see things like this as our First World problem? People in other parts of the world are starving and here I have a good life and I am not unhappy but just unsatisfied somehow still when I was in college. Other things happened and my senior year was the worst year of my life in college in terms of academic pressure and stress. I decided then that I wouldn't go to law school immediately but take some time off. My parents were angry and disappointed because they thought I was making a horrible decision, maybe the worst mistake of my life. However, I was adamant that I wouldn't go straightaway to law school. My parents were still unhappy, but they finally relented because they knew I was too stubborn and arrogant (yes, not good character traits, but I'm being honest about how I was) and therefore they knew better than to try to keep trying to change my mind because I wouldn't budge an inch.

This was a pivotal turning point in my life (only I didn't know it then!). I had researched major religions prior to this, but I don't know why I hadn't previously researched Islam. I can't exactly say why, but I guess it just didn't really cross my mind. Keep the story of the yoga and witchcraft project I'd told you earlier in mind because I'd become a "spiritual" atheist, whatever the heck that meant, and I don't even think I knew what I meant by describing myself as that. But even in a blog post I'd written in college, I'd described myself as "spiritual," even though I didn't engage in any rituals or anything and was still an atheist and my meditation/breathing exercise was limited to doing that one thing in yoga which I'd learned to sometimes do when I was stressed.

Like I'd told you, the yoga and my one-year long independent research project had opened my mind to the unseen. The other thing that I'd tell you to keep in mind is that my father once told me that when he was a young man he would find quotes that he felt were meaningful and memorable and write them down in his journal to remember as words to which he could live by. Now, this is interesting because I used to do something similar except of course replace diary with computer word document. So, I had this habit of whenever I used to read a quote that was interesting or I really liked, I'd either write it down on my computer or if it was already written down in a magazine or calendar mark the page by folding it or highlighting the words. Over years, I'd read many fantastic quotes that I'd loved.

You'll hear a lot of stories of how people came to Islam. Most people seem to come by Islam by reading the Quran: Well, not me! I guess I've always taken an off-beaten path for some reason in life and not intentionally I'd say either. Instead, there was a site on Islam in which hadiths were searchable, and I would type in a word like "kind" or whatever I was feeling that day and then read hadiths that came up. Well, I'd read those hadiths and then tears would start flowing on my face, and I couldn't understand why I was tearful because I didn't think I'd read objectively anything that profound as the words were simple but something in my heart would feel something strange even though I'd over the course of my life read many profound quotes. This kept happening until I started to research into Quran. I tried to read the Quran, but the Old English translation was too dull for me, and I wanted something more engaging (as I'm a spoiled Millennial!). So, I started watching YouTube videos in which the speaker was Nouman Ali Khan and he'd explain the miraculous nature of Quran with evidence. This was great for me because I could never believe something which didn't have evidence, and I'd watch avidly all of his videos and contemplate on his words and my life. This is important because while I do believe that some science is contained in the Quran, Quran is ultimately a guidance book and not a science book. Anyhow, I'd at this point started becoming convinced that Islam might be/probably was from God, but I didn't want to live my life as a Muslim and still resisted the lure of/rejected Islam. First off, I am ENFP, which if you don't know the personality-type means I'm free-spirited and I hate rules, and Islam seemed to have rules. Secondly, I was a staunch feminist, and I wasn't especially modest (especially in dressing and didn't desire to be). Thirdly, I still had trouble with the unseen (angels, devils, blah-blah).

I'd been in this post trying to get at how I came to eventually accept the unseen as per Islam, but I don't want to overwhelm/overload you in one go, even though you seem to be handling long posts well. This post would probably be lengthened further if I continued in this vein, and therefore I'm going to save this for another time God-willing. Thank you for your patience and consideration.

Wishing you much awesomeness,

[Serinity]

Try read a lot of Quran, and then seek questions. So ask questions WHILE you read the Quran. So read it!

Listen to the recitations, etc. May Allah :swt: guide you. Ameen.

Allahu alam.

[MisterK]

(In the Name of God, the Most Beneficent, the Most Merciful)

MisterK

So, I should also mention that I would research different religions in different points of time in the background of my life just out of my own interest, which aligned with wanting to understand cultures and human nature and human history. I didn't research religions with the intention to adopt a religion or because I was searching for a religion. No, that's not it at all. I researched and studied for my own edification, much like a person might Google something like "polyandry" without actually intending to engage in it himself/herself.

In college, I switched majors three times in college - from history to classical studies to anthropology - but stuck with anthropology and also studied communication as a minor. I think I was perhaps in hindsight searching for something but in my mind it wasn't religion, and I certainly would laughed if someone had said I was searching for religion because I wasn't.

I understand, and feel I can relate. I've looked into a lot of religions and belief systems, read various holy books and other materials about them in order to gain understanding, not for a desire to practice. That is why I find my current situation very unexpected but somewhat fascinating, because I read the Qur'an initially just to learn more about Islam, I did not expect to actually be drawn in by it in any way. As I mentioned before, I went into this as a strong skeptic and atheist, so reading any book about any religion intending to adopt it was something that never once entered my mind.

Even though I didn't lack for anything and my parents at that point in time were financially stable and I was busy and doing well in college and living in a dorm and had a good social life with nice friends, I did feel something was missing from my life when I was alone sometimes. Gaiety of life couldn't take that intangible feeling in the inner me that something's just...missing. Now, of course, the cynic somewhere might see things like this as our First World problem? People in other parts of the world are starving and here I have a good life and I am not unhappy but just unsatisfied somehow still when I was in college

I know exactly what you mean. There is a song that is in my head a lot, called "I Want More, part 1" by a group (no longer together) called "Faithless." The point of the lyrics hit me hard, as I am dealing with the very thing your describing here. I'll only share a couple verses (can't link to things yet, unfortunately), but it is enough to drive the point home;

Hey friend your misery bewilders me
How come you're never satisfied or gratified
Four walls n' a roof, electricity,
Stable mind, wife and child,
Hot and cold water to run anytime.
But still you, whine.

I want more

A bum could rummage through ya bin
And live like a king
On just one crumb o'ya cake
N'ya say ya life needs fulfilling
Some would give anything to live like you
Shame your mind, don't shine
Like your possessions do.
Whining, complaining all the time,
Don't see no rain on you
What side your bread is buttered on
If only you knew

What d'ya mean
I want more

* * *

Despite having what most on the planet would called a blessed, if not out right indulgent, life, there is a severe absence of meaning, of anything really resembling fulfilment. I *think* I know what those missing things are, I can't know for certain unless I obtain them in some fashion, and those things are things that seem rather central to Islam; family, community and the like. All things technically obtainable outside of Islam, for sure, but the simple revelation of that missing something doesn't seem, to me at least, as reason alone to have the pull I feel on an emotional level.

Other things happened and my senior year was the worst year of my life in college in terms of academic pressure and stress. I decided then that I wouldn't go to law school immediately but take some time off. My parents were angry and disappointed because they thought I was making a horrible decision, maybe the worst mistake of my life. However, I was adamant that I wouldn't go straightaway to law school. My parents were still unhappy, but they finally relented because they knew I was too stubborn and arrogant (yes, not good character traits, but I'm being honest about how I was) and therefore they knew better than to try to keep trying to change my mind because I wouldn't budge an inch.

This was a pivotal turning point in my life (only I didn't know it then!). I had researched major religions prior to this, but I don't know why I hadn't previously researched Islam. I can't exactly say why, but I guess it just didn't really cross my mind. Keep the story of the yoga and witchcraft project I'd told you earlier in mind because I'd become a "spiritual" atheist, whatever the heck that meant, and I don't even think I knew what I meant by describing myself as that. But even in a blog post I'd written in college, I'd described myself as "spiritual," even though I didn't engage in any rituals or anything and was still an atheist and my meditation/breathing exercise was limited to doing that one thing in yoga which I'd learned to sometimes do when I was stressed.

Likewise on the studying of Islam matter. All the religions I've studied, up until just recently Islam never crossed my mind to actually research. I wonder what would have happened if I'd researched it early, under different life circumstances, if I'd still feel as I do. And I also understand what (I think) you mean by "spiritual atheist." A lot of atheists I've seen, away from the anti-theist type of atheists, seem to have some sort of spiritual belief, even if it is a "one with nature" type of Zen-like idea, and not so much afterlives and spirits (though I've met some of those types of atheists as well, they subscribe to the idea of a godless cosmos to which life exists in a myriad of forms well beyond what we can see or deduce scientifically). As for my parents, they're happy I finally found a path (better late than never) in terms of school and developing a career and such, but I imagine all the good will that gained would be gone, and more, if I do end up adopting Islam. I can actually see a lot of relationships fracturing if I did (and came out as Muslim), which, of course, would bring about a whole different set of problems.

Like I'd told you, the yoga and my one-year long independent research project had opened my mind to the unseen. The other thing that I'd tell you to keep in mind is that my father once told me that when he was a young man he would find quotes that he felt were meaningful and memorable and write them down in his journal to remember as words to which he could live by. Now, this is interesting because I used to do something similar except of course replace diary with computer word document. So, I had this habit of whenever I used to read a quote that was interesting or I really liked, I'd either write it down on my computer or if it was already written down in a magazine or calendar mark the page by folding it or highlighting the words. Over years, I'd read many fantastic quotes that I'd loved.

A good collection of personally meaningful quotes has helped get me through many a dark time.

You'll hear a lot of stories of how people came to Islam. Most people seem to come by Islam by reading the Quran: Well, not me! I guess I've always taken an off-beaten path for some reason in life and not intentionally I'd say either. Instead, there was a site on Islam in which hadiths were searchable, and I would type in a word like "kind" or whatever I was feeling that day and then read hadiths that came up. Well, I'd read those hadiths and then tears would start flowing on my face, and I couldn't understand why I was tearful because I didn't think I'd read objectively anything that profound as the words were simple but something in my heart would feel something strange even though I'd over the course of my life read many profound quotes. This kept happening until I started to research into Quran. I tried to read the Quran, but the Old English translation was too dull for me, and I wanted something more engaging (as I'm a spoiled Millennial!). So, I started watching YouTube videos in which the speaker was Nouman Ali Khan and he'd explain the miraculous nature of Quran with evidence. This was great for me because I could never believe something which didn't have evidence, and I'd watch avidly all of his videos and contemplate on his words and my life. This is important because while I do believe that some science is contained in the Quran, Quran is ultimately a guidance book and not a science book. Anyhow, I'd at this point started becoming convinced that Islam might be/probably was from God, but I didn't want to live my life as a Muslim and still resisted the lure of/rejected Islam. First off, I am ENFP, which if you don't know the personality-type means I'm free-spirited and I hate rules, and Islam seemed to have rules. Secondly, I was a staunch feminist, and I wasn't especially modest (especially in dressing and didn't desire to be). Thirdly, I still had trouble with the unseen (angels, devils, blah-blah).

I still haven't looked through any of the hadiths, other than those quoted in various threads here from time to time. I don't even really know where to start with them. Maybe it would be useful for me to do so.

The view that the Qur'an as a guidebook is one I've considered. I still think there is too much of a lack of evidence for me to accept the Qur'an, or any scripture, as a book of literal history, but a book of divine revelation to serve as a guide for mankind is something I'd be able to accept much more readily if I find faith at all. Even if I believed in Allah tomorrow, just woke up with my heart and mind believing, I still don't think I'd be able to accept a literal, historical, interpretation of any holy book, at least not with a sudden emergence of a large amount of objective, historical, evidence to support it.

I'd been in this post trying to get at how I came to eventually accept the unseen as per Islam, but I don't want to overwhelm/overload you in one go, even though you seem to be handling long posts well. This post would probably be lengthened further if I continued in this vein, and therefore I'm going to save this for another time God-willing. Thank you for your patience and consideration.

Wishing you much awesomeness,

I appreciate you taking the time to post and relate your experience here. I enjoy seeing people's reasons and journeys for believing what they do and how they came to be where they are.

[MisterK]

Well you are right that once you have faith in Allah that everything does just fall into place :)

If you sincerely want to believe then you can talk to Allah, and ask Allah to guide you to the truth and make your journey easy.

All of us at some point have days of doubt and low faith, this is human nature but having even the smallest amount of faith helps to keep us going and get back up.

I too once had those arguments within myself, but i just reminded myself of who Allah is, what Allah wants from me and why i believe, i understand how hard it is to once have believed in something totally different and lived the complete opposite life of how a muslim should, but believe me once you have your faith it gets better, you feel better and will realise you made the right decision no matter how much you went through to get there, it all becomes worth it

Il post some youtube videos for you that talk about who Allah is in sha Allah (God willing) they may help you and strengthen your faith

If they help and/or you would like more then im more than happy to post more

So, I've finished all of the videos you've linked me to, thanks again for them. I understood what they were saying, and found the "Am I being Tested" and "Don't be sad" videos particularly moving and emotionally useful. That sort of reasoning, that it (everything, good or bad) is all part of the plan, that there is meaning and purpose behind existence, that there is life after death and all that is very appealing to me. Yet, still, I can't reconcile my thinking mind and my emotions on the matter. My thinking mind still craves some sort of tangible, objective evidence to all of it, and that I just don't see. Of course, my thinking mind and emotional self being at odds isn't anything new.

Probably one of the most disconcerting of this is when I would get sleep paralysis fairly regularly, waking up, fully conscious, but unable to move. I knew the cause of it, and logically understand it while it was happening (and really, found it very annoying/frustrating), but despite my logical thoughts, on a purely emotional level I would feel a permeating primal fear take over my being over being unable to move... and no amount of reasoning would make it go away (in fact, I even felt kind of dumb for feeling afraid over it, but still couldn't ease the fear. Now, with enough instances of the paralysis the fear did go away, leaving me with just the frustration, but still, before it did, I've never known a great dissonance between my mind and emotions. This current situation regarding Allah and Islam is probably at a tie for the second biggest instance of dissonance between mind and emotion for me.

The Jinn videos didn't really expand on anything I hadn't picked up on from the Qur'an and other reading I've done, but they were still good refreshers. And the one basically being done a poem was a nice touch. The Day of Judgement videos, frankly, I was surprised at how similar the lore was to Biblical lore, but then it also made sense since the Bible is still considered (mostly) true in Islam (as far as I understand it). And, of course, I did feel a bit of that old fear I've previously mentioned return, as end time scenarios tend to do that too me (especially Biblical-esque ones, given my Catholic up-bringing in my early life).In the end, and while being good explanations for what is believed in Islam regarding Jinn and the end of days, none of these videos did anything to move me closer to accepting the Unseen.

Truthfully, other than some sort of undeniable evidence, I don't know what might.

[Arfa]

So many new posts here :). I'm not really sure what kind of proof makes you able to trust and develop faith :hmm:

But here's a video I found on YouTube.

http://youtu.be/gC2_IMz9qcY

[Serinity]

So, I've finished all of the videos you've linked me to, thanks again for them. I understood what they were saying, and found the "Am I being Tested" and "Don't be sad" videos particularly moving and emotionally useful. That sort of reasoning, that it (everything, good or bad) is all part of the plan, that there is meaning and purpose behind existence, that there is life after death and all that is very appealing to me. Yet, still, I can't reconcile my thinking mind and my emotions on the matter. My thinking mind still craves some sort of tangible, objective evidence to all of it, and that I just don't see. Of course, my thinking mind and emotional self being at odds isn't anything new.

Probably one of the most disconcerting of this is when I would get sleep paralysis fairly regularly, waking up, fully conscious, but unable to move. I knew the cause of it, and logically understand it while it was happening (and really, found it very annoying/frustrating), but despite my logical thoughts, on a purely emotional level I would feel a permeating primal fear take over my being over being unable to move... and no amount of reasoning would make it go away (in fact, I even felt kind of dumb for feeling afraid over it, but still couldn't ease the fear. Now, with enough instances of the paralysis the fear did go away, leaving me with just the frustration, but still, before it did, I've never known a great dissonance between my mind and emotions. This current situation regarding Allah and Islam is probably at a tie for the second biggest instance of dissonance between mind and emotion for me.

The Jinn videos didn't really expand on anything I hadn't picked up on from the Qur'an and other reading I've done, but they were still good refreshers. And the one basically being done a poem was a nice touch. The Day of Judgement videos, frankly, I was surprised at how similar the lore was to Biblical lore, but then it also made sense since the Bible is still considered (mostly) true in Islam (as far as I understand it). And, of course, I did feel a bit of that old fear I've previously mentioned return, as end time scenarios tend to do that too me (especially Biblical-esque ones, given my Catholic up-bringing in my early life).In the end, and while being good explanations for what is believed in Islam regarding Jinn and the end of days, none of these videos did anything to move me closer to accepting the Unseen.

Truthfully, other than some sort of undeniable evidence, I don't know what might.

I think there will come a time, where perhaps the only thing you may doubt is the hereafter.. or something. Allah knows best.

But never underestimate any information on Islam!

[Search]

:bism: (In the Name of God, the Most Beneficent, the Most Merciful)

@MisterK

Hey, hope you're doing well, and like I'd told you, I will update this thread; and I now have. Best wishes for everything!

There was a dream which I'd seen some time ago before this journey started of me learning Islam, and at the time I didn't know what it meant. I saw myself in prostration with a bright white blinding light directly coming overhead from the roof. Islamically, that means guidance. I just didn't know at the time though what it meant - so, it was meaningless to me, but I wanted to let you know this in case you have seen or might see dreams that are of significance Islamically.

Islamically, dreams are considered of three types: 1) from the nafs (ego) and therefore meaningless, 2) shaitaan (satan), and 3) from Allah. If your heart is pleased with a dream, then it's from God. However, if your heart is displeased, then it's probably from shaitaan or nafs. Prophet :saws: (peace and blessings be upon him) said in the context of dreams being true during the Last Days, “That will be because the Prophethood and its effects will be so far away in time, so the believers will be given some compensation in the form of dreams which will bring them some good news or will help them to be patient and steadfast in their faith.”

Anyway, back to the topic of how I came to believe the unseen per Islam: Well, like I told you, I was an atheist, then described myself as spiritual even though I was still an atheist because of yoga and my project on witchcraft, and then my journey continued onward about learning Islam after I'd taken time off instead of going directly to law schools. Okay, we all have things in our life that haven't made much sense. Well, those things that had never made sense to me about my life prior to this made sense to me in light of Islam and what I'd been learning from Islam. I'd actually watched a lot of videos about Islam during that time and also contemplated a lot on certain ayats (verses) of Quran for actually hours at a time. I loved and learned so much about Islam from YouTube videos to other materials and articles online to the point that I'd started kind of believing in Islam, but like I'd told you, I didn't want to live a life of Islam.

For some reason, during this time, I came across the 99 names of Allah to which I'm linking you and in Arabic I recited the 99 names and then repeated some and I felt my whole body vibrating. I'd never experienced anything like it. To me, experiencing myself the vibration through recitation of 99 names of Allah further opened my mind to Islam, because I have never experienced this kind of vibration otherwise.

Also, during this time, since I've already spoke to you of my interest in witchcraft/black magic, I'd also found a video of a Satanist who'd repented from his Satanism. In a 9-hour long video in which he was interviewed, he spoke many things which were spooky, but what really interested me is the connectivity I could see with sihr (witchcraft) as described in Islam being a reality as well as during this time, I'd somehow also become interested in finding out if I had ever been the object of sihr or jinn. Somehow, I wound up through my study on this Forum called Ruqya Shariah Forum in which I learned specifically of how to cure oneself of sihr or jinn. Two books that I'd recommend to you on this subject which I'm attaching as a PDF are Jinn and Human Sickness and Sword Against Black Magic and Evil Magicians. So, I started reciting some of the recommended Quran ayats (verses) and Sunnah (prophetic) duas (supplications) as per Islam and you can imagine my surprise when I started having dreams indicating that I had long ago without my knowledge been a target of sihr and through my recitation was destroying sihr. As you can imagine, this not only freaked me out but I started really accepting the unseen as per Islam. More importantly, I distinctly remember the incident of a raqi (Islamic healer) saying that if there was a triangle-type spot on the body that the specific remedy required a specific recitation, and I did that recitation and saw before my very own eyes that triangle-type spot moving on my arm and then shrinking and changing its shape! I was seriously gobsmacked. Not only that, I began to "see" things like "energy parasites" in the form of spiders, things.

Then, alongside this happening, I'd also due to earlier having been troubled by the concept of unseen and sihr, I'd been experiencing a bit of insomnia and I'd read an article about how this person who was a chain-smoker couldn't quit smoking despite having tried various methods and in the end he hit upon the remedy of playing the Quran at night when sleeping with the intention that he'd cure himself of smoking and he'd become successful in then quitting the bad habit. I'd then thought if I could maybe get myself to be cured of this bit of insomnia, I'd be more relaxed and so I started playing the Quran at night too and been sleeping more peacefully. If you want to try something similar with whatever intention, you could try playing some audios at a low volume through the night too from this site as it has the same reciter to whom I'd listened known as Fares Abbad: Quran Audio.

Also, during this time, I'd also really started experiencing a love of God, not seeing God as an angry being or one looking to punish but as Being that is both merciful and just. This love had been increasing all along that I'd been learning about Islam and with watching so many YouTube videos on Islam until it finally culminated to the point where I'd as you know asked a theist about God and been told to think of God as a Power with power over all. The things I'd fought inside of myself such as wondering if I could ever discipline myself enough to read salat (prayer) and the like seemed so small now and manageable not because I was suddenly someone who could discipline myself but because I truly somewhere started believing that I could accomplish anything with the power and help of Allah and I was starting to become more humbled. More importantly, what I didn't realize (but I now realize) is that love can accomplish what fear or some other things can't. When I didn't love God, I couldn't accept anything that would ask me to discipline myself but nothing seemed to matter - rules or whatever - when I did start loving God because I actually wanted to submit. After realizing that love and humility in my heart, I made the sincere dua (supplication) (and this was during Ramadan which I now realize was the 27th Ramadan considered to be the Night of Power) for guidance from God. I made the dua (supplication) for guidance and for God to make the religion easy for me because I now believed in it as the Truth from God and therefore asked to make praying salat (prayer) easy for me as (at that moment in time) that was the thing that was concerning for me as I honestly didn't think I would be able to do so 5 times a day. Alhamdhullilah (thanks, praise, and credit to God), my dua (supplications) was accepted because despite the many flaws I have as a person and as a Muslim, salat (prayer) is one thing that God has made extremely easy for me despite me being generally still an undisciplined person in other areas of my life.

Like I'd told you, I'm not an especially modest person. I have read stories of how some females were modest and therefore attracted to Islam. Honestly, this part was a challenge for me, and though I'd started dressing modestly, I don't think I wore the hijab until three(?) years after my heart had submitted to Islam.

Also, in regards to the unseen, I have to tell you that I no longer have trouble with it because primarily of my experience with unseen. Through the practice of Quran and Sunnah (prophetic footsteps) and duas (supplications), my heart's inner eye known as basira in Arabic is relatively open though not as open as a person who probably is more conversant with all of the aforesaid more than I am and I still am getting a handle on things and Islamic meditation helps.

If you want your basira (inner eye) open, I think you should do so with the intention of meeting Prophet Muhammad :saws: (peace and blessings be upon him) in either a dream or open vision that you can trust by reading this salawat/durood (blessings upon the prophet) which when I'd once read as a Muslim had led me to see a movie-like dream that had completely shocked me and had come true. The particular salawat/durood that I'm speaking of is known as Durood Fatih which in transliteration (which is a life-saver for persons like me who do not know Arabic) is: Allahumma salli ' wa sallim was baarik ala Sayyidina Muhammadil nil-fatihi lima Ughliqa wal khatimi lima sabaqa wan-naa-siril-haqqi bil-haqqi wal-hadi ila Sirati-kal-mustaqima sal-lal-lahu 'alayhi wa 'ala alihi wa-ashaabihi haqqa qadrihi wa-miq-da rihil-'azim. The translation of the Durood Fatih is: "O God bless our Master Muhammad (pbuh) who opened what had been closed, and who is the Seal of what had gone before, he who makes the Truth Victorious by the Truth, the guide to thy straight path, and bless his household as is the due of his immense position and grandeur." And I think you should read it 11 times before sleeping at night with the intention that God enables a meeting to happen between you and Prophet Muhammad :saws: (peace and blessings be upon him) and if that meeting happens, in the dream, you should probably ask for your heart to become firm upon the Truth, for him (peace and blessings to be upon you) to pray for your welfare in dunya (world) and aakhirah (hereafter) and for you to be blessed with a wonderful spouse and partner to enjoy the blessings of both dunya (hereafter) and aakhirah (hereafter), and to enable you to drink from the Kausar river in Paradise.

And in case you're wondering, yes, I have seen Prophet Muhammad :saws: (peace and blessings be upon him) in my dreams. And Prophet :saws: (peace and blessings be upon him) said, “Whoever has seen me in a dream, then no doubt, he has seen me, for Satan cannot imitate my shape."

Now, unfortunately, one of the things that I'm really waiting for - lol :P- is the one about marriage coming true as that still hasn't happened, and it is one of my greatest wishes to have that come true. I also trust God that whatever happens will be for the best (and I'm gonna be okay whether I'm a single or a married person), but obviously, I want to enjoy the blessing and coolness of married life and children.

Also, in the meantime, I want you to know something about faith as per Islam; to be honest, I think faith is a muscle that has to be exercised just any like any other muscle if you want it to strengthen. I say this because I remember trying to talk to God during my journey in which I hadn't yet submitted to Islam but was coming closer and closer to Islam, and I felt so weird. I felt off and out of place and like I was a village idiot, because like I'd told you back then I still had problems accepting the unseen and to be honest I hadn't prayed for so long that I forgot what it was supposed to be like. So, that was very strange for myself, but as I started believing in Islam, it became easier and easier until it felt as natural as breathing to me when I embraced Islam from my heart.

Now, I'm not a perfect Muslim, and though I wish I was, I try to remember the directive of Prophet :saws: from a larger hadith (prophetic tradition: "Do the best you can." And yes, I try, and I'm sure I fall short, but I think that's okay because I know Allah knows I'm trying.

I'd also ask you to watch these videos first after you've read my post because hopefully they'll open your heart to Islam further just as they did mine:
Top American Surgeon Embraced Islam
Divine Prologue 1
Divine Prologue 2

Finally, when you're open to Islam and have tried and tested some of the above stuff, keep us updated and let us know how you're progressing. And of course, all success is with God. By the way, if/when you do embrace Islam, I ask you to please also pray for your family's hearts to be opened to submission to God and for them to be guided as well and for them to be a positive force and influence in your life and to pray for anything that concerns you about your life presently like a job or marital partner or whatever and to also pray for all believers to be protected against all evil and harm.

Also, if you're wondering what the purpose of Islam is, well...Prophet Muhammad :saws: himself said, “I have been sent to perfect noble character.” That was the mission of Islam, to enable our characters to be perfected so we can be in perfection just as our souls were in Heaven, to be in submission to God and in harmony with all.

I apologize again if this is a very long post, and if you have follow-up questions, you can PM me or we can continue our conversation here depending on your comfort level.

Wishing you awesomeness and happiness as you continue to learn,

[MisterK]

:bism: (In the Name of God, the Most Beneficent, the Most Merciful)

@MisterK

Hey, hope you're doing well, and like I'd told you, I will update this thread; and I now have. Best wishes for everything!

There was a dream which I'd seen some time ago before this journey started of me learning Islam, and at the time I didn't know what it meant. I saw myself in prostration with a bright white blinding light directly coming overhead from the roof. Islamically, that means guidance. I just didn't know at the time though what it meant - so, it was meaningless to me, but I wanted to let you know this in case you have seen or might see dreams that are of significance Islamically.

Islamically, dreams are considered of three types: 1) from the nafs (ego) and therefore meaningless, 2) shaitaan (satan), and 3) from Allah. If your heart is pleased with a dream, then it's from God. However, if your heart is displeased, then it's probably from shaitaan or nafs. Prophet :saws: (peace and blessings be upon him) said in the context of dreams being true during the Last Days, “That will be because the Prophethood and its effects will be so far away in time, so the believers will be given some compensation in the form of dreams which will bring them some good news or will help them to be patient and steadfast in their faith.”

Anyway, back to the topic of how I came to believe the unseen per Islam: Well, like I told you, I was an atheist, then described myself as spiritual even though I was still an atheist because of yoga and my project on witchcraft, and then my journey continued onward about learning Islam after I'd taken time off instead of going directly to law schools. Okay, we all have things in our life that haven't made much sense. Well, those things that had never made sense to me about my life prior to this made sense to me in light of Islam and what I'd been learning from Islam. I'd actually watched a lot of videos about Islam during that time and also contemplated a lot on certain ayats (verses) of Quran for actually hours at a time. I loved and learned so much about Islam from YouTube videos to other materials and articles online to the point that I'd started kind of believing in Islam, but like I'd told you, I didn't want to live a life of Islam.

For some reason, during this time, I came across the 99 names of Allah to which I'm linking you and in Arabic I recited the 99 names and then repeated some and I felt my whole body vibrating. I'd never experienced anything like it. To me, experiencing myself the vibration through recitation of 99 names of Allah further opened my mind to Islam, because I have never experienced this kind of vibration otherwise.

Also, during this time, since I've already spoke to you of my interest in witchcraft/black magic, I'd also found a video of a Satanist who'd repented from his Satanism. In a 9-hour long video in which he was interviewed, he spoke many things which were spooky, but what really interested me is the connectivity I could see with sihr (witchcraft) as described in Islam being a reality as well as during this time, I'd somehow also become interested in finding out if I had ever been the object of sihr or jinn. Somehow, I wound up through my study on this Forum called Ruqya Shariah Forum in which I learned specifically of how to cure oneself of sihr or jinn. Two books that I'd recommend to you on this subject which I'm attaching as a PDF are Jinn and Human Sickness and Sword Against Black Magic and Evil Magicians. So, I started reciting some of the recommended Quran ayats (verses) and Sunnah (prophetic) duas (supplications) as per Islam and you can imagine my surprise when I started having dreams indicating that I had long ago without my knowledge been a target of sihr and through my recitation was destroying sihr. As you can imagine, this not only freaked me out but I started really accepting the unseen as per Islam. More importantly, I distinctly remember the incident of a raqi (Islamic healer) saying that if there was a triangle-type spot on the body that the specific remedy required a specific recitation, and I did that recitation and saw before my very own eyes that triangle-type spot moving on my arm and then shrinking and changing its shape! I was seriously gobsmacked. Not only that, I began to "see" things like "energy parasites" in the form of spiders, things.

Then, alongside this happening, I'd also due to earlier having been troubled by the concept of unseen and sihr, I'd been experiencing a bit of insomnia and I'd read an article about how this person who was a chain-smoker couldn't quit smoking despite having tried various methods and in the end he hit upon the remedy of playing the Quran at night when sleeping with the intention that he'd cure himself of smoking and he'd become successful in then quitting the bad habit. I'd then thought if I could maybe get myself to be cured of this bit of insomnia, I'd be more relaxed and so I started playing the Quran at night too and been sleeping more peacefully. If you want to try something similar with whatever intention, you could try playing some audios at a low volume through the night too from this site as it has the same reciter to whom I'd listened known as Fares Abbad: Quran Audio.

Also, during this time, I'd also really started experiencing a love of God, not seeing God as an angry being or one looking to punish but as Being that is both merciful and just. This love had been increasing all along that I'd been learning about Islam and with watching so many YouTube videos on Islam until it finally culminated to the point where I'd as you know asked a theist about God and been told to think of God as a Power with power over all. The things I'd fought inside of myself such as wondering if I could ever discipline myself enough to read salat (prayer) and the like seemed so small now and manageable not because I was suddenly someone who could discipline myself but because I truly somewhere started believing that I could accomplish anything with the power and help of Allah and I was starting to become more humbled. More importantly, what I didn't realize (but I now realize) is that love can accomplish what fear or some other things can't. When I didn't love God, I couldn't accept anything that would ask me to discipline myself but nothing seemed to matter - rules or whatever - when I did start loving God because I actually wanted to submit. After realizing that love and humility in my heart, I made the sincere dua (supplication) (and this was during Ramadan which I now realize was the 27th Ramadan considered to be the Night of Power) for guidance from God. I made the dua (supplication) for guidance and for God to make the religion easy for me because I now believed in it as the Truth from God and therefore asked to make praying salat (prayer) easy for me as (at that moment in time) that was the thing that was concerning for me as I honestly didn't think I would be able to do so 5 times a day. Alhamdhullilah (thanks, praise, and credit to God), my dua (supplications) was accepted because despite the many flaws I have as a person and as a Muslim, salat (prayer) is one thing that God has made extremely easy for me despite me being generally still an undisciplined person in other areas of my life.

Like I'd told you, I'm not an especially modest person. I have read stories of how some females were modest and therefore attracted to Islam. Honestly, this part was a challenge for me, and though I'd started dressing modestly, I don't think I wore the hijab until three(?) years after my heart had submitted to Islam.

Also, in regards to the unseen, I have to tell you that I no longer have trouble with it because primarily of my experience with unseen. Through the practice of Quran and Sunnah (prophetic footsteps) and duas (supplications), my heart's inner eye known as basira in Arabic is relatively open though not as open as a person who probably is more conversant with all of the aforesaid more than I am and I still am getting a handle on things and Islamic meditation helps.

If you want your basira (inner eye) open, I think you should do so with the intention of meeting Prophet Muhammad :saws: (peace and blessings be upon him) in either a dream or open vision that you can trust by reading this salawat/durood (blessings upon the prophet) which when I'd once read as a Muslim had led me to see a movie-like dream that had completely shocked me and had come true. The particular salawat/durood that I'm speaking of is known as Durood Fatih which in transliteration (which is a life-saver for persons like me who do not know Arabic) is: Allahumma salli ' wa sallim was baarik ala Sayyidina Muhammadil nil-fatihi lima Ughliqa wal khatimi lima sabaqa wan-naa-siril-haqqi bil-haqqi wal-hadi ila Sirati-kal-mustaqima sal-lal-lahu 'alayhi wa 'ala alihi wa-ashaabihi haqqa qadrihi wa-miq-da rihil-'azim. The translation of the Durood Fatih is: "O God bless our Master Muhammad (pbuh) who opened what had been closed, and who is the Seal of what had gone before, he who makes the Truth Victorious by the Truth, the guide to thy straight path, and bless his household as is the due of his immense position and grandeur." And I think you should read it 11 times before sleeping at night with the intention that God enables a meeting to happen between you and Prophet Muhammad :saws: (peace and blessings be upon him) and if that meeting happens, in the dream, you should probably ask for your heart to become firm upon the Truth, for him (peace and blessings to be upon you) to pray for your welfare in dunya (world) and aakhirah (hereafter) and for you to be blessed with a wonderful spouse and partner to enjoy the blessings of both dunya (hereafter) and aakhirah (hereafter), and to enable you to drink from the Kausar river in Paradise.

And in case you're wondering, yes, I have seen Prophet Muhammad :saws: (peace and blessings be upon him) in my dreams. And Prophet :saws: (peace and blessings be upon him) said, “Whoever has seen me in a dream, then no doubt, he has seen me, for Satan cannot imitate my shape."

Now, unfortunately, one of the things that I'm really waiting for - lol :P- is the one about marriage coming true as that still hasn't happened, and it is one of my greatest wishes to have that come true. I also trust God that whatever happens will be for the best (and I'm gonna be okay whether I'm a single or a married person), but obviously, I want to enjoy the blessing and coolness of married life and children.

Also, in the meantime, I want you to know something about faith as per Islam; to be honest, I think faith is a muscle that has to be exercised just any like any other muscle if you want it to strengthen. I say this because I remember trying to talk to God during my journey in which I hadn't yet submitted to Islam but was coming closer and closer to Islam, and I felt so weird. I felt off and out of place and like I was a village idiot, because like I'd told you back then I still had problems accepting the unseen and to be honest I hadn't prayed for so long that I forgot what it was supposed to be like. So, that was very strange for myself, but as I started believing in Islam, it became easier and easier until it felt as natural as breathing to me when I embraced Islam from my heart.

Now, I'm not a perfect Muslim, and though I wish I was, I try to remember the directive of Prophet :saws: from a larger hadith (prophetic tradition: "Do the best you can." And yes, I try, and I'm sure I fall short, but I think that's okay because I know Allah knows I'm trying.

I'd also ask you to watch these videos first after you've read my post because hopefully they'll open your heart to Islam further just as they did mine:
Top American Surgeon Embraced Islam
Divine Prologue 1
Divine Prologue 2

Finally, when you're open to Islam and have tried and tested some of the above stuff, keep us updated and let us know how you're progressing. And of course, all success is with God. By the way, if/when you do embrace Islam, I ask you to please also pray for your family's hearts to be opened to submission to God and for them to be guided as well and for them to be a positive force and influence in your life and to pray for anything that concerns you about your life presently like a job or marital partner or whatever and to also pray for all believers to be protected against all evil and harm.

Also, if you're wondering what the purpose of Islam is, well...Prophet Muhammad :saws: himself said, “I have been sent to perfect noble character.” That was the mission of Islam, to enable our characters to be perfected so we can be in perfection just as our souls were in Heaven, to be in submission to God and in harmony with all.

I apologize again if this is a very long post, and if you have follow-up questions, you can PM me or we can continue our conversation here depending on your comfort level.

Wishing you awesomeness and happiness as you continue to learn,

Thank you for the post, Search. It is informative and gives me some tasks to undertake, I do hope they help.

I'll give this post the response it deserves once I have something to report (regardless of the outcome).

On a side note, I had begun listening to the Quran being recited a couple of weeks ago, and the reciter I've been listening happens to be Fares Abbad. I tried a few before, but I like his voice best of the ones I listened to.

[Little_Lion]

If I may make a recommendation, as you have read the Qur'an once fully, it may be time for you to also take in some lectures. There are many excellent ones on Youtube (personally I am a big fan of Yusuf Estes, especially his children's programming). I will warn you, you will NOT at this time agree with every argument they give, most likely, as that is us being human and using our brains and prior knowledge and experience. You appear to be a learned person, so I think you will find the same problem that I do when they use as evidence scientific theories that are unpopular or have been proven wrong by scientists today. Just the other day I watched a lecture that relied heavily on the Growing Earth theory, which I knew from my schooling to be (most likely and almost definitely) false. But listening to lectures will often provide you with thinking points and evidences that will not be in the interpretations of Qur'an, not because they are bad evidences, but just because there is rarely space for all the evidences to be given.

Insha'Allah some of the other good folks here can recommend some good lecture series for you. Me, I put on GuideUs TV and pretty much watch whatever comes on.

[MisterK]

Assalamu 'alaykum, brothers and sisters.

I have declared my faith through giving the shahada.

Though I had not converted until tonight, for the last three days I have been performing both wudu and the daily prayers. As I performed Isha'a tonight, I could feel a wave of emotion washing over me, making me teary-eyed. As I made dua following the final rakat, asking Allah, subhanahu wa ta'ala, to remove any veils on my heart and such, and to guide myself, family, and friends to Him, the emotion grew. I sat in silence afterwards and simply knew it was time.

I now think a large part of the previous hesitation I had was more out of fear of change such a big step like this would bring, afterall, there was no denying the pull I was feeling towards Islam despite having been a pretty staunch agnostic atheist.

Much learning remains to be done, of course, but I have taken that first big step on the path. And I thank all of who have contributed on this thread, as I don't think this would have happened were it not for all of you.

[Arfa]

Assalamu 'alaykum, brothers and sisters.

I have declared my faith through giving the shahada.

Though I had not converted until tonight, for the last three days I have been performing both wudu and the daily prayers. As I performed Isha'a tonight, I could feel a wave of emotion washing over me, making me teary-eyed. As I made dua following the final rakat, asking Allah, subhanahu wa ta'ala, to remove any veils on my heart and such, and to guide myself, family, and friends to Him, the emotion grew. I sat in silence afterwards and simply knew it was time.

I now think a large part of the previous hesitation I had was more out of fear of change such a big step like this would bring, afterall, there was no denying the pull I was feeling towards Islam despite having been a pretty staunch agnostic atheist.

Much learning remains to be done, of course, but I have taken that first big step on the path. And I thank all of who have contributed on this thread, as I don't think this would have happened were it not for all of you.

:) walikumassalam Brother,


Ma Sha Allah! SubhanAllah! Truly happy and overwhelmed when I read your post. May islam be your guiding light towards peace, hope , prosperity, fulfilment and happiness. Aameen.

[muslimah_B]

Assalamu 'alaykum, brothers and sisters.

I have declared my faith through giving the shahada.

Though I had not converted until tonight, for the last three days I have been performing both wudu and the daily prayers. As I performed Isha'a tonight, I could feel a wave of emotion washing over me, making me teary-eyed. As I made dua following the final rakat, asking Allah, subhanahu wa ta'ala, to remove any veils on my heart and such, and to guide myself, family, and friends to Him, the emotion grew. I sat in silence afterwards and simply knew it was time.

I now think a large part of the previous hesitation I had was more out of fear of change such a big step like this would bring, afterall, there was no denying the pull I was feeling towards Islam despite having been a pretty staunch agnostic atheist.

Much learning remains to be done, of course, but I have taken that first big step on the path. And I thank all of who have contributed on this thread, as I don't think this would have happened were it not for all of you.

Walaykum asalam warahmatullahi wabarakatahu

I know im like a year late replying to this but i was literally wondering if you took your shahada hoping Allah guided you and helped you overcome the difficulties you was facing

BUT im sooo happy for you I was crying reading you took your shahada just Alhamdulillah! What great news to read after such a long time away from Ib !

May Allah make your journey easy & keep you steadfast on your deen...Ameen

[Supernova]

Walaykum asalam warahmatullahi wabarakatahu

I know im like a year late replying to this but i was literally wondering if you took your shahada hoping Allah guided you and helped you overcome the difficulties you was facing

BUT im sooo happy for you I was crying reading you took your shahada just Alhamdulillah! What great news to read after such a long time away from Ib !

May Allah make your journey easy & keep you steadfast on your deen...Ameen

Its OK to reply to threads late. It serves as a lesson for one and all alike. This is the very reason that threads are left open. :popcorn: