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azc
03-31-2017, 06:46 PM
Ummah is divided in different dimensions. Differences in opinion and sectarian ideology is too much. Can we be united..?
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Scimitar
03-31-2017, 06:47 PM
Not until the rightful leader appears, and even then, many will oppose him.

So - this is a VERY open question with no real answer.

format_quote Originally Posted by azc
Differences in opinion and sectarian ideology is too much.
they do not affect our theology, so in that sense we are a united people.

All our sects in Islam are politically divided, not theologically which is what matters most ;)

Scimi
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azc
03-31-2017, 06:54 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Scimitar
Not until the rightful leader appears, and even then, many will oppose him.So - this is a VERY open question with no real answer.they do not affect our theology, so in that sense we are a united people.All our sects in Islam are politically divided, not theologically which is what matters most ;)Scimi
leaders as well as some of the scholars are also responsible for this division. I see many Muslims abstain from praying salah behind imam if belong to other group.
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Scimitar
03-31-2017, 07:06 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by azc
leaders as well as some of the scholars are also responsible for this division. I see many Muslims abstain from praying salah behind imam if belong to other group.
sad isn't it?

I recall telling you about how in Blackburn, Lancs, England UK, there are two masajid opposite each other, one a Brelwi, the other Deobandi... bro, they are like chalk n cheese with each other.

I was once engaged to a girl from Blackburn, her parents were hardcore Brelwi, and one Friday when I was there, I ended up going into the Deobandi masjid for Jummah, when I came out after salaat, her father and brother were waiting for me, looking for me at the gate of the Brelwi masjid. I turned up from behind and said salaam and they asked how long I had been outside waiting for? I replied "I was in the masjid across the road"... their faces :D

Honestly bro, some stupid crap I have seen in my life. Indian and Pakistani type stupid, if you know what I mean. Dumb crap that doesn't even need to be entertained.

Once I was at home in London, and my fiance from all those years ago asked me to go to her uncles house in East London because some Sunni Shaikh Pir Saheb was there. I said no, because I know that scam. But she was adamant I go and please her father who is currently there attending this gathering in a house.

So I went. the carpet of the ground floor was covered with rolls of material to make it more clean. The living room, was emptied. Only one sofa and table remained. All the men were sitting on the floor wearing topi's, looking solemn, doing nothing, brooding. But on the sofa, was the Pir Saheb. Fat, Obese even, a belly so large it was imposing, threatening even. His legs were like tree trunks, fatty and swollen. And so, I walked up to him, as one does, and shook his hand and "assalaam alaikum"... no waalakum salaam, he just held onto my hand for ages, saying "haaa, haaaaa" as if that was meant to impress me. Now, I don't like being made fun of. So I went into blatant mode. And I asked "did the propht ever sit above his companions in a gathering? or did he sit with them?" and snatched my hand back. Turned around, and went home.

An hour later, my fiance is ringing me, upset that I offended the whole house.

She never asked me to attend one of these again :D

It was over soon after that ;)

Scimi
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T L
03-31-2017, 09:05 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Scimitar
But on the sofa, was the Pir Saheb. Fat, Obese even, a belly so large it was imposing, threatening even. His legs were like tree trunks, fatty and swollen.
looool straight out of a book!
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Sho Islam
03-31-2017, 09:40 PM
“Allah has promised such of you who believe and do good deeds that He will surely make them to succeed (the present rulers) in the earth even as He caused those before them to succeed (others); and He will surely establish for them their religion which He has approved for them, and will give in exchange safety after their fear.” [TMQ 24:55]

Of course we will be united once again bi ithnillah
Reply

Supernova
03-31-2017, 10:05 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Scimitar
sad isn't it?

I recall telling you about how in Blackburn, Lancs, England UK, there are two masajid opposite each other, one a Brelwi, the other Deobandi... bro, they are like chalk n cheese with each other.

I was once engaged to a girl from Blackburn, her parents were hardcore Brelwi, and one Friday when I was there, I ended up going into the Deobandi masjid for Jummah, when I came out after salaat, her father and brother were waiting for me, looking for me at the gate of the Brelwi masjid. I turned up from behind and said salaam and they asked how long I had been outside waiting for? I replied "I was in the masjid across the road"... their faces :D

Honestly bro, some stupid crap I have seen in my life. Indian and Pakistani type stupid, if you know what I mean. Dumb crap that doesn't even need to be entertained.

Once I was at home in London, and my fiance from all those years ago asked me to go to her uncles house in East London because some Sunni Shaikh Pir Saheb was there. I said no, because I know that scam. But she was adamant I go and please her father who is currently there attending this gathering in a house.

So I went. the carpet of the ground floor was covered with rolls of material to make it more clean. The living room, was emptied. Only one sofa and table remained. All the men were sitting on the floor wearing topi's, looking solemn, doing nothing, brooding. But on the sofa, was the Pir Saheb. Fat, Obese even, a belly so large it was imposing, threatening even. His legs were like tree trunks, fatty and swollen. And so, I walked up to him, as one does, and shook his hand and "assalaam alaikum"... no waalakum salaam, he just held onto my hand for ages, saying "haaa, haaaaa" as if that was meant to impress me. Now, I don't like being made fun of. So I went into blatant mode. And I asked "did the propht ever sit above his companions in a gathering? or did he sit with them?" and snatched my hand back. Turned around, and went home.

An hour later, my fiance is ringing me, upset that I offended the whole house.

She never asked me to attend one of these again :D

It was over soon after that ;)

Scimi
Asalaamualaykum

Please tell me when she called you to complain & made Salaam, you replied ..........."haaa" "haaaa"
LoL
Reply

Mustafa16
03-31-2017, 10:06 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Scimitar
sad isn't it?

I recall telling you about how in Blackburn, Lancs, England UK, there are two masajid opposite each other, one a Brelwi, the other Deobandi... bro, they are like chalk n cheese with each other.

I was once engaged to a girl from Blackburn, her parents were hardcore Brelwi, and one Friday when I was there, I ended up going into the Deobandi masjid for Jummah, when I came out after salaat, her father and brother were waiting for me, looking for me at the gate of the Brelwi masjid. I turned up from behind and said salaam and they asked how long I had been outside waiting for? I replied "I was in the masjid across the road"... their faces :D

Honestly bro, some stupid crap I have seen in my life. Indian and Pakistani type stupid, if you know what I mean. Dumb crap that doesn't even need to be entertained.

Once I was at home in London, and my fiance from all those years ago asked me to go to her uncles house in East London because some Sunni Shaikh Pir Saheb was there. I said no, because I know that scam. But she was adamant I go and please her father who is currently there attending this gathering in a house.

So I went. the carpet of the ground floor was covered with rolls of material to make it more clean. The living room, was emptied. Only one sofa and table remained. All the men were sitting on the floor wearing topi's, looking solemn, doing nothing, brooding. But on the sofa, was the Pir Saheb. Fat, Obese even, a belly so large it was imposing, threatening even. His legs were like tree trunks, fatty and swollen. And so, I walked up to him, as one does, and shook his hand and "assalaam alaikum"... no waalakum salaam, he just held onto my hand for ages, saying "haaa, haaaaa" as if that was meant to impress me. Now, I don't like being made fun of. So I went into blatant mode. And I asked "did the propht ever sit above his companions in a gathering? or did he sit with them?" and snatched my hand back. Turned around, and went home.

An hour later, my fiance is ringing me, upset that I offended the whole house.

She never asked me to attend one of these again :D

It was over soon after that ;)

Scimi
that sounds awful, bro! muslims should behave better....and are you married, yet? :)
Reply

azc
04-01-2017, 08:45 AM
format_quote Originally Posted by Scimitar
sad isn't it?I recall telling you about how in Blackburn, Lancs, England UK, there are two masajid opposite each other, one a Brelwi, the other Deobandi... bro, they are like chalk n cheese with each other. I was once engaged to a girl from Blackburn, her parents were hardcore Brelwi, and one Friday when I was there, I ended up going into the Deobandi masjid for Jummah, when I came out after salaat, her father and brother were waiting for me, looking for me at the gate of the Brelwi masjid. I turned up from behind and said salaam and they asked how long I had been outside waiting for? I replied "I was in the masjid across the road"... their faces :DHonestly bro, some stupid crap I have seen in my life. Indian and Pakistani type stupid, if you know what I mean. Dumb crap that doesn't even need to be entertained.Once I was at home in London, and my fiance from all those years ago asked me to go to her uncles house in East London because some Sunni Shaikh Pir Saheb was there. I said no, because I know that scam. But she was adamant I go and please her father who is currently there attending this gathering in a house.So I went. the carpet of the ground floor was covered with rolls of material to make it more clean. The living room, was emptied. Only one sofa and table remained. All the men were sitting on the floor wearing topi's, looking solemn, doing nothing, brooding. But on the sofa, was the Pir Saheb. Fat, Obese even, a belly so large it was imposing, threatening even. His legs were like tree trunks, fatty and swollen. And so, I walked up to him, as one does, and shook his hand and "assalaam alaikum"... no waalakum salaam, he just held onto my hand for ages, saying "haaa, haaaaa" as if that was meant to impress me. Now, I don't like being made fun of. So I went into blatant mode. And I asked "did the propht ever sit above his companions in a gathering? or did he sit with them?" and snatched my hand back. Turned around, and went home.An hour later, my fiance is ringing me, upset that I offended the whole house.She never asked me to attend one of these again :DIt was over soon after that ;)Scimi
you missed the chance twice! what they said of you ''wahabi, deobandi , kafir......''..? Are you still a wahabi... Err.. I mean bachelor...
Reply

Simple_Person
04-01-2017, 10:03 AM
format_quote Originally Posted by Scimitar
sad isn't it?

I recall telling you about how in Blackburn, Lancs, England UK, there are two masajid opposite each other, one a Brelwi, the other Deobandi... bro, they are like chalk n cheese with each other.

I was once engaged to a girl from Blackburn, her parents were hardcore Brelwi, and one Friday when I was there, I ended up going into the Deobandi masjid for Jummah, when I came out after salaat, her father and brother were waiting for me, looking for me at the gate of the Brelwi masjid. I turned up from behind and said salaam and they asked how long I had been outside waiting for? I replied "I was in the masjid across the road"... their faces :D

Honestly bro, some stupid crap I have seen in my life. Indian and Pakistani type stupid, if you know what I mean. Dumb crap that doesn't even need to be entertained.

Once I was at home in London, and my fiance from all those years ago asked me to go to her uncles house in East London because some Sunni Shaikh Pir Saheb was there. I said no, because I know that scam. But she was adamant I go and please her father who is currently there attending this gathering in a house.

So I went. the carpet of the ground floor was covered with rolls of material to make it more clean. The living room, was emptied. Only one sofa and table remained. All the men were sitting on the floor wearing topi's, looking solemn, doing nothing, brooding. But on the sofa, was the Pir Saheb. Fat, Obese even, a belly so large it was imposing, threatening even. His legs were like tree trunks, fatty and swollen. And so, I walked up to him, as one does, and shook his hand and "assalaam alaikum"... no waalakum salaam, he just held onto my hand for ages, saying "haaa, haaaaa" as if that was meant to impress me. Now, I don't like being made fun of. So I went into blatant mode. And I asked "did the propht ever sit above his companions in a gathering? or did he sit with them?" and snatched my hand back. Turned around, and went home.

An hour later, my fiance is ringing me, upset that I offended the whole house.

She never asked me to attend one of these again :D

It was over soon after that ;)

Scimi
Huh? Very confusing to me. Your story is as if i am reading a science fiction story. Are there really such people? Isn't this all culture and nothing to do with Islam anymore? Also as long as the prayer as according to the Sunnah, based on what do these guys refuse to pray behind the other imaam?

Again do forgive me as this all is looking very confusing to me as if i have been living under a rock which may even be true to this. If you have more stories like this, do please share.
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azc
04-01-2017, 10:15 AM
What bro @Scimitar has experienced we see such hatred incidents day and night in subcontinent, especially in Pakistan no group is ready to accept other group
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Simple_Person
04-01-2017, 10:42 AM
format_quote Originally Posted by azc
What bro @Scimitar has experienced we see such hatred incidents day and night in subcontinent, especially in Pakistan no group is ready to accept other group
So it is pride and arrogance?
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Abz2000
04-01-2017, 10:51 AM
But that's how it was with 'aws and khazraj before the merger.
Fink about it, if everything was all hunky dory and there was no perceived drastic benefit in uniting, would they have gone out of their way to unite?
Rather they were exhausted by a senseless age old war and part of the reason for their acceptance of Islam was political.
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Eric H
04-01-2017, 11:32 AM
Greetings and peace be with you azc;

I see many Muslims abstain from praying salah behind imam if belong to other group.
This is the first and toughest stage towards unity, being able to pray together.

Blessings,

Eric
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azc
04-01-2017, 12:10 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Simple_Person
So it is pride and arrogance?
some scholars spit the venom against each other and their followers, fearlessly, declare each other kafir or mushrik. Particularly, Barelvi and ahlehadith scholars are spending this hatred business at large. Some of the deobandi scholars are also involved in munazra, mubahla
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Abz2000
04-01-2017, 12:26 PM
Just wanted to add about the chair though in case anyone mistakenly assumes things about the minbar:

Al-Bukhaari (917) and Muslim (544) narrated from Abu Haazim that a group of people came to Sahl ibn Sa‘d, and they had differed concerning the minbar and what kind of wood it was made of. He said: By Allaah, I know what kind of wood it is made of, and who made it, and I saw the Messenger of Allaah (blessings and peace of Allah be upon him) the first day he sat on it. I said to him: O Abu ‘Abbaas, tell us. He said: The Messenger of Allaah (blessings and peace of Allah be upon him) sent word to a woman of the Ansaar, saying: “Let your carpenter slave made me something of wood from which I may speak to the people.” So he made these three steps, then the Messenger of Allaah (blessings and peace of Allah be upon him) ordered that it be placed in this spot. It was made of tamarisk wood from al-Ghaabah (a wooded area near Madeenah).

Tamarisk is a tree that has no thorns. Al-Ghaabah is a well-known place near ‘Awaali al-Madeenah. What is meant is that it was made of this wood.

Ahmad (2415) narrated that Ibn ‘Abbaas said: The minbar of the Messenger of Allah (blessings and peace of Allah be upon him) was short, only three steps. Its isnaad is hasan. Al-Haythami said: It was narrated by Ahmad and its men are the men of as-Saheeh. Majma‘ az-Zawaa’id, 2/386

Muslim (1017) narrated from the hadeeth of Jareer: He (i.e., the Prophet (blessings and peace of Allah be upon him) prayed Zuhr, then he ascended a small minbar.

Al-Daarimi (41) narrated from Anas ibn Maalik that the Prophet (blessings and peace of Allah be upon him) used to stand on Fridays, leaning his back on the trunk of a palm tree that had been set up in the mosque, and he would address the people. Then a Byzantine came and said: Shall I not make for you something on which you may sit, and it will be as if you were standing. So he made for him a minbar that had two steps and he would sit on the third. When the Prophet of Allah (blessings and peace of Allah be upon him) sat on that minbar, the palm trunk made a groaning sound like the lowing of a bull, until the mosque shook, out of sorrow for (the departure of) the Messenger of Allah (blessings and peace of Allah be upon him). So the Messenger of Allah (blessings and peace of Allah be upon him) came down from the minbar and embraced it while it was groaning, and when the Messenger of Allah (blessings and peace of Allah be upon him) embraced it, it fell silent. Then he said: “By the One in Whose hand is the soul of Muhammad, if I had not embraced it, it would have carried on like that until the Day of Resurrection, out of sorrow for (the departure of) the Messenger of Allah (blessings and peace of Allah be upon him).”

Narrated by Ahmad (21252) and ad-Daarimi (36) from the hadeeth of Ubayy ibn Ka‘b.

Al-Albaani said in as-Saheehah (3/175): Its isnaad is jayyid and it meets the conditions of Muslim.

Abu Dawood (1082) narrated that Salamah ibn al-Akwa‘ said: Between the minbar of the Messenger of Allah (blessings and peace of Allah be upon him) and the wall was a space that was sufficient for a sheep to pass through.

Classed as saheeh by al-Albaani in Saheeh Abi Dawood.
There are some obvious benefits of the minbar, for instance, the ability of the speaker of the house to see the whole congregation and vice versa, it can also help with confidence and respect (looking up to one's peer - lol at the word resemblance) it is seen in parliaments, presidential addresses, royal seating etc.
Regarding the salam though, well, the fact that some big headed fools refuse to reply other than grunt, or even appar to blank people sometimes makes me feel like not even bothering since I feel angry afterwards so I think I know exactly what you mean there.
My mum told me to reply wassalam to myself and get both blessings.
Regarding the dude's stomach lol, I find it difficult to place too much blame since the guy's probably always invited to gatherings and is offered splendid feasts.


Scimi in action:

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Scimitar
04-01-2017, 12:37 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by azc
you missed the chance twice! what they said of you ''wahabi, deobandi , kafir......''..? Are you still a wahabi... Err.. I mean bachelor...
lol, the question is not exactly on topic ;)

Scimi
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Simple_Person
04-01-2017, 12:39 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by azc
some scholars spit the venom against each other and their followers, fearlessly, declare each other kafir or mushrik. Particularly, Barelvi and ahlehadith scholars are spending this hatred business at large. Some of the deobandi scholars are also involved in munazra, mubahla
Very bizarre, now i understand a bit more what brother Nouman Ali Khan was talking about, as he himself is from Pakistan.
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Eric H
04-01-2017, 12:40 PM
Greetings and peace be with you Abz2000;

Regarding the salam though, well, the fact that some big headed fools refuse to reply other than grunt, or even appar to blank people sometimes makes me feel like not even bothering since I feel angry afterwards so I think I know exactly what you mean there.
Unity starts with one person at a time, starting with me. We just have to keep praying for the other people, that they may be blesses, and then become a blessing to others.

Blessings

Eric
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Scimitar
04-01-2017, 12:47 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Abz2000
Scimi in action:

ah, pluck my life :D

Scimi
Reply

Scimitar
04-01-2017, 12:52 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Simple_Person
Huh? Very confusing to me. Your story is as if i am reading a science fiction story. Are there really such people? Isn't this all culture and nothing to do with Islam anymore? Also as long as the prayer as according to the Sunnah, based on what do these guys refuse to pray behind the other imaam?
When I first witnessed this, I was an apostate and this drove me further away from islam - that's what is really sad about this dumbness,

format_quote Originally Posted by Simple_Person
Again do forgive me as this all is looking very confusing to me as if i have been living under a rock which may even be true to this. If you have more stories like this, do please share.
Subhan Allah bro, I only posted to demonstrate the sectarian strife - I really don't want to remember the other times.

Scimi
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azc
04-01-2017, 01:01 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Scimitar
lol, the question is not exactly on topic ;)Scimi
sorry bro............ !
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Scimitar
04-01-2017, 01:07 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by azc
sorry bro............ !
hehe don't worry... in sha Allah, if it is in my destiny bro, I'll get married. Until then, Allahu Alam, right? :)

Scimi
Reply

Abz2000
04-01-2017, 01:40 PM
Originally Posted by @Simple_Person
Again do forgive me as this all is looking very confusing to me as if i have been living under a rock which may even be true to this. If you have more stories like this, do please share.
Happened to me on Plashet Road E13, most intriguing part about it was that the brother was an English revert and was aghast at the fact that I'd prayed at the Brelwi / or Deobandi (or whatever it was) run mosque, I just told him that I went to pray with good intention and I didn't have a clue as to what they'd done wrong.
Anyways, let's try and focus on getting it all together and what works since these vibes about disunity amongst the people closest in way of life to each other with usually insignificant differences are harmful and drain morale.
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Scimitar
04-01-2017, 01:52 PM
I think unity is possible on a micro level, because I have found that people in smaller groups tend to get along fine. It's when the group grows to become too large that opinions from stronger characters cause conflict, and sides get chosen. Group gets broken. Sectarian divide happens. Political, always.

On a larger macro level, leaders have to be chosen and this is where we are having problems. This is what the imperial west has understood with the Sunni Shia divide and it is thus no surprise how the Middle East was carved into nation states which pride themselves on nationalist ideals. Today, it's Kings and Statesmen who covet positions of power, when in the times of the Sahabi RA, they feared such such positions yet were under duress to accept them.

Small wonder then, in ahadeeth about Mahdi, they mention how Bayyah is given to him forcefully even though he doesn't want to accept - I believe it is only when men like this start to appear within the Muslim world that we can start to expect some unity again. And that man, from what we know will be Mahdi, according to ahadeeth. He will be on the same path as the rightly guided khaliph. Not like those who rule us today.

But hey, is anyone tired of waiting to exhale?

We don't even know what we are gonna eat tomorrow for certain. SoI believe it is wise to just carry on with life, while trying to keep our focus on akhirah.

Scimi
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Abz2000
04-01-2017, 02:00 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Scimitar
hehe don't worry... in sha Allah, if it is in my destiny bro, I'll get married. Until then, Allahu Alam, right? :)

Scimi
It appears that God keeps saving you from traps by pulling you out of non-working relationships, I sometimes envy you ...... until I look at the children playing and learning, being humble when i discipline them and trying to stop me smoking and realise that I probably wouldn't go back if given the option, but yeah, the difference in way of thinking in grown ups can be seriously depressing and make you want out, but then, how'd you divide the kids? Just cruising and stumbling along. God knows, maybe it'll all be ok some day.


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Scimitar
04-01-2017, 02:19 PM
Regarding unity in the Muslims world, it's as simple as this:

Define the borders of Muslim nations, and you've identified the core problem.

Scimi
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azc
04-01-2017, 02:42 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Scimitar
hehe don't worry... in sha Allah, if it is in my destiny bro, I'll get married. Until then, Allahu Alam, right? :)

Scimi
May Allah swt give you the best life partner. Ameen
Reply

talibilm
04-01-2017, 02:59 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by azc
Ummah is divided in different dimensions. Differences in opinion and sectarian ideology is too much. Can we be united..?
:sl:

Its the only one dua not accepted by Allah even from his beloved Nabi :saws:

If they (muslims)are not ENEMIES to each other that will a great blessing & acheivement for the Muslim Ummah and Inshaallah we can atleast dream of this .
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azc
04-01-2017, 03:10 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by talibilm
:sl:Its the only one dua not accepted by Allah even from his beloved Nabi :saws:If they (muslims)are not ENEMIES to each other that will a great blessing & acheivement for the Muslim Ummah and Inshaallah we can atleast dream of this .
:wa:At least we should respect each other
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anatolian
04-01-2017, 06:36 PM
We are supposed to have a one single Islamic state all over the world but that is not neccesary to have a unity within Muslims. There are muslims living in non-Muslim nations as well. The unity within Muslims comes with only when we put Islam above every value we have. So a muslim from Tanzania and a Muslim from Germany can feel same and united.
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talibilm
04-01-2017, 11:14 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by azc
:wa:At least we should respect each other
:sl:

Bro, can you please substantiate on this VIVIDLY since Unity among Muslims is such an important matter that Prophet :saws: even risked his fard salah once, engaged in creating unity among two Quarrelling groups of muslims.
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greenhill
04-02-2017, 02:09 AM
Can muslims be united? I think we can... the question 'will' the muslims be united? I believe No!

Why would I believe so? Because life is a test and we 'have' to make choices and those choices are laced with many factors and stuff like our real intentions, the temptations behind them etc.. but the most telling of all is that Syaitan has vowed to ...

He said: “Because thou hast thrown me out of the way, lo! I will lie in wait for them on thy straight way: Then will I assault them from before them and behind them, from their right and their left: Nor wilt thou find, in most of them, gratitude (for thy mercies).” (God) said: “Get out from this, disgraced and expelled. If any of them follow thee – Hell will I fill with you all.” (7: 16–18)

(Iblis/Satan) said: “O my Lord! Give me then respite till the Day the (dead) are raised.” (God) said: “Respite is granted thee till the Day of the Time appointed.” (Iblis) said: “O my Lord! Because Thou hast put me in the wrong, I will make (wrong) fair-seeming to them on the earth, and I will put them all in the wrong, Except Thy servants among them, sincere and purified (by Thy Grace).” (God) said: “This (way of My sincere servants) is indeed a way that leads straight to Me. For over My servants no authority shalt thou have, except such as put themselves in the wrong and follow thee.” (15: 36–42)

.. just a few verses from the Quran to say that Syaitan (Iblees) will never allow the umma to be united...


Just my 2 cents worth.



:peace:
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Eric H
04-02-2017, 06:56 AM
Greetings and peace be with you all,

Marriage should be the loving unity of one man and one woman. I can tell you that after thirty two years of marriage, this can be a struggle staying together, it is incredibly hard work. The couple must keep working at their relationship, day after day and year after year.

Multiply the problems of marriage by a billion, and now you start to comprehend the problems of uniting all Muslims. Unity always starts with 'One person' - ME. How much effort am I prepared to make, and keep making day after day, and year after year, to be united to whoever I wish to call my brother and sister.

At the heart of unity, is our willingness to pray a blessing for all people, to show forgiveness, compassion, mercy and kindness.

In the spirit of praying to 'One God'

Eric
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Abz2000
04-02-2017, 08:11 PM
We must long for and work towards acheiving unity based on the guidance of Allah which is the only source of complete justice and success in this world and in eternity, and we must hope to bring up our children in a state of being where they are heedful of Allah and don't become heedless as soon as they go out into society as many of us did. A bit like choosing one's friends wisely.

I remember the motorway signs on the way to Makkah from Yalamlam which read "Udhkur Allah" (Remember God), and I definitely didn't forget Allah even when my mind wandered off in the deserts. May Allah reward with good the groups who made the effort.
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greenhill
04-02-2017, 10:44 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Abz2000
We must long for and work towards acheiving unity based on the guidance of Allah which is the only source of complete justice and success in this world and in eternity, and we must hope to bring up our children in a state of being where they are heedful of Allah and don't become heedless as soon as they go out into society as many of us did. A bit like choosing one's friends wisely. . . . . . .
Yes, we should. Further to my earlier post, even this 'motive' is foretold by prophet Muhammad (pbuh) in his hadeeth (was it?) about the times when parents (or was it mothers?) giving birth to their masters... so it all points towards a disunited ummah . . .:hmm:


:peace:
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talibilm
04-03-2017, 12:37 AM
format_quote Originally Posted by talibilm
:sl:

Bro, can you please substantiate on this VIVIDLY since Unity among Muslims is such an important matter that Prophet :saws: even risked his fard salah once, engaged in creating unity among two Quarrelling groups of muslims.
:sl:

That hadith that narrates the above incident are here

Bukhari :: Book 2 :: Volume 22 :: Hadith 309

Narrated Sahl bin Sad:
The news about the differences amongst the people of Bani 'Amr bin 'Auf at Quba reached Allah's Apostle and so he went to them along with some of his companions to affect a reconciliation. Allah's Apostle was delayed there and the time for the prayer became due. Bilal came to Abu Bakr! and said, "O Abu Bakr! Allah's Apostle is detained (there) and the time for the prayer is due. Will you lead the people in prayer?" Abu Bakr replied, "Yes, if you wish." So Bilal pronounced the Iqama and Abu Bakr went forward and the people said Takbir. In the meantime, Allah's Apostle came piercing through thesrows till he stood in the (first) row and the people started clapping. Abu Bakr, would never look hither and thither during the prayer but when the people clapped much he looked back and saw Allah's Apostle. The Prophet beckoned him to carry on. Abu Bakr raised both his hands, praised Allah and retreated till he stood in the row and Allah's Apostle went forward and led the people in the prayer. When he had finished the prayer, he addressed the people and said, "O people! Why did you start clapping when something happened to you in the prayer? Clapping is for women. Whenever one is confronted with something unusual in the prayer one should say, 'Sub Han Allah'." Then the Prophet looked towards Abu Bakr and asked, "What prevented you from leading the prayer when I beckoned you to carry on?" Abu Bakr replied, "It does not befit the son of Al Quhafa to lead the prayer in the presence of Allah's Apostle



Bukhari :: Book 9 :: Volume 89 :: Hadith 300

Narrated Sahl bin Sa'd As-Saidi:
There was some quarrel (sighting) among Bani 'Amr, and when this news reached the Prophet, he offered the Zuhr prayer and went to establish peace among them. In the meantime the time of 'Asr prayer was due, Bilal pronounced the Adhan and then the Iqama for the prayer and requested Abu Bakr (to lead the prayer) and Abu Bakr went forward. The Prophet arrived while Abu Bakr was still praying. He entered the rows of praying people till he stood behind Abu Bakr in the (first) row. The people started clapping, and it was the habit of Abu Bakr that whenever he stood for prayer, he never glanced side-ways till he had finished it, but when Abu Bakr observed that the clapping was not coming to an end, he looked and saw the Prophet standing behind him.
The Prophet beckoned him to carry on by waving his hand. Abu Bakr stood there for a while, thanking Allah for the saying of the Prophet and then he retreated, taking his steps backwards. When the Prophet saw that, he went ahead and led the people in prayer. When he finished the prayer, he said, "O Abu Bakr! What prevented you from carrying on with the prayer after I beckoned you to do so?" Abu Bakr replied, "It does not befit the son of Abi Quhafa to lead the Prophet in prayer." Then the Prophet said to the people, "If some problem arises during prayers, then the men should say, Subhan Allah!; and the women should clap." (See Hadith No. 652, Vol. 1)
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Abz2000
04-03-2017, 06:12 AM
I remember this really catchy song in primary school assembly that went: "three great kings, I met at early morn', were on their way to meet the newly born".
well, I don't think most of the teachers knew that no such incident happened at the time of the birth in Jerusalem, or the fact that Frederick Barbarosa of Germany, Richard the Lionheart of England, and Philip II of France (the forerunners of the freemasons whose seat ended up in washington dc along with the official one eyed seal) assembled a huge army to sack and loot Jerusalem, dig for the satans' sorcery mantra inscriptions which solomon (pbuh) had buried, establish the corrupt foundations of current organized crime syndicate which includes NATO, the hellfire club, deMolay international, skull and bones, the east india company's financial backers, mark thatcher, bell pottinger, the international usurious banking cartels, fake freedom where the rich and powerful amongst people are worshipped and obeyed without a chance to question their actions, fake democracy where managers are changed by their financiers every 4-5 years regardless of expertise and ability - in case they get too attached to their jobs (an hour with the beast), and greedy bloodthirsty capitalist communism in the name of free trade.

So yes, it is useful to keep these little things in mind when considering which sheperds to entrust your children to.
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Futuwwa
04-03-2017, 09:55 AM
It is my experience that those who rant the hardest about Muslim disunity are the ones least willing to accept unity on any other basis than "everyone agree with me".
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azc
04-03-2017, 06:38 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Futuwwa
It is my experience that those who rant the hardest about Muslim disunity are the ones least willing to accept unity on any other basis than "everyone agree with me".
it may, be but I think that all scholars should come on a platform and appeal to all Muslims to be united
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Scimitar
04-03-2017, 09:45 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Abz2000
I remember this really catchy song in primary school assembly that went: "three great kings, I met at early morn', were on their way to meet the newly born".
well, I don't think most of the teachers knew that no such incident happened at the time of the birth in Jerusalem, or the fact that Frederick Barbarosa of Germany, Richard the Lionheart of England, and Philip II of France (the forerunners of the freemasons whose seat ended up in washington dc along with the official one eyed seal) assembled a huge army to sack and loot Jerusalem, dig for the satans' sorcery mantra inscriptions which solomon (pbuh) had buried, establish the corrupt foundations of current organized crime syndicate which includes NATO, the hellfire club, deMolay international, skull and bones, the east india company's financial backers, mark thatcher, bell pottinger, the international usurious banking cartels, fake freedom where the rich and powerful amongst people are worshipped and obeyed without a chance to question their actions, fake democracy where managers are changed by their financiers every 4-5 years regardless of expertise and ability - in case they get too attached to their jobs (an hour with the beast), and greedy bloodthirsty capitalist communism in the name of free trade.
Three blind mice is more fitting at this stage ;)

format_quote Originally Posted by Futuwwa
It is my experience that those who rant the hardest about Muslim disunity are the ones least willing to accept unity on any other basis than "everyone agree with me".
That irony does not escape my attention either lol

Scimi
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Eric H
04-04-2017, 05:53 AM
Greetings and peace be with you all,

I think it is worth trying to make an effort towards unity. For a number of years, I have been going into other churches maybe two or three times a month to pray with other Christians. From my experience, I often feel more welcome in other churches, than I do in my own.

All our church ministers meet once a month, to pray together, and to see what we can do better together in our town. Although I am not a minister, I attend as a part of the Street Pastor initiative, that tries to help people at risk late at night. For some time now, the ministers have been talking about 'The Church' in our town, as a recognition that we are more together than we are divided.

I think if we can work towards some kind of unity, then this will benefit our children and grandchildren more. How can we put aside our own feelings to work for the good of our community, which is always mixed.

blessings

Eric
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ardianto
04-04-2017, 01:35 PM
:sl:

When perform salah I put my hand on belly, while my friend put his hand on chest. But we can perform salah together behind same imam, no matter where the imam put his hand.

Imagine if I force my friend to perform salah like me, and my friend force me to perform salah like him?. We would never perform salah together.

Accept the difference. This is the key for unity.
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