PDA

View Full Version : The Book THEY Don't Want You To Read!!!



Scimitar
05-28-2018, 11:22 AM
In The Divine Reality, Hamza Andreas Tzortzis provides a compelling case for the rational and spiritual foundations of Islam, whilst intelligently and compassionately deconstructing atheism. Join him on an existential, spiritual and rational journey that articulates powerful arguments for the existence of God, the Qur’an, the Prophethood of Muhammad and why we must know, love and worship God.

He addresses academic and popular objections while showing how contemporary atheism is based on false assumptions about reality, which leads to incoherent answers to life’s important questions.

-Does hope, happiness and human value make sense without the Divine?
-Do we have an ultimate purpose?-Can we have consciousness and rational minds without God?
-Did the universe come from nothing?
-Does evil and suffering negate Divine mercy?
-Has scientific progress led to the denial of God?
-Are revelation and Prophethood myths?
-Is God worthy of our worship?

If you want to know how the Islamic intellectual and spiritual tradition answers these questions then this is the book for you.



Buy The Divine Reality: www.amazon.co.uk/Divine-Reality-Islam-Mirage-Atheism/dp/0996545387

Hamza Andreas Tzortzis’s new book presents a much needed comprehensive account of Islamic theism that draws upon Western and Islamic thought.

If you LIKED this video, then SUBSCRIBE to Dawah Digital for more in sh'Allah, and in return, we aim to bring you the freshest, most original Muslim content this side of youtube, in sh'Allah,

BarakAllahufeek!

The Dawah Digital Bros

EDIT: In sh'Allah, part two will be up in a few days. And in sh'Allah, every two or three days a new part will be released.
Reply

Login/Register to hide ads. Scroll down for more posts
czgibson
05-28-2018, 11:59 AM
Greetings,

If you've never read any philosophy before, you might be impressed by this book.

Peace
Reply

Scimitar
05-28-2018, 12:14 PM
Originally Posted by czgibson
Greetings,

If you've never read any philosophy before, you might be impressed by this book.

Peace
He has a masters and a postgraduate certificate in philosophy, what do you have?
Reply

czgibson
05-28-2018, 12:55 PM
Greetings,

Originally Posted by Bushwackk
He has a masters and a postgraduate certificate in philosophy, what do you have?
Do Hamza's qualifications necessarily mean he's right?

Since you ask, I have a Master's and a PGCE, plus various other qualifications related to education. How about you?

Peace
Reply

Welcome, Guest!
Hey there! Looks like you're enjoying the discussion, but you're not signed up for an account.

When you create an account, you can participate in the discussions and share your thoughts. You also get notifications, here and via email, whenever new posts are made. And you can like posts and make new friends.
Sign Up
Scimitar
05-28-2018, 02:24 PM
Originally Posted by czgibson
Greetings,



Do Hamza's qualifications necessarily mean he's right?

Since you ask, I have a Master's and a PGCE, plus various other qualifications related to education. How about you?

Peace
A Masters and PGCE ;) is hardly verifiable when you are an anonymous person on the web! Besides, I wasn't the one making the claim that his book is good only for the uninitiated, was I?

The point remains, your opinion means nothing, because you are nobody when you are anonymous! That goes for you, me and the shy person hiding behind the tree.

Hamza Tzortzis, on the other hand, is credible!

EDIT: It doesn't surprise me that his book has you rattled, in all honesty. His book puts atheists on the proverbial naughty step!
Reply

keiv
05-28-2018, 05:19 PM
Originally Posted by czgibson
Greetings,

If you've never read any philosophy before, you might be impressed by this book.

Peace
Originally Posted by czgibson
Greetings,



Do Hamza's qualifications necessarily mean he's right?

Since you ask, I have a Master's and a PGCE, plus various other qualifications related to education. How about you?

Peace


Interesting transition... Without actually discussing the contents of the book or video, you simply made the statement that those who don't have any background in philosphy might be impressed by the book as if to say they don't know any better. When confronted with the author's educational background, you then move on to essentially state that his credentials mean nothing since his views could be wrong. So really, what was the point you were initially trying to make, if there was one?
Reply

Scimitar
05-28-2018, 05:24 PM
Originally Posted by keiv
Interesting transition... Without actually discussing the contents of the book or video,
the series has them rattled ;) and I've only made one video so far on it, the others will release in due course. Can you imagine the atheist uproar arising from this??
Reply

Abz2000
05-28-2018, 05:52 PM
The title: The Book THEY Don't Want You To Read!!!

Reeks of rebellion.

The correct measure is that of Allah, the Creator and Sustainer of the heavens and the earth - does it fall in line with His spirit? If so, it's worth reading.
Reply

czgibson
05-28-2018, 08:37 PM
Greetings,

Originally Posted by Bushwackk
A Masters and PGCE ;) is hardly verifiable when you are an anonymous person on the web!
Do I have to verify anything? You either believe me or you don't. It makes no difference to me. ("Master's" has an apostrophe, by the way.)

Besides, I wasn't the one making the claim that his book is good only for the uninitiated, was I?
I'm sure plenty of ignorant people will lap it up with no objections.

Hamza Tzortzis, on the other hand, is credible!
I'm judging him on the basis of his debates on YouTube and the excerpts from this book that appear on his website. He knows a few big words and has obviously studied philosophy, but most of his arguments boil down to pure wishful thinking.

EDIT: It doesn't surprise me that his book has you rattled, in all honesty. His book puts atheists on the proverbial naughty step!
Rattled? Not even slightly. Why would it?

Peace
Reply

Scimitar
05-28-2018, 08:46 PM
Originally Posted by Abz2000
The title: The Book THEY Don't Want You To Read!!!

Reeks of rebellion.

The correct measure is that of Allah, the Creator and Sustainer of the heavens and the earth - does it fall in line with His spirit? If so, it's worth reading.
Watch the video Abz ;) Don't jump in all legs akimbo.
Reply

czgibson
05-28-2018, 08:51 PM
Greetings,

Originally Posted by keiv
Interesting transition... Without actually discussing the contents of the book or video, you simply made the statement that those who don't have any background in philosphy might be impressed by the book as if to say they don't know any better. When confronted with the author's educational background, you then move on to essentially state that his credentials mean nothing since his views could be wrong. So really, what was the point you were initially trying to make, if there was one?
I think you're seeing a contradiction where none exists. I certainly did not say that Hamza's qualifications are meaningless. The point I was initially trying to make is the point I mentioned first. Read it again a few times if you need to.

Peace
Reply

Scimitar
05-29-2018, 04:17 AM
Originally Posted by czgibson
Greetings,

Do I have to verify anything? You either believe me or you don't. It makes no difference to me. ("Master's" has an apostrophe, by the way.)
I don’t believe you! And even if I did, it wouldn’t lend you any credence in my eyes simply because you remain “unknown” in scholarly circles! Hamza, on the other hand is not only known but well respected! Despite your opinion of him ;)


Originally Posted by czgibson
I'm sure plenty of ignorant people will lap it up with no objections.
Man, you sound hopeful! Sorry to disappoint you but that’s not happening the way you like. Many an atheist have revisited their weak investment in life after reading his book and followed on by learning to study the Quran. They ended up as Muslims. But I digress. You sound hopeful... I’d even go as far as saying you almost sound desperate. Next you will be building a straw man around Hamza.



Originally Posted by czgibson
I'm judging him on the basis of his debates on YouTube and the excerpts from this book that appear on his website. He knows a few big words and has obviously studied philosophy, but most of his arguments boil down to pure wishful thinking.
I was right - that’s you laying the hay down around his cardboard cut out!

Originally Posted by czgibson
Rattled? Not even slightly. Why would it?

Peace
yet, here you are, rattled, evidently!

interesting isn’t it?
Reply

Abz2000
05-29-2018, 04:49 AM
Originally Posted by Bushwackk
Watch the video Abz ;) Don't jump in all legs akimbo.
I was referring to the video title and not the video or the book, it is wiser to measure with the rule of truth than to approach anything on the premIse of rebeliion - these are two hearts. One is serene and secure (saakinah), the other is dragging against the grain and "kicking against the pricks" (tughyaan) - the type of mindset a believer wants is serenity in all that is good and just, rebellion is made hateful to this soul.

Simply asking you to consider the psychology since the spirit of rebellion is different from the spirit of authority.

Btw, both of yous appear to be having one of those pass the parcel, spread the bets, dodgy tv debates. ;)


Rasul Allah (sal Allahu alaihi wasallam) told us that once there was a man who used to sell wine (before the advice to shun it). He would mix water in it, thereby cheating people.
He had a monkey and they went on a ship. The monkey went on top of the ship’s mast carrying with him all the money the man had made. He then proceeded to throw one coin in the ship and one in the sea till he was done with all of it. [Ahmed] :)

This hadith is talking about an earlier Ummah for whom alcohol was halal. This hadith tells us how because of cheating, only half of the money earned by the man was rightly his. This hadith also shows us how Allah (subhana wa ta’ala) used the monkey to purify the money of this man. Anything and everything can become a soldier of Allah (subhana wa ta’ala), as everything is under the command of Allah (subhana wa ta’ala). In this case, the monkey became a soldier of Allah (subhana wa ta’ala).


http://www.dailyhadith.adaptivesolut...s-of-Allah.htm
Reply

talibilm
05-29-2018, 06:34 AM
Originally Posted by czgibson
Greetings,



Do Hamza's qualifications necessarily mean he's right?

Since you ask, I have a Master's and a PGCE, plus various other qualifications related to education. How about you?

Peace
Salam :sl:

Be careful about this Hamza (Greek Revert Bro) , I had my reservations from the day 1 speech on the deen channel when he claimed to do Dawah in Greek but stumbled to translate the Shahadha in Greek and his speeches were SUPERFLUOUS he once supported the Scientific miracles of Glorious Quran but U turned later and again after a while U turned again. But after that I did not follow him much .

I do not declare anything about someone who calls himself as a muslim , Allahu Aalam , he MAY be much better Muslim than me but still for the Islamic Public with very average knowledge its better not to listen to him too much.


Jazakallah Khair

- - - Updated - - -

Originally Posted by czgibson
Greetings,



Do Hamza's qualifications necessarily mean he's right?

Since you ask, I have a Master's and a PGCE, plus various other qualifications related to education. How about you?

Peace
Salam :sl:

Be careful about Hamza , I had my reservations from the day 1 speech on the deen channel when he claimed to do Dawah in Greek but stumbled to translate Shahadha in Greek and he once supported the Scientific miracles of Glorious Quran but U turned later and again after a while U turned again. But after that I did not follow him much since I had written then about 1-2 years ago in favour of scientific miracles in the Glorious Quran proving with Verses and hadiths that clearly hinted Allah will make Islam prevail with new findings in this world , within themselves and in the horizons , Though its the nature of some Anti Islamists to create new fake records, delete old records and manipulate them to show their stance is right EVEN AT THE COST OF DISPROVING THEIR OWN HOLY BOOKS ( eg like Exodus was a Myth and never happened , Mecca was not present before 2000 years etc) just to disprove the Glorious Quran and its Last Prophet :saws:

I do not declare anything about someone who calls himself as a muslim , Allahu Aalam , he MAY be much better than me but still for the Islamic Public with very average knowledge its better not to listen to him too much.


Jazakallah Khair

@Bushwackk
Reply

Abz2000
05-29-2018, 07:19 AM
Greek is not primary scriptural source - the c before the k speaks. - not that he cares more than enough about taaghoot - as he's learned (learning?) from experience.....


وَاعْلَمُوا أَنَّ فِيكُمْ رَسُولَ اللَّهِ لَوْ يُطِيعُكُمْ فِي كَثِيرٍ مِّنَ الْأَمْرِ لَعَنِتُّمْ وَلَٰكِنَّ اللَّهَ حَبَّبَ إِلَيْكُمُ الْإِيمَانَ وَزَيَّنَهُ فِي قُلُوبِكُمْ وَكَرَّهَ إِلَيْكُمُ الْكُفْرَ وَالْفُسُوقَ وَالْعِصْيَانَ أُولَٰئِكَ هُمُ الرَّاشِدُونَ
Reply

czgibson
05-29-2018, 10:15 AM
Greetings,

Originally Posted by Bushwackk
I don’t believe you! And even if I did, it wouldn’t lend you any credence in my eyes simply because you remain “unknown” in scholarly circles! Hamza, on the other hand is not only known but well respected! Despite your opinion of him ;)
Fine. You asked the question, I gave you the answer. Now you say you don't believe the answer. It's rather like conversing with a toddler.

Of course Hamza is more well known in this area than me - that's his job! It doesn't mean he automatically speaks the truth. For example, after having spent years promoting the "scientific miracles in the Qur'an" argument, he now sees it as an "intellectual embarrassment" and fundamentally incoherent, just like I've been saying on this forum for years. Who knows, maybe this time next year Hamza will be promoting atheism?

Man, you sound hopeful! Sorry to disappoint you but that’s not happening the way you like.
Well, you seem to have fallen for it.

Many an atheist have revisited their weak investment in life after reading his book and followed on by learning to study the Quran. They ended up as Muslims. But I digress.
Many? How many, roughly? Any evidence for this assertion?

You sound hopeful... I’d even go as far as saying you almost sound desperate.
Your interpretation of my mood has nothing to do with the truth or falsity of Hamza's book. Any time you'd like to discuss the specifics of his argument, by the way, do let me know. According to one Amazon reviewer, the book gives Muslims the tools to destroy atheists intellectually. It would be nice to see someone giving that a try.

I was right - that’s you laying the hay down around his cardboard cut out!
I assumed you knew what a straw man fallacy is. Evidently not.

yet, here you are, rattled, evidently!

interesting isn’t it?
Hilarious! Tell us another!

Peace
Reply

Abz2000
05-29-2018, 06:24 PM
What's the score so far?


Originally Posted by czgibson
Who knows, maybe this time next year Hamza will be promoting atheism?
Is that when you plan to follow and obey and worship him as a "god"? Like, after you've convinced him of the error of his ways and when he sees the light?
And until then, wots ur plan? Accuse him of being the antichrist that you've shaped with your own hands and treated unjustly?

Isn't it better to be just and truthful whilst seeking the truth yourselves? Why on earth are you following him and playing chicken and "chips"? Because you believe none of it's true and because he's either a god or an impostor? But how can he be an impostor and threat if there's nothing super-natural? (The wicked fleeth when none pursueth).
Isn't he just a human being with rights? Why the brain picking?

Don't you know how to hold a vertical plumb bob yourselves and how to mark a horizontal spirit level according to truthful measure? if you don't - why deny him and dispute and reject and attempt to move the correct markings and push with the thumb when he shows you, yet still attempt to avoid responsibility by pinning your falsehood on him? How do you judge?
Also think - does holding a fixed horizontal and vertical torture device to a bent wall tell you that it's upright? And does it pass the engineering test? Or is it a scarecrow to chase away demons?


Attachment 6423

Why torture an "impostor" into measuring for you?




Surah 44. Smoke
1. Ha-Mim.
2. By the Book that makes things clear;-
3. We sent it down during a Blessed Night: for We (ever) wish to warn (against Evil).
4. In the (Night) is made distinct every affair of wisdom,
5. By command, from Our Presence. For We (ever) send (revelations),
6. As Mercy from thy Lord: for He hears and knows (all things);
7. The Lord of the heavens and the earth and all between them, if ye (but) have an assured faith.
8. There is no god but He: It is He Who gives life and gives death,- The Lord and Cherisher to you and your earliest ancestors.
9. Yet they play about in doubt.
10. Then watch thou for the Day that the sky will bring forth a kind of smoke (or mist) plainly visible,
11. Enveloping the people: this will be a Penalty Grievous.
12. (They will say: ) "Our Lord! remove the Penalty from us, for we do really believe!"
13. How shall the message be (effectual) for them, seeing that a Messenger explaining things clearly has (already) come to them,-
14. Yet they turn away from him and say: "Tutored (by others), a man possessed /crazy!"
15. We shall indeed remove the Penalty for a while, (but) truly ye will revert (to your wicked ways).
16. One day We shall seize you with a mighty onslaught: We will indeed (then) exact Retribution!
17. We did, before them, try the people of Pharaoh: there came to them an apostle most honourable,
18. Saying: "Restore to me the Servants of Allah. I am to you a messenger worthy of all trust;
19. "And be not arrogant as against Allah. for I come to you with authority manifest.
20. "For me, I have sought safety with my Lord and your Lord, against your injuring me.
21. "If ye believe me not, at least keep yourselves away from me."
22. Then he (eventually) cried to his Lord: "These are indeed a people given to crime."

23. (The reply came: ) "March forth with My Servants by night: for ye are sure to be pursued.
24. "And leave the sea as a furrow (divided): for they are a host (destined) to be drowned."
25. How many were the gardens and springs they left behind,
26. And corn-fields and noble buildings,
27. And wealth (and conveniences of life), wherein they had taken such delight!
28. Thus (was their end)! And We made other people inherit (those things)!
29. And neither heaven nor earth shed a tear over them: nor were they given a respite (again).

From Quran ch.44



14Wherefore hear the word of the LORD, ye scornful men, that rule this people which is in Jerusalem.

15Because ye have said, We have made a covenant with death, and with hell are we at agreement; when the overflowing scourge shall pass through, it shall not come unto us: for we have made lies our refuge, and under falsehood have we hid ourselves:

16Therefore thus saith the Lord GOD, Behold, I lay in Zion for a foundation a stone, a tried stone, a precious corner stone, a sure foundation: he that believeth shall not make haste.

Attachment 6424

17Judgment also will I lay to the line,
Attachment 6427
and righteousness to the plummet:
Attachment 6426

and the hail shall sweep away the refuge of lies,

and the waters shall overflow the hiding place.


18And your covenant with death shall be disannulled, and your agreement with hell shall not stand; when the overflowing scourge shall pass through, then ye shall be trodden down by it.

19From the time that it goeth forth it shall take you: for morning by morning shall it pass over, by day and by night: and it shall be a vexation only to understand the report.

Isaiah 51:4
Reply

talibilm
05-30-2018, 05:13 AM
bump
Reply

Scimitar
05-31-2018, 12:23 AM
Originally Posted by talibilm
bump
in sh'Allah More videos coming soon ;)
Reply

talibilm
06-01-2018, 06:30 AM
Originally Posted by Bushwackk
in sh'Allah More videos coming soon ;)
:sl:


About What Bro ? ( the gist)

Am seldom watching any videos. especially if its from persons whom i feel they are not worth watching. ;)

thanks
Reply

Scimitar
06-01-2018, 08:12 AM
Originally Posted by talibilm
:sl:


About What Bro ? ( the gist)

Am seldom watching any videos. especially if its from persons whom i feel they are not worth watching. ;)

thanks
Then don’t watch! More videos are still coming. Whether you want them to or not. It must make you feel all special making comments against brothers in Islam who put their names to their convictions while ironically, you (like czigibson) hide behind your anonymity on this forum lol and in the month of Ramadan! You’re no student of knowledge when your manners are so poor mr “talibilm”!
Reply

czgibson
06-01-2018, 10:18 AM
Greetings,

Originally Posted by Bushwackk
Then don’t watch!
That is definitely good advice regarding IERA propaganda.

[/QUOTE]You’re no student of knowledge when your manners are so poor mr “talibilm”![/QUOTE]

Rejecting an obvious charlatan isn't bad manners. Wise up.

Peace
Reply

talibilm
06-02-2018, 12:55 AM
Originally Posted by Bushwackk
Then don’t watch! More videos are still coming. Whether you want them to or not. It must make you feel all special making comments against brothers in Islam who put their names to their convictions while ironically, you (like czigibson) hide behind your anonymity on this forum lol and in the month of Ramadan! You’re no student of knowledge when your manners are so poor mr “talibilm”!

Dear MR Bush,

Kindly reply to My Salam first and show that you are an knowledgeable in Islam. (not a Jahil) and spread salam that.s the instruction from the Kalamullah and sahih hadith. perhaps you forgot, i give you the benefit of doubt as Every Muslim has to give his brother Muslim the Excuses

My name is with the Moderators and i want my Name to be Talibim ( Like You want to be Mr Bush, or Hitler its up to you ) since as I want to show that i like to learn and be humble from Aalims and the knowledgeable, so I learnt this hadith that has always guided me by the hidayah of Allah being a seeker of knowledge and Allah had blessed us by reminding me at this appropriate time , this hadith as a reminder to each other ( S al asr)


It was narrated from Jabir that :
the Messenger of Allah said: "Ask Allah for beneficial knowledge and seek refuge with Allah from knowledge that is of no benefit."


Do not take it as a Debate or criticism its just from the teachings of Sura Al Asr. :D


:jkk:
Reply

Scimitar
06-02-2018, 06:00 PM
Originally Posted by talibilm


Dear MR Bush,

Kindly reply to My Salam first and show that you are an knowledgeable in Islam. (not a Jahil) and spread salam that.s the instruction from the Kalamullah and sahih hadith. perhaps you forgot, i give you the benefit of doubt as Every Muslim has to give his brother Muslim the Excuses

My name is with the Moderators and i want my Name to be Talibim ( Like You want to be Mr Bush, or Hitler its up to you ) since as I want to show that i like to learn and be humble from Aalims and the knowledgeable, so I learnt this hadith that has always guided me by the hidayah of Allah being a seeker of knowledge and Allah had blessed us by reminding me at this appropriate time , this hadith as a reminder to each other ( S al asr)


It was narrated from Jabir that :
the Messenger of Allah said: "Ask Allah for beneficial knowledge and seek refuge with Allah from knowledge that is of no benefit."


Do not take it as a Debate or criticism its just from the teachings of Sura Al Asr. :D


:jkk:
More videos are coming, stay patient ;)
Reply

Hey there! Looks like you're enjoying the discussion, but you're not signed up for an account.

When you create an account, you can participate in the discussions and share your thoughts. You also get notifications, here and via email, whenever new posts are made. And you can like posts and make new friends.
Sign Up

Similar Threads

  1. Replies: 12
    Last Post: 02-04-2012, 07:25 PM
  2. Replies: 0
    Last Post: 12-14-2011, 11:55 AM
  3. Replies: 6
    Last Post: 07-17-2010, 05:13 PM
  4. Replies: 4
    Last Post: 10-26-2007, 06:52 AM
  5. Replies: 10
    Last Post: 10-16-2007, 05:51 PM

IslamicBoard

Experience a richer experience on our mobile app!