Understanding Islam

[Kittygyal]

Oh dear....where are the Christian memebers to clear this up? :D

:rant: wot are you trying to say am 1 not any more

[Umm Yoosuf]

:rant: wot are you trying to say am 1 not any more

ey?


:? :? :?

[Kittygyal]

ey?


:? :? :?

well am just saying i was one :rant:

[Umm Yoosuf]

You was what? A christian?

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[Kittygyal]

no christianity was true i don't think it was faluse :offended:

[Kittygyal]

yes a 'CHRISTIAN'

[Umm Yoosuf]

ok :)

When you was a christain, were you in disagreement that that Hitler was a Christian? .

[*Hana*]

you're suppose to be Muslim and you think Christianity is true? :? I was also a Christian and became a Muslim because Christianity has been clearly proven to be based on false doctrine.

[Umm Yoosuf]

no christianity was true i don't think it was faluse :offended:

Im confused :?

How did come to that conculsion? Are you a revert to islam?

[Umm Yoosuf]

Jazakallah for the input sister Hana :)

Islamgyal Assalaamu Alaikum :)

Can you please clear this up for me.

no christianity was true i don't think it was faluse

How did come to that conculsion? Are you a revert to islam?

[Kittygyal]

yes i am a revert

[*Hana*]

yes i am a revert

Then how can you say Christianity is not false? :?

[Kittygyal]

yea well still at the end of the day u can't say that

[*Hana*]

Ummm, well, yeah I can actually.

[Uthman]

:sl:

I don't believe it would be wise to claim that Christianity is totally false. It's just the parts of Christianity which contradict Islam that we believe are false. Please correct me if I am wrong Inshaa'Allah. :)

EDIT: My post was addressed to Sister Hana_Aku

[*Hana*]

Salam Alaikum, brother:

No, the original Gospel sent to Jesus, pbuh, is not false, but we don't have that. What the Christians claim is their salvation is absolutely false though and that's what I was referring to here. Sorry, if that wasn't clear. :)

Wasalam
Hana

[Kittygyal]

Ummm, well, yeah I can actually.

no you can't christians don't go around saying muslimz are faluse!!!!!!!!!

[*Hana*]

no you can't christians don't go around saying muslimz are faluse!!!!!!!!!

Yes, actually, they do say exactly that. Do you know how many times I've been told me and my son are going to Hell....by "devout" Christians because I don't accept Jesus, pbuh, as my saviour?

And, yes, I can say the doctrine of salvation Christians follow today is false doctrine created by Paul. Jesus, pbuh, never taught that.

Out of curiosity, why are you a Muslim if you believe in Christianity? :?

Wasalam
Hana

[Kittygyal]

well may be some christians do that not all yea!!!!!!!!!

well me mum is still a christian so why shouldn't be forward to the religion!!

[*charisma*]

Assalamu Alaikum (btw where's everyones salaams??)

Generally speaking, a true religion is considered to be 100% true, nothing less.

Unless Islam can be contradicted, it is true till proven false, correct?
Certain parts of christianity have been proven to be false already, therefore its not 100% true, and the Quran can only be proven false through its exact literal tense i.e. arabic, reason being that's its truest form with no editing, corruptions, human mistakes, etc.

Whether Christains say that Islam is false or not, they still have to bring upon their evidence, and vise versa inshallah.

fi aman Allah
w'salaam

[*Hana*]

well may be some christians do that not all yea!!!!!!!!!

well me mum is still a christian so why shouldn't be forward to the religion!!

Sister, my whole family is Christian. I don't dislike Christians. But, I still won't defend what they believe. They are following false doctrine, that's clear. It doesn't mean I don't love my family because they do.

I was once a devout Christian too, and argued with many muslims trying to defend my faith (which, I was never able to do successfully). Islam is the truth, it's that simple. :)

Wasalam
Hana

[Kittygyal]

how are they following false doctrine?

[Clasen]

Assalamu Alaikum

We know that Islam is the turth, and is the last and final revelation from Allâh.
We know that Allâh has been giving the Torah, and the Bibel, but the people
who had there hands on the books, changed them for there own good.
Thats why we cant follow the Torah or the Bibel. But if the people did not had changed it, then it would be the truth. But Quran is the final book, and Allâh
has promised of, that the Quran will never be changed.

[Kittygyal]

yea clasen i know that but how are the christians following false doctrine?

[Clasen]

well may be some christians do that not all yea!!!!!!!!!

well me mum is still a christian so why shouldn't be forward to the religion!!

She will not be abel too follow the truth, becouase the bibel has been changed so many times. If you ask a priest about, how many bibels he has at home. He will say more than 10. Then ask are they all alike? He will say no!
That must be proof enough, Insha'Allah

[Ansar Al-'Adl]

yea clasen i know that but how are the christians following false doctrine?

Christians believe that Jesus is the son of God, that he died for our sins and that Muhammad is not a Messenger of God etc. All of these things are false according to the Qur'an. Therefore, if someone is a Muslim i.e. they believe in the Qur'an, that necessitates that they view Christian doctrines as false.

:w:

[Kittygyal]

i know that the bibles are not a like

[Kittygyal]

Christians believe that Jesus is the son of God, that he died for our sins and that Muhammad is not a Messenger of God etc. All of these things are false according to the Qur'an. Therefore, if someone is a Muslim i.e. they believe in the Qur'an, that necessitates that they view Christian doctrines as false.

:w:

yea well at the end of the day christians believe wot ever they believe in and muslims believe wot they believe so what's the problem with that:?

[Umm Yoosuf]

yea well at the end of the day christians believe wot ever they believe in and muslims believe wot they believe so what's the problem with that:?

The problem is they are associating partners with Allah. Therefore their belief and their idea's are absolutely false. And for a Muslim to believe that the beliefs of Christianity are correct is bizarre.

[Kittygyal]

well they are correct

[Uthman]

:sl:

well they are correct

Not all of them.

[Umm Yoosuf]

What is correct?

[Kittygyal]

yeah not all ov em but some are

[Kittygyal]

What is correct?

the christians

[*Hana*]

What part is correct?

[Clasen]

well they are correct

The Bibel is not correct anymore, Allahu Aleem (Allâh knows best) if it ever have been.

[Kittygyal]

well wot ever the christians believe in that's them....
and the muzlims believe in the holy book they think that the book is true so the christians think that the bible is true

[Umm Yoosuf]

the christians

Please elaborate.



You said you're a revert to Islam. Meaning you stated "I bear witness that there is no deity (none truely to be worshipped) but, Allah, and I bear witness that Mohammad is the messenger of Allah", Also you believe that juses was only a messenger of god. He did not died or was killed.


Christian believe that Juses was son of god, some even believe that he is god! The believe that juses died for our sins, he is our Saviour. Thus this goes against the Islamic teaching.




"The Religion in the sight of Allah is Islam." (Qur'an 3:19)


"If unyone desires a religion other than Islam (Submission to Allah), Never will it be accepted of him; and in the Hereafter he will be in the ranks of those who have lost (their selves in the hell fire)."(Qur'an 3:85)

[*Hana*]

I see, so God is part of a trinity? Salvation is through belief as Jesus, pbuh, as the saviour? Original sin and blood atonement....all true? How about the crucifixion? Is that true too?

Sister, as a Muslim, you should know it is our responsibility to invite others to Islam. How will do that if you believe the bible is true on these things when it's the complete opposite of Islamic teaching?

You don't hate them for believing it...but we should be willing to show them the truth.

Wasalam
Hana

[Clasen]

Please brothers and sisters, dont be to hard on her, shes a reverted Muslim, Alhamdulillah. Shes confused, and im afried that shes about to get doubts...

[Kittygyal]

I see, so God is part of a trinity? Salvation is through belief as Jesus, pbuh, as the saviour? Original sin and blood atonement....all true? How about the crucifixion? Is that true too?

Sister, as a Muslim, you should know it is our responsibility to invite others to Islam. How will do that if you believe the bible is true on these things when it's the complete opposite of Islamic teaching?

You don't hate them for believing it...but we should be willing to show them the truth.

Wasalam
Hana

yea well wot ever the christians believe that's them you can't say there rong now:? :? like muzlimz believe in the holy book christians don't say muzlimz are wrong:?
do they or do they not:?

[akulion]

yes please lets start a new thread to discuss this matter and help our sis in understanding better insha'allah

[Kittygyal]

yes please lets start a new thread to discuss this matter and help our sis in understanding better insha'allah

yea i think we should so you start a new thread :okay:

[Uthman]

:sl:

I agree. We should continue this in a separate thread Inshaa'Allah.

[Clasen]

yea i think we should so you start a new thread :okay:

Okay I'll start one called "Christianity true or false?"

[Clasen]

Okay I cant...

[*Hana*]

ok New thread here

[*Hana*]

I started the new thread Christianity - True or False
I should have put it under comparative though. Ufff, oh well I'm in a hurry and have to run. :p I'll be back in a bit.

hana

[Kittygyal]

k i think we should go and talk about christianity

[akulion]

Continuing on from the "Hitler the Devout Christian" thread i think the thread is inadequately named We should have named it "Understanding Islam" or something similar since it would be based on explaining the principles to the sis

[Umm Yoosuf]

I agree with br Akulion

[Kittygyal]

ok never mind lets just start by explaining it to me plz

[Uthman]

:sl:

Those beliefs and values of Christianity which are in accordance with Islam are true.

Those which are not in accordance of Islam are false.

I don't agree with the thread title as I don't think it's a case of True or False, Black or White, Up or down, In or Out (you get the picture)

[Kittygyal]

:sl:

Those beliefs and values of Christianity which are in accordance with Islam are true.

Those which are not in accordance of Islam are false.

i just don't get that all can u kindly explain that to me plz

[Umm Safiya]

:sl:

Alright, we agree that Islam is the true religion, yeah?
Everything that goes against Islam is false..
The parts of Christianity that goes against the Islamic Beliefs is false..

:)

[Kittygyal]

yea well christianity is true aswell

[akulion]

Ok let us begin with the basics...

In Islam we believe:

-There is only one God allah

- Allah has no sons or daughters

- Allah is one and almighty

- Allah is the creator of everything

- Moses(s) was a prophet of Allah

- Jesus(s) was a prophet of Allah

- Mohammed(s) was a prophet of Allah

You get that part till now sis ?

[Kittygyal]

yeah i get that bit.... i think :(

[SolveEtCoagula]

True Esoteric Christianity will redeem churchianity

Please do not mix the exoteric (outer) teachings of the current catholic/evangelic church (St Paul) with the esoteric (inner) teachings of the current christian gnostic, theosophic and mystic community (St John).

The concept of the three big religion, Christianity, Judaism and Islam is exoteric, because the perception of God is outside.

The christian esoteric teachings exists as gnostic, theosophic and mystic communities like the Universal White Brotherhood which perceive God inside us.

In Judaism the esoteric teaching is the kabbala.

In Islam the esoteric teaching is sufism.

As you can see, true christianity is not yet fully known to the mass, but soon it will be. People like Pat Robertson are typically for exoteric christianity.

its only a question of time until exoteric christianity will be history, redeemed by esoteric christianity.

best wishes from Switzerland

lwwb
Roger

[SolveEtCoagula]

Esoteric Christianity and Exoteric Christianity

Jesus was familiar with the Cabbalah; this Science was an integral part of the Judaic tradition in which he was brought up and it was he who revealed it to St John. This is why we find so many cabbalistic elements it to St John's Apocalypse. In all spiritual traditions there is an exoteric teaching which is given to all the faithful, and an esoteric teaching which is revealed to a small minority of initiates. The exoteric aspect of Christianity is represented by St Peter and the esoteric aspect by St John. In the Gospels, St John is called 'the disciple whom Jesus loved', and his closeness to Jesus sometimes aroused some jealousy on the part of the other disciples, particularly St Peter. After the Resurrection St Peter questioned Jesus about St John and Jesus replied, 'if I will that he remain till I come, what is that to you?' And the Gospels adds, 'Then this saying went out among the brethren that this disciple would not die.? This is the source of that long-lived tradition according to which St John is still alive and he dwells with other Inititates in Agartha, waiting until that the old legends about the mysterious kingdom of Prester John originated in these words of Jesus and the fact that the early Christians took them to mean that St John would not die.

Jesus, therefore, prepared St John and St Peter for two different missions. Why did he divide his work in two in his way? Those who are familiar with the history of Initiations in the past know that all great Masters did the same thing. Moses, himself, gave one body of teaching and rules for the masses, but to the seventy elders chosen from amongst the wisest and most faithful of his followers, he entrusted the keys of his five books, the Pentateuch, and it was thanks to these keys that they were able to decipher the hidden meaning of those books. Certain truths were kept secret either because they were beyond the comprehension of the weak or because they would have put power into the hands of the wicked. This is why Jesus said, 'Do not cast your pearls before swine.' And, when his disciples asked him why he spoke to the multitude in parables, he replied, 'Because it has been given to you to know the mysteries of the kingdom of Heaven, but to them it has not been given'. All the established churches, whether Orthodox, Catholic or Protestant, are exoteric churches; they teach certain truths but their primary concern is with rules and regulations for the masses. They are unable to reveal the deepest and most mysterious truths, for only those whose minds have been tempered and made ready can accept and digest secret apspect of reality.

Jesus gave his exoteric teaching to St Peter, therefore, and his esoteric, Initiatic teaching to St John. This is how St John received the keys to the Old Testament and, in particular, to the deeply mysterious Book of Genesis. You are all familiar with the Word' which seem to echo the first words of Genesis, 'In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth.'

I know that a great many people have difficulty in accepting the idea that Jesus was familiar with the Cabbalah, but we find at least one proof that this was so in the Gospels. Do you remember the episode of the woman taken in adultery? Some Scribes and Pharisees brought a woman who had been caught in the act of adultery before Jesus. The Law of the Jews decreed that such a woman should be stoned to death and they wanted to get Jesus to tell them what they should do about it, in the hope of getting him to lay himself open to charges of breaking the Law. The Gospels says, 'But Jesus stooped down and wrote on the ground with his finger, as though he did not hear. So when they continued asking him, he raised himself up and said to them, "He who is without sin among you, let him throw a stone at her first." And again he stooped down and wrote on the ground. 'Nobody has ever explained what it was that Jesus wrote on the ground. Was he making idle marks in the dust like someone who doodles on a scrap of paper when he is bored? Was he pretending to be thinking of something else so as to avoid their questions? Neither of these, of course. Although no one has ever revealed this before, I will tell you what he was doing: he was tracing certain Cabbalistic signs and symbols with which the Scribes and Pharisees were as familiar as he was, having been schooled in the same tradition. Jesus took this way of telling them, 'If you are pure and blameless, you are free to apply the Law and punish this woman. but if you, yourselves, are guilty of the same sin, be careful what you do for, by virtue of these Cabbalistic signs you will be condemned and struck down'. Seing these – and because they understood perfectly well what they meant – they withdrew and left him alone with the woman. How can you explain that the Scribes and Pharisees, who had every justification in law for putting this adulterous woman to death, gave up their intention so readily if not because Jesus threatened them in some way?

Yes, there is no doubt about it: Jesus was familiar with the Cabbalah, and St John's Revelation cannot be interpreted without some of that same knowledge. Take, for instance, the passage about the scarlet Beast with seven heads and ten horns on which sat the Harlot, holding the golden cup full of abdominations and filth: this is obviously a reference to the evil, adverse Sephiroth known in the Cabbalah as the Kliphot. But how can anyone who does not possess the key to the secret meaning of the Apocalypse hope to interpret it correctly? St John wrote, for instance, that the number of the Beast was 666 and, failing to grasp the symbolism involved, a great many people have tried to decide to whom he was referring. Every imaginable interpretation has been given to this wretched number; it has been attributed to all the most hated tyrants of history: Napoleon, Hitler, Stalin, etc. But that is plainly ridiculous.

Christianity did not suddenly appear out of nowhere. It is the outcome of several different traditions, the most important of which is the Judaic tradition contained in the Cabbalah. This is why it is so important to have some knowledge of the Cabbalah in order to understand the Bible. Christianity possesses a vast philosophy, a science of tremendous richness but, unfortunetly, for several centuries the Church has been content to transmit only scraps of incomplete, superficial information to the faithful. Is it any wonder that they are flocking for inspiration to Japanese, Tibetan, Hindu and Sufic philosophies? The answers they receive from Christianity seem so poor and inadequate, whereas others have such a wealth of knowledge. The clergy should be ashamed of their inability to communicate the deep truths of Christianity to the faithful; they have been content to preach at them without teaching them anything, and it is only now that they see the results! It is high time that Christians began to reflect about these things, otherwise Christianity will finally disappear altogether. for my part,I am not opposed to Christianity, quite the contrary. Iwish that Christians would return to Christianity; they have no idea what it really is at all. If priests and pastors understood my attitude they should be the first to come and embrace me. But it is just the opposite: they think that I am working against Christ and against their interests. There is a great deal of misunderstanding here.

Omraam Mikhael Aivanhov

[akulion]

Good sis - continuing on with where I last left off.

- Christianity teaches that God has a son - Jesus

- This goes against what Islam teaches that God is one and has no sons or daughters

Therefore Islam and christianity dont agree here

and it is here where one must decide which is right and which is wrong.

Because if one believes in Jesus as Son of God then they are going against the basic teaching of Islam

And if one believes in God not having any sons or daughters then they are going against the teachings of Christianity

Do you understand my sis ?

[SolveEtCoagula]

Al-Serat

The Spiritual Significance of Jihad

Seyyed Hossein Nasr
Vol. IX, No. 1

And those who perform jihad for Us, We shall certainly guide them in Our ways, and God is surely with the doers of good. (Quran XXXIX; 69)

You have returned from the lesser jihad to the greater jihad. (Hadith)

The Arabic term jihad, usually translated into European languages as holy war, more on the basis of its juridical usage in Islam rather than on its much more universal meaning in the Quran and Hadith, is derived from the root jhd whose primary meaning is to strive or to exert oneself. Its translation into holy war combined with the erroneous notion of Islam prevalent in the West as the 'religion of the sword' has helped to eclipse its inner and spiritual significance and to distort its connotation. Nor has the appearance upon the stage of history during the past century and especially during the past few years of an array of movements within the Islamic world often contending or even imposing each other and using the word jihad or one of its derivative forms helped to make known the full import of its traditional meaning which alone is of concern to us here. Instead recent distortions and even total reversal of the meaning of jihad as understood over the ages by Muslims have made it more difficult than ever before to gain insight into this key religious and spiritual concept.

To understand the spiritual significance of jihad and its wide application to nearly every aspect of human life as understood by Islam, it is necessary to remember that Islam bases itself upon the idea of establishing equilibrium within the being of man as well as in the human society where he functions and fulfills the goals of his earthly life. This equilibrium, which is the terrestrial reflection of Divine Justice and the necessary condition for peace in the human domain, is the basis upon which the soul takes its flight towards that peace which, to use Christian terms, 'passeth understanding'. If Christian morality sees the aim of the spiritual life and its own morality as based on the vertical flight towards that perfection and ideal which is embodied in Christ, Islam sees it in the establishment of an equilibrium both outward and inward as the necessary basis for the vertical ascent. The very stability of Islamic society over the centuries, the immutability of Islamic norms embodied in the Shari'ah, and the timeless character of traditional Islamic civilization which is the consequence of its permanent and immutable prototype are all reflections of both the ideal of equilibrium and its realization as is so evident in the teachings of the Shari'ah (or Divine Law) as well as works of Islamic art, that equilibrium which is inseparable from the very name of islam as being related to salam or peace.

The preservation of equilibrium in this world, however, does not mean simply a static or inactive passivity since life by nature implies movement. In the face of the contingencies of the world of change, of the withering effects of time, of the vicissitudes of terrestrial existence, to remain in equilibrium requires continuous exertion. It means carrying out jihad at every stage of life. Human nature being what it is, given to forgetfulness and the conquest of our immortal soul by the carnal soul or passions, the very process of life of both the individual and the human collectivity implies the ever-present danger of the loss of equilibrium and the fact of falling into the state of disequilibrium which if allowed to continue cannot but lead to disintegration on the individual level and chaos on the scale of community life. To avoid this tragic end and to fulfill the entelechy of the human state which is the realization of unity (al-tawhid) or total integration, Muslims as both individuals and members of Islamic society must carry out jihad, that is they must exert themselves at all moments of life to fight a battle both inward and outward against those forces that if not combatted will destroy that equilibrium which is the necessary condition for the spiritual life of the person and the functioning of human society. This fact is especially true if society is seen as a collectivity which bears the imprint of the Divine Norm rather than an antheap of contending and opposing units and forces.

Man is at once a spiritual and corporeal being, a micro-cosm complete unto himself; yet he is the member of a society within which alone are certain aspects of his being developed and certain of his needs fulfilled. He possesses at once an intelligence whose substance is ultimately of a divine character and sentiments which can either veil his intelligence or abett his quest for his own Origin. In him are found both love and hatred, generosity and coveteousness, compassion and aggression. Moreover, there have existed until now not just one but several 'humanities' with their own religious and moral norms and national, ethnic and racial groups with their own bonds of affiliation. As a result the practice of jihad as applied to the world of multiplicity and the vicissitudes of human existence in the external world has come to develop numerous ramifications in the fields of political and economic activity and in social life and come to partake on the external level of the complexity which characterizes the human world.

In its most outward sense jihad came to mean the defence of dar al-islam, that is, the Islamic world, from invasion and intrusion by non-Islamic forces. The earliest wars of Islamic history which threatened the very existence of the young community came to be known as jihad par excellence in this outward sense of 'holy war'. But it was upon returning from one of these early wars, which was of paramount importance in the survival of the newly established religious community and therefore of cosmic significance, that the Prophet nevertheless said to his companions that they had returned from the lesser holy war to the greater holy war, the greater jihad being the inner battle against all the forces which would prevent man from living according to the theomorphic norm which is his primordial and God given nature. Throughout Islamic history, the lesser holy war has echoed in the Islamic world when parts or the whole of that world have been threatened by forces from without or within. This call has been especially persistent since the nineteenth century with the advent of colonialism and the threat to the very existence of the Islamic world. It must be remembered, however, that even in such cases when the idea of jihad has been evoked in certain parts of the Islamic world, it has not usually been a question of religion simply sanctioning war but of the attempt of a society in which religion remains of central concern to protect itself from being conquered either by military and economic forces or by ideas of an alien nature. This does not mean, however, that in some cases especially in recent times, religious sentiments have not been used or misused to intensify or legitimize a conflict. But to say the least, the Islamic world does not have a monopoly on this abuse as the history of other civilizations including even the secularized West demonstrates so amply. Moreover, human nature being what it is, once religion ceases to be of central significance to a particular human collectivity, then men fight and kill each other for much less exalted issues than their heavenly faith. By including the question of war in its sacred legislation, Islam did not condone but limited war and its consequences as the history of the traditional Islamic world bears out. In any case the idea of total war and the actual practice of the extermination of whole civilian populations did not grow out of a civilization whose dominant religion saw jihad in a positive light. On the more external level, the lesser jihad also includes the socio-economic domain. It means the reassertion of justice in the external environment of human existence starting with man himself. To defend one's rights and reputation, to defend the honour of oneself and one's family is itself a jihad and a religious duty. So is the strengthening of all those social bonds from the family to the whole of the Muslim people (al-ummah) which the Shari'ah emphasizes. To seek social justice in accordance with the tenets of the Quran and of course not in the modern secularist sense is a way of re-establishing equilibrium in human society, that is, of performing jihad, as are constructive economic enterprises provided the well-being of the whole person is kept in mind and material welfare does not become an end in itself; provided one does not lose sight of the Quranic verse, 'The other world is better for you than this one'. To forget the proper relation between the two worlds would itself be instrumental in bringing about disequilibrium and would be a kind of jihad in reverse.

All of those external forms of jihad would remain incomplete and in fact contribute to an excessive externalization of human being, if they were not complemented by the greater or inner jihad which man must carry out continuously within himself for the nobility of the human state resides in the constant tension between what we appear to be and what we really are and the need to transcend ourselves throughout this journey of earthly life in order to become what we 'are'.

From the spiritual point of view all the 'pillars' of Islam can be seen as being related to jihad. The fundamental witnesses, 'There is no divinity but Allah' and 'Muhammad is the Messenger of Allah', through the utterance of which a person becomes a Muslim are not only statements about the Truth as seen in the Islamic perspective but also weapons for the practice of inner jihad. The very form of the first witness (La ilaha illa' Lla-h in Arabic) when written in Arabic calligraphy is like a bent sword with which all otherness is removed from the Supreme Reality while all that is positive in manifestation is returned to that Reality. The second witness is the blinding assertion of the powerful and majestic descent of all that constitutes in a positive manner the cosmos, man and revelation from that Supreme Reality. To invoke the two witnesses in the form of the sacred language in which they were revealed is to practice the inner jihad and to bring about awareness of who we are, from whence we come and where is our ultimate abode.

The daily prayers (salat or namaz) which constitute the heart of the Islamic rites are again a never ending jihad which punctuate human existence in a continuous rhythm in conformity with the rhythm of the cosmos. To perform the prayers with regularity and concentration requires the constant exertion of our will and an unending battle and striving against forgetfulness, dissipation and laziness. It is itself a form of spiritual warfare.

Likewise, the fast of Ramadan in which one wears the armour of inner purity and detachment against the passions and temptations of the outside world requires an asceticism and inner discipline which cannot come about except through an inner holy war. Nor is the hajj to the centre of the Islamic world in Mecca possible without long preparation, effort, often suffering and endurance of hardship. It requires great effort and exertion so that the Prophet could say, 'The hajj is the most excellent of all jihads". Like the knight in quest of the Holy Grail, the pilgrim to the house of the Beloved must engage in a spiritual warfare whose end makes all sacrifice and all hardship pale into significance, for the hajj to the House of God implies for the person who practices the inner jihad encounter with the Master of the House who also resides at the centre of that other Ka'bah which is the heart.

Finally the giving of zakat or religious tax and khums is again a form of jihad not only in that in departing from one's wealth man must fight against the coveteousness and greed of his carnal soul, but also in that through the payment of zakat and khums in its many forms man contributes to the establishment of economic justice in human society. Although jihad is not one of the 'pillars of Islam', it in a sense resides within all the other 'pillars'. From the spiritual point of view in fact all of the 'pillars' can be seen in the light of an inner jihad which is essential to the life of man from the Islamic point of view and which does not oppose but complements contemplativity and the peace which result from the contemplation of the One.

The great stations of perfection in the spiritual life can also be seen in the light of the inner jihad. To become detached from the impurities of the world in order to repose in the purity of the Divine Presence requires an intense jihad for our soul has its roots sunk deeply into the transient world which the soul of fallen man mistakes for reality. To overcome the lethargy, passivity and indifference of the soul, qualities which have become second nature to man as a result of his forgetting who he is constitutes likewise a constant jihad. To pull the reigns of the soul from dissipating itself outwardly as a result of its centrifugal tendencies and to bring it back to the centre wherein resides Divine Peace and all the beauty which the soul seeks in vain in the domain of multiplicity is again an inner jihad. To melt the hardened heart into a flowing stream of love which would embrace the whole of creation in virtue of the love for God is to perform the alchemical process of solve et coagula inwardly through a 'work' which is none other than an inner struggle and battle against what the soul has become in order to transform it into that which it 'is' and has never ceased to be if only it were to become aware of its own nature. Finally, to realize that only the Absolute is absolute and that only the Self can ultimately utter 'I' is to perform the supreme jihad of awakening the soul from the dream of forgetfulness and enabling it to gain the supreme principal knowledge for the sake of which it was created. The inner jihad or warfare seen spiritually and esoterically can be considered therefore as the key for the understanding of the whole spiritual process, and the path for the realization of the One which lies at the heart of the Islamic message seen in its totality. The Islamic path towards perfection can be conceived in the light of the symbolism of the greater jihad to which the Prophet of Islam, who founded this path on earth, himself referred.

In the same way that with every breath the principle of life which functions in us irrespective of our will and as long as it is willed by Him who created us, exerts itself through jihad to instill life within our whole body, at every moment in our conscious life we should seek to perform jihad in not only establishing equilibrium in the world about us but also in awakening to that Divine Reality which is the very source of our consciousness. For the spiritual man, every breath is a reminder that he should continue the inner jihad until he awakens from all dreaming and until the very rhythm of his heart echoes that primordial sacred Name by which all things were made and through which all things return to their Origin. The Prophet said, 'Man is asleep and when he dies he awakens'. Through inner jihad the spiritual man dies in this life in order to cease all dreaming, in order to awaken to that Reality which is the origin of all realities, in order to behold that Beauty of which all earthly beauty is but a pale reflection, in order to attain that Peace which all men seek but which can in fact be found only through the inner jihad.

Source: http://www.--------------/al-serat/jihad-nasr.htm

[Kittygyal]

i don't get that

[akulion]

which part didnt you get my sis ?

ask all you want insha'allah we are here to help u

[Kittygyal]

Al-Serat

The Spiritual Significance of Jihad

Seyyed Hossein Nasr
Vol. IX, No. 1

And those who perform jihad for Us, We shall certainly guide them in Our ways, and God is surely with the doers of good. (Quran XXXIX; 69)

You have returned from the lesser jihad to the greater jihad. (Hadith)

The Arabic term jihad, usually translated into European languages as holy war, more on the basis of its juridical usage in Islam rather than on its much more universal meaning in the Quran and Hadith, is derived from the root jhd whose primary meaning is to strive or to exert oneself. Its translation into holy war combined with the erroneous notion of Islam prevalent in the West as the 'religion of the sword' has helped to eclipse its inner and spiritual significance and to distort its connotation. Nor has the appearance upon the stage of history during the past century and especially during the past few years of an array of movements within the Islamic world often contending or even imposing each other and using the word jihad or one of its derivative forms helped to make known the full import of its traditional meaning which alone is of concern to us here. Instead recent distortions and even total reversal of the meaning of jihad as understood over the ages by Muslims have made it more difficult than ever before to gain insight into this key religious and spiritual concept.

To understand the spiritual significance of jihad and its wide application to nearly every aspect of human life as understood by Islam, it is necessary to remember that Islam bases itself upon the idea of establishing equilibrium within the being of man as well as in the human society where he functions and fulfills the goals of his earthly life. This equilibrium, which is the terrestrial reflection of Divine Justice and the necessary condition for peace in the human domain, is the basis upon which the soul takes its flight towards that peace which, to use Christian terms, 'passeth understanding'. If Christian morality sees the aim of the spiritual life and its own morality as based on the vertical flight towards that perfection and ideal which is embodied in Christ, Islam sees it in the establishment of an equilibrium both outward and inward as the necessary basis for the vertical ascent. The very stability of Islamic society over the centuries, the immutability of Islamic norms embodied in the Shari'ah, and the timeless character of traditional Islamic civilization which is the consequence of its permanent and immutable prototype are all reflections of both the ideal of equilibrium and its realization as is so evident in the teachings of the Shari'ah (or Divine Law) as well as works of Islamic art, that equilibrium which is inseparable from the very name of islam as being related to salam or peace.

The preservation of equilibrium in this world, however, does not mean simply a static or inactive passivity since life by nature implies movement. In the face of the contingencies of the world of change, of the withering effects of time, of the vicissitudes of terrestrial existence, to remain in equilibrium requires continuous exertion. It means carrying out jihad at every stage of life. Human nature being what it is, given to forgetfulness and the conquest of our immortal soul by the carnal soul or passions, the very process of life of both the individual and the human collectivity implies the ever-present danger of the loss of equilibrium and the fact of falling into the state of disequilibrium which if allowed to continue cannot but lead to disintegration on the individual level and chaos on the scale of community life. To avoid this tragic end and to fulfill the entelechy of the human state which is the realization of unity (al-tawhid) or total integration, Muslims as both individuals and members of Islamic society must carry out jihad, that is they must exert themselves at all moments of life to fight a battle both inward and outward against those forces that if not combatted will destroy that equilibrium which is the necessary condition for the spiritual life of the person and the functioning of human society. This fact is especially true if society is seen as a collectivity which bears the imprint of the Divine Norm rather than an antheap of contending and opposing units and forces.

Man is at once a spiritual and corporeal being, a micro-cosm complete unto himself; yet he is the member of a society within which alone are certain aspects of his being developed and certain of his needs fulfilled. He possesses at once an intelligence whose substance is ultimately of a divine character and sentiments which can either veil his intelligence or abett his quest for his own Origin. In him are found both love and hatred, generosity and coveteousness, compassion and aggression. Moreover, there have existed until now not just one but several 'humanities' with their own religious and moral norms and national, ethnic and racial groups with their own bonds of affiliation. As a result the practice of jihad as applied to the world of multiplicity and the vicissitudes of human existence in the external world has come to develop numerous ramifications in the fields of political and economic activity and in social life and come to partake on the external level of the complexity which characterizes the human world.

In its most outward sense jihad came to mean the defence of dar al-islam, that is, the Islamic world, from invasion and intrusion by non-Islamic forces. The earliest wars of Islamic history which threatened the very existence of the young community came to be known as jihad par excellence in this outward sense of 'holy war'. But it was upon returning from one of these early wars, which was of paramount importance in the survival of the newly established religious community and therefore of cosmic significance, that the Prophet nevertheless said to his companions that they had returned from the lesser holy war to the greater holy war, the greater jihad being the inner battle against all the forces which would prevent man from living according to the theomorphic norm which is his primordial and God given nature. Throughout Islamic history, the lesser holy war has echoed in the Islamic world when parts or the whole of that world have been threatened by forces from without or within. This call has been especially persistent since the nineteenth century with the advent of colonialism and the threat to the very existence of the Islamic world. It must be remembered, however, that even in such cases when the idea of jihad has been evoked in certain parts of the Islamic world, it has not usually been a question of religion simply sanctioning war but of the attempt of a society in which religion remains of central concern to protect itself from being conquered either by military and economic forces or by ideas of an alien nature. This does not mean, however, that in some cases especially in recent times, religious sentiments have not been used or misused to intensify or legitimize a conflict. But to say the least, the Islamic world does not have a monopoly on this abuse as the history of other civilizations including even the secularized West demonstrates so amply. Moreover, human nature being what it is, once religion ceases to be of central significance to a particular human collectivity, then men fight and kill each other for much less exalted issues than their heavenly faith. By including the question of war in its sacred legislation, Islam did not condone but limited war and its consequences as the history of the traditional Islamic world bears out. In any case the idea of total war and the actual practice of the extermination of whole civilian populations did not grow out of a civilization whose dominant religion saw jihad in a positive light. On the more external level, the lesser jihad also includes the socio-economic domain. It means the reassertion of justice in the external environment of human existence starting with man himself. To defend one's rights and reputation, to defend the honour of oneself and one's family is itself a jihad and a religious duty. So is the strengthening of all those social bonds from the family to the whole of the Muslim people (al-ummah) which the Shari'ah emphasizes. To seek social justice in accordance with the tenets of the Quran and of course not in the modern secularist sense is a way of re-establishing equilibrium in human society, that is, of performing jihad, as are constructive economic enterprises provided the well-being of the whole person is kept in mind and material welfare does not become an end in itself; provided one does not lose sight of the Quranic verse, 'The other world is better for you than this one'. To forget the proper relation between the two worlds would itself be instrumental in bringing about disequilibrium and would be a kind of jihad in reverse.

All of those external forms of jihad would remain incomplete and in fact contribute to an excessive externalization of human being, if they were not complemented by the greater or inner jihad which man must carry out continuously within himself for the nobility of the human state resides in the constant tension between what we appear to be and what we really are and the need to transcend ourselves throughout this journey of earthly life in order to become what we 'are'.

From the spiritual point of view all the 'pillars' of Islam can be seen as being related to jihad. The fundamental witnesses, 'There is no divinity but Allah' and 'Muhammad is the Messenger of Allah', through the utterance of which a person becomes a Muslim are not only statements about the Truth as seen in the Islamic perspective but also weapons for the practice of inner jihad. The very form of the first witness (La ilaha illa' Lla-h in Arabic) when written in Arabic calligraphy is like a bent sword with which all otherness is removed from the Supreme Reality while all that is positive in manifestation is returned to that Reality. The second witness is the blinding assertion of the powerful and majestic descent of all that constitutes in a positive manner the cosmos, man and revelation from that Supreme Reality. To invoke the two witnesses in the form of the sacred language in which they were revealed is to practice the inner jihad and to bring about awareness of who we are, from whence we come and where is our ultimate abode.

The daily prayers (salat or namaz) which constitute the heart of the Islamic rites are again a never ending jihad which punctuate human existence in a continuous rhythm in conformity with the rhythm of the cosmos. To perform the prayers with regularity and concentration requires the constant exertion of our will and an unending battle and striving against forgetfulness, dissipation and laziness. It is itself a form of spiritual warfare.

Likewise, the fast of Ramadan in which one wears the armour of inner purity and detachment against the passions and temptations of the outside world requires an asceticism and inner discipline which cannot come about except through an inner holy war. Nor is the hajj to the centre of the Islamic world in Mecca possible without long preparation, effort, often suffering and endurance of hardship. It requires great effort and exertion so that the Prophet could say, 'The hajj is the most excellent of all jihads". Like the knight in quest of the Holy Grail, the pilgrim to the house of the Beloved must engage in a spiritual warfare whose end makes all sacrifice and all hardship pale into significance, for the hajj to the House of God implies for the person who practices the inner jihad encounter with the Master of the House who also resides at the centre of that other Ka'bah which is the heart.

Finally the giving of zakat or religious tax and khums is again a form of jihad not only in that in departing from one's wealth man must fight against the coveteousness and greed of his carnal soul, but also in that through the payment of zakat and khums in its many forms man contributes to the establishment of economic justice in human society. Although jihad is not one of the 'pillars of Islam', it in a sense resides within all the other 'pillars'. From the spiritual point of view in fact all of the 'pillars' can be seen in the light of an inner jihad which is essential to the life of man from the Islamic point of view and which does not oppose but complements contemplativity and the peace which result from the contemplation of the One.

The great stations of perfection in the spiritual life can also be seen in the light of the inner jihad. To become detached from the impurities of the world in order to repose in the purity of the Divine Presence requires an intense jihad for our soul has its roots sunk deeply into the transient world which the soul of fallen man mistakes for reality. To overcome the lethargy, passivity and indifference of the soul, qualities which have become second nature to man as a result of his forgetting who he is constitutes likewise a constant jihad. To pull the reigns of the soul from dissipating itself outwardly as a result of its centrifugal tendencies and to bring it back to the centre wherein resides Divine Peace and all the beauty which the soul seeks in vain in the domain of multiplicity is again an inner jihad. To melt the hardened heart into a flowing stream of love which would embrace the whole of creation in virtue of the love for God is to perform the alchemical process of solve et coagula inwardly through a 'work' which is none other than an inner struggle and battle against what the soul has become in order to transform it into that which it 'is' and has never ceased to be if only it were to become aware of its own nature. Finally, to realize that only the Absolute is absolute and that only the Self can ultimately utter 'I' is to perform the supreme jihad of awakening the soul from the dream of forgetfulness and enabling it to gain the supreme principal knowledge for the sake of which it was created. The inner jihad or warfare seen spiritually and esoterically can be considered therefore as the key for the understanding of the whole spiritual process, and the path for the realization of the One which lies at the heart of the Islamic message seen in its totality. The Islamic path towards perfection can be conceived in the light of the symbolism of the greater jihad to which the Prophet of Islam, who founded this path on earth, himself referred.

In the same way that with every breath the principle of life which functions in us irrespective of our will and as long as it is willed by Him who created us, exerts itself through jihad to instill life within our whole body, at every moment in our conscious life we should seek to perform jihad in not only establishing equilibrium in the world about us but also in awakening to that Divine Reality which is the very source of our consciousness. For the spiritual man, every breath is a reminder that he should continue the inner jihad until he awakens from all dreaming and until the very rhythm of his heart echoes that primordial sacred Name by which all things were made and through which all things return to their Origin. The Prophet said, 'Man is asleep and when he dies he awakens'. Through inner jihad the spiritual man dies in this life in order to cease all dreaming, in order to awaken to that Reality which is the origin of all realities, in order to behold that Beauty of which all earthly beauty is but a pale reflection, in order to attain that Peace which all men seek but which can in fact be found only through the inner jihad.

Source: http://www.--------------/al-serat/jihad-nasr.htm

ur gving me soo much info can we take it step by step plz

[Kittygyal]

which part didnt you get my sis ?

ask all you want insha'allah we are here to help u

that part where u said muzlim and christians don't agree

[akulion]

Sis insha'allah just read what I wrote since I am trying to take you step by step :) so read my last post and tell me if you got it insha'allah

[Clasen]

Islam is the final religion from Allah...
The Torah and the bibel came also from Allah, but the made some changes in them so it was not the truth anymore. Thats why we have to follow the last book give from Allah, and this book is in Hes own word.

[akulion]

Oh ok let me explain it to you again in simpler terms

- Christians believe God has a son called Jesus

- Muslims believe God has no Sons and that Jesus was a Prophet of God only

So Christians and Muslims do not agree on this part

Do you understand now sis ?

[Kittygyal]

Islam is the final religion from Allah...
The Torah and the bibel came also from Allah, but the made some changes in them so it was not the truth anymore. Thats why we have to follow the last book give from Allah, and this book is in Hes own word.

which is that book:?

and also the bible was truth before

[Kittygyal]

Oh ok let me explain it to you again in simpler terms

- Christians believe God has a son called Jesus

- Muslims believe God has no Sons and that Jesus was a Prophet of God only

So Christians and Muslims do not agree on this part

Do you understand now sis ?

ok i understand that bit

[akulion]

So you see if you say you believe that:

- Jesus is son of God , then you are disagreeing with Islam

But if you say that you believe:

- God is one and has no Sons and Jesus was a prophet of God then you are agreeing with Islam

So you cannot say both are right because then you are contradicting yourself in your belief

I hope u understand that? But if not ask me to explain more and you can ask any questions you may have too :)

[Kittygyal]

jesus is son of god

[akulion]

According to Islam Jesus was a Prophet Of God my sis

But if you believe he is Son of god then you cannot say you are Muslim

Because you believe as Christians believe

Do you understand?

[Clasen]

which is that book:?

and also the bible was truth before

Allahu Aleem... But we know that the books came from Allâh, so long time ago they have been with the truth.

[Kittygyal]

i just don't know :(

u see i've been going a church when revert and they follow jesus being son of god and that's wot i follow....

it is soooooo confusing

[akulion]

Dont worry sis

We can go over it in time one step at a time

For now just consider yourself a student of Islam and keep learning insha'Allah

oki doki?

[Clasen]

According to Islam Jesus was a Prophet Of God my sis

But if you believe he is Son of god then you cannot say you are Muslim

Because you believe as Christians believe

Do you understand?

You cant say that. You cant say that she cant call her a Muslim.
Do you know whats in her heart? Do you know how long she has been a Muslim?
You have too tell her the truth, and though that Allâh will guide her, Insha'Allah (If Allâh wills)
You have too accept her doubts... Im sure saying things like that breaks her heart, I had tryed that before...

[Kittygyal]

i just don't gget this at all :'(

when am i gona learn this god help mi :'(

[akulion]

Bro Clansen in Islam you cannot say "There is No God but Allah" and at the same time say "Allah has a son"

It is one of the basics of Islam bro

We must recognize where people have misunderstood and teach them the truth

It may break her heart but the Truth cannot be changed for anyone

[Clasen]

Verily, Allaah has created the world and everything in it in order to worship Him alone. He sent the Messenger to call the people to Tawheed and the Noble Qur'aan is concerned with the aqeedah of tawheed in most of its chapters, and it explains the harm of shirk for the individual and the society. Shirk is the reason for destruction in this life and the reason for eternal destruction in the Fire of the Hereafter.

[SolveEtCoagula]

According esoteric Christianity, Jesus was an ordinary person like me and you, during the process of personal evolution, education, learning from life, he reached a certain level of consciousness, that means he invoked Christ as an etheric intelligence which melted with his soul... therefore his name was Jesus Christ, but still he was a human being... an illuminated human being which experienced the highest initiation and level of consciousness... We all are free to experience the same. In my opinion Mohammad was also a human being which reached the highest level of consciousness like Jesus Christ.

It doesnt matter which Religion we choose, all esoteric Teachings/Religion brings us to Allah/God.

And therefore in my opinion not only Jesus Christ was a Son of God, all human beings are childrens of Allah/God... symbolically speaking...

I hope i was able to clarify a little bit...

Best wishes from Switzerland

lwwb
Roger

[Clasen]

Bro Clansen in Islam you cannot say "There is No God but Allah" and at the same time say "Allah has a son"

It is one of the basics of Islam bro

We must recognize where people have misunderstood and teach them the truth

Thats why we have to be carefull of what we are saying. Saying that she cant call her a Muslim is not the way. Guide her with your wisdom. Tell her how things are.

[akulion]

Yes bro but we have to establish the truth before we can move on

To give a person the impression that they can still be muslim while believeing "Jesus is the son of God" is not the way to go

eitherways....

Sis islamgyal I would like you to tell me the following:

- What do you believe exactly?

- Why do you believe it?

Try and explain as much as you can insha'Allah

[Clasen]

Dear sister Allâh says in the Quran:
"Say: Verily I call to my Lord and I do not ascribe any partners to Him at all." [72:20]
Thats Tawheed, the oneness of Gud, there is no Gud but Gud. Jusus is not Gud, he is a messenger from Gud. And all Muslims loves Jesus, and we know that he will come back to save us.

[Kittygyal]

i believe jesus is son of god,

i believe this cuz a learnt this in church

[Umm Yoosuf]

i just don't gget this at all :'(

when am i gona learn this god help mi :'(

Sister God Willing everything will be clear to you. It will just take a bit of time.

Br. akulion ur doing a good job.

Islamgya, Can you tell us what you know about Islam? Like what have you been taught? How did you come to Islam?

[Clasen]

It is reported from the Prophet that he said: "Whoever meets Allaah without having associated with Him in anything will enter Paradise and whosoever meets Him associating partners with him in anything will enter the Fire. " [Muslim]

[Kittygyal]

i know that god is 1.... muhmmed is the last prophet .... there's 5 pillers in izlam....

and wot do u mean how did i cum 2 izlam??

[akulion]

Islamgyal if God is one

then can you tell me how God has a son ?

Would not the Son of God also be a God?

Then dosent that make 2 Gods ?

[*Hana*]

Salam Alaikum:

Akulion, you are doing a great job here, mashallah :D

This sister seems extremely confused though and I think you're right in that it needs to be established what brought her to Islam.

These things you are trying to teach her are the very basics of Islam and I can't imagine saying the Shahadah without realizing that. I think it's best to establish what exactly she knows about Islam and why she embraced it.

Sister Islamgyal, if you can explain that, perhaps we can help you to better understand, inshallah. :)

Wasalam
Hana

[Umm Yoosuf]

i know that god is 1.... muhmmed is the last prophet .... there's 5 pillers in izlam....

and wot do u mean how did i cum 2 izlam??

Ok that a start.

What i meant are you a revert/convert to islam? If yes? How did you come to know about Islam? Did someone tell you about islam? or did you study it yourself?

[Clasen]

Jesus never said that he was the son of God, he said that he was the messenger of God. They call him Christ, that means lord in greak. That does not mean son of God.

[Kittygyal]

noooooooo god has a son which is jesus but you believe in 1 god that's wot i meant

[Kittygyal]

Ok that a start.

What i meant are you a revert/convert to islam? If yes? How did you come to know about Islam? Did someone tell you about islam? or did you study it yourself?

me step dad is an asian and all his family and tha's how i knew about it ...

well sum1 at work talk 2 me and that i should convert

[akulion]

Islamgyal

the son of man is a man right?

the son of elephant is an elephant right?

the son of mouse is a mouse right?

So is the son of God not also a God ?

Then that would make 2 Gods...then how can someone say it is 1 God?

So you see either Jesus is NOT son of God

Or there is more than 1 god?

Do you understand?

So which do you believe?

[Clasen]

Tell me Shadah (confess your faith)

[Kittygyal]

well i don't know cuz tha's wot i've been tought in church that's wot all the christians believe

[Umm Yoosuf]

Can we have one person giving dawah to the islamgyl please. It be better that way so then maybe we understand her views.

You're either very confused or you're having us on. Either way may Alllah guide you.

[akulion]

I vote for sis Jannah to continue :D

[Umm Yoosuf]

oi!

Br. akulion come on you started this. You finish it off :D

[akulion]

Ok then:p

Now Islamgyal I want you to think carefully before you answer me.

If the son of man is a man

and the son of mouse is a mouse

then what does that make the son of God ?
Choose one answer:

a) mouse
b) God
c) man
d) tree

Think and answer :)

[Kittygyal]

god....

but that's wot it say's in the bible...

am sori if i'm doing ur heading it's only been me 2 years since i've converted and i don't know that much am practising

[akulion]

Dont worry

The thing is that you have to use your mind instead of relying on what the Church people told you

Only by using your own mind will you be able to see the truth :)


So now to continue...

So you say Son of God = God

So there is God (1) + Son God (1)

So what is 1 + 1 = ?
Answer choices:
a) 1
b) 2
c) 3
d) 11

Can you tell me?

[Kittygyal]

1+1=2

[akulion]

Yes correct :D
So if 1 + 1 = 2

then 1 God + 1 Son God = 2 Gods

So you see Jesus can not be Son of God because IF he was then there would be 2 Gods

So either there is only 1 God - Allah

or

there are 2 Gods - God and Son God

Which do you think is right?

[Kittygyal]

that there is 1 god

[akulion]

Yes exactly :)

So you see that is why Muslims do not believe Jesus was son of God

Allah has told us that people loved Jesus so much that when he was gone they started to worship him And they were wrong in doing it

So Allah sent Prophet Mohammed(s) who told people the truth that there is only 1 God

Do you understand now why Jesus is not Son of God?

[Kittygyal]

yes i do

[akulion]

Good - see everything is so much more simple and easy to understand when you think carefully about it

So now you believe that there is:
1 God Allah and Jesus was not Son of God But a Prophet of God

Right?

[Kittygyal]

yea

[akulion]

Masha'allah :D

Now we move to the second part :)

Mohammed (s) is the last prophet of God

Do you believe this?

[Kittygyal]

yea i believe that

[akulion]

WOW!! Masha'Allah :D

So now you believe:

"There is only One God Allah and Mohammed is the last and final prophet of Allah"

Now If you TRULY believe in that say out aloud as you read it:

Say
I bear witness with all my heart and mind that

- There is only One God Allah
- and Mohammed is the last and final prophet of Allah
- and I believe in Jesus as a Prophet and not a son of God


And Alhamdolillah you would have embraced Islam :D:D

So if you truly believe it say it out loud and enter into the folds of Islam sis :D

[Kittygyal]

i did say it loud

[akulion]

CONGRATULATIONS SIS

You have embraced Islam :D Masha'Allah

Now you are truly a Muslim

You must now learn things as they come along and ask as many questions as you want :D

But always remember that Allah (God) is ONE

he has NO partners and has NO sons or daughters

oki doki :)

[Kittygyal]

k thanks evers so much phew it's over

don't wori i'll most as many Q as i can k

take care

[akulion]

oki doki sis

feel free to ask ANY and ALL questions that come to your mind

And over time we will all together teach you things as well :D

U take care too and Salam alaikum

[Kittygyal]

awwwwww are there my flowers???

[akulion]

Yes sis they are your flowers

and you are our flower and sister in Islam

Masha'allah may Allah always guide you and keep your faith safe ameen

[Hashim_507]

SolveEtCoagula

Do you believe in monotheism?

[Kittygyal]

awwwwww how sweet

tell me more bwt izlam amrow ok cuz a need a gus sleep

take care

[Kittygyal]

SolveEtCoagula

Do you believe in monotheism?

we've solved it out now

[akulion]

Oki doki sis

sweet dreams and keep safe

Insha'allah we will hold classes for you each day from now on :D

[Kittygyal]

ok wot tym ? lolz

[akulion]

Same time insha'allah

I will explain to you the 6 Articles of faith tomorrow so be ready :D

see you then insha'Allah

salam alaikum

[Kittygyal]

K I'll Be Ready

Take Care

[Umm Yoosuf]

Congrats :)


May Allah reward brother Akulion for his hadrd work :D

[*Hana*]

:sl:

Congratulations!

Akulion, may Allah, swt, reward you greatly for your effort. Ameen

wasalam
Hana

[akulion]

ok stop embarassing me :p

its just Gods mercy that he gives us opportunity to teach someone something

So no praise on my part

all praise belong to Allah :D

Allah hu Akbar

[akulion]

Todays Lesson.....

Six Articles of Faith

1st Article: Faith in the Oneness of God - We have already covered this

2nd article: Belief in all the Prophets of God - we have already partly covered this as well that Moses, Mohammed, Jesus were all prophets of God and apart from them there were many others as well)


So to complete the 2nd Article I would like to start from here :)

Ready ?

[Kittygyal]

yes i'm ready :)

[akulion]

Ok let us begin with simple things about the Prophets.

When Adam and Eve came to this Planet they did not know very much about it.

So God tought them many things.

For example:

Adam felt hunger for the first time on Earth and he asked God "what is this I feel?"

God then tought him how to hunt and get food.

another example:

when Adam died, his children had never seen a dead human before and did not know what to do with him.

so god sent an angel to teach them how to bury the dead.

--------------------------

this is why over time as humans saw new things and discovered new stuff.

Allah had to send prophets and sometimes books to guide them.

The Prophets used to guide people about God and how to live life.

The books used to be the law for the people to live by :)

So over time many many prophets came to the Earth to teach all types of people the truth that there is only 1 God.

Some of them are: Noah, abraham, Moses, Jesus, Mohammed

Because the people would not believe that these people are Prophets of God

Allah used to give them the power of miracles so that the people would believe.

So some prophets performed many great miracles so that people would know they are Prophts of God.

---------------------

Any questions up till now?
If yes feel fre to ask

[Kittygyal]

didn't god sent Jesus down too?

[akulion]

Yes Jesus was also sent by God as a Prophet to people.

I mentioned him above as well :)

Jesus was a special Prophet because he was sent as a "last chance"

The Jews had been choosen by allah at one time as his Choosen people.

But they always used to deny God

Moses came to them and showed them such great miracles but STILL after he was gone they denied God.

So God sent Jesus was a miracle on his own.

Because he was born without a father by the command of God.

Jesus also spoke when he was a baby.

And he told all the people to worship One God.

Allah had also given Jesus the power to raise dead people.

Allah had in the past also given this power to another Prophet called Ezekiel, to raise the dead.

But the people when they saw all these miracles started believeing that Jesus was God.

But Jesus never said he was God or Son of God, it was the people who did so out of error.

Thus a lot of people started worshipping Jesus after he was gone.

And thus Allah again sent another Prophet called Mohammed to correct the people.

But Mohammed did not come to the Jews

The jews had rejected Jesus thus they had lost their final chance to be Gods choosen people.

Mohammed(s) came to bring the message of God to ALL human beings.

He was the last prophet

And brought the last book of God with him.

---------------------------------------------

Any questions up to now?

[Kittygyal]

no ok that part is clear

[Clasen]

Yes, Allah (Gud) send Iza (Jesus) too mankind as a prophet.

[Kittygyal]

k thanks clasen

[akulion]

Oki doki

Now we must also remember that ALL prophets of Allah are loved by us

We love Moses
we love Jesus
we love Mohammed
we love Ezekiel
we love Abraham
and all of them!

We also believe that none of the Prophets can be blamed of SIN or of a crime

Why?

Because Prophets are special people sent by God and they only do Gods work.

That is why God has said that whatever they do is from me - do not blame them.

Even if it is a mistake it is as a lesson for people to learn from.

One Story I will give is:

Moses asked God "How will you raise the dead to life?"

God said to him "Do you doubt me moses?"

Moses said, "No my lord, I ask only for my heart to be firm"

You see in the above example moses was not doubting god or making a mistake to ask a question.

But he wanted to be even stronger in his heart and belief.

The Prophets of God used to have very hard lives because the people used to be bad to them.

On Prophet Mohammed people threw stones and thorns

On Moses they tried to kill him

On Jesus they tried to torture him

And every prophet used to face bad things from the bad people.

So because they were Prophets even they used to pray to God for help.

Jesus used to pray to God

Moses prayed to God

Mohammed also prayed to God

---------------------------------

So this is how we know that all Prophets of god used to worship God alone

and none of them were Gods

--------------------------------------

So basically the second article of faith is:

I believe in all the Prophets of God and whatever they did was from God

--------------------------------------------

Do you believe this?

[Kittygyal]

yea i believe that so was jesus a prophet too?

[akulion]

Yes Jesus was a Prophet too

He was also human like all other Prophets.

He may have been born without a father but he was still human.

He ate like any human

He slept like any human

He also went to the toilet like any human

He also felt pain

and he also used to pray to God

So IF he had been God would he be praying to himself? NO

And IF he was the son of God then like we discussed yesterday:

Son of God = God

Thus God + Son God = 2 Gods

So you see both the theories that :

1 He was son of God

2 He was God himself

Dont make sence

And thus we know Jesus was Gods Prophet.


If you have any questions feel free to ask :)

[Kittygyal]

k i get that bit

[akulion]

So now since we have covered:

1 - Belief in Oneness of God

2 - Belief in all the Prophets of God

So now let us move on to :

3 - belief in all revelations of God

Ok ?
If you have questions still in your heart or mind about the first 2 ask

If not lets move on to #3 :)

[Kittygyal]

ok lets start the 3 one

am gettin there oh my lord it's so much

how am i gona keep this in me brain :'(

i just can't do this

[akulion]

Dont worry you can remember it just remember the 6 points:

But for now lets move to #3 before moving on to the other 3 :)


3 - Belief in the Revelations sent by God

As human beings lived on this Planet many Prophets came to guide them.

But people used to forget the teachings of the Prophets

sometimes bad people would change the teachings so they could have power for themselves.

so God sent "revelations" through some of his Prophets.

In all God sent 4 Books

i) Zabur
ii) Injeel
iii) Torah
iV) Quran

Each new book that came also contained the commands of the book before it in it.

The reason that the books came one by one and not all at once was:

People were slowly learning over time.

If suddenly God had sent the full and final Book it would have been too hard for people to follow it.

So God sent the laws slowly over time so that people start following them step by step.

Same way when the Quran was sent - it was sent step by step so that people get used to it slowly and follow step by step.


-------------------------

Got it?
Any questions feel free to ask

[Kittygyal]

so wot is Zabur, Injeel, Torah?

are they in arabic too?

but i thought god only sent the koran

[akulion]

God sent

Zabur

Torah

Injeel

Quran

4 books in all

Each was in a different language depending on which people it was sent to.

For example:

zabur was sent to Dawood (david)

Torah to Moses

Injeel to Jesus

Quran to Mohammed

Torah were both sent to the Jewish people. So it was Aramaic

Quran was sent to the Arabs so it was in Arabic

---------------------------------------

The Zabur contained guidance to the Oneness of god

The Torah contained the Law

The Injeel contained the re-affirmation of the law

the Quran contained both the Guidance as well as the Law since it was the last and final revelation.

Furthermore because people in the past had been adding things to the revelations of God.

allah protected the Quran against any sort of Change

"Indeed, We have sent down the Quran, and surely We will guard it from corruption." [15:9]

------------------------

Any more Questions?

[Kittygyal]

ok i get that bit

[akulion]

Oki doki and that covers the article #3

3 - Belief in all the revelations of God

If you believe this we can move on? :)

[Kittygyal]

yea i believe that

[akulion]

Oki doki - Now we have covered:

1 - Belief in Oneness of God
2 - Belief in all the Prophets of God
3 - Belief in all the revelations of God

Now we will move on to:
4 - Belief in the unseen Angels and Jinns created by God.

This is something which is based on your belief in God, his Prophet and his Revelation.

why?

Because we can not see Angels or Jinns

But because we believe Allah is God
And we believe Quran is the final revelation
And we believe Prophet Mohammed is the last messenger

Thus we believe in what Allah, his Books and his Prophets have said that:

Allah has created angels who do everything that God commands them to do

And

Allah has created Jinn who are like humans but we cannot see them.

Jinns

Jinns also live on Earth but we neither feel them nor do we see them.

Jinns live life like humans

Jinns eat and drink

Jinns have male and females

Jinns have intelligence

Jinns also have free wills like humans

Jinns are basically another TYPE of creation of God

we are only told little about them but we know from faith that they do exist.

Angels

Angels are only created to carry out Gods commands

Angels have intelligence

But Angels do not have free will

Angels NEVER disobey God and neither can they disobey God because they do not have a free will

Angels do not have male or females

Angels do not eat or drink

Angels are basically another type of creation of God for a special purpose which it to carry out his command.

-------------------------------------

Did you understand that?

If you have questions feel free to ask :)

[Kittygyal]

no not at all :'(

[akulion]

ok dont worry sis

i will make it simple

Lets start with Angels

Angels were created by God to carry out his command

Whatever God tells them to do they do it

God has not given them a free will (meaning they can not do whatever they like)

They are simply like robots who do anything that their creator tells them to do

Did you get that part?

[Kittygyal]

yea

[akulion]

oki doki

Jinns are a creation of God too

Think of them like "aliens"

We can not see them but they do exist

they eat like we do

they sleep like we do

they think and do things like we do

but they are very different looking from us humans

Also Allah has told us that they also live on Earth but we can not see them

Got that part?
any questions?

[Kittygyal]

yep got that part

[akulion]

Oki doki sis

So now Muslims are required at this point to believe in angels and jinns.

We believe in them why?

Because we believe in allah his messengers and his revelations.

So if anyone says "show me an angel or jinn"

we should say "we can not show them to you because we dont see them ourselves, but we believe in them because Allah has told us about them in the Quran"

This is part of the "blind faith" - things that we cannot see or prove but which we believe do exist. That is why they are called "unseen"

So since you already said you believe in Allah and his messengers and his revelations

Thus i would like to ask you do you believe in the unseen angels and jinns as well ?

[akulion]

ok sis continuing on from last time - did u get my last post?

[Kittygyal]

yea but i don't believe in em

[Nawal89]

^o_0. sister, believing in jinns and angels are part of the islamic faith. It's something you have to believe in.

[Kittygyal]

ok so how do i start believin in em nw

[akulion]

oh you dont believe in Angels and Jinns....

Well

those are one of the things which are based on blind faith you see

So I cant show them to you - no one can

Things like:

- god
- angels
- jinns
- heaven
- hell

no one can show them to you

you have to believe in them based on the signs of God and your learning of the Quran

So maybe you should study the Quran more so you can come to a conclusion on your self.

Because I can only teach you - but I can not make you believe - thats every persons free will

[Kittygyal]

ok got that....

and wots wiv da bush pic? :)

[akulion]

Bush ?

i dont see any bushes...or trees even

[Kittygyal]

in uder pic it's George Bush and diz pic it's Tony Blair lolz

[akulion]

lol yea i know :p just some jokes

------------------------------------------
anyways...continuing on......

Ok Have you ever seen God?

[Kittygyal]

:) eheheheheheh keep it low :)

[akulion]

Ok joke time is over :p

Now tell me have you ever seen God?

So how do you know God exists?

[Kittygyal]

no av never seen god u can't see em

cuz we believe in em

[akulion]

Yes but there has to be reasons why you believe in God

Do you know of any ?

[Kittygyal]

no i don't

[akulion]

oki doki sis

ill tell u why I believe

1. I believe because everything around me is so beautifully made that I can not deny that there must be a creator to everything

Thus I believe in God

Do you agree?

[Kittygyal]

ok carry on

[Clasen]

Assalamu Alaikum,
Bismi'Allâh,

"He (God) is fully aware of what they have. He has counted the numbers of all things." [72:28]

"We will show them our proofs in the horizons, and within themselves, until they realize that this is the truth. Is your Lord not sufficient as a witness of all things?" [41:53]

[akulion]

ok now bear with me here......

Close your eyes and imagine you are lying down in the garden and looking at the stars

Then imagine you are travelling out into space

You can now see the Earth

then the moon

and then as you get further and further away you can only see Earth as a small dot because the Earth is so small

Just imagine how small you and me are who live on a DOT in this universe?

You get me?

[Kittygyal]

yea a get yea

[akulion]

so now think about it and tell me the answer

- who made the earth and the suns and the stars and the moons, they all run in perfect order every day and night?

- who made the human beings who walk on the planet talk and eat and sleep?

- who made the oceans which give us fish and othe sea food and never run dry?

- who made the flowers which bloom and we look at them and feel good and smell them?

- who made our feelings which make us sad and happy and feel in love?

Who do you think made all these wonderful things?

Some of them we have seen

and so many we have never seen

Think and tell me

[Kittygyal]

god

[Clasen]

"Man We did create from aequitessence (of clay); then We placed him as a drop of sperm in a place of rest, firmly fixed. Then we made the sperm into a clot of congealed blood or (leech like); then of that clot we made a fetus lump; then we made out of that lump bones and clothed the bones with flesh; then we developed out of it another Creature. So blessed Allah (God), the Best to create". [23:12-14]. Holy Qur'an

[Kittygyal]

thanks ever so much clasen

[akulion]

Yes God made them all

And if we think about it - in our life we make a house

or a car

or a 1000 sandwiches

but we have to work so so so hard to make it

but just think SO MANY things in the universe

And someone made them with such beauty and with such perfection

and everything runs smoothly

everything runs automatically

That is why we know that there is a ALL POWERFUL God

who made everything and who runs everything

So we know from the SIGNS of God that he Exists

[Kittygyal]

ok carry on and btw thanks for helpin mi and clasen

[Kittygyal]

btw can i ask u where is god?

[akulion]

ur welcome :)

But now another Question....How do we know that Allah is God?

To answer that we read the Quran and think about it.

Allah said in the Quran:

I have created the Earth in 7 layers (65:12)

So we check what Science has discovered about the Earth...

Science says:

Earth is divided into 7 layers as well

so we know that Only Allah could have known this and science only discovered this recently like a 100 years ago.


In another part Allah says:

I have created the Heavens (skies) in 7 layers (65:12)

What does science say about this?

Science tells us there are 7 laters in the Sky

So we again know that only God could have known this from the start and humans only discovered this a short while back like 100 years ago.


But the Quran was sent over 1400 years ago when no one on Earth knew these things and science had not discovered them!

So how do you think the quran spoke about them?

Can you tell me?

[Kittygyal]

i dunno

[akulion]

Those things are mentioned in the Quran because it is Allah who made the earth and the Sky

and it is he who knew about them before anyone did

So he told us in the Quran as one of his SIGNS

So that when human beings discover those things through science they would know that the Quran is the book from God

-------------------------------

Some other things Allah told us which science only found out in the last 100 years are:

Allah told the FEMALE honey bee to build its nest and to gather honey (16:68,69)

But we did not know that it was the FEMALe (girl) bee which did all the work.

People always thought that it must be both man and woman bees which do all the work together,

But science told us recently that the Man honey bees dont work!!!

It is the woman honey bees who do all the work!

Again something which Allah told us in the Quran 1400 years ago

But humans only found out less than a 100 years ago!

----------------------------

So all of these Signs and Proofs tell us that the creator of the univers is Allah

Got it?

Believe it?

[Clasen]

{Does man (a disbeliever) think that We shall not assemble his bones? Yes, We are Able to put together in perfect order the tips of his fingers}

[75:3,4] Holy Qur'an

Fingerprint is uniqued from person to person...

[Clasen]

{O men! Here is a parable set forth! Listen to it! Those on whom, besides Allah(God), you call, can not Create even a fly, if they all met together for the purpose! And if the fly should snatch away anything from them, they would have no power to release it from the fly. Feeble are those who petition and those whom they petition.}

[22:73]Holy Qur'an

[Kittygyal]

oh cool

[akulion]

See brother Clasen has given some other things for you to think about as well :D

So you got it yea?

Do you now understand and believe that Allah is God almighty?

[Clasen]

The thing with the fly, is that Allâh is giving you a challenge...
No man on earth or in the sky can create a fly, only Allâh has that power...

Say: Allahu Akbar (Allahu Is the Greatest)

[Kittygyal]

YeA I Get It N Believe It I Think

[akulion]

Ohh also one other things which is both Beautiful but also Scarey!!

Did you know that Allah told us in the Quran that when a Sun (like our sun) dies it is like:

And when the sky is torn apart and becomes rosy red like ointment (55:37)

What does science tell us?

Scientist recently took this picture of a Sun which was getting destroyed very very far away from us:

Dosent it look like a Rose and Rose red ?

Amazing yea?

How could the Quran have known this ?

Only because it is the word of God

[Kittygyal]

awwwww now i get that

[akulion]

You have to be sure in your heart sis that you believe

because EVERYTHING in Islam is based on only 1 thing:

- Belief that there is only One God Allah

Everything else that we believe is from this 1 belief.

So that is why i want you to be 100% certain about this 1 point (it is called Tawheed)

[Kittygyal]

yea i believe it bro

[akulion]

Good :)

So now you see in the Past like 500 years ago

No one would have believed you or me if we had told them that it is the female bee which does all the work

Or that the Earth has 7 layers

Or that the sky has 7 layers

But it is all true!

same way there are many things which Allah tells us that we can not see as long as we are alive.

these things are:

Angels
Jinns
Heaven
Hell
God

Do you know why?

Because life is a test for humans

Allah is testing everyone to see that after he will give us life and a free mind to think and a free will to do whatever we want - what will we do with it?

- will we party all the time and not care about anything else?

- will we try and help others?

- will we think about who created us and believe in God or not?

- will we after believeing in God do what he says or ignore it?

So that is why he has not shown us himself or angels or jinns or heaven and hell

Because if we saw all those things then the Test is over - we would know the answers!!!

So life is a test

and we must use our minds and our free wills to get the right answers

And then do what God tells us to do

So because we already believe that Allah is God

so we also believe in angels and jinns and heaven and hell

you get it now?

[Kittygyal]

yea i get it

[akulion]

So we believe

1 - There is only One God Allah

2 - We believe in all the Prophets of Allah

3 - We believe in all the books of Allah

4 - we believe in Angels and Jinns eventhough we have not see them but because Allah says they exist and we believe in Allah

5 - We believe in heaven and hell eventhough we have not see them but because Allah says they exist and we believe in Allah

---------------------------

so do you believe #4 and #5 now sis ?

[Umm Yoosuf]

She is banned:X

[abdullahi]

:sl:
do u know why?
:w:

[akulion]

dunno

maybe she set her "title" as that

i seen a lotta other people do it for fun

who knows

[afriend]

dunno

maybe she set her "title" as that

i seen a lotta other people do it for fun

who knows

She ain't that kinda person...

I wonder why........she didn't do anything.....she is a reali nice sister......

Allahu 'Alam

[akulion]

I have no clue

[Muhammad]

:sl:

She's been banned for some time due to persistence after a warning. Maybe this thread should be closed?

:w:

[akulion]

well since it was for her to understand - then i guess its best to close it now insha'Allah

[Kittygyal]

dunno

maybe she set her "title" as that

i seen a lotta other people do it for fun

who knows

:'( :'( no i did not do owt k n i am very very serious bwt izlam dat's y i worte ''islamgyal'' cuz yea well am a gyal who is practising her religion i believe....

far7an knws da score n he appologised 2 me cuz 1 of it wasn't me and 2 of all i don't av a clue y i was banned :rant:

well anyway i jus thought i'll make diz clear i avn't cum on this site for the fun of it or 2 mes abwt am jus not lyk dat i've came ere 2 learn...

so plz ppl don't think am a bad gyal cuz believe me am not cuz god is watchin and he knwz da best...

n plz ppl don't close diz thread cuz i wana learn :'( :'( :'( :'( :'(

take care

[Kittygyal]

She ain't that kinda person...

I wonder why........she didn't do anything.....she is a reali nice sister......

Allahu 'Alam

yea iqram u knw am not lyk dat

an thnks neyway

i got banned for owt bt nw far7an appologised a mi....

lyk a cd i am very serious bwt izlam

[Cheb]

:sl:
I was looking at the posts on this thread and I really dont see why she would be banned. All I see is a newly converted sister trying to learn more about Islam. I was surprised to know that she was banned because I think she needs to be here more than most others. It is good to have you back Islamgyal.
:w:

[Kittygyal]

:sl:
I was looking at the posts on this thread and I really dont see why she would be banned. All I see is a newly converted sister trying to learn more about Islam. I was surprised to know that she was banned because I think she needs to be here more than most others. It is good to have you back Islamgyal.
:w:

i know i don't get it y a gt banned 2 but neyway thanks ever so much...

n yea i do need all the bro/sis in this forum to help me to and share there knowledge wiv me and help me 2 becum a gud muzlim :uhwhat

[Kittygyal]

can sum1 kindly help me from were aukline left and sis Jannah knws :) were he left n wot am on a bwt :) :) :)

az u may knw br. aukline is avn hiz examz in 13/14 days sumet lyk dat n he's buzy REVISING so can sum1 carry on where he left plz plz if u dn't mind

take care

[akulion]

Insha'Allah I will be back in a lil while - I only come online for like an hour to the max - only 14 more days to go and I will be back sis :D

If anyone else wants to carry on please feel free

PS: Make dua I pass with excellent results in my GMATS ameen

[i_m_tipu]

:sl:
new on this thread :)
i really want to Understand Islam
lot to read
where to start:?

[Kittygyal]

same ere bro i really want to learn more too az av converted....

btw av converted r sumet?

and bro.auklion jus REVISIE and we'll all pray 4 yea

take care

[akulion]

Salam Alaikum....Islamgyal, here is something that I have put together to help you learn the 6 Articles of Faith

Please memorize them if possible :)

[MEDIA=550,550]http://path-to-peace.net/misc/6arti.swf[/MEDIA]

[Kittygyal]

k thanks eva so much :) :)

n u beta be revising k

i'll pray for yea... :)

take care