Evolution: Screwing with our heads one animal at a time

[Jason]

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20060307/...new_crustacean

First the platypus, now a hairy lobster. I am flipping evolution the bird right now. :P

I don't even think Islam can explain a hairy lobster.

I wonder how it tastes though...

[abdul Majid]

hahaha why would you need ISLAM to explain a hairy lobster??

[Jason]

Well something has to explain that freak of nature. :P

[abdul Majid]

lol, now that where on that subject, im sure that there are others speices not yet found....its funny how we wanna go to the moon, but we havent even been close to the bottom of oceans..lol

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[Shadow]

Just so you know, Islam teaches that humans were not evolved, im not sure if it mentions any other creatures.
It seems to me that people think just because small organisms evolve, humans also must have evolved
this is a fallacy known as "quaternio terminorum"

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fallacy_of_four_terms

[Malaikah]

Just so you know, Islam teaches that humans were not evolved, im not sure if it mentions any other creatures.
It seems to me that people think just because small organisms evolve, humans also must have evolved
this is a fallacy known as "quaternio terminorum"

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fallacy_of_four_terms

:sl:

bro you make a good point, im studying biology and weve done a small bit ov evolution in it, and i was wondering, i KNOW that HUMANS didnt evolve, Allah swt created Adam pbuh, but what about other animals, were they created like adam or is there a chance that Allah lets them evolve? and plants too.

:w:

[HeiGou]

bro you make a good point, im studying biology and weve done a small bit ov evolution in it, and i was wondering, i KNOW that HUMANS didnt evolve, Allah swt created Adam pbuh, but what about other animals, were they created like adam or is there a chance that Allah lets them evolve? and plants too.

Well anything is possible with an All-Powerful God although I expect many people might have problems reconciling that with the Quranic account.

But speaking as a non-Muslim with a vague agnostic bent, why rule off humans and not the other animals? Surely Occam's Law says to take the simplest viable option. So either evolution for all or creation for all.

[Snowflake]

Well something has to explain that freak of nature. :P

Do you know what just popped up in my mind. I was thinking that with all the chemicals/drugs etc being pumped out into the sea, maybe they could be having an adverse effect on sea life? Maybe the lobster got over dosed on testosterone and grew hairs :giggling: :X

[Nawal89]

Jason you heard saw what Muslimah_sis said..you still want to taste it now? ;D;D

[root]

It seems to me that people think just because small organisms evolve, humans also must have evolved
this is a fallacy known as "quaternio terminorum"

I would agree with you on that basis alone, however. Evolution by common descent does not work on your premis and it is like saying evolutionists believe that chimpz are our closest ancestor because they share similar visual characteristics which whilst valid actually is not true why evolutionists have the chimp as our closest ancestor and the Urangatang as our 2nd closest?

As for speciation, many life-forms currently in existence are yet to be discovered. Equally, 90% of all extinct life will never be known to us.

[Muezzin]

Just so you know, Islam teaches that humans were not evolved, im not sure if it mentions any other creatures.
It seems to me that people think just because small organisms evolve, humans also must have evolved
this is a fallacy known as "quaternio terminorum"

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fallacy_of_four_terms

Flippin heck, I misread that as Quentin Tarantino!

I wonder how it tastes though...

Fluffy.

[Malaikah]

But speaking as a non-Muslim with a vague agnostic bent, why rule off humans and not the other animals? Surely Occam's Law says to take the simplest viable option. So either evolution for all or creation for all.

um well thats good for you if you want to believe that but its not possible for a muslim to beleive that humans evolved becuase God already told us how he made humans.:)

[Silver Pearl]

:sl:

bro you make a good point, im studying biology and weve done a small bit ov evolution in it, and i was wondering, i KNOW that HUMANS didnt evolve, Allah swt created Adam pbuh, but what about other animals, were they created like adam or is there a chance that Allah lets them evolve? and plants too.

:w:

Evolution poses that all living creatures have descended and evolved from a single celled amoeba. Therefore it means that plants, animals and humans have descended from the same common ancestor which if traced back to beginning would be that single celled amoeba. The theory does not say that animals, humans and plants do not have a common ancestor. Although ironically humans and chimps are said to be very similar due to how humans have 46 chromosomes will chimps have 48. However, humans have a closer relative in terms of evolution which would be potatoes, yes potatoes. We both have 46 chromosomes but because the idea sounds so absurd and ridiculous it is not spoken of. It is possible with the will of Allah (swt) that plants could have evolved independently without placing humans and animals into this chain. Nonetheless in terms of speaking from the point of the theory, Evolution is contradictory to only plants evolving.

Allahu’3llim

:wasalamex

[root]

Although ironically humans and chimps are said to be very similar due to how humans have 46 chromosomes will chimps have 48. However, humans have a closer relative in terms of evolution which would be potatoes, yes potatoes. We both have 46 chromosomes but because the idea sounds so absurd and ridiculous it is not spoken of.

Actually Chromosome counts are poor indications of similarity; they can vary widely within a single genus or even a single species. The plant genus Clarkia, for example, has species with chromosome counts of n = 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 12, 14, 17, 18, and 26 (Lewis 1993). Chromosome counts in the house mouse species (Mus domesticus) range from 2n = 22 to 40 (Nachman et al. 1994).

Chromosomes can split or join with little effect on the genes themselves. One human chromosome, for example, is very similar to two chimpanzee chromosomes laid end to end; it likely formed from the joining of two chromosomes (Yunis and Prakash 1982). Because the genes can still align, a change in chromosome number does not prevent reproduction. Chromosome counts can also change through polyploidy, where the entire genome is duplicated. Polyploidy, in fact, is a common mechanism of speciation in plants.

Chromosomes are the "packaging" for DNA that is contained inside, it is the DNA that is used more accurately compare ancestory as noted:

Human to Chimp = 99.125%
Human to Potato = 77.564%
Human to Dog = 94.551%

Source:http://bioweb.cs.earlham.edu/9-12/cy...e_c/index.html

[HeiGou]

Evolution poses that all living creatures have descended and evolved from a single celled amoeba.

Actually evolution does not have to assert that this is the case. The evidence for the planet Earth seems to suggest it is the case, but it is not a core part of evolutionary theory. Theoretically all life could have evolved from amoeba and from other creatures from outer space (as Root believes). All evolution says is that we look like our parents (because we share DNA as it turns out). Not all the successive generations will live to reproduce. Those that do, or reproduce more than everyone else, will pass on their traits more often. Over very long periods of time this can amount to a change in the way we look or behave.

But the fossil record does seem to show that we evolved from even more simple creatures than amoeba.

It is possible with the will of Allah (swt) that plants could have evolved independently without placing humans and animals into this chain. Nonetheless in terms of speaking from the point of the theory, Evolution is contradictory to only plants evolving.

It is possible that only plants could have evolved and humans and animals evolved separately. But the fossil record does not seem to support this view.

[Muezzin]

I think everyone has missed the point of this thread - i.e. how on earth do you cook something like that?

[HeiGou]

I think everyone has missed the point of this thread - i.e. how on earth do you cook something like that?

And is it Hallal? I don't think lobster is kosher.

Personally I'd pan fry it with a little ginger and spring onions.

[root]

I think everyone has missed the point of this thread - i.e. how on earth do you cook something like that?

Easy, singe the hair off as part of the prep!

[Muezzin]

And is it Hallal? I don't think lobster is kosher.

There are schools of thought which say all creatures from the sea are halal. I'm not a 'student' of such schools. I was just curious.

Personally I'd pan fry it with a little ginger and spring onions.

And some Lea and Perrins for that extra zing?

Easy, singe the hair off as part of the prep!

By golly, you're right!

Maybe they could then eat the hair like strange, straw coloured lobster-floss.

We so have to send one of these bad boy crustaceons to the producers of Masterchef.

[HeiGou]

We so have to send one of these bad boy crustaceons to the producers of Masterchef.

I'd like to see Nigella Lawson cook it myself, but then she is Jewish so she probably would refuse.

Still, I'd like to see her try.

Because she is such a great cook of course.