disbelieving in God

[mirage41]

willberhum
have you lost your sense of reasoning?

According to your Bible...for a person who speaks blasphemy against God is supposed to be CERTAINLY PUT TO DEATH.
For the non-muslims, religion is a joke. Their desires is their Lord and thats what they worship and obey and bow down to.

If you had any sense of certainty that your religion is the truth, you would have applied that punishment to the disbelievers since it is a command from your Lord.

and what is humane? the filth that you guys are into? dis-believing in the Oneness of God is the worst crime a person can commit.

Disbelieving in God is the worst crime? You can't possibly believe that? What about mass murder? Or raping a child? Or how about crashing planes into buildings filled with innocent people? I'm sure those are all worse than disbelieving in an uncertain god.

[Ansar Al-'Adl]

Disbelieving in God is the worst crime? You can't possibly believe that? What about mass murder? Or raping a child? Or how about crashing planes into buildings filled with innocent people? I'm sure those are all worse than disbelieving in an uncertain god.

Your comment is built on the assumption that there is no god. If there is a God, then naturally, rejecting him is the greatest of all evils. As I said in another context:

[Rejecting God] is the most abominable and abhorrent sin because when someone commits a genocide they are refusing to implement God's mercy and justice, but the [disbeliever] has rejected God's mercy and justice in its entirey, and thus has laid the foundation for all evil. Violating the rights of the creation is certainly abhorrent injustice as in the case of genocide, but how about violating the rights of the Creator Himself? The magnitude of the injustice is unimaginable.

Regards

[mirage41]

Your comment is built on the assumption that there is no god. If there is a God, then naturally, rejecting him is the greatest of all evils. As I said in another context:

Regards

All I'm asking you to do is THINK about what that entails. For example I think, MURDER is a worse crime than STEALING. What that entails is that I'd rather see a person commit theft than murder. When you say "disbelieving is the worst crime" that basically means your saying you'd rather see a person murder a little kid rather than stop believing in God. Whether or not God exists is really irrelevant. I think anyone, Muslim or not, must know that there are WAAAAAY worse crimes than disbelieving.

[cool_jannah]

Disbelieving in God is the worst crime? You can't possibly believe that? What about mass murder? Or raping a child? Or how about crashing planes into buildings filled with innocent people? I'm sure those are all worse than disbelieving in an uncertain god.

what part of 'worst' you did not understand?

How unintelligent or 'stupid' a persobn can be to deny the existence of God.
What a shame on the human intellect. What a waste of life.

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[mirage41]

what part of 'worst' you did not understand?

How unintelligent or 'stupid' a persobn can be to deny the existence of God.
What a shame on the human intellect. What a waste of life.

Okay, that didn't explain anything. I could easily reverse a few words of your reply and it pretty much has the same effect:

"How unintelligent or 'stupid' a persobn can be to believe the existence of God.
What a shame on the human intellect. What a waste of life."


I have a question for you Mr. cool_jannah. Choose one of the two:

1) Stop Believing in God and become and Apostate
OR
2) Strangle a 5 year kid with electrical wire

Which one?

[cool_jannah]

All I'm asking you to do is THINK about what that entails. For example I think, MURDER is a worse crime than STEALING. What that entails is that I'd rather see a person commit theft than murder. When you say "disbelieving is the worst crime" that basically means your saying you'd rather see a person murder a little kid rather than stop believing in God. Whether or not God exists is really irrelevant. I think anyone, Muslim or not, must know that there are WAAAAAY worse crimes than disbelieving.

mirage
its ok. don't get too emotional. believeing in the existence of God itself will stop a person from comitting all those crime you mentioned. but that necessarily does not mean that every one who believes will not commit a crime. thats where we have to distinguish between the one's who truly believe and the one's who are out there just for the heck of it.

[cool_jannah]

All the crimes you mentioned are very serious and considered to be major sins, for which God will forgive if he wishes except for the crime of associating partners with God.

[Ansar Al-'Adl]

All I'm asking you to do is THINK about what that entails. For example I think, MURDER is a worse crime than STEALING. What that entails is that I'd rather see a person commit theft than murder. When you say "disbelieving is the worst crime" that basically means your saying you'd rather see a person murder a little kid rather than stop believing in God. Whether or not God exists is really irrelevant. I think anyone, Muslim or not, must know that there are WAAAAAY worse crimes than disbelieving.

I already answered this:

[Rejecting God] is the most abominable and abhorrent sin because when someone commits a genocide they are refusing to implement God's mercy and justice, but the [disbeliever] has rejected God's mercy and justice in its entirey, and thus has laid the foundation for all evil. Violating the rights of the creation is certainly abhorrent injustice as in the case of genocide, but how about violating the rights of the Creator Himself? The magnitude of the injustice is unimaginable.

I'm not sure what it was in my answer that was too difficult to understand. Perhaps you could highlight that for me.

Regards

[mirage41]

Actually neither of you answered anything. You just simply quoted me some verses. Please argue with your own words. Or has the Quran stunted your logical faculties?

[Sunflower]

Actually neither of you answered anything. You just simply quoted me some verses. Please argue with your own words. Or has the Quran stunted your logical faculties?

You should maybe try to phrase your words more politely thats really offensive. People can awnser a question how they want EVEN with quotes.

[Ansar Al-'Adl]

Actually neither of you answered anything. You just simply quoted me some verses.

I didn't quote any verses, in fact I didn't quote anyone else at all! I simply gave you my explanation which you have yet to respond to. Here it is again:
[Rejecting God] is the most abominable and abhorrent sin because when someone commits a genocide they are refusing to implement God's mercy and justice, but the [disbeliever] has rejected God's mercy and justice in its entirey, and thus has laid the foundation for all evil. Violating the rights of the creation is certainly abhorrent injustice as in the case of genocide, but how about violating the rights of the Creator Himself? The magnitude of the injustice is unimaginable.

[cool_jannah]

Or has the Quran stunted your logical faculties?

The Qur'an has opened our hearts and minds. you should read it InshaAllah, it will help you become a better person.

[Starseeker]

^^ I agree with you^^

[IbnAbdulHakim]

the fear of Allah stops more then we kno... if only more people understood this!

[cool_jannah]

I have a question for you Mr. cool_jannah. Choose one of the two:

1) Stop Believing in God and become and Apostate
OR
2) Strangle a 5 year kid with electrical wire

Which one?

LOL

ure a funny man. both ure options are contradictory. I cannot strangle a 5 year old kid to death because it is against the Shari'a Law or the rule followed by the people who believe in God. So if you are asking me to strangle a 5 year old having a sharp sword held right near my throat ready to be slit, I would rather choose my throat to be slit than an innocent life be taken. You cannot force someone to kill unless somebody controls your 5 senses through a computer or something.
And if you are holding a sharp sword again by my throat ready to be slit open for believeing in the Oneness of Allah, I would take that too INSHALLAH!
remember for both these choices, I will give away my life after Ive tried my best to defend myself and my religion.

[Nicola]

According to your Bible...for a person who speaks blasphemy against God is supposed to be CERTAINLY PUT TO DEATH

Would you mind please quoting where the Bible states this..
Because Jesus tells us blasheming against God and himself, God forgives us..
Bit against the Holy Spirit God will not forgiven, no matter how much we repent.

Mar 3:28 "Truly, I say to you, all sins will be forgiven the children of man, and whatever blasphemies they utter,
Mar 3:29 but whoever blasphemes against the Holy Spirit never has forgiveness, but is guilty of an eternal sin"--

[cool_jannah]

Would you mind please quoting where the Bible states this..
Because Jesus tells us blasheming against God and himself, God forgives us..
Bit against the Holy Spirit God will not forgiven, no matter how much we repent.

" . . neither shall thine eye pity him (the apostate), neither shalt thou spare him, neither shalt thou conceal him: "But thou shalt SURELY KILL HIM: thine hand shall be first upon him TO PUT HIM TO DEATH . . .DEUTERONOMY I 3 -8 9

[Alphaseed]

The Question is ,Who has the right to punish evil ?
I mean in the case of Rejecting God ?
Man or God ?
I believe it is God, He has prepared a place for people like that to spend eternity, so no man should do God's vengeance.
He is says, "Mine is the vengeance I will not be fooled"

[cool_jannah]

The Question is ,Who has the right to punish evil ?
I mean in the case of Rejecting God ?
Man or God ?
I believe it is God, He has prepared a place for people like that to spend eternity, so no man should do God's vengeance.
He is says, "Mine is the vengeance I will not be fooled"

I undestand where you are coming from. But you are basing your judgement because you think thats the right way to do it. It is true that the case of Apostasy is between the Apostate and God, but the whole jist of the argument is that - God has ordered us to do so. If it wasn't an order of God, then the believing nation would have no right to even touch the Apostate.
So this is a part of offering obideance to Allah. Rest is between the Apostate and the Lord of the Apostate.

[Nicola]

" . . neither shall thine eye pity him (the apostate), neither shalt thou spare him, neither shalt thou conceal him: "But thou shalt SURELY KILL HIM: thine hand shall be first upon him TO PUT HIM TO DEATH . . .DEUTERONOMY I 3 -8 9

that really isn't about blashemping but turning away from God to worship a god/idol..and that was to the Jews who God had lead out of Egypt to safety.

blaspheme

verb

To use profane or obscene language: curse, damn, swear. Informal cuss. See decent/indecent, sacred/profane, words.

[Nicola]

The Question is ,Who has the right to punish evil ?
I mean in the case of Rejecting God ?
Man or God ?
I believe it is God, He has prepared a place for people like that to spend eternity, so no man should do God's vengeance.
He is says, "Mine is the vengeance I will not be fooled"

I agree
God gave us free will to choose between heaven and hell...or to believe or not to believe..
It is not mans job to punish the unbeliever of what ever religion.

But there is coming a time when all man-kind will turn to the one religion. But only the Christians will be affected at the endtimes, if we do not renounce Jesus Christ.

Rev 20.4 I saw thrones, and they sat on them, and judgment was given to them. I saw the souls of those who had been beheaded for the testimony of Jesus, and for the word of God, and such as didn't worship the beast nor his image, and didn't receive the mark on their forehead and on their hand. They lived, and reigned with Christ for a thousand years

[cleo]

Disbelieving in God is the worst crime? You can't possibly believe that? What about mass murder? Or raping a child? Or how about crashing planes into buildings filled with innocent people? I'm sure those are all worse than disbelieving in an uncertain god.

I can't believe you said that, are you human? Or plain unknowledgable, everyone knows it wasn't the muslims that is doing that. You are being down to the path, of, no return. These actions of which you speak is being done by man, and not God. Get your facts straight..:?

[x Maz x]

mirage41 Brother your so humorous..shoukld be on stage!....seriously everyone is allowed to be stupid but you me ol' codger are abusing the privelledge...go re-read the posts inshAllah [God willing] it might knock some sense into you :) WalaykumAsalaam x

[H4RUN]

asalamalaikum...ok here goes...let me put it his way for the disbelievers....Allah swt does exist: An old woman was once usin a spinnin wheel 2 make thread from cotton and she was uttering the Kalimah Tawhid alongside...A traveller asked, "The God whom you are remembering, do you have any proof of his existence?" she replied, "Yes, my spinning wheel is proofof the existence of Allah swt." the traveller asked, "How is this?" she replied, " If i spin this wheel it spins and if don't give it motion it does not spin. Because the whole universe is active this is proof that someone is running it, and that entity is the One God who is the Creator and Owner of the whole universe."
wa'alikumsalam

[twelver]

But why should anyone believe that god "spoke through" a guy in the desert 1400 years ago? Pretty absurd, right?

[syilla]

do you want god to speak you right to your face?

*just asking.

[------]

But why should anyone believe that god "spoke through" a guy in the desert 1400 years ago? Pretty absurd, right?

Why should anyone believe that he didnt....:?

[HeiGou]

ok here goes...let me put it his way for the disbelievers....Allah swt does exist: An old woman was once usin a spinnin wheel 2 make thread from cotton and she was uttering the Kalimah Tawhid alongside...A traveller asked, "The God whom you are remembering, do you have any proof of his existence?" she replied, "Yes, my spinning wheel is proofof the existence of Allah swt." the traveller asked, "How is this?" she replied, " If i spin this wheel it spins and if don't give it motion it does not spin. Because the whole universe is active this is proof that someone is running it, and that entity is the One God who is the Creator and Owner of the whole universe."

Actually Newton's First Law says that a spinning wheel, like any other object, will continue to spin unless someone or something acts on it to make it stop. Or as Newton put it, Lex I: Corpus omne perseverare in statu suo quiescendi vel movendi uniformiter in directum, nisi quatenus a viribus impressis cogitur statum illum mutare. In the case of a spinning wheel, I would guess that friction between the axial and the frame exert a force on the wheel to slow it down. But if the wheel spun on a fiction-less surface, in a vacuum, it would spin forever.

[syilla]

The big bang theory is a better one... * i think..

[Ansar Al-'Adl]

:sl:
This thread has run its course. Issues relating to atheism have been discussed in threads in the comparative religion section.

:w:



:threadclo