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ivanna25
04-30-2006, 07:15 PM
assalam alaykom wa rahmatou Allah,

dear my brothers and sisters, thank God i am a Muslim and I love my religion. I try to talk about Islam with non-muslims and non-believers using the modest knowledge i have and logical arguments I have learnt for quran, Sunnah, and Muslim scholars.

I was adviced to learn about other religions: hinduism, budhism, sikhism, judaism, christianity etc. in order to have more knowledge and be able to discuss with others the logic of each religion. When I talk about Islam, i always say that Islam is the only religion which believes in the oneness of god and which gives value to human beings. after readin about sikhism ( aodou billah from that name), I ve relaized that the teaching of Sikhism is 90 percent like Islam. Sikhism is religion which came 8 centuries after Islam and its founder is Guru. I am really confused what I can i do to make a sikhi person embrace Islam and they are almsot alike, the only thing that they dont have quran and they dont mention Prophet Mohammed ( peace be upon you). some people claim that this religion is from God because Guru got nrevelation from God. We know that this is not true but what we can say, if someone tell us that the teachings of islma are like sikhism teachings?
thanks
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*noor
04-30-2006, 07:16 PM
Originally Posted by ivanna25
assalam alaykom wa rahmatou Allah,

dear my brothers and sisters, thank God i am a Muslim and I love my religion. I try to talk about Islam with non-muslims and non-believers using the modest knowledge i have and logical arguments I have learnt for quran, Sunnah, and Muslim scholars.

I was adviced to learn about other religions: hinduism, budhism, sikhism, judaism, christianity etc. in order to have more knowledge and be able to discuss with others the logic of each religion. When I talk about Islam, i always say that Islam is the only religion which believes in the oneness of god and which gives value to human beings. after readin about sikhism ( aodou billah from that name), I ve relaized that the teaching of Sikhism is 90 percent like Islam. Sikhism is religion which came 8 centuries after Islam and its founder is Guru. I am really confused what I can i do to make a sikhi person embrace Islam and they are almsot alike, the only thing that they dont have quran and they dont mention Prophet Mohammed ( peace be upon you). some people claim that this religion is from God because Guru got nrevelation from God. We know that this is not true but what we can say, if someone tell us that the teachings of islma are like sikhism teachings?
thanks
i think its good to know about other relgions even though you dont believe in them so that you can answer questions when people ask you and so you just know more things. :)
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ivanna25
04-30-2006, 07:25 PM
But why Sikhism is like Islam? why they have a holy book like us and they claim it is from God? here is a link talking about the teachings of sikhism:
The Sikhism Home Page: Sikh Religious Philosophy. sikhi poeple believe that their religion is the true one. Why all these non-Divine religions, are they from Satan? And what makes me crazy that Sikhism is the fifth world religion and Hinduism is the third, why people follow this rubbish and forsake Islam?
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*noor
04-30-2006, 07:28 PM
Originally Posted by ivanna25
But why Sikhism is like Islam? why they have a holy book like us and they claim it is from God? here is a link talking about the teachings of sikhism:
The Sikhism Home Page: Sikh Religious Philosophy. sikhi poeple believe that their religion is the true one. Why all these non-Divine religions, are they from Satan? And what makes me crazy that Sikhism is the fifth world religion and Hinduism is the third, why people follow this rubbish and forsake Islam?

Allahu A'lam ya ukhti, but what I am sure of is that Islam is the only religion that is from Allah. Why would God also give us Sikhism and Hinduism as true religions?
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ivanna25
04-30-2006, 07:36 PM
Of course Islma is religion from God, no doubt about that. Islam is the best. It is better than Chrisianity and Judaism. I dont know why sikhism took its principles from Islam and has another Holy Book? To me it seems
there is nothing special in Sikhism to forskae Islam and embrace Sikhism. please see the link: The Sikhism Home Page: Sikh Religious Philosophy

Edited: By Silver Pearl for violating rule
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*noor
04-30-2006, 07:41 PM
well i looked at the link. it does seem to have adopted some of the ideas of Islam, but its also very different. dont know why someone came up with it.
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ivanna25
04-30-2006, 07:43 PM
Originally Posted by nurofislam
well i looked at the link. it does seem to have adopted some of the ideas of Islam, but its also very different. dont know why someone came up with it.
In which way its very diffrent from islam? it s like Islam with little diffrence i notice.
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*noor
04-30-2006, 07:46 PM
"Rejection of all forms of blind rituals such as fasting, religious vegetarianism, pilgrimages, superstions, yoga, as well as any form of idol worship. " - from the site that you posted.

fasting and pilgrimages are part of Islam, not rejected by Islam.
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ivanna25
04-30-2006, 07:52 PM
yes, that s true, but i said at the begining its 90% like islam not 100%. What made me crazy that Sikhsim claimed that the founder of sikhism called Guru had revelation from God. Look at this: The Sikhism Home Page: Guru Nanak Dev.
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ivanna25
04-30-2006, 08:48 PM
Oh, thank god, finally i find a link which states the diffrence between Islam and sikhism. I hope you read this link. They take the teachings of Islamand modify them to serve them. Please have a look at this: The Sikhism Home Page: Sikhism and Other Religions.

May Allah guide the followers of sikhism to the straight path.....May Allah guide all his slaves to the straight path.

Edited: By Silver Pearl for violating rules
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- Qatada -
04-30-2006, 09:13 PM
:salamext:


I really don't have any evidence for this sister, but i heard that guru nanak was from india and he wanted to bring some sort of friendship or at least end the fighting between the hindus and the muslims, so he may have got a pick and mix of teachings from both religions to make both parties get along with each other.

Some people even say that he may have become muslim, but we should leave that upto Allaah azawajal to decide.


Anyway, i think guru nanak wasn't really the founder of sikhism, but the 10 guru's that came after him may have followed his ways (i.e. not shaving the hair [even though he might not have shaved it due to environmental reasons i.e. he lived in the wild i think- so he never really shaved that much, Allaahu a'lam. (Allaah Almighty knows best.) ) and each of the 10 guru's made his own personal innovations to it.


Thats my opinion anyway, and this might be one of the reasons why sikhism is so similar. But Allaah Almighty knows best.



:wasalamex
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NahidSarvy
04-30-2006, 11:00 PM
I think the best way for outsiders to understand this situation is to quote Sleeper Cell: "Sikhs and Muslims are like the Bloods and Crips. They've been killing each other for 400 years."

That is, there is a long history of bad blood in the Subcontinent, and I think that this might be bleeding into this conversation.

I don't think we should be asking God to curse anyone.
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afriend
04-30-2006, 11:03 PM
It's a good job because we can pick out their errors and then we can use them to argue with them.....

A great Da'wah technique...;)
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Eric H
05-01-2006, 01:19 AM
Greetings and peace be with you ivanna25;

All religions are morally neutral and the individual can use them in any way he might choose; he can use religion to do good, curse, or kill.

Religion is very much like a knife which is also a morally neutral tool, the surgeon can use the knife to heal, or the knife can be used to stab someone.

Religion like a knife helps us to reveal what is in our own hearts, when given the opportunity do we use these tools to benefit or to harm mankind in some way?

How can the religions of the world be used towards peace on Earth?

In the spirit of searching for greater interfaith friendships

Eric
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Alphaseed
05-01-2006, 02:04 AM
A man of God must be knowledable of His own belief system, that way no one can pull a fast one on you , such as kill yourself in the name of God and he will give you 13 virgins in Paradise.

r kill the unbelievers , why would you kill the unbeliever, when you kill them all who will you convince ?
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Eric H
05-01-2006, 10:36 AM
Greetings and peace snakelegs,

I often sense that all the conflict within religion and between religions turns many people away from a faith in God.

In the spirit of seeking a greater interfaith understanding

Eric
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ivanna25
05-01-2006, 12:05 PM
Islam gives the rules for jihad or physical strive. we should not kill people unless they present a threat in our life. we kill noly the people that fight us. this is our function, do u want God to come down to earth to fight? or send his angels? we are here to defend the word of God, and if some bad people do not understand Islam and kill innocent people, this does not mean that this is Islam, ok?
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IbnAbdulHakim
05-01-2006, 12:08 PM
students of comparative religion must hav excellent memory and understanding tho. Its a very hard feat! but mashAllah to those who attempt it, i think i'll prob luk into another religion afta i mastered islam.... lol ye so basically im jus stikin 2 islam :)
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x Maz x
05-01-2006, 12:28 PM
I think firstly you should perfect your deen and then look into other religions...as the current state of the Ummah shows the lack of knowledge the Muslims have about their own religion...InshAllah practice what you preach and perfect the deen...then look into other religions WalaykumAsalaam x
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Trumble
05-01-2006, 12:37 PM
Hehe... I wouldn't say so of Sikhism, but in the case of Buddhism and Hinduism she is of course quite right - from her own perspective of course.

A devout muslim can't help but consider Buddhism "rubbish", as the two religions are totally incompatible. I would disagree, of course, and my own opinion of Islam and theism in general can be guessed using the same logic - but nonetheless I could never condemn a muslim for holding that opinion; IMHO they simply have no choice.

I think the principle reason for studying other religions is not so much that it furthers your understanding of your own (although it certainly can do), as in that it helps you understand the people who believe in them. It engenders respect, if nothing else - or at least it should do, simply because all of the worlds great religions teach that adherents should follow a good and peaceful way of life. That doesn't mean that they all do, of course, but if they do they may (in the opinion of a muslim) be misguided, but why should they be "cursed" by anybody, let alone God? If you want to curse anybody, curse those doing the killing, muslim and non-muslim alike, not the Dalai Lama, Gandhi or Guru Nanak.

Edited: By Silver Pearl
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Nicola
05-01-2006, 12:47 PM
Originally Posted by ivanna25
Islam gives the rules for jihad or physical strive. we should not kill people unless they present a threat in our life. we kill noly the people that fight us. this is our function, do u want God to come down to earth to fight? or send his angels? we are here to defend the word of God, and if some bad people do not understand Islam and kill innocent people, this does not mean that this is Islam, ok?
I believe what God really wants for us is peace and love for one another.

Not to go around asking God to curse everyone but Muslims.
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IbnAbdulHakim
05-01-2006, 01:07 PM
Originally Posted by Nicola
I believe what God really wants for us is peace and love for one another.

Not to go around asking God to curse everyone but Muslims.
he created us into nations and tribes so that we may recognize each other not dispute amongst one another!
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NahidSarvy
05-01-2006, 01:19 PM
Originally Posted by Trumble
A devout muslim can't help but consider Buddhism "rubbish", as the two religions are totally incompatible.
Well, maybe some think that, but devotion does not equal orthopraxy or traditionalism.
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"..MariAm.."
05-01-2006, 01:24 PM
ASALAMOALAIKUM
I really don't have any evidence for this sister, but i heard that guru nanak was from india and he wanted to bring some sort of friendship or at least end the fighting between the hindus and the muslims, so he may have got a pick and mix of teachings from both religions to make both parties get along with each other.

Some people even say that he may have become muslim, but we should leave that upto Allaah azawajal to decide.


Anyway, i think guru nanak wasn't really the founder of sikhism, but the 10 guru's that came after him may have followed his ways (i.e. not shaving the hair [even though he might not have shaved it due to environmental reasons i.e. he lived in the wild i think- so he never really shaved that much, Allaahu a'lam. (Allaah Almighty knows best.) ) and each of the 10 guru's made his own personal innovations to it.


Thats my opinion anyway, and this might be one of the reasons why sikhism is so similar. But Allaah Almighty knows best.
um i also agree .. :)
well i think a person shud first try to learn all abt his own religion so that he can defend himself first ...... but going thru other religion can lower the level of ur imaan .....only great scholars can do that ....
cuz wen u find information abt other religions they ...tell u in a such a good way that u can also get confuse .... so i think its better to stick to ur own religion
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ivanna25
05-01-2006, 01:46 PM
i agree with you that before being excelent in your religion, you can move to study other religions. well, Islam has no end , this means i ll never study other religions. if i follow your logic Abd Majed by advising people to be stick to thier religion, how then people from other religion know Islam and convert to it? i know a great deal about islam and i am able to discuss many things, no one has the perfect knowledge except Allah.
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ivanna25
05-01-2006, 01:50 PM
Of course, i respect all religions, but Sikhsim is a religion which took the princilpes and teachings of Islam and modify them in their own ways. Islam has no errors to be modified. Buddhism is nice religion, i know a bout it, but which is better, believing that there will be an afterlife in which people will be happy and bad people will be punished or Buddhism which believes that people have to reject the amnities of the world in order to die forver and has no reward in the hereafter. Is this logical? which gives more honour to people, Buddhism or Islam? answer me Buddhi people.
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ivanna25
05-01-2006, 01:54 PM
Well, if God himself in the Book curse those who dont believ in Him and who associate anything with Him, how can i keep silent? this what God said not me, brothers and sisters, dont look vey peaceful, i am sure if you find a Buddhi or hindu in front of you, u ll not stop questioning his religion. Our function in this earth is to change munkar "the bad thing" and if we cant, we can feel just hatered toward i t.
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HeiGou
05-01-2006, 03:20 PM
Originally Posted by ivanna25
Of course, i respect all religions,
Weren't you the one that said they were all nonsense and lies just a minute ago? How do you reconcile what you obviously believe about other religions with what you claim to believe about other religions?

but Sikhsim is a religion which took the princilpes and teachings of Islam and modify them in their own ways. Islam has no errors to be modified.
Obviously a lot of Sikhs do not agree with you on that. If, in fact, what you say is true.

Buddhism is nice religion, i know a bout it, but which is better, believing that there will be an afterlife in which people will be happy and bad people will be punished or Buddhism which believes that people have to reject the amnities of the world in order to die forver and has no reward in the hereafter. Is this logical? which gives more honour to people, Buddhism or Islam? answer me Buddhi people.
Buddhism believes in the punishment of the guilty in the next life. Some very bad people go to Hell and are punished (for example in the Eastern Forest temple in Taiwan you can see carvings on black rock of the torments of Hell although I suppose as a Muslim you will never see them). The rest of us are re-born as either a higher or a lower form of life and so are punished for our deeds in this life. I don't see either as especially logical, but I suspect that Buddhism is more logical than most religions. Honor to people? In what sense do you mean that?
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Trumble
05-01-2006, 03:33 PM
Originally Posted by ivanna25
Buddhism is nice religion, i know a bout it, but which is better, believing that there will be an afterlife in which people will be happy and bad people will be punished or Buddhism which believes that people have to reject the amnities of the world in order to die forver and has no reward in the hereafter. Is this logical? which gives more honour to people, Buddhism or Islam? answer me Buddhi people.

It would depend on how you use the phrase "more honour to people".

I would argue that Buddhism in fact does offer more "honour" in the sense that 'salvation' (of whatever form) is acknowledged as the direct responsibility of the individual as opposed to a responsibility 'only' to believe and follow the teachings of a God that will arrange things when the time comes. Mankind is the acknowledged master of its own destiny, and what could offer more "honour" than that?

Of course, that is nonsense if you believe. as you do, in a single omnipotent, omniscient God. It must be.. as man cannot therefore be master of his own destiny in that fashion it would be foolish to believe that he is.. IF you believe in that God. That's why I made the point about the two religions being incompatible in any forms of them that I am aware of.




Originally Posted by NahidSarvy
Well, maybe some think that, but devotion does not equal orthopraxy or traditionalism.
I'm not sure either orthopraxy or traditionalism is required, is it? At the point at which any Islam accepted Buddhism as any more than an interesting, if hypothetical, philosophical idea it would cease to be Islam. All that could vary is the degree in tolerance and acceptance manifested towards Buddhists and what they believe, which would include an understanding of philosophical and intellectual merit, culture and art. But a muslim could never believe.. and hence in that sense however much respect or knowledge exists Buddhism must always be, ultimately, "rubbish" to them. That does not mean everything taught by Buddhism must be "rubbish" to that muslim, and of course when it comes to relations with our fellow human beings there is much commonality between the two religions, and the others too. "Good" behaviour is pretty much a universal ideal... why, of course, is a different question with equally polar differences of opinion as to the answer!
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Trumble
05-01-2006, 03:59 PM
Originally Posted by HeiGou

Buddhism believes in the punishment of the guilty in the next life. Some very bad people go to Hell and are punished (for example in the Eastern Forest temple in Taiwan you can see carvings on black rock of the torments of Hell although I suppose as a Muslim you will never see them). The rest of us are re-born as either a higher or a lower form of life and so are punished for our deeds in this life. I don't see either as especially logical, but I suspect that Buddhism is more logical than most religions.

Buddhism has to be considered as the quest to escape from the cycle of rebirth and suffering, samsara. It is essential to understand that it is not misdeeds that are "punished", but that the mental and spiritual consequences of such deeds necessitate by inevitable cause and effect where 'rebirth' will occur. It that sense, it is perfectly logical.

It varies a great deal according to the particular school you are discussing, but in 'traditional' Buddhism, as near as there is to such a thing, all talk of 'heavens' and 'hells' is purely metaphorical... and indeed can be equated directly to well defined stages in spiritual development. 'Hell' is as likely to be found in the current life as in the next one.
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ivanna25
05-01-2006, 06:08 PM
what the hell a Buddhist is doing in Islamic forum if he is convinced that buddhism is the best religion? Listen, talk about your religion which is man-made, dont say a word about Islam which purely from Allah. God punishes everyone seperately, not take one's bad soul and make in other body. Rebirth and samsara? your religion is like Hinduism and some other religions, do you think that God was unable to create a soul for everybody? why the same souls move from one body to another? why the bad soul go to an animal or a bad person? liste, please dont tell me about your religion, i read about it many times and causes me only headache. You leave the God who created you and give you health and beauty and worship Buddah who is like us, who goes to the toilet like us.
keep this for yourself.
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HeiGou
05-01-2006, 06:18 PM
Originally Posted by ivanna25
what the hell a Buddhist is doing in Islamic forum if he is convinced that buddhism is the best religion?
Maybe he is learning about Islam? Who knows.

Listen, talk about your religion which is man-made, dont say a word about Islam which purely from Allah.
So much for respect for all other religions!

God punishes everyone seperately, not take one's bad soul and make in other body. Rebirth and samsara? your religion is like Hinduism and some other religions, do you think that God was unable to create a soul for everybody?
So you don't really know much about Buddhism then? Of course God was able to create a soul for every living being. But did He? That is a different question.

why the same souls move from one body to another? why the bad soul go to an animal or a bad person? liste, please dont tell me about your religion, i read about it many times and causes me only headache.
So I guess it is not good to learn about other religions?

You leave the God who created you and give you health and beauty and worship Buddah who is like us, who goes to the toilet like us.
keep this for yourself.
Buddhists, on the whole, do not worship Buddha per se.
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*noor
05-01-2006, 06:20 PM
Originally Posted by ivanna25
what the hell a Buddhist is doing in Islamic forum if he is convinced that buddhism is the best religion?

Some people like to learn about other religions:)
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Nicola
05-01-2006, 06:24 PM
Originally Posted by ivanna25
what the hell a Buddhist is doing in Islamic forum if he is convinced that buddhism is the best religion? Listen, talk about your religion which is man-made, dont say a word about Islam which purely from Allah. God punishes everyone seperately, not take one's bad soul and make in other body. Rebirth and samsara? your religion is like Hinduism and some other religions, do you think that God was unable to create a soul for everybody? why the same souls move from one body to another? why the bad soul go to an animal or a bad person? liste, please dont tell me about your religion, i read about it many times and causes me only headache. You leave the God who created you and give you health and beauty and worship Buddah who is like us, who goes to the toilet like us.
keep this for yourself.

Why shouldn't he come and learn about Islam?
I've seen plenty of Muslims and various other religions on Christian forums...

Would you prefer to only have Muslims on this forum?
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NahidSarvy
05-01-2006, 06:51 PM
Buddhists don't worship Buddha. He was a human being. His teachings do not involve God - he refused to answer questions about whether there was or wasn't a God because he was afraid people would be sidetracked by those issues.

Christians and Jews and others have found in Buddhist meditation techniques much devotional use. Don't throw the baby away with the bathwater.
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Trumble
05-01-2006, 07:03 PM
Originally Posted by ivanna25
what the hell a Buddhist is doing in Islamic forum if he is convinced that buddhism is the best religion?
If I wasn't convinced it is the best religion (or to be be precise, the best religion for me) I wouldn't describe myself as a Buddhist. If I thought Islam was a better one, I would be a muslim!


Listen, talk about your religion which is man-made, dont say a word about Islam which purely from Allah.
What exactly have I said about Islam that you disagree with?


God punishes everyone seperately, not take one's bad soul and make in other body. Rebirth and samsara? your religion is like Hinduism and some other religions, do you think that God was unable to create a soul for everybody? why the same souls move from one body to another? why the bad soul go to an animal or a bad person? liste, please dont tell me about your religion, i read about it many times and causes me only headache. You leave the God who created you and give you health and beauty and worship Buddah who is like us, who goes to the toilet like us.
keep this for yourself.
There are several incorrect statements in there. I don't "worship" the Buddha, for example - he is dead, so there is little point. It is rather difficult to answer your questions without telling you about my religion, though!

As to what I am doing here, I'm trying to learn about Islam, and to find out what muslims think about particular issues, and how much common ground there may be. I came to an Islamic forum as opposed to, say, a Christian one because Islam at least makes sense to me (which is more than can be said for much Christian doctrine) even if I do not "believe" it.

It is difficult to have any meaningful discussion on the subject of "comparative religion" when only one religion can be discussed, don't you think? I'm sure you would agree that considering Buddhism, or Christianity, or Hinduism only through what some muslims understand (or think they understand) about them is unlikely to be be particularly rewarding.
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IbnAbdulHakim
05-01-2006, 08:13 PM
Originally Posted by Trumble
As to what I am doing here, I'm trying to learn about Islam, and to find out what muslims think about particular issues, and how much common ground there may be. I came to an Islamic forum as opposed to, say, a Christian one because Islam at least makes sense to me (which is more than can be said for much Christian doctrine) even if I do not "believe" it.
.
good job man, i commend ur efforts :peace: :thumbs_up
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ivanna25
05-01-2006, 09:00 PM
Peace be upon everyone,

I am sorry if I said anything wrong. I really do not mean to say anything bad. Of course, I do not know much about Buddhism, I jus have genral idea about it because I am convinced that Islam is the last religion and it is the best and I ma happy with it.

What makes me angry as a Muslim and as a believer is the fact that some people do not believe in God. What is the problem if you believe that there is a power, an energy or whatever is responsible of creating this universe, and instead of calling it a power or whatever , call it God or Allah. Everything you have is from Allah, so love Him. What is the problem if you believe in all Prophets who were sent from Allah, among them Mohammed ( Peace Be Upon Him). Just by believing in Allah and all the messengers, you become Muslim. Even if you do not like Islamic teaching but at least believe in those two things.Save your life before it is too late.

Islam is the simplist religion and it is not complicated like other religions . Islam is full of beauty. Hinduism and Buddhism invite people to be pure and to fight there desires in order to reach enlightment. How you are created with all the contradictions and you are ordered to fight some of these things which are part of you? you have reason and desire, you have kindnes and violence etc. All these things must have an oultlet in their right context.

Buddhism and Hinduism order people to reach the highest level of peace and to eradicate their desires and thier violent side which is part of the human psychology. they invite people to reject the amnities of the world. Islam, indeed, is like Buddhism and Hinduism in stressing the spiritual side of people but it does not eradictae nor suppress one's desires. We worship God and remeber Him, but we enjoy our life, we can eat the best food, wear the best clothes, and live in the best houses if we are financially able to, at the same time we have to help poor people. We can marry to satisy our desires, and we can use this violence for defending ourselves and not for harming others. Islam is a balance between the spiritual and the physical. Not only this, God promise us Jennah or Paradise if we worship Him.

If we do bad things, like stealing others, commiting adultery, and drink alcohol, but after that we regret for doing these things and repent, God makes all the past sins turn to good deeds. God will gives us a palace for each and give men many beautiful women in garden and He will give women what they dream of there. However, those who dont believe in God will go to the lowest rank of Hell.

So, we can enjoy our life here and worship God and we can have paradise, but in Buddhism and Hinduism, a person has to meditate, to reject the world, and to be isolated from people in order to reach this enlightment and you have no everlasting life with your family and freinds in a paradise like we will have.

Is there anything simpler than Islam. Is there anything sweeter than Quran ( Holy Book). Go to this link: TheHolyQuran.org, quran, holyquran, holy quran, al quran, qur'an, al qur'an, coran, kuruan, koran, corano,koraani, qoran, kuran, islam, muslim, allah, arabic, türkçe,meal, der heilige Koran, islam, muslim, chinese al qur'an, el sagrado coran, japanese Kuruan, kerim, allah, god, le saint coran, il sacro corano, finnish koraani, alcoao sagrado, russian, poland, portugal, qur'ani tukufu, kitab suci al-quran, indonesian, malesian, meal, Jesus, christian, catholic, ateist. you can find our Book written in all the languages and choose the language you speak and read some chapters, i am sure you will adore God's words. God is speaking to you and me and to everyone with a brain in His Book.

Please worship none but God who created everyhting perfect in this world and Who is waiting you patiently to worship Him and to love Him.

Thanks.
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Umm-Layth
05-02-2006, 12:29 AM
Originally Posted by ivanna25
assalam alaykom wa rahmatou Allah,

dear my brothers and sisters, thank God i am a Muslim and I love my religion. I try to talk about Islam with non-muslims and non-believers using the modest knowledge i have and logical arguments I have learnt for quran, Sunnah, and Muslim scholars.

I was adviced to learn about other religions: hinduism, budhism, sikhism, judaism, christianity etc. in order to have more knowledge and be able to discuss with others the logic of each religion. When I talk about Islam, i always say that Islam is the only religion which believes in the oneness of god and which gives value to human beings. after readin about sikhism ( aodou billah from that name), I ve relaized that the teaching of Sikhism is 90 percent like Islam. Sikhism is religion which came 8 centuries after Islam and its founder is Guru. I am really confused what I can i do to make a sikhi person embrace Islam and they are almsot alike, the only thing that they dont have quran and they dont mention Prophet Mohammed ( peace be upon you). some people claim that this religion is from God because Guru got nrevelation from God. We know that this is not true but what we can say, if someone tell us that the teachings of islma are like sikhism teachings?
thanks
Once you really study the Qur'aan you realize that all the answers are there...

Allaah has clearly refuted their ideologies and in my opinion there is no point of going and learning any "similarities". Rather we need to look as to why we are Muslim and they are not... obviously Tawheed. The foundation of everything.

And also it is a grave error to say the Islaamic teachings are like the sikhism teachings. Rather, we need to call them to tawheed - because there is one truth and one truth only. The rest are just things that have been played with you know?

Allaah is the Source of the Truth - not the other way around.
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snakelegs
05-02-2006, 01:55 AM
ivanna25,
as i said earlier, you are a fine example of religious tolerance!
and some muslims go crazy when islam or the prophet are criticized and demand respect from others?
respect goes both ways.
loving your religion does not mean you have to hate others. is that what you think god wants you to do to prove your iman?
sad....


from some of your previous posts in this thread you started:

"Well, if God himself in the Book curse those who dont believ in Him"

where does it say this in the qur'an?

"Our function in this earth is to change munkar "the bad thing" and if we cant, we can feel just hatered toward it." (re:buddhism and hinduism).

"what the hell a Buddhist is doing in Islamic forum if he is convinced that buddhism is the best religion? Listen, talk about your religion which is man-made, dont say a word about Islam which purely from Allah."

"liste, please dont tell me about your religion .... keep this for yourself"

"What makes me angry as a Muslim and as a believer is the fact that some people do not believe in God"
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syilla
05-02-2006, 02:08 AM
i think... i read somewhere before that they believe a muslim killed their god. That's why they hate islam.
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snakelegs
05-02-2006, 02:13 AM
Originally Posted by syilla
i think... i read somewhere before that they believe a muslim killed their god. That's why they hate islam.
huh?
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syilla
05-02-2006, 02:23 AM
i try to find the web site for you...

it is about a sikh converted to islam...(sorry... related to previous-previous thread)....
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extinction
05-02-2006, 02:29 AM
well after reading this I think alot of sikhs nowadays simply follow the religion of thier parents....thats how people can come to accept religions which dont have much "steak"
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syilla
05-02-2006, 02:59 AM
found it...!!!

(*sigh ... i always delete my history... if i want to do some research...i got to surf it again... again ... and again)

here is the website...

DiscoverSikhi.Com > Why I Left Sikhism to Revert to Islam

*pls bare in mind that... there maybe a little truth in it... but still... we may learn something from it.
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HeiGou
05-02-2006, 09:25 AM
Originally Posted by syilla
i think... i read somewhere before that they believe a muslim killed their god. That's why they hate islam.
Well several of the Sikh Gurus were tortured and executed by Mughal Emperors. Is that what you mean? Of course the problem is deeper than that as the Sikhs were persecuted by Muslim authorities from the moment they started. They converted people from Hinduism and Islam both of which the Mughals prohibited. I don't think you have to go far to discover why Sikhs bear grudges against Muslims.
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ivanna25
05-02-2006, 10:21 AM
Hey Sankelegs, how come you dont know that in our Book God curses thse who worship someone else except God or associate anything with Him? you asked me where in the Quran, well, the Quran is full of verses in which God says that the infidels who worshp anything or anyone beside Him will be etrenally in Hell.
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NahidSarvy
05-02-2006, 02:30 PM
Sikhs are monotheists, so this doesn't really apply, does it?
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ivanna25
05-02-2006, 03:02 PM
well, sikhs claim to be monotheist but still they believe that God is father, mother, friends and portector, so they are worse than those who say that Jesus is God"s son.

Only the name of this religion can make me scared, "Sikhism"????
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Alphaseed
05-02-2006, 09:14 PM
Originally Posted by ivanna25
Islam gives the rules for jihad or physical strive. we should not kill people unless they present a threat in our life. we kill noly the people that fight us. this is our function, do u want God to come down to earth to fight? or send his angels? we are here to defend the word of God, and if some bad people do not understand Islam and kill innocent people, this does not mean that this is Islam, ok?
Yes you should expect God to fight his own Battles, He said He would and he will, God further said "mine is the vengeance I will not be fooled"
God does not want his sons to fight anyone but hasatan and his fallen angels.
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ivanna25
05-02-2006, 09:31 PM
What is our function, then, if God does everything to us? God help His slaves and makes them victorious if they really fight for spreading justice. We should take the initiative and then God help us and gives us powers we never expect to have.
See, what s happening is Palestine and lately in Iraq, God is able to kill those who kill and harm innocent people in a glance, but we are the ones to take the initiative to defend our brothers and sisters, then, Allah will make us victorious.
In Battle Badr, Mohammed ( Peace Be Upon Him) and His warriors were much fewer than infidels and Muslims were not prepared for war, but still they were victorious. Victory is related to numbers or military power but in strong faith and noble objectives.
Some people say that jihad is what makes Islam have a violent and agressive outlook. I tell those who believe in this, do you want Muslims to be peaceful even if their sisters and brothers are raped, tortured and killed everyday. violence is a result of violence and injustice.
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snakelegs
05-02-2006, 11:52 PM
Originally Posted by ivanna25
Hey Sankelegs, how come you dont know that in our Book God curses thse who worship someone else except God or associate anything with Him? you asked me where in the Quran, well, the Quran is full of verses in which God says that the infidels who worshp anything or anyone beside Him will be etrenally in Hell.
because it has been a long time since i've read the quran - it is time for me to read it again!
what about the other statements you've made that i quoted? here they are again:

"Our function in this earth is to change munkar "the bad thing" and if we cant, we can feel just hatered toward it." (re:buddhism and hinduism).

so are you supposed to feel hatred toward people like buddhists and hindus? - do you think it's religious to hate people?

"what the hell a Buddhist is doing in Islamic forum if he is convinced that buddhism is the best religion? Listen, talk about your religion which is man-made, dont say a word about Islam which purely from Allah."

in spite of the ironic subject line you gave this thread obviously buddhists at least, should keep their mouths shut on an islamic forum because they are following the wrong religion? how is this attitude going to win you the ears of people you are trying to bring to islam?

"liste, please dont tell me about your religion .... keep this for yourself"

so, you want to tell people about yours but not listen to what they say about theirs? why did you give this thread the title you did? how are you going to learn about all religions with this attitude? a little tolerance and respect would be very useful if you want to promote yours.

"What makes me angry as a Muslim and as a believer is the fact that some people do not believe in God"

why should this anger you? shouldn't it be a matter between the unbeliever and god? sounds like god's department to me.
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ivanna25
05-03-2006, 09:52 AM
Dear everyone,

Of course, we dont have to hate people. This is not what we ordered to do. I said i should hate the wrong deeds and those who do these wrong deeds. I think I am free to feel what I like.

Religiously speaking, believing in God is something instinct but our social, religious and political background has a strong impact on us and they either distort this instinct or refine it and change our perspectives.

Because I love God, I must hate everyone does not believe in Him. This is what I believe. It is logical to know that this world has a Master and has a Controller, we should all fear and love Him. He is the one who gives all the beauties of life even if we lack something in this life, this does not mean that God was unable to make us perfect, but this life is ephemeral and short and we cant be perfect in it. How can I love someone who disobey his parents who bring him to life, feed him, provide him with all the ncessary things and at the end this person leave his parents without thanking them? the same thing for people who were created by God and they are provided with many good things, but still they dont worship Him or associate anything with Him? I cant accept this. I respect only those who do not know anything about Islam and other Divine releigions because they are ignorant and they cant be blamed, but you and many people like you know much about Islam, Its tolearnce, Its logic, and Its mercy but still you resume your atheistic, agnostical, or even polytheistic faith.

why you should have doubts about the existence of God and about His absolute powers? You see that we, human beings, have reached the highest level of knowldge and make this big world like a small farm through technology: mobiles, internet,etc. So, if we human beings were able to do that, what about the one Who creates us all?

Why you want to see this God to believe in Him? You dont have to see Him but look at His creation. You can see people around you but still they give you nothing. The highest level of faith is to believe in something you dont see. Our reward will be Paradise, you know what is Paradise? do you want to get this Paradise easily? Do you want to see God in front of your eyes to believe that He is there? If we all see God, no one will disbelieve, while in fact, the reason behind the creation of this wordly life is to testify our faith. Life is just an exam and bridge to a bteer life. If this life was soooooo important, you would not find people live only few years, while others live 80 years, you would not find people who are handicap and others who are healthy, you wouldnt find people who are rich and others who starve. It s not fair to have only one life in which people live comfortably while others suffer. It must be another life in which we ll be all equal in happiness, beauty, and prosperity. Only those who dont want to believe in God who will spend the rest of their life in Hell. Why you expect God to give you Paradise and you dont do anything to Him. God doesnt need anything from us because we are powerless, He just wants us to worship Him. He is God and we are His slaves. He gives us many things and we should worship Him in return. This the reason behind the existence of humanity on the face of this Allah.

It is not that complicated, believe in your God. I am sure there are many things you believe in and you use though you dont see them. Whats the soul u have in your body? can u see it, but still it is more important than your body which you can see. Your body worth nothing without this abstract matter. What is imagination? what are dreams? and a lot of other things you cant grasp their meanings.

By the way,if I am bad person or whatever, it doesnt mean that I will be the reason behind your unwilingness to convert to Islam. You can see in the media, some bad Muslims kill innocent people, but still everyday people convert to Islam. I am not bad like those, but I have a bad feelings for those who dont believe in God Who created every little thing in this universe. this is my personal attitude, I am free to think what I like as you are free to doubt about the existence of God who has no father nor son. when one day you convert to Islam, you will understand why I am angry with disbelievers. God is the greatest and we are ordered to feel sad when we see people do anything to disobey God.
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NahidSarvy
05-03-2006, 01:44 PM
Originally Posted by ivanna25
Dear everyone, Of course, we dont have to hate people. This is not what we ordered to do. I said i should hate the wrong deeds and those who do these wrong deeds. I think I am free to feel what I like.

Because I love God, I must hate everyone does not believe in Him. This is what I believe. (snip) How can I love someone who disobey his parents who bring him to life, feed him, provide him with all the ncessary things and at the end this person leave his parents without thanking them? the same thing for people who were created by God and they are provided with many good things, but still they dont worship Him or associate anything with Him? I cant accept this.
Umm... self-contradiction here? I don't hate non-Muslims, I hate non-Muslims?
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Silver Pearl
05-03-2006, 02:13 PM
Greetings to fellow non-muslims and :salamext:

This is not a place to bash other people’s faith nor is it a place for anyone to curse others.

If you do not hold ilm (knowledge) on a topic it is best you refrain from posting in the first place. Allah (subhana wa ta’ala) guides whom he pleases.


It is alright for one to learn about other people’s faiths and their teachings. Ahmed Deedat (May Allah be pleased with him) is a great example of some one who was well versed in other faith. However, you have to notice that he was also well versed in Islam. It is best that one learns about their deen first before jumping the wagon. Just because one knows about tahweed and has read few books does not qualify them to be in the same level as the likes of Scholars.

Also people, in future references be careful on what you write. It doesn’t give anyone here the right to mock other people’s faith. That is not the teachings of Islam.

This thread has diverted from its original purpose, serves little benefit and thus will be
Closed, if you have any queries PM me for further clarification on the matter.
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