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sonz
05-01-2006, 07:43 PM
Sveriges muslimska förbund, or the Swedish Muslim Association, (SMuF), the largest Muslim organisation in Sweden, with 70,000 members that represent the nearly 470,000 Muslim immigrants living in the country, sent a letter to the Swedish parliament demanding it to launch a separate legislation for Muslims.

Muslims, who form nearly 4% of the population of Sweden, live in the major city areas as Stockholm (South and North–West of the city), Gothenburg (North, East and South of the city) and Malmoe (City centre, South and East of the city). There are also a few active Muslim communities in the mid-size cities (population of 30.000 to 90.000) of Sweden.

There is no dominant ethnic group, but the largest communities are from Iran, Turkey and Bosnia. There are also significant numbers of Iraqis, Palestinians and Albanians.

In its letter to Parliament parties, SmuF demanded that divorces between Muslims be approved by a Muslim Imam, and that Imams be allowed to give Muslim students who go to public schools separate lessons in Islam and in their native languages.

It also requested that Muslim boys and girls have separate swimming and gym lessons.

But Swedish minister for Integration and Equality, Jens Orback, rejected the Muslim demands for separate laws.

“In Sweden we are all equal before the law. In Sweden we have fought for a long time to achieve gender-neutral laws, and to propose that certain groups should not be treated like others is completely unacceptable,” Orback said.

“I think it is very problematic and unfortunate that people who have been in Sweden for so long are making proposals like these, that are so opposed to our intentions, when we are fighting for women’s rights and the right to divorce.”

But Ebtisam Aldebe, a female candidate of the Centerpartiet, the Centre Party, which belongs to the Allians för Sverige, a coalition of four center-right parties that hope to oust the Social-Democrats from power next Autumn, expressed her support to SmuF’s proposal, saying that men should be inherit more than women, as this is what the Qur’an, the Muslims holy book, says.
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HeiGou
05-01-2006, 07:50 PM
Originally Posted by sonz
Sveriges muslimska förbund, or the Swedish Muslim Association, (SMuF), the largest Muslim organisation in Sweden, with 70,000 members that represent the nearly 470,000 Muslim immigrants living in the country, sent a letter to the Swedish parliament demanding it to launch a separate legislation for Muslims.
So not very representative then.
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knuckles
05-01-2006, 07:50 PM
They should have seperate laws. They want Islamic laws move back to Iran, Iraq, Turkey, and Albania
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sonz
05-01-2006, 07:52 PM
so whats wrong with seperate laws for marriage and stuff???

in islamic state

christians jews and others also have their own laws for marriage and stuff
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Nicola
05-01-2006, 07:54 PM
I really don't know how they can live in a country if they don't like their laws of the land..
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Nicola
05-01-2006, 07:55 PM
Originally Posted by sonz
so whats wrong with seperate laws for marriage and stuff???

in islamic state

christians jews and others also have their own laws for marriage and stuff
which islamic states?
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HeiGou
05-01-2006, 07:56 PM
Originally Posted by sonz
so whats wrong with seperate laws for marriage and stuff???

in islamic state

christians jews and others also have their own laws for marriage and stuff
Well in an Islamic state it comes with a whole lot of discriminatory laws as well. So if you want the full of range of traditional Muslim Dhimmitude that would be one thing - no Muslim testimony accepted in a Western court for instance, no Mosques being built or repaired, no death sentence for anyone who killed a Muslim, a ban on intermarriage with non-Muslim women, but not for Muslim women, death for any attempt to convert a non-Muslim, penal taxation rates for Muslims etc etc. Would you really want all that?

Now the West has experiences of this with African-Americans in the South. It did not work out. I think that the West needs to defend their values which means all citizens need to accept a minimum set of common values and this is not reconcilable with this demand.
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IbnAbdulHakim
05-01-2006, 07:56 PM
i see nothing wrong with these requests?

seperate swimming pools, private teachers.

Its racism to not allow these things i tell u!!!
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HeiGou
05-01-2006, 07:57 PM
Originally Posted by Abd'Majid
i see nothing wrong with these requests?

seperate swimming pools, private teachers.

Its racism to not allow these things i tell u!!!
They can have separate swimming pools and private teachers. If they pay for them. Why should the Swedish tax payer pay for these things? It is an absurd demand and should be ignored.
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Trumble
05-01-2006, 07:57 PM
Originally Posted by knuckles
They want Islamic laws move back to Iran, Iraq, Turkey, and Albania
I have to agree. If they are unwilling to accept the same laws as other Swedes, they should never have accepted Swedish citizenship.
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sonz
05-01-2006, 07:58 PM
Originally Posted by Nicola
which islamic states?
i said in islamic state like khilafah

i remember that india also has personal laws for each group and they copied it from the khilafa system since muslims used to rule india
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IbnAbdulHakim
05-01-2006, 08:00 PM
Originally Posted by HeiGou
They can have separate swimming pools and private teachers. If they pay for them. Why should the Swedish tax payer pay for these things? It is an absurd demand and should be ignored.
to pay 4 the pools is ok as its been done in this country but the teachers i admit is a bit overboard :p
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HeiGou
05-01-2006, 08:00 PM
Originally Posted by sonz
i remember that india also has personal laws for each group and they copied it from the khilafa system since muslims used to rule india
Indeed it does. But only for Muslims. Which is why a woman who was raped by her Father-in-law can have some bizarre tribal council proclaiming, in the name of Islam, that she has to divorce her husband and marry his Father.

I do not think that this would be a good thing to have in Sweden. How do you know that these people know what is really Islamic when they don't in India?
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knuckles
05-01-2006, 08:01 PM
Originally Posted by sonz
i said in islamic state like khilafah

i remember that india also has personal laws for each group and they copied it from the khilafa system since muslims used to rule india
India is not an Islamic state and in Islamic states they do have seperate laws for non muslims. Do we need to run down the Dhimmitude laws like having to wear distinctive dress?
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sonz
05-01-2006, 08:08 PM
Originally Posted by knuckles
India is not an Islamic state and in Islamic states they do have seperate laws for non muslims. Do we need to run down the Dhimmitude laws like having to wear distinctive dress?
i never said that india is an islamic state. i said they copied it from the khilafa system.

whats wrong in wearing distinctive dress. its much better forbidding religious clothes. at least distinctive dress is for recognizing.

chk this quote from li modz:

Originally Posted by kadafi
As for the policy that they have to be distinct from the Muslims (i.e. not dress as the Muslims), then this is true and has been enforced for various reasons.
  • It helps them preserve their identity
  • It protects them incase they do something contrary in Islaam for which a Muslim would face punishment and for which they by being non-Muslims are exempt from punishment.
Compare this to the new policy that is adopted in many non-Muslims countries where they prevent the Muslims from wearing their Islaamic clothes.
masalama
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knuckles
05-01-2006, 08:13 PM
Originally Posted by sonz
i never said that india is an islamic state. i said they copied it from the khilafa system.

whats wrong in wearing distinctive dress. its much better forbidding religious clothes. at least distinctive dress is for recognizing.

chk this quote from li modz:


masalama
It is a device used to single people out for abuse. The Nazi's used this same tactic
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snakelegs
05-02-2006, 03:35 AM
if muslims can not live in an open, pluralistic society, they should not be living in the west. who is forcing them to stay in sweden?
why do they expect their adopted countries to cater to them?
it "demands" like these that will one day cause the europeans to throw them all out.

i agree with the statement below:
"But Swedish minister for Integration and Equality, Jens Orback, rejected the Muslim demands for separate laws.

“In Sweden we are all equal before the law. In Sweden we have fought for a long time to achieve gender-neutral laws, and to propose that certain groups should not be treated like others is completely unacceptable,” Orback said.

“I think it is very problematic and unfortunate that people who have been in Sweden for so long are making proposals like these, that are so opposed to our intentions, when we are fighting for women’s rights and the right to divorce.”
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north_malaysian
05-02-2006, 03:38 AM
Israel recognizes seperate laws for Muslims (I mean personal law)
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Bunk
05-02-2006, 04:10 AM
if muslims can not live in an open, pluralistic society, they should not be living in the west. who is forcing them to stay in sweden?
why do they expect their adopted countries to cater to them?
it "demands" like these that will one day cause the europeans to throw them all out
Amen. One set of rules, our rules, for everyone in the country. The Law. You may leave if it hurts your feelings. Or you may go to a muslim country if you are offended by western "decadence". But you will get zero special treatment from a society that already goes out of its way to be "sensitive" to your religion. Stop complaining, too. Thank-you.
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extinction
05-02-2006, 04:14 AM
hey I dont agree with this....yo if your going to move to someone elses country then stick with their laws and stop trying to draw attention for the wrong reasons if you dont like it go back home......... if they have any laws that are like going against islam then yes of course try and change them otherwise live with it
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syilla
05-02-2006, 04:22 AM
it will take them...more than 10 years...to create a systematic one...

here in malaysia...we have our own laws (islamic law)... but always conflict with the civil laws (non-islamic)...

but syaria laws...is on top of the civil law --- for the muslims here

but what about the converts...?? or for the one who is murtad.

still create problems...
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north_malaysian
05-02-2006, 05:00 AM
Originally Posted by syilla
here in malaysia...we have our own laws (islamic law)... but always conflict with the civil laws (non-islamic)...
Islamic law which is not really islamic ... RM2,000 for adultery. If a person is a millionaire, he can commit as many adulterous acts as he want - just plead guilty and pay RM2,000.

Originally Posted by syilla
but syaria laws...is on top of the civil law --- for the muslims here
Nop... syaria laws is at par with the civil laws (in the same level) But in Malaysian Federal Constitution, the Federal Constitution is the highest and most supreme laws of the nation - WHICH IS ABOVE Syariah Laws.
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