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View Full Version : Another "SCIENTIFIC FACT" that struck my mind, don't know if its right.



Muhammad Waqqas
07-05-2006, 01:54 PM
:sl:

Dear brothers, and sisters, I'm really not here duplicating someone's words, if I am, i-e if this idea has already been presented, then I'm sorry for re-writing it.

So, the point that came to my mind is that:

We know, that this word cannot give 100% justice to any criminal. For that, Allah (Subhanahu wa'ta'aala) has created the hell. The law or the police of this world would atmost 'kill' the person once who has commited 100 murders. That is not justice. Allah (Subhanahu wa'ta'aala) can kill the person 100 times, by reborning him 100 times, right?

Please correct me whereever I get wrong. I'm just another studen't.

So, Allah created hell so that the justice in the punishment can take place. Now, in the Qur'an and the Sahih Hadith, we're told that the hell is going to be hot, very hot, hoter than hot.

Now lets just suppose a situation: A person has commited 100 sins, he's going to be burnt in a fire which is 100° C. (Just supposing ok, I'm not making a new Fiqh here ofcourse :)) Next, a person has 250 sins, and suppose he is burnt in a fire which is 250° C. Similarly a person did 10,000 sins, he'll be burnt in a fire 10,000° C.

But the same situation is wrong if the hell had been cold. Ofcourse for Allah everything is easy. But just to make us understand this, perhaps this is why he made it the way it is. I mean there is no limit on how hot, hot can be. But there is a limit on how cold, cold can be. -273° C I guess.

At the time of Prophet Muhammad, this fact was not known that there is a limit on how cold cold can be, therefore the Hell should be hot so that anybody who no matter how many sins he has can get the reward according to his actions. Like we learn from the Qur'an and the Hadith that the hell's fire is very very hot than the fire of this world, may be millions and million times more. But if (Na aaozubillah) the Prophet Muhammad was a false prophet (Na auzubillah) and he would have made a statement like "The hell's coldness is going to be million times colder than the cold of this world.", they would have proved him wrong right away.

This, in my sight, seems to be a cool miracle of the Qur'an.

I'm sorry if that didn't make any sense, or if I bored you.

:sl:
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IceQueen~
07-05-2006, 02:01 PM
isn't the fire of hell supposed to be 70 times hotter than the fire of the world?
did you know there is also a place in hell where it is freezing cold?
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Muhammad Waqqas
07-05-2006, 02:12 PM
No, I have not heard of such a place. Perhaps you can enlighten me some more. I think there are 7 levels of the Hell, and the hotest is 'Havia', others are, I think 'Hutama' etc.. I dont remember their names. I have never heard of a place which is freezing cold. Secondly I am saying it might be another 'scientific fact' to be proved from the Qur'an. I mean obviously for Allah nothing is difficult.
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Muhammad Waqqas
07-05-2006, 02:14 PM
The Fire of hell has no comparison with the fire of the world. Not just "70" times? Correct me if I am wrong.
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Sis786
07-05-2006, 02:27 PM
Originally Posted by Muhammad Waqqas
The Fire of hell has no comparison with the fire of the world. Not just "70" times? Correct me if I am wrong.
;D Sorry but you post made me laugh! Remind me of this kid at school and instead of answering a question simple he would go wild and say all sorts!

No offence Bro and i get ya post just wondering why would someone think of this :rollseyes lol :giggling:
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Abdulwaheed
07-05-2006, 02:33 PM
Lol i read it 3 times i still dont understand the poiny he is trying to get across
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Samee
07-05-2006, 05:20 PM
:sl:

It has been proven authentically that the fire of hell will be 69 times hotter than the fire on earth.

The Prophet said, ‘The Hell Fire is 69 times hotter than ordinary worldly fires.’ So someone said, ‘Allah’s Apostle, wouldn’t this ordinary fire have been sufficient to torture the unbelievers?’”

And he is trying to say that if a person committed 150 sins, his fire would be 150 degrees. That if he committed 700 sins, his fire would be 700 degrees Celsius. Then he says that if the fire was cold, it would be impossible- cold cannot be colder than -273 celsius. That is the coldest we know of. And if somone committed 274 sins, then they couldnt feel -274 celsius because it doesn't exist.

This is WRONG however. The hellfire does NOT go higher in degrees just because of the amount of sins someone committed. Technically it does, but it isn't uniform, i.e 17 sins feels 17 degrees fire. There are 7 gates of hell, each for the types of people. One for the hypocrites, where they feel one type of punishment, one for the polythiests, etc.

And Abu'Talibb, uncle of the Prophet (upon him be peace) will feel the lowest type of punishment in hell, where he will wear sandals with laces of fire. The fire will be so hot that it will boil his brain. And this is the man with the lowest punishment :(

People are thrown into the gate of hell where they belong, and the amount of degrees of fire doesnt relate to the amount of sins people feel. The fire of hell will be 69 times hotter than the fire of the world, but there will be therein in the hellfire numerous types of punishments for all the types of sinners.
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Muhammad Waqqas
07-06-2006, 05:59 AM
Brother Samee, The first thing I want to ask you is that is it right, according to the sister that there is a place which will be freezing cold in hell?

Secondly, I have heard a hadith which says that even if the walls of hell have a hole which is as big as diameter of the needle, it will yet burn all the shurbs and herbs present on earth. That indicates its hotness. Another one I heard which said that if only one small pot of hell's water is pourd in the see's they would all dry up.

Now this, in my mind, made me thinking about the hotness of fire of Hell. Secondly, we cannot stick to one hadith. It is also said that the fire of Havia is so hot that the fire of the other parts of Hell itself seeks Allah's refuge from it. So only saying that the fire is this much hot is kind of.... wrong. I mean the fire is not of a fixed temprature. Different levels have different temprature.


Sorry but you post made me laugh! Remind me of this kid at school and instead of answering a question simple he would go wild and say all sorts!

No offence Bro and i get ya post just wondering why would someone think of this lol
Its Allright, I did not expect everyone to understand it.

Lol i read it 3 times i still dont understand the poiny he is trying to get across
Thanks dear brother, and sister, for asking me about the point I've raised (or duplicated, if somebody has already made it).

Brother, the thing I want to state is that I have never heard how cold hell will be, rather I have heard how hot hell will be. But there is a limit on how cold, cold can be, but there is no limit on how hot, hot can be.

Considering the amount of hotness that the other brother posted about, i-e 69 times hoter than the hotness of this world, we can yet prove it that a fire exists that can be 69 times hoter than the worldly fire. But the reson why Prophet Muhammad (SAWM) didn't say that hell will be 69 times colder than the Ice, is because there is no such thing which is 69 times colder than Ice, it dosen't exist. Ice is usually at -273 K, which if we multiply by 69 becomes -18,837 which actually dosen't exist. That's a proof that the Prophet (SAWM) had the knowledge of the limit of coldness (At the time when it was not reveald) and the unlimited hotness so that humans may understand.
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Woodrow
07-06-2006, 06:09 AM
Originally Posted by Muhammad Waqqas
Brother Samee, The first thing I want to ask you is that is it right, according to the sister that there is a place which will be freezing cold in hell?

Secondly, I have heard a hadith which says that even if the walls of hell have a hole which is as big as diameter of the needle, it will yet burn all the shurbs and herbs present on earth. That indicates its hotness. Another one I heard which said that if only one small pot of hell's water is pourd in the see's they would all dry up.

Now this, in my mind, made me thinking about the hotness of fire of Hell. Secondly, we cannot stick to one hadith. It is also said that the fire of Havia is so hot that the fire of the other parts of Hell itself seeks Allah's refuge from it. So only saying that the fire is this much hot is kind of.... wrong. I mean the fire is not of a fixed temprature. Different levels have different temprature.



Its Allright, I did not expect everyone to understand it.



Thanks dear brother, and sister, for asking me about the point I've raised (or duplicated, if somebody has already made it).

Brother, the thing I want to state is that I have never heard how cold hell will be, rather I have heard how hot hell will be. But there is a limit on how cold, cold can be, but there is no limit on how hot, hot can be.

Considering the amount of hotness that the other brother posted about, i-e 69 times hoter than the hotness of this world, we can yet prove it that a fire exists that can be 69 times hoter than the worldly fire. But the reson why Prophet Muhammad (SAWM) didn't say that hell will be 69 times colder than the Ice, is because there is no such thing which is 69 times colder than Ice, it dosen't exist. Ice is usually at -273 K, which if we multiply by 69 becomes -18,837 which actually dosen't exist. That's a proof that the Prophet (SAWM) had the knowledge of the limit of coldness (At the time when it was not reveald) and the unlimited hotness so that humans may understand.
"but there is no limit on how hot, hot can be."

I'm just nit picking. But, in the physical world there is a maximum hot that can be achieved. It reaches a point where the individual atoms reach a level of excitement that the distance between them becomes too great for heat to exist. It been awhile since I read any physic books so I can not recall what the temp is. But, it is a very high number. Point being I doubt if the maximum high temperature or the lowest low temperature are governed by our laws of physics, so probably the lowest temperature for the cold hell may be far below what we call absolute zero.
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Muhammad Waqqas
07-07-2006, 06:03 AM
There is no limit of heat.
Regarding absolute zero, obviously, it can be much colder than that, but at absolute zero the movement of the atoms actually stops, therefore, we say it cannot get colder than this, since you know? They cannot do anything other than stoping. For Allah, Alhamdulilah everything is possible, but I have never seen such a Sahih Hadith, or any verse of the Qur'an that says the Hell will be cold. I say for Allah everything is possible, but perhaps, just as another sign of the truthfullness of His Prophet, He might have made hell the way it is, so that when science advances, we learn that this is something which was known 1400 years ago.
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Woodrow
07-07-2006, 06:42 AM
Originally Posted by Muhammad Waqqas
There is no limit of heat.Regarding absolute zero, obviously, it can be much colder than that, but at absolute zero the movement of the atoms actually stops, therefore, we say it cannot get colder than this, since you know? They cannot do anything other than stoping. For Allah, Alhamdulilah everything is possible, but I have never seen such a Sahih Hadith, or any verse of the Qur'an that says the Hell will be cold. I say for Allah everything is possible, but perhaps, just as another sign of the truthfullness of His Prophet, He might have made hell the way it is, so that when science advances, we learn that this is something which was known 1400 years ago.
After reading this post I got inquisitive over the concepts I was hearing in physics classes in the 1950s. So I went looking for more up to date stuff. Found something interesting that makes your statement show even more of how Glorious Allah(swt) is. Here is the simple article that impressed me. This is sort of a general summation of the articles I sifted through. Might not look too scientific, but it is a general summary of all the technical stuff.

It is certainly true that increasing the temperature will eventually cause
>combustion but this does not limit the temperature -- it just indicates the
>limit of the temperatures that a particular combination of materials can
>withstand.
>
>The only limitation to the upper end of the temperature scale would be the
>limitation of the available energy.Dr. Bradburn
================================================== =======
>There is no maximum temperature. Temperature is a measure of the average
>kinetic energy of particles, which can be no less than zero (hence absolute
>zero), but there is no upper limit.
>
>It is true that at high enough temperatures, things like molecules and even
>atoms will fly apart into their constituents. That does not mean that the
>pieces can't still move even faster. So any given material may not endure
>at high temperatures, but that does not at all mean that even higher
>temperatures aren't possible.
Now my old physics classes basicaly said essentialy the same thing except somebody calculated the amount of finite energy in the universe. Thereby a theoretical maximum temp was possible. Now it seems that physics findings are showing that the amount of eneergy available is not finite it is infinite so an infinitly high temperature is possible. As best as I know Allah(swt) is the only possible source of infinite energy.

Final view, yes there would be a maximum absolute Temperature IF the universe was finite and there was no infinite energy source.
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Muhammad Waqqas
07-08-2006, 02:15 PM
Yes, but I'm not reffering to the heat in this universe. I'm talking about the Aakhira'h.

Secondly, do you know of any Hadith that talks about hell being cold?
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Muezzin
07-08-2006, 05:54 PM
The fact that we are discussing the heat of the flames of hell disturbs me.
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gr8man
07-08-2006, 06:10 PM
Asalamualikum,
Its gud to see that now a days people r taking huge intrest in Islam, this topic is also concering Islam but My suggestion is that if we spent our more time in service of islam rather then spenting time in tallking abt the Hell. Hell is place where no Muslim want to go so if we dont want to go to hell that mean we have to give our full time in service of Allah & Islam.
so thats wht I think
hope u people dont mind
Walikumsalam
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Woodrow
07-08-2006, 06:22 PM
Originally Posted by gr8man
Asalamualikum,
Its gud to see that now a days people r taking huge intrest in Islam, this topic is also concering Islam but My suggestion is that if we spent our more time in service of islam rather then spenting time in tallking abt the Hell. Hell is place where no Muslim want to go so if we dont want to go to hell that mean we have to give our full time in service of Allah & Islam.
so thats wht I think
hope u people dont mind
Walikumsalam
Shukrah to you and Muezzin, for putting this into proper perspective. Those are what we need to look at, rather then dwelling over the charecteristics of hell.
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