PDA

View Full Version : OFFICIAL: Israel lists Conditions NECESSARY for Peace!



Dahir
08-01-2006, 03:10 AM
Source

NEW YORK (CNN) -- With hopes dimming for a quick end to fighting in Lebanon, Israeli Deputy Prime Minister Shimon Peres presented five conditions Monday that he said must be met before Israel can achieve peace with Hezbollah.

"There must be a change in the whole situation in the Middle East," Peres said. "There must be a sustainable peace, a more profound arrangement that will answer the real problems."

In a briefing with reporters at the Omni Berkshire Place hotel in Manhattan, Peres said Israel must:

  • ensure that Hezbollah will never return to the Israeli-Lebanese border;
  • obtain the release of two Israeli soldiers captured by Hezbollah guerrillas July 12;
  • stop Hezbollah from shooting missiles and rockets into Israel;
  • prevent the Lebanon-based militant group from rearming with missiles and rockets from Syria and Iran; and
  • free Lebanon from Hezbollah's control.


Israel doesn't have a problem with Lebanon, but with Hezbollah and its Syrian and Iranian backers, he said.

"Though Hezbollah is a Lebanese body, they don't serve any Lebanese purpose," he said, adding that the militants are trying to make Israel's northern neighbor "part of the sphere of influence of Iran."

Peres said that Iran intended to acquire nuclear weapons as well as remake the Middle East.

"That becomes a real problem for the rest of the world" he added, saying Iran's actions will prompt other countries to follow suit and increase the odds that such weapons end up in terrorists' hands.

Peres made no apologies for Israel's attacks on Lebanon since Hezbollah guerrillas seized the two Israeli soldiers 20 days ago in a cross-border raid.

"We shall fight because we were attacked," he said. "We didn't initiate the fight, nor can we ignore it."

Israel faces mounting international pressure to halt its campaign, especially after an airstrike Sunday killed at least 54 civilians in the southern Lebanese town of Qana.

Israel called the Qana attack a tragic mistake and announced it would temporarily halt its airstrikes.

But bombing continued Monday in southern Lebanon, and Israeli Prime Minister Ehud Olmert said there would be no cease-fire "in the coming days."

Regarding the Qana attack, Peres said, "In war, you have a lot of mistakes. The greatest mistake is the war itself. Anyone who wants to prevent mistakes must stop the war."

He added that Israel was carrying out an investigation to determine how the bombs used in the attack landed more than 300 meters (328 yards) from their intended target.

"We are still investigating what happened. That does not prevent us from feeling deeply sorry to see children losing their lives," he said.

Still, he said, "When you use civilian life as a shield for rockets and missiles, according to international law, you have the right to defend yourself."

Israeli airstrikes and artillery have pounded Lebanon for almost three weeks, leaving nearly 500 people dead. Hezbollah has fired scores of rockets daily into northern Israel, killing at least 18 Israeli civilians.

Clashes with Hezbollah have left 33 Israeli troops dead. Hezbollah's casualties are unknown.

Regarding criticism that Israel's response to Hezbollah has been disproportionate, Peres pointed out that militants fire 100 missiles and rockets every night into northern Israel.

"We don't feel that this is exactly proportionate," he said. "If somebody would suggest another method on how to stop it, we would be happy."

Peres said that the captured Israeli soldiers are "alive and healthy" and that Israel holds Lebanon responsible for their safety.

"Lebanon cannot behave like they are responsible for nothing and the whole world owes them everything," he said.

At 83, Peres said he has lived through wars and "terrible times" when people thought Israel would be destroyed.

"All those times, I remained an optimist and a man of peace," he said. "I didn't change my mind. We shall make it."
Reply

Login/Register to hide ads. Scroll down for more posts
nimrod
08-01-2006, 03:33 AM
Dahir, if you were an Israeli what, of the 5 demands, would you disagree with.

Thanks
Nimrod
Reply

Dahir
08-01-2006, 04:38 AM
Dahir, if you were an Israeli what, of the 5 demands, would you disagree with
None. If I were Israeli I'd know and believe that Hezbollah is a clear threat to me, and which it is!

All of the stated conditions are valid and simple; stop Hezbollah...end of story!

The only problem; will it Happen? Israel knows fully this is impossible, but, hopefully this can be a learning curve.
Reply

nimrod
08-01-2006, 09:48 PM
Dahir, you may very well be right, it looks as though there maybe some sort of armed force put in place that may enable Lebanon to control and disarm Hezbollah.

Thanks
Nimrod
Reply

Welcome, Guest!
Hey there! Looks like you're enjoying the discussion, but you're not signed up for an account.

When you create an account, you can participate in the discussions and share your thoughts. You also get notifications, here and via email, whenever new posts are made. And you can like posts and make new friends.
Sign Up
azim
08-01-2006, 10:05 PM
Originally Posted by nimrod
Dahir, if you were an Israeli what, of the 5 demands, would you disagree with.

Thanks
Nimrod
Originally Posted by Dahir
None. If I were Israeli I'd know and believe that Hezbollah is a clear threat to me, and which it is!

All of the stated conditions are valid and simple; stop Hezbollah...end of story!

The only problem; will it Happen? Israel knows fully this is impossible, but, hopefully this can be a learning curve.
Asalaamu alaykum.

Let's have a quick look at these demands.

In a briefing with reporters at the Omni Berkshire Place hotel in Manhattan, Peres said Israel must:
  • ensure that Hezbollah will never return to the Israeli-Lebanese border;
Why should Hezbollah remove themself from a land that doesn't belong to Israel. Yes, Hezbollah fire rockets into Israel, however (to quote the rhetoric of G. Bush) the Lebanese 'have a right to defend themselves'.

Also, Hezbollah arent just a military power "Hezbollah not only has armed and political wings but also boasts an extensive social development programme. The civilian wing also runs hospitals, news services, and educational facilities."


So why should it discontinue these services to the public in favour of Israel occuption?
  • obtain the release of two Israeli soldiers captured by Hezbollah guerrillas July 12;
Of course Israel should get its soldiers back, but perhaps the thousands of Palestinian and Lebanese who have been captured and imprisioned should be released as well to show that Israel aren't hyprocritical.
  • stop Hezbollah from shooting missiles and rockets into Israel;
This is a ridiculous demand from the most militarily aggressive goverment in the world. Tally up the civilian death caused by Hezbollah and the civilian deaths caused by Israel in the past few decades. One is just about in double figures while the other closing in to the 1000 mark (if it hasn't done so already - no comprehensive body counts are kept)
  • prevent the Lebanon-based militant group from rearming with missiles and rockets from Syria and Iran; and
This is fair - if America stopped arming Israel.
  • free Lebanon from Hezbollah's control.
This is the most pompous demand. Hezbollah is a party which is made up of and supported by the Lebanese people. If every Hezbollah memeber was rounded up and arrested, more would take their place or a similar group would emerge from the civilian population of Lebanon.

These demands just show further the bigoted and imperialistic mind set of Israel. They are completely unfair and anything but valid.
Reply

Zulkiflim
08-01-2006, 10:29 PM
Salaam,

Azim,great reply.

I just wish to add that Hezbollah should aslo make it own condition for peace.

Israel leader are to tried for war crimes for targetting civvilians.
Israel to pay full recompensation for all infrastructure,lives lost/destoyed.
Isreal is to release all prisoner form Palestine and Lebanon
Israel must remove itself from all disputed land.
Israel must once and for all destroy it WMD programs.

Only then can peace happen.
Reply

azim
08-01-2006, 10:35 PM
Originally Posted by Zulkiflim
Salaam,

Azim,great reply.

I just wish to add that Hezbollah should aslo make it own condition for peace.

Israel leader are to tried for war crimes for targetting civvilians.
Israel to pay full recompensation for all infrastructure,lives lost/destoyed.
Isreal is to release all prisoner form Palestine and Lebanon
Israel must remove itself from all disputed land.
Israel must once and for all destroy it WMD programs.

Only then can peace happen.
Jazakallah mul khair.

I would add: -

  • Remove the 'security fence' (i.e. neo-berlin wall) that surrounds Palestinian land which has been ruled illegal by several international courts and honour the UN demands to stop building said wall.
  • Israel should discontinue its constant bombardment of Palestinian borders which often causes death as well mentally traumatising young children.
The war crimes one is great though, if it were to happen then there would be very few Israeli polticians left.
Reply

wilberhum
08-01-2006, 10:41 PM
I just wish to add that Hezbollah should aslo make it own condition for peace.
They don’t have any. There purpose is to destroy Israel not have peace with Israel.
Reply

azim
08-01-2006, 10:42 PM
Originally Posted by wilberhum
They don’t have any. There purpose is to destroy Israel not have peace with Israel.
Hey wilberhum.

It's great you can make such strong factless statements about the populous of a country you know very little about, whose living conditions you could never imagine and about political situations that go back decades.

GO YOU!!!
Reply

wilberhum
08-01-2006, 10:50 PM
Originally Posted by azim
Hey wilberhum.

It's great you can make such strong factless statements about the populous of a country you know very little about, whose living conditions you could never imagine and about political situations that go back decades.

GO YOU!!!
Have a read of there "Charter" and find out how little you know.
You argue from lack of knowledge. Don't knock those who know. :hiding:

[MAD]Stop the Hate![/MAD]

Have a read:
http://www.ict.org.il/Articles/Hiz_letter.htm
Our primary assumption in our fight against Israel states that the Zionist entity is aggressive from its inception, and built on lands wrested from their owners, at the expense of the rights of the Muslim people. Therefore our struggle will end only when this entity is obliterated. We recognize no treaty with it, no cease fire, and no peace agreements, whether separate or consolidated.
Reply

azim
08-01-2006, 11:19 PM
Originally Posted by wilberhum
Have a read of there "Charter" and find out how little you know.
You argue from lack of knowledge. Don't knock those who know. :hiding:

[mad]Stop the Hate![/mad]
One of the main aims of Hezbollah was to drive Israel out of southern Lebanon.

Source:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hizbollah
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/mid...st/4314423.stm

Since this had been acheived (until the recent invasion), Hezbollah increased its position as a welfare state.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hizbollah#Social_Services

Hezbollah, like Hamas, doesn't recognise Israel. And I do recall a few statements that quite expressly called for the destruction of Israel.

If you sum up a complex political, military and social party that has popular support among its people and aims to benefit its people as simply existing to wipe out its enemy - then you have contributed to perpetuating the hate and ignorance that people hold.

If you truly believe that Hezbollah have no conditions for peace and that its sole purpose is to destroy Israel then you have just dehumanised a people through the party that represents them. Is this fair or honest?
Reply

wilberhum
08-01-2006, 11:22 PM
If you truly believe
I believe what they say. Why do you assume they don't mean what they say?

[MAD]Stop the Hate![/MAD]
Reply

azim
08-01-2006, 11:55 PM
Originally Posted by wilberhum
I believe what they say. Why do you assume they don't mean what they say?

[mad]Stop the Hate![/mad]
Like I said: -
Hezbollah, like Hamas, doesn't recognise Israel. And I do recall a few statements that quite expressly called for the destruction of Israel.

If you sum up a complex political, military and social party that has popular support among its people and aims to benefit its people as simply existing to wipe out its enemy - then you have contributed to perpetuating the hate and ignorance that people hold.
I hope I can continue this discussion tomorrow with you. I'll be going offline for tonight so this is my last post until then.
Reply

wilberhum
08-02-2006, 12:42 AM
Hezbollah like many orginizations have many goals. There are short term and long term goals. But how do you deal with an orginization with a stated goal of dertroying you? Giving in to a short term goal will not change the long term goal.
Reply

Dahir
08-02-2006, 01:08 AM
Hezbollah like many orginizations have many goals. There are short term and long term goals. But how do you deal with an orginization with a stated goal of dertroying you? Giving in to a short term goal will not change the long term goal.
The only way to get peace is to completely ERADICATE one side, and since Israel is doing the eradicating, then the complete riddance of Hezbollah is the ONLY way to peace!

Get those F-16's fired up and tear Hezbollah a new one!
Reply

guyabano
08-02-2006, 09:57 AM
* ensure that Hezbollah will never return to the Israeli-Lebanese border;
* obtain the release of two Israeli soldiers captured by Hezbollah guerrillas July 12;
* stop Hezbollah from shooting missiles and rockets into Israel;
* prevent the Lebanon-based militant group from rearming with missiles and rockets from Syria and Iran; and
* free Lebanon from Hezbollah's control.
absolutely fair ! This would really ensure the peace in this part of region !

Reply

wilberhum
08-02-2006, 04:57 PM
Originally Posted by Dahir
The only way to get peace is to completely ERADICATE one side, and since Israel is doing the eradicating, then the complete riddance of Hezbollah is the ONLY way to peace!

Get those F-16's fired up and tear Hezbollah a new one!
If history repeates it's self then Hezbollah will not win. Noone has beat Isreal in 50 years. Multi-national forces have failed. But, only time will tell.
Reply

searchingsoul
08-02-2006, 06:01 PM
Originally Posted by Dahir
The only way to get peace is to completely ERADICATE one side, and since Israel is doing the eradicating, then the complete riddance of Hezbollah is the ONLY way to peace!

Get those F-16's fired up and tear Hezbollah a new one!
Since Hezzbollah's stated goal is to completely eradicate Israel, all out war may be the only option. This is why the short term objectives of Hezzbolah fall on deaf ears.

I don't like the death of innocents or destruction of communities but I'm starting to find the Israeli military action necessary. May the best country (or organization) win.
Reply

Zulkiflim
08-02-2006, 08:11 PM
Salaam,

Inshallah,the winner are already known and the losers are already known.

In the end the return is to Allah,and on that day the punishment and reward is for eternity..
Allah knows best.

So fight if they fight you...
Reply

azim
08-02-2006, 08:57 PM
Originally Posted by searchingsoul
Since Hezzbollah's stated goal is to completely eradicate Israel, all out war may be the only option. This is why the short term objectives of Hezzbolah fall on deaf ears.

I don't like the death of innocents or destruction of communities but I'm starting to find the Israeli military action necessary. May the best country (or organization) win.
In what way do you feel it is neccessary to destroy the civilian infrastructure of an entire country to destory a single organisation?

As the news shows, this war hasn't weakened Hezbollah at all.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/mid...st/5239568.stm
Reply

searchingsoul
08-02-2006, 09:08 PM
Originally Posted by azim
In what way do you feel it is neccessary to destroy the civilian infrastructure of an entire country to destory a single organisation?

As the news shows, this war hasn't weakened Hezbollah at all.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/mid...st/5239568.stm
It's sad but Lebanon did neglect to disarm Hezbollah. This makes Lebanon responsible for the Hezbollah actions.
Reply

wilberhum
08-02-2006, 09:09 PM
In what way do you feel it is neccessary to destroy the civilian infrastructure of an entire country to destory a single organisation?
What would your sugestion be? How would you destroy Hezbollah?
Reply

azim
08-03-2006, 12:03 PM
Originally Posted by wilberhum
What would your sugestion be? How would you destroy Hezbollah?
That's the thing, everyones looking at Hezbollah as the instigator of this war.

If I was the leader of a country which came into existence by stealing land from another people then I hope I'd have enough moral strength to resign from the post and move somewhere else.

Hypothetically speaking though, there is no real way to destroy a guerilla group unless the cause for that guerilla group to exist is eliminated.

Like I said, if everyone Hezbollah memeber was captured and killed today, tomorrow there would be people to take their place. They have a real and serious greivance that should be addressed. It's too easy to claim a people only exist out of some random need for violence and destruction and that they need to be destroyed, it's a lot harder to sit down and think about why they exist in the first place.
Reply

wilberhum
08-03-2006, 04:22 PM
Originally Posted by azim
That's the thing, everyones looking at Hezbollah as the instigator of this war.

If I was the leader of a country which came into existence by stealing land from another people then I hope I'd have enough moral strength to resign from the post and move somewhere else.

Hypothetically speaking though, there is no real way to destroy a guerilla group unless the cause for that guerilla group to exist is eliminated.

Like I said, if everyone Hezbollah memeber was captured and killed today, tomorrow there would be people to take their place. They have a real and serious greivance that should be addressed. It's too easy to claim a people only exist out of some random need for violence and destruction and that they need to be destroyed, it's a lot harder to sit down and think about why they exist in the first place.
Are you saying that Isreal has 1 of 2 choices. Do what they are doing or 7 million people packup and leave.
Reply

azim
08-03-2006, 06:22 PM
Originally Posted by wilberhum
Are you saying that Isreal has 1 of 2 choices. Do what they are doing or 7 million people packup and leave.
Packing up and leaving would be fair, though not feasible.

I'd say a serious solution would be fairly distribute the population of Palestine in Israel (seeing as how the Palestinians own the land in the first place, this is a compromise on behalf of the Palestinians) rather than letting them rot in over-populated refugee camps and villages.

Palestinians were ripped from their entire lives and futures when Israel took the land. If any serious peace is going to be acheived, then the living conditions of the Palestinians and Israeli's should be equal.
Reply

wilberhum
08-03-2006, 06:27 PM
I'd say a serious solution would be fairly distribute the population of Palestine in Israel
But every time Isreal open the gates Suicide Boomers come in. It only seams reasonable, at least to me, that Israel can not tolerate that.
Reply

azim
08-03-2006, 06:30 PM
Originally Posted by wilberhum
But every time Isreal open the gates Suicide Boomers come in. It only seams reasonable, at least to me, that Israel can not tolerate that.
Your missing the point - if Palestinians were not forced to live the way they do - they're wouldn't be any suicide bombers.

As long as Israel oppresses the masses, resistance of some form will continue.
Reply

wilberhum
08-03-2006, 06:36 PM
Originally Posted by azim
Your missing the point - if Palestinians were not forced to live the way they do - they're wouldn't be any suicide bombers.

As long as Israel oppresses the masses, resistance of some form will continue.
It would be real nice if we could trun back the clock. We could solve/eleminate all problems. But we can't. The situation that Palestinians live in is a discrace to humanity. But there are suicide bombers and if Isreal open the gates, they will go in. So what does Isreal do?
Reply

guyabano
08-03-2006, 06:40 PM
Originally Posted by azim
Hey wilberhum.

It's great you can make such strong factless statements about the populous of a country you know very little about, whose living conditions you could never imagine and about political situations that go back decades.

GO YOU!!!
Well, honestly..........he's right ! Even if Israel would drop all arms and give back all land, still there would be some troublemakers !
Reply

azim
08-03-2006, 10:17 PM
Originally Posted by guyabano
Well, honestly..........he's right ! Even if Israel would drop all arms and give back all land, still there would be some troublemakers !
If Israel dropped all their arms and gave back the land - there would be no reason to make trouble.

If there were troublemakers - they'd be making trouble for completely different reasons so it'd be a different situation to consider.

It's like saying "What's the point of curing cancer when people will still die from AID's!".
Reply

nimrod
08-04-2006, 01:07 AM
I'd say a serious solution would be to fairly distribute the population of Palestine in Israel (seeing as how the Palestinians own the land in the first place, this is a compromise on behalf of the Palestinians) rather than letting them rot in over-populated refugee camps and villages”.

I have to wonder which would result in less harm for Palestinians, distributing them through out Israel, or through out the Muslim nations.

Thanks
Nimrod
Reply

Dahir
08-04-2006, 01:53 AM
I have to wonder which would result in less harm for Palestinians, distributing them through out Israel, or through out the Muslim nations.
Neither, the good Palestinian people were brainwashed by hellbent ultra-Nationalist pan-Arab nations into the thought of destroying Israel, then brainwashed by radical clerics to destroy the pan-Arab nations, who supposedly are sheep for the US.

I doubt the Palestinian people are compatable with any modern, peaceful society, 50+ years of brainwashing does that, sadly.
Reply

nimrod
08-04-2006, 02:01 AM
Dahir, you may be right, but I sure hope not.

I have a hard time believing that the mothers in Palestine wouldn’t want to try something new in a different land, in order to save their children.

Surely at least the Moms have had enough of this dieing of their children. I can’t bring myself to think otherwise.

Thanks
Nimrod
Reply

Keltoi
08-04-2006, 02:12 AM
Does anyone know what the Palestinians are demanding? I haven't heard a reasonable list of demands that would result in a peaceful end to the violence. Yasser Arafat was given a good deal, but he backed out due to the so-called "right of return", which is an obvious non-starter and always has been. Sometimes I wonder if there is anything short of the end of Israel that will actually end the violence.
Reply

nimrod
08-04-2006, 02:22 AM
Keltoi, do you remember what happened to Sadat when he made peace with Israel?

I am sure that Arafat was bearing that in mind, as he rejected the peace deal.

Thanks
Nimrod
Reply

Dahir
08-04-2006, 02:55 AM
Does anyone know what the Palestinians are demanding?
That list is more eXtreme than the Tony Hawk! :D
Reply

S_87
08-04-2006, 09:35 AM
:sl:

ensure that Hezbollah will never return to the Israeli-Lebanese border;
so the israeli army can continue terrorising the palestinians.

obtain the release of two Israeli soldiers captured by Hezbollah guerrillas July 12;
''but since we arent going to get them this is a good excuse to bomb up lebanon'' :rolleyes:

stop Hezbollah from shooting missiles and rockets into Israel;
''but we are quite enjoying bombing lebanon over air''

prevent the Lebanon-based militant group from rearming with missiles and rockets from Syria and Iran;
they are a big threat

and
free Lebanon from Hezbollah's control
because we are scared
Reply

azim
08-04-2006, 02:16 PM
Originally Posted by Dahir
Neither, the good Palestinian people were brainwashed by hellbent ultra-Nationalist pan-Arab nations into the thought of destroying Israel, then brainwashed by radical clerics to destroy the pan-Arab nations, who supposedly are sheep for the US.

I doubt the Palestinian people are compatable with any modern, peaceful society, 50+ years of brainwashing does that, sadly.
Aaah, so thats why the Palestinians are so pissed off. And theres me thinking ft was the fact they're land was stolen from them and being made to live a life of poverty in refugee camps and over populated strips of desert land. Guess we learn something everyday.
Reply

Hey there! Looks like you're enjoying the discussion, but you're not signed up for an account.

When you create an account, you can participate in the discussions and share your thoughts. You also get notifications, here and via email, whenever new posts are made. And you can like posts and make new friends.
Sign Up

Similar Threads

  1. Replies: 0
    Last Post: 02-05-2010, 08:25 PM
  2. Replies: 33
    Last Post: 07-25-2008, 07:20 PM
  3. Replies: 0
    Last Post: 07-08-2008, 07:23 AM
  4. Replies: 0
    Last Post: 07-02-2007, 03:09 PM
  5. Replies: 0
    Last Post: 03-14-2006, 10:14 PM

IslamicBoard

Experience a richer experience on our mobile app!