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Selising
08-21-2006, 07:49 AM
The reason why I asked this question is... so many teenagers ang youngsters in Malaysia has embrace Christianity without their parents knowledge. The hottest issue is the case of Azlina Jailani who changed her name to Lina Joy. She wants to become a Christian to marry a Christian Hindu.

Why I called him Christian Hindu is that, so many Hindu became Christian because they don't want to be called a pariah since they were from lower cast even thou they are university graduate. So I randomly calls an Indian a Christian Hindu. Not because they see Christianity as a good religion but just to feel good about themselves

Back to our topic. She has been raised in Muslim culture, know to read Quran. Able to read Quran very well, but why she choose to become a Christian just to get married. Same case with the famous Aishah Bukhory whom her father was an imam. The father was the imam for Tarawikh in a nearby masjeed when her boyfriend came, took her to Australia so that they can get married.
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Asyur an-Nagi
08-21-2006, 07:51 AM
probably she got a misguided enlightment?
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syilla
08-21-2006, 09:28 AM
:sl:

i really really worried about this...

i am so afraid...that i read albaqarah ayah 128...all the time... :cry:

i heard so many stories that...eventhough you've bring up your children in islamic way as you can...the children still become disobedient...or the worst thing would be...kufar...

even some of the prophet's children...become disbeliever...

All i can say is...make alot of dua and salah...and the final decision is made only by Allah s.w.t. Tawakalalallah...

:w:
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F.Y.
08-21-2006, 10:38 PM
I think this happens a lot because of what parents allow their kids to watch on TV etc. Apparently I heard so many people in Indonesia are leaving Islam each year because they watch Bollywood movies. And these movies show how 'romantic' Indian men are ( !!!) and so they go to india and marry a hindu person and leave Islam for thsi reason. Coz apparently indian men are more romantic than those that are not. But again, its all brainwashing....these movies can be dangerous.
Peace
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glo
08-22-2006, 07:11 PM
I think these are issues not only in Muslim families, but in families of other faiths too.
Outside influences are strong in many cultures, especially in secular societies.

One solution would be to isolate your children from their friends and peers, and the rest of society. I am not sure how effective that is though. :X
It is better to let your children grow strong enough in their faith, so they can stand up against temptations around them.

Also, children reach an age, when they can and should make their own decisions even if they go against the views of their parents.
There comes the time when you have to trust them into God's hands and hope that their upbringing was sound enough. After all, you cannot force them! There is no obligation to be a believer!

Remember that teenagers often stray from the right path ... and many return when they realise the truth for themselves!

peace.
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QuranStudy
08-22-2006, 07:19 PM
I hate it when kids do this. They need to get a good beating, regardless if they were initially Muslim or Christian.
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F.Y.
08-22-2006, 11:51 PM
^beating just drives them away and makes them want to get back at you and rebel more. Patience and wisdom is very effective. Also taking them to places where there are strong people of faith and inspirational people. If they constantly look upto moviestars - theyll want to be quite shallow like them and copy them. However, if you introduce them and show them people in the community who are inspriational, young, happy, motivated and doing things for Allah, like charity workers and people who give dawah, they'll aspire to be like them inshallah. Taking them to different countires to see different types of muslims also helps.

Peace
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QuranStudy
08-23-2006, 12:12 AM
^beating just drives them away and makes them want to get back at you and rebel more.
Not in the case descibed by the OP.
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Abdulwaheed
08-23-2006, 12:17 AM
Originally Posted by QuranStudy
I hate it when kids do this. They need to get a good beating, regardless if they were initially Muslim or Christian.
HAHA i like that idea although I dont plan on beating my kids when i eventualli have some.
Physical punishment is something i think shouldnt be inflicted on kids as it isnt that effective. Im sure there are other ways to guide them.
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QuranStudy
08-23-2006, 12:22 AM
Physical punishment is something i think shouldnt be inflicted on kids as it isnt that effective. Im sure there are other ways to guide them.
Beating is a good way to make a child obedient. Giving them to much freedom makes them rebellious in the future?

Do you prefer a "time-out?"
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Selising
08-23-2006, 12:47 AM
I've read from the grandson of Ghandi about punishment. I can't remember the word he use, unviolent pinishment or what? I read in Readers Digest some times ago.

He cheated his father, in return his father punish him by not getting into his car but chose to walk for I think about 5km to their home. The lad was very sad and decided not to do anything that will hurt his parent again.

But how to apply it in our case? In educating our children to love our deen
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czgibson
08-23-2006, 12:51 AM
Greetings,
Originally Posted by QuranStudy
I hate it when kids do this. They need to get a good beating, regardless if they were initially Muslim or Christian.
Well, that just says it all, doesn't it? What more honourable path to faith could there be?

Peace
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Selising
08-23-2006, 12:55 AM
BTW, a famous motivator in Malaysia, Dr Fadzillah Kamsah said, the best way to educate children are

When they are less than 7, educate them with love
When they are between 7-13, educate them with punishment
When they are 14-21, involve them in all of our activities such as washing car together, bring them to market
When they are >21, make them your best friend.
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QuranStudy
08-23-2006, 12:58 AM
Well, that just says it all, doesn't it? What more honourable path to faith could there be?
If it takes a beating to save a child from ignorance, then so be it.
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F.Y.
08-23-2006, 01:03 AM
^What if beating wasnt the way to save them from ignorance. Beating would make them bitter and hurt. They wouldnt listen to anything you told them after a beating.
The Prophet (saw) never beat anyone the way you are suggesting. Not even an animal, for fear that the animal would hold him to account on the DOJ. Also because animals are also deserving of good treatment.
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Selising
08-23-2006, 01:16 AM
Islam has set rules for beating. Hv to check with muallim. If I'm not mistaken

U can't beat at certain part of body
There are kind of material allowed for beating, not everything can be use
the hardness of beating has to be controlled
Don't beat when you are extremely angry
avoid causing permanent disablement

Need to refer to my mualllim. Meanwhile, if anybody knows, please share your knowledge
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F.Y.
08-23-2006, 01:19 AM
Yes, I think hitting the head is disallowed. That's why boxing is a bit...iffy. Its a cool sport but maybe if in muslim boxing groups....they could refrain from hitting the head.
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syilla
08-23-2006, 01:45 AM
:sl:

Beating needed only when it really necessary....but not hard beating....and it should be only on certain part of the body.

:w:
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Nσσя'υℓ Jαииαн
08-23-2006, 01:55 AM
Originally Posted by QuranStudy
I hate it when kids do this. They need to get a good beating, regardless if they were initially Muslim or Christian.
*sigh*...brother i find it hard to believe that u have the name "QuranStudy" but u behave the opposite! Can i ask why ur so negative? Islam teaches u to be polite and humble =\*sigh*...I would think ud know that beating them will "infact" drive them away. You cannot force it on them and expect them to believe..*sigh*... i dunno i thinkso.
-------------------------------
Yea ur not allowed to hit some1 in the face.
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Abdulwaheed
08-23-2006, 03:28 AM
I dont see how beating children will save them from ignorance.. Beating them may cause them to resent you, or worse resent the deen.
like a lot of people have said. there are a lot of other ways to show your displeasure. Hitting kids is not the answer
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manaal
08-23-2006, 10:27 AM
The question is, "How do you make your children love Islam?". Has anyone attempted to answer the question? Is beating the child to submission the solution?

The problem as I see it among muslim parents (at least where I live) is that they show their kids that Islam is a strict religion that is very difficult to follow. They rarely teach the ypung children the beauty about our religion and how to love it.

When a child does something bad, we hear the mothers saying "Allah will punish you".
"If you lie, Allah will punish you"
"If you still, your hands will be cut off"
Dooes he even try to explain the why we shouldn;t lie or steal. "Allah will punish you" is a very easy method to make children obedient, but does it help make them love Islam?

Now lets take the Christians.In schools and homes and in their hymns they always "god loves you, jesus loves you" "inflame our hearts with love you oh jesus". Isn's that what children want to hear, that someone loves them and they have someone to love?

The simple solution to making kids love islam more is to show them the beauty of the religion.
  • Teach them how Allah has rewarded the righteous and what rewards awaits them in the hereafter.
  • Teach kids to understand that life in this world is short, that we are preparing purselves for the day of judgement. The ultimate test is yet to come.
  • Read them stories about the sahabas and prophets.
  • Teach them understand that Islamic teachngs have a prupose. Allah and his prohet (s.a.w) have guided us as to how we should lead our lives, show them the beauty in simple islamic teachings.
For example, why does islam forbid the interaction with members of the opposite sex? It's because it leads to even more sinful acts. Aren;t social problems such as single parenthood, teen preganacies and AIDS some results of free mixing?

This is what I think. I hope to teach my children to love Islam in this way.
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Abdulwaheed
08-23-2006, 02:36 PM
MashaAllah Sister Those are some very good points. :)
I hope to be able to successfully teach my kids to love and practice islam the way its should be practiced
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QuranStudy
08-23-2006, 02:55 PM
*sigh*...brother i find it hard to believe that u have the name "QuranStudy" but u behave the opposite! Can i ask why ur so negative? Islam teaches u to be polite and humble =\*sigh*...I would think ud know that beating them will "infact" drive them away. You cannot force it on them and expect them to believe..*sigh*... i dunno i thinkso.
Beating is a generous consequence. In Islam, apostates are to be killed.

Look at kids in America today, would you consider them obedient? I know it's painful to beat a child but that's only way the child will be more responsible. He/she would think twice before doing anything stupid. Children are prone to mischief, and later they turn out really rebellious to their parents due to excessive freedom.

I dont see how beating children will save them from ignorance.. Beating them may cause them to resent you, or worse resent the deen.
like a lot of people have said. there are a lot of other ways to show your displeasure. Hitting kids is not the answer.
Interestingly, it is quite the opposite. Just look at Western society and how spoiled most of the kids are here. Then look at kids from China, India, and other Asian countries. You'll notice the difference.

Now lets take the Christians.In schools and homes and in their hymns they always "god loves you, jesus loves you" "inflame our hearts with love you oh jesus". Isn's that what children want to hear, that someone loves them and they have someone to love?
That is a stupid idea IMO. The percentage of Christians that attend church is really low. Christians are becoming atheists at an alarming rate. Over 80% of Christians are non-practicing and only Christian by name.
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Nσσя'υℓ Jαииαн
08-23-2006, 03:47 PM
Discipline is necessary, look at me i turned out fine :D lol. but jus not excessively..
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manaal
08-24-2006, 03:49 AM
Originally Posted by QuranStudy
Beating is a generous consequence. In Islam, apostates are to be killed.

That is a stupid idea IMO. The percentage of Christians that attend church is really low. Christians are becoming atheists at an alarming rate. Over 80% of Christians are non-practicing and only Christian by name.
Oh really? But don;t you think the idea of being loved is something that kids wants to hear? Maybe those 80% of Christians had parents who did not teach them their religion properly.

Let's not generalise the Christians then, what I should have said was "Catholics". catholics are among the most devout of Chrsitians. I can;t tell you about America, but in Sri Lanka Catholicism is widespread religion and very few convert to other religions. The majority of Catholics enter catholic schools and in that way they are taught their religion from the time they enter school. (I know because I studied at a catholic convent school as well).


On the subject of beating
There are instances that it might work and it might not. I was beaten as child when I was disobedient (e.g. refusing to bathe, talking back to mum.. childish things like that). It worked just a little. I still turned out to be quite rebellious as a teenager. (But Masha' Allah I've grown out of that now).

(I'm going to talk about my life here a bit......................)
when it came to religious matters, I only recall being beaten by my dad while he was teachng me the Quran and I kept on misprouncing the words. since then everytime my dad asked me to come for a Quran lesson I used to tremble with fear and make even more mistakes. My mum felt sorry for me and took over the Quran lessons and I improved my recitation.
My decision to love Islam, to improve my islamic knoweldge and to wear hijab did not come from being beaten or thretened in any way by my parents. My parents are religious and they lead by example. I was never told "wear hijab or you will be thrown into the hellfire!!!". I don;t know if that really works.
I was taught to fear Allah, not a one who inflicts punsihment on you for every bad thing you do, but as the creator and sustainer of the worlds. My mother used to always tell me "Allah is merciful, but don't take that mercy for granted".
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aishaazher
10-11-2006, 10:14 PM
salaam,
we have to take our rasul as an example.....did the rasul ever raise his voice or hands against his kids.....no
did his children turn out as ignorant people......no
our rasul(SAW) raised his kids with love, wisdom, and patience......and there are many hadises to support this.

we have to learn the way of the prophet before comming up with our own theologies........beating and violence was not the way of the prophet......and it shouldn't be our way either

Can you give me an example when the prophet raised his hand against any of his kids???
He did not even scream or yell.....he was humble, piouse, patient, loving and careing.........
what evidence sais that islam encourages parents to beat their kids????
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MahmoodShariff
10-22-2006, 02:36 AM
aswrwb

regarding this topic :

"your childs mind is like an empty fertile field, what u sow is what u will reap"

so dear brothers and sisters who have kids and are concerned about them,

1. move to a muslim neighbourhood
2. avoid harmful tv channels(even cartoons are very filthy)
3. replace computer games to education based software
4. give time to ur children, dont let the tv br their parents.

JK

wswrwb
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czgibson
10-22-2006, 05:43 PM
Greetings,

How about letting your children grow up and decide for themselves once they are mature enough to understand what it is they're actually signing up to?

Peace
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Ansar Al-'Adl
10-22-2006, 06:22 PM
Originally Posted by czgibson
Greetings,

How about letting your children grow up and decide for themselves once they are mature enough to understand what it is they're actually signing up to?

Peace
Hi Callum,
It's been a while, nice to hear from you again.

Of course children will eventually become adults and they will decide for themselves what they wish to follow. Everyone will be accountable for their decision. But education facilitates decisions, it does not impair it. Why do we teach kids anything in science? Why not let them grow up and decide for themselves what they think the laws of nature are? I'm sure you know how I always draw a parallel between science and Islam. Just as we teach our kids what we feel is the most parsimonious theory in accordance with experimental evidence concerning the laws of nature, we do the same with Islam. We do not abandon our children physically, so we do not the same intellectually and spiritually. They have a right to recieve help from this with knowledge and experience. Our different opinions on this subject most likely stem from different world views.

Peace.
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