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Isma'el
10-04-2006, 08:03 AM
Minister of Higher Education and Scientific Research Al-Habib Al-Malki argued that the move came to fight extremism.

RABAT — The Ministry of Education in Morocco has omitted from preparatory school curricula a Qur'anic verse, hadith and a photo of a hijab-clad girl, claiming that it moved to nip extremism in the bud.

"They omitted verse no. 31 of surat An-Nur, which reads: "And tell the believing women to lower their gaze and be modest, and to display of their adornment only that which is apparent, and to draw their veils over their bosoms…..," Abdul Kareem Al-Howeshri, the head of the non-governmental Islamic Education Association, told IslamOnline.net Tuesday, October 3.

He said they also erased a hadith narrated by Abu Dawood that Prophet Muhammad (peace and blessings be upon him) cursed men dressing up in women's clothes and women putting on men's clothes.

"The Revival of Islamic Education textbook has been withdrawn from schools and distributed after the omissions," Howeshri said.

The ministry has further removed a photo of a girl wearing hijab and kissing her mother's hands from Al-Waha textbook, which also has to do with Islamic education.

Admitting the omissions at a recent parliamentary interpellation, Minister of Higher Education and Scientific Research Al-Habib Al-Malki argued that the move came to fight hardliners.

Howeshri blasted the minister's justification as unacceptable and implausible.

"The minister wants to impose a fait accompli though such a move negates the very sense of Islamic identity and the Constitution, which says that Islam is the official religion of the state and all laws should be in harmony with Shari`ah," he fumed.

Pressure

Howeshri, also the chairman of the Moroccan committee for Islamic subject teachers, said the government must have come under pressure to omit subjects from curricula already approved by specialized ministerial committees.

"Pressures exercised by women organizations known for their secular and liberal trend have apparently paid off," he said.

Women organizations have launched a fierce campaign against the hijab-clad girl photo and pressed for removing it from the textbook, IOL's correspondent says.

They said hijab is a poignant symbol of women's subordination to men.

Howeshri also said the move is part of a government policy to reform curricula in the wake of the 9/11 attacks on the United States.

"Unfortunately some Moroccan officials, mostly leftists, toed the American line," he said.

The ministry's drive, in effect, is not unprecedented.

Last year, the ministry pressed for abolishing the Islamic studies subjects from the science section of high school syllabus.

It further proposed removing any references to "jihad" in the Islamic subjects

http://www.islamonline.net/English/N...10/03/07.shtml
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Muezzin
10-04-2006, 08:10 AM
Removing verses from holy books and photos of hijabs? Whatever happened to freedom of speech...
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Snowflake
10-04-2006, 10:28 AM
Other than the 'girl in hijab' photo, is the minister saying that the omited Quranic verse and hadith lead to extremism? :?:rant:
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starfortress
10-04-2006, 12:15 PM
Didn't they realize,they just plant a future resistance seeds,some people learn from books,some others learn from experience.But those guys never learnt.I scared to imagine what will happen to Muslims World in the next 20 years.

http://www.islamicboard.com/userpage.php?userid=7058
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rania2820
10-04-2006, 12:18 PM
since when did wearing hijab become extreme? when did it become so wrong to teach women and girls modesty? and when did it become so wrong to teach men not to dress like women and women not to dress like men? its sad to see the muslim ummah having this type of thinking.

may allah guide us all!
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wilberhum
10-04-2006, 04:49 PM
Originally Posted by Muezzin
Removing verses from holy books and photos of hijabs? Whatever happened to freedom of speech...
Freedom of speach also includes freedom not to speak.
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Ibn Abi Ahmed
10-04-2006, 04:56 PM
:sl:

Just another failed attempt by these people. This will promt more people to read the verse and even more muslimahs to Inshallah start wearing the Hijab there in Morocco and elsewhere around the world. Its a case of taking away a toy from a baby which makes the baby want the toy even more.

The legislation of Hijab is here and its here to stay. The verse is in the hearts of millions of people. How will they remove it from there? These people's attempts are getting more pathetic by the day. Dont they realize that they are fighting a battle that they have already lost?

The Quran is unchanged and it will remain unchanged.

6: 123. And thus We have set up in every town great ones of its wicked people to plot therein. But they plot not except against their ownselves, and they perceive (it) not.

:w:
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Bittersteel
10-04-2006, 05:06 PM
I hope you are right Ahmed.The situation in my country is even....worse though.
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Woodrow
10-04-2006, 05:15 PM
I'm missing something here. This does not make any sense:

The Ministry of Education in Morocco has omitted from preparatory school curricula a Qur'anic verse, hadith and a photo of a hijab-clad girl, claiming that it moved to nip extremism in the bud.
The majority of the people in Morocco are Muslim. I doubt if there are any homes in Morocco that do not have a copy of the Qur'an and the ahadith.

These are standard teachings most if not all of the children already know. It is part of the language and the general culture. No other cultural beliefs are being infringed upon.

Virtually all students in the public school system are Muslim. Yes there are non-Muslims in Morocco, but they usually attend private schools. The University of Rabat does get some non-Muslim students from France and Spain.
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KAding
10-04-2006, 05:16 PM
Originally Posted by Muezzin
Removing verses from holy books and photos of hijabs? Whatever happened to freedom of speech...
This is not about free speech though. It would be if it would become illegal to publish books containing it. This is about the contents of school books, which is obviously up to the government to determine.
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Daffodil
10-04-2006, 05:23 PM
whoever deletes n edits the quran is a kafir
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Mawaddah
10-04-2006, 05:25 PM
^ They weren't removing the verses from the actual Qur'an, only from the text books.

Why would they want to though? They have no reason to do so, Morocco is already mostly Muslim.

Reminds me of when Malaysia removed the teaching of Jawi from schools.
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Woodrow
10-04-2006, 05:27 PM
Originally Posted by KAding
This is not about free speech though. It would be if it would become illegal to publish books containing it. This is about the contents of school books, which is obviously up to the government to determine.
True and the government has the right to do such. However, this is a government that is supposed to be upholding Islam. Morocco is not a Democracy, it is a Kingdom. Apparantly the Government is not representing what the people are lead to believe it represents.

What is odd Morocco refused to renew base leases with the US in the 1960's and essentialy evicted an American presence in the country. One of the reasons was it was felt the American presence was undermining Islam in the country. Seems like Islam was stronger then, than what it is today.
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Nσσя'υℓ Jαииαн
10-04-2006, 05:28 PM
They can cut, paste, delete all they want but never will they be successful. This is a given.
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Muezzin
10-04-2006, 06:20 PM
Originally Posted by wilberhum
Freedom of speach also includes freedom not to speak.
So are you condoning state censorship, by a monarchy no less?

Originally Posted by KAding
This is not about free speech though. It would be if it would become illegal to publish books containing it. This is about the contents of school books, which is obviously up to the government to determine.
Surely you're not implying that the people should sit idly by and let the system dictate what their children learn?
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Bittersteel
10-04-2006, 06:27 PM
^ and these uh people come and lecture us about democracy and human rights.
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wilberhum
10-04-2006, 06:32 PM
Originally Posted by Muezzin
So are you condoning state censorship, by a monarchy no less?


Surely you're not implying that the people should sit idly by and let the system dictate what their children learn?
Of course not. That is one of the advantages of your freedoms. You have the freedom and right to work to cause a change. (Within the system)
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Muezzin
10-04-2006, 06:35 PM
Originally Posted by wilberhum
Of course not. That is one of the advantages of your freedoms. You have the freedom and right to work to cause a change. (Within the system)
Okay. Cool. Though I have a thing against monarchies. That's a system I wouldn't mind people changing - the French had the right idea, but perhaps the wrong execution.

No pun intended.
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wilberhum
10-04-2006, 06:38 PM
Originally Posted by Muezzin
Okay. Cool. Though I have a thing against monarchies. That's a system I wouldn't mind people changing - the French had the right idea, but perhaps the wrong execution.

No pun intended.
I to have "a thing against monarchies". Also, I have "a thing against" all kinds of government. But I also realize that each has there good points. It is just that some have more good points than others.
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KAding
10-04-2006, 06:57 PM
Originally Posted by Daffodil
whoever deletes n edits the quran is a kafir
But they aren't editing the Qu'ran. Obviously school books can never contain the whole Qu'ran, so they have to make choices on where to quote it and where not to.

It appears they made a choice to either refer to it less or simply refer to different parts. Clearly such behavior of selecting certain phrases from the Qu'ran and ignoring others to make a point is widespread within Islam. It is no different in Christianity or any other religion IMHO. Different people simply appear to have different opinions on what parts are most important. Sure, this is generally up to scholars, but on this forum it is fairly easy to see who values what more, for example. Thats because there are always different perspectives.
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KAding
10-04-2006, 07:04 PM
Originally Posted by Woodrow
True and the government has the right to do such. However, this is a government that is supposed to be upholding Islam. Morocco is not a Democracy, it is a Kingdom. Apparantly the Government is not representing what the people are lead to believe it represents.
I don't know. As far as I know Morroco does not claim to be an Islamic state. Neither do I know if the majority of Morrocans would want to live in an Islamic state. I always get the impression that the majority of this forum assume this is the case for any Muslim nation, but personally I am not convinced. I remember north_malaysian posting some poll data from Malaysia for example which clearly showed that only a minority wanted more Islam at the level of the state.

Mind you, I am not saying that Morrocans support this measure, but I am warry of claims that they must be against this simply because they are Muslim.

What is odd Morocco refused to renew base leases with the US in the 1960's and essentialy evicted an American presence in the country. One of the reasons was it was felt the American presence was undermining Islam in the country. Seems like Islam was stronger then, than what it is today.
Hard to say. Morroco was very different then I suppose, much more tribal and less developed. Besides, most resentment against the US at that time must be seen either within the context of the Cold War or the Arab-Israeli conflict. Autocratic arab regimes often claimed to be Islamic, but only rarely were their actions truly motivated by Islam IMHO.
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Woodrow
10-04-2006, 07:10 PM
Originally Posted by KAding
I don't know. As far as I know Morroco does not claim to be an Islamic state. Neither do I know if the majority of Morrocans would want to live in an Islamic state. I always get the impression that the majority of this forum assume this is the case for any Muslim nation, but personally I am not convinced. I remember north_malaysian posting some poll data from Malaysia for example which clearly showed that only a minority wanted more Islam at the level of the state.

Mind you, I am not saying that Morrocans support this measure, but I am warry of claims that they must be against this simply because they are Muslim.



Hard to say. Morroco was very different then I suppose, much more tribal and less developed. Besides, most resentment against the US at that time must be seen either within the context of the Cold War or the Arab-Israeli conflict. Autocratic arab regimes often claimed to be Islamic, but only rarely were their actions truly motivated by Islam IMHO.
Of course my memory of Morocco is based on my memories of the late 1950's and early 1960's. It does seem many changes have taken place since I was there.
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Hawa
10-04-2006, 07:22 PM
Originally Posted by Muezzin

Surely you're not implying that the people should sit idly by and let the system dictate what their children learn?

sadly the people are going to do just that.
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KAding
10-04-2006, 08:15 PM
Originally Posted by Muezzin
Surely you're not implying that the people should sit idly by and let the system dictate what their children learn?
Well, is there any country in the world in which the state does not decide the curriculum in public schools?

I agree that the issue is more contentious in an undemocratic country like Morroco, since it is hard to influence government policy. But what is the alternative exactly? If it isn't the 'system' (ie. the state) that determines the curriculum, than who should?
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Lina
10-04-2006, 08:33 PM
Originally Posted by Woodrow
Of course my memory of Morocco is based on my memories of the late 1950's and early 1960's. It does seem many changes have taken place since I was there.
:sl:

What about the death of Hassan II?

There have been a lot of changes Alhamdulilah.

Allahu A'lam.

:w:
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Woodrow
10-04-2006, 08:41 PM
Originally Posted by Lina
:sl:

What about the death of Hassan II?

There have been a lot of changes Alhamdulilah.

Allahu A'lam.

:w:
Muhammad 5 was King when I first went to Morocco. He was very powerfull, but fair both to his people and to those he had treaties with. When he died in 1961 and his son Moulay Hassan (Hassan 2) became King there was some initial clamor over Moulay's ability to fulfill his father's shoes. When I left Morocco Moulay was just taking office.
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Lina
10-04-2006, 08:51 PM
Originally Posted by Woodrow
Muhammad 5 was King when I first went to Morocco. He was very powerfull, but fair both to his people and to those he had treaties with. When he died in 1961 and his son Moulay Hassan (Hassan 2) became King there was some initial clamor over Moulay's ability to fulfill his father's shoes. When I left Morocco Moulay was just taking office.
:sl:

Yes, you're right.

It was not until 1961 he officially took the throne of Miserable Morocco.

:w:
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north_malaysian
10-05-2006, 04:44 AM
Originally Posted by Mawaddah
Reminds me of when Malaysia removed the teaching of Jawi from schools.
When was that? Because our Islamic Education textbooks are written in Jawi. Starting from Standard 3, I think....
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Zulkiflim
10-07-2006, 11:02 PM
Salaam,

"Unfortunately some Moroccan officials, mostly leftists, toed the American line," he said.
This is the best muslim in the western world.

They are termed moderate muslim by the west.

The apex of a moderate muslim is one who drink alchohols,yet say it is haram.
Fornicate but say it is not right for gender to mix.
Will say gay and lesbian have a right o live and marry,tho they know that is is not allowed
Money is the goal,and for a paltry price will condemn islam and the Quran while claiming to be muslim..

The best moderate muslim.
and so to breed such people,the western world have started to train their own imams.

All i can say is that as the Propeht said,may sects will rise up and only one is true.
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