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Isma'el
10-10-2006, 03:12 PM
http://uk.news.yahoo.com/10102006/14...eils-suck.html
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Pygoscelis
10-11-2006, 05:28 AM
This seems a good opportunity for the muslims here to enlighten the non-muslims about the whole Rushie incident with Satanic Verses. I knew little about it but the media here made it sound like the author was leaving his religion and the church tried to kill him for it.

This is a misconception? I hope? Please clear it up.
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Muhammad
10-11-2006, 05:53 AM
Greetings,

We already have a few threads about Salman Rushdie, which include:

http://www.islamicboard.com/refutati...ic-verses.html?

http://www.islamicboard.com/world-af...n-rushdie.html?
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F.Y.
10-11-2006, 06:04 AM
His lack of tact is hardly surprising.
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S_87
10-11-2006, 09:32 AM
:sl:

if this is his way of getting more fame and being in the headlines then so be it, just reconfirms what a sad loser he is and lets many people who would love to carry out that fatwa remember it :rolleyes:
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Joe98
10-11-2006, 11:29 AM
Originally Posted by amani
and lets many people who would love to carry out that fatwa remember it

The fatwah is the murder of the man.


In Islam, is murder permitted if it is in a fatwah?
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muzna
10-11-2006, 11:33 AM
its not murder, its execution
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Malaikah
10-11-2006, 11:36 AM
^ its not murder, its a punishment. The punishment for apostatcy is death. and i think this situation highlights nicely the wisdom behind the ruling. See how the apostate propagates anti-islamic attitudes... thus turning people away from the true religion...
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Joe98
10-11-2006, 11:39 AM
Originally Posted by cheese
The punishment for apostatcy is death.

And i think this situation highlights nicely the wisdom behind the ruling.

Thank you for teaching us about Islam!
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Janissary
10-11-2006, 04:03 PM
The guy had to go into permanent hiding for writing the Satanic Verses, and he didn't learn?

He's not only a mean infidel, he's apparently bloody stupid too. If he is ever found dead at the bottom of a smoking crater, I won't dedicate him as much as a single condoleance.
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amirah_87
10-11-2006, 04:09 PM
As Salaamu Alaykum,

Muslim Veils 'Suck'
SubhanAllah!! How Dare He!?? :? :mad:

Hope he makes Tawbah for All his Actions InshaAllah!! :heated:
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Bittersteel
10-11-2006, 04:14 PM
Thank you for teaching us about Islam!
go to the ref section.The apostasy thing has been discussed over there.
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Kamilah
10-11-2006, 04:16 PM
Seems the Satan is at it again! what has he gained in his life spewing out such venom? he lives a dogs life...actually, a dog lives a better life than he does!!! he is in hiding....lives his life in fear! this world is a prison for him!! he knows better than any of us the burden his actions have upon him!

i really wish i could write a letter to this loser and tell him how pathetic and imprudent he really is!
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Ibn Abi Ahmed
10-11-2006, 04:24 PM
:sl:

14: 42. Consider not that Allah is unaware of that which the Zalimin(polytheists, wrong-doers, etc.) do, but He gives them respite up to a Day when the eyes will stare in horror.

43. (They will be) hastening forward with necks outstretched, their heads raised up (towards the sky), their gaze returning not towards them and their hearts empty (from thinking because of extreme fear).

:w:
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Trumble
10-11-2006, 05:07 PM
Originally Posted by muzna
its not murder, its execution
The only difference is the point of view. For that reason 'execution' should be avoided just as is murder. Leave the life and death over others stuff to God... unless you believe human 'justice' is as infallible as God?
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duskiness
10-11-2006, 06:18 PM
Originally Posted by Kamilah
he lives a dogs life...actually, a dog lives a better life than he does!!! he is in hiding....lives his life in fear! this world is a prison for him!! he knows better than any of us the burden his actions have upon him!
hymmm..he was last month in Poland, gave public lacture, his photos were all over newspapers, and in tv...it did't look as if he was hiding..salman rushdi on ceremony of awarding best polish writer (1 from left)

The only difference is the point of view. For that reason 'execution' should be avoided just as is murder. Leave the life and death over others stuff to God... unless you believe human 'justice' is as infallible as God?
i could sign beneath this with my both hands :D
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Kamilah
10-11-2006, 07:28 PM
Originally Posted by duskiness
hymmm..he was last month in Poland, gave public lacture, his photos were all over newspapers, and in tv...it did't look as if he was hiding..salman rushdi on ceremony of awarding best polish writer (1 from left)

i could sign beneath this with my both hands :D
:ooh: la hawla wa la quwwata illa billah!!

:vomit: who let the devil out?? trust the polish to invite him!! *rolls eyes*

following on from the Ayaats Brother ahmed posted...

devil rushdie cannot blame the Satan for his verses! because on the day of judgement the Satan will stand up and say

'I invited you and you responded to me, so don't blame me blame yourselves.' ( Surah Ibrahim 14:22)
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Muezzin
10-11-2006, 08:29 PM
Quick question - has anyone actually read his books?

I haven't, so I don't judge him on those. I do however judge him on comments like this.
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Kamilah
10-11-2006, 10:31 PM
Originally Posted by Muezzin
Quick question - has anyone actually read his books?

I haven't, so I don't judge him on those. I do however judge him on comments like this.
you mean his pathetic novels?

titles like "shalimar the clown" and "midnight's children" :giggling:

in a nutshell = waste of paper.

they would be utilised better as toilet paper.
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wilberhum
10-11-2006, 10:34 PM
Originally Posted by Kamilah
you mean his pathetic novels?

titles like "shalimar the clown" and "midnight's children" :giggling:

in a nutshell = waste of paper.

they would be utilised better as toilet paper.
If you have never read, how do you judge?
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Kamilah
10-11-2006, 10:39 PM
Originally Posted by wilberhum
If you have never read, how do you judge?
I read the excerpts, and I also work in a library I know how UNpopular they are!:okay:
with a click of a button i can see the loan history of every book
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wilberhum
10-11-2006, 10:49 PM
I know how UNpopular they are!
There are surly a million writers that wish they were that UNpopular.
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samiya_06
10-11-2006, 10:50 PM
Originally Posted by Kamilah
I read the excerpts, and I also work in a library I know how UNpopular they are!:okay:
with a click of a button i can see the loan history of every book


do true sister. his books are UNPOPULAR. i agree with u.
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Zulkiflim
10-11-2006, 11:01 PM
Salaam,

Perhaps if any reporter can ask Salman rushidie if he pray and fast and pays the zakat.

We already know he cant enter Mecca.LOL
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akulion
10-11-2006, 11:04 PM
who cares what that loser says anyways lol

he will live in fear and hiding in this dunya

and some really hot treats await him in the next insha'allah

if u get what i mean ;)
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Kamilah
10-11-2006, 11:12 PM
Originally Posted by wilberhum
There are surly a million writers that wish they were that UNpopular.

he sure has sold himself short!!!

This world is nothing but a mirage!

please refer to brother Ahmed's post...

Only Allah knows what is in store for this loser.
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Ibn Abi Ahmed
10-11-2006, 11:29 PM
:sl:

Last thing you guys want is him to come on the Day of Resurection and take your good deeds because of your backbiting and what a waste will it be on him too because they wont avail him in the least anyway.
Just leave him, he isnt even worth mentioning. This is what he wants, more publicity. Remember Allah is aware of him and what he's doing and done. Its not like he wont be payed back for what he has done. Look at the wisdom of Allah! He is letting him live a comfortable life here in this dunya, and after death and in the Aakhirah he is going to meet Allah with no good deeds but all of his evil deeds and the Curse and Anger of Allah Inshallah. Then he will wish that he never did what he has done.

2: 161. Verily, those who disbelieve, and die while they are disbelievers, it is they on whom is the Curse of Allah and of the angels and of mankind, combined.

162. They will abide therein (under the curse in Hell), their punishment will neither be lightened, nor will they be reprieved.

:w:
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maroon1
07-15-2007, 10:44 AM
Hi

Now the fatwa for killing Rushdie was made just because he criticized Islam !! criticism = murder !! oh... For some people criticism is an insult, but a again I don't think insult = murder
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Skywalker
07-15-2007, 11:20 AM
Originally Posted by Malaikah
its not murder, its a punishment. The punishment for apostatcy is death. and i think this situation highlights nicely the wisdom behind the ruling. See how the apostate propagates anti-islamic attitudes... thus turning people away from the true religion...
I think we need to better clarify this because I noticed some non-Muslim members of this forum might be getting confused.

I started a thread on apostasy a while back and it came to a conclusion that I think everyone was OK with.

Not all apostates from Islam are eligable to be killed. In fact very few are. The ones that are are those who by leaving Islam make themselves enemies of Islam. For example, if a Muslim becomes a Christian, and the only difference in his life is that he goes to a church instead of a Mosque, yet makes no comments about how "bad" Islam is, then he's ok. There's no compulsion in religion.

However, if a person leaves Islam and then goes on in the newspapers claiming that Islam is from the devil or even taking physical action against Muslims just for their religion, he makes himself an enemy of Islam and becomes eligable for capital punishment.

However, it's even more complex that that. This has to be within the boudaries of a Islamic country, one that is ruled by Sharia law. If he does this outside of the boudaries of such a state, I think but I don't know, that it would not be halal to kill him. Allah knows best.

Lastly, u should all listen to <--> (did I spell that correctly?), and not indulge yourselves in talking about this guy too much. We can discuss the things he says in order to have an idea about who he is, but to start insulting him talking trash about him is not Islamic. We're better than that brothers and sisters, let's not forget that.

:w:
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Cognescenti
07-15-2007, 03:16 PM
The link is broken. If he really said that, in addition to aposty, he is also guilty of banality. It seems like soemthing a teenager would say.
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Zman
07-15-2007, 03:56 PM
Originally Posted by Janissary
The guy had to go into permanent hiding for writing the Satanic Verses, and he didn't learn?
:sl:

The goal that was set for him, was to push the wrong buttons and be as Crude & offensive as possible.

He has no reason to learn, because his atrocious behavior wasn't accidental nor a mistake. They were calculated acts of provocation.

This was his masters plan, from the beginning.

He is Just merely a deaf/dumb/blind, puppet in their hands...
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Cognescenti
07-15-2007, 04:37 PM
Originally Posted by Kamilah
I read the excerpts, and I also work in a library I know how UNpopular they are!:okay:
with a click of a button i can see the loan history of every book
Hmmmmmm? Sholuld you really be doing that without a valid institutional reason?

I sure hope nobody with a name suggesting they are Muslim checked it out. Are you part of the undercover Aposty police? :sunny:
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Bittersteel
07-15-2007, 05:01 PM
Now the fatwa for killing Rushdie was made just because he criticized Islam !! criticism = murder !! oh... For some people criticism is an insult, but a again I don't think insult = murder
okay did he criticize Islam in the Satanic Verses?have you read the book?I haven't so want to tell me what he wrote?
AFAIK he didn't exactly criticize.he said he wrote something fiction ,which angered all the Muslim hardliners across the world.
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guyabano
07-15-2007, 06:35 PM
Originally Posted by Malaikah
The punishment for apostatcy is death.
So far for the tolerance of Islam?

A muslim woman who fall in love with an non-muslim man and want to leave Islam must be scared to death.

My goodness !
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IbnAbdulHakim
07-15-2007, 06:37 PM
in the satanic verses rushdie insults all mothers, white people, margaret thatcher and many many others. He greatly insults islam, and the language used is beyond vulgar. He also attacks the dieties of the hindu's,

for more information check out ahmed deedat - how rushdie fooled the west
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------
07-15-2007, 06:54 PM
:salamext:

The link in the first post of this therad is not working, however, Rushdie? Puh-lease. After 'Satanic Verses', he should have a lot more sense. But NO. He insists on provoking Muslims. :-\
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Bittersteel
07-15-2007, 07:17 PM
So far for the tolerance of Islam?
[off-topic]
there are certain conditions;like the final decision rests on the head of state to determine whether he/she is a threat to the Islamic way of life/Islamic practice.
the law was based owing to such incidents back in the time of the Prophet(PBUH).People would accept and then leave the religion sometimes for causing confusion and trouble and disbelief.
personally I don't care about people leaving the religion.But generally those who have left the religion and the liberal Muslims ,they tend to be hostile towards its most strict practitioners and its principles.[off-topic]
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wilberhum
07-15-2007, 08:07 PM
Originally Posted by Muj4h1d4
:salamext:

The link in the first post of this therad is not working, however, Rushdie? Puh-lease. After 'Satanic Verses', he should have a lot more sense. But NO. He insists on provoking Muslims. :-\
He didn't provoke Muslims. He wrote a novel. Muslims provoked themselves.
Like the post above quotes.
So far for the tolerance of Islam?
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Pygoscelis
07-15-2007, 09:43 PM
Originally Posted by Aziz
[off-topic]
there are certain conditions;like the final decision rests on the head of state to determine whether he/she is a threat to the Islamic way of life/Islamic practice.
the law was based owing to such incidents back in the time of the Prophet(PBUH).People would accept and then leave the religion sometimes for causing confusion and trouble and disbelief.
personally I don't care about people leaving the religion.But generally those who have left the religion and the liberal Muslims ,they tend to be hostile towards its most strict practitioners and its principles.[off-topic]
So essentially you are saying Islam is against freedom of speech and against criticism or "exposees" from those who have been within it and thus know about it and wish to warn the rest of us about its negative aspects. That seems awfully insecure for a group of people claiming to be backed up by the devine.
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KAding
07-15-2007, 09:45 PM
Originally Posted by Muj4h1d4
:salamext:

The link in the first post of this therad is not working, however, Rushdie? Puh-lease. After 'Satanic Verses', he should have a lot more sense. But NO. He insists on provoking Muslims. :-\
Thinking Muslim veils 'suck' is not a provocation, it is a perfectly reasonable opinion for a non-Muslim. Did he also call for a prohibition on wearing a veil? If not, I don't really see what is so shocking about it. Most non-Muslim Westeners would think the principle behind the veil 'sucks' I think. Thats why they don't wear them!
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Malaikah
07-16-2007, 06:06 AM
Originally Posted by Pygoscelis
So essentially you are saying Islam is against freedom of speech and against criticism or "exposees" from those who have been within it and thus know about it and wish to warn the rest of us about its negative aspects. That seems awfully insecure for a group of people claiming to be backed up by the devine.
He did not criticise, he attacked.

Writing stories where the Prophets wives are portrayed as prostitutes is not criticism, it is blatant stupidity and disrespect.
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wilberhum
07-17-2007, 12:27 PM
Originally Posted by Malaikah
He did not criticise, he attacked.

Writing stories where the Prophets wives are portrayed as prostitutes is not criticism, it is blatant stupidity and disrespect.
Semantics.
Blatant stupidity? Well you have your right to your openion.
Disrespect? So? Is he not entitled to his openion?
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IbnAbdulHakim
07-17-2007, 01:57 PM
rushdie, ali sina other enemies of islam i just dont understand YOU

You dont believe in the afterlife so why work so hard to misguide people, just enjoy life and await hell sheesh
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IbnAbdulHakim
07-17-2007, 02:00 PM
Originally Posted by wilberhum
Semantics.
Blatant stupidity? Well you have your right to your openion.
Disrespect? So? Is he not entitled to his openion?
have you even read the satanic verses?


if i write a book on how i hate everything i would immediately be taken to jail.


stop thinking with your lust and hatred and sit down, sip some tea and THINK.

WHY IS RUSHDIE ALlOWED TO GET AWAY WITH THIS?

ps: if you raed the book you would know he insulted the queen, thatcher, all mums and most religions. the book consists of 52 F*** words, now if you dont think its full of hatred then stay blind, ....
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InToTheRain
07-17-2007, 02:05 PM
Originally Posted by Malaikah
He did not criticise, he attacked.
He did not just insult the muslims, anyone who has read the Satanic verses will know this. Roahl Dhal called him a twit.

Indeed, he is an ignorant bafoon whos also an opportunist. whats worse is the wests support of this fool even after how he insulted them:

http://www.jamaat.net/rushdie/Rushdie.html

as you can see actor Micky Ruorke was banned from entering UK by, MPS demanded the Ban out of anger saying "I hope he never sets foots on our shores, I am shocked beyond belief"! what did ruorke do? he described the policies of Margerett tatcher who was the Primeminister at that time using "A 4 letter word".

BUt Rushdie, who was bold enough to call the Primeminister herself a BIT** got no such response, its like his attempt to tarnish the good name of Islam sends some people into states of such ecstacy that it turns the sinusoidal affect of all the other negative things said to others to a possitive one.

hmmm...maybe I should put this in My double standards thread
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Tania
07-17-2007, 02:11 PM
I never read anything by him in which he attack his religion. Except may be that small lines about pakistani doctors:-[
But we should be content that an indian writer succeded to write so well about India.:)
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Malaikah
07-17-2007, 02:11 PM
Originally Posted by wilberhum
Semantics.
Blatant stupidity? Well you have your right to your openion.
Disrespect? So? Is he not entitled to his openion?
Oh, please. It has nothing to do with semantics.

And you expect us to do what, exactly? Celebrate? Naturally we aren't going to be happy with him.

What opinion man? He just made up rubbish, it can't possibly be excused as an "opinion".
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IbnAbdulHakim
07-17-2007, 02:13 PM
Originally Posted by Malaikah
Oh, please. It has nothing to do with semantics.

And you expect us to do what, exactly? Celebrate? Naturally we aren't going to be happy with him.

What opinion man? He just made up rubbish, it can't possibly be excused as an "opinion".
sis watch ahmed deedats - how rushdie fooled the west and you will see the disgusting sick psychotic insane depraved filthy rubbish he writes.
it will sicken you to the core...
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Skywalker
07-17-2007, 02:52 PM
Is it just me, or does Rushdie look demonic? Seriously, that is one scary face that he has...
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Nσσя'υℓ Jαииαн
07-17-2007, 03:27 PM
^^LOL! YEA! I always think he looks evil ;D SubhanAllah he really does :X A person can be in trouble for treason of a country and he can face punishment but not when he attacks our religion. HYPOCRITES!
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Tania
07-17-2007, 05:40 PM
Originally Posted by Jazzy
^^LOL! YEA! I always think he looks evil ;D SubhanAllah he really does :X A person can be in trouble for treason of a country and he can face punishment but not when he attacks our religion. HYPOCRITES!
Sis i read "The midnight Childrens" and " The ground benith her feet" and both are well written with a great style. :embarrass You should think at his other books too, not only at one.
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IbnAbdulHakim
07-17-2007, 05:43 PM
^ if only you knew the sick depraved mind those "good stories" you read came from...
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Zman
07-17-2007, 10:13 PM
Originally Posted by Skywalker
Is it just me, or does Rushdie look demonic? Seriously, that is one scary face that he has...
Originally Posted by Jazzy
^^LOL! YEA! I always think he looks evil ;D SubhanAllah he really does :X A person can be in trouble for treason of a country and he can face punishment but not when he attacks our religion. HYPOCRITES!
:sl: To All,

Yeah, it's the Eye's & eyebrows. They make him look devilish/demonic:



This guy is also similar in appearance:



For some reason,Tony Blairs face really reminds me of the ancient Greek mythical goat-god, Pan."

All he's missing are a pair of horns & hooves:



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Joe98
07-17-2007, 10:43 PM
Originally Posted by WnbSlveOfAllah
He did not just insult the muslims,

…..the wests support of this fool even after how he insulted them
That’s called free speech further evidence there are no double standards


Originally Posted by WnbSlveOfAllah
….actor Micky Rourke was banned from entering UK…..
He is not a citizen of the UK. The UK can let in or ban whoever they please. Nor is he a muslim. Further evidences of no double standards.

Rushdie is a citizen of the UK. When Islam said he must be killed the UK must protect it’s citizen.
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SATalha
07-17-2007, 11:21 PM
The one thing that realy annoys me about Salaman Rushdie is that the books his written (especial Satanic Verses) are not of great standards. I mean the whole western world want to protect this mans great work and aknowledge him as a great writer.......what nonsense is that?

Like some one has already mentioned watch Ahmed Deedat's talk about how Salman Rushdie fooled the West.
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wilberhum
07-17-2007, 11:37 PM
Originally Posted by SATalha
The one thing that realy annoys me about Salaman Rushdie is that the books his written (especial Satanic Verses) are not of great standards. I mean the whole western world want to protect this mans great work and aknowledge him as a great writer.......what nonsense is that?

Like some one has already mentioned watch Ahmed Deedat's talk about how Salman Rushdie fooled the West.
what nonsense is that? That is your nonsense. :muddlehea :thumbs_do
We protect the man because it is necessary to protect freedom of speach.
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SATalha
07-17-2007, 11:43 PM
Yes i know all that shananigans......what i mean is that hes work frankly is...........what word to use?
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Zman
07-18-2007, 12:41 AM
:sl:

Protecting "freedom of speech," actually means: protecting the freedom to insult Islam & Muslims.

Protecting the right to incite hatred & violence against Muslims.

They try Muslim for "spreading hate," and "inciting violence," but people like Mike Savage remain on the air and free to spread their venom.

Where is the coveted "freedom of speech" for thos who question the Holocaust.

Regardless of their belief, aren't they entitled to their free speech and opinions? They sure are...
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جوري
07-18-2007, 01:03 AM
Originally Posted by Zman
:sl: To All,


This guy is also similar in appearance:



For some reason,Tony Blairs face really reminds me of the ancient Greek mythical goat-god, Pan."

All he's missing are a pair of horns & hooves:



I try to stay away from world affairs but that was +vly hilarious ;D ;D ;D
:w:
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wilberhum
07-18-2007, 01:42 AM
Originally Posted by Zman
:sl:

Protecting "freedom of speech," actually means: protecting the freedom to insult Islam & Muslims.

Protecting the right to incite hatred & violence against Muslims.

They try Muslim for "spreading hate," and "inciting violence," but people like Mike Savage remain on the air and free to spread their venom.

Where is the coveted "freedom of speech" for thos who question the Holocaust.

Regardless of their belief, aren't they entitled to their free speech and opinions? They sure are...
For once you are right. It also allows you to make all the insulting remarks about your country.
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Keltoi
07-18-2007, 01:43 AM
Originally Posted by queefer
I think it would be funny if the Pope or maybe the Dali Lhama issued some 'fatwas' calling for the 'punishing' of Islamofascists.. :D
Why would that be funny?
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Keltoi
07-18-2007, 01:56 AM
Originally Posted by queefer
I think it would be a nice change of pace.
You do realize that the Pope has enough influence to call for violence even today? Hypothetically, if the Pope were to give an address in which he ordered all good Catholics to kill...yellow tomcats(for example), Europe and the U.S. would be fairly free of yellow tomcats right? Thanks goodness the Catholic church no longer endorses violence.
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queefer
07-18-2007, 02:05 AM
Originally Posted by Keltoi
You do realize that the Pope has enough influence to call for violence even today? ...


I don't think that's true. Sure, you may have a few nuts, (abortion clinic killers ) but I don't see anything near the fervor and numbers as the Islamofascist.
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Zman
07-18-2007, 02:30 AM
Originally Posted by queefer
I don't think that's true. Sure, you may have a few nuts, (abortion clinic killers ) but I don't see anything near the fervor and numbers as the Islamofascist.

The ferver and numbers of ChristoFascists & JudeoFascists are the same or larger than those of the fringe Muslim groups.

Their inhumane & barbaric weapons are by far more deadly & destructive...
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queefer
07-18-2007, 02:42 AM
Originally Posted by Zman

The ferver and numbers of ChristoFascists & JudeoFascists are the same or larger than those of the fringe Muslim groups.

Their inhumane & barbaric weapons are by far more deadly & destructive...
I don't know, man. I've never seen thousands of Christians jumping up and down in the streets chanting 'Death to Iran' or anything like it. When was the last time you saw thousands of Christians burning Ahmadinejad in effigy ?(although that would be pretty funny. ) And you can't blame Christians/West for being good engineers.
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Zman
07-18-2007, 02:54 AM
Originally Posted by queefer
And you can't blame Christians/West for being good engineers.

I'm glad you admitted to many bloodletting, devastation and war crimes that were perpetrated by the West & Christendom.

We in the West willl be answering for them, for a long time. Thanks to people like you and your ilk.

Just don't whine when the enemies our governments create, become "good engineers," also...
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Malaikah
07-18-2007, 03:38 AM
Originally Posted by queefer
I don't know, man. I've never seen thousands of Christians jumping up and down in the streets chanting 'Death to Iran' or anything like it. When was the last time you saw thousands of Christians burning Ahmadinejad in effigy ?(although that would be pretty funny. ) And you can't blame Christians/West for being good engineers.
What has Iran done to them for them to need to react that way?

Maybe it will happen if Iran goes on an country invading rampage like the US did, you might start to see it. :offended:
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queefer
07-18-2007, 03:44 AM
Originally Posted by Malaikah
...Maybe it will happen if Iran goes on an country invading rampage like the US did, you might start to see it. :offended:



I highly doubt it. It seems we in the West have better things to do with our time than whipping ourselves into a frenzy, chanting stupid slogans.
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Skywalker
07-18-2007, 06:53 AM
2 quick comments:

Originally Posted by queefer
I've never seen thousands of Christians jumping up and down in the streets chanting 'Death to Iran' or anything like it.
You mean similar to thousands of Muslims jumping up and down chanting 'death to Israel'? In that case it would be better to label them 'Palestinians' than 'Muslims' because this is not a religious protest, but a political one. They got forced out of their homes and they want them back. On the other hand, Iran has never done anything to have anyone want to destroy it.

Originally Posted by wilberhum
We protect the man because it is necessary to protect freedom of speech.
Why?

I mean let's just think about this for a minute. What exactly are you protecting? An ideal? Based on what? If it's human experience that freedom of speech is better for humanity, I'm going to have to disagree with you. Freedom of speech has done a lot more bad in the last decade than good. Sure I think it's important to criticize negative elements of our societies, but there's a limit to that...when you start publically criticizing positive elemets or degrading morals or inciting hatred...that's not the kind of freedom of speech that I would ever support. This to me is harassment, and it just makes the world a lousy place to live.
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wilberhum
07-18-2007, 12:59 PM
I mean let's just think about this for a minute. What exactly are you protecting? An ideal? Based on what? If it's human experience that freedom of speech is better for humanity, I'm going to have to disagree with you. Freedom of speech has done a lot more bad in the last decade than good. Sure I think it's important to criticize negative elements of our societies, but there's a limit to that...when you start publically criticizing positive elemets or degrading morals or inciting hatred...that's not the kind of freedom of speech that I would never support. This to me is harassment, and it just makes the world a lousy place to live.
You have limited your world to black and white. Too bad you don’t see the 98 shapes of gray.

Freedom of speech or any other freedom will cause problems. I can’t think of anything that does not cause some problem. Even too much of a good thing is not a good thing.

Maybe you would like to live in a country where there is no or extremely restricted freedoms, but not me.
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Skywalker
07-18-2007, 02:29 PM
Originally Posted by wilberhum
You have limited your world to black and white. Too bad you don’t see the 98 shapes of gray.

Freedom of speech or any other freedom will cause problems. I can’t think of anything that does not cause some problem. Even too much of a good thing is not a good thing.

Maybe you would like to live in a country where there is no or extremely restricted freedoms, but not me.
Actually on most computer screens, there are actually 254 shades of gray, and in case you haven't noticed, I wasn't talking black and white. When I mentioned several exceptions to which complete freedom of speech seems to be a disadvantage, but at the same time I never said that our speech should be so restricted as to not allow anyone to utter a word.

As for choosing to live in a country where freedoms are "extremely restricted", it depends on your definition of extremely restricted. For example, if I lived in a country where the government did not allow me to interact with anothe human being, to only eat once a day, to only sleep for 3 hours each night...then no, I would not at all like to live in such a place. I would however like to live in a place where freedoms are restricted to a level that allows people to live in as much harmony as humanly possible while at the same time having enough freedom to not feel forcefully constrained. Complete freedom of speech (ie. allowing negative elements of society to degrade and humiliate the positive parts) is not my idea of a harmonious society, but with a few more ground rules it could be.
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Muezzin
07-18-2007, 02:37 PM
Er... yeah, this is another really old thread drudged up for no apparent reason (considering that there already exist at least two other Rushdie threads, probably a third for the recent honours controversy). Since this thread is much older than 3 days, and since all threads in this section may be closed after 3 days, and since the posts in this thread are no longer really adding anything to a discussion but are rather stirring the pot, I'm locking this.
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