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Nσσя'υℓ Jαииαн
10-12-2006, 12:29 AM
Britain’s Deputy Prime Minister John Prescott said that Muslim women should be free to wear the veil, adding that the debate over the issue could increase prejudice and damage community relations, The Telegraph reported.

Prescott’s comments largely isolated House of Commons leader Jack Straw, who angered the Muslim community last week when he described the veil as a “visible statement of separation”, and said he asked women visiting his constituency office in Blackburn to take it off.

Prescott said that Straw had the right to raise the issue, stressing that it shouldn’t be a "no go area for debate".

But he expressed concern that such debate could lead to "considerable difficulties" in terms of community relations.

"I think a woman who wants to wear a veil - why shouldn't she? It is her choice. It is a cultural difference but it is her choice," he said.

Prescott also stressed that he wouldn’t follow Straw’s example and ask women visiting him to remove their veil.

"If somebody comes into my constituency, whether they are wearing a skull cap or wearing a turban or very dark glasses, I'm not going to ask them to remove it. I think you can communicate with them,” he said.

Other top UK officials agreed with Prescott, including the Health Secretary, Patricia Hewitt, Ruth Kelly, Secretary of State for Communities, and Peter Hain, Secretary of State for Northern Ireland and Wales.

Patricia Hewitt said she wouldn’t ask Muslim women to take off their veils. She admitted that she had, in the past, considered the veil as a symbol of oppression, but changed her mind after a meeting with a Muslim woman in her Leicester West constituency.

“She'd made the decision - not her parents or anybody else - that she wanted, as part of her statement of her faith, to wear the veil. I would not ask her to take that off or to change a decision that she has made as an adult woman," she told BBC1's Politics Show.
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Muezzin
10-12-2006, 08:29 AM
I just gained a lot more respect for John Prescott.

Patricia Hewitt is an MP of my city so she has my respect by default :p

Also, could you post the link if you have one please?
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The Ruler
10-12-2006, 08:34 AM
Originally Posted by Muezzin
I just gained a lot more respect for John Prescott.
:sl:

yup true :happy:...i hope thats the end to this veil thingy majiggy :)

:w:
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amirah_87
10-12-2006, 09:15 AM
As Salaamu Alaykum,

Wow Alahmdulillah!! I thought everyone was going to go against it!!

Where's George Galloway when you need him?




;D
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- Qatada -
10-12-2006, 09:20 AM
:wasalamex



Masha'Allaah that's kinda good. But we gota realise that the minority are mainly ignored, and because we know that the muslim world is being attacked from all sides, Allaah azawajal may test us here too.


Remember, we're coming upto the time when their will only be two parties - pure kufr (disbelief), or pure emaan (faith.) Right now, we're in the grey area, but it's already being proven to us that the party of emaan is being tested (i.e. the scholars, the muslimah sisters with the niqaab etc.) and the kufar leader's, and non muslim's are also being tested.


The two parties are already being cleared up, black and white is being shown infront of our own eyes, and we too will be tested.



Allaahu a'lam but once these two parties are split up, and there's only white and black left, then the trial's may get even tougher. But no-one said that jannah would be an easy ticket...
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Bittersteel
10-12-2006, 11:51 AM
^haha.we better acquire nuuclear weapons.
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S_87
10-12-2006, 11:52 AM
Originally Posted by amirah_87
As Salaamu Alaykum,



Where's George Galloway when you need him?




;D
:sl:

lol you didnt hear him on this? he was along the lines of here i am with a small dagger and im heading for jack straw :lol:

he was proper dissing him on his radio show

good for prescott :coolious:
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amirah_87
10-12-2006, 11:56 AM
Originally Posted by amani
:sl:

lol you didnt hear him on this? he was along the lines of here i am with a small dagger and im heading for jack straw :lol:

he was proper dissing him on his radio show
As Salaamu Alaykum,

Oh Really!!?!?! :haha:

May Allah Guide that Guy!! :)
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Nσσя'υℓ Jαииαн
10-12-2006, 05:14 PM
Lol, sorry about that.
Here's the link.

http://islamonline.com/cgi-bin/news_...ervice_id=2558
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Ansar Al-'Adl
10-12-2006, 05:21 PM
:sl:

A comment on the ridiculous claim that Muslim women should remove their veils for the sake of the wider community in the UK

:w:
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Hanif_Revert
10-12-2006, 06:16 PM
I went on Talk sport last week to answer some of the bigoted remarks being made by some radio presenter.
Amongst these claims were "No-one can tell me why they wear it?"
Is it to show their identity?
Is it because their men make them
etc, etc.
Once i had explained to him the meaning of it to him he accepted this, however, two or three calls later he was asking the same question!!
i.e. "Noone can tell me why."
Two or three women had come onto the phone explaining they wore it because they wanted too, yet he kept insinuating that it could be because of culture or men etc, etc.
I had to stop listening because i was getting upset.
It was clear that people's misinterpritations of the religion and bigoted views were surfacing
It seems that if something is not understood, it is ridiculed or mocked and more importantly not accepted
I just pray to Allah that there are no outbreaks of violence on women because of this mans comments
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Nσσя'υℓ Jαииαн
10-12-2006, 06:18 PM
Yeap Allah has blinded their eyes and hearts. Allah does not guide people like that.
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Mohsin
10-13-2006, 10:32 AM
Originally Posted by Hanif_Revert
I just pray to Allah that there are no outbreaks of violence on women because of this mans comments
well I have extremeley extremely sad bad news. A sister who wears niqab in london was raped three days ago. A friend of a friend knew her. I been on the look out for it in the news but I guess they dont want to show how straw's comments had bad consequences
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Musaafirah
10-13-2006, 10:37 AM
Originally Posted by amirah_87
As Salaamu Alaykum,

Wow Alahmdulillah!! I thought everyone was going to go against it!!

Where's George Galloway when you need him?




;D
:sl:
I thought he asked for the resignation of Jack straw? ..well..that was inidicated in this video..
http://search.bbc.co.uk/cgi-bin/sear...=all&edition=d
and click on Straw's Veil remarks discussed..
:w:
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- Qatada -
10-13-2006, 11:53 AM
Originally Posted by Mohsin
well I have extremeley extremely sad bad news. A sister who wears niqab in london was raped three days ago. A friend of a friend knew her. I been on the look out for it in the news but I guess they dont want to show how straw's comments had bad consequences

Allaah azawajal will destroy that faasiq insha'Allaah.. or if He wills, he will be guided..


subhan Allaah.



:salamext:
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Hanif_Revert
10-13-2006, 12:06 PM
Originally Posted by Mohsin
well I have extremeley extremely sad bad news. A sister who wears niqab in london was raped three days ago. A friend of a friend knew her. I been on the look out for it in the news but I guess they dont want to show how straw's comments had bad consequences
That is the most horrible news. I had a feeling in the pit of my stomach that comments of prejudice comming from such a well known and 'respected' figure of authority would only create a justification for attack on Muslimah. once again Islam has been thrust into the limelight to be rediculed and mocked by ignorant, bigotted thugs.

My heart goes out to your friend. May Allah give her strngth in this time of need.
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Hanif_Revert
10-13-2006, 12:19 PM
Looks like the persicution has begun

http://www.guardian.co.uk/uklatest/s...144713,00.html
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S_87
10-13-2006, 12:40 PM
Originally Posted by Hanif_Revert
Looks like the persicution has begun

http://www.guardian.co.uk/uklatest/s...144713,00.html
:sl:

when she was given the job contract, when she had the meeting she didnt have the veil nor mentioned it in any way. however when she went she insisted on wearing the veil.
this has been going on for quite a while, and she was given right to wear in school just not when talking to children...
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Hanif_Revert
10-13-2006, 12:51 PM
Originally Posted by amani
:sl:

when she was given the job contract, when she had the meeting she didnt have the veil nor mentioned it in any way. however when she went she insisted on wearing the veil.
this has been going on for quite a while, and she was given right to wear in school just not when talking to children...
Thank you for clearing this up sister.

I apologise for jumping the gun!!
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------
10-13-2006, 01:05 PM
"I think a woman who wants to wear a veil - why shouldn't she? It is her choice. It is a cultural difference but it is her choice," he said.
Safe :D

Wiked link! :thumbs_up
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*Hana*
10-13-2006, 01:06 PM
Salam Alaikum:

Personally, I think she should remove the veil in the classroom while teaching children. Particularly, if she is teaching them another language. Seeing how letters and sounds are made is a very important part of speech when trying to learn a new language. Quite frankly, I think it's rather unfair to expect young children to grasp a new language without this integral part of the teaching process. She is around chldren, not male adults and the school has absolutely no problem with her wearing it outside the classroom environment.

We too have to be careful in not going to extremes here. While I am extremely angry at the stupidity of Jack Straw's comments that have no basis in fact, in the case of teaching young children a new language, wearing the veil while teaching could, and most probably will, be a hinderance. We do have to be considerate of the fact that the removal of the veil, in some instances, will be neccessary...ie: Visiting a Dentist, etc.

If she insists on not removing it while teaching, then she probably should not be teaching second language classes and should choose an area in education where the veil would not interfere with the student's learning process.

Anyway, just my opinion.

Wasalam,
Hana
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Mohsin
10-14-2006, 10:43 PM
Originally Posted by Hana_Aku
Salam Alaikum:

Personally, I think she should remove the veil in the classroom while teaching children. Particularly, if she is teaching them another language. Seeing how letters and sounds are made is a very important part of speech when trying to learn a new language. Quite frankly, I think it's rather unfair to expect young children to grasp a new language without this integral part of the teaching process. She is around chldren, not male adults and the school has absolutely no problem with her wearing it outside the classroom environment.
masha'allah a very valid point. i wasnt aware she is teaching languages tio children. and to be honest, she shouldnt have gone to the interview without the veil on. She should have let them know from the beginning that she wears a veil, it would have avoided the problem perhaps, but who am i to say. Allah Knows Best
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KAding
10-15-2006, 11:36 AM
Veil is woman’s own choice – Prescott
I absolutely agree. Just like it's a woman's own choice not to wear a veil. Right?
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S_87
10-15-2006, 12:20 PM
:sl:

regarding my previous post on this issue.... what i said was based on what a person who works in that same school told me....
however now the identity of the woman has been revealed, i realise i know the sister from school. she has been wearing the veil since ages, even in school... she was a very strong in that sense.

oh, and shes not teaching the kids a second language. the kids do know english just all mixed up which is kinda common amongst the children round here :p
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*Hana*
10-15-2006, 03:27 PM
Originally Posted by amani
:sl:

regarding my previous post on this issue.... what i said was based on what a person who works in that same school told me....
however now the identity of the woman has been revealed, i realise i know the sister from school. she has been wearing the veil since ages, even in school... she was a very strong in that sense.

oh, and shes not teaching the kids a second language. the kids do know english just all mixed up which is kinda common amongst the children round here :p
Salam Alaikum Sister:

According to the news article, "Bilingual support worker Aishah Azmi, 24, was asked to remove the veil after pupils found it hard to understand her during English language lessons."

I applaud her for her stand to wear the veil, mashallah! But, we also have to realize that if she is a bilingual support worker, it means she is there to help with a 2nd language, and in this case English lessons.

It is almost impossible to pronounce sounds without seeing how the mouth is formed to make the correct sounds. I have a Russian friend that is fluent in English now, but in her class, they all had mirrors and after the teacher showed them how to form the letters, they had to practice with the little mirror to make sure it was correct. The "th" was extremely difficult and it wasn't until she came here (canada), to visit, that she perfected it. We sat for a long time practicing. And it was the same for me learning how to pronounce a Russian word that seemed to start with an "F", but it wasn't until she showed me how to form the letter correctly, that I could finally pronounce it. So, you see, even though she is fluent and speaks with barely an accent, it is still necessary at times to learn to form letters. Imagine children without formal training trying to learn without this very important step.

Personally, from the reports I read, the school was very accomodating and only requested she not wear it, inside her classroom while teaching children. I think this is very reasonable and necessary.

I'm sure she's a wonderful sister, mashallah, and it's wonderful she dedicates herself to teaching children, but it's also important the children receive all the tools necessary to learn. Unfortunately for this sister, one of those tools is the ability to see word formation, not just hear it. :)

wasalam,
Hana
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*Hana*
10-15-2006, 03:30 PM
Originally Posted by KAding
I absolutely agree. Just like it's a woman's own choice not to wear a veil. Right?
Yup
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