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AnonymousPoster
10-28-2006, 02:58 AM
I know of a sister who is in a troubled marriage. She is a revert, her family are not muslim and dont live near her, she doesn't have many friends since her husband doesn't really let her.

Her husband has hit her in the face before, forced himself on her, I think that might be allowed, as in she has to be intimate when he wants unless she has a reason like illnes, but I mean she has ended up hating him so how can she sleep with him, she finds that difficult, she doesn't want to but he just does what he does anyway. He has held her around her neck and put a knife to her, and the marriage is basically just arguements.

She can't go masjid, and when she want's to speak to the Imams they cant speak english properly so she cant talk to them, plus when she wants to go, she has to go with her husband, she is also scared to leave him because she says something about a waiting period where she is going to have to stay at his place for a while, and if she asks for a divorce and then goes to stay again with him she doesn;t know what will happen

So what does she do? What does Islam say?
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AnonymousPoster
10-28-2006, 03:14 AM
Originally Posted by Anonymous Tester
I know of a sister who is in a troubled marriage. She is a revert, her family are not muslim and dont live near her, she doesn't have many friends since her husband doesn't really let her.

Her husband has hit her in the face before, forced himself on her, I think that might be allowed, as in she has to be intimate when he wants unless she has a reason like illnes, but I mean she has ended up hating him so how can she sleep with him, she finds that difficult, she doesn't want to but he just does what he does anyway. He has held her around her neck and put a knife to her, and the marriage is basically just arguements.

She can't go masjid, and when she want's to speak to the Imams they cant speak english properly so she cant talk to them, plus when she wants to go, she has to go with her husband, she is also scared to leave him because she says something about a waiting period where she is going to have to stay at his place for a while, and if she asks for a divorce and then goes to stay again with him she doesn;t know what will happen

So what does she do? What does Islam say?
:offended:

the judge should listen 2both sides of the story incase there's exagerations or misunderstandings or watever... and he should judge between them.

if the case is wat u describe... allahu alam but the guy sounds like he has a mental problem... she would hav the right to leave him.

may allah help her ameen :(
salam
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AnonymousPoster
10-28-2006, 03:22 AM
Originally Posted by Anonymous Tester
:offended:

the judge should listen 2both sides of the story incase there's exagerations or misunderstandings or watever... and he should judge between them.

if the case is wat u describe... allahu alam but the guy sounds like he has a mental problem... she would hav the right to leave him.

may allah help her ameen :(
salam
What Judge?
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AnonymousPoster
10-28-2006, 03:24 AM
Originally Posted by Anonymous Tester
Her husband has hit her in the face before, forced himself on her, I think that might be allowed, as in she has to be intimate when he wants unless she has a reason like illnes,
:salamext:

It is true she should not refuse without a valid reason, but he is not allowed to force her if she refuses.
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anonymous
10-28-2006, 03:32 AM
Originally Posted by Anonymous Tester
What Judge?
as in an islamic judge, perhaps a trustworthy just imam or scholar.

Or an arbitrator from both sides of the family, who will use quran as their sorce of judgement.

by the way yeh i think the abov anon is correct based on the hadith that says 'if he calls her and she refuses...'

wasalam
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AnonymousPoster
10-28-2006, 04:08 AM
Just to recap, she is not really allowed of the home alone, yet alone to go to a masjid to speak to an imam, and the imam round there hardly speak english thus her husband always goes there because he can speak arabic.

Plus she says that apparently she'd still have to spend the iddah time with her husband which she is scared of doing.
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Curaezipirid
10-28-2006, 04:10 AM
Originally Posted by Anonymous Tester

Her husband has hit her in the face before, forced himself on her, I think that might be allowed, as in she has to be intimate when he wants unless she has a reason like illnes, but I mean she has ended up hating him so how can she sleep with him, she finds that difficult, she doesn't want to but he just does what he does anyway. He has held her around her neck and put a knife to her, and the marriage is basically just arguements.
?
There may be examples in which a female over abused her vanity in her appearance and needed to experience a painful retribution; and that might have at one time accorded the punishment of appearing with a bruised face.

However that single instance must at all times be kept very seperate from a Husbands right to make love with his wife. If it hurts her in any way at all; then it is not right in Islam.

The teaching is that it is not for any female to decide when marital intimacy occurs; and that only the male's want can determine when.

So whenever there is privacy and he wants to inimately love her, her role is to acquiesce. But if he hurts her, then she has the right to leave him. Most especially if there is any pain experienced by her in connection with any amount of intimacy with even the slightest sexual reference.

That is Law. Even to the extent that a female must identify to the male if he has hurt her and had not realised.

It sounds to me that your friend has no real marriage at all. I have been in situations with men whom took it to themself to seek pleasure in me at the expense of causing ill to me; and in every example I regard the friendship as ended. The man may try to recomense the friendship and prove his worth in the offer he made to marry; but in the example of him inflicting pain associated with sexual intimacy, even when to pain is slight and he had not intended the interaction as painful to her, the woman can have no further obligation to him.

If we are not strict with ourselves in this regard we fall to gog and magog.

Usually in instances of poor marital relations there is evidence of gog and magog. Especially if a wife lets her Husband ejaculate; or if he has been socially misinformed to imagine that that is what it is he wanted from her. That form of social misinformation is the primary evidence of the society being amid fall to gog and magog.

She can not sustain her own Islam with him, that much is clear. So the marriage is already dissolved.

waram
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AnonymousPoster
10-28-2006, 04:23 AM
Originally Posted by Anonymous Tester
Just to recap, she is not really allowed of the home alone, yet alone to go to a masjid to speak to an imam, and the imam round there hardly speak english thus her husband always goes there because he can speak arabic.

Plus she says that apparently she'd still have to spend the iddah time with her husband which she is scared of doing.
sis if her life is at risk you're not going to be a shaheed by puttin urself in death's way... especially if he's threatenin 2 kill her as u say :offended: :offended: :offended:

look seriously this isn't a light matter, she must be very honest with herself coz just coz anyone (sheikh or whoeveR) passess a judgement based on wat he hears doesnt mean she'll be off the hook if what she said was fabricated in the slightest.....

http://islam-qa.com/index.php?ref=13...husband%20beat

inshalah that answers your question.... may allah protect him, and heal him if he's insane... or return his plots on his head if he's a villain.

Subhanallah it really is sad, if she fears that taking him to a qadhi will put her in more harm... Allah won't put someone under more than what they can bear... the above fatwa should be of help inshalah

send her our salams n sympathy and best wishes. reminder her its a test from Allah... especially becasue she's a revert incase she's getting wrong idea of Islam or something.
wasalam.
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AnonymousPoster
10-28-2006, 04:25 AM
^ oops i meant may allah protect HER big typo there sorry!1
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Umar001
10-28-2006, 04:44 AM
Originally Posted by Curaezipirid
There may be examples in which a female over abused her vanity in her appearance and needed to experience a painful retribution; and that might have at one time accorded the punishment of appearing with a bruised face.
Wait, what are you saying?

There might be times where she steps out of line and needs PAINFUL punishment, through which she ends up with a bruised face?

Is that what you mean?
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AnonymousPoster
10-28-2006, 04:44 AM
sis cura could you please simplify the english, it's too advanced mashalah :)

salams
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DigitalStorm82
10-28-2006, 06:36 AM
http://islam-qa.com/index.php?ref=1859&ln=eng

also look at this fatwah in addition to the fatwah posted above regarding a husband mistreating the wife.
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Malaikah
10-28-2006, 06:43 AM
:sl:

Arent you her friend? Cant she stay with you for a while if she isnt safe with her husband? Cant you take her to a different mosque where they speak english?
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AnonymousPoster
10-28-2006, 09:51 AM
There are three SUBJECTS when you should report a case to the police. NO ONE IS EXEMPT NOT EVEN A MUSLIM MAN

1-CHILD ABUSE
2- SPOUSE ABUSE
3-ELDER ABUSE

PLEASE WHERE IS YOUR CONSCIOUS KNOWING THIS WOMAN IS SUFFERING ON THE HANDS OF A MAN WHO COULD POTENTIALLY KILL HER AND HAS NOT ONLY THREATENED BUT ABUSED HER PHYSICALLY? IF YOU WERE TRAPPED WITH A MONSTER AND YOUR FRIEND KNEW WOULD YOU NOT WISH FOR HER TO HELP YOU? FOR THE LOVE OF ALLAH, IF YOU REALLY CARE AND LOVE YOUR FRIEND YOU WILL DO THE RIGHT THING AND CALL SOME DOMESTIC ABUSE PLACE TO SAVE THIS WOMAN, DO IT AS AN ANONYMOUS, LIKE WE ARE DOING NOW TO OFFER YOU SANE ADVISE WITHOUT BEING JUDGED FOR OUR FIRM BELIEFS. IF THIS IS YOUR WAY OF GETTING A NUDGE TO DO IT, THEN WHAT IS HOLDING YOU? remeber why people end up in SAQAR in Jouhnam..... one of them isn't being able to help a maskeen person. I think your friend qualifies as that. please help your friend.
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glo
10-28-2006, 10:12 AM
Amen to the previous post!!

Your friend's husband has hit her, threatened her with a knife and forced her to have intercourse??!
regardless of what the Qu'ran says, this is not the behaviour of a loving and respecting husband!!!

This is clearly domestic violence - and you should support your friend in any way you can.
She should ring social services. There are safe houses for women (and children) who suffer at the hands of violent husbands/fathers, where she can stay under anonymity ina protected environment.

Please don't encourage your friend to stay in this situation - nobody should suffer abuse and fear, least of all in their own home! imsad
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Tania
10-28-2006, 10:17 AM
She has one solution: i heard on tv from women which were abused in foreign countries, regardless of their religion, or his religion. I want to say this apply to all religion :-[

1.Phone your parents - they can contact the loco police which will begin the procedure of recovering her from that town

2. Call the embassy - or if she is not yet locked inside of the house, run to the embassy. They will ensure the security until will get at home.
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AnonymousPoster
10-28-2006, 12:11 PM
Your friend's husband has hit her, threatened her with a knife and forced her to have intercourse??!
regardless of what the Qu'ran says, this is not the behaviour of a loving and respecting husband!!!
:rollseyes
i think after spending so much time in an islamic forum- you would know the Quran (and therefore Islam) does not support such actions

[BANANA]Based on what has been mentioned in the question, it is permissible for you to ask for a divorce (this is what is called khula’), because living with this man and anyone like him is something that is unbearable. Perhaps Allaah will compensate you with someone better than this man. If you cannot find another husband, then staying without a husband in your parents’ house, where you will be cared for and respected, will be better for you than staying with this man, so long as you do not fear that you will be tempted or will fall into haraam things. But if you fear that you may be tempted, then being patient and bearing worldly troubles by staying with this man will be better for you than having to bear the punishment of Allaah.

The reasons for which it is permissible for a woman to seek divorce (khula’) from her husband are mentioned in Question 1859 on this site.

And Allaah knows best.

Islam Q&A
Sheikh Muhammed Salih Al-Munajjid
[/BANANA]
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Kittygyal
10-28-2006, 12:16 PM
Assalamualikum warhmathullahi warbarakathuhu

am confused here because reading all this there are two "anonymous accounts" the same && talking to there self :confused:

walikumassalam warhmathullahi warbarakathuhu
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AnonymousPoster
10-28-2006, 12:23 PM
Originally Posted by Anonymous Tester
There are three SUBJECTS when you should report a case to the police. NO ONE IS EXEMPT NOT EVEN A MUSLIM MAN

1-CHILD ABUSE
2- SPOUSE ABUSE
3-ELDER ABUSE

PLEASE WHERE IS YOUR CONSCIOUS KNOWING THIS WOMAN IS SUFFERING ON THE HANDS OF A MAN WHO COULD POTENTIALLY KILL HER AND HAS NOT ONLY THREATENED BUT ABUSED HER PHYSICALLY? IF YOU WERE TRAPPED WITH A MONSTER AND YOUR FRIEND KNEW WOULD YOU NOT WISH FOR HER TO HELP YOU? FOR THE LOVE OF ALLAH, IF YOU REALLY CARE AND LOVE YOUR FRIEND YOU WILL DO THE RIGHT THING AND CALL SOME DOMESTIC ABUSE PLACE TO SAVE THIS WOMAN, DO IT AS AN ANONYMOUS, LIKE WE ARE DOING NOW TO OFFER YOU SANE ADVISE WITHOUT BEING JUDGED FOR OUR FIRM BELIEFS. IF THIS IS YOUR WAY OF GETTING A NUDGE TO DO IT, THEN WHAT IS HOLDING YOU? remeber why people end up in SAQAR in Jouhnam..... one of them isn't being able to help a maskeen person. I think your friend qualifies as that. please help your friend.
put ur emotions in the dunny for a moment...

4.35 And if you fear a breach between the two, then appoint judge from his people and a judge from her people; if they both desire agreement, Allah will effect harmony between them, surely Allah is Knowing, Aware.
since her family is not Muslim.

4.65 But no! by your Lord! they do not believe (in reality) until they make you a judge of that which has become a matter of disagreement among them, and then do not find any straitness in their hearts as to what you have decided and submit with entire submission.
cops don't judge by what the mesenger n Allah came with, do they? So best to get the Imam or sheikh involved... but see.. das y it sux when you hav a society where Islam isn't beign applied... there's no authority :(

salamz
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glo
10-28-2006, 01:27 PM
Originally Posted by Anonymous Tester
:rollseyes
i think after spending so much time in an islamic forum- you would know the Quran (and therefore Islam) does not support such actions
That is what I thought ... all the more reason to support this poor sister in her hardship!

However, other posters seem not so sure that Islam does not support such actions ... :rollseyes :
Her husband has hit her in the face before, forced himself on her, I think that might be allowed, ...
There may be examples in which a female over abused her vanity in her appearance and needed to experience a painful retribution;
Those were the comments that prompted me to write 'regardless of what the Qu'ran says, ...'

Please don't judge me if I am igorant. I am trying to make sense of the Qu'ran. Seems I am not the only one who isn't always clear about it's teachings ...

Peace :)
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- Qatada -
10-28-2006, 01:35 PM
Originally Posted by glo
Please don't judge me if I am igorant. I am trying to make sense of the Qu'ran.

We don't judge the qur'an on what any person says, unless they have proof from the qur'an to backup what their saying. Therefore i feel that you shouldn't make any judgement of the qur'an, unless you have an understanding of what is said. Regardless of what the average person may think or say.

Therefore, i advise you to read the tafsir/explanation of the Qur'an from this link:

http://www.theholybook.org/en


That way, it won't offend no-one and you won't be guilty of your ignorance. :)



Peace.
Reply

glo
10-28-2006, 01:58 PM
Originally Posted by Fi_Sabilillah
We don't judge the qur'an on what any person says, unless they have proof from the qur'an to backup what their saying. Therefore i feel that you shouldn't make any judgement of the qur'an, unless you have an understanding of what is said. Regardless of what the average person may think or say.

Therefore, i advise you to read the tafsir/explanation of the Qur'an from this link:

http://www.theholybook.org/en
Thanks, Fi_Sabilillah :)

The link opens a general Qu'ranic search engine. Is that what you wanted me to have?
Or was the link meant to be to a site answering the original question about the appropriateness of physical violence within a marital relationship?

What does the Qu'ran say about a husband having intercourse with his wife against her wishes? About hitting her in the face? And about threatening her with a knife?

Did you give me the above link so I can find out for myself?

That way, it won't offend no-one and you won't be guilty of your ignorance. :)

Peace.
Thank you, brother! :)

Peace
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- Qatada -
10-28-2006, 02:12 PM
Hi glo.


I pasted that link because theres links there which give a tafsir/explanation of the qur'an in detail, and i thought that it was what you may have been after.


Anyway, regarding your questions - you might be interested in listening to these lectures on women's rights in islam by yusuf estes. He uses the bible and the Qur'an to find the similarities, differences and also what society says regarding women's rights etc. If you're interested, you can take a look and he's likely to discuss the issues you addressed above too insha'Allaah.


You can download off:

http://www.islamicboard.com/islamic-...-lectures.html



Peace.
Reply

AnonymousPoster
10-28-2006, 05:09 PM
Originally Posted by Anonymous Tester
put ur emotions in the dunny for a moment...
I am sorry? I don't know what putting my emotions in the "dunny" for a while is going to do for this lady? if you are the person who posted the first query, I am baffled as to why you'd seek help on a cyber counseling forum, if disinterested in the replies you'd get?

I hope you'll do the right thing!

:w:

Originally Posted by Kittygyal
Assalamualikum warhmathullahi warbarakathuhu

am confused here because reading all this there are two "anonymous accounts" the same && talking to there self :confused:

walikumassalam warhmathullahi warbarakathuhu
I am not the one who posted the query!
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Dawud_uk
10-30-2006, 08:34 AM
assalaamu alaykum,

islam is a practical deen, the person asking this question should take her in or see someone else pious and trustworthy takes her in.

what is more this 'brother' should be dealt with because if the fear of Allah through persausion will not work then the fear of a fresh beating might as sad as that is to say.

once she is out of the situation there are people she can contact for help if the local imams cannot or will not help.

for example in the uk there is the shariah council who act in the position of qadi (islamic judge) where the locals refuse to act correctly.

subhanallah it is sad that it has come to this and the community around her will be held accountable if she could have been helped and they didnt do their duty towards their sister in islam.

assalaamu alaykum,
Abu Abdullah
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Pk_#2
10-30-2006, 09:59 AM
Ameen to the du'a!

:(

May Allah help you to help your freind! :)
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Snowflake
10-30-2006, 10:42 AM
To the original poster - please take this seriously.

If you can't or don't want to get involved personally, I am willing to do it. I am not even scared of the sister's bully of a husband and will 'sort' him out if I have to!

How I get to the sister is my headache which I know how to sort out. If you want me to help her practically, PM me your email add. and we'll take it from there. Let's not wait for another bruise to appear before helping her.
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AvarAllahNoor
10-30-2006, 10:47 AM
Originally Posted by Anonymous Tester

Her husband has hit her in the face before, forced himself on her, I think that might be allowed, as in she has to be intimate when he wants unless she has a reason like illnes,
allowed??? Which insane person told you that:?
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Malaikah
10-30-2006, 10:56 AM
Originally Posted by Anonymous Tester
I am sorry? I don't know what putting my emotions in the "dunny" for a while is going to do for this lady? if you are the person who posted the first query, I am baffled as to why you'd seek help on a cyber counseling forum, if disinterested in the replies you'd get?
:sl:

dont be confused, its pretty obvious from the writting stlye that they are different people.

Originally Posted by AvarAllahNoor
allowed??? Which insane person told you that:?
some things get passed off as part of the religion even though they never were.. weird. :rollseyes
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AvarAllahNoor
10-30-2006, 10:57 AM
Originally Posted by Muslimah_Sis
To the original poster - please take this seriously.

If you can't or don't want to get involved personally, I am willing to do it. I am not even scared of the sister's bully of a husband and will 'sort' him out if I have to!

How I get to the sister is my headache which I know how to sort out. If you want me to help her practically, PM me your email add. and we'll take it from there. Let's not wait for another bruise to appear before helping her.
Waheguru Ji Ka Khalsa Waheguru Je Ke Fateh.

Now this is a true muslim sister....Helping those that need it .:)

Waheguru Ji Ka Khalsa Waheguru Je Ke Fateh.
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