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AnonymousPoster
10-29-2006, 08:41 AM
:sl:

i got dis friend... n she does sum haram stuff and when she mentions that she did something like she wents movies or something n i tell her 'nah u know thats not right' and then she acts like 'yeh i know one day inshaallah ill be better' but then if i tell her thats not the way it works u need to take initiative to be better n not just wait for it to magically happen... n then she gets annoyed and says im 2 pushy :cry:

i need help.. how can i make my point but not be seem 'pushy'?
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lolwatever
10-29-2006, 08:53 AM
Originally Posted by Anonymous Tester
:sl:

i got dis friend... n she does sum haram stuff and when she mentions that she did something like she wents movies or something n i tell her 'nah u know thats not right' and then she acts like 'yeh i know one day inshaallah ill be better' but then if i tell her thats not the way it works u need to take initiative to be better n not just wait for it to magically happen... n then she gets annoyed and says im 2 pushy :cry:

i need help.. how can i make my point but not be seem 'pushy'?
salams sis
mashalah great to c you're being a sincere friend towards her,
there's so many ppl like that unfortunately...

remind her that proscastination is exactly what all the people of hell will be regretting.

The Day that their faces will be turned upside down in the Fire, they will say: "Woe to us! Would that we had obeyed Allah and obeyed the Messenger." Ahzab
also.. remind her that it's just too late when she's stretched on her death bed and she's looking at the two dark faced angels staring at her informing her of the punishments that await her.

27.If thou couldst but see when they are confronted with the Fire! They will say: "Would that we were but sent back! Then would we not reject the signs of our Lord, but would be amongst those who believe!"

28. Yea, in their own (eyes) will become manifest what before they concealed. But if they were returned, they would certainly relapse to the things they were forbidden, for they are indeed liars.

30. If thou couldst but see when they are confronted with their Lord! He will say: "Is not this the truth?" They will say: "Yea, by our Lord!" He will say: "Taste ye then the penalty, because ye rejected Faith."
an'3am

That's very very few from many verses..... and remind her strongly that those verses are about people like her, coz they knew it was the truth butkept delaying and only seriously regret it when they see the punishment b4 their eyes.

And tell her that there's no guarentee that death isn't around the corner, many have died (young and old) all of a sudden in car crashes, in their sleep, heart attacks.. you name it... tell her that you want the best for her and that she shouldn't be risking her akhirah over a 1 hour cheap thrill.

n tell her 'if the messenger was here advising you, would u be saying he's too pushy? just like wat his enemies kept telling him?'

hope that helps.. feel free 2 ask if u need nefn else in specific
all the best with it sis!
salams
Reply

lolwatever
10-29-2006, 09:16 AM
Originally Posted by Anonymous Tester
:sl:

i got dis friend... n she does sum haram stuff and when she mentions that she did something like she wents movies or something n i tell her 'nah u know thats not right' and then she acts like 'yeh i know one day inshaallah ill be better' but then if i tell her thats not the way it works u need to take initiative to be better n not just wait for it to magically happen... n then she gets annoyed and says im 2 pushy :cry:

i need help.. how can i make my point but not be seem 'pushy'?
By the way.... congrats for being called pushy... mashalah should remind you of this hadith:

I heard Allah's Apostle saying, "My example and the example of the people is that of a man who made a fire, and when it lighted what was around it, Moths and other insects started falling into the fire. The man tried (his best) to prevent them, (from falling in the fire) but they overpowered him and rushed into the fire. The Prophet added: Now, similarly, I take hold of the knots at your waist (belts) to prevent you from falling into the Fire, but you insist on falling into it."
so don't see that as something negativ :D ur tryin 2 drag ur mate away fromt he punishment, how can being pushy be a bad thing :)
Reply

AnonymousPoster
10-29-2006, 09:59 AM
Originally Posted by Anonymous Tester
:sl:

i got dis friend... n she does sum haram stuff and when she mentions that she did something like she wents movies or something n i tell her 'nah u know thats not right' and then she acts like 'yeh i know one day inshaallah ill be better' but then if i tell her thats not the way it works u need to take initiative to be better n not just wait for it to magically happen... n then she gets annoyed and says im 2 pushy :cry:

i need help.. how can i make my point but not be seem 'pushy'?
:sl:
That is wonderful of you to warn your friend.
What is wrong with going to the movies though? I mean is she watching Harry potter...? Is she going to unwind for an hour or to pick up strange men?

May Allah Guide us all into the right path, InshaAllah.
:w:
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DigitalStorm82
10-29-2006, 10:00 AM
Your job is to give the message not enforce it...

If you enforce something... it may as well push her further away... be patient.
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AnonymousPoster
10-29-2006, 10:09 AM
Originally Posted by DigitalStorm82
Your job is to give the message not enforce it...

If you enforce something... it may as well push her further away... be patient.
Mashallah. Excellent advise! There is much to be learned of the human psyche. The same that drives children to the cookie jar when warned repeatedly of impending punishment from a parent. Also, when advising of perfection, we too are setting ourselves up for scrutiny, and being viewed with a microscope, so hopefully if we are calling for behavioral adjustment, hopefully we too can display it? otherwise it would be considered reaction formation, with a touch of hypocrisy?

:w:
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lolwatever
10-29-2006, 10:11 AM
Originally Posted by Anonymous Tester
Mashallah. Excellent advise! There is much to be learned of the human psyche. The same that drives children to the cookie jar when warned repeatedly of impending punishment from a parent. Also, when advising of perfection, we too are setting ourselves up for scrutiny, and being viewed with a microscope, so hopefully if we are calling for behavioral adjustment, hopefully we too can display it? otherwise it would be considered reaction formation, with a touch of hypocrisy?

:w:
sis personally i dont think that'st he logic you should be running on..

The companiosn would make dawah and enforce it to best of their ability... and keep nagging people to do it, that's the way of the prophet and the sahabah.

this isnt worldly issues where its not important if u dont enforce thigns.. its to do with getting roasted in the fire :offended:

recapping:

I heard Allah's Apostle saying, "My example and the example of the people is that of a man who made a fire, and when it lighted what was around it, Moths and other insects started falling into the fire. The man tried (his best) to prevent them, (from falling in the fire) but they overpowered him and rushed into the fire. The Prophet added: Now, similarly, I take hold of the knots at your waist (belts) to prevent you from falling into the Fire, but you insist on falling into it."
sahih
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DigitalStorm82
10-29-2006, 10:17 AM
Please be careful of what you say regarding this prophet and the companians...

2.256
There is no compulsion in religion. Verily, the Right Path has become distinct from the wrong path. Whoever disbelieves in Tâghût [2] and believes in Allâh, then he has grasped the most trustworthy handhold that will never break. And Allâh is All-Hearer, All-Knower.
Reply

lolwatever
10-29-2006, 10:19 AM
Originally Posted by DigitalStorm82
Please be careful of what you say regarding this prophet and the companians...

2.256
There is no compulsion in religion. Verily, the Right Path has become distinct from the wrong path. Whoever disbelieves in Tâghût [2] and believes in Allâh, then he has grasped the most trustworthy handhold that will never break. And Allâh is All-Hearer, All-Knower.
There's no compulsion in adopting a religion... But once you adopt a religion you're expected to follow it.

Otherwise why is there shareeah, y the need for a law if ppl can do wat they like n pick n choose from a religion?
Reply

Malaikah
10-29-2006, 10:26 AM
Originally Posted by Anonymous Tester
What is wrong with going to the movies though? I mean is she watching Harry potter...?
:sl:

Firstly, no matter what movie you are watching, it will have music. Music is haram. So unless you block your ears through the whole movie, then it is haram to watch it.

Secondly, the movies contain people acting in a way that is not allowed in Islam. Free-mixing between people of opposite genders, people not covering their awrah. For a female, you would have to look away if a character wasnt covering navel to knee. And even in Harry Potter, he comes out in shorts in one of the movies. So you would have to look away. Dont even get me started on how the women dress, lets just say the men will have to lower their gaze through out the whole movie.

So, combining those two, you have to block your eyes because of the music, and lower your gaze because they dont cover their awrah. So, I recommend you either sit there, deaf and blind, and make use of your three remaining senses and enjoy your popcorn, or just save yourself $20 and two hours.

Originally Posted by lolwatever
There's no compulsion in adopting a religion... But once you adopt a religion you're expected to follow it.

Otherwise why is there shareeah, y the need for a law if ppl can do wat they like n pick n choose from a religion?
:thumbs_up :thumbs_up :thumbs_up :bravo:
Reply

DigitalStorm82
10-29-2006, 10:27 AM
That is for an islamic state...

you cant really go around in western countries enforcing islamic law can you?

If you did... you'd have the taliban regieme all over again.
Reply

lolwatever
10-29-2006, 10:27 AM
Originally Posted by cheese
:sl:

Firstly, no matter what movie you are watching, it will have music. Music is haram. So unless you block your ears through the whole movie, then it is haram to watch it.

Secondly, the movies contain people acting in a way that is not allowed in Islam. Free-mixing between people of opposite genders, people not covering their awrah. For a female, you would have to look away if a character wasnt covering navel to knee. And even in Harry Potter, he comes out in shorts in one of the movies. So you would have to look away. Dont even get me started on how the women dress, lets just say the men will have to lower their gaze through out the whole movie.

So, combining those two, you have to block your eyes because of the music, and lower your gaze because they dont cover their awrah. So, I recommend you either sit their, deaf and blind and make use of your three remaining senses and enjoy your popcorn, or just save yourself $20 and two hours.
:lol: n males, block ur nose too, coz alot of women go cinemas wearing perfume :uuh:
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lolwatever
10-29-2006, 10:28 AM
Originally Posted by DigitalStorm82
That is for an islamic state...

you cant really go around in western countries enforcing islamic law can you?

If you did... you'd have the taliban regieme all over again.
Look at the companions in makkah.... islamic state just makes it easier to encourage ppl 2 practice teh religion, it's not a condition to apply religion... or to enforce it 2 best of ur ability.

salamz
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DigitalStorm82
10-29-2006, 10:38 AM
That was my point...

You cant force the religion on someone... even if they are the same religion.

Ex. You cant force your friend to make salaah... If he did pray because he was forced to pray.. he's praying for the wrong reasons..

But anyway... back to the original post... Just be patient and keep advising your friend to be better in deen... and make duah for your friend. That is the best thing you can do for your friend.
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Malaikah
10-29-2006, 10:38 AM
Originally Posted by DigitalStorm82
you cant really go around in western countries enforcing islamic law can you?
:sl:

Why not? You sure as hell can for those who are in your power, obviously though it would have to be within the boundaries of the law of the country you live in.

Some aspects, you cant, such as the specific punishments for crimes etc. However, for mundane issues such as that which was mentioned in the first post, such as going to the movies, you can. While you cant stop your friend from going, you can discourage it as much as you can, and you can stop your kids from going, because they are who you are responsible for.
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DigitalStorm82
10-29-2006, 10:44 AM
I agree... as much as the law of the country allows... I understand its a different situation when it comes to children...

But most western countries... well at least US has law which says "freedom of religion" so you cant enforce hijaab here for example...

We're just going in circles... and hijacking the thread... this will be my last post here.. regarding this shareeah business :)
Reply

AnonymousPoster
10-29-2006, 10:46 AM
Originally Posted by cheese
:sl:

Firstly, no matter what movie you are watching, it will have music. Music is haram. So unless you block your ears through the whole movie, then it is haram to watch it.

Secondly, the movies contain people acting in a way that is not allowed in Islam. Free-mixing between people of opposite genders, people not covering their awrah. For a female, you would have to look away if a character wasnt covering navel to knee. And even in Harry Potter, he comes out in shorts in one of the movies. So you would have to look away. Dont even get me started on how the women dress, lets just say the men will have to lower their gaze through out the whole movie.

So, combining those two, you have to block your eyes because of the music, and lower your gaze because they dont cover their awrah. So, I recommend you either sit there, deaf and blind, and make use of your three remaining senses and enjoy your popcorn, or just save yourself $20 and two hours.



:thumbs_up :thumbs_up :thumbs_up :bravo:
There are different opinions on whether or not music is Haram. Secondly, though I agree that some choices of movies are abhorrent, some are educational and some are even suitable for children. That is why God gave us a brain with which to discern and make appropriate choices for ourselves.
The prophet SAW also did say:
"Rawi'ho 'ann qolobikim sa'atan Ba'ad sa'aa" unwind the heart for an hour.
if you make religion very hard for yourself, you are bound to set yourself up for tribulations. Watching a movie, hardly equates with not praying, not fasting, and not giving alms. Worst yet judging people on their behaviour isn't very islamic either, I agree one should warn and advise, but not expect people to be carbon copies of oneself.

The Prophet said: 'Blessed is he who preoccupies himself with his own defects, rather than those of others.' (Musnad Al-Bazzâr)
The Prophet said: 'Make things easy (for people) and do not make them difficult, and cheer people up and do not drive them away.' (Sahîh Bukhârî, Sahîh Muslim)

lastly, what makes you think I am a sister? maybe I am a brother?
If you wish to be obeyed then advise with that, which can be enforced. Old Arabic adage.
:w:
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Malaikah
10-29-2006, 10:52 AM
Originally Posted by Anonymous Tester
Secondly, though I agree that some choices of movies are abhorrent, some are educational and some are even suitable for children.
:sl:

I doubt Hollywood produces many movies suitable for children. And i wasnt talking about educational movies anyway. They obviously fall into a different category. And even then they contain haram stuff in them, but then again that is only because we are limited in our choices, there arent many good kids films that i know of which are produced by Muslims in accordance to Islamic standards.

if you make religion very hard for yourself, you are bound to set yourself up for tribulations.
Avoiding sins isnt not the same as making the religion hard for oneself.

Watching a movie, hardly equates with not praying, not fasting, and not giving alms.
So? A lot of sins dont equat to that either, such as being a liar. But its still a sin.

Worst yet judging people on their behaviour isn't very islamic either,
Who did i judge? :uuh:

take care :)

:w:
Reply

lolwatever
10-29-2006, 11:02 AM
Originally Posted by Anonymous Tester
There are different opinions on whether or not music is Haram. Secondly, though I agree that some choices of movies are abhorrent, some are educational and some are even suitable for children. That is why God gave us a brain with which to discern and make appropriate choices for ourselves.
The prophet SAW also did say:
"Rawi'ho 'ann qolobikim sa'atan Ba'ad sa'aa" unwind the heart for an hour.
if you make religion very hard for yourself, you are bound to set yourself up for tribulations. Watching a movie, hardly equates with not praying, not fasting, and not giving alms. Worst yet judging people on their behaviour isn't very islamic either, I agree one should warn and advise, but not expect people to be carbon copies of oneself.

The Prophet said: 'Blessed is he who preoccupies himself with his own defects, rather than those of others.' (Musnad Al-Bazzâr)
The Prophet said: 'Make things easy (for people) and do not make them difficult, and cheer people up and do not drive them away.' (Sahîh Bukhârî, Sahîh Muslim)

lastly, what makes you think I am a sister? maybe I am a brother?
If you wish to be obeyed then advise with that, which can be enforced. Old Arabic adage.
:w:
Allah said he will put us through tribulations and tests... to see who will be serious from those who are jokers... (read the opening verses of surat ankabut)............

so ofcourse.. if the sister who posted the question didnt wanna be from the people who are firm on the truth, she can twist n decieve herself into thinking dawah, enjoinin good n forbiddin evil isn't important and hence rid herself of the test (for a few years till she meets Allah).

salams
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AnonymousPoster
10-29-2006, 11:06 AM
Originally Posted by cheese
:sl:

I doubt Hollywood produces many movies suitable for children. And i wasnt talking about educational movies anyway. They obviously fall into a different category. And even then they contain haram stuff in them, but then again that is only because we are limited in our choices, there arent many good kids films that i know of which are produced by Muslims in accordance to Islamic standards.:
Hence I did state, we have a brain with which to discern. Also hence I said not all movies are suitable. and lastly, Not every movie produced is made in hollywood.



Originally Posted by cheese
:Avoiding sins isnt not the same as making the religion hard for oneself. .:
Guess it all depends on what your definition is of sin then? Just read another poster where someone feels like they are losing their faith? I believe that is a tribulation that is inevitable if one doesn't make a suitable hobby for themselves outside the realm of religion. At least an hour a day of some recreational activty within the guidelines of Islam, is sure to keep a good balance. Some argue that boxing for example is Haram, I am not sure why it would be? some Argue writing poetry is Haram, again I am not sure why it would be? What is wrong with making an hour for yourself to establish balance? or in using a gift that God has bestowed upon you?

Originally Posted by cheese
:So? A lot of sins dont equat to that either, such as being a liar. But its still a sin. .:
You have clearly answered your ownself here. watching a movie, is hardly the same as other cardinal sins that are known and universal. lying, stealing, cheating, not preforming your rituals. None can hardly equate with watching a movie.



Originally Posted by cheese
:Who did i judge? :uuh:

take care :)

:w:
Someone here keeps addressing me as sister? maybe it is the other gentleman, my apologies.

You too take care please
:w:
Reply

AnonymousPoster
10-29-2006, 11:12 AM
Originally Posted by lolwatever
Allah said he will put us through tribulations and tests... to see who will be serious from those who are jokers... (read the opening verses of surat ankabut)............

so ofcourse.. if the sister who posted the question didnt wanna be from the people who are firm on the truth, she can twist n decieve herself into thinking dawah, enjoinin good n forbiddin evil isn't important and hence rid herself of the test (for a few years till she meets Allah).

salams
true! but boy, am I eternally ecstatic that you will not be the one judging me or others come the day of reckoning. "Da'o Alkhalq lilkhaliq"
Best in general to lead by example rather than screaming and warning. Eventually people become the company they keep, if one is a good example, one is bound to rebuff off on others without the verbal whip.
:D
:w:
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lolwatever
10-29-2006, 11:14 AM
Originally Posted by Anonymous Tester
true! but boy, am I eternally ecstatic that you will not be the one judging me or others come the day of reckoning. "Da'o Alkhalq lilkhaliq"
Best in general to lead by example rather than screaming and warning. Eventually people become the company they keep, if one is a good example, one is bound to rebuff off on others without the verbal whip.
:D
:w:

the prophet lead by example and action.... wanna giv him a verbal lashing 4 not only leading by xample :offended:

Allah said such things are a sin and people who do it get sinned, i'm not making the judgement... you are!

yes allah is merciful, but treating allah as if he's something that can be decieved n tricked isn't an easy thing, i don't think you feel sorry for people who will enter hell over sins!! you talk as if you think hell is somethign real easy 2 go thru and ppl should be free to feel the experiecne!!!!! :offended:
salam
Reply

AnonymousPoster
10-29-2006, 11:18 AM
Originally Posted by lolwatever
edit
I will not defend or attest against anything which I am not sure of its nature. It is heresay. Two sides to every story. Her friend could have been watching a documentary on the horrors of war for all I know Or some Japanese Anime?

take care inshallah
:w:
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Malaikah
10-29-2006, 11:19 AM
Originally Posted by Anonymous Tester
Best in general to lead by example rather than screaming and warning. Eventually people become the company they keep, if one is a good example, one is bound to rebuff off on others without the verbal whip.
:sl:

you know i can honestly say from experience that this is soooo not true, at least not for me anyway, almost everytime i have made a change for the better was because so one told me to, and encouraged me to, not because i just saw them doing it.

you just have to warn ppl and tell them or else they will be clueless and just continue sinning as if nothing is wrong cos its never brought to their attention.

to the thread starter, keep at it, be strong but smart and direct at the same time and never forget the hell fire that God has promised those who do not deserve his mercy
Reply

AnonymousPoster
10-29-2006, 11:22 AM
Originally Posted by lolwatever
the prophet lead by example and action.... wanna giv him a verbal lashing 4 not only leading by xample :offended:

Allah said such things are a sin and people who do it get sinned, i'm not making the judgement... you are!

yes allah is merciful, but treating allah as if he's something that can be decieved n tricked isn't an easy thing, i don't think you feel sorry for people who will enter hell over sins!! you talk as if you think hell is somethign real easy 2 go thru and ppl should be free to feel the experiecne!!!!! :offended:
salam
1- please have some respect for God and the prophet and don't compare them to humans who dwell in the forum.
2- I don't see anywhere in the Quran nor sunnah, where it states movies are Haram!
2- Yes Alhmdlilah God is merciful and all knowing and doesn't run the universe by your standards.
what do you know about who is going where?
have you not read of the parable of the man who accused another of sinning so much that God would never forgive him his sins. God ended up forgiving he who sinned but not the one who had vain hopes that God wouldn't forgive.

I have nothing more on this subject so you may go ahead and have the last of it, should it please you!
:w:
Reply

AnonymousPoster
10-29-2006, 11:26 AM
Originally Posted by Anonymous Tester
From other posts, I find that you tend to dwell in generalities. I will not defend or attest against anything which I am not sure of its nature. It is heresay. Two sides to every story. Her friend could have been watching a documentary on the horrors of war for all I know Or some Japanese Anime?
:sl:

thank u every1 for ur advice, helps a lot. may allah guide us all to the right path n forgive us n make us strong in our ability to advice n see wrong from right

my friend wasnt watching somethin good, it was some kind of horror flick n she watches heaps of movies n tv shows and stuff, listens to cheap western music 2, da otha day she mentioned she wanted 2 watch some romance movie yuk, why would i tell her off for watching a good documentary? dats not even a movie in da 1st place
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AnonymousPoster
10-29-2006, 11:28 AM
Originally Posted by cheese
:sl:

you know i can honestly say from experience that this is soooo not true, at least not for me anyway, almost everytime i have made a change for the better was because so one told me to, and encouraged me to, not because i just saw them doing it.

you just have to warn ppl and tell them or else they will be clueless and just continue sinning as if nothing is wrong cos its never brought to their attention.

to the thread starter, keep at it, be strong but smart and direct at the same time and never forget the hell fire that God has promised those who do not deserve his mercy
Never forget that God's mercy and gentleness superceeds his punishment.

فَذَكِّرْ إِنَّمَا أَنتَ مُذَكِّرٌ {21}
[Pickthal 88:21] Remind them, for thou art but a remembrancer,

لَّسْتَ عَلَيْهِم بِمُصَيْطِرٍ {22}
[Pickthal 88:22] Thou art not at all a warder over them.
with that, I bid you well
:w:
Reply

lolwatever
10-29-2006, 11:29 AM
Originally Posted by Anonymous Tester
1- please have some respect for God and the prophet and don't compare them to humans who dwell in the forum.
2- I don't see anywhere in the Quran nor sunnah, where it states movies are Haram!
i don't c ne where saying crack cocaine is haram.... not? :X
it's called qiyas sis.... in fiqh, wats movie composed of, music, free mixin n watever else... does islam say they're haram, no? then you base the judgement on movies from there..

dere u go.. mini crash course on fiqh lol.

2- Yes Alhmdlilah God is merciful and all knowing and doesn't run the universe by your standards.
And allah also punishes people, you seem to have no fear of his punishment wat so ever!!!! I'm not condemin u 2 hell, but your behaviour is exactly like the hypocrites who keep underestimating Allah and his punishments!!

Allah says 'tell my servants that i am the gracious most merciful, and that my punishment is indeed the most tormentful punishment' u4got the bit in bold innit :?


what do you know about who is going where?
I'm not saying anyone is going to hell.. i'm just describin the actions of the ppl of hell, i quoted verses, go argue with the verses i quoted n hnadiths, not me!

have you not read of the parable of the man who accused another of sinning so much that God would never forgive him his sins. God ended up forgiving he who sinned but not the one who had vain hopes that God wouldn't forgive.
yep, where did i say allah wanst gonna 4giv the sis?!

I have nothing more on this subject so you may go ahead and have the last of it, should it please you!
ah... how ppl luv missin the point.... :uhwhat
:w:
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Malaikah
10-29-2006, 11:31 AM
Originally Posted by Anonymous Tester
1- please have some respect for God and the prophet and don't compare them to humans who dwell in the forum.
:sl:

ya allah! :offended: the prophet is our example!! of course we refer back to him!
2- I don't see anywhere in the Quran nor sunnah, where it states movies are Haram!
If the content is haram, how can the movie not be haram? I dont see why you are being so defensive because lolwatever is so obviously talking about the types of movies that you said are not good!

2- Yes Alhmdlilah God is merciful and all knowing and doesn't run the universe by your standards.
AllahuAkbar! :D
have you not read of the parable of the man who accused another of sinning so much that God would never forgive him his sins. God ended up forgiving he who sinned but not the one who had vain hopes that God wouldn't forgive.
That doesnt give anyone and excuse to sin.

dont stress yourself out!! :)

:w:
Reply

lolwatever
10-29-2006, 11:31 AM
Originally Posted by Anonymous Tester
Never forget that God's mercy and gentleness superceeds his punishment.

فَذَكِّرْ إِنَّمَا أَنتَ مُذَكِّرٌ {21}
[Pickthal 88:21] Remind them, for thou art but a remembrancer,

لَّسْتَ عَلَيْهِم بِمُصَيْطِرٍ {22}
[Pickthal 88:22] Thou art not at all a warder over them.
with that, I bid you well
:w:
xactly, the prophet done his job by being pushy to hsi uncle... but when his uncle died not listening, the prophet was sad, but done his bit, so allah sent that verse so the prophet doesnt stress about things beyond his capacity!

otherwise y was the prophet told 'waddoo law tudhinu fa yudhinoon' (surat noon), (they wish you moderate a lil so they can compromise with u)

salam
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AhlaamBella
10-29-2006, 11:33 AM
*raises one eyebrow* I think AnonymousGender needs to calm down. The brother is trying to help so try not to bite his head off lol :)
Reply

lolwatever
10-29-2006, 11:45 AM
gettin bak 2 the topic... i hope the sis doesnt lose hope after seein this disagreement :(.... i think we alllll agree that she should keep it up and encourage her friend to get off her bad habits inshaAllah

'wa ta-awanoo alal birri wataqwaa walaa ta'3awanu '3alal ithmi wal 'udwaani '

(and cooperate on goodness n piety and dont cooperate on sins and opression and disboebedience of the messenger)

i hope you keep it up sis... its great being pushy fee sabililah inshalah...

"Whoever seeks the pleasure of Allah through the anger of people, Allah will make him sufficient of the plots of the people. And whosoever seeks the pleasure of people through the anger of Allah, Allah will make him a dependent on people and never attain their complete pleasure with him."

sahih.
salams :)
Reply

Malaikah
10-29-2006, 11:47 AM
Originally Posted by Anonymous Tester
I hope that you have or marry a patient good wife inshallah. Because, I personally don't find gentleness nor patience to be in your traits.
:sl:

well then isnt it good that he wont allow his wife to sin? :? i reckon his appraoch was fine
Reply

lolwatever
10-29-2006, 11:52 AM
lol i didnt c that post...

Originally Posted by Anonymous Tester
From other posts, I find that you tend to dwell in generalities. I will not defend or attest against anything which I am not sure of its nature. It is heresay. Two sides to every story. Her friend could have been watching a documentary on the horrors of war for all I know Or some Japanese Anime?
ok ... well besdies the fact that ur fallin bak on ur statement (first u where defendin harry porry), now ur sayin perhaps she was referrin 2 that...

i'm very very wrong and sorry if the anon poster was referrin 2 halal documentaries that didnt contain anything unislamic.

I hope that you have or marry a patient good wife inshallah. Because, I personally don't find gentleness nor patience to be in your traits.:rollseyes
take care inshallah
:w:
ameen:D

checkout my userpage, tryin 2put up with alot :p my patience trainin ground ... ill get there eventually...:hiding:
Reply

Malaikah
10-29-2006, 11:55 AM
:sl:

^she wasnt:

Originally Posted by Anonymous Tester
:sl:

thank u every1 for ur advice, helps a lot. may allah guide us all to the right path n forgive us n make us strong in our ability to advice n see wrong from right

my friend wasnt watching somethin good, it was some kind of horror flick n she watches heaps of movies n tv shows and stuff, listens to cheap western music 2, da otha day she mentioned she wanted 2 watch some romance movie yuk, why would i tell her off for watching a good documentary? dats not even a movie in da 1st place
Reply

lolwatever
10-29-2006, 12:05 PM
oh i missed that too... ill pretend i didnt c it just 2 not b accused of bein quick to take bak my apologies :p
Reply

AnonymousPoster
10-29-2006, 06:26 PM
Originally Posted by lolwatever
i don't c ne where saying crack cocaine is haram.... not? :X:
I guess it depends on what it is you do with the cocaine? Cocaine like lidocaine and benzocaine can be used as an anesthetic for surgeries. it is a poweful vaso-constrictor so can be used in neck and face surgery as it reduces bleeding and numbs the pain! So I hope that puts a dent in lots of theories? you can use a knife to kill someone and again you can use it excise a tumor? You can use TV to watch porn, and you can use it to expand your knowledge. You can use the inernet for evil and you can use it for good! Please try to establish some middle ground.


Originally Posted by lolwatever
dere u go.. mini crash course on fiqh lol.:
it would be my pleasure. But I am humbled by all your knowledge and I don't think I can hold a candle to you.



Originally Posted by lolwatever
And allah also punishes people, you seem to have no fear of his punishment wat so ever!!!! I'm not condemin u 2 hell, but your behaviour is exactly like the hypocrites who keep underestimating Allah and his punishments!!:
Thank you. How so very kind!

Originally Posted by lolwatever
Allah says 'tell my servants that i am the gracious most merciful, and that my punishment is indeed the most tormentful punishment' u4got the bit in bold innit :?:
Again! Thank God for your presence. We need you to remind us :)

:w:
Reply

The Ruler
10-29-2006, 06:30 PM
Originally Posted by Anonymous Tester
i need help.. how can i make my point but not be seem 'pushy'?
:sl:

haha...im the one facing that and i'm trying to give you advice lol :D...but anyways...

the thing that you gotta do is tell her that as muslims it is our duty to correct one another...the strength of our imaan is shown as to how we react to the things done around us...the weakest imaan is when a person sees someone do something wrong and just thinks about it as wrong and does nothing...the strongest sig of imaan is when a person stops that wrong doing with their own hands...nw trll her that that is exactly what you're doing :D...you're not being pushy, but trying to help her come out of her darkness :)

:w:
Reply

Malaikah
10-29-2006, 09:48 PM
Originally Posted by Anonymous Tester
it would be my pleasure. But I am humbled by all your knowledge and I don't think I can hold a candle to you.

Thank you. How so very kind!

Again! Thank God for your presence. We need you to remind us :)
:sl:

Are you for real or is this dripping with sarcasm? :uuh: :? It's hard to tell.
Reply

hakkerz
10-29-2006, 09:59 PM
Mashaalah..

Just a comment if i may. You try your best.

Allah guides not whom we love, but whom he chooses...

And those who choose to disbelieve, then do not let it upset you...

There is no compulsion in religion..

...All those are from the Quran..I honestly think that is your answer. The Quran is an amazing tool, you will find nearly all your answers in it, about life.

And...whats wrong with going to the movies out of interest?
Reply

hakkerz
10-29-2006, 10:04 PM
btw, that Aayat about, those who choose to disbelieve. That came down to prophet Ibrahim (AS) i think, correct me if im wrong. Point being, yes we should try and try, and never give up, but keep in mind, that a Prophet of Allah, with all his piety and knowledge, was unable to make his father believe. Dont have a go at yourself if you cant change her. At the same time, i think we all have a responsibility to care for our friends, and that is certainly good, and its nice you are looking out for her..

...Take care..hope it helps...

Asking Your Duuas
Reply

lolwatever
10-29-2006, 10:50 PM
Originally Posted by cheese
:sl:

Are you for real or is this dripping with sarcasm? :uuh: :? It's hard to tell.
nah (s)he's being serious.. i just realised, he/she one of those that hav gotten 2 the stage where they dunneed reminders :D too good 4 it :D

congrats whoever u are... came across v few ppl who r dat good :lol: i'm not one of those i must say :hiding:
Reply

lolwatever
10-29-2006, 10:52 PM
Originally Posted by hakkerz
Mashaalah..

Just a comment if i may. You try your best.

Allah guides not whom we love, but whom he chooses...

And those who choose to disbelieve, then do not let it upset you...

There is no compulsion in religion..

...All those are from the Quran..I honestly think that is your answer. The Quran is an amazing tool, you will find nearly all your answers in it, about life.

And...whats wrong with going to the movies out of interest?
salams bro, mashalha i luv the bit in bold :) jazak allah khayr great advise

as for the rest, all 3 points where covered in the lil discussion int he first few pages of this thread :)
http://www.islamicboard.com/cyber-co...le-advice.html

all the best akh (pls dont hack me :hiding: ) :p

salamz
Reply

lolwatever
10-29-2006, 11:55 PM
btw.. anon dude.. check this out.... wanna know why children of israel whre cursed?

005.078
Curses were pronounced on those among the Children of Israel who rejected Faith, by the tongue of David and of Jesus the son of Mary: because they disobeyed and persisted in excesses.

and why else?... read on..

005.079
Nor did they (usually) forbid one another the iniquities which they committed: evil indeed were the deeds which they did.
so wat makes us think that forbiddin evil is an exception on our ummah?

n ur crack analysis is just lame. as if i was referrin 2 medical applications... shesh, (and anyway, the prophet said in the hadith 'my ummah's cures where not made in haram', so that throws ur philosophications in the bin too...)

sorry if i'm being harsh... but your anonymous and ur still insisting on messing around with evidences, subhanallah.
salams...
Reply

AnonymousPoster
10-30-2006, 01:10 AM
Originally Posted by lolwatever
nah (s)he's being serious.. i just realised, he/she one of those that hav gotten 2 the stage where they dunneed reminders :D too good 4 it :D

congrats whoever u are... came across v few ppl who r dat good :lol: i'm not one of those i must say :hiding:
:sl:
I need my reminders from those who are sincere. Those who have scholarly knowledge. And know how to use it wisely. Those who are upright and have "roshd". And those who DON'T JUDGE OTHERS AS IF THEY HAVE GUARANTEED THEMSELVES A PALACE IN HEAVEN. Those who don't reduce themselves to finger pointing and name calling. Those who don't make visible the sins of others lest they themselves engage in folly.
If you were one to accept advise as you so claim, then start by changing your manners of speech and the way you engage others.
Mu'awiyah ibn al-Hakam al-Sulami said: 'By my father and mother, (I swear that) I never saw a teacher, before or after him, who was a better teacher than the Messenger of Allah. By God, he never shouted at me, or punished me, or insulted me.' (Sunan Ad-Dârimî)

I am tired of this imsad ! how about you?
:w:
Reply

lolwatever
10-30-2006, 01:15 AM
Originally Posted by Anonymous Tester
:sl:
I need my reminders from those who are sincere. Those who have scholarly knowledge. And know how to use it wisely. Those who are upright and have "roshd". And those who DON'T JUDGE OTHERS AS IF THEY HAVE GUARANTEED THEMSELVES A PALACE IN HEAVEN. Those who don't reduce themselves to finger pointing and name calling. Those who don't make visible the sins of others lest they themselves engage in folly.
If you were one to accept advise as you so claim, then start by changing your manners of speech and the way you engage others.
Mu'awiyah ibn al-Hakam al-Sulami said: 'By my father and mother, (I swear that) I never saw a teacher, before or after him, who was a better teacher than the Messenger of Allah. By God, he never shouted at me, or punished me, or insulted me.' (Sunan Ad-Dârimî)

I am tired of this imsad ! how about you?
:w:
salams bro/sis

i'm really really really reeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeealllllll llly sorry if i name called u nefn or said that i hav a place reserved in jannah. like i am honestly n sincerely sorry 4 that if das how i came across :cry:

i must say i'm far from thinking that i'm reserved jannah! i hope Allah grants me jannah tho from his mercy ameen!!! i've got so many shortcomings its not funny... and my behaviour here is perhaps one of many...

however i kindly ask you put aside my bad behaviour n look at wat i said critically inshalah :)

reeeally sorry once again..

take care all the best
salams :)

ps: again witha ll due respect, i'm not a scholar, or even worth half a hair of a scholar, but i just quoted to you simple things from what allah n his messenger said... dawah isnt restricted to the scholars, everyone should deliver watever they know.. even if its a verse.. as the hadith said.
Reply

AnonymousPoster
10-30-2006, 01:28 AM
Originally Posted by lolwatever
salams bro/sis

i'm really really really reeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeealllllll llly sorry if i name called u nefn or said that i hav a place reserved in jannah. like i am honestly n sincerely sorry 4 that if das how i came across :cry:

i must say i'm far from thinking that i'm reserved jannah! i hope Allah grants me jannah tho from his mercy ameen!!! i've got so many shortcomings its not funny... and my behaviour here is perhaps one of many...

however i kindly ask you put aside my bad behaviour n look at wat i said critically inshalah :)

reeeally sorry once again..

take care all the best
salams :)

ps: again witha ll due respect, i'm not a scholar, or even worth half a hair of a scholar, but i just quoted to you simple things from what allah n his messenger said... dawah isnt restricted to the scholars, everyone should deliver watever they know.. even if its a verse.. as the hadith said.
:sl: brother
please don't apologize. It makes me feel bad too. I am not arguing against anything you stated if you would really play close look, we are stating the same things but have very different methods in approach. I don't know that mine is correct? but from expereince I tend to find people more responsive if I approach with gentility. If I come across with wa'eed and Inzhar and a big stick, they make a 180 degree turn. that is horrible. I notice even my brother and my dad changed their methods with time. It is called wisdom. instead of getting a knife out to warn someone, they bestow gentle reminders. I know some argue against leading by example but I still believe it is best. If your friend who is loosely moraled finds you not wanting to engage in poor choices and questionable activities, he/she will eventually come around or risk losing you. As for things where there is question and may fall on the cusp of either Haram/ Halal, will it is best to MAKE IJTIHAD, and really approach with best intention. Since God looks at your heart and knows whether or not you are being sincere or deceptive :)
:w:
:w:
Reply

lolwatever
10-30-2006, 01:35 AM
Originally Posted by Anonymous Tester
:sl: brother
please don't apologize. It makes me feel bad too. I am not arguing against anything you stated if you would really play close look, we are stating the same things but have very different methods in approach. I don't know that mine is correct? but from expereince I tend to find people more responsive if I approach with gentility. If I come across with wa'eed and Inzhar and a big stick, they make a 180 degree turn. that is horrible. I notice even my brother and my dad changed their methods with time. It is called wisdom. instead of getting a knife out to warn someone, they bestow gentle reminders. I know some argue against leading by example but I still believe it is best. If your friend who is loosely moraled finds you not wanting to engage in poor choices and questionable activities, he/she will eventually come around or risk losing you. As for things where there is question and may fall on the cusp of either Haram/ Halal, will it is best to MAKE IJTIHAD, and really approach with best intention. Since God looks at your heart and knows whether or not you are being sincere or deceptive :)
:w:
:w:
-where did i say be harsh or don't be gentle :?
- where did i encourage gettin a big stick :?
- the sis is askin how 2not be pushy.... being pushy is different to carrying a stick n kicking their guts out.

The prophets where all "pushy" they never stopped reminding theri ppl even tho dat annoyed the hell out of them, yet they where polite but firm.

i just hope the sis keeps it up inshalah... the way she's goin is just fine. did she say she was being rude or bashing them up or wat not?

agree?
salam.
Reply

AnonymousPoster
10-30-2006, 01:51 AM
Originally Posted by lolwatever
-where did i say be harsh or don't be gentle :?
- where did i encourage gettin a big stick :?
- the sis is askin how 2not be pushy.... being pushy is different to carrying a stick n kicking their guts out.

The prophets where all "pushy" they never stopped reminding theri ppl even tho dat annoyed the hell out of them, yet they where polite but firm.

i just hope the sis keeps it up inshalah... the way she's goin is just fine. did she say she was being rude or bashing them up or wat not?

agree?
salam.
It is a feeling I get when reading your post. the "you are going to hell if you do this" or "don't do this", the you are a "hypocrite for saying this", the you forget that "God will punish you for sins". The hell's fire is awaiting.

forgive me for saying and this I write after much reflection: but fear of hell's fire isn't the only reason one should lead an upright life. It is also a love of being with God, the comfort one gets knowing God is with them, It is the feeling of wellness one gets from preforming things that would please God.

You see even though we know hell exists, we also know that heaven does too. So what is your motive? fear of hell's fire or love of being with God and eternity in the Gardens of bliss.

I am not saying ignore one in favor of the other. I am saying please have an equal dose of both to give yourself balance and not drive yourself into worldly trials and tribulations. By you I am being metphorical of course. Don't be so driven by fear. Anymore than you should be so driven by taking God for granted.

Other than that I totally agree with you.
over and out. as this has gone on to all sorts of tangents.
:w:
Reply

lolwatever
10-30-2006, 02:04 AM
salam. you didnt even answer ne of my questions.

Originally Posted by Anonymous Tester
It is a feeling I get when reading your post. the "you are going to hell if you do this" or "don't do this", the you are a "hypocrite for saying this", the you forget that "God will punish you for sins". The hell's fire is awaiting.
Instead of being all emotional, look into why i say wat i said and evaluate it. Is that what allah says or not! it's frustratin, ur goin in circles too much...

forgive me for saying and this I write after much reflection: but fear of hell's fire isn't the only reason one should lead an upright life. It is also a love of being with God, the comfort one gets knowing God is with them, It is the feeling of wellness one gets from preforming things that would please God.
Part of being on the side of Allah is to enjoin what he orders and forbid what he tells us to not do. I quoted you verses, go argue with them if you please. And tell god that he's wrong for cursing the children of israel for not forbidding evil. And you can go dictate to Allah what he should be pleased with and what he shouldn't.

That's the feeling i get from your posts.

You see even though we know hell exists, we also know that heaven does too. So what is your motive? fear of hell's fire or love of being with God and eternity in the Gardens of bliss.
Both, hence the verse i quoted a page or 2 back.. allah reminds us of his mercy and warns us from his punishment. We should be balanced. subhanallah this is way off topic man.

I am not saying ignore one in favor of the other. I am saying please have an equal dose of both to give yourself balance and not drive yourself into worldly trials and tribulations. By you I am being metphorical of course. Don't be so driven by fear. Anymore than you should be so driven by taking God for granted.
bro sis, i beg you stop it... i've covered this in previous posts already.... the sis in question is just doing her job by reminder her friend that wat she's doing in wrong. You're not encouraging her by saying she's imposing problems on herself.

It's a test from Allah and she's doing well the way she is...

I quoted verses and hadiths, When someone is doing a bad thing, you don't go telling them 'oh dont worry alalh will granmt you jannah and you'll be forgiven, keep it up its ok darling'. That's NOT enjoinign good and forbidding evil.

Subhanallah man!!! For every situation there is a way to handle it, if you do that you're no diff 2 the children of israel, once agian, go argue with the verses i quoted, don't take a go at me.

Other than that I totally agree with you.
over and out. as this has gone on to all sorts of tangents.
Good. Now khalas, back to topic.
:w:
Reply

Malaikah
10-31-2006, 05:05 AM
:sl:

Just in case the original poster needs some arguments to support her stance:

Question:
Is watching TV permitted in Islaam ? If so under what coditions ?

Answer:
Praise be to Allaah.

The issue of watching films is not free from numerous reservations from a shar’i point of view, such as uncovering ‘awraat, listening to music, spreading corrupt beliefs and calling for imitation of the kuffaar.

---

Hence Shaykh Ibn Baaz (may Allaah have mercy on him) said in al-Fataawa 3/227:

With regard to television, it is a dangerous device and its harmful effects are very great, like those of the cinema, or even worse. We know from the research that has been written about it and from the words of experts in Arab countries and elsewhere enough to indicate that it is dangerous and very harmful to Islamic beliefs (‘aqeedah), morals and the state of society. This is because it includes the presentation of bad morals, tempting scenes, immoral pictures, semi-nakedness, destructive speech, and Kufr. It encourages imitation of their conduct and ways of dressing, respect for their leaders, neglect of Islamic conduct and ways of dressing, and looking down on the scholars and heroes of Islam. It damages their image by portraying them in an off-putting manner that makes people despise them and ignore them. It shows people how to cheat, steal, hatch plots and commit acts of violence against others. Undoubtedly anything that produces so many bad results should be stopped and shunned, and we have to close all the doors that could lead to it. If some of our brothers denounce it and speak out against it, we cannot blame them, because this is a part of sincerity towards Allaah and towards other people.

Whoever thinks that this device (TV) can be free of these evils and can be used only for good purposes if it is censored properly is exaggerating and is making a big mistake, because the censor may miss things and most people nowadays want to imitate the foreigners. It is very rare to find censors who are doing their job properly, especially nowadays when most people are only interested in time-wasting entertainment and things that turn people away from true guidance. Reality bears witness to that.

We ask Allaah to keep us safe from all evil for He is the Most Generous.

Islam Q&A
Sheikh Muhammed Salih Al-Munajjid
Reply

AnonymousPoster
11-02-2006, 09:36 AM
shwo this 2ur mate, pretty powerful...i wish it wasnt caps.. but neway:

IF THE PROPHET (Peace be upon him)* VISITED YOU,
JUST FOR A DAY OR TWO,
IF HE CAME UNEXPECTEDLY,
I WONDER WHAT YOU WOULD DO.
OH, I KNOW, YOU'D GIVE HIM YOUR NICEST ROOM,
TO SUCH AN HONOURED GUEST;
AND ALL THE FOOD YOU'D SERVE HIM,
WOULD BE THE VERY BEST.
AND, YOU WOULD KEEP ASSURING HIM,
YOU ARE GLAD TO HAVE HIM THERE,
THAT SERVING HIM IN YOUR HOME,
IS JOY BEYOND COMPARE.
BUT... WHEN YOU SAW HIM COMING,
WOULD YOU MEET HIM AT THE DOOR.
WITH ARMS OUTSTRETCHED IN WELCOME,
TO YOUR VISITOR?
OR...WOULD YOU HAVE TO CHANGE YOUR CLOTHES,
BEFORE YOU LET HIM IN?
OR HIDE SOME MAGAZINES AND PUT,
THE QURAN WHERE THEY HAD BEEN?
WOULD YOU STILL WATCH FORBIDDEN MOVIES,
ON YOUR TV SET?
OR WOULD YOU RUSH TO SWITCH IT OFF,
BEFORE HE GETS UPSET?
WOULD YOU TURN OFF THE RADIO,
AND HOPE HE HADN'T HEARD?
AND HOPE HE HADN'T UTTERED,
THE LAST LOUD, HASTY WORD?
WOULD YOU HIDE YOUR WORDLY MUSIC,
AND INSTEAD TAKE HADITH BOOKS OUT?
COULD YOU LET HIM WALK RIGHT IN,
OR WOULD YOU RUSH ABOUT?
AND, I WONDER... IF THE PROPHET* SPENT,
A DAY OR TWO WITH YOU,
WOULD YOU GO RIGHT ON DOING THE THINGS,
YOU ALWAYS DO?
WOULD YOU GO RIGHT ON SAYING THE THINGS,
YOU ALWAYS SAY?
WOULD LIFE FOR YOU CONTINUE,
AS IT DOES FROM DAY TO DAY?
WOULD YOU KEEP UP EACH AND EVERY PRAYER,
WITHOUT PUTTING ON A FROWN?
AND WOULD YOU ALWAYS JUMP UP EARLY,
FOR PRAYERS AT DAWN?
WOULD YOU SING THE SONGS YOU ALWAYS SING,
AND READ THE BOOKS YOU READ?
AND LET HIM KNOW THE THINGS ON WHICH,
YOUR MIND AND SPIRIT FEED?
WOULD YOU TAKE THE PROPHET WITH YOU,
EVERYWHERE YOU PLAN TO GO?
OR WOULD YOU, MAYBE, CHANGE YOUR PLANS,
JUST FOR A DAY OR SO?
WOULD YOU BE GLAD TO HAVE HIM MEET,
YOUR VERY CLOSEST FRIENDS?
OR WOULD YOU HOPE THEY'D STAY AWAY,
UNTIL HIS VISIT ENDS?
WOULD YOU BE GLAD TO HAVE HIM STAY,
FOREVER ON AND ON?
OR WOULD SIGH WITH GREAT RELIEF,
WHEN HE AT LEAST WAS GONE?
IT MIGHT BE INTRESTING TO KNOW,
THE THINGS THAT YOU WOULD DO,
IF THE PROPHET MOHAMMAD*,
IN PERSON CAME,
TO SPEND SOME TIME WITH YOU.
Reply

AnonymousPoster
11-02-2006, 09:38 AM
oops ijsut realised das already here
http://www.islamicboard.com/islamic-...sited-you.html

:hiding:
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