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Chechnya
11-16-2006, 06:46 PM
Amnesty International has received disturbing testimony from a survivor of the Chernokozovo "filtration camp" that detainees, including women and children, have been raped and subjected to brutal torture.

Amnesty International's field researcher interviewed in Ingushetia "Musa"*, a 21-year-old man, who was held in the Chernokozovo camp between 16 January and 5 February. He was detained in the village of Znamenskiy, while fleeing the shelling of Grozny by bus with his mother and brother. Musa was detained with 10 other men, including two teenage boys.

"Musa" was severely beaten and tortured several times each day during his detention. On 18 January, he was forced to walk between a "human corridor" of 20-25 masked men armed with clubs and hammers, who beat him and the other detainees as they passed. "Musa" was hit on his back with a hammer which has left him with a fractured spine.

"Musa" witnessed a 14-year-old girl being raped by a dozen prison guards in the corridor outside the cells in which he and other detainees were held. The girl had come to visit her detained mother and for the price of 5,000 Rubles she was permitted a five-minute meeting. Her five-minute meeting became a four-day ordeal during which she was locked in a cell, beaten and repeatedly raped by guards.

"Musa" also told Amnesty International about a 16-year-old boy called Albert, originally from the village of Davydenko, who was brought to his cell after being gang-raped and severely beaten by prison guards. One of his ears had been cut off and the guards referred to him by the female name of "Maria". "Musa" believes that up to 10 men were raped in the camp during his 21-day detention.

"Musa" shared a cell for one week with Andrey Babitsky, the Radio Liberty journalist. Among his other cell mates during his 21-day detention, were a man whose hands had been severely burnt by prison guards with cigarette lighters and a 17-year-old youth whose teeth had been sawn off with a metal file and whose lips were shredded, leaving him unable to eat, drink or speak. "Musa" estimated that 10-15 new detainees were brought to the camp each day. Among those he saw were 13-14 year-old girls.

His freedom was eventually secured on 5 February by his mother who paid 4,000 Rubles and bought the release of two Russian prisoners of war from Chechen fighters, as demanded by the camp authorities. "Musa" and his mother escaped to Ingushetia and are currently in hiding fearing for their safety after he was identified following an interview he gave about his ordeal to the national NTV channel. According to medical doctors who examined "Musa" after his release, without urgent medical treatment he risks being paralysed for life.

"'Musa's' shocking ordeal is consistent with other reports that have emerged from the Russian "filtration camps", despite continual denials by the Russian government to the international community and the media that torture and rape are prevalent in these camps," Amnesty International said.

"The Russian government must take immediate measures to end such appalling human rights violations and allow medical personnel and the International Committee of the Red Cross immediate and unhindered access to the detainees. " Amnesty International stressed.

ENDS.../

*"Musa" is not his real name. It has been changed for his own security.
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blunderbus
11-16-2006, 07:51 PM
Are the Russians who carry out theses atrocities "heroes"?

No of course they are not.
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- Qatada -
11-16-2006, 07:56 PM
:salamext:


May Allaah have mercy on the muslims.. Allaah surely brings with every hardship ease. These people will pay for what they do, they might feel that they not responsible for their actions - but Allaah is watching over them.. they put the muslims through hell in this life, but atleast this world isn't forever.. the hellfire of the hereafter is prepared for the disbelievers, and they won't find no ending to the pain. A reward for what they do..
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wilberhum
11-16-2006, 07:58 PM
Did the Filtration Camps only contain Muslims?

If the Filtration Camps only targeted Muslims, why doesn’t the word “Muslim” appear in the article?

If Muslims weren’t the only target, then do you only care about the Muslims that suffered?
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- Qatada -
11-16-2006, 08:01 PM
Chernokozovo is in Russia or Chechnya, the majority of the prisoners are muslim.



Peace.
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wilberhum
11-16-2006, 08:05 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Fi_Sabilillah
Chernokozovo is in Russia or Chechnya, the majority of the prisoners are muslim.



Peace.
So then the Filtration Camps only contain Muslims?
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- Qatada -
11-16-2006, 08:08 PM
Did the concentration camps in Germany only contain jews? Why did everyone make a big deal only about the jews and not anyone else?
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abdur_Rahmaan
11-16-2006, 08:13 PM
To Allaah we belong and to Allaah we will return...

The Day of Ressurrection is going to be an atrocious Day. May ALlaah save us from those fitan (trials and tribulations) that Day. aameen.
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wilberhum
11-16-2006, 08:23 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Fi_Sabilillah
Did the concentration camps in Germany only contain jews? Why did everyone make a big deal only about the jews and not anyone else?
We must live in different worlds. In the world that I live in there is plenty of acknowledgements of all the groups that suffered.
So it seams my conclusion “you only care about the Muslims that suffered” is correct.
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- Qatada -
11-16-2006, 08:50 PM
I prayed for the muslims, is there a problem in that? No where did i say that i hate non muslims. :)


Peace.
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wilberhum
11-16-2006, 09:01 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Fi_Sabilillah
I prayed for the muslims, is there a problem in that? No where did i say that i hate non muslims. :)


Peace.
Did I imply that you hate non-Muslims? I think not. Nor do I assume that you hate non-Muslims.

I assume though that you only care about Muslims and have little concern about the plight of any non-Muslim.

You pray for Muslims. I think that is an indicator of your quality. I too pray for Muslims. Also I pray for non-Muslims. Do you pray for non-Muslims?
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blunderbus
11-16-2006, 09:03 PM
Wilberhum didn't say you hated non Muslims. He asked it you CARED about the suffering of the non Muslims as well.
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abdur_Rahmaan
11-16-2006, 09:07 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by wilberhum
Did I imply that you hate non-Muslims? I think not. Nor do I assume that you hate non-Muslims.

I assume though that you only care about Muslims and have little concern about the plight of any non-Muslim.

You pray for Muslims. I think that is an indicator of your quality. I too pray for Muslims. Also I pray for non-Muslims. Do you pray for non-Muslims?
...for their guidance, sure. All Muslims pray for their (non-Muslims) guidance, to worship the Almighty Creator the way that He (the Most High) Legislated that we worship Him.

In actuality, I have non-Muslim relatives that I wish to be guided, but I do not guide whom I love, it is the Almighty Creator who guides whom He wills. And all praises are due to Allaah, the Lord of mankind, jinns and all that exists.
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blunderbus
11-16-2006, 09:13 PM
Do you care about their suffering? Do you feel any pain at the suffering of another human being? Or do you only feel pain at the suffering of another Muslim?
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Rou
11-16-2006, 09:14 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by wilberhum
We must live in different worlds. In the world that I live in there is plenty of acknowledgements of all the groups that suffered.
So it seams my conclusion “you only care about the Muslims that suffered” is correct.
You are unbeleiveable its sick really sick...

after reading the articale the only thing you can say is your only talking about muslims hey!?

let him refer to who he wishes are you intrested in his Dua or the innocents that are being harmed??

you seem more worri4ed about showing the fact that you dont want muslims only prayed for than you are about the sick acts of these animals!?????

just do your own prayer if you feel like that!??

quite selfish to just act the way you did in this post and pretend its for the fact that not only muslims are suffering!?? he didnt state that he prayed...

have an issue do your own prayer...disturbing seriously disturbing...

These types of things are going on in the world brothers and sisters and dont expect tears from the majority of the world....

for if those tears were genuine these things would be stopped.....

those of you who truly care await your time and do what you can now to stop such things use your voice let not the innocent suffer in silent and think if this is happening to those you have heard about those you have not heard of are far far worse off....may allah have mercy on them and may he crush the evil doers and make them pay ten fold for there crimes...

:w:
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Skillganon
11-16-2006, 09:19 PM
Advance reminder: Come on Guy's let's try to keep this discussion as polite as possible. Any thread that spirals away from the Op of the thread, will be closed.
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Keltoi
11-16-2006, 09:22 PM
Horrible story, but nothing that goes on in Russia surprises me. Putin has taken Russia backwards in the realm of human rights and open government. I'm still not completely convinced that he is going to step down as president when the time comes.
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AHMED_GUREY
11-16-2006, 09:29 PM
ugh my stomach turned when i read the article

especially the little sista that was visiting a relative and what they did to her

what a cowards

chechens are hard fighters masha-allah may Allah swt increase their strength and insha-allah may they defend their families from these pyschopaths

insha-allah insha-allah
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wilberhum
11-16-2006, 09:34 PM
Rou,
You really understand me. :giggling: :giggling:
I am a horrible discussing person that doesn’t give special consideration to people based on there religion.

You don’t have to believe as I do in order for me to pray for you. You don’t have to pass a religious test to get my help either.

I’m just an evil sicko who cares about people.:hiding: :hiding:
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Rou
11-16-2006, 09:55 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by wilberhum
Rou,
You really understand me. :giggling: :giggling:
I am a horrible discussing person that doesn’t give special consideration to people based on there religion.

You don’t have to believe as I do in order for me to pray for you. You don’t have to pass a religious test to get my help either.

I’m just an evil sicko who cares about people.:hiding: :hiding:

??? You are once again missing the point i did not call you evil if i did pls state where...

i said your unbeleiveable...that you miss the whole point in the articale of the innocents suffering and grab Fi_Sabilillah on his prayer!?

i dont claim to understand you nor do i wish to understand you as above you and me there are so many suffering so why you on about you or Fi_Sabilillah or what i understand!???

i agree that it should not matter what religon or race you are all innocents deserve to be saved from such animals!

however your undercut the article and jump on Fi_Sabilillah!??

and indeed to me that is unbelivable...let him pray for who he wants and you pray for who you want...

If he had added anything blatent i would understand but the man just said he sends prayers for muslims should we start shouting about wether he will include brothers and sisters or what color muslims??

leave that to him and his prayers im sure he will pray for all innocents and what he prays for is between him and allah not you and me...

now i suggest we get back to the subject at hand that is we as a world must stop these acts happening for they are against humanity....

:w:
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Chechnya
11-16-2006, 10:40 PM
^ Bro, many non-muslims will always differentiate between their women and children and Muslim women children.
Its the only way they can get away with electing mass-murderers of Muslim women and children eg. Bush, Putin, Sharon.

You must remember our raped and killed people are collateral damage - its not a big issue for them.
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Keltoi
11-16-2006, 11:21 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Chechnya
^ Bro, many non-muslims will always differentiate between their women and children and Muslim women children.
Its the only way they can get away with electing mass-murderers of Muslim women and children eg. Bush, Putin, Sharon.

You must remember our raped and killed people are collateral damage - its not a big issue for them.
In one aspect you are correct, Americans, English, Israelis, etc put a higher priority on their innocents than others. However, that is the same with any country, whether it be the U.S. or Iran. Did the 3,000 people who died on 9-11 have more significance for me than the Iraqi civilian deaths that occurred as a result of the war? Yes, I admit that. I just don't see how that is any different than anyone else on this forum. It depends on where you are coming from. That doesn't mean I don't care about Iraqi civilians, it is simply a matter of what I can relate to and what affects me personally.
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Dahir
11-16-2006, 11:30 PM
Dealing with Godless Russians is a very tough task for Chechens. May the road ahead be paved gracefully for them.


imsad
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Chechnya
11-17-2006, 01:36 AM
In one aspect you are correct, Americans, English, Israelis, etc put a higher priority on their innocents than others. However, that is the same with any country, whether it be the U.S. or Iran. Did the 3,000 people who died on 9-11 have more significance for me than the Iraqi civilian deaths that occurred as a result of the war? Yes, I admit that. I just don't see how that is any different than anyone else on this forum. It depends on where you are coming from. That doesn't mean I don't care about Iraqi civilians, it is simply a matter of what I can relate to and what affects me personally
At least your honest.

Why do you think these people vote in mass-murderers then claimsinnocence when people say they are to blame too? Seems odd.

Also I dont understand the numbers either.

Despite the massive bias for fellow non-muslims against Muslims - how can such people possibly pretend to be outraged by something relatively small like Beslan when for the previous decade they have been ignoring the massive slaughter of muslim children just a few miles to the east of Beslan?
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Abu Ibraheem
11-17-2006, 01:38 AM
Yaa Allaaaah!!!
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Keltoi
11-17-2006, 03:10 AM
format_quote Originally Posted by Chechnya
At least your honest.

Why do you think these people vote in mass-murderers then claimsinnocence when people say they are to blame too? Seems odd.

Also I dont understand the numbers either.

Despite the massive bias for fellow non-muslims against Muslims - how can such people possibly pretend to be outraged by something relatively small like Beslan when for the previous decade they have been ignoring the massive slaughter of muslim children just a few miles to the east of Beslan?
Relatively small? The intentional slaughter of hundreds of children is very far from a "relatively small" event. What made Beslan so horrifying to the rest of the world wasn't the fact it happened to be Russian children, it was the act itself. A primary factor was the available media coverage of the event, where there were no cameras involved with the atrocities committed by the Russians. Reading something in print and watching it unfold on your television are two different things. Any human being with a soul is affected by the death of children, regardless whether they are Muslim, Hindu, or anything else. Beslan seemed so awful because it was a premeditated act of cruelty against children. At a school during a day the terrorists knew would bring more children into their hands. The intentional wholesale slaughter of children isn't going to win you any friends, and in this case it surely didn't help the Chechen cause at all.
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Woodrow
11-17-2006, 05:13 AM
We all need to keep in mind that even the most tolerant of us, still has some degree of bias. The atrocities done against our own people do seem to be much worse then the atrocities our own people do to others. It is all a matter of perspective.

Atrocities are atrocities no matter who commits them. They are not the actions of a person who follows what they believe to be right or wrong. They are the actions of a person who is finding self gratification out of hurting others.

Yes we all have a tendency to pray for our brethren first. It is not lack of concern over the pain of others, it is because we believe we identify with our kin better than we can identify a stranger.
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SirZubair
11-17-2006, 08:22 AM
format_quote Originally Posted by wilberhum
Did I imply that you hate non-Muslims? I think not. Nor do I assume that you hate non-Muslims.

I assume though that you only care about Muslims and have little concern about the plight of any non-Muslim.

You pray for Muslims. I think that is an indicator of your quality. I too pray for Muslims. Also I pray for non-Muslims. Do you pray for non-Muslims?

Wilberhum, i see where you are coming from..

..but is this really neccessary? Does it really matter at this stage wether Fi_Sabilillah prays for Non-muslims as well as Muslims? The title IS "Muslim Children..." so he made a prayer for The Muslims.

Please, if you wish to, go ahead and create a new thread, stop derailing this thread.

Thank You.

As for the topic at hand, it is truly sad. Kheir, May allah swt grant us ALL the Hikma ( wisdom ) that we desire and the Hidayat ( Guidance ) that we all require.

Wa'salaam.
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north_malaysian
11-17-2006, 08:37 AM
format_quote Originally Posted by Dahir
Dealing with Godless Russians is a very tough task for Chechens. May the road ahead be paved gracefully for them.


imsad
I thought Putin goes to Church...
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Chechnya
11-17-2006, 05:09 PM
Relatively small? The intentional slaughter of hundreds of children is very far from a "relatively small" event.
Yes relatively small. It was very bad but compared to the amount of children killed in Chechnya, relatively Beslan was small/


What made Beslan so horrifying to the rest of the world wasn't the fact it happened to be Russian children, it was the act itself.
No, it was the very fact that it was non-muslim Russians that led to the out-cry.

If it was the act itself, the wold would have been outraged for the previous decade when tens of thousands of Chechn children were being slaughtered and raped.

Beslan taught us that to non-muslim citizens all children are NOT equal and some are more important than others.

A primary factor was the available media coverage of the event, where there were no cameras involved with the atrocities committed by the Russians.
Are you saying that every non-muslims is that fickle?

And whose fault is it that the non-muslim organisations dont think Chechn children being slaughtered and raped is a stroy worth covering?

Any human being with a soul is affected by the death of children, regardless whether they are Muslim, Hindu, or anything else. Beslan seemed so awful because it was a premeditated act of cruelty against children. At a school during a day the terrorists knew would bring more children into their hands.
I suppose Russias rape of little Muslim girls and slaughter of thouands of Muslim children isnt enough to describe the Russians and Putin as "terrorists"?

Why do you possibly think this is? Double standards maybe?

The intentional wholesale slaughter of children isn't going to win you any friends, and in this case it surely didn't help the Chechen cause at all.
Well apart from the fact that it wasnt they who slaughtered the children, i agree with you. Beslan should never have happened and im glad Shamil offered to pay the ultimate price for it.

As for "didnt help the Chechen cause" at all, i dont think that really matters.

Who was helping in the first place? Nobody.
Who was trying to stop the rape and murder of Chechen children in the first place? Nobody.

Even "islamic" groups like Hamas stabbed the nation in the back. Btw i think Hamas supports the rape and murder of these little children.

So the fact their was no support in the first place means they didnt lose much. I even think if they did have even a little support, they wuoldnt have carried out Beslan - just a personal opinion.

May Allah (swt) grant the children of Beslan paradise and bring ease to their suffering parents. Ameen
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Nσσя'υℓ Jαииαн
11-19-2006, 12:24 AM
Omg :( May Allah help these people :( Ameen.
Ameen to other Dua's too!
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