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rubiesand
12-16-2006, 11:11 AM
by Craig Murray


Google "Rashid Rauf - mastermind". On the first page of results you will find CBS, the BBC, the Times, Guardian and Mail all describing Rauf last summer, on security service or police briefing, as the "Mastermind" behind the "Liquid terror bomb plot". So the fact that a Pakistani court has found there is no evidence of terrorism against him cannot be lightly dismissed by the cheerleaders of the plot story.

Rashid Rauf still faces other charges, including forgery, and what is touted as possession of explosives, although what he actually possessed was hydrogen peroxide, which is not explosive. As hydrogen peroxide is readily obtainable without limitation from any chemist or hardware store in the UK, why you would source it in Pakistan to blow up jets in Britain was never very convincing. The Pakistani court perhaps felt so too.

Rashid Rauf has much to answer. He is still wanted in the UK over the murder of his uncle some years ago - a crime which, like the alleged forgery, had no apparent terrorist link. None of which adds to the credibility of the evidence he allegedly gave the Pakistani intelligence services about the liquid bomb plot in the UK.

A second and simultaneous development is even more compelling evidence that this massive scare was, as I said at the time, "More propaganda than plot". Thames Valley police have given up after five months scouring the woods near High Wycombe where the bomb materials were allegedly hidden. They told the Home Office on 12 December that they would only continue if the government were prepared to meet the costs; they wished to get back to devoting their resources to real crimes, like armed robbery and burglary.

Remember this was a plot described by the authorities as "Mass murder on an unimaginable scale" and "Bigger than 9/11". There have been instances in the UK of hundreds of police officers deployed for years to find an individual murderer. If the police really believed they were dealing with an effort at "Mass murder on an unimaginable scale", would they be calling off the search after five months? No.

Which brings us to the lies that have been told - one of which concerns this search. An anonymous police source tipped off the media early on that they had discovered a "Suitcase" containing "bomb-making materials". This has recently been described to me by a security service source as "A lot of rubbish from someone's garage dumped in the woods". You could indeed cannibalise bits of old wire, clocks and car parts to form part of a bomb - perhaps you could enclose it in the old suitcase. But have they found stuff that is exclusively concerned with causing explosions, like detonators, explosives or those famous liquid chemicals? No, they haven't found any.

Wycombe Woods, like the sands of Iraq, have failed to yield up the advertised WMD.


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Woodrow
12-16-2006, 07:42 PM
The Hydrogen peroxide could be a problem if it is fuel grade and not pharmaceutical grade. The Pharmaceutical Grade is from .05 to 10% Hydrogen Peroxide. The fuel grade or nacent Hydrogen peroxide is 99.99% Hydrogen peroxide and is such a powerful oxydiser that a drop spilled on most organic material will cause it to ignite violently. One ounce is equal to several pounds of TNT.
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afriend
12-16-2006, 08:12 PM
Hydrogen peroxide and is such a powerful oxydiser that a drop spilled on most organic material will cause it to ignite violently. One ounce is equal to several pounds of TNT.
That's crazy lol...But cool :shade:
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Woodrow
12-16-2006, 08:16 PM
We messed with nacent Hydrogen Peroxide while I was in college. Although technicaly it is not explosive itself, it can cause nearly any organic matter to explode. Sort of like oxygen itself is not flamable. However, it can make everything else burn. sale and possession of nacent hydrogen peroxide is/was restricted. If I recall way back in the stone age we were limited to one ounce for the entire college.

It is also what is used as fuel in some of our liquid fuel rockets.
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afriend
12-16-2006, 08:18 PM
lol yeah the oxygen-flamability link......What do you mean by messing? :p
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Woodrow
12-16-2006, 08:32 PM
In bio-lab we used it primarily for sterilzation. Back then we got to play with some nasty critters in micro-biology, stuff like diptheria cultures, and other nasties.

Off course those of us who had taken one too many chemistry classes used to use it to make bigger and better fire works. A drop of it went a long ways. It is roughly 1000 times more powererfull as an oxident then pure liquid oxygen.

That is why I am saying what type of hydrogen peroxide did the guy have. If he had the regular dilute drug store variety, there is no way to use that as an explosive. You will just end up with water and blond hair. If he had pure (nacent) hydrogen peroxide, it has no home use except as an explosive.
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rubiesand
12-16-2006, 08:57 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by woodrow
That is why I am saying what type of hydrogen peroxide did the guy have.
It's a good question Woodrow. All news reports I have read simply say he possessed hydrogen peroxide. No mention of its concentration. I guess it will all come out in his trial later. Still, charges of terrorism have been dropped, and that is quite telling in itself.
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Skillganon
12-16-2006, 09:01 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Woodrow
In bio-lab we used it primarily for sterilzation. Back then we got to play with some nasty critters in micro-biology, stuff like diptheria cultures, and other nasties.
We use both H2O2 and ethanol.

H2O2 is mainly used as rockect propollent.

H202 can be converted to acetone peroxide which can be used as an explosive.
However I am not sure how well of an explosive it can be. Better to check with scientific Journals.
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Woodrow
12-16-2006, 10:26 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by rubiesand
It's a good question Woodrow. All news reports I have read simply say he possessed hydrogen peroxide. No mention of its concentration. I guess it will all come out in his trial later. Still, charges of terrorism have been dropped, and that is quite telling in itself.
Good point. If it was pure H2O2 the terrorism charges should not have been dropped, as there is no houshold use for it.


Any cop who is aware that it can be used as an explosive should also know that dilute H2O2 can not be made into an explosive. (At least not easily).
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Abdul Fattah
12-16-2006, 10:33 PM
Brother Woodrow, be carefull. It's il legal for muslims to know that much about explosives :p
Keep under the radar ;)

Anyway, wikipedia says it's not the H2O2 itself thta explodes but the vapor it creates:
Above roughly 70% concentrations, hydrogen peroxide can give off vapor that can detonate above 70 °C (158 °F) at normal atmospheric pressure
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/H2O2#Hazards
The liquid itself is non flamable.

Just cause it ignites doesn't mean it can be used as explosive. If you blow fine sugar or flour over a candle you'll see an ignition. But you'd need a whole silo of flour to get a plane down. And we all know there's limits to hand luggage :)
The power an explosive gives comes from the chemical bounds of the elements. I'm no expert, but my educated guess is Peroxide has way to lil energy. We're talking 4 small atoms with 3 sp covalent binds. there's just no hidden energy there.
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Woodrow
12-16-2006, 10:53 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by steve
Brother Woodrow, be carefull. It's il legal for muslims to know that much about explosives :p
Keep under the radar ;)
That is very open information here and well known to anyone in the USA who has a degree in a Medical, Biology or Chemistry related fields. Goes back to Miro-technique 101 and the proper handling of lab equipment and chemicals. Lots of the reagents we used for tissue fixatives were either explosive or extremely toxic.

It is also well known that Hydrogen Peroxide is used as the Fuel for launching our space shuttles. That goes back to 6th grade general sciece.
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Abdul Fattah
12-16-2006, 11:05 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Woodrow
That is very open information here and well known to anyone in the USA who has a degree in a Medical, Biology or Chemistry related fields. Goes back to Miro-technique 101 and the proper handling of lab equipment and chemicals. Lots of the reagents we used for tissue fixatives were either explosive or extremely toxic.

It is also well known that Hydrogen Peroxide is used as the Fuel for launching our space shuttles. That goes back to 6th grade general sciece.
Lighten up, I was just joking brother, hence the smilies :)
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Woodrow
12-17-2006, 04:45 AM
format_quote Originally Posted by steve
Lighten up, I was just joking brother, hence the smilies :)
And ruin my reputation as a Grumpy old man? It took me a long time to earn that.
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