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England
01-03-2007, 09:59 PM
STOP ALL IMMIGRATION

The contribution of immigrants to the UK economy is "very slight indeed" and the main benefits are to the migrants themselves, a pressure group has said.
Migrationwatch UK says the economic benefit is equal to 4p a week for each person in Britain.


Its chairman Sir Andrew Green accused Whitehall of trying to divert attention from the problems caused by migration.

A Home Office spokesman said there was "a clear consensus" that migrants had helped the economy to grow.

But Migrationwatch said its figures showed immigration's benefit to the UK was far lower than claimed.



"What we have done is to look at the economic contribution of migrants, taken as a whole, taking the economy as a whole," Sir Andrew told BBC News.

"We find they certainly do add to production, but they also add in virtually the same proportion to population."

The benefit of mass migration to each individual member of society was "trivial", Sir Andrew added.

He said the main beneficiaries were the immigrants themselves, who were able to send home about £10m each day.

Migrationwatch reached its conclusion by comparing the proportion of the population who arrived as immigrants in 2005 with Treasury estimates for the proportion of GDP growth coming from immigration.

The difference between these figures, it said, amounted to a 4p gain for each person in the UK per week - or about £2.10 a year.

But Susan Anderson of the Confederation of British Industry said Migrationwatch was "seeking to score a few cheap political points".

"Migrants to the UK bring valuable skills and ideas with them and help to fill job vacancies where Britons are unable or unwilling to do so," she said.

"Their taxes help pay for our public services and our pensions, long after many migrants have returned home.

"Their presence also helps keep inflation low at a time when there are many forces pushing the other way."


'Impossibly complicated'

BBC economics editor Evan Davis said Migrationwatch was right to try to assess how immigration affected an individual's wealth, rather than relying on government figures relating to the overall size of the economy.

But he said neither the government nor Sir Andrew had tried to work out the overall economic effect of immigration, which would be "impossibly complicated".

Last December, the Ernst and Young Item Club, an influential economic forecasting body that uses Treasury models, estimated that immigration had brought in an extra £12bn to £18bn in tax since 1998.

Eastern European workers were reducing the UK's trade deficit by an extra £1bn every year, it said.

In the same month a fresh Bank of England analysis suggested the effect of new migrants was complex.

While they were highly-educated, they were also working in more low-skilled jobs, it said. Some of these migrants may also be replacing low-skilled UK workers in certain jobs, although more data was needed.

A spokesman for the Home Office said there was clear evidence of migration's benefits.

"Independent research has found migrants make a net contribution to the Exchequer," said a spokesman.

"We have seen a large movement of people from the EU coming here to work.

"There is a clear consensus from commentators, business and our own research that this has helped the economy to grow. There is no evidence that it has increased unemployment."

David Davis, the shadow home secretary, said the Migrationwatch figures sharply contrasted to those of the government.

"Immigration can be a real benefit to the country but only if it is properly controlled," he said.

"You need to have accurate information about its level and effects. The government patently has neither."

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/6226217.stm
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Genius
01-03-2007, 10:15 PM
I think we should stop you from reproducing.
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skhalid
01-03-2007, 10:18 PM
Interestin'....but what can we do bout dis??:?
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chacha_jalebi
01-03-2007, 10:21 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by skhalid
Interestin'....but what can we do bout dis??:?
dunno what we can do but the Uk can do summin!

instead of bombing innocent people and tryin to jack their oil :D

uk can use it money wisely and help these people in their own countries, then they wont be comin over as immigrants, and they will be happy in their own countries :D doesnt that sound great :p
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skhalid
01-03-2007, 10:25 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by chacha_jalebi
dunno what we can do but the Uk can do summin!

instead of bombing innocent people and tryin to jack their oil :D

uk can use it money wisely and help these people in their own countries, then they wont be comin over as immigrants, and they will be happy in their own countries :D doesnt that sound great :p
We do help out our countries...but it is never enough to help prevent immigration:exhausted
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chacha_jalebi
01-03-2007, 10:32 PM
well i do believe that the total cost of the afghanistan, iraq genocides :p i mean wars :D could have most probably built a new country! every bomb costs like £100,000 and they drop them round like they sweets, so i do believe the uk could help foreign countries instead of bombin innocent countries along with their husband US & A :p :D
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Eric H
01-03-2007, 10:54 PM
Greetings and peace be with you all;

Britain built an Empire and gained a huge wealth with the slave trade, we took people out of their place of birth and forced them to go to countries they did not want to go.

Why should we winge now when people want to come to our country. Like chacha_jalebi said we have bombed a lot of people out of their own country with our aggressive war mongering policies.

In the spirit of seeking peace on Earth

Eric
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rav
01-03-2007, 11:12 PM
I remember when may Americans were saying stop these dirty jews from entering our country because they are all filth and poor. Now look, what happend 60-80 years later, Jewish people contribute to the economy. Discrimnation is a dirty buissness, and the people in England are exhibiting this against immigrants now, I suppose.
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MinAhlilHadeeth
01-04-2007, 12:03 PM
THREAD MOVED.




format_quote Originally Posted by Eric H
Greetings and peace be with you all;

Britain built an Empire and gained a huge wealth with the slave trade, we took people out of their place of birth and forced them to go to countries they did not want to go.

Why should we winge now when people want to come to our country. Like chacha_jalebi said we have bombed a lot of people out of their own country with our aggressive war mongering policies.

In the spirit of seeking peace on Earth

Eric
Precisely. Excellent post.
Reply

duskiness
01-04-2007, 01:02 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by England
Eastern European workers were reducing the UK's trade deficit by an extra £1bn every year, it said.
Almost all my friends and some family members were/are "reducing your trade deficit" ;)
kind of sad story...so many have to leave. They have university degrees, which allow them to serve ice-creams in London.
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FBI
01-04-2007, 01:36 PM
:sl:

I watched a programme on channel 4 a while back called "100% English" It had several people who claimed to have full English heratiage, the funny thing was it was proven they actually wern't through DNA, one women got so upset she said she was gonna sue the show, another lady who was racists was left looking like an idiot, every one is an immigrant this is how humanity spreads.
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sameer
01-04-2007, 04:18 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Eric H
Greetings and peace be with you all;

Britain built an Empire and gained a huge wealth with the slave trade, we took people out of their place of birth and forced them to go to countries they did not want to go.

Why should we winge now when people want to come to our country. Like chacha_jalebi said we have bombed a lot of people out of their own country with our aggressive war mongering policies.

In the spirit of seeking peace on Earth

Eric
i live far from england...but still an excellent post.
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England
01-04-2007, 06:50 PM
Since when was Poland, Bulgaria, Slovenia, Romania a country in crisis. So much money is being put into Africa by us. We're one of the biggest aiders if not THE biggest, but I see we still get these Africans coming in...
I like the Polish, I have alot Polish friends, and I love their women too. In fact they're much like us only they have a bit more respect. I don't blame them. I blame our government. One good thing I could take out of this is that it's definately boosting the Christian population dramatically without a doubt. I've had enough of people saying "this will an Islamic country in 50 years." Perhaps this is why the government is doing this?
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FBI
01-04-2007, 07:09 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by England
Since when was Poland, Bulgaria, Slovenia, Romania a country in crisis. So much money is being put into Africa by us. We're one of the biggest aiders if not THE biggest, but I see we still get these Africans coming in...
I like the Polish, I have alot Polish friends, and I love their women too. In fact they're much like us only they have a bit more respect. I don't blame them. I blame our government. One good thing I could take out of this is that it's definately boosting the Christian population dramatically without a doubt. I've had enough of people saying "this will an Islamic country in 50 years." Perhaps this is why the government is doing this?
:sl:

U think the goverment care about Christian Morals, If they did there would be no UK involvement in iraq.
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England
01-04-2007, 07:20 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by FBI
:sl:

U think the goverment care about Christian Morals, If they did there would be no UK involvement in iraq.

Well they're dramatically boosting Christianity by the day whether they realise it or not. This year 600,000 Bulgarians and Romanians will be on their way which is another Christian country. :X
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Pk_#2
01-04-2007, 07:25 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Eric H
Greetings and peace be with you all;

Britain built an Empire and gained a huge wealth with the slave trade, we took people out of their place of birth and forced them to go to countries they did not want to go.

Why should we winge now when people want to come to our country. Like chacha_jalebi said we have bombed a lot of people out of their own country with our aggressive war mongering policies.

In the spirit of seeking peace on Earth

Eric
Not much WE could do about it... sit back and watch :X :skeleton:
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FBI
01-04-2007, 07:30 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by England
Well they're dramatically boosting Christianity by the day whether they realise it or not. This year 600,000 Bulgarians and Romanians will be on their way which is another Christian country. :X
:sl:

People will still be binge drinking ect aint gonna make a diffrence, and remember just beacuse someone holds the title of a religion doesn't mean anything it's wheather they practice or not that makes a diffrence.
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England
01-04-2007, 07:36 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by FBI
:sl:

People will still be binge drinking ect aint gonna make a diffrence, and remember just beacuse someone holds the title of a religion doesn't mean anything it's wheather they practice or not that makes a diffrence.
I hope it does remain as it is. Binge drinking? So what? I'm happy with my way of life and they are no danger to it. In fact I have known alot of them to love the English which is why I like the Polish.
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Jayda
01-04-2007, 07:51 PM
hola,

not all of the benefits of immigration can be measured in economics... what about culture, values, language diversity and things like that? and i do not think just because a group says that immigrants are not contributing makes it so... people say mexicans "steal all the good jobs" in the united states but that is not true...

Dios te bendiga...
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rav
01-04-2007, 08:20 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Jayda
hola,

not all of the benefits of immigration can be measured in economics... what about culture, values, language diversity and things like that? and i do not think just because a group says that immigrants are not contributing makes it so... people say mexicans "steal all the good jobs" in the united states but that is not true...

Dios te bendiga...
Good Post.
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Keltoi
01-04-2007, 09:29 PM
Sometimes accepting a large wave of immigrants is harmful to an economy, depending on the current labor demand. That is an economic debate. However, immigration in itself cannot be measured by economics alone. For example, the U.S. has developed as a new home for many immigrants who were being persecuted, were poor, or simply looking for a better way of life. This acceptance of immigrants into the U.S. is an important part of the American experience.

I must mention though, the issue with Mexicans in the U.S. has very little to do with "immigration" and a whole lot to do with "illegal immigration". Contrary to what some might believe, there is a major difference. I myself support tougher regulation and deportation of Mexican illegals. That doesn't mean I'm anti-immigrant, I'm simply pro-American sovereignty.
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MinAhlilHadeeth
01-05-2007, 10:38 AM
format_quote Originally Posted by England
Since when was Poland, Bulgaria, Slovenia, Romania a country in crisis. So much money is being put into Africa by us. We're one of the biggest aiders if not THE biggest, but I see we still get these Africans?
You didn't really mind them coming when you were enslaving them and pilfering their natural resources.
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SilentObserver
01-06-2007, 04:42 AM
I personally am against any immigration to my country (not Britain). I don't see any economic benefit to it. And the problems that many people bring with them from their old country have no place in my country. In my city, there are problems with crime that did not exist 15 years ago before a certain group of people lived here. They have brought a certain behaviour (and drug trade) with them. I think it best to stop all migration of people to this place.
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lolwatever
01-06-2007, 05:10 AM
format_quote Originally Posted by SilentObserver
I personally am against any immigration to my country (not Britain). I don't see any economic benefit to it. And the problems that many people bring with them from their old country have no place in my country. In my city, there are problems with crime that did not exist 15 years ago before a certain group of people lived here. They have brought a certain behaviour (and drug trade) with them. I think it best to stop all migration of people to this place.
actually it depends on which economy you're talking about and the needs of the economy.

having studied the effects of population growth/structure on economies, it's more than just 'its a good idea' or 'its a bad idea'.

tc all the best :)
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SilentObserver
01-06-2007, 08:15 AM
format_quote Originally Posted by lolwatever
actually it depends on which economy you're talking about and the needs of the economy.

having studied the effects of population growth/structure on economies, it's more than just 'its a good idea' or 'its a bad idea'.

tc all the best :)
As for where I live, and what's happened since immigration has increased as explained in my last post, call it a decline in quality of life. Money is not everything.
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lolwatever
01-06-2007, 10:16 AM
format_quote Originally Posted by SilentObserver
As for where I live, and what's happened since immigration has increased as explained in my last post, call it a decline in quality of life. Money is not everything.
Economists also think alot about quality of life not only money, well the humane ones of them atleast :p

Umm but on serious note, i think what you're worried about is the immigration of people hwo contribute negatively to the economy, so long as your economy is not 100% efficient, importing useful immigrants is never a bad thing :)
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Sabbir_1
01-06-2007, 01:16 PM
this is such as load of bull, without immigrants this country would not be where it is now .. immirgants put billions of dollars into the economy..

''I've had enough of people saying "this will an Islamic country in 50 years." Perhaps this is why the government is doing this?''

It will, dont worry mate.. just hope u be alive in 50 years so u can live under the shariah.. u will like it.. dont have to pay tax.. u will have to anyway.. but we wont..!!! ha



''This year 600,000 Bulgarians and Romanians will be on their way which is another Christian country''

u think they wanna live in this country permenantly. they just to make money and go bak home.. also u have more christians from uk going abroad than comin in..
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England
01-06-2007, 07:45 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by khalil27
this is such as load of bull, without immigrants this country would not be where it is now .. immirgants put billions of dollars into the economy..

''I've had enough of people saying "this will an Islamic country in 50 years." Perhaps this is why the government is doing this?''

It will, dont worry mate.. just hope u be alive in 50 years so u can live under the shariah.. u will like it.. dont have to pay tax.. u will have to anyway.. but we wont..!!! ha



''This year 600,000 Bulgarians and Romanians will be on their way which is another Christian country''

u think they wanna live in this country permenantly. they just to make money and go bak home.. also u have more christians from uk going abroad than comin in..

I've said before that I have many Polish friends. There are many that are living here permanently, some of them having babies here so yes I do :statisfie

Fear not though. Labour won't be in power long, and the conservatives are nothing nor are the Liberal Democrats but there is one party that's the fastest growing political party in Britain, hence 2nd biggest party in Barking & Dagenham
Bahahahaha :statisfie
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Sabbir_1
01-06-2007, 08:15 PM
I've said before that I have many Polish friends. There are many that are living here permanently, some of them having babies here so yes I do
Good.. they can become muslims too. inshallah..

Fear not though. Labour won't be in power long, and the conservatives are nothing nor are the Liberal Democrats but there is one party that's the fastest growing political party in Britain, hence 2nd biggest party in Barking & Dagenham
Who is this part u talking about, BNP. nonees gonna vote for them only the stupid racists....i doubt they will be in power...
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England
01-06-2007, 08:51 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by khalil27
Good.. they can become muslims too. inshallah..



Who is this part u talking about, BNP. nonees gonna vote for them only the stupid racists....i doubt they will be in power...

I'll PM you the response.
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Sabbir_1
01-06-2007, 09:03 PM
i pm 'ed u the response
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SilentObserver
01-07-2007, 03:29 AM
format_quote Originally Posted by lolwatever
Economists also think alot about quality of life not only money, well the humane ones of them atleast :p

Umm but on serious note, i think what you're worried about is the immigration of people hwo contribute negatively to the economy, so long as your economy is not 100% efficient, importing useful immigrants is never a bad thing :)
Unfortunatly, my country has a real habit for importing troublemakers and people of no use, and no benefit to society here.
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lolwatever
01-07-2007, 04:15 AM
^ if you say so :skeleton:

must be a cactus economy lol.
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SilentObserver
01-08-2007, 02:12 AM
format_quote Originally Posted by lolwatever
^ if you say so :skeleton:

must be a cactus economy lol.
I am unfamiliar with the term. If it means a slow or poor economy, that would be quite the opposite of the reality.
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lolwatever
01-08-2007, 09:05 AM
cactus, metaphor for 'stuffed' or 'hopeless'

who knows could be, afterall i dont even know what economy we're talking about here, i was just making a gen statement :)
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akulion
01-08-2007, 09:43 AM
Well maybe if they stopped paying 5 pence per day labour to people in developing nations and paid real wages to immigrants in the UK and give them jobs, bring about more employment - maybe it would make a difference
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aamirsaab
01-08-2007, 10:49 AM
:sl:

Immigrants hardly contribute to UK economy
Time for some refutations:

1) the word contribution means to put in, or to help/ to aid etc. There is no specific value of contribution. Therefore, saying someone hardly contributes to X economy doesn't mean anything - you're comparing a variable that isn't universally quantifiable.

2) The only way to contribute to the UK economy is to spend money - if you don't have any money then you can't contribute. This opens up an entire can of worms that even if I explained, would make no difference as people who the explanation is aimed at have already read the headline(s) and have taken it as the gospel truth.

3) Certain other minorities "hardly contribute to the UK economy".
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lolwatever
01-08-2007, 11:08 AM
^ salams bro i totally agree akh :), but i think she meant in the sense that htey're being social parasites... i guess economy is synonymous to 'country' :? afterall wat is a country but an economy ;)

but i guess i'll step back and let her confirm my suspicion.
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