Shiek Faiz To Be Charged With Hate Crime!

[FBI]

:sl:

Charge the Sheik of Hate
By Luke McIlveen
January 18, 2007
The Daily Telegraph [Sydney, Australia]

http://www.news.com.au/dailytelegra...5001021,00.html

A TOP community leader says Sydney's most influential radical Muslim cleric should be charged for hateful rants in which he labels Jews pigs and urges children to die for Allah.

There has been widespread condemnation of the repugnant remarks of firebrand Sheik Feiz Mohammed, which were revealed by The Daily Telegraph today.

Sheik Feiz, head of the Global Islamic Youth Centre in Liverpool, delivered the loathsome lectures on a collection of DVDs called the Death Series, being sold here and overseas.

"Today many parents, they prevent their children from attending lessons. Why? They fear that they might create a place in the their hearts, the love, just a bit of the love, of sacrificing their lives for Allah," he says in the video.

"We want to have children and offer them as soldiers defending Islam. Teach them this: There is nothing more beloved to me than wanting to die as a mujahid (holy warrior). Put in their soft, tender hearts the zeal of jihad and a love of martyrdom."

Community Relations Commission chairman Stepan Kerkyasharian called for the sheik to be charged over his comments.

"The public prosecutor, the federal prosecutor should really have a close look as what is being conveyed by this guy and whether it is in breach of any laws and he should be charged,'' Mr Kerkyasharian told Macquarie Radio.

NSW Jewish Board of Deputies chief executive Vic Alhadeff said the sheik should not abuse his position to incite hatred.

"It is of great concern when people in positions of influence, who should be demonstrating responsible leadership, abuse that power to incite racial hatred,'' Mr Alhadeff said.

"As a Jewish community, we work well and closely with moderate sectors of the Muslim community.

"Hate speech such as these remarks by Sheik Mohammed has no place in Australian society and must be vigorously condemned by all.''

Acting Attorney-General Kevin Andrews said today the importation of hatred into Australia was totally unacceptable.

"The Australian government denounces these reprehensible and offensive remarks,'' Mr Andrews told reporters in Adelaide.

"We particularly denounce the outrageous comments made about the Jewish community in Australia.''

An Australian citizen born in Sydney who has spent the past year living in Lebanon, Sheik Feiz was exposed this week in a British documentary Undercover Mosque.

Watch part of the documentary by clicking on the play symbol below.

Investigators found Sheik Feiz's DVDs being sold by children in the carpark of the Green Lane Mosque in Birmingham and other Islamic bookshops. The entire set can be bought online for $150.

"The peak, the pinnacle, the crest, the highest point, the pivot, the summit of Islam is jihad," he declares in the film, before denouncing "kaffirs" (non-Muslims).

"(Kaffir) is the worst word ever written, a sign of infidelity, disbelief, filth, a sign of dirt."

In an excerpt from a video lecture series called Signs of the Hour, Sheik Feiz then ridicules Jews as pigs.

Sheik Feiz – who just two weeks ago said he felt like an "alien" in his own country – leads about 4000 followers through his Global Islamic Youth Centre in Sydney's southwest.

He also accused Australian authorities of being over-zealous in their approach to clerics like him.

"There are no sheiks preaching chaos there. No one is telling people to raise arms against the Australian community," he said.

Sheik Feiz left for Lebanon just before the arrest of 23 men in Sydney and Melbourne in November 2005.

[MTAFFI]

:sl:

wow, and we wonder why there is war...

[Pk_#2]

I duno what to say,

Allah (swt) help him :)

Lifes a struggle,

AsalamuAlaykum Warahmatullahi Wabarakatuh

[FBI]

wow, and we wonder why there is war...

actually I know why there's war but that's a diffrent topic.

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[FBI]

:sl:

I have alot of respect for this brother.

[Pk_#2]

Who MTAFFI?

or the shiekh?

Actually it's the first time i heard of both of them!

AsalamuAlaykum Warahmatullahi Wabarakatuh :)

[IbnAbdulHakim]

same here FBI, a lot of the stuff he says is beautiful, especially about the children having a place in their hearts to die for Allaah, mashaAllaah !!!!

[Trumble]

a lot of the stuff he says is beautiful, especially about the children having a place in their hearts to die for Allaah, mashaAllaah !!!!

'Sickening' is the word I would use in this context. It amounts to no more than child exploitation, brainwashing innocents into becoming puppets for political fanatics under the pretext of Islam. The man is beneath contempt.

[Pk_#2]

I don't believe you fully understood his objectives!

[Bittersteel]

what exactky did this sheikh mean when he talked about Jihad and the jews?

[Abu Zakariya]

Interesting that they accused him of inciting racial hatred, but didn't quote him at all. What did he say that is so racist? For all I know, he could've been taking about Jews that are fighting the Muslims. With that sort of reasoning, ridiculing al-Qaida is racism!

As for what he said about shahadah, he is correct. Every Muslim should be raised to love shahadah. Is there something wrong with being taught to step up and defend your religion and people for the sake of Allah? It's not sickening. Muslims have had this feeling for hundreds of years, it's nothing new. We live for Allah, and we die for Allah. Say (O Muhammad SAW): "Verily, my Salât (prayer), my sacrifice, my living, and my dying are for Allâh, the Lord of the 'Alamîn (mankind, jinns and all that exists). (Al-An'am 6:162)


And the part where he said that Jihad is the pinnacle of Islam, that's a hadith. He was quoting a hadith! What's wrong with that? It's only if you're uneducated and think that he was referring to terrorism, then you would react.

[azim]

'Sickening' is the word I would use in this context. It amounts to no more than child exploitation, brainwashing innocents into becoming puppets for political fanatics under the pretext of Islam. The man is beneath contempt.

Do you really think that after reading a single article with a single quote by Sheikh Faiz that your in a fair position to call his words 'sickening' and him 'beneath contempt'?

[Khattab]

'Freedom of Speech' great isn't it

[IbnAbdulHakim]

'Freedom of Speach' great isn't it

lol its better then hearing bushes lies, at least the sheikh was being honest,

youth having the desire for Allaah swt, wallahi its so beautifUL!

[MTAFFI]

Well let me ask you this what would you say if the pope or a bishop came out and said that "(Muslim) is the worst word ever written, a sign of infidelity, disbelief, filth, a sign of dirt." and at the same time published a series of DVDs entitled the "Death Series" and preached of martyrdom and a catholic version of Jihad against those who do not share our faith? [removed]:enough!:

[MTAFFI]

deleted

[Trumble]

Do you really think that after reading a single article with a single quote by Sheikh Faiz that your in a fair position to call his words 'sickening' and him 'beneath contempt'?

Yes, at least in relation to the former.

"Put in their soft, tender hearts the zeal of jihad and a love of martyrdom."

is more than enough. Sickening.

[- Qatada -]

Hi MTAFFI.


Kafir means disbeliever, hence according to christians - muslims are disbelievers/kafirs.


Sheikh Fiez never started the wars, rather he encouraged the muslims to fight back because of the opposition their brothers and sisters are facing in the muslim world. These muslims never started the war, rather it has been a long conflict and the UN is doing it under the banner of democracy and peace, and we don't agree with that, and the muslims from them countries don't either.



PS: Please don't use insults.



Peace.

[- Qatada -]

Yes, at least in relation to the former.


is more than enough. Sickening.

The countries those go to fight the opposition if killed are praised if they die for their country. So what's wrong with muslims fighting for what they feel is right?

[IbnAbdulHakim]

Well let me ask you this what would you say if the pope or a bishop came out and said that "(Muslim) is the worst word ever written, a sign of infidelity, disbelief, filth, a sign of dirt." and at the same time published a series of DVDs entitled the "Death Series" and preached of martyrdom and a catholic version of Jihad against those who do not share our faith? [removed]:enough!:

whoah that IS offensive, i feel obligated to apologise on his behalf :eek:

hmm, but still you must admit not fully accepting the one who created you and gives you every breath is quite.. emm.. bad!

[Abu Zakariya]

Well let me ask you this what would you say if the pope or a bishop came out and said that "(Muslim) is the worst word ever written, a sign of infidelity, disbelief, filth, a sign of dirt." and at the same time published a series of DVDs entitled the "Death Series" and preached of martyrdom and a catholic version of Jihad against those who do not share our faith? [removed]:enough!:

Kafir doesn't mean Catholic, so you can't compare the two.

By the way, this was completely taken out of context. It just shows you how sickening the media is, and not Shaykh Feiz (hafidhahullah). Because when he said this thing about the word kafir, he wasn't refering to Christians, or the Jews, or Hindus or whatever. He was refering to a specific person: the anti-Christ. The anti-Christ will have the letters ka-fa-ra on his forehead. And he showed his disgust with the anti-Christ by speaking this way about him. He wasn't refering to Catholics. Thus, your example of the bishop using the same rhetoric about Muslims is crazy. You should've asked us how we would react if a bishop used the same words in reference to the anti-Christ.

As for the second part of your question. Well, if the Catholics preached that they have the right to defend themselves and fight their enemies, then I would have no problem with it. Frankly, I fail to see why you have a problem with us saying that? Is it because you feel that a Muslim state shouldn't have a right to defend itself and fight nations that are hostile towards it (this is what Jihad is)?

and by the way FBI, I cant wait to hear what your remarks in particular will be on this, because in my opinion it is those that share your beliefs that fuel the war that is going on the middle east. If it werent people like this there would be no reason to war against these people. IT IS THESE PEOPLE THAT WANT EVERYONE TO BE ISLAM OR NON EXISTENT. You think it is the West that pushes itself on everyone but it is these extremist that preach to children of death and martyrdom that push the Islamic faith on everyone. He and all those that stand with him will surely one day recieve the wrath of God, Allah or whomever you worship one day. Where is the peace that Islam tells these people to practice, because I fail to see it

He never said that! Shaykh Feiz never said the things you are mentioning here. He isn't saying that either you accept Islam or you die. But the fact that you thought that he did by reading the article, just shows you how irresponsible the media is! Muslims are getting attacked because of articles like this, because people like yourself read these things and imagine what he is saying is that everyone should convert or lose their head. But this isn't true. He is talking about jihad, which isn't about killing the non-Muslims if they don't convert. However, people read these articles and get the idea that it's what it means, and so they think that Muslims want to take over the world, and what happens? Muslims get attacked.

As for what he did say. If it is criminal to say these things, then you will have to ban this verse of the Qur'an from being recited:

Say (O Muhammad SAW): "Verily, my Salât (prayer), my sacrifice, my living, and my dying are for Allâh, the Lord of the 'Alamîn (mankind, jinns and all that exists). (Al-An'am 6:162)

This is a Muslim belief. Our life and death is for our Lord. Let me explain to you what Shaykh Feiz meant, by using an example. There was a Jihad in my country a few years ago. Muslims were being slaughtered and there was a genocide of the Muslims. Do you mean to tell me that my people should've done nothing? No. We as Muslims believe in Jihad. So we fight. We fight for the sake of Allah to make His Word supreme. And in war you might die. But we would love to die for the sake of Allah. We don't just accept that Muslims were being put in concentration camps, tortured and killed. We fight back.

How come it isn't wrong to say that it's honourable to die while fighting for freedom and democracy, but when someone promotes the idea of fighting for the sake of God, then it's all controversial.

Well, our life and our death is for Allah. Deal with it.

[Khattab]

Kafir doesn't mean Catholic, so you can't compare the two.

By the way, this was completely taken out of context. It just shows you how sickening the media is, and not Shaykh Feiz (hafidhahullah). Because when he said this thing about the word kafir, he wasn't refering to Christians, or the Jews, or Hindus or whatever. He was refering to a specific person: the anti-Christ. The anti-Christ will have the letters ka-fa-ra on his forehead. And he showed his disgust with the anti-Christ by speaking this way about him. He wasn't refering to Catholics. Thus, your example of the bishop using the same rhetoric about Muslims is crazy. You should've asked us how we would react if a bishop used the same words in reference to the anti-Christ.

As for the second part of your question. Well, if the Catholics preached that they have the right to defend themselves and fight their enemies, then I would have no problem with it. Frankly, I fail to see why you have a problem with us saying that? Is it because you feel that a Muslim state shouldn't have a right to defend itself and fight nations that are hostile towards it (this is what Jihad is)?



He never said that! Shaykh Feiz never said the things you are mentioning here. He isn't saying that either you accept Islam or you die. But the fact that you thought that he did by reading the article, just shows you how irresponsible the media is! Muslims are getting attacked because of articles like this, because people like yourself read these things and imagine what he is saying is that everyone should convert or lose their head. But this isn't true. He is talking about jihad, which isn't about killing the non-Muslims if they don't convert. However, people read these articles and get the idea that it's what it means, and so they think that Muslims want to take over the world, and what happens? Muslims get attacked.

As for what he did say. If it is criminal to say these things, then you will have to ban this verse of the Qur'an from being recited:

Say (O Muhammad SAW): "Verily, my Salât (prayer), my sacrifice, my living, and my dying are for Allâh, the Lord of the 'Alamîn (mankind, jinns and all that exists). (Al-An'am 6:162)

This is a Muslim belief. Our life and death is for our Lord. Let me explain to you what Shaykh Feiz meant, by using an example. There was a Jihad in my country a few years ago. Muslims were being slaughtered and there was a genocide of the Muslims. Do you mean to tell me that my people should've done nothing? No. We as Muslims believe in Jihad. So we fight. We fight for the sake of Allah to make His Word supreme. And in war you might die. But we would love to die for the sake of Allah.

How come it isn't wrong to say that it's honourable to die while fighting for freedom and democracy, but when someone promotes the idea of fighting for the sake of God, then it's all controversial.

Well, our life and our death is for Allah. Deal with it.

Nice reply.

Its a double standard for such people the fighting to spread democracy and there ideolgies, dying for what they beleive in is more honourable. When someone mentions fighting in the way of Allah (SWT) against those who oppresse these same people label them as 'terrorists'. They have no answer for this, to die for the 'stars and stripes' against these 'extremist moslems' is what they beleive in, they paint themselves as angels and well wishers but as Allah (SWT) says what is in there hearts is far worse.

[chacha_jalebi]

elo ello

its propa stupid when so called sheikhs, tel others to go for jihad, and they jus sit at home!! sheikhs lik dat r jus wannabeez :D

[Abu Zakariya]

elo ello

its propa stupid when so called sheikhs, tel others to go for jihad, and they jus sit at home!! sheikhs lik dat r jus wannabeez :D

He was quoting a hadith. He wasn't telling anyone to go anywehere. You shouldn't backbite our brother.

[IbnAbdulHakim]

elo ello

its propa stupid when so called sheikhs, tel others to go for jihad, and they jus sit at home!! sheikhs lik dat r jus wannabeez :D

umm.. be careful of how you say dat akhee :eek:

coz anwar... he did read out certain books n stuff and theres other sheikhs who try give us the knowledge not necessarily telling us to DO IT NOW but BE PREPARED.


lol jus heads up bro ;)

[chacha_jalebi]

lol:D firstly manz havent backbited:D

2nd, i jus gav my opinion, in the main story it says he encouragin children for jihad, then he callin jews pigs. i dont agree with dat:D. its lik he buildin up hatred, i know the videos hav been edited to look bad,but in the video when he talks bout jews he makes pig noises lol. now that is stupid, jihad isnt meant to be a personal battle, its meant to be for only Allah swt:D

[Abu Zakariya]

lol:D firstly manz havent backbited:D

2nd, i jus gav my opinion, in the main story it says he encouragin children for jihad, then he callin jews pigs. i dont agree with dat:D. its lik he buildin up hatred, i know the videos hav been edited to look bad,but in the video when he talks bout jews he makes pig noises lol. now that is stupid, jihad isnt meant to be a personal battle, its meant to be for only Allah swt:D

Well, akhi you've gone and completely changed the subject. You were talking about telling others to go for jihad and then not doing it yourself. Where did Shaykh Feiz do that? He was quoting ahadith. Jihad is the pinnacle of Islam - Rasulullah sall Allahu 'alayhi wa sallam told us that. Jihad is a part of Islam. Why shouldn't we teach it to our children? Why shouldn't we instill the love of shahadah in our children?

As for the part about the Jews... Well, I haven't seen the whole video. But I seriously doubt that he called the Jews pigs (because if he did, they would've quoted him but they didn't). Now, he might've refered to Jews that fight against Muslims as pigs. Is that racism? Is someone racist for ridiculing al-Qaida? I do hate the extremist Jews that occupy Muslim lands and kill Muslims. I don't see anything wrong with ridiculing them.

[chacha_jalebi]

ok bruv:D

i didnt change subject, you said he was talkin bout a hadiths and that sorted it out:D

also wen preachin you should preach and follow the islamic ethics of behaviour, and riduculin ppl durin a khutba, is wrong!

[Abu Zakariya]

ok bruv:D

i didnt change subject, you said he was talkin bout a hadiths and that sorted it out:D

also wen preachin you should preach and follow the islamic ethics of behaviour, and riduculin ppl durin a khutba, is wrong!

He might've done something wrong. Or not. I don't know. Allahu ta'ala 'alim.
But he's not present here, so let's not talk bad about him. Especially when non-Muslims are attacking him. We are his brothers, we at least should defend him.

[chacha_jalebi]

i jus gav my opinion no harm was intended:D

and the kuffar are attackin him, bcos they wana try and say islam is like that! judgin a religion by lookin at one person is dum:D. cos i can jus turn around and say that co sum priests are peadophiles or gay:p then the christian religion teaches that. and we all know that isnt tru, judgin a religion by lookin at a few ppl is dum:D

[Snowflake]

A big thumbs up to the Sheik for his comment about instilling the love of Jihad in children's hearts.

And to those members who find his comment offensive, you should know that Jihad becomes obligatory at certain times. Like myself the Sheikh must've noticed that the majority of todays muslim youth have astrayed from Islam and the last thing they want to do is die defending their muslims brothers and sisters. So the Shiekh is right in saying the children must be taught this obligation from an early age and be prepared for jihad as adults.

I am going to teach my son his obligation of Jihad as a muslim. And I hope that some day he will put his life on the line to defend his brothers and sisters in Islam. If every muslim stood up to do that, we'd wipe out the oppressers and not leave a sign that they ever walked this earth. Allahu Akbar! :D

[Umar001]

Erm, brother FBI, is this the same brother who was recorded as making a kind of joke with the 'oink oink'?? Argh. :enough!: :enough!:

is more than enough. Sickening.

Just wondering, is there anything in life that you would fight for and would die for?

[sevgi]

im goin off my nut here in Australia.u shud hear the stuff they are saying about him...i feel like laughing and crying at the same time. they introduce him as a "one of Australias leading sheiks..." stuf like, he is the head of all aussie muslims...he doesnt even have that sort of Authority. i could bet a whole lot saying that 70% of muslims in Australia dnt even know who he is, (before he started his crap) let alone follow him and 'sacrifice themselves' because he said so.:enough!:

[Ibn Abi Ahmed]

:sl:

I think our brothers and sisters would benefit much from this:

http://www.islamicboard.com/sects-di...vs-jihadi.html

This is not to attack him, as I dont know much about him, but this ^ clarifies alot.

[Malaikah]

Erm, brother FBI, is this the same brother who was recorded as making a kind of joke with the 'oink oink'?? Argh. :enough!: :enough!:

:sl:

Yes, it is. The joke was tactless for sure, but lets give him the benefit of the doubt because he was talking about the Jews who will be fighting the Muslims in the main war to come, the ones who will hide behind objects and the object would yell out something like 'oh muslim, there is a jew behind me, come and kill him'... so he wasn't referring to all jews.

But yeh the joke was tactless, though it isn't the end of the world.

[MTAFFI]

deleted

[SilentObserver]

I am going to teach my son his obligation of Jihad as a muslim. And I hope that some day he will put his life on the line to defend his brothers and sisters in Islam. If every muslim stood up to do that, we'd wipe out the oppressers and not leave a sign that they ever walked this earth. Allahu Akbar! :D

Most people would consider this the sign of a terrible mother that does not love her child.

[Malaikah]

^Most people are also not Muslim.

[SilentObserver]

It is one thing to raise a child to be willing to put his life on the line for what he believes, and hope that he doesn't have to. It is another very terrible thing to hope that he puts his life on the line.

[Malaikah]

Then what's the point of preaching something you don't expect or want them to use?!

[SilentObserver]

It is twisted and sick, and a very unloving act for a mother to teach and hope that her child puts their life on the line for her beliefs. And that is not my opinion, that is an undisputable fact.

[AHMED_GUREY]

Originally Posted by Muslimah_Sis
I am going to teach my son his obligation of Jihad as a muslim. And I hope that some day he will put his life on the line to defend his brothers and sisters in Islam. If every muslim stood up to do that, we'd wipe out the oppressers and not leave a sign that they ever walked this earth. Allahu Akbar!

Most people would consider this the sign of a terrible mother that does not love her child.

In wich country are gallant soldiers that fight to protect those who can't defend themselves seen as products of bad parenting?

this muslim sister who is a mother or a future mom is/will bring/ing up her son the Islamic way and that includes fighting injustice and defending the helpless that's not bad parenting and it's ridicilous to project your own POV as the general view on this issue, having your child fight injustice and then dying in battle only to receive the highest honor in Islam is what every muslim mother dreams off and prays for.

[SilentObserver]

In wich country are gallant soldiers that fight to protect those who can't defend themselves seen as products of bad parenting?

this muslim sister who is a mother or a future mom is/will bring/ing up her son the Islamic way and that includes fighting injustice and defending the helpless that's not bad parenting and it's ridicilous to project your own POV as the general view on this issue, having your child fight injustice and then dying in battle only to receive the highest honor in Islam is what every muslim mother dreams off and prays for.

Like I said, I agree with teaching them to be willing to fight injustice whenever they see it. But to hope that your child dies in battle so that you can be proud, is sick, selfish, demented, and not from God. This is only for the selfish pride of the parent. Not for the child.

Any person that wants this for their child should have their children taken away.
They don't deserve the blessing that a child is.

End of discussion for me. This is not one of "my opinion" topics. This is black and white. Wanting this for your child is 110% WRONG.

If I saw a mother teaching this to her child, I would report her to child services agency and take steps to have her child placed in a better home.

[sevgi]

Like I said, I agree with teaching them to be willing to fight injustice whenever they see it. But to hope that your child dies in battle so that you can be proud, is sick, selfish, demented, and not from God. This is only for the selfish pride of the parent. Not for the child.

Any person that wants this for their child should have their children taken away.
They don't deserve the blessing that a child is.

End of discussion for me. This is not one of "my opinion" topics. This is black and white. Wanting this for your child is 110% WRONG.

If I saw a mother teaching this to her child, I would report her to child services agency and take steps to have her child placed in a better home.

i agree...but u must remember that become a martyr(in the right cause) is a wonderful thing and mothers may feel that they would rather their child be martyred rather than live a rebelious life and end up out of Gods favour.

but the "fighting in battle" that we are speaking of here doesnt seem to be the pure way...so i agree with u wholly bro.:)

[AHMED_GUREY]

Like I said, I agree with teaching them to be willing to fight injustice whenever they see it. But to hope that your child dies in battle so that you can be proud, is sick, selfish, demented, and not from God. This is only for the selfish pride of the parent. Not for the child.

I agree pride should not be the reason and i think you prejudged Muslimah sis reply cause for a muslim mother to wish for her son to die in a just battle where he receives the highest honor in Islam is far from being selfish actually we could say it's more like a selfless wish since the mother-child bond is ''one of'' if not the strongest emotional links between humans and it's difficult to let go and not to forget every mother would rather have her children burry her instead of the other way around

[SilentObserver]

i agree...but u must remember that become a martyr(in the right cause) is a wonderful thing and mothers may feel that they would rather their child be martyred rather than live a rebelious life and end up out of Gods favour.

but the "fighting in battle" that we are speaking of here doesnt seem to be the pure way...so i agree with u wholly bro.:)

but u must remember that become a martyr(in the right cause) is a wonderful thing and mothers may feel that they would rather their child be martyred rather than live a rebelious life and end up out of Gods favour.

I agree with this part completely, it is preferable to eternal punishment. But it is different from hoping that one's child dies in battle just because that is what one wants for them.

[Malaikah]

Why is it so evil to hope that your child will receive one of the highest positions in paradise and a reward so great that the martyr would wish that he could be returned to his body so he could die for the sake of Allah again?:?

Yeh very selfish. Not.

[AvarAllahNoor]

Like I said, I agree with teaching them to be willing to fight injustice whenever they see it. But to hope that your child dies in battle so that you can be proud, is sick, selfish, demented, and not from God. This is only for the selfish pride of the parent. Not for the child.

Any person that wants this for their child should have their children taken away.
They don't deserve the blessing that a child is.

End of discussion for me. This is not one of "my opinion" topics. This is black and white. Wanting this for your child is 110% WRONG.

If I saw a mother teaching this to her child, I would report her to child services agency and take steps to have her child placed in a better home.

LOL - Why are you getting all worked up about it? its her child let her bring it up how she feels best.

It's good to encourage your child and YOURSELF to stand up for truth and righteousness. I've not seen the whole video (is there an online version or link which can be posted up please?)

I too, as a Sikh would do that. But I'd draw the line at calling others 'unbelievers' Although I know how you lot see the rest of humanity as 'Kafir' which means absolutely N O T H I N G to me! - I am a follow of God, and I do not need other people to tell me I don't believe. Total codswallop.

Like I say, i've not seen it, but even referring to another as a pig is not neccessary. Is this what Isalm encourages? I don't think it does, then why do a few of you condone such things? Perahps it's because you've alot to learn about Islam yourselves. :)

[Malaikah]

^No one justified the pig part. It was just a tactless joke. But to reject everything he said based on one joke is stupid.

[AvarAllahNoor]

^No one justified the pig part. It was just a tactless joke. But to reject everything he said based on one joke is stupid.

Jokes? You get many pig jokes in th Quran then? Odd

[Malaikah]

No! The person in question made a joke likening Jews to pigs. Well that is all they showed anyway, if he said more they didn't make any mention of it.

[IbnAbdulHakim]

^No one justified the pig part. It was just a tactless joke. But to reject everything he said based on one joke is stupid.

this is what i was thinking as well :?

if a man is giving advice with much proof then why reject it because he acted a bit badly.

Also just because of a few kaafirs attacking him many muslims seem to think its ok to slander a brother who testifies to laa ilaala illalaah, Astagfirullaah.

this brothers taught me quite a bit, before i realised his a bit... um... (takfeeri) i learnt quite a bit off him Alhamdulillaah, now i've moved onto Yasir Qadhi, lets hope he never makes pig noises or else maybe everyone would reject all the beautiful teachings his given :rollseyes

[Snowflake]

Most people would consider this the sign of a terrible mother that does not love her child.

That'd be non muslims only. Any loving muslim mother would teach her child the means to attain the pleasure of his Creator. And those means include defending his brothers and sisters for the sake of Allah.

Death is certain, sooner or later and I'd rather my son dies a brave death fighting for the rights of muslims than dying a coward because he was too scared to risk his life to defend his brothers and sisters.

You wouldn't call non muslim mothers whose sons join the army to defend their country. Are you saying that no mother feels proud of her soldier son? Neither would you say that about mothers who support their sons in other professions where they put their life on the line to save others i.e. firefighters/cops. Then why say that about muslim mothers who support and encourage their sons to do the same?

It is not like I want my son to die, but rather that he dies defending muslims because their defence is his duty. We know death is inevitable, hiding away from it isn't going to prevent it. As for a terrible mother, if I had to, I'd give my own life without a split seconds hesitation for the sake of my son's. So if anyone assumes that by teaching my son his duty to defend muslims makes me a terrible mother, then they can think that all they want.

A coward dies many times before his death. The valiant never taste of death but once - William Shakespeare

[Bittersteel]

Say (O Muhammad SAW): "Verily, my Salât (prayer), my sacrifice, my living, and my dying are for Allâh, the Lord of the 'Alamîn (mankind, jinns and all that exists). (Al-An'am 6:162)

This is a Muslim belief. Our life and death is for our Lord. Let me explain to you what Shaykh Feiz meant, by using an example. There was a Jihad in my country a few years ago. Muslims were being slaughtered and there was a genocide of the Muslims. Do you mean to tell me that my people should've done nothing? No. We as Muslims believe in Jihad. So we fight. We fight for the sake of Allah to make His Word supreme. And in war you might die. But we would love to die for the sake of Allah.

you are referring to self defence.I am all for that and if he meant jiahd is okay for self defence then I guess whatever he said was okay.However if he advocated the killing of innocent which is forbidden...

[Malaikah]

:sl:

^Please show us where he said that?

[Isaac]

This is just pure non-sense and pathetic to see muslims brothers and sisters defaming a brother who im sure if far more knowedgable than all of us here. Now why are people defaming and abrogating his words on JIHAAD. Lets talk about this issue. The issue in reagrding the pig is something which i can say was a distasteful and if intented to be used to desrcribe all jews was disrespectful. No evil inteneded towrads the brother in mention.

Now moving on to his mention of jihaad and only in the conetxt we heard it, not what we persume can any MUSLIM say this was wrong and unIslamic. Can any Muslim say that instilling the love for jihaad amongst the youth of the ummah is evil and deviant?

Jihad in self defense is Fard-ayn. Wright or Wrong? The teaching of jihaad and its importance and virtues is just as important as any other aspect of Islaam. The Love of jihaad and desire of martydom is legitament and praisworthy.

Now looking further into his comments, when he mention jihaad, there is no evidence or inclination to say he asscoiated it with killing innocent people, killing Jews, Christians or any one else for the fact. Not once did he mention blowing up trains or attacking Australia or the UK. Now the onus is on the brothers and sisters who say otherwise that his comments on jihaad were incitment to muder innocent people, and perverted. The onus is on those people who have defamed the brother for his comments which are not sinful, unIlslamic, or haraam in anyway. The Onus is now on those people who say otheriwse to bring a transcript of hims saying such words or remain silent and repent to Allah for ascribing words whcih were not said, purely on the bassi of a biased programme and assumptions.

Remember only go on what you heard and saw. Not one what you think he was referring to.

[Abu Zakariya]

MTAFFI

you can manipulate the words this man said all you want, but I will order these videos and see exactly what is in them.

I didn't manipulate his words.

The article refers to racism and specifically Jews.

Where? Where is the quote? They only said that he said this about Jews and it was racism, they didn't quote him. I would like to see for myself what he said, not let this article tell me what to think.

Jews are not anti christ, and they definitely are not muslim.

What's your point?

Every time something like this comes up there is always an excuse, "Oh it is the media" or "oh that is not what he meant". Truth is I am getting so tired of the excuses, the mans needs to face the consequence of his actions.

But the fact that you thought he was inciting Muslims to convert or kill non-Muslims shows you that this article misrepresented his views. Because he didn't say that!

Jihad is just an excuse that some muslims use for their violence today. No one is trying to opress the Muslims and no one is taking their faith from them, with an exception to Palestine and Chechnya, and that is only about some land!!

First of all, the Shaykh was talking about Jihad. Not terrorism or any specific country, as far as I'm aware of.

So what is the Jihad being used for, you tell me?

Jihad is an Islamic concept. When it refers to fighting (it doesn't always refer to that), it is about making the Word of God supreme. This means for instance that when a Muslim country is attacked, you defend it. Also, you carry out military action against hostile countries that don't want peace with the Muslims (like if a country is planning to attack the Muslim state, you do a pre-emptive strike). This is to be carried out by the Muslim head of state.

If Christians published a set of CD's entitled "Death Series" what would your reaction be?

You don't even know what the title "Death Series" refers to. It isn't about killing. It's about death, the grave and the after life. So it's basically about what happens when someone dies. He's lecturing about the angels coming to take the soul of the dead person, the trials of the grave and the Day of Judgement. This particular lesson was probably about the signs of the Day of Judgement since he was talking about the anti-Christ.

I do not believe that this man was speaking specifically of the anti christ. I believe he was speaking of Americans, and westerners that do not share his views.

I know for a fact that he was talking about the anti-Christ because I know the hadith in question. The anti-Christ will have the letters "ka-fa-ra" on his forehead and the Shaykh was talking about this. He wasn't talking about Americans or Westerners. But the media didn't mention this and made you believe that he was talking about Westerners. This shows you that blaming the media isn't an excuse, it's a fact that they deceive people in this way.

Everything I ever read is so open ended, and to me that says someone doesnt want to be specific because of the reaction it may incite. The Muslim community needs to condemn these types of things to show that is not acceptable behavior. If you truly want peace then please stop talking about war.

Muslims are condeming racism and terrorism. The Shaykh wasn't talking about any of these two things. So I'm not going to condemn him.

When I get these tapes and if I see what I think I might see on them, it could very well change my view on Muslims as a whole. I say this because who really knows what anyone is thinking, and I am not going to consider anyone a brother who is taught that suicide bombings are ok or acceptable in any situation (and I am not saying yet that these videos condone it, I am making an assumtion and will know if that is correct when I view the information). Eventually, if this type of behavior that I am speaking of will lead to the demise of Islam as a whole, because eventually no one will feel that this type of behavior is acceptable in the world we live in today.

You see why these types of articles are dangerous. You start thinking that Muslims are animals out for blood or something. They make it same as if this is what the Shaykh said, when he didn't.

[MTAFFI]

Abu Zakariya

I must apologize to you and anyone else who read my previous message.:cry: I spoke before I have seen these videos, when I should not have. This particular issue raises and unacceptable rage inside of me, and brings out a hatred that I honestly dont think I have ever felt. I have ordered some of these videos and I will watch them, and then I will make another thread for it, once I know what was said, good or bad.

I do not dislike Muslims, or any other type of people for that matter, however I will say when I read this particular article and then read others agreeing with it, and saying things like "a big thumbs up" to teaching children that it is OK to die, it just really bothered me. I have a little girl, and I would never tell her it is OK to die for anything. I will tell her to strive to live and let live, I guess that is where I differ from many Muslim people.

Again I am very sorry for the earlier post:-[

[Bittersteel]

Please show us where he said that?

obviously some people think he meant that.They thought he said Muslim children should strap bombs to their bodies and kill every Non-Muslim they see in front of them.

I will say when I read this particular article and then read others agreeing with it, and saying things like "a big thumbs up" to teaching children that it is OK to die,

you are the not the only one bothered.I am too.
I guess he couldn't nice explain what he wanted to explain.I think he tried to mean its good for Muslims to die defending their country.Exactly how they defend is another issue.

[Abu Zakariya]

obviously some people think he meant that.They thought he said Muslim children should strap bombs to their bodies and kill every Non-Muslim they see in front of them.

Then they have to do something about their ignorance. Because he didn't say that. He was talking about Jihad which has been something that's been a part of this Ummah for 1400 years.

[Abu Zakariya]

MTAFFI

Thanks for your last post.

As for the thing about dying. Well, we do teach that the life of someone belongs to God. And we live and die for Him. As for the details, then we aren't saying that you go and strap bombs on your self and kill innocents. The people that do say this are extremists and there aren't a lot of them among the Muslims. The scholars have refuted the people that advocate terrorism. So we aren't refering to this.

As for the concept itself, it isn't unique to Islam. As the Jews of this forum have explained, they are taught to prefer death over polytheism. They would rather commit suicide than accept worshipping idols.

[MinAhlilHadeeth]

It is twisted and sick, and a very unloving act for a mother to teach and hope that her child puts their life on the line for her beliefs. And that is not my opinion, that is an undisputable fact.

That sounds more like an opinion.

[Joan of Arc]

They've just did a BBC special on him and some other Imams that have said some pretty nasty things. This is a video clip of the special with these Imams speaking in their own words.

http://littlegreenfootballs.com/webl...er_Mosque&only

[Umar001]

Am amazed, it seems that some hope for something we are not meanto hope for, is there not a narration that says 'do not hope to meet the enemy' i.e. to fight them? Yet we hope to?

And then we use such terminology with people who might not even comprehend the meaning of Jihad or the meaning of Shahada, no wonder people end up thinking 'This is not from God'

Hmm, as for Speakers making jokes, personally I place an emphasise on it since we live in times where Muslims are misunderstood, so we need to be extra vigilant to show Islam in the right way, for example, if someone knows you well then you can joke around with that person, and they will know your joking and that your not normally that way, but when someone does not know you well and thinks your a sexist man, then you make a joke then that person would not know if that is really you or you just joking.

So at such times it seems very unwise to make such jokes, in my view anyway, and as long as there are speakers who do not make such remarks I will insha'Allah listen to them first, am not saying this against any brother or sister in particularly just my view.

[Joan of Arc]

Am amazed, it seems that some hope for something we are not meanto hope for, is there not a narration that says 'do not hope to meet the enemy' i.e. to fight them? Yet we hope to?

And then we use such terminology with people who might not even comprehend the meaning of Jihad or the meaning of Shahada, no wonder people end up thinking 'This is not from God'

Hmm, as for Speakers making jokes, personally I place an emphasise on it since we live in times where Muslims are misunderstood, so we need to be extra vigilant to show Islam in the right way, for example, if someone knows you well then you can joke around with that person, and they will know your joking and that your not normally that way, but when someone does not know you well and thinks your a sexist man, then you make a joke then that person would not know if that is really you or you just joking.

So at such times it seems very unwise to make such jokes, in my view anyway, and as long as there are speakers who do not make such remarks I will insha'Allah listen to them first, am not saying this against any brother or sister in particularly just my view.

It goes beyond a joke. In every joke it reveals a little bit of truth about yourself. Did you watch the clip? You have Imans saying how women are inferior to a man in every way. You have Imans giving spiritual instruction to beat women if they refuse the hijab. Watch it, it is the words of these people unaltered.

[Umar001]

It goes beyond a joke. In every joke it reveals a little bit of truth about yourself. Did you watch the clip? You have Imans saying how women are inferior to a man in every way. You have Imans giving spiritual instruction to beat women if they refuse the hijab. Watch it, it is the words of these people unaltered.

With all due respect, I have seen it, and I am astonished as to how people can edit so maliciously and still sleep with a ease in their heart.

Let me give you an example, a man named Khalid Yaseen is quoted, from a Dvd named something like 'Muslim Woman's Character' now, I have watched the Dvd more than once, I had it at my house, what the show quotes him as saying is something like 'Here Khalid Yaseen says that Woman equality is a delusion' and so forth, giving the impression of the stereotype that women are less than man and so forth, they do not show the whole of the speech in essence, yet me having watched the Dvd, I know that the speaker was talking about the fact that man has a role and woman has a role, not in a derogatory way, but yes, woman and man are not equal in the sense that man cannot have a child, and so forth, yet the way he was quoted made it seem as though he meant that women are like animals.

Anyhow, I do not expect you in honesty to want to undertake the task of finding the truth out, if you do then it will benefit you if you don't then I guess it will only wrong you.

Also, it would be nice if you would watch a partial reply given by Abu Usamah.

I cannot say I agree with all of the things, since I have not known the other speakers, but the theory of probability tells me that just as I have seen some quoted in less than honest fashion, I can be pretty sure that others probably have been too.

Regards, Eesa :).

[Joan of Arc]

With all due respect, I have seen it, and I am astonished as to how people can edit so maliciously and still sleep with a ease in their heart.

Let me give you an example, a man named Khalid Yaseen is quoted, from a Dvd named something like 'Muslim Woman's Character' now, I have watched the Dvd more than once, I had it at my house, what the show quotes him as saying is something like 'Here Khalid Yaseen says that Woman equality is a delusion' and so forth, giving the impression of the stereotype that women are less than man and so forth, they do not show the whole of the speech in essence, yet me having watched the Dvd, I know that the speaker was talking about the fact that man has a role and woman has a role, not in a derogatory way, but yes, woman and man are not equal in the sense that man cannot have a child, and so forth, yet the way he was quoted made it seem as though he meant that women are like animals.

Anyhow, I do not expect you in honesty to want to undertake the task of finding the truth out, if you do then it will benefit you if you don't then I guess it will only wrong you.

Also, it would be nice if you would watch a partial reply given by Abu Usamah.

I cannot say I agree with all of the things, since I have not known the other speakers, but the theory of probability tells me that just as I have seen some quoted in less than honest fashion, I can be pretty sure that others probably have been too.

Regards, Eesa :).

So how can you misinterpret "When they are 4 we tell them to wear the Hajib, when they are 9 we hit them."? Or "Allah has made the woman deficient"? Or "If she refuses to wear the hijab we hit her"? Or "if you wife refuses you you prod her with your fist"? Or "Allah has ordered us to do brainwashing"?

[Umar001]

Hi Joan,

So how can you misinterpret "When they are 4 we tell them to wear the Hajib, when they are 9 we hit them."?

I have never heard of this as a Hadeeth or as part of the Islamic teachings. As I said before, I cannot testify for all, but for the few that I know I can.

Or "Allah has made the woman deficient"?

If you were to take a look at the reply given by the party that was quoted, i.e. Abu Usamah maybe you'd see his meaning in this.

Furthermore, if you would like to know the topic then I urge you to take a look at this site's refutation area under which you will find a thread discussing something linked to this.

The talking of such a topic would entail hours of discussion and much reading.

http://www.islamicboard.com/refutati...witnesses.html

Or "if you wife refuses you you prod her with your fist"?

This issue again is something which has been discussed on the forum, I would again encourage anyone to read on it, that is if they are sincere in their search.

Or "Allah has ordered us to do brainwashing"?

If you actually view what the man is speaking of he does say something like 'they have done brain defiling..' i.e. indicating that many of us have been confused or in some ways misguided by society, i.e. that homosexuality is right or that sleeping around is ok, and so forth, basic matters that some Jews and Christians would agree with, I know many Christians, family members, who don't like their kids watchin tv, and have only the God channel, because they believe that non believers can influence their kids, so the speaker is saying, because of such defiling that has happend, 'we are ordered to do brain WASHING' i.e. was away the wrong that we have been brought up knowing and being told.

If one takes the whole talk into consideration it would make sense, specially if they watch it again and again, but if you take a two second sound bite then am sure 'brainwashing' will be misunderstood.

Coming to the conclusion, what I would like to say to you is that, am sure as a rational person you have had times where you've needed more than 3 minutes to explain a situation you have found yourself in, now imagine being in a totally alien place, where noone understood your 'culture' and then having to explain to such people why you do what you do, then imagine that you practice that your trying to explain may at first be misunderstood, I am sure you understand that a two minute time gap is not enough to explain. Thus if people are truthful in exposing such teachings they should do it properly, each of the above quotes is something that is seens as 'contraversial' if you have noticed, something that would of course require explanantion and background knowledge if it were to be understood properly, and this is the difference between a truthseeker and one who just seeks to make his own view truthful.

Regards, Eesa :)

[MinAhlilHadeeth]

A general reminder for all:


"If you hear something that you do not like about your brother, then try your best to seek out an excuse for him. And if you do not find any excuse for him, then say: perhaps my brother has an excuse that I do not know about." -Abu Qulamah Al-Jirmi

[- Qatada -]

:salamext:

This Thread seems to be going offtopic.


Thread Closed.