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tomtomsmom
01-25-2007, 07:16 PM
If you really think of religion without really having one, most of them are the same basic roots.
ex: i am the only god and love only me and be a good person

the differences start with exactly what is a good person and how do you become one.

then there is free will. if we were given free will to decide if we should be good or not then why not have the free will on how we want to worship? what if all religions are right and it is left for us to decide which one we believe? what if all of the fighting is over the same god?

i think that it is really hard for most people to tell the difference between tradition and religion. just because it has been done a certain way for thousands of years does not mean that the religion itself makes it that way.

a question for christians----what does eggs and rabits have to do with easter? i don't understand.

please don't take offence to any of this......i am only trying to find my way.
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- Qatada -
01-25-2007, 07:39 PM
Hey tomtomsmom.


I think the difference is that the majority of all other faiths believe in God, they believe that God created the heavens, the earth and everything we have. The problem is that even though they believe this, they believe that others should be worshipped along with God.

So polytheists believe in the Creator too, however they believe that the idols they worship/pray to etc are intermediaries between them and God. If they pray to these idols, its a form of associating partners to God because if God is the All-Hearer, then why not pray to Him Alone anyway?


And your Lord said: "Invoke Me, [i.e. believe in My Oneness (Islâmic Monotheism)] (and ask Me for anything) I will respond to your (invocation). Verily! Those who scorn My worship [i.e. do not invoke Me, and do not believe in My Oneness, (Islâmic Monotheism)] they will surely enter Hell in humiliation!" [Qur'an 40:60]



If thou ask them, who it is that created the heavens and the earth. They will certainly say, "Allah". Say: "Praise be to Allah!" But most of them understand not. [31:25]


If indeed thou ask them who has created the heavens and the earth and subjected the sun and the moon (to his Law), they will certainly reply, "Allah". How are they then deluded away (from the truth)? [29:61]


Is it not to Allah that sincere devotion is due? But those who take for protectors other than Allah (say): "We only serve them in order that they may bring us nearer to Allah." Truly Allah will judge between them in that wherein they differ. But Allah guides not such as are false and ungrateful. [39:3]



That's what all other people who believe in God do. We don't believe God has children because He doesn't have to. And if someone says that God can do anything, then you have to ask them if God can lie? Or the simple argument by the philosophers; can God make a rock so heavy that no-one can pick it up? The answer to this is simple, God only does what befits His majesty.


Had Allah wished to take to Himself a son, He could have chosen whom He pleased out of those whom He doth create: but Glory be to Him! (He is above such things.) He is Allah, the One, the Irresistible. [39:4]


All worship is due to God Almighty, and Allaah is what the arabs call God, so its nothing new, even the christian arabs call God, Allaah.


Our testification of faith is that there is none worthy of worship [i.e. of being divinely obeyed, prayed to, worshipped etc.] besides God Alone, and that Muhammad (peace be upon him) is God's Final Messenger.

And verily, We have sent among every Ummah (community, nation) a Messenger (proclaiming): "Worship Allah (Alone), and avoid (or keep away from) Taghut (all false deities, etc. i.e. do not worship Taghut besides Allah)." Then of them were some whom Allah guided and of them were some upon whom the straying was justified. So travel through the land and see what was the end of those who denied (the truth). [Qur'an 16:36]

So all prophets actually called to the worship of God Alone, without no associates. So we dont believe God is in three parts, or that God should be contacted through stone idols.

This (Quran) is a Message for mankind (and a clear proof against them), in order that they may be warned thereby, and that they may know that He is the only One Ilah (God - Allah) - (none has the right to be worshipped but Allah), and that men of understanding may take heed.

[Qur'an 14:52]


And Allaah Almighty knows best.



Peace. :)



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Woodrow
01-25-2007, 07:44 PM
Not Christian but I believe I can answer this.


a question for christians----what does eggs and rabits have to do with easter? i don't understand.
Eggs and Rabbits do have a lot to do with Easter, more properly called Estor which is the feast of the pagan goddess of spring.

The question is how did it get mixed into Christianity and why do Christians still celebrate it with the same name and the traditional druid ceremony?
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Goku
01-25-2007, 07:46 PM
Originally Posted by Woodrow
Not Christian but I believe I can answer this.




Eggs and Rabbits do have a lot to do with Easter, more properly called Estor which is the feast of the pagan goddess of spring.

The question is how did it get mixed into Christianity and why do Christians still celebrate it with the same name and the traditional druid ceremony?
Constantine mixed pagan practices to with Christianity to make Christianity more appealing to the pagans, maybe this was one of them.
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Jayda
01-25-2007, 07:46 PM
hola tomtomsmom,

this is an interesting question... i think many western people would like to believe that all religions lead to God, for cultural reasons... like they feel that religions are divisive because they identify some people as good and other people as bad... for many reasons, including actions and beliefs... and i think it is the second part that western people are so afraid of religion for... it says certain beliefs are wrong or sinful, just like very bad actions...

i do not believe that practices are minor things... and beyond that i do not believe that different practices, traditions or as you say cultures is the only thing that separates religions.

i believe we are Gods favorite creation and that we were made for a purpose... but He did not abandon us and has made our purpose explicit through specific Revelations and vehicles of Grace... like His Son or His Church.

i believe that it is correct for us to seek these things out, which God has specifically sanctioned for us to reach to him with over man made paths to heaven... towers of Babel.

but i do agree with i think one thing, that many religions have things in common with Christianity... like all seek good, many seek a specific good diety or even closer like the case with islam and Christianity... i think that is a wonderful thing, and that because of shared beliefs or directions there is at least something fundamentally redeeming in these other religions... but it is only redeeming in that they share something in common with the specific path God intended us to travel...

i hope that last part makes sense...

Dios te bendiga
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Jayda
01-25-2007, 08:02 PM
Originally Posted by Woodrow
Not Christian but I believe I can answer this.




Eggs and Rabbits do have a lot to do with Easter, more properly called Estor which is the feast of the pagan goddess of spring.

The question is how did it get mixed into Christianity and why do Christians still celebrate it with the same name and the traditional druid ceremony?
hola Woodrow and Tomtomsmom,

this is kind of a westcentric question...

...i have never seen a rabbit, egg, large red man with a satchell, reindeer, or christmas tree included in a Church service as an actual christmas or easter religious practice or symbol...

i think it is important to remember that these two holidays are very basic in terms of what is religiously obligated... but they are also cultural holidays in christian countries and have attached cultural things that may predate Christianity in some cases, just in how certain cultures observe it... you are asking about the cultural celebrations in the west... it is not so outside the west, like mexican families do not have yule logs, gift baskets from large rabbits, (many do not have christmas trees), easter bunnies and do not dream of white christmases...

in many parts of central mexico the easter tradition is to carry santos or statues of Jesus or Mary through the streets and have him vanquish statues of old pagan aztek gods or figures of death... this is all...

again it is only a cultural celebration, not a Church endorsed easter or christmas practice... from time to time when these kinds of celebrations get out of hand or delve into completely unchristian practices the Church will move to stifle them... this has happened to Christmas in the West sometimes, and recently to certain lenten practices in south america recently... even though the Church moves to stifle the cultural celebrations if they are over the top, it still celebrates the holy days as it always does, with a solemn mass and special reflections on the religious significance of the day...

i hope i explained this well

Dios te bendiga
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Umar001
01-26-2007, 12:44 AM
Originally Posted by tomtomsmom
If you really think of religion without really having one, most of them are the same basic roots.
ex: i am the only god and love only me and be a good person

Well most religions do have similar teachings at their core. Maybe we should be asking, why and what is the link?

Christianity claims to be a continuation of Judaism, thus it explains why there might be a link.

But on a whole I have not come to a clear cut explanation.

Except in Islaam, Islaam teaches this:


Not a messenger did We send before thee without this inspiration sent by Us to him: that there is no god but I; therefore worship and serve Me.

So we see that according to the Islamic belief there were messengers and prophets before Muhammad, peace be upon them, and all of them were told 'There is no god but I (meaning ALmighty God) therefore worship and serve Me' So the basic foundations are here.


Originally Posted by tomtomsmom
the differences start with exactly what is a good person and how do you become one.
The three major religions again if you look carefully tell you how to become a good person, they all emphesise on the acknowledgement of God, that is the fundamental, Moses, according to the Old Testament and Jewish writings told us the first commandment, according to New Testament writings Jesus told us the greatest commandment which was the first, and according to Islamic writings Muhammad told us the greatest commandment, all three were about KNOWING, i.e. acknowledging that God Is One, through this thus it implied knowing and acting upon that knowledge.

The Books of James says, in chpt 2 verse 19:


19You believe that there is one God. Good! Even the demons believe that—and shudder.

This is talking about the fact that FAITH without deed is DEAD. And in Islam we are told, in the Qu'ran chpt Muhammad verse 19:


Know, therefore, that there is no god but Allah, and ask forgiveness for thy fault, and for the men and women who believe

So here we see that we must have the Knowledge of God, as in the commandments given by Jesus and Moses according to some scriptures, to KNOW, this knowledge alone is not enough, as the Book of James tells us, actions are needed, and Islam shows us, Know and then ask for FORGIVENESS.

This is the rough outline, the depth is interesting. So how do we become a good person, the three religions give us the start, i.e. acknowledging God, then this knowledge of God should be implimented as shown by the book of James and the Qu'ran.

How should it be implimented? Through Submission, this is again told to Christians in the book of James, chapter 4 verse 7:


7Submit yourselves, then, to God. Resist the devil, and he will flee from you.

So submission is a key, this is also known in Islam, for islam itself, as in the word, comes from a root word meaning submission.

So at least the three main religions show us how to be good people, i.e. acknowledging God and then submitting to him.

I think I'll leave it there am abit tired.

Eesa.
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Pygoscelis
01-26-2007, 12:13 PM
Religious belief is understandable. People have a need to explain the unexplained, to have a sense of control over the uncontrolled, to believe that all will turn out ok, to believe that they will somehow live forever, and to believe that they are superior to others. It is not at all suprising that religions sprouted up. And it is not suprising that they all fill these roles. It has the added bonus of keeping the populace placated and obedient to their rulers (who tell them what their deities want).

The ones that have survived and spread best are of course the ones that encourage spreading (through missionaries, breeding, holy war, etc).
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IbnAbdulHakim
01-26-2007, 01:00 PM
Hey,

Originally Posted by tomtomsmom
If you really think of religion without really having one, most of them are the same basic roots.
but a root means it came from the same place, thats not true. Islam has always been around since the time of Adam, all other religions are distortions of islam.

Allah told Adam AS to worship him alone, he was the prophet of God and Adam did that, when he passed away people wanted to remember the pious people so they made statues to remember them. As time went by they forgot why they made statues so they started worshipping them, this is the cause of the devils whispers.

I hope you understand what i mean.

Every other religion is a distortion along the line.

Root of Islam - From God

Root of Judaism - Rabbi's

Root of Christians - From inspired saints who claim to have the spirit.
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tomtomsmom
01-26-2007, 02:34 PM
i am not saying "roots" as in they all start from the same place. but within each of the 3 major religions the core message in each one is i am god love only me and be a good person.
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IbnAbdulHakim
01-26-2007, 02:38 PM
hmm but, true love is accepting him as he really is right? without associating partners with him and following him and loving him. From what i know muslims strive to obey the commands and follow their prophet most... but maybe someone else has a different view.
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- Qatada -
01-26-2007, 04:14 PM
Hey tomtomsmom.


The difference is that if we really love God, we have to love what He loves instead of simply stating we love Him. And we know that God doesn't have any associates, so why do people ascribe that to Him? So we should try to stay away from evil to please Him. At the same time we should do good to please Him, and everything we do in life can be an act of worship, this is done through islaam (submission towards the Creator) because islaam is a whole way of life, and covers all aspects unlike any other way of life.



Peace.
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Pygoscelis
01-27-2007, 09:57 AM
Originally Posted by IbnAbdulHakim
Hey,but a root means it came from the same place, thats not true. Islam has always been around since the time of Adam, all other religions are distortions of islam.
That sounds like a contradiction. If your view is that all other religions came t be as disortions of Islam, then they all do have a common root, the formation of Islam.
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Pygoscelis
01-27-2007, 10:00 AM
Originally Posted by Fi_Sabilillah
So we should try to stay away from evil to please Him. At the same time we should do good to please Him
But not JUST to please him, correct? Allah isn't your sole motivation to do good and avoid evil.
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- Qatada -
01-27-2007, 12:02 PM
Originally Posted by Pygoscelis
But not JUST to please him, correct? Allah isn't your sole motivation to do good and avoid evil.

Why not? Everyone has an intention whenever doing any action, and if we do it to please Allaah - we don't expect a favour off the other person. That's actually better than doing it for someone else because we expect our reward off Allaah instead of the creation.


Verily, the Abrar (pious, who fear Allah and avoid evil), shall drink a cup (of wine) mixed with water from a spring in Paradise called Kafur.

A spring of which the [righteous] servants of Allah will drink; they will make it gush forth in force [and abundance].


They (are those who) fulfill (their) vows, and they fear a Day whose evil will be wide-spreading.

And they give food, inspite of their love for it (or for the love of Him), to Miskin (poor), the orphan, and the captive,


(Saying): "We feed you seeking Allah's Countenance only. We wish for no reward, nor thanks from you.

Verily, We fear from our Lord a Day, hard and distressful, that will make the faces look horrible (from extreme dislikeness to it)."


[Qur'an 76: 5-10]



It's actually better to please Allaah because it makes the person more humble instead of acting arrogant for the 'favours' they've done to a certain person. Rather we should be thankful to Allaah for His favours upon us, because we couldn't have supported anyone except through what Allaah has provided us with. :)

Peace.
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IbnAbdulHakim
01-27-2007, 01:47 PM
Originally Posted by Pygoscelis
That sounds like a contradiction. If your view is that all other religions came t be as disortions of Islam, then they all do have a common root, the formation of Islam.
lol true :D thanks :)
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