Originally Posted by YamahaR1
The first point to note is what Br. Khattab expressed very nicely, that there is no country today which can claim to be accurately implementing the Shariah.
The second point to note is that before you can make a judgement about something you have to know what it is. If you don't understand Shariah law, then how can we expect you to "buy that Shariah is the end of evil of any kind.
Thirdly, the Shariah law is a divine system of law revealed by Our Creator who knows human beings better than they know themselves. Hence, He has revealed to them the most appropriate system of Law.
To begin your understanding of Shariah law, particularly the criminal law as that seems to be the subject of discussion, I would recommend the following link:
Are you telling me that khilifah (and forgive me, I am not familiar with all terms here yet) is something that was actually written by the hand of Allah himself?
The khilafa was a system decreed by God Himself, yes. However, the latter part of your comment is inaccurate due to lack of understanding the methods of revelation.
Originally Posted by Yamaha
And why should there be? :brother: The previous revelations were entrusted to their respective nations to preserve, but the challenge for followers of the Qur'an is not to preserve it (for God has promised to do so) but instead to spread its light to all humanity.
The Bible also speaks of the corruption:
Jeremiah 8:8 'How can you say, "We are wise, for we have the law of the LORD," when actually the lying pen of the scribes has handled it falsely?
And for an Islamic perspective, check here:
We'll save that discussion for the comparative religion section.
I have no problem with people who do not believe as I do. Where I take offense is when people want to force their religious beliefs on me. It's one of those "western" things that I'm rather proud of....freedom to believe and worship as I want.
Its not just a "western" thing. Its an Islamic thing too...
Qur'an 2:256 Let there be no compulsion in religion: Truth stands out clear from Error.
This is where I have an issue. I don't think human beings are perfect. Maybe the prohet Mohammed injected some of his own thoughts while translating allah's wishes?
Such a notion would suggest that God was incapable of protecting His message. God clearly refutes such ideas in the Qur'an so that there may be no doubts:
69:43-48 (This is) a Message sent down from the Lord of the Worlds. And if the apostle were to invent any sayings in Our name, We should certainly seize him by his right hand, And We should certainly then cut off the artery of his heart: Nor could any of you withhold him (from Our wrath).
But verily this is a Message for the God-fearing.
But let's say you wish to argue that Prophet Muhammad pbuh wrote the Qur'an himself. In response to such an argument, I suggest you read the article here:
I think you will find that site fascinating, insha'Allah.
Another good site is the following:
I don't know. I wasn't there I'm not trying to be disrespectful to your religion at all....really I'm not. I just think human beings are imperfect and therefore, capable of mistakes and of injecting their own spin on things.
God does not pick any random human being for His divine revelation. The Prophets were the best servants of God ever created. They were infallible in the sense that they could commit no major sins, however, as human beings they may have made minor mistakes but they could do nothing but deliver their message to the people in the purest form. We can discuss this in more detail in the comparative religion section.
And, just look at the various opinions on this board regarding the muslim stance on various issues.
As the Qur'an says:
Say: "Are those equal, those who know and those who do not know?
Onviously you cannot consider the opinions of the average joe on equal footing with those who have studied Islam and are capable of supporting their views with the Qur'an and Sunnah.
Is it because there are some who are not following their religion correctly 100%? Is it because different people interpret statements differently? Is it because some people follow things that make sense and use their noggin to make the best choice when something doesn't seem right? Is it all of the above?
To be honest, most often it is due to ignorance.
I once read...."Is man made in the image of God or is God made in the image of man?"
I would say neither. The Creator is totally unlike and far greater than His creation.
From what I gather where Islam is concerned, it seems that muslims prefer a government that is reflective of their religious values. Well, that's great if everyone in your country believes as you do.
Actually, an Islamic government entails that minorities are protected and they are not harassed for their views.
As Dr. M. Hamidullah writes:
When the Prophet Mohammed settled down in Medina, he found there complete anarchy, the region having never known before either a State or a king to unite the tribes torn by internecine feuds. In just a few weeks, he succeeded in rallying all the inhabitants of the region into order. He constituted a city state, in which Muslims, Jews, pagan Arabs and also probably a small number of Christians, all entered into a statal organism by means of a social contract. The constitutional law of this first 'Muslim' State - which was the confederacy as a sequence of the multiplicity of the population groups - has come down to us in toto, and we read therein not only in clause 25: "to Muslims their religion, and to Jews their religion," or, "that there would be benevolence and justice," but even the unexpected passage in the same clause 25: "the Jews . . . are a community (in alliance) with - according Ibn Hisham and in the version of Abu-'Ubaid, a community (forming part) of - the believers (i.e., Muslims)." The very fact that, at the time of the constitution of this city-state, the autonomous Jewish villages acceded of their free will to the confederal State, and recognized Muhammad as their supreme political head, implies in our opinion that the non-Muslim subjects possessed the right of votes in the election of the head of the Muslim State, at least in so far as the political life of the country was concerned. (Hamidullah, Introduction to Islam, paragraphs 414-416)
And the Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him said):
"No Jew is to be annoyed because of their Judaic faith."
"Whoever hurts a Non-Muslim citizen of a Muslim state hurts me, and he who hurts me annoys God." (Bukhari)
For more info on the Islamic goverment refer to the following:
For more info on the noble character of Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him), please refer to the following:
Our forefathers left their home countries for various reasons...one was to have the freedom to worship as they wanted. Today, we maintain that. We believe in separation of church and state.
Note that such a view contradicts the Bible.
There is a big debate in our country regarding homosexual marriage. While I personally think that homosexuality is sinful, it is not illegal to be a homosexual in this country. And, if they choose a partner that they want to marry, then I do not think that my religious beliefs should trump their right to marry if they want. That would be forcing my religious beliefs and values on someone else.
Do you not believe that God was truthful when He said that homosexuality was a sin? Are you not disobeying God by discarding His decree to follow the whims of society?
As long as health care coverage, and other rights given to heterosexual couples has legal ties with marriage, I can not deny this right to homosexuals even though I do not agree with their lifestyle.
Even if God commands you?
Another example, if my child attends a public school, I do not want a teacher at that school openly discussing their religious beliefs with my children (unless they asked a question). I, as the parent, am responsible for the spirtual growth of my child. I do not want someone teaching them about theirs unless they are also teaching my child about all religions....I see a difference there between trying to convert someone and simply teaching tolerance and understanding.
You have suprisingly secular views. Do you realize that such a view necessitates that all religions are false? If even one religion is true then it must be preached to the world.
Nevertheless, I agree that we must respect the views of others. However, we should distinguish between respecting other views and disobeying the commands of God.
It's interesting that you would say that since the bible is very similar to what I've seen of the Koran. Just curious, have you ever read a bible? Have you read any of the scripture according to Mark, Luke or John?
I know the question wasn't asked to me, but yes I have. And I would like to mention that the Bible is fundamentally a different type of religious scripture since it was inspired
while the Qur'an was revealed word-for-word
Originally Posted by ButterflyLady
Hi Butterflylady (welcome back :) )
That's the whole paradox of liberation. It is the hijaab that liberates a woman from being enslaved to the desires of society.
For more info on Hijaab please read here
To understand how Islam has liberated women, please read here