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iqbal_soofi
03-02-2007, 09:01 PM
When a discussion forum is online and open for public, then how come it's still called a private discussion forum?

When a discussion forum is targetting the public to learn some ideology in only the way the owner of the forum wants them to know about it, and to hide important facts and truth about it, then don't you think it's some kind of propaganda for some vested interest?
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'Abd al-Baari
03-02-2007, 10:12 PM
Salams

interesting question bro
don't know the answer myself though, Inshallah some will answer
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IbnAbdulHakim
03-02-2007, 10:17 PM
Originally Posted by iqbal_soofi
When a discussion forum is online and open for public, then how come it's still called a private discussion forum?

When a discussion forum is targetting the public to learn some ideology in only the way the owner of the forum wants them to know about it, and to hide important facts and truth about it, then don't you think it's some kind of propaganda for some vested interest?
:salamext:

ye lol, that sounds a lot like propaganda, would be better if all false allegations were strongly refuted. That way the person can make a good choice...
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aamirsaab
03-02-2007, 10:25 PM
:sl:

When a discussion forum is targetting the public to learn some ideology in only the way the owner of the forum wants them to know about it,
You're free to ask any questions you wish. Though, like any system, we have rules, boundaries if you will.

and to hide important facts and truth about it, then don't you think it's some kind of propaganda for some vested interest?
Propoganda? This forum? Please.
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strider
03-02-2007, 10:27 PM
Originally Posted by iqbal_soofi
When a discussion forum is online and open for public, then how come it's still called a private discussion forum?

When a discussion forum is targetting the public to learn some ideology in only the way the owner of the forum wants them to know about it, and to hide important facts and truth about it, then don't you think it's some kind of propaganda for some vested interest?
It's a possibility.

Literally anybody can open up a site on the internet addressing a particular issue. Some forums choose to be protected in order to maintain security amongst other things, and they are within their right to do so.
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Maidah
03-02-2007, 10:29 PM
Originally Posted by iqbal_soofi
When a discussion forum is online and open for public, then how come it's still called a private discussion forum?

When a discussion forum is targetting the public to learn some ideology in only the way the owner of the forum wants them to know about it, and to hide important facts and truth about it, then don't you think it's some kind of propaganda for some vested interest?
i would dare 2 guess that it's probably cuz some topics are just not appropriate to be discussed generally. and sometimes ppl can get offended by the truth. I think inorder to spread knowledge through these means it's best to me moderate and select what is appropriate to be put out to the public. The point here is the to collect the fact provided and pick out what is of use to u, inorder to increase ones knowledge of the deen.

Best is to seek the truth urself from multiple sources at areas you're unsure of. :happy:
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iqbal_soofi
03-02-2007, 11:05 PM
Originally Posted by strider
It's a possibility.

Literally anybody can open up a site on the internet addressing a particular issue. Some forums choose to be protected in order to maintain security amongst other things, and they are within their right to do so.
My point is that some people may have difference of opinion. Every one should be given a fair chance to prove one's point if it is different from the owner/moderator's point of view. Why some posts with different view points are deleted randomly?
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- Qatada -
03-02-2007, 11:21 PM
The reason why the mods may delete some posts is because some people might claim that there is a certain belief of the muslims and they may make up something which isn't part of the religion. :)

Which goes against forum rules:


18. Do not say "Islam says X" unless your position is based upon sound evidence - which means the Qur'an and the Sunnah. Always cite your sources. If quoting the Qur'an, give soorah (chapter) and ayah (verse) number. For ahadeeth, you must the name of the collection, volume/book number and hadeeth number. Unless you quoting from an agreed-upon authenthic collection (i.e. Bukharee, Muslim) you must also provide authenthic information.

http://www.islamicboard.com/faq/foru...warning_levels
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Muezzin
03-02-2007, 11:24 PM
Originally Posted by iqbal_soofi
When a discussion forum is online and open for public, then how come it's still called a private discussion forum?
Dude, a supermarket is open to the public. It's still private property. :)

Bro Fi answered your other point above.
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snakelegs
03-03-2007, 12:56 AM
Originally Posted by iqbal_soofi
My point is that some people may have difference of opinion. Every one should be given a fair chance to prove one's point if it is different from the owner/moderator's point of view. Why some posts with different view points are deleted randomly?
i don't think things are deleted randomly = there's a method to their madness!
the owners of the forum make whatever rules they wish, since they are the owners and we are not.
agree - sometimes the rules are frustrating, but if you want to participate you gotta go by them.....or else you get beheaded and recycled.
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iqbal_soofi
03-03-2007, 02:09 PM
Originally Posted by Muezzin
Dude, a supermarket is open to the public. It's still private property. :)

Bro Fi answered your other point above.
Thank you for making it clear that it's like a supermarket. They're selling Islam here. They've made a commodity of it. However, when a customer has already paid the price, then it's his right to complaint if he got the defective merchandise. The complaints are deleted/supressed on purpose so that the potential new targets/victims don't learn the truth about the defective merchandise.

I'm an old customer. My forefathers purchased this commoditity many centuries ago for our better future in this world as well for the next. But we went dowards economically as well as morally more we used this commodity. You'll notice that those areas of Muslim societies are more backward economically as well as morally where there's more business of Islam is taking place. The dealers and promoters of this commodity (rulers, government servants, government contractors, mullahs, prostitutes) have benefitted a lot from us by selling this commodity to us. We're still paying a high price for our own disaster. Therefore we shouldn't let em promote the business of this defective merchandise any further. I'll keep telling the truth about it to make the targeted public aware of their harmful business. Let me see how many posts they delete.
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Muezzin
03-03-2007, 02:11 PM
Whatever, man. I think you're missing the point, but live and let live and all that.
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iqbal_soofi
03-03-2007, 05:45 PM
Originally Posted by Muezzin
Whatever, man. I think you're missing the point, but live and let live and all that.
You cannot grow or even live if you let the cancer grow in your body. The Muslim societies where this cancer is growing are living like sick nations. Their honest and hardworking individuals are migrating to other countries because this cancer has made their countries unliveable.
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strider
03-03-2007, 05:54 PM
If you don't like this forum or any other forum on the internet there is a simple solution to your problem: leave.

Carrying on from the supermarket analogy, if they don't accept your goods you are free to shop elsewhere.
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iqbal_soofi
03-03-2007, 06:09 PM
Originally Posted by strider
If you don't like this forum or any other forum on the internet there is a simple solution to your problem: leave.

Carrying on from the supermarket analogy, if they don't accept your goods you are free to shop elsewhere.
I'm not doing any shopping for the harmful materials. I'm creating awarness against harmful drugs of all kinds, material drugs as well as the spiritual ones. The spiritual drugs are deadlier than the material drugs. See their affects on our societies. After all we've to live in the same societies. Street crimes and corruption in our societies are sharply on rise because more people are geting addicted to these drugs. Somebody need to stop it.
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strider
03-03-2007, 06:10 PM
Originally Posted by iqbal_soofi
I'm not doing any shopping for the harmful materials. I'm creating awarness against harmful drugs of all kinds, material drugs as well as the spiritual ones. The spiritual drugs are deadlier than the material drugs. See their affects on our societies. After all we've to live in the same societies. Street crimes and corruption in our societies are sharply on rise because more people are geting addicted to these drugs. Somebody need to stop it.
So what exactly is your objection?
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iqbal_soofi
03-03-2007, 06:47 PM
Originally Posted by strider
So what exactly is your objection?
My ojbection is that promoting evil in the name of good is bad. Exploiting the name of Quran and Hadith to justify evil and to kill new ideas is bad. Healthy brains always create new ideas that move any society forward. To stop them developing their societies with new ideas and limiting everything to Quran and Hadith with which nobody even the high class religious could develop or produce anything worthwhile for humanity is a social crime.
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strider
03-03-2007, 06:51 PM
Originally Posted by iqbal_soofi
My ojbection is that promoting evil in the name of good is bad. Exploiting the name of Quran and Hadith to justify evil and to kill new ideas is bad. Healthy brains always create new ideas that move any society forward. To stop them developing their societies with new ideas and limiting everything to Quran and Hadith with which nobody even the high class religious could develop or produce anything worthwhile for humanity is a social crime.
I agree, but nonetheless a private discussion on the internet reserves the right to bar people who not agree with them.
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- Qatada -
03-03-2007, 06:56 PM
Originally Posted by iqbal_soofi
My ojbection is that promoting evil in the name of good is bad. Exploiting the name of Quran and Hadith to justify evil and to kill new ideas is bad. Healthy brains always create new ideas that move any society forward. To stop them developing their societies with new ideas and limiting everything to Quran and Hadith with which nobody even the high class religious could develop or produce anything worthwhile for humanity is a social crime.

The Qur'an and Authentic Ahadith are the guidance which Allaah revealed to us. :) If we don't even accept them as our source of law, then we really have to question our faith.

Nowhere in islaam does it prohibit us to make new innovations in technology etc. yet matters of worship are limited according to how the Messenger of Allaah (peace be upon him) performed worship. If we don't accept him as our final messenger, and we prefer a way other than his way, and the way of Allaah - then we're going down a really dangerous path.


We do not stop you or anyone else from using evidences from Qur'an and Authentic Sunnah (while not taking them out of context) to post your views. But to say that islaam says so and so without these leads to others understanding islaam the wrong way, and it can harm our belief in Allaah, His messengers, this world and also the hereafter. If anything like this is done, then we will delete the posts inshaa Allaah as it is part of the forum rules.



Regards.
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iqbal_soofi
03-03-2007, 07:48 PM
Originally Posted by Fi_Sabilillah
The Qur'an and Authentic Ahadith are the guidance which Allaah revealed to us. :) If we don't even accept them as our source of law, then we really have to question our faith.

Nowhere in islaam does it prohibit us to make new innovations in technology etc. yet matters of worship are limited according to how the Messenger of Allaah (peace be upon him) performed worship. If we don't accept him as our final messenger, and we prefer a way other than his way, and the way of Allaah - then we're going down a really dangerous path.


We do not stop you or anyone else from using evidences from Qur'an and Authentic Sunnah (while not taking them out of context) to post your views. But to say that islaam says so and so without these leads to others understanding islaam the wrong way, and it can harm our belief in Allaah, His messengers, this world and also the hereafter. If anything like this is done, then we will delete the posts inshaa Allaah as it is part of the forum rules.



Regards.


As far using Quran and Hadith as evidences to prove something, the religious scholars can use them any way they like, but nobody else could use them as an evidence even for a rgihtful action. I give you an interesting example here:

Recently here was a long debate in Pakistan on the resoration of women's rights in the country. The leading religious scholars and leaders opposed the women's right bill using evidences from Quran and Sunnah. At the end when they saw that they couldn't convince the people, then they threatened to resign from the assemblies. On a number of TV shows, the opponents requested them not to resign if they couldn't win majority on this issue. They gave evidences from Quran and Hadith that it'd be a great sin if they continued to be the members of the assembly after it passed the women's rights bill which according to them is against Sharia.

The bill was passed with overwhelming majority. The supporters of the religious scholars/leaders were disappointed because their leaders didn't resign according to their committment. Now you could see them on different talk shows on TV justifying their move which is not to resigning from the assemblies. They again use a lot of evidences from Quran and Hadith to prove that resigning from assemblies is a great sin. Only some stupid fanatics take them seriously now. Sensible people just laugh at them when they make such a sharp U-Turn. They're eating what they spit a few days ago. They used eveidences of Quran and Hadith for their opposite actions.
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- Qatada -
03-03-2007, 08:53 PM
And where does it state that women dont have rights in islaam? :) This religion is perfect as Allaah Almighty has stated in the Qur'an:

This day have I perfected your religion for you, completed My favour upon you, and have chosen for you Islam as your religion. [Qur'an 5:3]
So whatever happens on tv shows isn't of concern to me. The scholars who follow the Qur'an and Sunnah according to the companions of the Messenger of Allaah (peace be upon him) are the rightly guided as stated by the prophet himself. I don't need to object to that, and i'm sure alot of muslims don't either. :)


If you have any problems regarding the rules, then i'm sure you can put it forward to the main admins inshaa Allaah.



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