Re: Seperate debate from Al-Aqsa thread

[rebelishaulman]

This was an off topic debate that started on another thread. As the Debate seems like a seperate one from the original topic I believe it needs a seperate thread on it's own.

I must say, that is quite far-fetched. That mosque will remain. And I swear, the one you are waiting for, the one who was mentioned in your scriptures, has already come and gone. The one you await now is none other than the False Messiah. But this, only time will confirm.

Alright. You continue to believe in the jesus myth of the "virgin birth" which how many times was a claim by false pagan gods?

The proof is what you said. You of course will oppose the Moshiach! You must do this, and you have no choice in the matter but to believe he will be false. How else will the Moshaich at first fight the wars of G-d, if he has no enemies? Until then, continue to gaurd the Temple Mount from evil idolators and do the honorable job G-d has assigned you to do as a babysitter.

Peace.

[جوري]

وَآتَيْنَا مُوسَى الْكِتَابَ وَجَعَلْنَاهُ هُدًى لِّبَنِي إِسْرَائِيلَ أَلاَّ تَتَّخِذُواْ مِن دُونِي وَكِيلاً {2}

[Pickthal 17:2] We gave unto Moses the Scripture, and We appointed it a guidance for the children of Israel, saying: Choose no guardian beside Me.

ذُرِّيَّةَ مَنْ حَمَلْنَا مَعَ نُوحٍ إِنَّهُ كَانَ عَبْدًا شَكُورًا {3

}
[Pickthal 17:3] (They were) the seed of those whom We carried (in the ship) along with Noah. Lo! he was a grateful slave.

وَقَضَيْنَا إِلَى بَنِي إِسْرَائِيلَ فِي الْكِتَابِ لَتُفْسِدُنَّ فِي الأَرْضِ مَرَّتَيْنِ وَلَتَعْلُنَّ عُلُوًّا كَبِيرًا {4}

[Pickthal 17:4] And We decreed for the Children of Israel in the Scripture: Ye verily will work corruption in the earth twice, and ye will become great tyrants.

فَإِذَا جَاء وَعْدُ أُولاهُمَا بَعَثْنَا عَلَيْكُمْ عِبَادًا لَّنَا أُوْلِي بَأْسٍ شَدِيدٍ فَجَاسُواْ خِلاَلَ الدِّيَارِ وَكَانَ وَعْدًا مَّفْعُولاً {5}

[Pickthal 17:5] So when the time for the first of the two came, We roused against you slaves of Ours of great might who ravaged (your) country, and it was a threat performed.ثُمَّ

رَدَدْنَا لَكُمُ الْكَرَّةَ عَلَيْهِمْ وَأَمْدَدْنَاكُم بِأَمْوَالٍ وَبَنِينَ وَجَعَلْنَاكُمْ أَكْثَرَ نَفِيرًا {6}

the above happened under titus
[Pickthal 17:6] Then we gave you once again your turn against them, and We aided you with wealth and children and made you more in soldiery.

Sound familiar?

إِنْ أَحْسَنتُمْ أَحْسَنتُمْ لِأَنفُسِكُمْ وَإِنْ أَسَأْتُمْ فَلَهَا فَإِذَا جَاء وَعْدُ الآخِرَةِ لِيَسُوؤُواْ وُجُوهَكُمْ وَلِيَدْخُلُواْ الْمَسْجِدَ كَمَا دَخَلُوهُ أَوَّلَ مَرَّةٍ وَلِيُتَبِّرُواْ مَا عَلَوْاْ تَتْبِيرًا {7}

[Pickthal 17:7] (Saying): If ye do good, ye do good for your own souls, and if ye do evil, it is for them (in like manner). So, when the time for the second (of the judgments) came (We roused against you others of Our slaves) to ravage you, and to enter the Temple even as they entered it the first time, and to lay waste all that they conquered with an utter wasting

... but we'll gladly baby sit mean while!

[rebelishaulman]

Wait, what are the verses from mohamads book suppose mean? Nothing there sounds really familiar at all. mohamads book has no accuracy or relevance in life at all in my humble opinion. if it gets the goyim to follow the seven laws, then it has served its purpose and i welcome you to believe all the myths about the ones you adore mohamed and ishmael. it is of no meaning to am yisroel. When the time comes the swears of the nations will be rebuked, and they will feel ashamed. In this period the goyim will be ashamed, so sure of being correct! Rebuked and humbled, they will be, therefore, they must be entirely confident in the false ideals around them before Moshiach.

Good night.

[جوري]

Wait, what are the verses from mohamads book suppose mean? Nothing there sounds really familiar at all. mohamads book has no accuracy or relevance in life at all in my humble opinion. if it gets the goyim to follow the seven laws, then it has served its purpose and i welcome you to believe all the myths about the ones you adore mohamed and ishmael. it is of no meaning to am yisroel. When the time comes the swears of the nations will be rebuked, and they will feel ashamed. In this period the goyim will be ashamed, so sure of being correct! Rebuked and humbled, they will be, therefore, they must be entirely confident in the false ideals around them before Moshiach.

Good night.

They are "supposed" to mean-- enjoy yourself meanwhile and we'll gladly baby sit "your" temple!
Thus far the "myths" in the Quran have come to pass up to and including you gathering back from all nations --- to meet with an eventual certain fate!---
I can throw back at you (the enjoy the myths and seek the bosom of the satanist that shall come for you) but that would make me as ridiculous and infantile as you!

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[جوري]

First of all, the covanent is eternal. The Zionist - Talmud debate has nothing to do with this, everything is planned for a reason.

Indeed! Was the Talmud given to you by Moses? That was a rhetorical Q!

Now, I will make my statement on your discussions. First, Ashkenazi Jews, are related to the Middle East, and it is Arab propaganda that they are not, but I should not even devote my time to speaking to you of this.

No you shouldn't... you wouldn't persevere very long---I don't need to be a student of theology...just science to know ---
Lysosomal storage diseases prevalent only in European Jews the Ashkenazics...The scientists are propagandists too?
http://www.merck.com/mmpe/sec19/ch296/ch296f.html

an ex.Type I gaucher:
from the Merk Manual Type I (non-neuronopathic) is most common (90% of all patients). Residual enzyme activity is highest. Ashkenazi Jews are at greatest risk; 1:12 is a carrier. Onset ranges from age 2 yr to late adulthood. Known to the entire scientific community as European Jews! These aren't prevelant in the middle eastern jews...Middle eastern jews have a whole set of other problems more of the Mediterranean type for instance Buerger's Disease not found in European jews !
so go ahead you and your pal there and quote all the ridiculous zionists claims you want about commonalities and derivation found on the Y chromosome! Science not wikipedia will prove you wrong!

The goyim will always fight Israel and feel the need to slander Israel. The goyim have heaped such a huge mountain of lies on am yisroel that they are blinded by there ancestors ignorance. The sages shoud never have translated the Torah into outside of Hebrew ie. Greek because the goyim would not understand it. They would base conclusions foreign to the beliefs and try and create new religions folloing ishmael and the nazarene but this is of no matter, because as long as the goyim occupy there time with the seven laws, I have no objections of them following the mohamad teachings.

Israel was Jacob (PBUH), Bani Israel were his 12 sons...the rest of you are just impostors! and to be quite frank I don't think anyone here cares about your objections! You can't uphold a civil discussion and oblige yourself to the minimum of common courtesies. You reduce yourself to wickedly juvenile descriptions just to get a reaction...and that doesn't make for an honest debate!
G-D is the G-D of all who seek him--not a select few.... This arrogance is almost unsettling!

In a world of kindliness purpose and wisdom there is a reward and punishment for every deed. But the great injustices of the goyim against Am Yisroel is not merely in the terrible sufering they caused us. The Chief harm lies, where they have prevented us from doing our mission. This has been done by hindering our people from studying the Torah and fufiling G-d's will.

Is it G-D's will to shed blood everywhere and leach off American tax payers?
Do you think G-D is blind in all that your Govt. does in his name?

The Torah is G-d's plan for his chosen community. The Torah not understood by many looked through the thin lense a gentile will look at it through has no hope of understanidng it. By creating "bible critisism" they have no idea the amount of judgement on them. Not only did they misunderstand it, but caused others to as well. I feel pain for the souls that post bible critisism here. The evil inclination has a wrap around there brains.

How deep and obscure! I find you more ridiculous with some of the things you describe! You should worry of your own soul. Each soul after all is held hostage by its own deeds...not a communal thing!

The sinfulness of am yisroel never removed a covananet but did result in punishment. I suggest you read my post on Zionism in the Judaism Q/A thread. But anyway, let me explain my point of this post.

Thanks I'll pass!

It is troubling to see to non-Jews discussing the holy Jewish text which none of you should study because you will only misunderstand it. Jewish text must be loooked at from such a unique view to understand it. When looked at it by a goy who does not know of how to look at it, the opposite is found.

lol--Hey if Madonna, demi moor and briteny spears can do it --
I Have the entire Torah in Arabic -- it really isn't that clandestine! ....

My Point? Don't judge or speak about our scriptures. Do not post a video of a "Rabbi" who is issued a cherem (excommunication) and is n avaoda zara (idolator) and an apostate Jew who breaks the Torah so much, he is clouded all around by the evil inclination. Certianly do not post a wierd story of some iraqi jew, who has not Torah ethics, and it has nothing to do with his critisism of the israeli gov.

I can post what I want...it is almost laughable that you'd suggest I not--this is an Islamic forum! Guard your own worshippers from our wicked views... and I hazard say-- actually assert than the Iraqi Jew seems more authentic than you for starters he is a true semite! and I know for a fact you didn't read that entire post you'd have showed minimal understanding!

I would love to explain and have a down to earth discussion, but to post about Judaism like you understand even the most basic facts and then posting that ridiculous man in that video as proof. Well you only insult yourself.

You are too presumptuous almost narcissistic that it is actually amusing for a so-called man of (G-D) ... . this time would be better spent teaching your disciples/followers/worshippers-- of the virtues of being chosen...and how deranged from the truth the rest of the world!

In closure we get it:...your Anti-Christ (moshaich) is coming for you we can agree on that much...and we shall all be smote by him...and he shall build his temple and restore your animal sacrifices ...and you'll all follow him (ila jouhnama wa b'esalmaseer insha'Allah)....... and you'll have shown us all O select few of Zion!

...As much as I enjoyed this debacle...the time has come for us to move on-- I am unsubscribing from your thread!

Peace!

[rebelishaulman]

Indeed! Was the Talmud given to you by Moses? That was a rhetorical Q!

The Mishna was, the Gemora is commentary of the Mishna. The two make up the Talmud.

Israel was Jacob (PBUH), Bani Israel were his 12 sons...the rest of you are just impostors! and to be quite frank I don't think anyone here cares about your objections! You can't uphold a civil discussion and oblige yourself to the minimum of common courtesies. You reduce yourself to wickedly juvenile descriptions just to get a reaction...and that doesn't make for an honest debate!
G-D is the G-D of all who seek him--not a select few.... This arrogance is almost unsettling!

Alright, think of us as imposters. I could care less, it is obviously the evil inclanation. Now let me ask you, when has Judaism ever taught that G-d cannot be found by all who seek him? Judaism's belief on being non-Jewish and going to the same heaven as Jews for following less laws is much better then the hell fire your religion promises all that do not submit to its will.

Is it G-D's will to shed blood everywhere and leach off American tax payers?
Do you think G-D is blind in all that your Govt. does in his name?

First of all, you need to understand the fact that Judaism believes in the fact that G-d wills everything! And by the way, the Israeli goverment does very little in G-d's name. They are very secular and atheist of a goverment. Islamic terrorists who blow up a bus and record a video before saying they did it for G-d are the ones I would worry about.

How deep and obscure! I find you more ridiculous with some of the things you describe! You should worry of your own soul. Each soul after all is held hostage by its own deeds...not a communal thing!

Oh really? Only for its own deeds? You do not think G-d judges you based on how you act and defend his holy books, whatever you believe them to be?

lol--Hey if Madonna, demi moor and briteny spears can do it --
I Have the entire Torah in Arabic -- it really isn't that clandestine! ....

Madinaa and demi moor do not study Judaism. They study a made up wacky "kabalah" that isn't real Kabalah. By the way the "written Torah" is worthless without the Oral Law or the Mishna, which explains it deeper. That was my point. You only study the written Torah and the deeper meanings are what you cannot find.

I can post what I want...it is almost laughable that you'd suggest I not--this is an Islamic forum! Guard your own worshippers from our wicked views... and I hazard say-- actually assert than the Iraqi Jew seems more authentic than you for starters he is a true semite! and I know for a fact you didn't read that entire post you'd have showed minimal understanding!

Oh the Iraqi Jew seems more authentic? Why is that? Do you know the first thing on who a Jew is according to halacha. Its great that you feel someone can be more Jewish then someone else.

You are too presumptuous almost narcissistic that it is actually amusing for a so-called man of (G-D) ... . this time would be better spent teaching your disciples/followers/worshippers-- of the virtues of being chosen...and how deranged from the truth the rest of the world!

Alright. You realize that the term "chosen people" doesn't mean better right? A chosen person who doesnt follow the laws prescribed to him are less than a gentile who does. A chosen one who follows the 613 laws is equal to a gentile who follows only seven. Did you realize this.


Now you might be wondering why I seemed so harsh in all my posts, there is a reason. You and Manchesterfolk, were discussing Zionism and Judaism and both of you had it very wrong in many ways. You misrepresented our scriptures and I was really angry because it it very painful to see how little people understand yet how quick they are to go off telling others about the Jewish scriptures.

Not only that but your claims that some Jews are "more jewish" then other Jews is a teaching that is probably the most opposite of what Judaism teaches. You cannot be more Jewish then another Jew by skin because when we were put in exile we became like the communities around us culture wise. The communities will regather, and not recongnize eachother from the last time their bretherin departed.

If you are hurt by my Hashkafah (views) then I am sorry, but the entire reason for this post was to support your control over the Holy Temple as a religion that was destined to gaurd it for us, being not of idolatry.

[YusufNoor]

A`udhu Billahi mina Shaytanir Rajeem,

Bismillahir Rahmanir Raheem

Assalamu 'alaykum,

so sad to see a nice thread hijacked this way...

many Muslims seem to forget that one of the tasks of the Prophet of Allah(pbuh) came to perfect good manners...

my appologies Rabbi Rebelishaulman, sometimes our brothers and sisters get a bit too anxious to share their beliefs with others, and get a little stressed when their efforts don't seem to bear fruit. i'm sure they mean well.

If you are hurt by my Hashkafah (views) then I am sorry, but the entire reason for this post was to support your control over the Holy Temple as a religion that was destined to gaurd it for us, being not of idolatry.

it was such a beautiful thought...

:w:

Yusuf

[rebelishaulman]

Thank you, but I must say that I had bad manners as well in debating, and I did not come here to debate but to stop misconceptions about Judaism, and being rude myself in the process of correcting a misconception I may have backfired. :p

[Ibn Abi Ahmed]

Alright. You continue to believe in the jesus myth of the "virgin birth" which how many times was a claim by false pagan gods?

The proof is what you said. You of course will oppose the Moshiach! You must do this, and you have no choice in the matter but to believe he will be false. How else will the Moshaich at first fight the wars of G-d, if he has no enemies? Until then, continue to gaurd the Temple Mount from evil idolators and do the honorable job G-d has assigned you to do as a babysitter.
Peace.

Time will confirm which of us speaking the Truth and which of us is lying. It will confirm who will indeed be victorious and those who will face a humiliating defeat. It's quite pointless to debate on this matter now.