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A-Way-Of-Life
04-29-2007, 09:12 PM
I read that before the birth of the prophet, the Kaba was being attacked, and the Quarish were in charge of the Kaba. I read that they asked Allah (SWT) to protect it. I thought that before the prophet (PBUH) became a prophet, the only religions that believed in god were jews and christions, how did they know about Allah (SWT) before the revalation.
I slso read that people were expecting the seal of the prophets to come, how did they know about another prophet before the seal of the prophets came if the scriptures were changed?
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A-Way-Of-Life
04-29-2007, 09:22 PM
Sorry for the double post, I just have another question to ask
I also read that that before the revlation crisitians worshiped one god, I thought that christians belive in 2 gods, I am confused.
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Ibn Abi Ahmed
04-30-2007, 12:33 AM
:sl:

The majority of the people in Makkah before the birth of the Messenger were pagans, those who worshipped idols. Jews and Chrisitans did exist, but they were the minority. The Jews were, if I am correct in Madinah (known at that time as Yathrib) and Khaibar. The Chrisitans were in the north, the Byzantine Empire. And there were the magians, the Persian empire. However the area of arabia which we are concerned with were mostly pagans and idol worshippers. The time before the Messenger is known as the time of Jahiliyyah, i.e. Ignorance.

Before the Messenger, at the time of Isma'il a.s. the people were upon Tawheed and that continued until some generations before the Messenger where a person called ‘Amr b. Luhay brought an idol to the people and from that idol worhsip and paganism spread amongst the arabs. He was the reason that shirk spread amongst them and people started making new idols after pious people such as Al-Lat etc.

Now you asked how did they (the arabs of Jahilliyah) know about Allaah. You see, they did not believe that their idols could create, destroy, benefit or cause harm. They know only Allaah could do that and they knew that Allaah was the Rabb. However, their shirk came in when they took their idols as intercessors with Allaah and approached Allaah by the means of these idols. For example, Al-Lat was a pious man who used to give a type of food to the pilgrims of Makkah, and when he died the arabs of Jahilliyah turned him into an idol and started seeking intercession from it. The Qur'an testifies to the fact that they knew that Allaah was the creator, yet they commited shirk in their worship of Allaah:
10: 18 And they worship besides Allah things that hurt them not, nor profit them, and they say: "These are our intercessors with Allah." Say: "Do you inform Allah of that which He knows not in the heavens and on the earth?" Glorified and Exalted be He above all that which they associate as partners with Him!

39: 3 Surely, the religion is for Allah only. And those who take Auliya' (protectors and helpers) besides Him (say): "We worship them only that they may bring us near to Allah." Verily, Allah will judge between them concerning that wherein they differ. Truly, Allah guides not him who is a liar, and a disbeliever.

39:38 And verily, if you ask them: "Who created the heavens and the earth?" Surely, they will say: "Allah." Say: "Tell me then, the things that you invoke besides Allah, if Allah intended some harm for me, could they remove His harm, or if He (Allah) intended some mercy for me, could they withhold His Mercy?" Say : "Sufficient for me is Allah; in Him those who trust (i.e. believers) must put their trust."
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A-Way-Of-Life
04-30-2007, 12:37 AM
Thanks!:)
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barney
04-30-2007, 01:21 AM
A Way Of Life: Christians beleive in one god..but they think he comes in 3 forms. The Father (God), the Son (Isa) and the Holy Ghost (Isa-in-heaven).
I cant get my head around that at all, neither could the early Christians and it had to be hammered out at The Council of Niciea. It still causes so much confusion that no christian can really answer it and it ends up with a response of " You just need to have faith" or "God knows best".

Al Madhani. I have done a lot of research into pre-islamic beleif,(and to be honest have already decided based on this research the answer to this question) but would like your take on it anyway. :)

Did the Worshippers of Allah (pre - Amr b. Luhay ) beleive their religion had any connection with the Monothism of the Jews? If not...then who did they beleive he was?
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- Qatada -
04-30-2007, 10:51 AM
Hey. :)

Originally Posted by barney
Did the Worshippers of Allah (pre - Amr b. Luhay ) beleive their religion had any connection with the Monothism of the Jews? If not...then who did they beleive he was?

They may have, Allaah knows best. The arabs knew they were descendants of Prophet Abraham, and we know that they were closely linked since Isma'eel (father of the arabs) and Isshaaq (fathers of the jews) [the two sons of Ibrahim] were brothers.

We can't really say whether they totally knew they followed the same religion since the arabs stayed among themselves and travelled around the arabian peninsula more than going to the jewish populated countries [since the jews have a loooong history of their own when they kept getting expelled from the lands etc.] So even if they were to meet, the jews may have added aspects to the religion [i.e. saying the Prophets/Messengers are only for our 'race'] - so the arabs later on may have been mistaken or confused on what the jewish beliefs really were. Unless they had contact with Prophet Isma'eel's knowledge, and therefore this may have allowed them to understand that Isma'eels religion was the exact same as the religion of his brother Isshaaq. And Allaah knows best.



Regards.
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A-Way-Of-Life
04-30-2007, 05:28 PM
Originally Posted by barney
A Way Of Life: Christians beleive in one god..but they think he comes in 3 forms. The Father (God), the Son (Isa) and the Holy Ghost (Isa-in-heaven).
I cant get my head around that at all, neither could the early Christians and it had to be hammered out at The Council of Niciea. It still causes so much confusion that no christian can really answer it and it ends up with a response of " You just need to have faith" or "God knows best".

Al Madhani. I have done a lot of research into pre-islamic beleif,(and to be honest have already decided based on this research the answer to this question) but would like your take on it anyway. :)

Did the Worshippers of Allah (pre - Amr b. Luhay ) beleive their religion had any connection with the Monothism of the Jews? If not...then who did they beleive he was?

That makes sense, thanks. This question was on my mind for a while.:statisfie

So the christians admit that this "trinity" stuff was made up by people, right?:)
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- Qatada -
04-30-2007, 05:36 PM
:salamext:


Bro, they took their priests and rabbi's as lords besides Allaah:



The Messenger of Allah recited this Ayah;

[اتَّخَذُواْ أَحْبَـرَهُمْ وَرُهْبَـنَهُمْ أَرْبَاباً مِّن دُونِ اللَّهِ]

(They took their rabbis and their monks to be their lords besides Allah). `Adi commented, "I said, `They did not worship them.''' The Prophet said,



«بَلَى إِنَّهُمْ حَرَّمُوا عَلَيْهِمُ الْحَلَالَ وَأَحَلُّوا لَهُمُ الْحَرَامَ فَاتَّبَعُوهُمْ فَذَلِكَ عِبَادَتُهُمْ إِيَّاهُم»

(Yes they did. They (rabbis and monks) prohibited the allowed for them (Christians and Jews) and allowed the prohibited, and they obeyed them. This is how they worshipped them.) The Messenger of Allah said to `Adi,



«يَا عَدِيُّ مَا تَقُولُ؟ أَيُفِرُّكَ أَنْ يُقَالَ: اللهُ أَكْبَرَ؟ فَهَلْ تَعْلَمُ شَيْئًا أَكْبَرَ مِنَ اللهِ؟ مَا يُفِرُّكَ؟ أَيُفِرُّكَ أَنْ يُقَالَ: لَا إِلَهَ إِلَّا اللهُ؟ فَهَلْ تَعْلَمُ مَنْ إِلهٌ إِلَّا اللهُ؟»

(O `Adi what do you say Did you run away (to Ash-Sham) so that 'Allahu Akbar' (Allah is the Great) is not pronounced Do you know of anything greater than Allah What made you run away Did you run away so that `La ilaha illallah' is not pronounced Do you know of any deity worthy of worship except Allah)

The Messenger invited `Adi to embrace Islam, and he embraced Islam and pronounced the Testimony of Truth. The face of the Messenger of Allah beamed with pleasure and he said to `Adi,


«إِنَّ الْيَهُودَ مَغْضُوبٌ عَلَيْهِمْ وَالنَّصَارَى ضَالُّون»

(Verily, the Jews have earned the anger (of Allah) and the Christians are misguided.) Hudhayfah bin Al-Yaman, `Abdullah bin `Abbas and several others said about the explanation of,

[اتَّخَذُواْ أَحْبَـرَهُمْ وَرُهْبَـنَهُمْ أَرْبَاباً مِّن دُونِ اللَّهِ]

(They took their rabbis and their monks to be their lords besides Allah...) that the Christians and Jews obeyed their monks and rabbis in whatever they allowed or prohibited for them. This is why Allah said,


[وَمَآ أُمِرُواْ إِلاَّ لِيَعْبُدُواْ إِلَـهاً وَحِداً]

(while they were commanded to worship none but One God), Who, whatever He renders prohibited is the prohibited, whatever He allowed is the allowed, whatever He legislates, is to be the law followed, and whatever He decides is to be adhered to;


[لاَّ إِلَـهَ إِلاَّ هُوَ سُبْحَـنَهُ عَمَّا يُشْرِكُونَ]

(None has the right to be worshipped but He. Hallowed be He above what they associate (with Him).) Meaning, exalted, sanctified, hallowed above partners, equals, aids, rivals or children, there is no deity or Lord worthy of worship except Him.


http://tafsir.com/default.asp?sid=9&tid=20998
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islamirama
04-30-2007, 05:38 PM
Originally Posted by A-Way-Of-Life
That makes sense, thanks. This question was on my mind for a while.:statisfie

So the christians admit that this "trinity" stuff was made up by people, right?:)
There are divisions in christianity, like Jehovah Witness, that do not believe in Trinity. Trinity is actually a religion of Paul and not Esa a.s. Paul couldn't kill enough christians as roman on and so he decided to convert and claimed he was inspired by God to relay the message to others. The original disciples of Esa a.s. rejected him but he still preached. He introduced christianity and Esa a.s. as the "lord" that many christians believe and many other things that contradict Islam.
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A-Way-Of-Life
04-30-2007, 05:40 PM
Thanks everyone!:statisfie
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barney
05-04-2007, 03:15 AM
Originally Posted by A-Way-Of-Life
That makes sense, thanks. This question was on my mind for a while.:statisfie

So the christians admit that this "trinity" stuff was made up by people, right?:)
Nope. A Catholic will tell you that the Trinity existed from the beginning of time. A religion that opines that it's teachings are made up by people loses the title "religion" and becomes a Theory.
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A-Way-Of-Life
05-14-2007, 12:51 AM
I have one last question, I have heard that the prophet Muhammad (PBUH) is mentioned in the bible, didn't people change the injeel completly? Did one of the desiples hear Isa (PBUH) mention a prophet coming and one of the desipels who changed the injeel add it? I don't get come someone explain it to me:)
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- Qatada -
05-14-2007, 01:02 PM
:salamext:


Not all of the previous scriptures have been altered totally, there are still parts which are true, others false.


If something contradicts the Furqaan [Qur'an - the Criterion] - we don't accept it.

If something is silent in the Qur'an - then we neither reject it nor do we totally accept it.

If something agrees with the Qur'an, we can accept it.


Also check this insha Allaah:
http://www.islamicboard.com/comparat...criptures.html
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