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Bittersteel
08-12-2005, 05:40 PM
Originally Posted by Irshad Manji

It was the leader of progress and debate and critical thinking. This was during the golden age of Islam, for example, when Jews and Christians and Muslims worked together to preserve the works of Plato and Socrates and so forth. (insertion-huh?what's this)

There was a time when critical thinking was embraced and that tradition was called ijtihad. I know it sounds a lot like jihad to non-Arab ears and in fact it comes from the same root – to struggle. But unlike violent struggle ijtihad is all about independent reasoning and independent thinking.

I explain in the book that towards the end of the 11th century, for very political reasons - which we can go into if you are interested - the gates of ijtihad were deliberately closed; 135 schools of thought were whittled down to only four schools of thought. And today a thousand years later, most Muslims have inherited that legacy of a ban on independent thinking.

And I am asking my fellow Muslims, especially in the West but not only in the West, what is stopping us from rattling at the gates of ijtihad at the very least and if nothing else ripping off the lock and saying, it is time that we rediscovered our tradition of critical thinking.
;D

finally satan got some competition.

we need someone to write a refutation about this......"Islamic expert".
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Lateralus63
08-12-2005, 05:43 PM
:sl:

Not any average muslim can do ijtihad, you have to be a mujtahid, you have to master arabic, know tafsir, ahadith, etc.

Stupid woman.
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Bittersteel
08-12-2005, 05:47 PM
what's actually an ijtihad???

and what was she trying to say about Plato and Socrates???

I definitely agree she's a stupid woman.
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Uthman
08-12-2005, 05:48 PM
:sl:

Regarding Ijtihad, please see here :)

:w:

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SalafiFemaleJih
08-12-2005, 05:48 PM
she got no life : )
she gotta go...

welll Allah hu alaam.
I'm not someone who can judge people.
May Allah swt guide her to the right path...the path of pious Ameen.

its just gotta end man.

waaslamuaaikum wr wb. : )
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Bittersteel
08-12-2005, 06:01 PM
anyone knows about her background?
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SalafiFemaleJih
08-12-2005, 06:02 PM
Originally Posted by Abdul Aziz
anyone knows about her background?
shez a desi chick from uk
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Ansar Al-'Adl
08-12-2005, 06:03 PM
:sl:
Ijtihad is using personal judgement to derive a legal ruling. But in Islam we know that the Qur'an, the Sunnah, and the Ijmaa' (consensus) of the scholars takes precedence over Ijtihad.

Manji is using Ijtihad as a smokescreen for her desire to eliminate Islam. She has made it cloear that she doesn't believe in the Qur'an and Sunnah, she openly criticizes them and rejects the rulings found therein, so she instead pretends to advocate ideas of ijtihad. But since when does ijtihad replace the Qur'an and Sunnah?! Ijtihad is still here and has always been. Its just in its rightful place. if Manji wants Muslims to discard the Qur'an and start build their religious rulings on the basis of their whims and desires, then we apologize because the Muslims do not want to follow Manji into Hellfire.

:w:
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Bittersteel
08-12-2005, 06:04 PM
her parents,environment,etc.?I want to know what really caused to turn against Islam.
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SalafiFemaleJih
08-12-2005, 06:09 PM
Manji was born in Uganda, but moved to Canada at age three, when Idi Amin exiled all South Asians from Uganda; she is of Pakistani origin. She studied history at the University of British Columbia, and became the first humanities student to win the Governor-General's Gold Medal for the top graduate.

like WHATEVER

she is not really from uk but she studied there.

ws
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Muezzin
08-12-2005, 06:11 PM
Originally Posted by SalafiFemaleJih
shez a desi chick from uk
LOL
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Bittersteel
08-12-2005, 06:12 PM
hmm....Is till want to know what's wrong with her?

she is a weapon in the hands of the Anti-Islamists as she a renegade.
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Ansar Al-'Adl
08-12-2005, 06:14 PM
:sl:
Most likely she wouldn't tell people of her social problems which turned her against Islam, she wants to appear unbiased. And it seems some Muslims think too much of her as a weapon. She can do us no harm, she's nothing more than a joke.

:w:
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minaz
08-12-2005, 06:15 PM
I smell a good ol witch hunt, c'mon Muezzin lets polish our pitch forks! ;p
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SalafiFemaleJih
08-12-2005, 06:16 PM
Originally Posted by Muezzin
LOL

lol akhi, I thought she is from uk...my bad.

well not everyone whos bad is from uk ;) lol only joking

waslamualaikum wr wb : )
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Bittersteel
08-12-2005, 06:20 PM
she's a joke but some people take it seriously so it has a negative effect on the ummah.
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Uthman
08-12-2005, 06:24 PM
:sl:

Originally Posted by Ansar Al-'Adl
if Manji wants Muslims to discard the Qur'an and start build their religious rulings on the basis of their whims and desires, then we apologize because the Muslims do not want to follow Manji into Hellfire.
Well said. :)

:w:

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Bittersteel
08-12-2005, 08:17 PM
what was she saying about Socrates and Plato?
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Takumi
08-12-2005, 10:01 PM
:sl:

I've written somewhat about Irshad Manjid and her so called progressive muslim friends. This is take from my blog. You may read more over there. :)

http://slacov.blogspot.com/2005_06_1...v_archive.html

Originally Posted by blog
Originally Posted by Manji
The knee-jerk reaction to being reminded of our internalized racism is predictable: complete denial. Racism governs our behavior, yet we are oblivious to our own prejudices and tribalism. With noted exceptions, I saw this in action on Sunday. I heard repeatedly from Arabs in the audience that Amina Wadud does not understand Arabic. Instead of debating the merits of her argument, many invoked and sought refuge in their ethnic and linguistic superiority
taken from the Progressive Muslim...(I'm NOT linking it to their site!!)

I've made the issue in question in bold and italics. Here's my response.

No, we don't seek refuge in our ethnic and linguistic superiority. It's just plain simple that linguistic ability, is a MUST in order to properly interpret Al Quran and extrapolate Islamic rules. Because Al Quran was revealed in that language. You're the one seeking refuge in your ethnic and linguistic INFERIORITY.

You desperately want to champion Islam but since you did not have the privilege to learn the language, (or you're just plain lazy) you refuse to be handcuffed with that handicap. In fact you took the short cut and talk about Islam and put in front this facade of racism and prejudices. Or, you like your westernized lifestyle, the salad bar mixing of female and male without marriage, (in fact, I wont' suprised if the progressive muslim will have a swimming pool party), that you find the TRUE ISLAM is very restrictive to your desires, hence you blame the mullahs and the scholars for making Islam hard.

Where do they draw the line? If hijab is a choice, then what will stop Amina Wadud and Ani being in a same swimming pool with Ahmed Nassef? I guess nothing. If that is the case, what will stop them from hugging and kissing each time they meet?

You see, when people solely use their minds without divine guidance, they allow themselves to be dragged into complete breakaway from God's rules.
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Bittersteel
08-16-2005, 08:02 AM
nice.
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basitisnumberone
09-06-2005, 03:24 PM
Lesbian Muslim Reformer is a New World Orderly

By Henry Makow Ph.D.
October 16, 2004

(Note: Since the event described below, Manji has attended the 2005 Bildersburg meeting near Munich and rubbed shoulders with other Zionist pawns such as David Rockefeller.)

Muslim "reformer" and lesbian activist Irshad Manji, 35, symbolizes the globalist push to extinguish true religion and enslave humanity.

Her book "The Trouble With Islam: A Wake Up Call for Honesty and Change" is being translated into a dozen languages.

Last week, for the second time in six months, Manji spoke here in Winnipeg.

The Asper Foundation and the Jewish Women's Federation sponsored her. The Aspers (Canwest Media) own a TV network and the largest chain of newspapers in Canada. Manji charges $7500 an hr.

In her speech, Manji called on Muslims to return to their ancient tradition of "ijtihad" which encouraged them to scrutinize their social and religious institutions and make their own decisions about how to live.

As far as I could tell, there was only one Muslim in the audience of about 800.

The title of the lecture ("Why I Support Women, Jews and Pluralism") may have been a factor. Most of the people present were Jews (some out of social obligation) with a smattering of lesbians and globots. (globalists)

It was comical to listen to Manji exhort Muslims to challenge their tradition in front of an audience composed mainly of Jews, a community not noted for welcoming constructive criticism.

Ever heard of a book (or lecture) entitled "The Trouble with Judaism: A Wake Up Call for Honesty and Change?"

The globalist elite peddles Manji, a Toronto writer who immigrated from Uganda as an infant, as a herald of necessary change in Muslim society.

Oprah Winfrey and Maclean's magazine have honoured her. She has spoken at Oxford University, the United Nations press club, the World Presidents Organization, the International Women's Forum, and the Pentagon. The New York Times described her has "Osama bin Laden's worst nightmare." You get the picture.

The wonder is that Manji and her audience actually think they are bucking the establishment. Many are anti globalist!


SELECTIVE DIVERSITY AND TOLERANCE


In the Q & A session, the sole Muslim present at the Winnipeg event said she had flouted her family by having a Black child out-of-wedlock. She also had adopted two aboriginal children so her family was "a regular United Nations."

She was heartily applauded for her rebellion and presented as an example of racial tolerance.

I doubt if any of these Jews would have applauded had this woman been their daughter.

Organized Jewry seems to promote "tolerance" for other people (like Muslims) but does not embrace it itself.

For example, I asked Manji to comment on Israel's policy to forbid Palestinians who are married to Israelis from living in Israel. Manji evaded my question and the moderator didn't remind her of it.

Jews (and homosexuals) have no idea how they are being used to create the New World Order, only to be cast aside or made a scapegoat later.

A cabal of Masonic dynastic families based in the City of London control the New World Order. They decided to use Jews to colonize the Middle East long before the birth of "Zionism." The US invasion of Iraq is the latest phase in this satanic plan for "world government."

Yes Virginia, there is a Conspiracy.

See "The Jewish Conspiracy is British Imperialism" and "Bush Victory Could Foil Occult Plot"

This occult cabal uses some Jews (and homosexuals) to dynamite the four pillars of our personal and collective identity and thereby transform humanity into a faceless slave race.

These four pillars are Race, Religion, Nation and (heterosexual) Family. They are the source of our visceral power.

Irshad Manji is sabotaging all four and is rewarded handsomely.


EMASCULATE MUSLIMS USING FEMINISM


In her talk, Manji alluded vaguely to women's oppression in Muslim societies. She advocated "micro business loans" for women (not men) so they could become "entrepreneurs."

Muslim men then would be "working for their wives," she said.

In other words, deprive men of their social role as protectors and providers. Muslims are the only men resisting the New World Order precisely because they haven't been gelded like "men" in the West.

In the words of "insider" Harold Wallace Rosenthal:

"We have castrated society through fear and intimidation. Its manhood exists only in combination with a feminine outward appearance. Being so neutered, the populace has become docile and easily ruled. As all geldings...their thoughts are not involved with the concerns of the future and their posterity, but only with the present and with the next meal."

In Muslim society women are cherished and loved for their service to their families. Manji would export the West's family breakdown and plummeting birthrate by "liberating" women from this place of honor. How like a lesbian activist.

Globalists hate nothing more than a woman devoted to her husband and family. She is dangerous. They can't control her. She might have a healthy happy family with independent values. This could spread!

Manji said some women in Afghanistan are using these small business loans to start schools for girls (not boys.)

"They believe that if you educate a boy, you educate only him," she said. "But if you educate a girl, you educate the whole family."

Huh? Don't fathers have a role in educating their children?

This unsubtle attempt to exclude fathers is typical of the hateful underhanded attack on the heterosexual family made by self-described "women of conscience" and "champions of human rights" who say they are opposed to "marginalizing any group."

These pious self-serving dupes define "human rights" selectively.

The vast heterosexual majority of European or Muslim origin, males in particular, evidently are not entitled to them. They can be attacked mercilessly and if they resist, they are accused of bigotry.

Many homosexuals and Jews have this in common: they feel they are "outsiders" socially and metaphysically.

While most are content to live and let live, organized Jewry and gay activists like Manji must convince their constituencies they are being persecuted in order to advance their hostile agenda: to recast society in their own image.

These activists are financed and promoted by the financial elite whose goal is to control society by first destabilizing it.


CONCLUSION

The political ramifications of Manji's crusade became clear when she referred to Israel's occupation of the West Bank and Gaza as a "double occupation."

She acknowledged that indeed there was a military occupation. But she spoke of how Palestinians are "occupied ideologically" by their religion, which made them reject Israel's "many generous peace offers."

She related a conversation she had in Gaza City with the political chief for Hamas. He told her most suicide bombers are very successful in life and because of their religion, consider it an honor to sacrifice their lives.

She cited this as an example of Islam's fanaticism. Without condoning Hamas' tactics, clearly there would be less resistance in general if Muslims were stripped of their religion and culture.

What better way to disinherit Muslims than encourage them to become "free thinkers" like all the courageous and independent "free thinkers" we have here in the West.

These days the champions of freedom, diversity, human rights and tolerance wear a deceptive face. One such face belongs to Irshad Manji.


c. 2004 Henry Makow Ph.D.

"Zionism: Compulsory Suicide for Jews"
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Shadow
09-06-2005, 06:18 PM
:sl:
is the author of this article muslim???
just asking...
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Uthman
09-06-2005, 06:56 PM
:sl:

I think this thread should be merged with the one here.

:w:

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Genius
09-07-2005, 12:39 AM
Originally Posted by SalafiFemaleJih
Manji was born in Uganda, but moved to Canada at age three, when Idi Amin exiled all South Asians from Uganda; she is of Pakistani origin. She studied history at the University of British Columbia, and became the first humanities student to win the Governor-General's Gold Medal for the top graduate.

like WHATEVER

she is not really from uk but she studied there.

ws
British Columbia is in Canada.
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