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View Full Version : Does The Qur'an Says It Confirms The Scriptures Of Before ?



Balthasar21
06-16-2007, 09:15 AM
Chapter & Verses Please .:)
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Balthasar21
07-06-2007, 01:12 AM
Most muslims are under the impression that The Koran says that The Bible is Tampered With muslims think that The Koran is referring to The Whole Bible when it states that the jews were Altering Word From Their Places In Koran 4 ; 46 . However , The Koran lists several books which are to be followed and were sent as a guidance for man ;

1 . As Suhuf
2 . Al Hikmah ( The Wisdom )
3 . At Tawrah ( The Torah )
4 . Az Zabuwr ( The Psalms )
5 . Al Injiyl ( The Evangel , Revelation )
6 . And The Koran Itself

Muslims don't even know that A Torah existed in Abraham's time , Which is spoken about in Genesis 26 ; 5 ( Modern Hebrew Script ) Where it says and I quote ; Because That Abraham Obeyed My Voice , And Kept My Charge , My Commandments , My Statutes , And My Laws '' The Hebrew word used for laws in this quote is Towtah , Meaning '' Law Or Teaching '' .

This means that there is law that Abraham followed which is The Prophet whose religion you are supposed to be following according to Koran 2 ; 130 as muslims are also misinformed , And the muslims that do know a little about The Koran , Will use any excuse and say that The Scriptures which came before The Koran which are The Torah and The Injily , are Tampered With so ,

This is why they don't use them . However , This is not true and I am about to prove this to you . Most muslims want to prove that the Scriptures prior to the coming of The Koran were Tampered with for fear of learning or having to Adhere to the 613 laws which were given to Moses ( Koran 19 ; 51 - 52 ) . Let me make this quite clear that if you say The Bible was Tampered With ,

I would like to know when did this occur ? Was it before of after the coming of The Prophet Muhammad ? Because it you say before , The Koran itself will disprove you for the same verses which you say confirm The Bible Tampered with ; Koran 2 ; 140 , 3 ; 78 , 4 ; 46 , 5 ; 44 , 7 ; 162 .. And states that The Tampering was done in that day and time . So we can agree that The Bible Was Not Tampered With Up Until The Year 610 A.D.

Muhammad revealed the following verses stating that the scriptures prior to The Koran were being confirmed by The Koran itself , And would guard their every word in safety . To say that The Bible was Tampered with before the arrival of Muhammad would make him a Liar also because it states in the Koran 4 ; 47 ,

Koran 4 ; 47 , ( Persian Arabic Script ) And I Quote ; '' O Ye People Of The Book ! Believe In What We Have ( Now ) Revealed , Confirming What Was ( Already ) With You , Before We Change The Face ..< Abdullah Yusuf Ali 1938 A.D. >

And in Koran 2 ; 41 , ( Persian Arabic Script ) It States '' And Believe In What I Reveal , Confirming The Revelation Which Is With You , And Be Not The First To Reject Faith Therein ... ..< Abdullah Yusuf Ali 1938 A.D. >

Now , If you deny what these Koranic verses say . Then you deny that Muhammad preached the truth . You would be saying that The Koran was sent to confirm the corrupted scriptures of before . Do You Overstand ?

Now read Koran 3 ; 3 ( Persian Arabic Script ) And I Quote ; '' It Is He Who Sent Down To Thee
( Step By Step ) , In Truth , The Book Confirming What Went Before It ; And He Sent Down The Law ( Of Moses ) And The Gospel ( Of Jesus ) Before This .. ..< Abdullah Yusuf Ali 1938 A.D. >

Now lets take a look at this . The Arabic word being used in this quote is Unzila < arabic Meaning '' Sent Down '' From the root word Nazala < arabic '' To Send Down Or Down , Loose .According to this quote this means these scriptures came down from Allah . These verse did not come from man to man as the many Hadiths published by Sahih Al Bukhari , Muslims want to believe that the original Torah was changed by The Jews betweent 610 - 632 . In the city of Medina and they use this quote to substantiate their claims ;

Koran 4 ; 46 ( Persian Arabic Script ) And I Quote ; '' Of The Jews There Are Those Who Displce Words From Their ( Right ) Places , And Say ; We Hear And We Disobey ; And Hear What Is Not Heard ; And 'Raina ; With A Twist Of Their Tongues And A Slander To Faith . ..< Abdullah Yusuf Ali 1938 A.D. >

This verse is only talking about one word '' Raina '' , Read it again , Now what are you saying that even after you God Allah tells you time and time again that The Torah and The Injiyl are his words and in Koran 5 ; 47 Your God Allah tells you to read The Torah as a guidance and light while there are Errors in these scriptures ? I want you to think and carefully read what I am about to say Chapter 4 , Which is the one you use to say The Scriptures are Tampered with was revealed between The Years 625 - 627 A.D. The Koran Chapter 5 , Which speaks about The Torah being A '' Guidance And Light '' Was reavealed between The Year 627 - 629 A.D. Or after the verse in The Koran which speaks about The Jews in Medina altering words from their places . Therefore , If anything was wrong with The Torah , Wouldn't your God Allah , Being Al Aliymu -- The Knower '', His 19th Attribute , Would have known and made mention of its Tampering instead of speaking of its purity in Koran 5 ; 47 . Or are you saying that some human beings came along and Tampered with The Scriptures of old and your God was not capable of knowing this was going to happen ? Are you saying that your God only knows up to a certain point or are you taking the words of A Hadiths , By Ibn Abbas where he presents his own opinion and his interpretation of a verse in The Koran which is suppose to contradict Koran 4 ; 46 .

461 . Narrated '' Ubaidullah ; Ibn Abbas Said , '' Why Do You Ask The People Of The Book About Anything While Your Book ( Qur'an ) Which Has Been Revealed To Allah's Apostle Is Newer ? You Read It Pure , Undistorted And Unchanged , And Allah Has Told Youth That The People Of The Book ( Jews And Christians ) Change Allah's Book And Distored It , And Wrote The Book With Their Own Hands And Said , '' It Is From Allah'' . To Sell It For A Little Gain . Does Not The Knowledge Which Has Come To You Prevent You From Asking Them About Anything ? No . By Allah We Have Never Seen Any Many From Them Asking You Regarding What Has Been Revealed To You ! ''

Who gave Ibn Abbas the right to tell other to only read The Koran ? How did his opinion get to be regarded as Sunna of The Prophet Muhammad ? Ibn Abbas is giving a explanation for a verse of The Koran when he has no knowldge of . It is not stated in This Hadith that what Ibn Abbas is saying . Are words from Muhammad at all and this is supposedly one your criterions for Hadith .

So I ask you now is This Sunna which you say you follow , Is it from men or from the prophet Muhammad ? No can you see how easy it has been for men's opinions to be weaved into Islam for hundred of years this is what you call reliable , Truthful , And Trustworthy Narrators . These are examples of men who are allowed to freely opinionate on what shoould be ICLUDED or EXCLUDED From The Koran and its laws , Why is such hypocrisy allowed and why are men's opinions of The Koran still being supported ?
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Zulkiflim
07-07-2007, 02:36 AM
Salaam,

I think this has been covered before..

The accusation have always been the same and the refutation are always the same.

Did the Chrisitna of the time of Propeht Muhammad saw rever Propht Jesus as as god?

Yes they did and thus their book is corrupted even during that time..

And the Quran confirm what was in the Book of the Olden Prophets..
And the Quran is sent as th Criterion to seperate truth from falsehood..
Simple sint it...
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Walter
07-07-2007, 10:10 PM
Hi Zukliflim:

You claim that this topic has been covered before. You are correct. I started a thread titled:Are Muslims Obligated to Read the Bible.

The evidence presented in that thread from the Qu’ran and Tafsir, that Muslims are instructed to read Books in the Bible, is explicit and extensive. However, while debating the evidence, the thread was inexplicably closed after two fellows made completely unsupported conclusions.

If this issue has been satisfactorily refuted, then please provide a link to a credible refutation of why Muslims should not read the Books that came before. Otherwise, the previous thread should be opened to allow the debate to continue.

Regards,
Grenville
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Umar001
07-09-2007, 10:14 AM
This is the most misinformed thread amongst others. For example;

However , This is not true and I am about to prove this to you . Most muslims want to prove that the Scriptures prior to the coming of The Koran were Tampered with for fear of learning or having to Adhere to the 613 laws which were given to Moses ( Koran 19 ; 51 - 52 ) .

Even if the Bible had not been tampered with, then the Prophet, made it clear that even Moses would have to follow him! Not the other way round.

The whole concept of confirming something is taken to suits means, let us ask, if we confirm God sent something does this mean that that thing has to be with us? I confirm to you that God sent Aadam, does this mean Aadam is alive or with us? No, if I were confirm that the Bible is with us and has not changed ok, but if I confirm that God sent books in the past, this does not mean, neccesarily, that the books are here and that they are unchanged. Rather if we go with the context of the Qur'an and Sunnah, then we do know they have been changed, as Ibn Abbas said.

As for the are muslims obligated to read the Bible, far from refuted, there is still the verse of the Qur'an which Ibn Abbas used to show the Bible had been curropted. That has remained untouched.
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