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Zman
07-04-2007, 09:33 PM
:sl:/Peace To All

The Islamic History Of Europe

A) Muslims In Spain:


The following is an excellent BBC documentary:

Part-1 (44:28)

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Part-2 (44:28)
Sicily then Paris

In the last part of the film in Part 2, Rageh Omer travels to Paris to trace the influence of Islam on the intellectual revival of Europe

In the 13th. century, 2 centuries before the European Renaissance, the writings of Ibn Rushd (Averreos) reached Paris and sparked a great debate and introduced new ideas which were opposed by the Catholic church

He meets Dr. George Saliba (Professor of Arabic and Islamic Science at Colombia University) at the Institut du Monde Arabe who gives a presentation on Muslim scientists and their impact on Europe


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B) When The Moors Ruled In Europe:

Part-1 (9:38)

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Part-2 (9:43)

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Part-3 (9:31)

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Part-4 (9:57)

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Part-5 (9:10)

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Part-6 (9:46)

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Part-7 (9:19)

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Part-8 (9:59)

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Part-9 (9:39)

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Part-10 (9:06)

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Part-11 (6:06)

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C) "The Muslim Influence on Europe and the West:"

By Abdal Hakim Murad

Purchase the full-length lecture at http://www.MeccaCentric.com
Or call 1-800-607-9810

In his final address to the non-Muslim participants of the New Mexico educational retreat, Abdal Hakim looks at the other aspects of the long-standing historical interaction of the three Abrahamic faiths, such as the transmission of science, technology, and philosophical ideas from the Islamic world to the Western world.

Islam in the middle ages was a very successful commercial and material civilization and this fact combined with the Muslim's strategic geographic positions allowed for such a profound influence and contribution.

The speaker looks at the economic/cultural/scientific contributions in the areas of maritine navigation and exploration, agriculture, music, poetry, mathematics, astronomy, medicine, chemistry, and much more.

(Recorded at the Dar al Islam Teachers' Institute seminar).

(17:41)

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D) Muslim Cordoba:

This Islam On Line article on the city should of interest:

The Invasion
The Mezquita
The Legacy of Cordoba
A Symbol of Prosperity, Diversity, and Tolerance
The Beginning or the End?

Source for The Above information: IslamOnLine


E) Further Sources:

AFP. "Controversial London Sale of Spanish Mosque Beams Withdrawn '

Coates, Ken. "The Cordoba Seminar on Peace and Human Rights in Europe and the Middle East"

Gedal, Najib. "The Great Mosque of Cordoba: A Geometrical Analysis."

Guichard,P. "Cordoba the Magnificent."

Kubisch,N. "The Great Mosque of Cordoba."

Menocal. M. R. "Culture in the Time of Tolerance."

Menocal. M. R. "The Culture of Translation."

Menocal. M. R. "The Literature of Al-Andalus."

Phyun5. "The Middle Ages."

Sills, Ben. "Cathedral May See Return of Muslims." Apr. 19, 2004.

United Press International (UPI). "Rare Mosque Beams Pulled from Auction." Apr. 4, 2006.

Wikipedia "Cordoba, Spain"

Wikipedia "Mezquita"

Source:
http://freethoughtmanifesto.blogspot...of-europe.html

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sudais1
07-04-2007, 10:04 PM
Amazing
Reply

Zman
07-05-2007, 03:22 PM
Originally Posted by sudais1
Amazing
:sl:

Yes it is.

I've read that quite a few Catholic Spaniards are beginning to explore their Islamic past...
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جوري
07-05-2007, 04:49 PM
Systematically written out of history is so very true... but we'll get it back Insha'Allah!
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Amadeus85
07-05-2007, 04:56 PM
If you talk about islamic history in Europe dont forget about Osman Empire that occupied for few hundred years- Bulgaria, Serbia, Romania, Hungary, Armenia, Bosnia, Greece, Cyprus. Also we shall mention the first genocide that hapenned when Osmans killed 1,5 millions Armenians in the beginning of XX century. Also bloody attacks of Tatars and Turks on eastern and central Europe and thousands of people taken as slaves in yassir. If you talk about Al Andaluz, dont forget ro remind that Arabs came to Spain as occupants and invadors. Arabs would probably conquere all Western Europe in medieval unless Karol Martens didnt beat them in France. BTW Turkey is still occupying Cyprus, but no one cares.
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جوري
07-05-2007, 04:59 PM
You are right no one cares of your Jejune accounts of history... But as usual we were expecting more of your acid feedback... It won't change what was and what is meant to be however, so yammer on!
Reply

Keltoi
07-05-2007, 05:14 PM
Originally Posted by Aaron85
If you talk about islamic history in Europe dont forget about Osman Empire that occupied for few hundred years- Bulgaria, Serbia, Romania, Hungary, Armenia, Bosnia, Greece, Cyprus. Also we shall mention the first genocide that hapenned when Osmans killed 1,5 millions Armenians in the beginning of XX century. Also bloody attacks of Tatars and Turks on eastern and central Europe and thousands of people taken as slaves in yassir. If you talk about Al Andaluz, dont forget ro remind that Arabs came to Spain as occupants and invadors. Arabs would probably conquere all Western Europe in medieval unless Karol Martens didnt beat them in France. BTW Turkey is still occupying Cyprus, but no one cares.
I'm not so sure Muslim kingdoms would have conquered all of Western Europe. Spain and places in Eastern Europe, which were more easily accessible to the Turks or Arabs, meaning a secure supply line and no enemies behind, were one thing. When you get into Germany, to some extent France, England, Ireland, and Scandanavia, you have a much more warlike and hard to subdue people. Especially in England, Ireland, Scotland, and Scandanavia. Of course with the conquest of Spain and the Byzantine Empire they obtained a necessary foothold in the region...so I suppose anything is possible. How Martens managed that feat I will never understand. He keeps us from knowing how that tale might have ended.
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Amadeus85
07-05-2007, 05:21 PM
Originally Posted by PurestAmbrosia
You are right no one cares of your Jejune accounts of history... But as usual we were expecting more of your acid feedback... It won't change what was and what is meant to be however, so yammer on!
Truth hurts. Because muslims didnt come to Europe without sword and fire. Learn some history and you will see. My own country has few hundred years tradition with defending its lands against Osmans and Tatars invadors.
BTW if i said something not true, so please tell me what was not true and correct me.
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Amadeus85
07-05-2007, 05:27 PM
Originally Posted by Keltoi
I'm not so sure Muslim kingdoms would have conquered all of Western Europe. Spain and places in Eastern Europe, which were more easily accessible to the Turks or Arabs, meaning a secure supply line and no enemies behind, were one thing. When you get into Germany, to some extent France, England, Ireland, and Scandanavia, you have a much more warlike and hard to subdue people. Especially in England, Ireland, Scotland, and Scandanavia. Of course with the conquest of Spain and the Byzantine Empire they obtained a necessary foothold in the region...so I suppose anything is possible. How Martens managed that feat I will never understand. He keeps us from knowing how that tale might have ended.
The Battle of Tours (October 10, 732), also called Battle of Poitiers and in Arabic بلاط الشهداء (Balâṭ al-Shuhadâ’) The Court of Martyrs[6] was fought near the city of Tours, close to the border between the Frankish realm and then-independent Aquitaine. The battle pitted Frankish and Burgundian[7][8] forces under Austrasian Mayor of the Palace Charles Martel against an army of the Umayyad Caliphate led by ‘Abdul Rahman Al Ghafiqi, Governor-general of al-Andalus. The Franks were victorious, ‘Abdul Rahman Al Ghafiqi was killed, and Martel subsequently extended his authority in the south. Ninth-century chroniclers, who interpreted the outcome of the battle as divine judgment in his favour, gave Charles the nickname Martellus ("The Hammer"), possibly recalling Judas Maccabeus ("The Hammerer") of the Maccabean revolt.[9][10] Details of the battle, including its exact location and the exact number of combatants, cannot be determined from accounts that have survived.[11]

As later chroniclers praised Charles Martel as the champion of Christianity, pre-20th century historians began to characterize this battle as being the decisive turning point in the struggle against Islam. "Most of the 18th and 19th century historians, like Gibbon, saw Poitiers (Tours), as a landmark battle that marked the high tide of the Muslim advance into Europe."[12] Leopold Von Ranke felt that "Poitiers was the turning point of one of the most important epochs in the history of the world." [13]

While modern historians are divided as to whether or not the victory was responsible — as Gibbon and his generation of historians claimed — for saving Christianity and halting the conquest of Europe by Islam, the battle helped lay the foundations of the Carolingian Empire and Frankish domination of Europe for the next century. "The establishment of Frankish power in western Europe shaped that continent's destiny and the Battle of Tours confirmed that power."[14]
Franks were badly outnumbered at the onset of battle by at least 2-1
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جوري
07-05-2007, 05:33 PM
Originally Posted by Aaron85
Truth hurts. Because muslims didnt come to Europe without sword and fire. Learn some history and you will see. My own country has few hundred years tradition with defending its lands against Osmans and Tatars invadors.
BTW if i said something not true, so please tell me what was not true and correct me.
The truth would hurt if there was in fact truths in it. But yours is the account of a cultist indoctrinated in some medieval beliefs which he doesn't want to shake off, Sort of like the gentleman above speaking of the outrage of taking a bath in medieval Europe and how it is incompatible with Christianity and casting aside those who bathed as magicians . A clean mind and body I suppose is in fact incompatible with Christianity still? it is all what you wish to be true , but in fact your Christian history pales so severely in comparison to the wonders of the Muslim empire. And thankfully though Europeans admitted to the burning of all Muslim literature in Spain, many are piecing together, this fantastic history, and yours will remain the opinion of an unschooled boy, with a temper tantrum ...I can understand how that would raise in you feelings of indignation inferiority ...but from that point on is really not worthy of a response. I have grown tired of your posts and they have lost all meaning over time... !
have a great day!
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guyabano
07-05-2007, 05:34 PM
Originally Posted by Aaron85
Truth hurts. Because muslims didnt come to Europe without sword and fire. Learn some history and you will see. My own country has few hundred years tradition with defending its lands against Osmans and Tatars invadors.
BTW if i said something not true, so please tell me what was not true and correct me.
I never saw any muslim in my country neither !

Originally Posted by PurestAmbrosia
but we'll get it back Insha'Allah!
What will you get back? :rollseyes The candy someone stole you ?
Reply

Amadeus85
07-05-2007, 05:39 PM
Originally Posted by PurestAmbrosia
The truth would hurt if there was in fact truths in it. But yours is the account of a cultist indoctrinated in some medieval beliefs which he doesn't want to shake off, Sort of like the gentleman above speaking of the outrage of taking a bath in medieval Europe and how it is incompatible with Christianity and casting aside those who bathed as magicians . A clean mind and body I suppose is in fact incompatible with Christianity still? it is all what you wish to be true , but in fact your Christian history pales so severely in comparison to the wonders of the Muslim empire. And thankfully though Europeans admitted to the burning of all Muslim literature in Spain, many are piecing together, this fantastic history, and yours will remain the opinion of an unschooled boy, with a temper tantrum ...I can understand how that would raise in you feelings of indignation inferiority ...but from that point on is really not worthy of a response. I have grown tired of your posts and they have lost all meaning over time... !
have a great day!

Except of making such emotional post you should rather show me exactly where i said not truth and show me the truth, for example- Osmans came to Greece and Serbia not as invadors but as guests because Serbs and Greeks invited them or Tatars enslaved thousands of europeans only to raise them as philosophs and lawayers and then they sent them back or something like that.
I say it again which my words are not true. I am a student of history. If i am wrong just correct me.
Reply

جوري
07-05-2007, 05:41 PM
Originally Posted by guyabano

What will you get back? :rollseyes
I understand you to be a little vexed from the previous post, where surprisingly you didn't get to have the last word for a change... perhaps you should take your own advise and just not reply to my usually "choleric posts".... Surely you can get your adrenaline from some other worthy activity?
We'll get Europe back as Allah wills and when Allah wills ...We have three out of four thus far--


"You will invade the Arabian Peninsula and Allah will grant it (to you). Then (you will conquer) Persia and Allah will grant it (to you). Then, you will invade Ar-Rum and Allah will grant it (to you). Then, you will invade The Dajjal and Allah will grant him (to you)." Nafi' said to Jabir, "O Jabir! We do not believe that the Dajjal will appear until Ar-Rum is conquered."[Ibid., no. 2028]

The land of Ar-Rum is Europe and Rome is its heart. The Messenger of Allah gave us the good tidings that we will conquer Rome, the capital of Christendom today, after the Muslims conquered the first capital of Christendom, Constantinople.
same Hadith different version!

"You will invade the Arabian Peninsula and God will grant it. Then Persia and God will grant it. Then you shall invade Ar-Rum (Europe) and God will grant it. Then you shall attack the Antichrist and God shall give him to you"The Messenger of God was then asked "which of the two cities will be conquered first - Constantinople or Rome?" and the Holy Prophet PBUH replied : " The city of Heraclius (Constantinople) will be conquered FIRST"
peace!
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Amadeus85
07-05-2007, 05:44 PM
Originally Posted by PurestAmbrosia
, but in fact your Christian history pales so severely in comparison to the wonders of the Muslim empire.
Muslim great empire began and ended in medieval. It was 1 thousands year ago. Since then, we european barbarians created spaceships and reached the Moon. All technology that you are using now was made by people from Western civilization. Without us , people would still ride on horses or donkeys, and die from a flu.
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Amadeus85
07-05-2007, 05:46 PM
Originally Posted by PurestAmbrosia
"You will invade the Arabian Peninsula and Allah will grant it (to you). Then (you will conquer) Persia and Allah will grant it (to you). Then, you will invade Ar-Rum and Allah will grant it (to you). Then, you will invade The Dajjal and Allah will grant him (to you)." Nafi' said to Jabir, "O Jabir! We do not believe that the Dajjal will appear until Ar-Rum is conquered."[Ibid., no. 2028]

The land of Ar-Rum is Europe and Rome is its heart. The Messenger of Allah gave us the good tidings that we will conquer Rome, the capital of Christendom today, after the Muslims conquered the first capital of Christendom, Constantinople.


peace!
Yeah, first conquer and then peace. But its quite typical. Religion of peace.
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جوري
07-05-2007, 05:54 PM
Originally Posted by Aaron85
Yeah, first conquer and then peace. But its quite typical. Religion of peace.
Quran mandates that we are to be good to POW's
"They perform (their) vows, and they fear a Day Whose evil flies far and wide. And they feed, for the love of Allah, the indigent, the orphan, and the captive (prisoner of war) -- (Saying), 'We feed you For the sake of Allah alone: No reward do we desire from you, nor thanks.' (The Noble Quran, 76:7-9)"
Does Christianity tell you to do to people what your soldiers did in Abu Gharib? it is Christian to make people naked and burn them with cigarettes for voyeuristic purposes?-- impose economic and political sanctions on them? I probably have to assume it does! But out mannerisms aren't yours and it is again visible to the naked eye!
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ACC
07-05-2007, 06:19 PM
Originally Posted by PurestAmbrosia
I understand you to be a little vexed from the previous post, where surprisingly you didn't get to have the last word for a change... perhaps you should take your own advise and just not reply to my usually "choleric posts".... Surely you can get your adrenaline from some other worthy activity?
We'll get Europe back as Allah wills and when Allah wills ...We have three out of four thus far--



same Hadith different version!



peace!
Wouldnt it make sense that Constantinople would be reached after Arabia and before Rome because of geographical reasons?

I for myself believe that Rome will never be Muslim, God willing. How can you get something back that you never had?
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czgibson
07-05-2007, 06:45 PM
Greetings,
Originally Posted by PurestAmbrosia
We'll get Europe back as Allah wills and when Allah wills
Just out of interest:

When, throughout the history of the world, has Europe been Muslim?

Peace
Reply

Muezzin
07-05-2007, 06:51 PM
Er... isn't this thread more about Islamic contributions to Europe rather than Islamic conquest of Europe? I think there's been a mix up somewhere.

Unless that place is me.

That sentence makes no sense.
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czgibson
07-05-2007, 07:01 PM
Greetings,

I thought it was about the Islamic history of Europe...

:p

Peace
Reply

Muezzin
07-05-2007, 07:02 PM
Originally Posted by czgibson
Greetings,

I thought it was about the Islamic history of Europe...

:p

Peace
Aha!

Perhaps certain members should stop fighting now? :)
Reply

guyabano
07-05-2007, 08:31 PM
Originally Posted by PurestAmbrosia
I understand you to be a little vexed from the previous post, where surprisingly you didn't get to have the last word for a change... perhaps you should take your own advise and just not reply to my usually "choleric posts".... Surely you can get your adrenaline from some other worthy activity?
We'll get Europe back as Allah wills and when Allah wills ...We have three out of four thus far--



same Hadith different version!



peace!
Ermmm, the topic is about History of Europe, islam, something, no? Please stay on topic! Well, you cannot already get back Israel, so how you will get back Europe. You're spinning in higher spheres. Maybe you should come back to reality.
I think, we all want to live in peace, and you want to conquer the world? Wow !!

PS: in this previous post you speak about, the mods deleted your post, so I let you at least a small satisfaction to have the last word.:D
Reply

جوري
07-05-2007, 08:46 PM
Originally Posted by ACC
Wouldnt it make sense that Constantinople would be reached after Arabia and before Rome because of geographical reasons?

I for myself believe that Rome will never be Muslim, God willing. How can you get something back that you never had?
we didn't have Arabia to have Persia or Rome at the time -- in fact if you know anything of history you'd have known that even that Muslims were threatened in the Arabian Peninsula itself as a minority, and after wards were threatened by Rome, you can read about Khalid ibn Alwaleed on this site
This web-site contains perhaps one of the most brilliant biographies written on the Companion of the Prophet (SAWS), Khalid bin Al-Waleed, Sword of Allah.

Khalid bin Al-Waleed was one of the greatest generals in history, and one of the greatest heroes of Islam. Besides him, Genghis Khan was the only other general to remain undefeated in his entire military life. A measure of Khalid's genius is that he was the only person to inflict a (temporary) defeat on the Prophet Muhammad, (may Allah bless him and grant him peace).

The original title of the book, "The Sword of Allah: Khalid bin Al-Waleed, His Life and Campaigns" was written by the late Lieutenant-General A.I. Akram of the Pakistan Army, in October 1969. The author learnt Arabic in order to draw on the earliest historical sources and he visited every one of Khalid's battlefields in order to draw analyses from the viewpoint of military strategy, including reconciling conflicting historians' accounts. The book was originally published by the Army Education Press, Rawalpindi, Pakistan and printed by Feroze Sons Publishers in Lahore, Pakistan. The excellence of the book was such that it has been translated from English into Arabic and is currently sold in bookshops throughout the Arab World.

Since the material is taken from a book, for maximum benefit, the reader is advised to read the book from the beginning to the end. However, before you do that, please read the following sections in the following order:-- http://www.swordofallah.com/

all of these events happened post the passing of the Messenger PBUH, that is Arabia/ Persia/ Constantinople, Muslims reached many part of Europe but there were problems external and internal and bros Qatada has written a great post about the history of the time and what sort of problems arose I don't want to waste more time discussing scandals within, even treaties between Harun Ar-Rachid and Charlemagne to bring Andulus down but that is an expansive topic and I don't think any of these posts revolve around the discussion at hand-- I have watched many great posts fall to an untimely descent by the regular Poorly and insufficiently educated three or four members-- At this point your feelings or hopes are inconsequential to me--and I find it a bit non-sequitur to tie in (conquests to proximity?).. what is that about? a little non-sensical...

I am un subscribing from this thread because I find it a great waste of time to quarrel with zealous pubescent teenagers-- it won't change history as documented and learned by historians or change the future which lies entirely in the hand of G-D..



peace!
Reply

Amadeus85
07-05-2007, 08:50 PM
Originally Posted by PurestAmbrosia
But out mannerisms aren't yours and it is again visible to the naked eye!
Yes, every day we can see it. Just watch the tv and check world news.
Reply

جوري
07-05-2007, 08:51 PM
Originally Posted by guyabano
Ermmm, the topic is about History of Europe, islam, something, no? Please stay on topic! Well, you cannot already get back Israel, so how you will get back Europe. You're spinning in higher spheres. Maybe you should come back to reality.
I think, we all want to live in peace, and you want to conquer the world? Wow !!

PS: in this previous post you speak about, the mods deleted your post, so I let you at least a small satisfaction to have the last word.:D
Actually they deleted yours... perhaps you have problems understanding the written word? as for Israel what do you know their wealth and power is mentioned too in the Quran.. and at the end of the chapter shall too be their demise!

وَقَضَيْنَا إِلَى بَنِي إِسْرَائِيلَ فِي الْكِتَابِ لَتُفْسِدُنَّ فِي الأَرْضِ مَرَّتَيْنِ وَلَتَعْلُنَّ عُلُوًّا كَبِيرًا {
4}
[Pickthal 17:4] And We decreed for the Children of Israel in the Scripture: Ye verily will work corruption in the earth twice, and ye will become great tyrants.

فَإِذَا جَاء وَعْدُ أُولاهُمَا بَعَثْنَا عَلَيْكُمْ عِبَادًا لَّنَا أُوْلِي بَأْسٍ شَدِيدٍ فَجَاسُواْ خِلاَلَ الدِّيَارِ وَكَانَ وَعْدًا مَّفْعُولاً {5}
[Pickthal 17:5] So when the time for the first of the two came, We roused against you slaves of Ours of great might who ravaged (your) country, and it was a threat performed.

ثُمَّ رَدَدْنَا لَكُمُ الْكَرَّةَ عَلَيْهِمْ وَأَمْدَدْنَاكُم بِأَمْوَالٍ وَبَنِينَ وَجَعَلْنَاكُمْ أَكْثَرَ نَفِيرًا {6}
[Pickthal 17:6] Then we gave you once again your turn against them, and We aided you with wealth and children and made you more in soldiery.

إِنْ أَحْسَنتُمْ أَحْسَنتُمْ لِأَنفُسِكُمْ وَإِنْ أَسَأْتُمْ فَلَهَا فَإِذَا جَاء وَعْدُ الآخِرَةِ لِيَسُوؤُواْ وُجُوهَكُمْ وَلِيَدْخُلُواْ الْمَسْجِدَ كَمَا دَخَلُوهُ أَوَّلَ مَرَّةٍ وَلِيُتَبِّرُواْ مَا عَلَوْاْ تَتْبِيرًا {7}
[Pickthal 17:7] (Saying): If ye do good, ye do good for your own souls, and if ye do evil, it is for them (in like manner). So, when the time for the second (of the judgments) came (We roused against you others of Our slaves) to ravage you, and to enter the Temple even as they entered it the first time, and to lay waste all that they conquered with an utter wasting.
they are having their great rise as is decreed and shall have a great demise as is decreed
peace!
Reply

sudais1
07-05-2007, 10:47 PM
Originally Posted by Aaron85
Muslim great empire began and ended in medieval. It was 1 thousands year ago. Since then, we European barbarians created spaceships and reached the Moon. All technology that you are using now was made by people from Western civilization. Without us , people would still ride on horses or donkeys, and die from a flu.
I thought you studied history, The Muslims had such a great influence in the medical world and others. While Islam witnessed the great years in Spain while other euro countries were in the dark age. Muslim countries had lit there whole cities with light before i think about 750-800 before European major cities. We established great medical practices which are still practiced today. Your post was very ignorant and as you claim to be a student of history you would know this. The quality of life was so low in Europe in contrast the Muslims enjoyed great wealth. After a crusade the fighters of the cross would stay in Muslim countries to gather spices, clothing, and other goods which europe was yet to see. Muslims had the first book stores and were the first people to put patients of differnent diseases in different rooms so they don't infect each other. You europeons used to get Preists to heal sickness while the Islamic empire had medical scholars and physicians. The quality of life enjoyed by the Muslims is far greater than that of the rest of the world. Even today our cities are greater than yours. Everybody knowadys wants to go to Emirates, WHY? because its the most beutiful place in the world. The type of buildings there are far greater than europe. europes streets are still two feet wide with narrow houses same as they were 800 years ago. Wheater you except it or not, The Islamic empires history is far superior than any other. I am not saying this out of emotion but truth. Our Muslim countries have much more resuorces than europe thats why your countries came to Africa and the middle east to take resources. In Malaysia the largest Muslim populated country was not conqured, not oine sword was raised but they were impressed by the behaviour of the muslim fishermen and that made them convert. Your "lies" about Islam are ignorant and your claims are out of emotion and have no truth in them.

Peace
Reply

جوري
07-05-2007, 11:23 PM
Originally Posted by sudais1
I thought you studied history, The Muslims had such a great influence in the medical world and others. While Islam witnessed the great years in Spain while other euro countries were in the dark age. Muslim countries had lit there whole cities with light before i think about 750-800 before European major cities. We established great medical practices which are still practiced today. Your post was very ignorant and as you claim to be a student of history you would know this. The quality of life was so low in Europe in contrast the Muslims enjoyed great wealth. After a crusade the fighters of the cross would stay in Muslim countries to gather spices, clothing, and other goods which europe was yet to see. Muslims had the first book stores and were the first people to put patients of differnent diseases in different rooms so they don't infect each other. You europeons used to get Preists to heal sickness while the Islamic empire had medical scholars and physicians. The quality of life enjoyed by the Muslims is far greater than that of the rest of the world. Even today our cities are greater than yours. Everybody knowadys wants to go to Emirates, WHY? because its the most beutiful place in the world. The type of buildings there are far greater than europe. europes streets are still two feet wide with narrow houses same as they were 800 years ago. Wheater you except it or not, The Islamic empires history is far superior than any other. I am not saying this out of emotion but truth. Our Muslim countries have much more resuorces than europe thats why your countries came to Africa and the middle east to take resources. In Malaysia the largest Muslim populated country was not conqured, not oine sword was raised but they were impressed by the behaviour of the muslim fishermen and that made them convert. Your "lies" about Islam are ignorant and your claims are out of emotion and have no truth in them.

Peace
I hate to feed into that puerile psychology, that some resort to when they find a post with any glimmer of hope to echo their sentiment , hang on to, and augment its resonance, it is narcissism wrapped in a slew of vacuous comments.
In the face of all these documentaries, you'll find some of them insisting that they "know" history or its "under belly"? unbeknownst to the rest of the read world.... I can't find one post here of Muslims, or about Muslims that isn't tainted by the lot of them. And I admit that I get baited into contending with some of them ... but my goal and yours should ultimately be the young Muslims on board. History isn't learned from blogs on the hands of juvenile adolescents who lecture bombastically from wikipedia when they have neither matured psychology or linguistically to take on a key board...as always it turns out to be more of a soccer match for people who should better invest their time acquiring some basic vocational training to foster self-esteem!
in other words just disregard the ill comments you read like you would do charity toward any challenged person.. the documentaries speak for themselves he and others of his ilk can have their conniption fit to their heart's content
:w:
Reply

snakelegs
07-06-2007, 12:26 AM
in case anyone missed it, the 3 part series, islam empire of faith is also very good.
http://www.islamicboard.com/general-...ire-faith.html
Reply

Zman
07-06-2007, 03:24 AM
Originally Posted by Aaron85
Muslim great empire began and ended in medieval. It was 1 thousands year ago. Since then, we european barbarians created spaceships and reached the Moon. All technology that you are using now was made by people from Western civilization. Without us , people would still ride on horses or donkeys, and die from a flu.


Just like you and a few other Islamophobes berated Muslims when we posted articles about the accomplishments of the Islamic Civilization, by constantly not failing to miss any opportunities to remind us that "our" accomplishments wouldn't have materialized if "we" hadn't translated and benefited from the "Greek," and "Roman" achievements

I'd like to take this opportunity to remind you also, that Christendom & the West would still be living in their Dark Ages if they hadn't translated and utilized Islamic Sciences and what we generousely passed on to you from past civilizations, instead of hording it and trying to keep you in your miserable state so we can maintain our dominion over you.

It is also Just as true that the Greeks & Romans benefited from their translation and utilization of the sciences that were pioneered by civilizations that were much older and advanced than theirs. Like the ancient Egyptians, Babylonians, Mesopotamians, Assyrians, etc.

One of the reasons that the West plunged into its Dark Ages, was when the Western Roman Empire lost it's contact with the Eastern Civilizations & know-how. Compare that with the Eastern Roman Empire going on to flourish, due to its constant contact with the East and the benefit that was gained from that continuous interaction.

The history of human advancement in general and science in particular did not begin with the Greeks. Nor did it reach it's height by their civilization.

So you need to swallow some humble pie and salute those ancient and glorious civilizations that pre-dated the Greeks & Romans, and you also need to salute the Islamic Civilization & Muslim Scientists for their achivements and ethics in passing down their unique discoveries and translations of ancient texts to the West, or you wouldn't have been able to learn how to fly or go into space, etc...
Reply

guyabano
07-06-2007, 08:11 AM
Originally Posted by PurestAmbrosia
Actually they deleted yours... perhaps you have problems understanding the written word? as for Israel what do you know their wealth and power is mentioned too in the Quran.. and at the end of the chapter shall too be their demise!

وَقَضَيْنَا إِلَى بَنِي إِسْرَائِيلَ فِي الْكِتَابِ لَتُفْسِدُنَّ فِي الأَرْضِ مَرَّتَيْنِ وَلَتَعْلُنَّ عُلُوًّا كَبِيرًا {

they are having their great rise as is decreed and shall have a great demise as is decreed
peace!
Well, funny to see, how you highlight it. . I didn't nearby notice it, but I will contradict you in this point.
Well, I can read/write fluently 6 languages, but sorry, I don't understand abrabic.
Further, I base my words on facts and not verses out of a book. I believe what I see, and not what somebody once said centuries ago.

But go on, I enjoy reading your posts. It's always funny, when you turn to

Back to topic: I will not copy/paste texts out of websites, but honestly, I learned history of my region long enough in school, but never was mentionned the word muslim or islamisation of Europe. I also doubt, that the muslims reached the north of Europe because I don't know what the Vikings would have done with the muslim soldiers. The Romans are often mentionned, the Teutons, the britains, the french, sure, but I never heard anything about muslims and Islam.
So, all in all, is that words 'We will get back Europe' not a little bit exaggerated?
Muslims may have large communities across Europe, but I seriously doubt, countries like UK, Scotland, Sweden, Netherland (to name only a few) will ever be islamic countries.
Reply

Muezzin
07-06-2007, 10:26 AM
Guys, I'd really like it if this thread didn't just become some sort of demented internet holy war.
Reply

جوري
07-06-2007, 12:49 PM
Originally Posted by guyabano
Well, funny to see, how you highlight it. http://www.cosgan.de/images/smilie/froehlich/k010.gif . I didn't nearby notice it, but I will contradict you in this point.
Well, I can read/write fluently 6 languages, but sorry, I don't understand abrabic.
Further, I base my words on facts and not verses out of a book. I believe what I see, and not what somebody once said centuries ago.

But go on, I enjoy reading your posts. It's always funny, when you turn to http://www.cosgan.de/images/smilie/boese/a030.gif

Back to topic: I will not copy/paste texts out of websites, but honestly, I learned history of my region long enough in school, but never was mentionned the word muslim or islamisation of Europe. I also doubt, that the muslims reached the north of Europe because I don't know what the Vikings would have done with the muslim soldiers. The Romans are often mentionned, the Teutons, the britains, the french, sure, but I never heard anything about muslims and Islam.
So, all in all, is that words 'We will get back Europe' not a little bit exaggerated?
Muslims may have large communities across Europe, but I seriously doubt, countries like UK, Scotland, Sweden, Netherland (to name only a few) will ever be islamic countries.
Let's start in the order of my choosing...
here is what you "didn't notice:, it has been laying orphaned in my mail box would you like to see it? an excerpt-- though I think whomever erased it for you has done you a grand favor, because I thought it was hilarious
You just encourage all the muslims to vote 'muslim'. So it is not only me, and also I got some private messages from board members who said the same thing. Your intentions in this post are too much obivious.
perhaps the give away was that I am Muslim, posting on an Islamic forum, encouraging people to vote Muslim and stating in the very title 3 more days vote Islamic?-- Man you are much too observant if it weren't for all those languages under your belt I'd have taken you for an erudite detective... Indeed, How dare I post encouraging people to bring back love for their Islamic architecture? this should definitely be a topic for discussion and some clandestine affair going on between you and two of your alter egos via PM on how to change the outcome of some silly contest-- are you really that petty and obsequious?

further, where in my "original" post did I say we'll get back Europe garbanzo or do you so Enjoy reading between the lines? it wasn't until later posts and a non sequitur to what I first wrote and I see it gives you a case of hives, but indeed the Hadith states that we'll be granted Rome not twice but once, the first is the city of Heraculues (Constantinople) which is Modern day Turkey by the way [there is strong evidence to suggest that king Offa of England was in fact Muslim], but that is a topic for another day and another thread! -- The original post however, states we are systematically being written out of history but we'll get it back... your inferences must be a direct result of all that Psycho babble you pass off as languages? Save it for your employer, or the one checking out your crypts of Morgagni on a DRE!
If you had such an impressive list of resumes, please let it refine you a little, I find your style comparable to someone in grade school... and yes it would be really nice if we can have a topic without the three of four of you trolling, I am not sure why you are under this impression that what you think of us Muslims or our history or religion somehow matters ? Whether you believe or not in what I quote is honestly utterly inconsequential to me, this is an Islamic forum, where Muslims dwell and discuss Muslim affairs, using Islamic sources, encouraging Islamic crafts and Islamic history. what you see or don't see in the world around you and learned from your PS 173 is like wise amusing but utterly inconesquential.
Perhaps your feelings of invisibility, attention seeking behavior, and incessant display of temper tantrums is something you ought to discuss with your therapist, and not publically on a forum? though I think s/he should have passed you a dx of Klüver-Bucy than just a mere case of alexia with hemianopia that has rendered you unable to comprehend the written word or engage with others on a human level!



peace!

Addendum:
To the mods: I am impressed!--I have never had privileges like these on a Christian forum, or an Atheist forum the two I once upon a time joined-- complaining for instance that a Muslim member is encouraging other members to vote for Islamic things ( the nerve)? Imagine I had the audacity to do this on another forum telling a Christian your charade is obvious, you are encouraging people to vote for Christian things, or completely lying about their history, impugning their achievements, maligning their character, I'd have been banned in a heart beat not further encouraged. I don't understand really? I am not just speaking of incessant, trolling, lying, harassing members, conspiring on private messages amongst themselves but down right insolence. Do these seem like a mature debates to you, or the intent here only obvious to a handful?
:w:
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Woodrow
07-06-2007, 01:55 PM
I think it best if this thread has at least a cooling off period. If it can be cleaned up and brought back to it's original intent it will be reopened but until then:

:threadclo
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