U.S. plans big arms sale to Saudi Arabia

[islamirama]

U.S. plans big arms sale to Saudi Arabia: report

Fri Jul 27, 11:30 PM ET
NEW YORK (Reuters) - The Bush administration is preparing to ask Congress to approve arms sales totaling $20 billions over the next decade for Saudi Arabia and its neighbors, The New York Times reported in Saturday editions.

Coming as some U.S. officials contend that the Saudi government is not helping the situation in Iraq, the proposal for advanced weapons for Saudi Arabia has stoked concern in Israel and among its U.S. backers, the Times said. The package of advanced weaponry includes advanced satellite-guided bombs, upgrades for its fighters and new naval vessels.

Senior officials, including State Department and Pentagon officials who outlined the deals' terms, told the Times they thought the Bush administration had resolved those concerns, partly by offering Israel more than $30 billion in military aid over the next 10 years , which would be a significant increase over recent levels.
Administration officials remain concerned, however, that the package could draw opposition from Saudi critics in Congress, which is to be notified formally about the deal this autumn, the newspaper said.
The State Department and the White House had no comment on the Times' article, and a Pentagon spokesperson could not immediately be reached for comment.
Assurances from the Saudis about being more supportive in Iraq were not sought by the administration as part of the deal, U.S. officials told the newspaper.
The Times said officials described the plan as intended to bolster Gulf countries' militaries in a bid to contain Iran's growing strength in the region, as well as to demonstrate Washington's commitment to its Arab allies.
But they added that Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice and Defense Secretary Robert Gates still plan to use their joint visit to Saudi Arabia next week to press for help with Iraq 's government.
"The role of the Sunni Arab neighbors is to send a positive, affirmative message to moderates in Iraq in government that the neighbors are with you," the newspaper quoted a senior State Department official as saying.
The official added that Washington wants Gulf states to stress to Sunnis that engaging in violence is "killing your future."
Other salves to Israel in light of the proposed deal include asking the Saudis to accept restrictions on the range, size and location of the satellite-guided bombs , the Times said. The Pentagon is also asking for a commitment not to store the weapons at air bases close to Israeli territory, it added.

Along with Saudi Arabia, Bahrain , Kuwait , Oman , Qatar and the United Arab Emirates are likely to receive equipment and weaponry from the arms sales under consideration, the Times said.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20070728/...t_usa_saudi_dc

--------

Assalaamu 'alaikum wa rahmatullaah wa Barakaatuh,

What would Saudi Arabia do with $20 billion worth of new weapons except waste its money? Saudi Arabia has no immediate enemies in the region except Israel, Western forces occupying Afghanistan and Iraq and their stooges in the area ( i.e. Ethiopia). Moreover, it is fatal for Saudi Arabian security, or any Muslim state, to equip its armed forces with weapons made by the enemies of Islaam. The Saudi military would be a lame duck if the U.S. withholds the supply of spare parts, missiles and munitions for any reason in the future. The U.S. is a staunch enemy not an ally. Any nation that relies on imported weapons, especially from its enemies, to defend itself is doomed nation.

What did Saudi Arabia do with the AWACS it bought in the late 1970s? They were flown by American pilots and were used to spy on Iraq and Iran.

The difference between the weapons the U.S. will sell to the Saudis and those it will give to the Israelis is that Israel sends its own shopping list to Washington and its experts to pick the weapons they want. The Saudis, however, will be given weapons the U.S. chooses and will be stripped down to the bare minimum of capabilities.

The U.S. and its Zionist bosses want To ignite a war between Iran on the one side and its neighbors on the other, and have Saudi Arabia fight America 's war against Iran for them!



Saudi is like Switzerland. That place is the mecca of the kuffars as saudi is for the Muslims. The kuffar's god (wealth) is in that land. All the money for is in swiss accounts so no one dares attack that nation, the nation doesn't even have an army. Saudi is the same way, it doesn't need an army as no one would dare attack it.



From Bahjat

[wilberhum]

What would Saudi Arabia do with $20 billion worth of new weapons except waste its money?

Protect it’s self from terrorists.

Saudi Arabia has no immediate enemies in the region except Israel,

When has Israel threatened Saudi Arabia?

equip its armed forces with weapons made by the enemies of Islaam.

The enemies of Islam are the terrorists not those that attack them.

Just more of your standard “I hate the country that has given me a home”.
Just can't stand the fact that not all countries hate America, can you.

[جوري]

probably sold them some mal-functioning crap that will either self-destruct or be good for nothing.. Approved by Israel should have been the give away... I can almost see the two louts and poor excuses for countries laughing all the way to the bank..

Saudi Arabia should have made that transaction with Russia, not the U.S.!... at least now, let's hope they have some Egyptian engineers on board to inspect their undoubtedly questionable equipment!

[Keltoi]

probably sold them some mal-functioning crap that will either self-destruct or be good for nothing.. Approved by Israel should have been the give away... I can almost see the two louts and poor excuses for countries laughing all the way to the bank..

Saudi Arabia should have made that transaction with Russia, not the U.S.!... at least now, let's hope they have some Egyptian engineers on board to inspect their undoubtedly questionable equipment!

Of course, we all know that the Saudis are incapable of testing equipment before purchase....:hiding:

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[جوري]

Are we reaffirming the obvious?

[Keltoi]

Are we reaffirming the obvious?

How does it make any sense at all for the United States, known to have the most advanced weapons systems in the world, to sell faulty equipment in a major diplomatic deal? That question was rhetorical, it doesn't make any sense.

[جوري]

You have a very trusting nature.. it is pure, I like it =)... Why sell faulty equipment? I suppose for the same reasons China sells tainted food and bogus drugs to the U.S and other parts of the world... unscrupulous politicos exist every where, including in your very private 'one nation under G-D'..
The U.S doesn't have Arab or Muslim interest at heart!

peace!

[Amadeus85]

Saudi Arabia should have made that transaction with Russia, not the U.S.!... at least now, let's hope they have some Egyptian engineers on board to inspect their undoubtedly questionable equipment!

With Russians? The same who conquered and murdered Afghans and who still murder Chechens?

[جوري]

Since when do you care for Afghans or Chechens?.. I'd indeed trust the Russians with military equipments.. Many other countries in the middle east got their arms from Russia--- Egypt, Syria, to name a few.. they might have been modest arms but there was no hokey pokey business going on with their weapons the rest relied on the skill and training of the soldiers... Saudis are too pampered to fight or have the tenacity and drive of the neighboring regions who have suffered and continue to suffer and don't have that kind of wealth to squander on weaponery... 20 billion would have gone a long way with the rouskies, and I have no doubt their equipment would be more withstanding and rugged at least in the right hands...

[Keltoi]

Since when do you care for Afghans or Chechens?.. I'd indeed trust the Russians with military equipments.. Many other countries in the middle east got their arms from Russia--- Egypt, Syria, to name a few.. they might have been modest arms but there was no hokey pokey business going on with their weapons the rest relied on the skill and training of the soldiers... Saudis are too pampered to fight or have the tenacity and drive of the neighboring regions who have suffered and continue to suffer and don't have that kind of wealth to squander on weaponery... 20 billion would have gone a long way with the rouskies, and I have no doubt their equipment would be more withstanding and rugged at least in the right hands...

What evidence do you have that the equipment is faulty in the first place? Absolutely none. There is no logic behind it. Politically, it is a slap in the face to Iran, whose government is not going to be happy about a strengthened Saudi Arabia. Another factor to consider is that this is also a business deal, meaning those who build and sell these military technologies have a stake in selling the best product available.

[جوري]

My evidence is my own mother country's intelligence agency with such deals that went on in the past... I don't really have to share any more than that, as I don't feel on trial, nor do I care if this gets misrepresented with the usual satirical ridicule... It would be good if the intentions are indeed to keep Iran at bay, but I doubt things are as obvious as they seem!

Neither Israel nor the U.S have anyone's vested interest at heart... there is a double or triple incentive here I could think of right off the bat.. the best and most obvious is what a lucrative deal it is.. the rest we'll just have to watch as it unravels, if we live long enough!

Prior I told you I respect you as a member which I do BTW, However, I disagree with 99% of what you say, which is alright I hope?.. I just can't believe the kind of naiveté you display sometimes.. either you think we are complete oafs when it comes to politics, or you just need to believe the obvious without any critical judgement when it comes to your govt. as you don't think them at all capable of evil or having an ulterior motive?


peace!

[guyabano]

...to equip its armed forces with weapons made by the enemies of Islaam

When you write already posts with insulting words, be at least a little bit descent with the words. There are no enemies of Islaam, just of terrorism.

[sarcastic mode ON]I say, let's equip all middle east countries with Hightec weapons. Anyway, most there are such war lovers, they will wipe out themselves, so no more problems with radicals. Problems solved[sarcastic mode=OFF]

[Curaezipirid]

Maybe Saudis will end all war by buying out every gun from every American?

There is always Hope.

[vapid vagabond]

I would be worried less about whether the weapons are of good quality (I am fairly sure that they are plenty lethal), but rather with the enormous quantity of weaponry going into a very tense part of the world.

Guyabano said he was being sarcastic, but I sometimes wonder how far off such an idea is.

- the vapid vagabond

[Keltoi]

My evidence is my own mother country's intelligence agency with such deals that went on in the past... I don't really have to share any more than that, as I don't feel on trial, nor do I care if this gets misrepresented with the usual satirical ridicule... It would be good if the intentions are indeed to keep Iran at bay, but I doubt things are as obvious as they seem!

Neither Israel nor the U.S have anyone's vested interest at heart... there is a double or triple incentive here I could think of right off the bat.. the best and most obvious is what a lucrative deal it is.. the rest we'll just have to watch as it unravels, if we live long enough!

Prior I told you I respect you as a member which I do BTW, However, I disagree with 99% of what you say, which is alright I hope?.. I just can't believe the kind of naiveté you display sometimes.. either you think we are complete oafs when it comes to politics, or you just need to believe the obvious without any critical judgement when it comes to your govt. as you don't think them at all capable of evil or having an ulterior motive?


peace!

We are talking about two different issues here. You seem to think that because I believe the weapons sold to Saudi Arabia will indeed function properly I'm also suggesting the U.S. sold the weapons out of kindness and brotherly affection. I don't believe that either. Politically, the Saudis have shown their willingness to fight Al-Qaeda and their affilliates. Throw Iran into the equation, and you have a good reason to keep the Saudis happy and properly armed.

Obviously Israel has no illusions about the functionality of the weapons sold, as they were very upset by the deal, which led to the U.S. promising Israel another military aid program over the next 10 years. This is all politics and strategy, and no it doesn't come from brotherly love. However, I would bet the life of my dog Mollinator that when the first Saudi soldier picks up his new American made rifle it will fire and leave a large hole in the target.

[Muezzin]

I would be worried less about whether the weapons are of good quality (I am fairly sure that they are plenty lethal), but rather with the enormous quantity of weaponry going into a very tense part of the world.

Business is business.

As an aside: I wonder why there tends to be more vitriole directed towards lawyers than arms companies. Maybe because lawyer jokes are safer.

[Haidar_Abbas]

:sl: if the house of saud buy more stuff from them its further affirming their deeping level of straying from islaam...May Allah(SWT) replenish the lands of Islaam with believers and restore the honor of the land that was walked upon by the best generation ..AAMEEN.:sl:

[wilberhum]

:sl: if the house of saud buy more stuff from them its further affirming their deeping level of straying from islaam...May Allah(SWT) replenish the lands of Islaam with believers and restore the honor of the land that was walked upon by the best generation ..AAMEEN.:sl:

Saudi's should send back all there TV sets too. :confused:

[Muezzin]

Saudi's should send back all there TV sets too. :confused:

Nah, not if they're Hitachi.

More seriously and on topic, what my frail brain understands about the reality of world economics is that just about every country relies on imported goods of one kind or another.

[MTAFFI]

My evidence is my own mother country's intelligence agency with such deals that went on in the past... I don't really have to share any more than that, as I don't feel on trial, nor do I care if this gets misrepresented with the usual satirical ridicule... It would be good if the intentions are indeed to keep Iran at bay, but I doubt things are as obvious as they seem!

Neither Israel nor the U.S have anyone's vested interest at heart... there is a double or triple incentive here I could think of right off the bat.. the best and most obvious is what a lucrative deal it is.. the rest we'll just have to watch as it unravels, if we live long enough!

Prior I told you I respect you as a member which I do BTW, However, I disagree with 99% of what you say, which is alright I hope?.. I just can't believe the kind of naiveté you display sometimes.. either you think we are complete oafs when it comes to politics, or you just need to believe the obvious without any critical judgement when it comes to your govt. as you don't think them at all capable of evil or having an ulterior motive?


peace!

pretty apparent from this post and every other one that you have made on this thread is pointless and ignorant. I am suprised that the mods have not deleted your baseless accusations by now.

By the way, the equipment that is recieved in the M.E. from Russia are typically soviet era weaponry, produced by a workforce and economy that is known for its short life span and heavy drinking. I know I wouldnt want to shoot a russian rifle put together by a heavily vodka sedated russian put together.

**Also why is there always an ulterior motive, why cant things ever be as they seem?

[wilberhum]

Of course to make a statement like

probably sold them some mal-functioning crap that will either self-destruct or be good for nothing..

One would need to assume that the sellers never want to make another sale and concider this there "Going out of Business" Sale. :confused:

See, I can recognize stupid statements. :D

[Cognescenti]

Let me see if I understand the line of argument. When the US sells F-16's and F-15's to Israel and the Isarelis shoot down 100 Syrian jets (supplied by you-know-who) in one day without the loss of one US-supplied fighter (this really happened, BTW), that is explained by the superior technology, but when the US sells even newer models to the Saudis, the Saudis are imagined to be duped with recycled 1970's technology (or something like this) and would have been well advised to buy Russian planes?????

There is no rocket science involved in knowing if an F-16 is working right, if you are up in the air in the thing and the engine stops working it is not going to take a lot of diagnostic effort to determine there is a problem.

[NobleMuslimUK]

Not far back US sold China some planes, they had spying technology installed too. Also the deal with Pakistan, they were supposed to deliver the F-18's but the zionists came up with a plan. Now Saudi, they are pathetic for trusting theirs and the whole worlds biggest enemy. Especially if that enemy is best allie is (Israel), under control by (Israel) and is the devils headquarters.

I think that gives a glimpse about why we shouldn't trust US equipment in the first place.

Saudis do need weapons, against their main enemy Israel and now a growing threat Iran. But then again lets not get excited here they are just toys being bought, why not buy nukes. Pakistan nukes are useless until Musharaf is in charge, since Pakistan army is in charge of Saudi protection.

[wilberhum]

Saudis do need weapons, against their main enemy Israel

When has Israel ever threatened Saudi Arabia? :hiding:

Pakistan army is in charge of Saudi protection

What? :giggling: :giggling: :giggling:

whole worlds biggest enemy

Westphobia, what else can be said? :thumbs_do :offended: :hmm:

[جوري]

Not far back US sold China some planes, they had spying technology installed too. Also the deal with Pakistan, they were supposed to deliver the F-18's but the zionists came up with a plan. Now Saudi, they are pathetic for trusting theirs and the whole worlds biggest enemy. Especially if that enemy is best allie is (Israel), under control by (Israel) and is the devils headquarters.

Exactly, I don't think the Saudis even know what to look for, prior in my post I stated such arm sales were attempted in the middle east in exchange for their Russian arms to American made tanks and weapons replete with spy technology, and can be controlled at American head quarters... these surreptitious administrations will not reveal their aims or methods...

unfortunately it takes a licking or two for people to realize what this is all about... a couple of confused cavaliers from on board aren't going to effectively persuade us with their venomous rhetoric..

However, I must admit I enjoy the penning of the billious fellow who tries to get every post removed when it doesn't cater to his version of the truth.. :lol:

:w:

:w:

[Keltoi]

Right, there is a secret U.S. headquarters that secretly controls all technologies sold to foreign buyers....all part of the Zionist plan to spread the word of Satan. It all makes sense now. The issue has been solved...no need to keep the thread open.

[جوري]

I'll refer you back to my previous citation

I don't really have to share any more than that, as I don't feel on trial, nor do I care if this gets misrepresented with the usual satirical ridicule..

I do agree, there is no point to keep the thread open, I am getting jaded with 'world Affairs', are we here to be informed? or to be behave (make-believe) we are good will emissaries on a delegacy to manage public affairs in two paragraphs or less?

peace!

[Woodrow]

Weapons manufacturing is one of if not the largest industry that exists today. One of the odd facts of todays weapons and weapon systems all that I can think of depend on componants made in other countries. Often in the very country they may one day be used against.

I do not know of any country that manufactures their own weapons today. the governments simply request a product. An engineer someplace designs it, sells his idea to a manufacturer who then tries to get a lucrative government contract to make it. the sub-components are often from many separate manufacturers from all around the world.

It really is not a country that sells any weapons, it is an independent business that does. They seldom care about the result, as long as the finished product is being sold to a place far away.

Although there may be some people that believe they are being ruled by the leader of the country they live in, the real truth is we are all being ruled by the corporate heads of big business. If somebody has a product that can make a profit for a mass distributer, it will be on the store shelfs world wide, no matter who makes it or what country it is produced in.

Some business man found a market for surplus US weapons and has managed to find the means of getting the US Government to supply the money so that Saudi and Israel can buy the products from him. It is not the case of any government making an arms deal, it is the case of a scrap metal dealer getting rich off of Saud, Israel and the US.

Just my opinion from reflecting upon the arms industry in the world.

Someday check out the Krupp family on Google. But, keep in mind they are just a small part of the arms industry.

[Keltoi]

I'll refer you back to my previous citation

peace!

My intention is not to put you on trial. I simply stated the same thing as was stated by you and the other poster. Let me try again... The U.S., controlled by their Zionist masters, are participating in a plot to sell faulty military equipment, which they can control from their Satanic HQ, in attempt to do what? The last part I'm not clear on. If it sounds absurd, like I'm being sarcastic, there might be a reason for that.

[Keltoi]

Weapons manufacturing is one of if not the largest industry that exists today. One of the odd facts of todays weapons and weapon systems all that I can think of depend on componants made in other countries. Often in the very country they may one day be used against.

I do not know of any country that manufactures their own weapons today. the governments simply request a product. An engineer someplace designs it, sells his idea to a manufacturer who then tries to get a lucrative government contract to make it. the sub-components are often from many separate manufacturers from all around the world.

It really is not a country that sells any weapons, it is an independent business that does. They seldom care about the result, as long as the finished product is being sold to a place far away.

Although there may be some people that believe they are being ruled by the leader of the country they live in, the real truth is we are all being ruled by the corporate heads of big business. If somebody has a product that can make a profit for a mass distributer, it will be on the store shelfs world wide, no matter who makes it or what country it is produced in.

Some business man found a market for surplus US weapons and has managed to find the means of getting the US Government to supply the money so that Saudi and Israel can buy the products from him. It is not the case of any government making an arms deal, it is the case of a scrap metal dealer getting rich off of Saud, Israel and the US.

Just my opinion from reflecting upon the arms industry in the world.

Someday check out the Krupp family on Google. But, keep in mind they are just a small part of the arms industry.

Aww...blessed sanity.

[جوري]

My intention is not to put you on trial. I simply stated the same thing as was stated by you and the other poster. Let me try again... The U.S., controlled by their Zionist masters, are participating in a plot to sell faulty military equipment, which they can control from their Satanic HQ, in attempt to do what? The last part I'm not clear on. If it sounds absurd, like I'm being sarcastic, there might be a reason for that.

it doesn't sound absurd at all-- Orotund-- yes and maybe laced with little sophistry for my palate, but yes that is the general idea! The latter of your Q's needs some thought on your part... I am not here to dispense with answers... a unipolar world is bound to fail though...

peace!

[جوري]

Weapons manufacturing is one of if not the largest industry that exists today. One of the odd facts of todays weapons and weapon systems all that I can think of depend on componants made in other countries. Often in the very country they may one day be used against.

I do not know of any country that manufactures their own weapons today. the governments simply request a product. An engineer someplace designs it, sells his idea to a manufacturer who then tries to get a lucrative government contract to make it. the sub-components are often from many separate manufacturers from all around the world.

It really is not a country that sells any weapons, it is an independent business that does. They seldom care about the result, as long as the finished product is being sold to a place far away.

Although there may be some people that believe they are being ruled by the leader of the country they live in, the real truth is we are all being ruled by the corporate heads of big business. If somebody has a product that can make a profit for a mass distributer, it will be on the store shelfs world wide, no matter who makes it or what country it is produced in.

Some business man found a market for surplus US weapons and has managed to find the means of getting the US Government to supply the money so that Saudi and Israel can buy the products from him. It is not the case of any government making an arms deal, it is the case of a scrap metal dealer getting rich off of Saud, Israel and the US.

Just my opinion from reflecting upon the arms industry in the world.

Someday check out the Krupp family on Google. But, keep in mind they are just a small part of the arms industry.

I value your opinion bros. Woodrow, but read a few pieces to the contrary on Al-Ahram news paper, and heard different from functionaries and government officials.. And that is why such countries as Egypt would rather hold on to their Russian Tanks from fifties and sixties than barter for American made arms...
We'll have to wait and see how this unfolds over the next few decades..
:w:

[Woodrow]

I value your opinion bros. Woodrow, but read a few pieces to the contrary on Al-Ahram news paper, and heard different from functionaries and government officials.. And that is why such countries as Egypt would rather hold on to their Russian Tanks from fifties and sixties than barter for American made arms...
We'll have to wait and see how this unfolds over the next few decades..
:w:

:w:

As with all things there are many sides. I can not disagree that the American surplus arms will fall apart. It may or may not be intentional. But, it is surplus junk that was headed for the scrap metal piles until a market was found for it. the simple fact is no country is going to permit the sale of any equipment that is equal or better than what their military has.

I do not see were the old surplus Russian equipment is any better. It is difficult to find spare parts for and it did not show much promise when used in Afghanistan.

The whole point I am trying to make is there never would have been any arms deal, if some munitions manufacturer or scrap dealer was not going to make a lot of money from it. Governments have little control of corporate power and it is corporate power that is rapidly becoming the world government.

[Cognescenti]

As for the Egyptians using old T-72's (tanks)...yeah..I can see that. They could keep a few running and they aren't going to fight a modern armored force. They are there for parades and to use against civilians if they get out of line. This idea of some kind of magical power to make US-manufactured weapons stop working is ...well..it's fantasy.


There are 3 small exceptions.

1) I believe the US still has the power to turn off the civilian GPS broadcasts (from the US run Global Positioning System) in time of war. I have a suspicion they might retain that ability for export versions of GPS-dependant US made hardware. If true, this could degrade navigation for affected systems

2) The US definitely still has the ability to change IFF codes (Identification Friend or Foe). This is a code that tells radar systems and missile systems and the like who is an enemy and who is a friend. The US used this threat against Israel in GWI to keep them from sending Israeli aircraft to take out Hussein's missile launchers which were aimed at Israel. Without the codes, the Israelis knew they might be "accidentally" attacked by US systems.
This, of course would also be true for Iran, which has some really old US equipment and even the Saudis.

3) The US can always turn off the spare parts pipeline. This is one reason why foreign sales often involve stockpiling spare parts which means big money for the suppliers.

[KAding]

The Gulf States are spending money left and right on their military's. It seems like a good business opportunity. It's not as if they only buy from the US! Russia is also a major supplier in the region, as are France and England.

[Woodrow]

The Gulf States are spending money left and right on their military's. It seems like a good business opportunity. It's not as if they only buy from the US! Russia is also a major supplier in the region, as are France and England.

When a market exists, the supply will increase to fill the demand. Basic rule of economics and business.

It makes no difference of what a nations policies are, big business eventually becomes the winner.

At this moment there is probably more than one CEO of a weapons manufacturing plant looking at his sales chart and smiling very happily.

Why do I keep getting this strange feeling that we are all becoming the willing pawns of major corporations? I am not opposed to Big Business, I am opposed to them profiting by creating victims.

[Bittersteel]

KSA should buy more from European nations;US always gave them downgraded military wares so Israel can be ahead of the Arabs.Heck,I heard Egyptian F-16s haven't got BVR capability,dear dear it's a great pity if it's true.

[NobleMuslimUK]

The same people will tell you no mind control takes place in America. If it isnt mind control then what is it with this blind patriotism on the Americans part that they defend their governments corrupt actions. At least we dont claim Saudi government to angels.

[wilberhum]

The same people will tell you no mind control takes place in America. If it isnt mind control then what is it with this blind patriotism on the Americans part that they defend their governments corrupt actions. At least we dont claim Saudi government to angels.

[Insert head in sand=on]Of course it is mind control. Israel perfected it. The Zionists control all news sources that feed nothing but lie to the American people.

The only thing that confuses me is that since Jews control the world, what are they trying to gain?[Insert head in sand=off]

There will always be some “blind patriotism”.
What is more apparent is the tremendous volume of “blind faith”.

[yigiter187]

usa accuses many countries of supporting terrörism...but its economy is generally based on war,weapon industry.....isnt this two-facedness?

[Keltoi]

usa accuses many countries of supporting terrörism...but its economy is generally based on war,weapon industry.....isnt this two-facedness?

Our economy is based on war and the weapon industry? Interesting, I'll have to inform the stock market.

[wilberhum]

usa accuses many countries of supporting terrörism...but its economy is generally based on war,weapon industry.....isnt this two-facedness?

two-facedness? Most countries put forth many more than two.

PS:MTAFFI Stop all the harassing. You have no right to defend your self. :giggling:

[yigiter187]

then say me please how much does usa earn annualy from selling weapons,rockets,etc...?
pkk terrörist in turkey use american weapons...arrested terrorists confess that usa troops bring weapons to them...

[MTAFFI]

then say me please how much does usa earn annualy from selling weapons,rockets,etc...?
pkk terrörist in turkey use american weapons...arrested terrorists confess that usa troops bring weapons to them...

I would say the US makes a substantial amount of $ on weaponry, but I wouldnt think that it is the base of the US economy, the US economy is extremely diverse, maybe the most diverse in the world (I will look it up and let you know, sorry for answering ignorantly)

here is a good summary of the US economy just scroll down

[Keltoi]

then say me please how much does usa earn annualy from selling weapons,rockets,etc...?
pkk terrörist in turkey use american weapons...arrested terrorists confess that usa troops bring weapons to them...

In 2004 total weapons sales made by the Pentagon was $24 Billion, which doesn't include private arms companies who apply for a licence through the State Deparment. In total, that is a very small portion of the U.S. economy. If you really want to explore this area try http://www.fas.org/asmp/profiles/worldfms.html

As for "usa troops" bringing weapons to the PKK...well, that is quite a dubious claim.

[MTAFFI]

In 2004 total weapons sales made by the Pentagon was $24 Billion, which doesn't include private arms companies who apply for a licence through the State Deparment. In total, that is a very small portion of the U.S. economy. If you really want to explore this area try http://www.fas.org/asmp/profiles/worldfms.html

As for "usa troops" bringing weapons to the PKK...well, that is quite a dubious claim.

nice source!

[Keltoi]

After all the work I put into finding a reliable source on U.S. weapons transactions this thread will be closed...:)

[yigiter187]

In 2004 total weapons sales made by the Pentagon was $24 Billion, which doesn't include private arms companies who apply for a licence through the State Deparment. In total, that is a very small portion of the U.S. economy. If you really want to explore this area try http://www.fas.org/asmp/profiles/worldfms.html

As for "usa troops" bringing weapons to the PKK...well, that is quite a dubious claim.

dubious calim? well it is not me who claims this...turkish defence ministry says this...turkish soldiers find american made weapons on killed terrorists,and arrested terrorists confess that usa brings weapons to pkk camps in north ıraq...

[Keltoi]

dubious calim? well it is not me who claims this...turkish defence ministry says this...turkish soldiers find american made weapons on killed terrorists,and arrested terrorists confess that usa brings weapons to pkk camps in north ıraq...

There are American made weapons floating all across Iraq, most of them stolen police weapons intended for the Iraqi security forces. There is no logical or political reason for the U.S. to be supplying arms to a terrorist organization opposed to Turkey. While the relationship is still troubled due to the Iraq War, there are steps being made to mend this relationship. It wouldn't surprise me if the Kurds of Iraq were given access to weapons, as they are allies in that country, but as for the U.S. directly and purposely giving military assistance to the PKK..well, until there is actual evidence of this I must call bull excrement on those claims.

[yigiter187]

it is very diffucult to tell the situation to you....
okay ignore everything we have written.....
then please tell me why usa does nothing to stop,to put an end to pkk though usa recognise pkk as an terroist group...

[yigiter187]

ım goın so ı will say you the reason why america doent stop pkk..
because pkk services for american aims on turkey...it is very clear...

[Keltoi]

ım goın so ı will say you the reason why america doent stop pkk..
because pkk services for american aims on turkey...it is very clear...

What aims are those? Turkey is considered a U.S. ally, and the E.U. will probably accept them as a member before too long. It is very easy to make accusations, but what exactly would the U.S. gain by supporting the PKK, whom you admit is listed as a terrorist organization by the U.S., against Turkey, a recognized ally?

[Cognescenti]

ım goın so ı will say you the reason why america doent stop pkk..
because pkk services for american aims on turkey...it is very clear...

"American aims on Turkey" ? :D :D :D Oh, that is rich. You can't seriously believe that.

The Kurds are our allies in Iraq but they don't take orders from us. In fact, there was recent friction because of the presence of Iranian Rev. Guard types in Kurdish territory.

Did it ever occur to you the PKK might say they were being supplied by the US just to put a burr under your saddle?

[KAding]

usa accuses many countries of supporting terrörism...but its economy is generally based on war,weapon industry.....isnt this two-facedness?

Only a small percentage of the US economy is based on the arms industry though. The US spends about 3.5% of its GDP in defense. Another $5bn a year of arms is exported each year (which is like 0.05% of GDP), quite low really. Russia exports like 10 times that share of the economy.

So I disagree. Besides, I don't really see the point about the 'two-facedness' of having large military industries and condemning other states for supporting terrorism.

[aamirsaab]

:sl:
Can we please try and discuss these issues like CIVILISED people. You so don't want to get me angry, 5 minutes before I go to bed. Heck, I might just accidentally ban half of the forum...permanently.

[Cognescenti]

Just for comparison, Boeing sold 112 Billion $ worth of commerical airliners in 2005

How many hamburgers do you think McDonalds sold in 2006?

What is the value of Hollywood's ticket sales and dvd sales in 2006?

[wilberhum]

http://internationaltrade.suite101.c...s_global_sales

Restaurants in the U.S. account for about 35% of total revenues (expected to hit US$22 billion in 2006).

So one year of McDonalds revenue is in excess of the 10 year Saudi deal.

[wilberhum]

:sl:
Can we please try and discuss these issues like CIVILISED people. You so don't want to get me angry, 5 minutes before I go to bed. Heck, I might just accidentally ban half of the forum...permanently.

Which half? ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
I might want to tempt you.:? :giggling: :giggling: :giggling:

[ISLAMASWEENEY]

America is trying to start a arms race in the region.

[Woodrow]

America is trying to start a arms race in the region.

I could be wrong. But I think that more specifically it is the world's arms sellers that are the ones rubbing their hands with joy. They don't care who they sell to or what was the source they get them from, as long as they have a willing market to buy the weapons, use them as fast as possible and place more orders for replacements.

The Arms race is great business for the arms dealers, who all are living quietly and peacefully, far away from any area in which they may be a target for their own products.

a google search for Arms sellers is very interesting.

Arms sellers turn eye to "new" Libya

By ELAINE GANLEY

The Associated Press

PREV 1 of 2 NEXT



Libyan leader Moammar Gadhafi



French president Nicolas Sarkozy

PARIS — The Libyan army, until now largely stuck with obsolete equipment from the 1970s and 1980s, will soon be getting new hardware: European anti-tank missiles and advanced communications systems.

European defense group EADS announced Friday that it has completed a contract for the new hardware — reportedly worth $405 million — with the North African country run by Col. Moammar Gadhafi, which is rapidly shedding its status as a pariah and luring Western arms manufacturers with its oil wealth.

"There is no reason why there isn't a bonanza to be had here," said David Hartwell, Mideast and North Africa editor for the London-based risk-assessment publication Jane's Country Risk.

"If Libya is able to open up its market efficiently, there is potentially billions of dollars to be made there and, conversely, to be spent."

Source: http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/htm...4_libya05.html

Russia, France now top arms sellers
Article from: Agence France-Presse



From correspondents in Washington

October 29, 2006 08:53pm

THE US ceded to Russia and France last year its role of the top arms supplier to the developing world as it failed to take full advantage of emerging markets and opportunities created by booming oil prices.

The annual report by the Congressional Research Service showed the US share in the total value of all arms transfer agreements concluded in 2005 dropped to 20.5 per cent from 35.4 per cent the year before.

In monetary terms, the value of these deals concluded by the United States fell from $US9.4 billion ($12.3 billion) in 2004 to about $US6.2 billion in 2005.

By contrast, Russia made last year $US7 billion worth of such deals in Asia, Africa and Latin America, a notable increase from $US5.4 billion in 2004, which propelled Russia to the position of the top arms supplier to the developing world, the report said.

Source: http://www.news.com.au/heraldsun/sto...005961,00.html

Russia Tops in Quantity of Arms Shipped in 2002

Due to its export of hundreds of missiles to China and Kuwait, Russia shipped more individual weapons around the globe than any other country last year, according to data volunteered by arms sellers to the UN Register of Conventional Arms.

Roughly 120 countries have submitted reports this year on their 2002 arms trade to the register, which was established in 1992 to shed light on the global arms market. All countries are called upon annually to provide information to the register on their previous year’s imports and exports of seven types of weapons: tanks, armored combat vehicles (ACVs), large-caliber artillery, combat aircraft, attack helicopters, warships, and missiles and missile launchers. The intent underlying the register’s creation was that arms sellers might show more restraint in brokering weapons deals if they had greater awareness of the total amount of arms a potential buyer was stockpiling.

Moscow claimed that it exported 330 missiles to China and 941 missiles to Kuwait as part of 1,626 total arms deliveries last year. The Kremlin identified another 11 countries, including Algeria, Angola, Burma (Myanmar), and Sudan, as also receiving Russian arms.

Most of Russia’s declared arms exports, including those to China and Kuwait, could not be verified because many of the recipients do not participate in the register.

Source: http://www.armscontrol.org/act/2003_11/UNregister.asp

True, people are making massive profits from the arms race in the Mideast and they will continue to fuel the fires that make it a very lucrative business.