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Sarada
09-06-2007, 11:39 AM
I wonder how many people would attend a service at a place of worship outside their faith, if invited to do so?
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Abdul Fattah
09-09-2007, 04:28 AM
I think a lot depends on the context.
Some example:
*My sister is getting married in a church.
*A man walking on the street invites me to join a ceremony
*In an attempt to bridge communities there's an inter religious evening.
*Simply out of curiosity, or to learn
*I'm going in an attempt to preach my own faith
...

It all depends on the purpose, different purposes will get different answers. Some other things to consider, will I be expected to join in certain ceremonies (even singing along or standing up and so on)? For example, when in church the priest calls to stand up in honorance of the communion, and I remain seated, will that be interpreted as disrespectful? Maybe it's better not to go in the first place then.
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snakelegs
09-09-2007, 09:16 AM
I am none of the above, and I WOULD ATTEND
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Woodrow
09-09-2007, 12:23 PM
It all depends on the purpose and the place of worship. Some churches, such as Methodist ones, in which there are no statues etc.

Lots of factors to consider, so a blanket no is not valid. It depends on the church, the purpose of the service and what is expected of me.
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Sarada
09-09-2007, 12:28 PM
Originally Posted by Abdul Fattah
I think a lot depends on the context.
Some example:
*My sister is getting married in a church.
*A man walking on the street invites me to join a ceremony
*In an attempt to bridge communities there's an inter religious evening.
*Simply out of curiosity, or to learn
*I'm going in an attempt to preach my own faith
...

It all depends on the purpose, different purposes will get different answers. Some other things to consider, will I be expected to join in certain ceremonies (even singing along or standing up and so on)? For example, when in church the priest calls to stand up in honorance of the communion, and I remain seated, will that be interpreted as disrespectful? Maybe it's better not to go in the first place then.
Salaam Abdul Fattah,

I understand what you are saying. Where people would not attend at a relgious function not of their own faith, on general principle, other might depending on the circumstances.

Polls have their limitations. Here are my answers to your scenarios:

My sister is getting married in a church.
Definitely Yes

*A man walking on the street invites me to join a ceremony
Probably not, I am against prosletysing

*In an attempt to bridge communities there's an inter religious evening.
Definitely yes

*Simply out of curiosity, or to learn
Definitely yes, but with respect

*I'm going in an attempt to preach my own faith
Definitely not, I am against prosletysing

With regard to you other concerns, if there was a certain ritual that I felt uncomfortable with, or knew that according to that faith, unbelievers should not participate in(such as communion in a Lutheran church), I would refrain from participating.

But standing up, sitting down, kneeling, singing (if I knew the words and the tune),even bowing, I personally would have no problem with.

Since I have become a Hindu, my husband (also a Hindu) and I have attended at various Christian churches (funerals, special services), and we have attended Islamic "readings" to which we were invited by a Muslim friend.

My brother, on the other hand, who is a fundamenatalist Christian, would not attend any religious function not of his faith out of general principle, (not even memorial services for our mother that I had arranged at our Hindu temple).

So, you see, I am well acquainted with both extremes.
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Sarada
09-09-2007, 12:54 PM
Originally Posted by Woodrow
It all depends on the purpose and the place of worship. Some churches, such as Methodist ones, in which there are no statues etc.

Lots of factors to consider, so a blanket no is not valid. It depends on the church, the purpose of the service and what is expected of me.
As I understand it, you would not attend any place of worship that has aspects forbidden by your faith. I respect your point of view.
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Woodrow
09-09-2007, 01:05 PM
Originally Posted by Sarada
As I understand it, you would not attend any place of worship that has aspects forbidden by your faith. I respect your point of view.
Thank you. Your views are also respected.
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Ebtisweetsam
09-09-2007, 01:29 PM
I voted i wouldnt attend, but remembered a few times i attended for different reasons:
1. i was dared when i was younger (silly childish thing)
2. to attend an appointment that was held in a church (its true!)
3. to prove ( at the time) that i am open to other peoples relious beliefs

So after reading other peoples posts, ive changed my opinion on the poll.
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glo
09-09-2007, 03:27 PM
Like others have said, I can think of reasons when I would attend a ceremony of another religion/faith, such as a wedding, a funeral, or to give my support to a friend.

Actually participating in the worship of a religion/faith different to mine is different though, and I don't think I would ever do it.

So my answer would be 'yes' or 'no', depending on what is meant by 'attending a service'.
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kwolney01
09-09-2007, 03:32 PM
I don't see anything wrong with going. It's our duty to learn and to respect other religions. As long as your there for the right reasons then I don't see anything wrong with it.
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Pygoscelis
09-09-2007, 06:48 PM
I am atheist. I would attend so long as I am not expected to participate and may sit and silently observe. I have attended at churches, mosques, synagoges (sp?), temples of buddhists and hindus and a collection place for wiccans. I enjoyed observing each of them.
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Mpls_Muslim
09-10-2007, 11:55 AM
:sl: this is a good question/poll. I had the oppertunity after converting to attend a wedding at a christain church and I was told that they almost did not invite me because they were not sure with my faith and all if I would attend.

Abdulah
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IbnAbdulHakim
09-10-2007, 11:55 AM
i cant help but feel i will be promoting the other religion if i attend.


this is a personaly feeling i have, i am not saying if its correct or not as i dont have enough knowledge to deduce as such.
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Sarada
09-10-2007, 12:46 PM
Originally Posted by Mpls_Muslim
:sl: this is a good question/poll. I had the oppertunity after converting to attend a wedding at a christain church and I was told that they almost did not invite me because they were not sure with my faith and all if I would attend.

Abdulah

What did you think of the experience? How did you feel afterwards?
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Sarada
09-10-2007, 12:47 PM
One of the reasons I asked this question is because, in Guyana, and Trinidad, perhaps elsewhere in the West Indies, Muslims, Christians and Hindus routinely get together and celebrate Eid, Christmas, Diwali, and others.
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Sarada
09-10-2007, 12:50 PM
Originally Posted by IbnAbdulHakim
i cant help but feel i will be promoting the other religion if i attend.


this is a personaly feeling i have, i am not saying if its correct or not as i dont have enough knowledge to deduce as such.


Salaam IbnAbdulHakim,

Did you ever think that you might be promoting a better understanding amongst people of different faiths, and reducing the tension that often exists out of ignorance of one another's beliefs and practices?
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IbnAbdulHakim
09-10-2007, 12:52 PM
Originally Posted by Sarada
Salaam IbnAbdulHakim,

Did you ever think that you might be promoting a better understanding amongst people of different faiths, and reducing the tension that often exists out of ignorance of one another's beliefs and practices?
lol nice way to look at it, im not sure at the moment. I'll have to research and ask some scholars if attending a service in the place of worship of another religion is even permitted in islam.



im not sure, but i do know i would feel uncomfrtable...
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Sarada
09-10-2007, 12:56 PM
Originally Posted by IbnAbdulHakim
lol nice way to look at it, im not sure at the moment. I'll have to research and ask some scholars if attending a service in the place of worship of another religion is even permitted in islam.



im not sure, but i do know i would feel uncomfrtable...

Good idea.
I would be very interested to know if there are actually Islamic rules whether in the Qur'an or Hadith which prohibit attending.
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Pygoscelis
09-10-2007, 07:06 PM
Speaking of concern over promoting the other religion...

I often find myself wondering what to do when I go to a church as a non-believer (to observe/study or with a friend - I dont go often) and the collection plate comes around.

I don't support the religion on the one hand so it feels wrong to fund it. But on the other hand the people have put on quite a show and it feels wrong not to give them something for it.
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wilberhum
09-10-2007, 07:11 PM
When I was Catholic, I did on several ocasions.
Now as an agnostic, I still do.
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Sarada
09-10-2007, 08:08 PM
Originally Posted by Pygoscelis
Speaking of concern over promoting the other religion...

I often find myself wondering what to do when I go to a church as a non-believer (to observe/study or with a friend - I dont go often) and the collection plate comes around.

I don't support the religion on the one hand so it feels wrong to fund it. But on the other hand the people have put on quite a show and it feels wrong not to give them something for it.
that's very generous of you.
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wilberhum
09-10-2007, 11:17 PM
Originally Posted by Pygoscelis
Speaking of concern over promoting the other religion...

I often find myself wondering what to do when I go to a church as a non-believer (to observe/study or with a friend - I dont go often) and the collection plate comes around.

I don't support the religion on the one hand so it feels wrong to fund it. But on the other hand the people have put on quite a show and it feels wrong not to give them something for it.
IMHO If you don't feel comfortable, don't participate. Any one who looks down at that is a bigot.
If you don't feel right about providing financial support, don't. It is not an obligation.

People make big deals out of all thes stuff.

Do what you feel comfortable with. You can sit through the entire service. No need to stand up, knell, or give any verbal or financial support.

If they are deasent people, they will not have a problem, and neither will you.
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جوري
09-11-2007, 01:43 AM
I have attended many simply because I love architecture.. some of these places are brilliant feats of engineering.. I'd advise everyone to see la Sagrada família, though it was never finished.. or to compare some of the works of Bernini and Borromini... rivals, both brilliant in their own rights. I always thought Borromini was more consistent with Islamic style architecture whereas Bernini was just over the top.. but it is purely from an artistic/architectural point of view that I pursue these whenever on vacation.. the theology aspect I prefer to do as private reading, though I have attended catholic school and plenty of mass... I will not reduce this to my religion is better than yours.. but let's just say, I didn't find what I am looking for spiritually/mentally/ and emotionally in other houses of worship and I have frequented few out of interest.. sometimes when the statues are too imposing, I get the sensation I am asphyxiating and feel the need to go outdoors... I like places that are open, and let the light in generally speaking keeping it simple is in concert with my own personal style, but art and architecture are too remarkable and historical to be ignored!
Nice thread Sarada.. thank you
peace!
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Sarada
09-11-2007, 02:09 AM
Originally Posted by wilberhum
IMHO If you don't feel comfortable, don't participate. Any one who looks down at that is a bigot.
If you don't feel right about providing financial support, don't. It is not an obligation.

People make big deals out of all thes stuff.

Do what you feel comfortable with. You can sit through the entire service. No need to stand up, knell, or give any verbal or financial support.

If they are deasent people, they will not have a problem, and neither will you.
.

My question to my muslim sisters and brothers, is would minimal participation (as per wilberhum's description) in a mosque be accepted?
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جوري
09-11-2007, 02:12 AM
I don't see how you can participate unless you knew something about the prayers performed.. I think it would be easier to observe... praying in a mosque is quite ritualistic, unless you were attending a sermon...
besides I have never been to a mosque where they handed out a donation box, simply because charity in islam is considered to be a very private act and shouldn't be publicized!

peace!
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Sarada
09-11-2007, 02:14 AM
Originally Posted by PurestAmbrosia
...I will not reduce this to my religion is better than yours.. but let's just say, I didn't find what I am looking for spiritually/mentally/ and emotionally in other houses of worship and I have frequented few out of interest.. sometimes when the statues are too imposing, I get the sensation I am asphyxiating and feel the need to go outdoors... I like places that are open, and let the light in generally speaking keeping it simple is in concert with my own personal style, but art and architecture are too remarkable and historical to be ignored!
Nice thread Sarada.. thank you
peace!
Thanks for the compliment, PurestAmbrosia,

I also appreciate your not getting into the superiority of one faith over another. I too, find the architecture of and decorations within differing places of worship phenomenal.

I like to see how various people express their love for God.

I too, like open spaces with lots of light when I look for spiritual nourishment. In fact, I prefer the outdoors, whenever I have the chance.
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Sarada
09-11-2007, 02:16 AM
Originally Posted by PurestAmbrosia
I don't see how you can participate unless you knew something about the prayers performed.. I think it would be easier to observe... praying in a mosque is quite ritualistic, unless you were attending a sermon...
besides I have never been to a mosque where they handed out a donation box, simply because charity in islam is considered to be a very private act and shouldn't be publicized!

peace!

Is it possible, then to just go into a mosque, as a woman, and observe?
What would be the protocol?
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جوري
09-11-2007, 02:34 AM
Originally Posted by Sarada
Is it possible, then to just go into a mosque, as a woman, and observe?
What would be the protocol?
None.. you just walk in observing the dress code at least in part, and most who attend out of curiosity do..
There is usually a female section.. during the time of the prophet men and women weren't not segregated by walls but I believe now it is for the better anyway, since the men have changed since.
The other day I was out shopping and almost missed asr prayer but luckily there was a small mosque, and so we parked our car, went performed ablution ( if you have ever seen surgeons scrub it is close to that) then we made our noon prayer and left.. it was a saturday so it wasn't too crowded in the women's section, it was uneventful... and non intrusive.. in other words no one will bother you unless you want to be bothered..on fridays if you attend you can listen to the friday sermon and it is lovely.. if you really want to attend where it will make an incredible heart quivering impact I suggest you show up for taraweeh in Ramadan.. there is nothing like it, I really mean that..anyhow, here is how people often perform prayer.. of course this is a distilled look...

Media Tags are no longer supported

this is short one minute just to give you an idea.. here is the meaning...

Surah 93
The Forenoon ad Dhuha

In the name of Allah, the Beneficent, the Merciful.

1) CONSIDER the bright morning hours,
وَالضُّحَى {1}


(2) and the night when it grows still and dark.*
وَاللَّيْلِ إِذَا سَجَى {2

* The expression "bright morning hours" symbolizes the few and widely-spaced periods of happiness in human life, as contrasted with the much greater length of "the night when it grows still and dark", i.e., the extended periods of sorrow or suffering that, as a rule, overshadow man's existence in this world (cf. 90 : 4).

The further implication is that, as sure as morning follows night, God's mercy is bound to lighten every suffering, either in this world or in the life to come - for God has "willed upon Himself the law of grace and mercy" (6:12 and 54).

(3) Thy Sustainer has not forsaken thee, nor does He scorn thee:*

مَا وَدَّعَكَ رَبُّكَ وَمَا قَلَى {3}

(4) for, indeed, the life to come will be better for thee than this earlier part [of thy life]!
وَلَلْآخِرَةُ خَيْرٌ لَّكَ مِنَ الْأُولَى {4}

(5) And, indeed, in time will thy Sustainer grant thee [what thy heart desires], and thou shalt be pleased.
وَلَسَوْفَ يُعْطِيكَ رَبُّكَ فَتَرْضَى {5}

6) Has He not found thee an orphan, and given thee shelter?*أَلَ
مْ يَجِدْكَ يَتِيمًا فَآوَى {6
(7) And found thee lost on thy way, and guided thee?
وَوَجَدَكَ ضَالًّا فَهَدَى {7

8) And found thee in want, and given thee sufficiency?
8وَوَجَدَكَ عَائِلًا فَأَغْنَى {

(9) Therefore, the orphan shalt thou never wrong,
فَأَمَّا الْيَتِيمَ فَلَا تَقْهَرْ {9
(10) and him that seeks [thy] help shalt thou never chide,*
وَأَمَّا السَّائِلَ فَلَا تَنْهَرْ {

*The term sa'il denotes" literally, "one who asks", which signifies not only a "beggar" but anyone who asks for help in a difficult situation, whether physical or moral, or even for enlightenment
11) and of thy Sustainer's blessings shalt thou [ever] speak.*
وَأَمَّا بِنِعْمَةِ رَبِّكَ فَحَدِّثْ {
11
so generally we recite from the Quran in all prayers... prayer basically is more a ritual than a supplication... it is wonderful to touch base with your creator all throughout the day-- thanks for reading this

peace!
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Abdul-Raouf
09-11-2007, 02:40 AM
I have been to temples and churches in the past(they are just another place for me) with my non-muslim friends....


But i do not involve in their prayers or services... i distant myself...



I hav gon to to the temples and churches jus to see wats happenin there.. some temples in India have a wonderful architecture(exception to the living being images)... underground tunnels... they were built by Kings.. thousands of years ago..
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Sarada
09-11-2007, 02:50 AM
Thanks for that, PurestAmbrosia, I have always wanted to attend a mosque, and you have encouraged me to do so.
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Sarada
09-11-2007, 10:38 AM
Salaam Purest Ambrosia,

Thanks for the video clip, the prayers and the words were beautiful!
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islamic
09-11-2007, 10:41 AM
WHY to attend a place of worship of Other faiths? WHY? do we go to our places of worship regularly? do we attend Mosque 5 times a day? DO WE ?
look, we first should attend Mosque like it should be, we should perform salat more often there, we should have strong Iman, and if we have this things like we should, we can go in some church or something but WHAT TO DO THERE? we can go and see what the Christians are doing there, how they have changed the religion that Jesus (pbuh) preached to them, how they added things that Jesus (pbuh) never told, never preached, never ...
So, with that intention, with PREVIOUS knowledge of Islam and with PREVIOUS knowledge of how Christianity today is not that "Christianity" that Jesus preached ... with that knowledge, we can attend.
But, we should ALWAYS keep in mind what example we would provide to our CHILDREN. Imagine little Fatima, your child, watching you going into church ... attending church ceremony ..... or sometimes taking her there ... WHAT SHE WILL THINK? she will say: "you know, I saw my mother/father going into church, let me go there ... see what is there ... " ... a little child, find friends there .... those friends invite her at their house ... they start to go in church every Sunday .... WHAT IS WRONG WITH you brother and sisters??
In those places someone else is worshiped, NOT ALLAH but Jesus or some other self proclaimed saint. WE ARE NOT ALLOWED to help those places to be build ... ! why to go there?
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IbnAbdulHakim
09-11-2007, 10:49 AM
Originally Posted by wilberhum
IMHO If you don't feel comfortable, don't participate. Any one who looks down at that is a bigot.
If you don't feel right about providing financial support, don't. It is not an obligation.

People make big deals out of all thes stuff.

Do what you feel comfortable with. You can sit through the entire service. No need to stand up, knell, or give any verbal or financial support.

If they are deasent people, they will not have a problem, and neither will you.
to be honest i see nothing wrong in this because at least that way we remain honest and sincere. If we can keep up such values then perhaps when we find a right cause we truelly believe in we can help far more to further that cause..


WHY to attend a place of worship of Other faiths? WHY? do we go to our places of worship regularly? do we attend Mosque 5 times a day? DO WE ?
look, we first should attend Mosque like it should be, we should perform salat more often there, we should have strong Iman, and if we have this things like we should, we can go in some church or something but WHAT TO DO THERE? we can go and see what the Christians are doing there, how they have changed the religion that Jesus (pbuh) preached to them, how they added things that Jesus (pbuh) never told, never preached, never ...
WELL DONE BRO,mashaAllah :) reps :D
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NoName55
09-12-2007, 07:03 PM
edit :zip:
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wilberhum
09-12-2007, 07:10 PM
Originally Posted by islamic
WHY to attend a place of worship of Other faiths?
Why? Maybe a friend is getting married or has died.

Maybe you wish honour a frind for many of the things that are recognized in churches.

Maybe just an act of tollorance.
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Amadeus85
09-12-2007, 08:00 PM
I was once in an orthodox church wwhen i was in Greece this year.I really liked that place. And thats all i think. I didnt attend to any other place of worship of other faiths.Maybe its because in my country there are very few jewish temples and mosques. And i also dont know how i will behave i those places, as all life in go to catholic churche in the nearest town.But going to churches of other christian denominations isnt a problem for me.
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wilberhum
09-12-2007, 08:06 PM
Originally Posted by Aaron85
I was once in an orthodox church wwhen i was in Greece this year.I really liked that place. And thats all i think. I didnt attend to any other place of worship of other faiths.Maybe its because in my country there are very few jewish temples and mosques. And i also dont know how i will behave i those places, as all life in go to catholic churche in the nearest town.But going to churches of other christian denominations isnt a problem for me.
If you behave with respect, I can all but gaurentee that you will be treated with respect.
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Amadeus85
09-12-2007, 08:18 PM
Originally Posted by wilberhum
If you behave with respect, I can all but gaurentee that you will be treated with respect.
Yes sure i know Wilb. I just mean that i dont like entering places of worship like museums. I know the feeling because i dont feel best when i see hundreds of Japan tourists (and others too :p ) who come to old and famous churches in Warsaw or Cracow just to make some pics. In Poland at least there are still some people in who pray, but when i was in Vienna this year, the sight of cathedra filled with asian tourists only, didnt make my humour better . :p
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MustafaMc
09-13-2007, 12:53 AM
I personally have no reservation about attending a special worship service of another faith if I am invited. However, I must admit that since starting to practice Islam again in June 2001 that I have not attended a non-Islamic worship service. I see nothing wrong with occassionally attending a worship service of another faith, but I would not participate by singing, partaking of communion, giving an offering, or saying amen at the end of prayer. My intention would be either building personal relationship or to learn about another religion.

I first learned of the "Hail, Mary" supplication at a Catholic funeral. I attended the funeral out of respect for the deceased husband of the one being buried. I also attended the funeral service of my father in a Baptist church over 5 years ago. I don't consider weddings and funerals to be worship services. Even though songs are sung and prayers are prayed, the stated intention of these services is not to worship God.
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Woodrow
09-13-2007, 03:24 AM
I believe that some of us are giving different meanings to the original question. Attending a worship service of a different faith, should not be a substitute for our own worship. The purpose of attending should not be for the purpose of worship, but be more of a social, educational or Peace purpose. We can make a big error if we see it as a means of worship in our concept of worship.
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Sarada
09-13-2007, 11:33 AM
Originally Posted by Woodrow
I believe that some of us are giving different meanings to the original question. Attending a worship service of a different faith, should not be a substitute for our own worship. The purpose of attending should not be for the purpose of worship, but be more of a social, educational or Peace purpose. We can make a big error if we see it as a means of worship in our concept of worship.

Salaam Woodrow,

I agree with you 100%.

My intention was not to ask who would worship in a place dedicated to another religion, but who would Visit.

Perhaps I should have made the question more clear.
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Abdul-Raouf
09-13-2007, 02:35 PM
Originally Posted by Sarada
Salaam Woodrow,

I agree with you 100%.

My intention was not to ask who would worship in a place dedicated to another religion, but who would Visit.

Perhaps I should have made the question more clear.

^^^^^

Yup the question wasnt clear.... thats y i was unable to vote.....

so jus gave the below comment :


I have been to temples and churches in the past(they are just another place for me) with my non-muslim friends....


But i do not involve in their prayers or services... i distant myself...



I hav gon to to the temples and churches jus to see wats happenin there.. some temples in India have a wonderful architecture(exception to the living being images)... underground tunnels... they were built by Kings.. thousands of years ago..
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islamic
10-25-2007, 06:20 PM
Originally Posted by wilberhum
Maybe a friend is getting married or has died.
If a Christian friend is getting married you can go at his/her home and show respect. Will you attend his marriage ceremony in some Church and listen to the priest glorifying Jesus as God, reading the Bible .. !?

Originally Posted by wilberhum
Maybe you wish honour a frind for many of the things that are recognized in churches.
I don't understand you!

Originally Posted by wilberhum
Maybe just an act of tollorance.
There is a tolerance LIMIT in Islam, you can not tolerate everything! Imagine, you see a women raped by someone in the street, what you will say? TOLERATE!!!!!
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wilberhum
10-25-2007, 06:30 PM
Originally Posted by islamic
If a Christian friend is getting married you can go at his/her home and show respect. Will you attend his marriage ceremony in some Church and listen to the priest glorifying Jesus as God, reading the Bible .. !?
I feal sad for you. My first guess is that you have no Christian friends.


I don't understand you!
Many things happen at church. Baptism for one.


There is a tolerance LIMIT in Islam, you can not tolerate everything! Imagine, you see a women raped by someone in the street, what you will say? TOLERATE!!!!!
Raped on a street? Get a life. We are talking about places that worship god.
I would guess your "tolerance LIMIT" would be just below zero. :hiding:
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islamic
10-25-2007, 06:39 PM
Originally Posted by Aaron85
I was once in an orthodox church when i was in Greece this year.I really liked that place.
I don't doubt, you are a Christian as I can see from your profile, it's normal that you will like a church.
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islamic
10-25-2007, 06:58 PM
Originally Posted by wilberhum
My first guess is that you have no Christian friends.
Your guessing is WRONG, and obviously many other things you got wrong.
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wilberhum
10-25-2007, 07:10 PM
Originally Posted by islamic
I don't doubt, you are a Christian as I can see from your profile, it's normal that you will like a church.
It is normal for people to like places of worship.

From the grandeur of St. Peters in Rome to the thatch roof prairie church in Nebraska, they are all great sights.

Sheik, Hindu, Buddhist, Christian, Muslim, or whatever, I have never seen a “non-interesting” place of worship.

Open up the box and jump out. You might find an open mind interesting.
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islamic
10-25-2007, 07:14 PM
wilberhum, I think you didn't understood well what is my opinion on this topic.
I give you this link where you can read my first commentary. I hope you will clear your mind and calm down.

The Link: http://www.islamicboard.com/comparat...-faiths-3.html
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wilberhum
10-25-2007, 07:25 PM
Originally Posted by islamic
wilberhum, I think you didn't understood well what is my opinion on this topic.
I give you this link where you can read my first commentary. I hope you will clear your mind and calm down.

The Link: http://www.islamicboard.com/comparat...-faiths-3.html
Calm down? If I was any calmer I would go to sleep.:shade:

As I guessed, your first post conveys the thoughts of a narrow mind. :rolleyes:

How many non-Muslim, places of worship have you been in?
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Abu Musab
10-25-2007, 07:30 PM
Someone asked about attending funerals in a church so here's a fatwa about it.

http://islamqa.com/index.php?ref=137...#37;20churches
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wilberhum
10-25-2007, 07:34 PM
Originally Posted by Abu Musab
Someone asked about attending funerals in a church so here's a fatwa about it.

http://islamqa.com/index.php?ref=137...ing%20churches
attending the funeral is a way of showing love and respect, and it is not permissible to show that towards a kaafir, according to the correct view.
So a Muslim is not allowed to respect a non-Muslim.

Now that is sad. I mean really sad.

I sure most here don't think that way.
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islamic
10-25-2007, 07:53 PM
Originally Posted by wilberhum
So a Muslim is not allowed to respect a non-Muslim.
:ooh: you mix different things. Don't rise RESPECT question here !
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wilberhum
10-25-2007, 08:02 PM
Originally Posted by islamic
:ooh: you mix different things. Don't rise RESPECT question here !
Why?

Abu Musab posted the link.
The link brings up the question.

But I did submit a thread with the link, the content, and my questions.

Hope they approve it soon.
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islamic
10-25-2007, 08:10 PM
Originally Posted by wilberhum
Why?

Abu Musab posted the link.
The link brings up the question.

But I did submit a thread with the link, the content, and my questions.

Hope they approve it soon.
that question of yours will be discussed on the thread you opened, if the thread is approved.
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MustafaMc
10-26-2007, 02:34 AM
Originally Posted by Abu Musab
Someone asked about attending funerals in a church so here's a fatwa about it.

http://islamqa.com/index.php?ref=137...ing%20churches
I would have to disagree. I am the only Muslim in my family and my wife is the only one in hers. I attended the funeral of both of my parents in Baptist churches and, Insha'Allah, I will attend the funeral of other close kin as well. We are to maintain the ties of kinship.
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islamic
10-26-2007, 09:11 AM
there are many other ways to show respect and kindship!!
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Abu Musab
10-26-2007, 12:43 PM
Originally Posted by MustafaMc
I would have to disagree. I am the only Muslim in my family and my wife is the only one in hers. I attended the funeral of both of my parents in Baptist churches and, Insha'Allah, I will attend the funeral of other close kin as well. We are to maintain the ties of kinship.
Yes family ties should be maintained, but not when it goes against islam, that is why a child cannot obey their parents if they command them to do something that is against islam.
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MustafaMc
10-26-2007, 01:30 PM
The authority for my religion before Allah (swt) is the Quran and the Sunnah of Prophet Muhammad (saaws). Quote an ayat or an authentic hadith that supports your position and I will reconsider my position.
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Abu Musab
10-26-2007, 02:19 PM
Originally Posted by MustafaMc
The authority for my religion before Allah (swt) is the Quran and the Sunnah of Prophet Muhammad (saaws). Quote an ayat or an authentic hadith that supports your position and I will reconsider my position.
To support which part? the part about children not obeying their parents or muslims not attending churches etc?
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Amadeus85
10-26-2007, 02:25 PM
It is ok to visit different places of worhip, but of course catholics shouldnt worship there. Just to clraify my previous statements in this thread.
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Grace Seeker
10-26-2007, 08:54 PM
I will first speak to my own experience, and then perhaps try to draw some general principles from it.



I am a Christian, for those to whom it matters, I am a United Methodist, a type of protestant, not a Catholic.

I have attended worship services in many different protestant church, not just my own, in Catholic churches, at a Mormon stake (a group I consider non-Christian) and a Christian Scientist service (another non-Christian group) and in Muslim mosques, and I have visited Greek Orthodox churches, Jewish synagogues and Bahai temples.

I felt I was able to worship in all of these places, not because they were necessarily worshiping the one true God (I certainly don't think they were at the Christian Science service or Bahai temple), but because I knew who it was that I worship and that there is no place that God is not.
Psalm 139
7 Where can I go from your Spirit?
Where can I flee from your presence?

8 If I go up to the heavens, you are there;
if I make my bed in the depths, [a] you are there.

9 If I rise on the wings of the dawn,
if I settle on the far side of the sea,

10 even there your hand will guide me,
your right hand will hold me fast.

11 If I say, "Surely the darkness will hide me
and the light become night around me,"

12 even the darkness will not be dark to you;
the night will shine like the day,
for darkness is as light to you.
So, there is no place that if that is where I happen to be, that I cannot worship God while there.

On the other hand, having been to some of these places, I can also testify that there was nothing offered to me in some of them that helped me to worship God, I was totally dependent on the faith that was within me. The service at the Mormon stake and Christian Science service were the least God glorifying experiences of my life. I wondered how it was that those who attended were able to maintain any sort of spiritual life based on them at all? So, I would probably decline, unless there were extenuating circumstances that caused me to go to be supportive to some significant individual in my life, having nothing to do with the practice of my own faith.

What should others do? I'm not going to say. But I would think that the following are questions to ask one's self:

1) Do you believe that God can still be present in that place and time, even if no one else there knows God as you know God?

2) Will attending there actually do you any spiritual harm? Or another way to put that same question-- If you did attend, is God big enough and providential enough to protect you from any spiritual stumbling, and are you strong enough in your own faith to sustain it?

3) If you expect to receive no spiritual nourishment in this other environment, are you able to either subsequent to visiting or prior to visiting worship in a way that will be meaningful to you?

4) Are you attending out of respect for important and valued family/personal relationships that will either benefit from your attendance or might be harmed by your lack of attendance?

5) If going for the purpose of simply learning or satifying a curiousity, can one attend as a respectful observer without having to actually be a participant?


The answers to these questions help me to determine whether and at what level I can attend another faith's place of worship. Perhaps others will find them helpful as well.
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Woodrow
11-03-2007, 12:11 AM
Peace Gene,

Very good 5 questions. Those are very wise questions we should ask ourselves before we answer yes or no about attending another faiths place of worship.


My wife was Native American, and she followed the Native Cherokee religion. There was no identified place of worship for her, every place she happened to be was a place of worship for her. So in that sense every one of us is now in a Cherokee place of worship. It is impossible for a non-Cherokee not to be in a Cherokee place of worship. So all of us except for the Cherokees are now in a place of worship of another faith.
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MustafaMc
11-03-2007, 12:33 AM
Originally Posted by Grace Seeker
I felt I was able to worship in all of these places, not because they were necessarily worshiping the one true God (I certainly don't think they were at the Christian Science service or Bahai temple), but because I knew who it was that I worship and that there is no place that God is not.

So, there is no place that if that is where I happen to be, that I cannot worship God while there.
This is a difference in our faith. We Muslims don't believe that Allah is in all places at the same time (omnipresent). We believe that Allah is aware of everything, but not that He is in all places and beings. Christians believe that God (the Holy Spirit) dwells within them, but to my knowledge we Muslims don't share this belief. Allah is separate from us, human beings being subordinate to the Master and Lord of the universe (Rabbi-Al'amin).
On the other hand, having been to some of these places, I can also testify that there was nothing offered to me in some of them that helped me to worship God, I was totally dependent on the faith that was within me. The service at the Mormon stake and Christian Science service were the least God glorifying experiences of my life. I wondered how it was that those who attended were able to maintain any sort of spiritual life based on them at all?
We Muslims have very well defined modes of worship that trace back to Prophet Muhammad (saaws). Christian worship services do not trace back to Jesus (as) and would probably not be recognized as such by him if he were to return today. We would not join in a Christian service as we believe they are blasphemous to the Unity of Allah.
But I would think that the following are questions to ask one's self:
Perhaps, these questions were not to be answered here, but I will put forth my point of view anyway.

1) Do you believe that God can still be present in that place and time, even if no one else there knows God as you know God?
No, see above. We believe that Allah does not exist within the confines of the universe as we know it and certainly that He does not exist in the most disgusting places imaginable as has been put forth by adherents of other non-Abrahamic religions.

2) Will attending there actually do you any spiritual harm? Or another way to put that same question-- If you did attend, is God big enough and providential enough to protect you from any spiritual stumbling, and are you strong enough in your own faith to sustain it?
Yes, I believe that participating in the Christian service would do me spiritual harm as I would be ascribing partners to Allah. Within our confines, we have free will to chose to obey or to disobey Allah. Allah does not prevent us from disobeying or from sinning - we are personally accountable for our choices. It would be hypocritical for me to attend Christian worship services listening to things that I don't believe to be true and for me to not raise a voice in opposition.

3) If you expect to receive no spiritual nourishment in this other environment, are you able to either subsequent to visiting or prior to visiting worship in a way that will be meaningful to you?
I have not attended a Christian worship service since deciding to practice Islam in 2001. If I did happen to attend a service (with my sister for example), that would not stop me from my 5 daily prayers. I attend Jumm'ah (Friday) prayer not so much for "spiritual nourishment", but rather as an act of worship as prescribed by Prophet Muhammad (saaws).

4) Are you attending out of respect for important and valued family/personal relationships that will either benefit from your attendance or might be harmed by your lack of attendance?
If I went, that would be the reason why I would.

5) If going for the purpose of simply learning or satifying a curiousity, can one attend as a respectful observer without having to actually be a participant?
If one had the interest in doing so, I personally see no harm. As an observer, I believe that he would serve as a witness either for or against those participants on the Day of Judgment.
Reply

Grace Seeker
11-03-2007, 12:46 AM
Originally Posted by Pygoscelis
Speaking of concern over promoting the other religion...

I often find myself wondering what to do when I go to a church as a non-believer (to observe/study or with a friend - I dont go often) and the collection plate comes around.

I don't support the religion on the one hand so it feels wrong to fund it. But on the other hand the people have put on quite a show and it feels wrong not to give them something for it.

I missed this earlier and I can understand how it is that you might feel at a loss as to which to do. Let me assure you that there is nothing wrong with simply passing the plate to the next person. We have church members who are unable to give, or who give only once a month, so many within the body itself will pass the plate without putting anything in it on any given Sunday. Beyond that, even if you were a Christian I would not expect a visitor from another congregation to contribute to the support of our congregation rather than his/her own. Similarly, I do not expect a non-Christian to do so either. You should always feel free to simply pass the plate.

And there is another very good reason why you may wish to take a pass on putting anything in the offering plate. Although not everyone thinks of this at the time, the real significance of receiving the offering is NOT to support the church. Rather it is a presentation of one's self, an offering of one's self to God. If you don't believe in God, the whole concept of offering one's self to a being that doesn't exist, would seem to be something that you might not want to participate in. But, if you do decide to make an offering, I would hope that no one would reject it either. It is a generous thing to do, and the monies received by most churches go toward a whole host of different things, some of which I am sure you would support. So, I suppose, in your mind you can think of yourself as supporting those things rather than that which you do not agree with.
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Grace Seeker
11-03-2007, 01:06 AM
Originally Posted by Woodrow
Peace Gene,
My wife was Native American, and she followed the Native Cherokee religion. There was no identified place of worship for her, every place she happened to be was a place of worship for her. So in that sense every one of us is now in a Cherokee place of worship. It is impossible for a non-Cherokee not to be in a Cherokee place of worship. So all of us except for the Cherokees are now in a place of worship of another faith.

And not to be insulting to your wife, or any other Cherokee for that matter, but some would consider any Native American faiths to be a pagan religion. So if, as some here have suggested, that one should not enter a place where other gods are worshipped:
Originally Posted by MadeenJibreel
Exactly - why would a Muslim enter a polytheistic place where partners are constantly being ascribed to Allah the Most High??
I think a person who believed thusly might find it a hard time living in this world where every place is a place of worship for some other individual who believes differently than them. I think they make life too hard for themselves. I am not saying that I would enter another faiths place of worship with the intention of worshipping. But on the other hand, in my opinion the true God is too big to be confined in any building or other place of worship, and he is also to big to be kept out of any building or other place of worship. Surely those who know God, can worship God in any location on the earth (though not copying just any other faith's methods) for he created the whole of it and there is not one part of it absent of his presence.
Reply

MustafaMc
11-03-2007, 02:16 AM
Originally Posted by Grace Seeker
Surely those who know God, can worship God in any location on the earth (though not copying just any other faith's methods) for he created the whole of it and there is not one part of it absent of his presence.
Yes, Muslims can perform salah (ritual prayer) in most places on earth. I have prayed in many different places: airport lobby, airport chapel, hotels, my office, empty room in convention center, beside the road, forest, cotton field, homes of family, behind churches, under highway bridges, non-denominational building for travelers, etc.
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Woodrow
11-03-2007, 11:05 AM
Originally Posted by Grace Seeker
And not to be insulting to your wife, or any other Cherokee for that matter, but some would consider any Native American faiths to be a pagan religion.
True, however I found that the Native American religions were/are very monotheistic. From what I seen of them they are much closer to judaism thean they were /are to animistic pagan beliefs. I didn't worship as she did but it was an interesting study.




So if, as some here have suggested, that one should not enter a place where other gods are worshipped: I think a person who believed thusly might find it a hard time living in this world where every place is a place of worship for some other individual who believes differently than them. I think they make life too hard for themselves. I am not saying that I would enter another faiths place of worship with the intention of worshipping. But on the other hand, in my opinion the true God is too big to be confined in any building or other place of worship, and he is also to big to be kept out of any building or other place of worship. Surely those who know God, can worship God in any location on the earth (though not copying just any other faith's methods) for he created the whole of it and there is not one part of it absent of his presence.
That is the point I was attempting to make. Much of it depends on the intent and reason a person enters a place of worship thean there own. I don't think a blanket yes or no answer could suffice. There can be valid reasons to enter other than for the purpose of worship, if if others were worshiping in accordance with their belief. It is what we do not what they are doing.
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Grace Seeker
11-05-2007, 04:31 PM
Originally Posted by MustafaMc
Yes, Muslims can perform salah (ritual prayer) in most places on earth. I have prayed in many different places: airport lobby, airport chapel, hotels, my office, empty room in convention center, beside the road, forest, cotton field, homes of family, behind churches, under highway bridges, non-denominational building for travelers, etc.
And the NW corner bedroom in my house as well. :D
Reply

MustafaMc
11-05-2007, 06:09 PM
Originally Posted by Grace Seeker
And the NW corner bedroom in my house as well. :D
Yes, how could I forget, you were a most gracious host. :happy: I also appreciated the tour of the church where you minister. I believe that the non-denominational prayer building was on a road between your home and Indianapolis.

One more knowledgeable may correct me, but I believe that I heard or read that places where we have performed salah will testify on our behalf on that fateful Day.
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Jayda
11-12-2007, 04:04 PM
Originally Posted by Sarada
I wonder how many people would attend a service at a place of worship outside their faith, if invited to do so?
hola Sarada,

no but with a few exceptions. weddings or funerals are such an exception but i would pray according to my beliefs and not theirs. i think most people would understand that weddings and funerals are not appropriate places to push their religion on their friends, and that the purpose of inviting them is to show their support of the people and not the beliefs involved. outside of that, i have visited a synagogue and an ensuing dinner with the rabbi and his prominent congregation members as an invitation to ask questions about Judaism... i didn't join in though.

i think that kind of thing is okay just for academic understanding... i would never do anything to compromise my Catholic faith.

que Dios te bendiga
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Esther462
11-14-2007, 06:09 PM
My family are Christian and I still help at the kids church I did help out at before I converted to Islam. I know this wrong but I can't give this up as the church is ok with me helping. I pray in the churches quiet room away from the kids. I will enter a church building if there was a family specile occations like weddings. I love be a Muslim and it is away of life for me. I still want to be counted as part of my family and I have respect there faith or the Majorty of family and extended family, even though I total agree with what they believe in.
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wilberhum
11-14-2007, 06:28 PM
That is so wonderful I don't know what to say.

You are a bright spot in this world. :thumbs_up :thumbs_up :thumbs_up
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smile
11-16-2007, 08:33 PM
i would go
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nevesirth
11-16-2007, 09:36 PM
used to attend but not anymore
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AntiKarateKid
01-04-2008, 07:20 PM
I would attend for the purpose of knowing where they are coming from. I feel that I don't have to sit and ponder about these other ways of worship when God has perfected it for us. But as a sign of brotherhood I would attend if a friend asked me to.
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Jayda
01-04-2008, 07:27 PM
hola,

i don't agree with the term 'abrahamic faith' it's an external label that assumes the validity of a theological connection rejected by the Church.

all the same... i would attend depending upon the circumstances and what is intended to occur there. i would not pray to any false gods or join anyone in worshipping God in a way against how He intended.

i've been invited to a jewish service and dinner with the rabbi and people from his congregation. i attended and it was very interesting... i've never been invited to a mosque but i would probably not take the invitation without first reading a little bit more about islamic manners since i know the issue of women in mosques around men is contentious.

que Dios te bendiga
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cat eyes
03-25-2010, 09:57 PM
i wouldnt because shayytan is always hiding out in those places waiting for some curious muslim to come along so he can make him do shirk
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Esther462
03-27-2010, 08:24 PM
Things have change for me now. I will only go into another faith place of worship for weddings, furnals and when I need to see my family and friends.
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KAding
03-27-2010, 08:47 PM
I like going to religious services. It is always so fascinating. Gonna go to a protestant one soon in Amsterdam, see how it differs from the couple Catholic ones I've been to in Belgium a while ago!
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Amadeus85
03-27-2010, 10:53 PM
Creating one religion which is a mix for all people is an eternal goal of freemasonry. I believe that interfaith dialogue plays important role in their attempts.
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Supreme
03-27-2010, 11:22 PM
I would love to observe and witness a service of another faith. I went to a Catholic church a few months back, which seemed completely alien, but I would love to experience a service at a mosque or synagogue.
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Amadeus85
03-27-2010, 11:38 PM
Originally Posted by Supreme
I would love to observe and witness a service of another faith. I went to a Catholic church a few months back, which seemed completely alien, but I would love to experience a service at a mosque or synagogue.

Where it was? I wonder how correct was the mass with the rules.
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Supreme
03-27-2010, 11:54 PM
Originally Posted by Amadeus85
Where it was? I wonder how correct was the mass with the rules.
It was in Eastbourne.:statisfie
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Amadeus85
03-28-2010, 02:02 PM
Originally Posted by Supreme
It was in Eastbourne.:statisfie
I wonder how much the evil spirit of Vaticano Secundo has damaged the catholic mass in UK and other western countries.
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Esther462
03-28-2010, 06:50 PM
Originally Posted by Supreme
I would love to observe and witness a service of another faith. I went to a Catholic church a few months back, which seemed completely alien, but I would love to experience a service at a mosque or synagogue.
I've experience services in many differnt type of Churches, I've also experience a service in a Synagogue (I was a kid at the time) and I've experience a few services in a Mosque.
Insh allah you will experience a service in Mosque soon Supreme.:D
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Supreme
03-28-2010, 06:57 PM
Originally Posted by Amadeus85
I wonder how much the evil spirit of Vaticano Secundo has damaged the catholic mass in UK and other western countries.
LOL- that'll be the work of Jews, atheists and communists, eh?

It was completely alien to me. I enjoyed it, it was a good experience- you Catholics certainly know how to make you churches look beautiful with all those decorations, that's for sure- but it just wasnt for me. The hymns were too boring for someone accustomed to jumping and singing their heart out to Hillsong.;D


I've experience services in many differnt type of Churches, I've also experience a service in a Synagogue (I was a kid at the time) and I've experience a few services in a Mosque.
Insh allah you will experience a service in Mosque soon Supreme
Well, where I live there's:

about 10-12 churches, 10 Protestant and 2 Catholic.
1 synangogue, which I went to in Primary school, but for a tour, not a service.
And no mosques... well, none that I know of anyway. There must be some sort of Muslim congregation at a local community center, because I have lived here all my life and I have never encountered a mosque before.

I have been to a mosque before, albeit an Ahymaddiya one on the other side of London. I think that mosque is the largest in Britain or something, it was lovely building, but it was part of a tour again, and we had crisps after. It wasn't to experience prayers or anything. Plus, I don't think an Ahymaddiya mosque would give me the full experience like a Sunni or Shia mosque might.
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Somaiyah
03-28-2010, 08:21 PM
Assalamo alaykom,

If I had to, I would. But it's not like I would go just for fun. At the same time I like to be there and walking around proudly in my hijab, because they will see me and think that "What does a Muslim do in our church?". But I want to avoid it. Still since I live in Sweden and some occations happens and I have to be there, but not for the reason of what is in there but just because people often fix things in church for some reason.
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