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wilberhum
09-13-2007, 05:19 PM
Taliban readies Ramadan offensive
The Taliban says it is launching a major Ramadan offensive ..........

The Taliban has said it would use the month to launch a new operation involving suicide bombings, ambushes and other attacks.
(More)
http://english.aljazeera.net/NR/exer...11A1C76573.htm

Suicide bomber for Ramadan, interesting.
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NobleMuslimUK
09-13-2007, 05:31 PM
May Allah grant them all the success and victory during this blessed month to send the invaders packing home. Ameen.
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wilberhum
09-13-2007, 05:35 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by NobleMuslimUK
May Allah grant them all the success and victory during this blessed month to send the invaders packing home. Ameen.
Do you have special prayers for the Suicide bombers?
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ahsan28
09-13-2007, 06:24 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by wilberhum
Do you have special prayers for the Suicide bombers?
Nothing special :D
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MTAFFI
10-23-2007, 05:50 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by ISLAMASWEENEY
The Taliban have turned evil e.g (SUICIDE BOMBINGS) but they cant beat Americans and nato hand to hand so it is the only option of victory they have even if it is horrible.
but it is not islamic and goes directly against what they claim to be fighting for... it is very disturbing to hear that they did do that

In my opinion it simply shows their true colors (or at least some of them)... a mujahideen would never "blow himself up", he might try to out smart his enemy and pick and choose his place to fight, but he wouldnt risk a woman or childs life and he wouldnt disgrace his Lord by intentionally blowing up his lords creation. Only the mind of a madman could interpret the Quran to allow such a cowardly dispicable act
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MTAFFI
10-23-2007, 06:01 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by ISLAMASWEENEY
I Know It Is Very Wrong.
Indeed it is, the only we can really do is pray that those perpetrating these acts come to the realization that Allah does not like the transgressors
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MTAFFI
10-23-2007, 06:05 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by ISLAMASWEENEY
They Should Talk To The Afghan Goverment President Kaizai Has Already Offered The Taliban A Place In The Afghan Goverment.
It would be a miracle if somehow peace could be restored to that unfortunate country
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MTAFFI
10-23-2007, 06:16 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by ISLAMASWEENEY
Yeah Bro Say The Taliban Agree T O Peace There Is Then Al Queada And The Northern Alliance To Deal With And Foreign Fighters.
I know, alot of people dont realize how long that country has been ravaged by brutality and war. Those people badly deserve a break, if I had a way to give it to them I would, but sadly it doesnt appear to be in the cards
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MTAFFI
10-23-2007, 06:20 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by ISLAMASWEENEY
It Has Been Ravaged By War Since Ussr Invade It In 1979.
pretty sad isnt it:grumbling
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ahsan28
10-23-2007, 06:32 PM
I fail to understand why US and NATO couldn't defeat Talibans, despite having their mighty airforce, gunships and missiles :?

Is Afghanistan turning into another Veitnam ;D
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MTAFFI
10-23-2007, 06:45 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by ahsan28
I fail to understand why US and NATO couldn't defeat Talibans, despite having their mighty airforce, gunships and missiles :?

Is Afghanistan turning into another Veitnam ;D
I fail to understand why you would think the US is losing the war in Afghanistan, there is a fairly stable government in place, the party that the US went in to oust has been ousted, the Taliban gets weaker and smaller by the day and their influence is felt less and less by the day. Afghanistan in many respects could be considered a victory, far more victory on the US and NATO side than the Taliban side, that is for sure.

Iraq on the other hand could be considered a bit more like a vietnam situation
(I was going to put a giggling smilely after all that but for some reason wars dont make me happy, I guess I must just be sick)
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ahsan28
10-23-2007, 07:21 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by MTAFFI
I fail to understand why you would think the US is losing the war in Afghanistan, there is a fairly stable government in place, the party that the US went in to oust has been ousted, the Taliban gets weaker and smaller by the day and their influence is felt less and less by the day. Afghanistan in many respects could be considered a victory, far more victory on the US and NATO side than the Taliban side, that is for sure.

Iraq on the other hand could be considered a bit more like a vietnam situation
(I was going to put a giggling smilely after all that but for some reason wars dont make me happy, I guess I must just be sick)

In a sense you may be correct, but that applies to tactical dimensions only. Afghanistan is gripped by an insurgency due to resurgence of Talibans. They have organised themselves over the period and are no more an easy prey, as seen during the initial stages of the war, when tons of munitions were delivered on them. That is an easy coourse of action since you have defined positions, however during insurgency the situation often remains fragile for the invading force, since majority of the local population views them an illegal occupation force. You can't expect much from the locals, that leads to massive intelligence failures, resulting in killing of innocent civilians and destruction of civilian infrastructure due to wrong selection of targets.

In today's complexed wars, retention of captured states becomes impossible due to several factors. The same we are witnessing in Iraq and Afghanistan.

As to your remarks about a stable Afghan govt, well I have every reason to disagree for a govt, which doesn't exercise an effective control outside Kabul. Moreover that is a puppet govt, which doesn't enjoy majority support.

Talibans aren't getting weaker. During counter insurgency operations, the regular force takes the maximum toll, whereas insurgents/freedom fighters enjoy an edge having initiative of selection of time and targets. The force, which is in the reactionary mode usually suffers.
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MTAFFI
10-23-2007, 08:19 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by ahsan28
In a sense you may be correct, but that applies to tactical dimensions only. Afghanistan is gripped by an insurgency due to resurgence of Talibans. They have organised themselves over the period and are no more an easy prey, as seen during the initial stages of the war, when tons of munitions were delivered on them. That is an easy coourse of action since you have defined positions, however during insurgency the situation often remains fragile for the invading force, since majority of the local population views them an illegal occupation force. You can't expect much from the locals, that leads to massive intelligence failures, resulting in killing of innocent civilians and destruction of civilian infrastructure due to wrong selection of targets.

In today's complexed wars, retention of captured states becomes impossible due to several factors. The same we are witnessing in Iraq and Afghanistan.

As to your remarks about a stable Afghan govt, well I have every reason to disagree for a govt, which doesn't exercise an effective control outside Kabul. Moreover that is a puppet govt, which doesn't enjoy majority support.

Talibans aren't getting weaker. During counter insurgency operations, the regular force takes the maximum toll, whereas insurgents/freedom fighters enjoy an edge having initiative of selection of time and targets. The force, which is in the reactionary mode usually suffers.
I can understand your point of view on the subject and you make some good points. Such as that of the Afghan government, I guess rather than using a word like "stable" I should have used "held office for a period of time". I also agree that Taliban has an edge as far as being on the offensive the majority of the time. However, their goal unlike that of the AQI, is not to kill all the civilians and create chaos, they are working to get back into society and government, and I think the US & NATO is pretty effectively preventing that in the majority of the country. The Helmand province seems to really be the last "frontier" as far as that war is going and progress is being made in that area right now, which is where Islamasweeney is right, the activity has increased, possibly to a higher level than Iraq, in the past month and it is because of this US/NATO led aggression into this province to remove the Taliban from this area as well. US and NATO casualties are not near as high or common as that of the Taliban. The Taliban are ill equiped and undertrained for the type of war they are fighting and whether it be 1, 2, 5 or 20 years now it is inevitable that the Taliban will lose. Their numbers are a mere 10 to 12 thousand, they are concentrated mostly in Pakistan and as I said before their influence over the country and its people gets smaller and smaller by the day. Not only that but while the troops are driving the Taliban back the Afghans are seizing more control over their own country, their military is building, their police and law enforcement system is improving and unlike in Iraq, it is not being infiltrated by the enemy to cause disruption and violence. At the rate it is going there is a chance that at some point Afghanistan may be able to enjoy peace in many of it areas, God knows I pray for it.
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snakelegs
10-23-2007, 08:26 PM
talibaan is getting stronger all the time - both in afghanistan and in pakistan.
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MTAFFI
10-23-2007, 08:27 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by snakelegs
talibaan is getting stronger all the time - both in afghanistan and in pakistan.
in terms of what? How are they getting stronger, exactly?
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snakelegs
10-23-2007, 09:48 PM
until fairly recently, suicide bombings were almost unknown in kabul and the talibaan had little or no presence there.
they are controlling more and more areas. in pakistan, too, they are gaining more and more power and influence and from everything i've read, they are just getting stronger all the time.
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ahsan28
10-24-2007, 07:59 AM
format_quote Originally Posted by MTAFFI
US and NATO casualties are not near as high or common as that of the Taliban. The Taliban are ill equiped and undertrained for the type of war they are fighting and whether it be 1, 2, 5 or 20 years now it is inevitable that the Taliban will lose. Their numbers are a mere 10 to 12 thousand, they are concentrated mostly in Pakistan and as I said before their influence over the country and its people gets smaller and smaller by the day. Not only that but while the troops are driving the Taliban back the Afghans are seizing more control over their own country, their military is building, their police and law enforcement system is improving and unlike in Iraq, it is not being infiltrated by the enemy to cause disruption and violence. At the rate it is going there is a chance that at some point Afghanistan may be able to enjoy peace in many of it areas, God knows I pray for it.

The US and NATO casualties are less not due to the weakness of Talibans, its because of the fact that they are relying on air in most of the cases and avoid road movements as much as they can and where there is a real need, they keep Afghan Army and Police on the front. But you must remember, you can't rely on air operations entirely for an idefinite period, which leads you to resort to road movements, including logistics, which remains a sour point for the US and NATO. See how many logistic convoys have been attacked and destroyed by Talibans.

Regarding Taliban's casualties, I agree, but not in numbers, as being portrayed in the western media, while they try to conceal their own casualties. You see, mainstream media is in their hands, whatever they feed to the people, will be taken as true by the majority.

Talibans have gained momentum due to their recent resurgence and they are unlikely to be defeated, till they enjoy majority support. People consider them as real warriors, who have been resisting foreign forces for years and haven't surrendered, despite being negligible in strength and resources. Its something to do with ideology, faith and conviction, which drives a smaller force to remain steadfast and face odds and critical situations cheerfully.

I again disagree that the US and NATO are getting effective against Talibans. See yourself, the US has been complaining regarding NATO's role in the war. I happened to scan an article yesterday, where Americans have alleged NATO for not taking due interest in active operations. Any person having a balanced and unbiased thinking can reach to the conclusion that the situation for the invaders is not as rosy as being depicted.

A couple of months back, I read an article in Newsweek, in which it was claimed that the Americans have enhanced their budget against IEDs (improvised explosive devices) from US 4$ to US 6$ for the current year, but the chances of getting any significant success aren't much. They expressed their utter dissatisfaction over destruction of their million dollor expensive equipment being destroyed by these cheap devices having worth no more than a pizza.

Just analyse, a strong US and NATO force, equipped with latest systems and 100,000 Pakistani soldiers deployed along the border, carrying out operations, but remain miles behind of any visible success. The credit goes to Talibans.
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Malaikah
10-24-2007, 08:28 AM
format_quote Originally Posted by MTAFFI
In my opinion it simply shows their true colors (or at least some of them)... a mujahideen would never "blow himself up", he might try to out smart his enemy and pick and choose his place to fight, but he wouldnt risk a woman or childs life and he wouldnt disgrace his Lord by intentionally blowing up his lords creation. Only the mind of a madman could interpret the Quran to allow such a cowardly dispicable act
While I disagree with suicide bombing- it is naive to think that they are targeting women and children, or will blow themselves up anywhere near them. They actually might have military targets.
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MTAFFI
10-24-2007, 02:27 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by ahsan28
The US and NATO casualties are less not due to the weakness of Talibans, its because of the fact that they are relying on air in most of the cases and avoid road movements as much as they can and where there is a real need, they keep Afghan Army and Police on the front. But you must remember, you can't rely on air operations entirely for an idefinite period, which leads you to resort to road movements, including logistics, which remains a sour point for the US and NATO. See how many logistic convoys have been attacked and destroyed by Talibans.

Regarding Taliban's casualties, I agree, but not in numbers, as being portrayed in the western media, while they try to conceal their own casualties. You see, mainstream media is in their hands, whatever they feed to the people, will be taken as true by the majority.

Talibans have gained momentum due to their recent resurgence and they are unlikely to be defeated, till they enjoy majority support. People consider them as real warriors, who have been resisting foreign forces for years and haven't surrendered, despite being negligible in strength and resources. Its something to do with ideology, faith and conviction, which drives a smaller force to remain steadfast and face odds and critical situations cheerfully.

I again disagree that the US and NATO are getting effective against Talibans. See yourself, the US has been complaining regarding NATO's role in the war. I happened to scan an article yesterday, where Americans have alleged NATO for not taking due interest in active operations. Any person having a balanced and unbiased thinking can reach to the conclusion that the situation for the invaders is not as rosy as being depicted.

A couple of months back, I read an article in Newsweek, in which it was claimed that the Americans have enhanced their budget against IEDs (improvised explosive devices) from US 4$ to US 6$ for the current year, but the chances of getting any significant success aren't much. They expressed their utter dissatisfaction over destruction of their million dollor expensive equipment being destroyed by these cheap devices having worth no more than a pizza.

Just analyse, a strong US and NATO force, equipped with latest systems and 100,000 Pakistani soldiers deployed along the border, carrying out operations, but remain miles behind of any visible success. The credit goes to Talibans.
I think that you have some good points but I also stand by mine. I think that there are probably pros and cons going on, on each side and we could probably go back and forth all day about it, so instead I will make a final point and you can respond in kind if you like. My main reason for seeing the Taliban as losing the war in Afghanistan is because of everything they have lost. In many of the areas they have lost support from the people, they have lost their position of authority as government, they are confined to certain areas (Pakistan border, mountain areas), they are killed in fairly high numbers each day, even when they attack, a month ago for example, they tried to attack a small military outpost that was manned by a dozen troops and there was 70 Taliban, they lost over 30 taliban in that battle compared to 1 US troop. I give the Taliban credit for having the endurance and the capability to adapt to new fighting styles and for being able to survive this long, but I do believe that they are being closed in on from all sides and at some point they will have to fight heads up rather than attack and hide and when that time comes they will either lose or ask for a truce. (That is all hypothetical of course)
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MTAFFI
10-24-2007, 02:29 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Malaikah
While I disagree with suicide bombing- it is naive to think that they are targeting women and children, or will blow themselves up anywhere near them. They actually might have military targets.
I am not saying that they are "targeting" women in children, but it would be incredibly naive to say that women and children in Afghanistan havent been killed by a suicide bomber. Regardless however, the post you responded to also included the bomber himself, and whether he has a military target he is still mutilating his lords creation (himself) and disobeying the word of God, commiting suicide is a mortal sin, those who do it go to hell.
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ahsan28
10-24-2007, 02:52 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by MTAFFI
when that time comes they will either lose or ask for a truce. (That is all hypothetical of course)
May be as Im not sure about that. As per our religion, we can't predict about a next moment. However the existing realities suggest otherwise. The puppet govt has been asking Talibans for negotiations, they didn't. Even Afghan President offered them direct talks, they refused. Taliban spokesman informed them that peace talks could only be held, once foreign forces leave Afghanistan.

Lets wait n see, what happens in future.
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MTAFFI
10-24-2007, 03:18 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by ahsan28
May be as Im not sure about that. As per our religion, we can't predict about a next moment. However the existing realities suggest otherwise. The puppet govt has been asking Talibans for negotiations, they didn't. Even Afghan President offered them direct talks, they refused. Taliban spokesman informed them that peace talks could only be held, once foreign forces leave Afghanistan.

Lets wait n see, what happens in future.
Agreed, the future will show us one day. It was good to speak with you on this subject, let just hope whatever the outcome may be, it is good for the Afghan people. I think everyone could agree with that :peace:
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ahsan28
10-24-2007, 03:26 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by MTAFFI
let just hope whatever the outcome may be, it is good for the Afghan people. I think everyone could agree with that :peace:
Inshallah, we all pray that they are out of their troubles soon.
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ahsan28
10-25-2007, 02:48 AM
Appeal for countries to provide more troops is rejected

From The Times
October 25, 2007


The United States was rebuffed yesterday after urging Nato countries with a minimal troop presence in Afghanistan to send more soldiers to ensure the success of the campaign.

The appeal, delivered at a meeting of Nato defence ministers at Noordwijk, in the Netherlands, was rejected by Germany, and other nations were reluctant to boost their numbers, alliance sources said.

In Afghanistan the International Security Assistance Force (Isaf) of Nato has about 41,000 troops, but with Isaf’s remit having spread to every region of the country, there are now gaps in combat troops and logistics units and a shortfall in helicopters and other vital equipment.

The British troops in Helmand province, the Americans in the eastern region and other Nato countries, including the Netherlands and Canada, have borne the brunt of the battles with the resurgent Taleban forces.


http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/new...cle2733769.ece
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ahsan28
10-25-2007, 04:43 AM
Afghanistan is lost

Telegraph. UK
25 OCT 2007

The former United Nations High Representative for Bosnia and Herzegovina delivered his dire prediction after being proposed as a new "super envoy" role in Afghanistan.

Lord Ashdown said: "We have lost, I think, and success is now unlikely."

Lord Ashdown added: "I believe losing in Afghanistan is worse than losing in Iraq.

Britain and the US infuriated by the lack of assistance granted by allies to those countries with forces operating in Afghanistan.


http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main...25/wafg125.xml
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wilberhum
10-25-2007, 11:02 AM
ahsan28,
So do you think the suicide bombers are really working out well for the Tailban?

Do you think the increase of suicide bombers for Ramadan pleased god?
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ahsan28
10-25-2007, 12:25 PM
If you think that alleged suicide bombings was the only factor determining the humiliation being faced by the US and NATO after years of killings of innocent Afghans.
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MTAFFI
10-25-2007, 02:04 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by ahsan28
Afghanistan is lost

Telegraph. UK
25 OCT 2007

The former United Nations High Representative for Bosnia and Herzegovina delivered his dire prediction after being proposed as a new "super envoy" role in Afghanistan.

Lord Ashdown said: "We have lost, I think, and success is now unlikely."

Lord Ashdown added: "I believe losing in Afghanistan is worse than losing in Iraq.

Britain and the US infuriated by the lack of assistance granted by allies to those countries with forces operating in Afghanistan.


http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main...25/wafg125.xml
I would keep in mind while posting these comments that they were made by the former leader of the liberal democrats.
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wilberhum
10-25-2007, 04:04 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by ahsan28
If you think that alleged suicide bombings was the only factor determining the humiliation being faced by the US and NATO after years of killings of innocent Afghans.
Alleged? I love it. :(
You sure are proud of your suicide kidnapping heros. :offended:
Do you feel a rush of glee every time they shoot a woman in the back of the head?

Surly at this point you don't think these drug runners are "Good Muslims" practicing Islam.
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ahsan28
10-25-2007, 06:26 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by wilberhum
Alleged? I love it. :(
You sure are proud of your suicide kidnapping heros. :offended:
Do you feel a rush of glee every time they shoot a woman in the back of the head?

Surly at this point you don't think these drug runners are "Good Muslims" practicing Islam.

What is the mechanism to determine about a suicidal attack? The US and NATO are quite capable to plant IEDs, followed by spreading falsehood about Talibans resorting to suicidal attacks. By no means Im denying possibility of such retaliations against illegitimate occupation, but you must know that propaganda is also considered an essential tool of warfare.

Remember German spymaster said during WWII:-

"Give me resources and I shall prove that the devil is god" :D
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wilberhum
10-25-2007, 06:34 PM
The alleged invasion is only propaganda. :giggling:

Hay, I have a bridge I will sell you. :D
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MTAFFI
10-25-2007, 06:46 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by ahsan28
What is the mechanism to determine about a suicidal attack? The US and NATO are quite capable to plant IEDs, followed by spreading falsehood about Talibans resorting to suicidal attacks. By no means Im denying possibility of such retaliations against illegitimate occupation, but you must know that propaganda is also considered an essential tool of warfare.

Remember German spymaster said during WWII:-

"Give me resources and I shall prove that the devil is god" :D
I wouldnt call afghanistan an "illegal" occupation
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wilberhum
10-25-2007, 06:51 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by MTAFFI
I wouldnt call afghanistan an "illegal" occupation
I would!


The Talibans "illegaly" took control of the country.

They are still trying to "illegaly" regain control.

They are a bunch of criminals, there is nothing legal about them.
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ahsan28
10-25-2007, 07:00 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by wilberhum
I would!
They are a bunch of criminals, there is nothing legal about them.
Agreed and law-abiding are those, who drop 1000 kgs bombs on women and kids :D and later portraying in the media that they killed 100 Talibans :embarrass
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wilberhum
10-25-2007, 07:18 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by ahsan28
Agreed and law-abiding are those, who drop 1000 kgs bombs on women and kids :D and later portraying in the media that they killed 100 Talibans :embarrass
Ya, you just have to keep an eye on Al Jazeera.
It is nothing but a pro-Western rag. :D

But you love your drug dealing kidnappers, thats OK. :-\

You know that "Moon Rocks" are nothing but propaganda.
Every one knows the Moon is made of green chese.
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ahsan28
10-25-2007, 07:29 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by wilberhum
Ya, you just have to keep an eye on Al Jazeera.
But you love your drug dealing kidnappers, thats OK. :-\
Drug lovers are already there to supervise and promote dug trafficking :D

If not then how will they retrieve the expenditure on account of aimless war :D
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MTAFFI
10-25-2007, 07:39 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by ahsan28
Drug lovers are already there to supervise and promote dug trafficking :D

If not then how will they retrieve the expenditure on account of aimless war :D

FACT: The vast majority of poppy coming out of Afghanistan comes from the Helmand province, which many on this site have proudly declared the Taliban controlled hotspot.

You are right that someone is "retrieving the expenditure" but it certainly isnt the US army.

Did anyone else know that the highest concentration of heroin users reside in Iran?
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wilberhum
10-25-2007, 07:41 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by ahsan28
Drug lovers are already there to supervise and promote dug trafficking :D

If not then how will they retrieve the expenditure on account of aimless war :D
More "Moon Rocks".

By by, little boy.:peace:

Well done MTAFFI,
I will leave the hopeless task to you.
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ahsan28
10-25-2007, 07:58 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by MTAFFI
FACT: The vast majority of poppy coming out of Afghanistan comes from the Helmand province, which many on this site have proudly declared the Taliban controlled hotspot.

Strange what we get from western media itself

Britain is protecting the biggest heroin crop of all time


In six years, the occupation has wrought one massive transformation in Afghanistan, a development so huge that it has increased Afghan GDP by 66 per cent and constitutes 40 per cent of the entire economy. That is a startling achievement, by any standards. Yet we are not trumpeting it. Why not?

The answer is this. The achievement is the highest harvests of opium the world has ever seen.

The Taliban had reduced the opium crop to precisely nil. The Taliban were a bunch of mad and deeply unpleasant religious fanatics. But one of the things they were vehemently against was opium.

That is an inconvenient truth that our spin has managed to obscure. Nobody has denied the sincerity of the Taliban's crazy religious zeal, and they were as unlikely to sell you heroin as a bottle of Johnnie Walker.


http://www.mailonsunday.co.uk/pages/...n_page_id=1770
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islamirama
10-25-2007, 07:59 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by MTAFFI
FACT: The vast majority of poppy coming out of Afghanistan comes from the Helmand province, which many on this site have proudly declared the Taliban controlled hotspot.

You are right that someone is "retrieving the expenditure" but it certainly isnt the US army.

Did anyone else know that the highest concentration of heroin users reside in Iran?
When taleban rose to power, 95% of the opium in the world was coming from Afghanistan. After the rise of Taleban, it went down to almost 0%.

after the fall of Talebans in US crusade for oil, the opium is back up to 95% +

Taleban may control that region but only in keeping the invading kuffars out, you can't go legislating a country when your not in control 100% and have to worry about fighting the enemy. This is a war, they have more pressing concerns (fighting the kuffars and repelling them from Muslim land)
then to worry about the opium and drug dealers.

Americans sitting in US shouldn't be discussing such topics when they don't have any reliable information to go on.
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ahsan28
10-25-2007, 08:21 PM
UK failed in Afghan drugs war: reports

October 22, 2007


Britain, in charge of efforts in Afghanistan to stamp out narcotics, has not only failed to reduce drug production but has been unable to stop an increase in production.

Afghanistan produced 93 per cent of the world's opium in 2007. The failure to address the problems had pushed Afghanistan to the brink of a "political and social crisis".

http://www.smh.com.au/news/World/UK-...940981621.html
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wilberhum
10-25-2007, 09:26 PM
ahsan28
Since you seam to accept “The Sydney Morning Herald” as a relievable source of news.

http://www.smh.com.au/news/world/bom...301044804.html
Bombings by Taliban soar
Abdul Rahim Wardak said suicide bombings were up 50 per cent from a year ago
Is your source also spreading lies?
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ahsan28
10-25-2007, 09:40 PM
Thanks giving me the link and I really liked the first sentence :-

Afghanistan's Defence Minister has asked for more money and equipment to fight rising Taliban violence.

Keep feeding your own puppet govt, otherwise they will betray you in the same way as they betrayed Talibans :D
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wilberhum
10-25-2007, 09:41 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by ahsan28
Thanks giving me the link and I really liked the first sentence :-

Afghanistan's Defence Minister has asked for more money and equipment to fight rising Taliban violence.

Keep feeding your own puppet govt, otherwise they will betray you in the same way as they betrayed Talibans :D
Takes a lot of money to fight criminals. :rolleyes:

But then I never denied the alleged cost of it.
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ahsan28
10-25-2007, 09:49 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by wilberhum
Takes a lot of money to fight criminals. :rolleyes:
Not a problem, as long as you are earning through drug business under the shelter of so-called war against terror :D
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wilberhum
10-25-2007, 10:06 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by ahsan28
Not a problem, as long as you are earning through drug business under the shelter of so-called war against terror :D
I think I would earn more money if I sold drugs, but hay, that would be un-Islamic. :D
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ahsan28
10-25-2007, 10:46 PM
Not for the champions of war against terror and their puppet moderates :D
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MTAFFI
10-26-2007, 11:11 AM
format_quote Originally Posted by islamirama
When taleban rose to power, 95% of the opium in the world was coming from Afghanistan. After the rise of Taleban, it went down to almost 0%.

after the fall of Talebans in US crusade for oil, the opium is back up to 95% +

Taleban may control that region but only in keeping the invading kuffars out, you can't go legislating a country when your not in control 100% and have to worry about fighting the enemy. This is a war, they have more pressing concerns (fighting the kuffars and repelling them from Muslim land)
then to worry about the opium and drug dealers.

Americans sitting in US shouldn't be discussing such topics when they don't have any reliable information to go on.
it is incredible how many times i can refute the same exact arugment without anyone ever taking it for what it is. the only reason that the opium production went to an all time low in afghanistan towards the end of their reign is because there was one of the most severe droughts this century occuring at the time. During the Talebans reign the amount of opium production fluctuated, more often to a higher point than a lower. I have posted the link for this at least 10 times, if you need the proof just look up any taleban thread, it has more than likely been shown their before.
Reply

MTAFFI
10-26-2007, 06:15 PM
http://www.unodc.org/pdf/afghanistan...2005-09-09.pdf

here is a little something for those interested in the Talibans "opium eradication"...lol... if you look at the numbers you will notice that they steadily rise while the taliban is in control and then there is a sudden drop. Take that year of the drop and type in Afghanistan drought and you will find that the Taliban did not eradicate anything, it was the lack of water that eradicated it.

It is really disturbing to me how just because a group says that they follow a religion, they can get so much backing from the Muslim community. People defend them until the end just because they claim to be Muslim, I think many people are being fooled.
Reply

ahsan28
10-28-2007, 10:05 AM
Afghan force is insufficient, US general says


October 28, 2007


NATO is taking a risk by not sending enough troops to Afghanistan and restrictions on deployment of some countries' soldiers hampers operations, NATO's commander in Afghanistan said on Saturday.

ISAF commander General Dan McNeill said NATO countries had not even sent troops already promised. Many of the 37 nations contributing troops impose tight restrictions, known as caveats, barring them from offensive operations or from deployment in the more dangerous south.

German troops in the relatively safe north, for example, are not allowed to patrol at night, officials say.


http://www.smh.com.au/articles/2007/...05.html?page=2


Security forces from 37 countries are unable to control Talibans :embarrass
Reply

ahsan28
10-28-2007, 10:19 AM
Diggers pull out of Afghan battle


October 28, 2007


AUSTRALIAN troops, who feared many civilian casualties in an Afghan operation, refused to take part in the Dutch-led assault on advancing Taliban militia.

The battle left dozens of innocent Afghans dead, Fairfax newspapers said.

Almost 70 civilians died when Dutch forces fought a 500-strong Taliban assault in the Chora Valley.

The civilians died in a storm of bombing and artillery fire, human rights investigators report.


http://www.news.com.au/heraldsun/sto...005961,00.html
Reply

wilberhum
10-28-2007, 04:48 PM
What do you think Afghan will be like if your "Heroes" win?
Reply

ahsan28
10-28-2007, 06:00 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by wilberhum
What do you think Afghan will be like if your "Heroes" win?

Certainly better than the past. We should be hopeful for a promising future :D
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wilberhum
10-28-2007, 06:44 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by ahsan28
Certainly better than the past. We should be hopeful for a promising future :D
Certainly it has to be better than the past.
My hart breaks for those that had to live under the Taliban.
But why do you think it would be better next time.
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ahsan28
10-28-2007, 07:23 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by wilberhum
But why do you think it would be better next time.

Im not sure who will be ruling when invaders withdraw from Afghanistan. Its upto Afghans themselves to decide, being their internal matter.

We can only be optimistic :D
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wilberhum
10-28-2007, 07:32 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by ahsan28
Im not sure who will be ruling when invaders withdraw from Afghanistan. Its upto Afghans themselves to decide, being their internal matter.

We can only be optimistic :D
I assume that as soon as the terrorists are whipped the invaders will leave.

Only time will tell.
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islamirama
10-30-2007, 09:11 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by wilberhum
I assume that as soon as the terrorists are whipped the invaders will leave.

Only time will tell.
Terrorists invaders are being whipped, the stubborn mules still won't leave. Guess the mujahideens need to send them all in bodybags inshallah :D
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snakelegs
10-30-2007, 09:15 PM
you must be in the bodybag industry. :giggling:
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wilberhum
10-30-2007, 09:17 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by islamirama
Terrorists invaders are being whipped, the stubborn mules still won't leave. Guess the mujahideens need to send them all in bodybags inshallah :D
Ya, right! OBL supporters are the big loosers.

When you call the kidnapping, drug runing criminals you surly are insulting the Mujahideens.

The fought for there god, not for drug profits.
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Amadeus85
10-30-2007, 09:32 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by islamirama
Terrorists invaders are being whipped, the stubborn mules still won't leave. Guess the mujahideens need to send them all in bodybags inshallah :D
From what i know from TV talebans loose about 20 people every day in NATO atatcks.So it doesnt sound like they were winning or something.BTW, considering the extreme poor of Afgani people, the war will be won by the won who feed them.
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Amadeus85
10-30-2007, 09:33 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by wilberhum
Ya, right! OBL supporters are the big loosers.

When you call the kidnapping, drug runing criminals you surly are insulting the Mujahideens.

The fought for there god, not for drug profits.
You are right, the Mujahedeens who fought with Soviets and Talebans are two different groups (that even fought with each other in nineties). Im just suprised that Islamirama doesnt know it.
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islamirama
10-30-2007, 09:38 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Aaron85
From what i know from TV talebans loose about 20 people every day in NATO atatcks.So it doesnt sound like they were winning or something.BTW, considering the extreme poor of Afgani people, the war will be won by the won who feed them.
well if you keep watching that trash on your tv then you will rot you brain buddy. And the invaders are only killing civilians in their war OF terror. You won't find afghani ppl on their side. Afghans are proud ppl, they have never been controlled. Russia occupied them for decades and at end had to go home defeated and they were brutal in their killings and torture. Don't expect much from current invaders either except shamelessly go home after all the massacre and chaos they have caused.
Reply

Whatsthepoint
10-30-2007, 09:38 PM
The taliban regime was cruel and oppressive. The US brought human rights and freedom, no matter what their actual intentions were.
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islamirama
10-30-2007, 09:46 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Whatsthepoint
The taliban regime was cruel and oppressive. The US brought human rights and freedom, no matter what their actual intentions were.
lady go look up some facts. Taleban were given power by the people for fighting war lords and bringing security back to afghan. Cruel and oppressive the US that murdered and massacred afghans left and right, calling them all talebans. Go read up on war crimes of US and invasion of afghan.

Funny how ppl sitting in the west think they are expert of the stuff they are spoon fed by their lie media.
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Amadeus85
10-30-2007, 09:46 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by islamirama
well if you keep watching that trash on your tv then you will rot you brain buddy. And the invaders are only killing civilians in their war OF terror. You won't find afghani ppl on their side. Afghans are proud ppl, they have never been controlled. Russia occupied them for decades and at end had to go home defeated and they were brutal in their killings and torture. Don't expect much from current invaders either except shamelessly go home after all the massacre and chaos they have caused.
I know that NATO forces do kill innocent people there. I believe that it is hapenning by mistake. But at the other hand, are you aware that the same amount of people dies because of taleban's atatcks? You do or not? Because it is reality.I agree that Afgans are proud people and its good that they got rid of Soviets, but you think that Afghanistan under taleban was succesfull and happy country? Where girls couldnt even attend the schools and people lived in great poverty? Wasn't the action of talebans in the 90's also messing in in Afghanistan politics? To remind you, talebans are students of pakistani quaranic schools. Who taught them and what for? And why talebans wanted to protect OBL after 9/11? Why didnt they give him to USA?
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wilberhum
10-30-2007, 09:52 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by islamirama
lady go look up some facts. Taleban were given power by the people for fighting war lords and bringing security back to afghan. Cruel and oppressive the US that murdered and massacred afghans left and right, calling them all talebans. Go read up on war crimes of US and invasion of afghan.

Funny how ppl sitting in the west think they are expert of the stuff they are spoon fed by their lie media.
Lady? Wow! Your true knowledge is showing.:hmm:
Look up some facts? Good advise, you should try it. :giggling:
The Taleban were not given power by the people, they took it by force. :?
The "Cruel and oppressive the US" (That you live in) attacted the power that protected an international terrorist nad his orginization. :phew
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Whatsthepoint
10-30-2007, 09:53 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by islamirama
lady go look up some facts. Taleban were given power by the people for fighting war lords and bringing security back to afghan. Cruel and oppressive the US that murdered and massacred afghans left and right, calling them all talebans. Go read up on war crimes of US and invasion of afghan.

Funny how ppl sitting in the west think they are expert of the stuff they are spoon fed by their lie media.
:statisfie:blind:
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ummzayd
10-30-2007, 09:55 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Whatsthepoint
The taliban regime was cruel and oppressive. The US brought human rights and freedom, no matter what their actual intentions were.
what are the 'human rights' and 'freedom' that the afghani people enjoy? oh yes they can watch porno and have an entry in the 'Miss World' pageant...gee three cheers for the good ol' u s of a. in the meantime the same problems, including oppression, that existed before still exists. as a matter of fact the oppression is worse these days. except us/uk turns a blind eye, cos they have their puppets in charge and they must by all means keep churning out the propoganda about how beauty salons have brought happiness to the lives of afghan women......

peace
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Amadeus85
10-30-2007, 09:58 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by ummzayd
what are the 'human rights' and 'freedom' that the afghani people enjoy? oh yes they can watch porno and have an entry in the 'Miss World' pageant...gee three cheers for the good ol' u s of a. in the meantime the same problems, including oppression, that existed before still exists. as a matter of fact the oppression is worse these days. except us/uk turns a blind eye, cos they have their puppets in charge and they must by all means keep churning out the propoganda about how beauty salons have brought happiness to the lives of afghan women......

peace
And talebans by destroying school where girls are learning and killing the teachers are helping this country right?
Reply

wilberhum
10-30-2007, 10:07 PM
Some of the Taliban take there wives and children to the battle field. Drop a bomb on the guy who is shooting a grenade launcher at you and 5 innocent civilians are killed.

Remove the grenade launcher and now you can say 6 innocent civilians were killed. The Taliban say “We will install Sharia Law” and they are assumed to be the “Good Guys” by millions of Muslims.

The vast majority of the world saw them for what they were.

Human rights abuses denied it United Nations recognition and most world's states, including Iran, India, Turkey, Russia, USA and most Central Asian republics opposed the Taliban.

Most of them are nothing but power hungry, kidnapping, drug running, misogynistic criminals.
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Whatsthepoint
10-30-2007, 10:08 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by ummzayd
what are the 'human rights' and 'freedom' that the afghani people enjoy? oh yes they can watch porno and have an entry in the 'Miss World' pageant...gee three cheers for the good ol' u s of a. in the meantime the same problems, including oppression, that existed before still exists. as a matter of fact the oppression is worse these days. except us/uk turns a blind eye, cos they have their puppets in charge and they must by all means keep churning out the propoganda about how beauty salons have brought happiness to the lives of afghan women......

peace
Women were prohibited from driving and working. Girls above the age of 7 were denied the right to educate. They were not allowed to attend general hospitals - there was only one all-female hospital in Kabul, a city with a population of nearly 3 million.
Apart from that they banned all non-islamic stuff, such as music, shaving etc. They destroyed one of the alrgest and oldest Buddha statues in the world!
And they too killed unarmed civilians.
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wilberhum
10-30-2007, 10:11 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by ummzayd
what are the 'human rights' and 'freedom' that the afghani people enjoy? oh yes they can watch porno and have an entry in the 'Miss World' pageant...gee three cheers for the good ol' u s of a. in the meantime the same problems, including oppression, that existed before still exists. as a matter of fact the oppression is worse these days. except us/uk turns a blind eye, cos they have their puppets in charge and they must by all means keep churning out the propoganda about how beauty salons have brought happiness to the lives of afghan women......

peace
More proof that all the West does all day is witch porno. :uuh:

Do you think shooting women in the back of the head in a public stadium brought women happiness?
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ummzayd
10-30-2007, 10:15 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by wilberhum
More proof that all the West does all day is witch porno. :uuh:

Do you think shooting women in the back of the head in a public stadium brought women happiness?
do you really maintain that women are not suffering in every conceivable way under the present regime in afghanistan? if you think the afghan government, or the us government, or the uk government, gives two hoots about the happiness/safety/security/education of afghan women then I have nothing further to say to you.

peace
Reply

ummzayd
10-30-2007, 10:21 PM
I fear I have stumbled into some kind of playground fight here.....I can't say I have much agreement with anyone here so I will graciously withdraw.

play nicely now

peace
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wilberhum
10-30-2007, 10:26 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by ummzayd
do you really maintain that women are not suffering in every conceivable way under the present regime in afghanistan? if you think the afghan government, or the us government, or the uk government, gives two hoots about the happiness/safety/security/education of afghan women then I have nothing further to say to you.

peace
I think they all give about one hoot. :offended:

Sad to say, I think you are right.
But at the same time it is not there intent to harm women.

There always seams to be a tendency to forget what caused the invasion.
It was not to liberate women it was to take down a terrorist organization that declared war and attacked the US, and there supporters, the Taliban.

Have we done a good job? No way. We have done a horrible job.

For what ever reason, Bush forgot what and who caused 9/11 and went off to start another war. But that is another story.
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Whatsthepoint
10-30-2007, 10:30 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by wilberhum
I think they all give about one hoot. :offended:

Sad to say, I think you are right.
But at the same time it is not there intent to harm women.

There always seams to be a tendency to forget what caused the invasion.
It was not to liberate women it was to take down a terrorist organization that declared war and attacked the US, and there supporters, the Taliban.

Have we done a good job? No way. We have done a horrible job.

For what ever reason, Bush forgot what and who caused 9/11 and went off to start another war. But that is another story.
True. However the invasion did bring some positive side effects, i. e. women and other gropus have more rights than before.

It brought lots of negative side effects as well...
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wilberhum
10-30-2007, 10:36 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Whatsthepoint
True. However the invasion did bring some positive side effects, i. e. women and other gropus have more rights than before.

It brought lots of negative side effects as well...
Nothing is all good or all bad.

Even though we have done it badly, I think invasion was our "Least Bad" choice.
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ahsan28
10-31-2007, 12:07 AM
format_quote Originally Posted by wilberhum
most world's states, including Iran, India, Turkey, Russia, USA and most Central Asian republics opposed the Taliban.
So why did these two countries oppose Talibans? What do you think?
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wilberhum
10-31-2007, 05:21 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by ahsan28
So why did these two countries oppose Talibans? What do you think?
India's problem with terrorism is probably there reason.
Iran I would guess general sectarian hatred. That is always in the for front.

But if I was you, I would focus more on why the other 180+ did not recognize them.
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ayesha309
10-31-2007, 05:48 PM
bro ahsan28 i like your arguments that you have been posting through out this post :) keep it up!
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ahsan28
10-31-2007, 06:38 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by wilberhum
India's problem with terrorism is probably there reason.
But if I was you, I would focus more on why the other 180+ did not recognize them.

What Afghanistan has to do with instability and security related problems in India?

So in your opinion, recognition of Talibans by other countries was far more important than the majority approval, they enjoyed on the internal front on assumption of power.

By that logic, the existing Afghan Govt is better than Talibans, which has recognition by the West, despite the fact, it doesn't exsercise any authority outside Kabul and has miserably failed in tackling internal security and resurgence of Talibans.
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wilberhum
10-31-2007, 06:51 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by ahsan28
What Afghanistan has to do with instability and security related problems in India?
I gave you my openion. What is yours?

So in your opinion, recognition of Talibans by other countries was far more important than the majority approval, they enjoyed on the internal front on assumption of power.
It is your assumption they enjoyed "internal" support, not mine.

By that logic, the existing Afghan Govt is better than Talibans, which has recognition by the West, despite the fact, it doesn't exsercise any authority outside Kabul and has miserably failed in tackling internal security and resurgence of Talibans.
The fact that there has been major failures in removing them from all power does not make them "The Good Guys".
Peace
Wilber
Reply

ahsan28
10-31-2007, 07:59 PM
India was opposed to Talibans because they marginalized Indian influence in Afghanistan. India did not recognize the Taliban government because of its tilt towards Pakistan. As part of its efforts to maintain its influence in Afghanistan and counter Pakistan’s support to the Taliban Government, India established links with the Northern Alliance in collaboration with Iran. In post Taliban scenerio, India is now more active in Afghanistan, as compared to the past. They wanted to dominate and influence Afghanistan in sheer retaliation to Pakistan, not due to some security concerns and terrorism.

They wanted to ensure that Afghanistan, which is being considered a strategic depth for Pakistan in case of Indo-Pak war is turned into hostile country for Pakitan and they are quite successful in their efforts.
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wilberhum
10-31-2007, 08:07 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by ahsan28
India was opposed to Talibans because they marginalized Indian influence in Afghanistan. India did not recognize the Taliban government because of its tilt towards Pakistan. As part of its efforts to maintain its influence in Afghanistan and counter Pakistan’s support to the Taliban Government, India established links with the Northern Alliance in collaboration with Iran. In post Taliban scenerio, India is now more active in Afghanistan, as compared to the past. They wanted to dominate and influence Afghanistan in sheer retaliation to Pakistan, not due to some security concerns and terrorism.

They wanted to ensure that Afghanistan, which is being considered a strategic depth for Pakistan in case of Indo-Pak war is turned into hostile country for Pakitan and they are quite successful in their efforts.
Oh you mean India did it for political reasons. How interesting. :?
That has to be a first. :D
PS To India, siding with Pakistan is siding with terrorism. You may not agree, in fact neither do I, but probably about 90% of the Hindu Indians would.

Want to dispell one of the other 180+? :hmm:
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ahsan28
10-31-2007, 08:22 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by wilberhum
siding with Pakistan is siding with terrorism.
Thats why US and the West are siding with Pakistan :D

Sometimes your statements are based on ground realities ;D
Reply

Fishman
10-31-2007, 08:23 PM
:sl:
Question: Why do so many Muslims on this site seem to support the Taliban?
:w:
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ahsan28
10-31-2007, 08:37 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Fishman
:sl:
Question: Why do so many Muslims on this site seem to support the Taliban?
:w:
Its because they are resisting against unprecedented aggression by the US and NATO forces. Don't you feel sad about indiscriminate killings of Afghan non-combatants including women and children through 1000 kgs smart bombs to an extent that even the puppet Afghan Govt has also started criticising the genocide of Afghans.
Reply

al-muslimah
10-31-2007, 08:38 PM
Because duh they are the mujahideen of allah and his supporters and it is our job to support Islam and Jihad. If you don't then why kind of muslim ru?

May Allah strenghthen them another timeand may he return our khilafah to us and may the word of Allah be the highest.For some reason they remind me of Al-Murabidoon.The reason they are getting stronger is because they, the kuffar coalition NATO and US forces are fighting with adaeefatul msnsoora.
Reply

wilberhum
10-31-2007, 08:39 PM
IMHO The Taliban say Sharia Law and they are assumed to be great Muslims.

They then are willing to dismiss all the kidnappings, drug running, and other criminal acts.
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wilberhum
10-31-2007, 08:42 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by ahsan28
Its because they are resisting against unprecedented aggression by the US and NATO forces. Don't you feel sad about indiscriminate killings of Afghan non-combatants including women and children through 1000 kgs smart bombs to an extent that even the puppet Afghan Govt has also started criticising the genocide of Afghans.
So before 9/11 you didn't support the Taliban?
Why not?
If you did, then the invasion has nothing to do with why you origionally supported them.
How about a straight answer?
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Fishman
10-31-2007, 09:00 PM
:sl:
format_quote Originally Posted by ahsan28
Its because they are resisting against unprecedented aggression by the US and NATO forces. Don't you feel sad about indiscriminate killings of Afghan non-combatants including women and children through 1000 kgs smart bombs to an extent that even the puppet Afghan Govt has also started criticising the genocide of Afghans.
Just because the USA behaved badly doesn't mean the Taliban are good. They are both pretty bad if you ask me.


Because duh they are the mujahideen of allah and his supporters and it is our job to support Islam and Jihad. If you don't then why kind of muslim ru?

May Allah strenghthen them another timeand may he return our khilafah to us and may the word of Allah be the highest.For some reason they remind me of Al-Murabidoon.The reason they are getting stronger is because they, the kuffar coalition NATO and US forces are fighting with adaeefatul msnsoora.
Who says that the Taliban are the Mujahideen? Themselves? :D

They have done nothing but brought chaos and destruction to Islam. They should give up and go back to their homes in Saudi and let real Islam take over. When that happens the Americans will get bored with nobody to fight and go home too.
  • The way I have been 'brought up' as a new Muslim is being taught that Islam is about loving, serving and worshipping Allaah, being kind to one another and generally being nice, not blowing up skyscrapers full of women and kids as the Taliban do.
  • I have been taught that Jihaad can mean a deep spiritual process of cleansing the heart from sinful thoughts and actions, as well as working to protect, spread or help Islam in the world. But the Taliban reduce it to screaming, firing machine guns in the air and waving political banners.
  • When I think of Muslims I think of the smiling old men who greet me kindly in the Masjid and I think of my friends who have helped me so much with learning and practicing deen. When I think of the Taliban I think of idiot puritans with guns.

Islam has always been about God, not soldiers. The Taliban should ask themselves what kind of Muslims they are...
:w:
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ahsan28
10-31-2007, 09:06 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by wilberhum
So before 9/11 you didn't support the Taliban?
Why not?
If you did, then the invasion has nothing to do with why you origionally supported them.
How about a straight answer?
Prior to 9/11, Taliban Govt whether good or bad was their internal matter, but now the basless war against terror is affecting the whole region. The mass killings of Afghans are compelling them to retaliate against foreign forces and those, who decided to side with US on usjustifiable grounds and now facing the brunt of showing their unflinching loyalties with US.

Someone rightly said that Pakistan is fighting US war on its own territory :D
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wilberhum
10-31-2007, 09:10 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by ahsan28
Prior to 9/11, Taliban Govt whether good or bad was their internal matter, but now the basless war against terror is affecting the whole region. The mass killings of Afghans are compelling them to retaliate against foreign forces and those, who decided to side with US on usjustifiable grounds and now facing the brunt of showing their unflinching loyalties with US.

Someone rightly said that Pakistan is fighting US war on its own territory :D
basless? You calling protecting international terrorists basless?
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ahsan28
10-31-2007, 09:25 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by wilberhum
basless? You calling protecting international terrorists basless?
And who are those, busy killing Afghan women and kids with no justification, but I think you would declare them peace-keepers due to their outstanding performance against non-combatants.
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Fishman
10-31-2007, 09:27 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by ahsan28
And who are those, busy killing Afghan women and kids with no justification, but I think you would declare them peace-keepers due to their outstanding performance against non-combatants.
:sl:
I doubt Wilber would call them that, based on his previous posts:
Sad to say, I think you are right.
But at the same time it is not there intent to harm women.

There always seams to be a tendency to forget what caused the invasion.
It was not to liberate women it was to take down a terrorist organization that declared war and attacked the US, and there supporters, the Taliban.

Have we done a good job? No way. We have done a horrible job.

For what ever reason, Bush forgot what and who caused 9/11 and went off to start another war. But that is another story.
:w:
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wilberhum
10-31-2007, 09:28 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by ahsan28
And who are those, busy killing Afghan women and kids with no justification, but I think you would declare them peace-keepers due to their outstanding performance against non-combatants.
It is always interesting when people use B to justify A, forgetting A comes before B.
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ahsan28
10-31-2007, 09:35 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by wilberhum
It is always interesting when people use B to justify A, forgetting A comes before B.
I agree with you, but you need to inform your ideal peace-keepers :D
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muthenna
10-31-2007, 09:39 PM
Do you feel a rush of glee every time they shoot a woman in the back of the head?
Have you asked the taliban why they shot that woman in the head in the stadium, I chellenge everyone who is against our talib brothers,
-Why did they shoot her? if you dont know than you are rabbling the american and nonmuslim propaganda !
[QUOTE][I have been taught that Jihaad can mean a deep spiritual process of cleansing the heart from sinful thoughts and actions, as well as working to protect, spread or help Islam in the world. But the Taliban reduce it to screaming, firing machine guns in the air and waving political banners.
/QUOTE]
Read surah Taubah, yes jihad means also spiritual bur also involves fighting for the SAKE OF ALLAH, meaning the WORD OF ALLAH TO BE THE HIGHEST (in the land dear brother cause we know it is the highest spiritualy) AND THE WORD OF THE KUFFAR THE LOWEST.
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wilberhum
10-31-2007, 09:39 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by ahsan28
I agree with you, but you need to inform your ideal peace-keepers :D
Again you have proven that you have no concept of what I concider ideal or any thing else. :?

You need to lissen to Fishman. There is some one with some common sense.
Reply

muthenna
10-31-2007, 09:41 PM
Those who are against taliban please answer if you know:
Why was that woman shot in the head ?
If you dont know please dont talk about it at all, dont support american propaganda blindly
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ahsan28
10-31-2007, 09:44 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by wilberhum
There is some one with some common sense.
Common sense comes with maturity and mutual respect for each other, not through the use of military muscle in order to occupy other countries :D
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wilberhum
10-31-2007, 09:51 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by muthenna
Those who are against taliban please answer if you know:
Why was that woman shot in the head ?
If you dont know please dont talk about it at all, dont support american propaganda blindly
American propaganda?
The vido was sumggled out by an Afagan woman.
Blindly? You are obviously lacking any knowledge of me.
She was accused of murdering her Husband.
She was never allowed to testify. But was found guilty.
Reply

Fishman
10-31-2007, 09:55 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by muthenna
Read surah Taubah, yes jihad means also spiritual bur also involves fighting for the SAKE OF ALLAH, meaning the WORD OF ALLAH TO BE THE HIGHEST (in the land dear brother cause we know it is the highest spiritualy) AND THE WORD OF THE KUFFAR THE LOWEST.
:sl:
Yes I know this, but I believe there is a difference between the brave Mujahids of old who fought valiantly against oppressors such as the Russians, the Makkans and Genghis Khan, and today's 'wannabe Mujahids' who blow themselves up and wave AKs like lunatics. The reason I don't like the Taliban goes further than this, but I won't mention it was it will probably lead to a flame war...
:w:
Reply

muthenna
10-31-2007, 09:56 PM
She was foung guilty of the crime and the rule implemented, so if you are against islamic law say it, and dont hide behind taliban bashing
Reply

muthenna
10-31-2007, 10:00 PM
[QUOTE][Yes I know this, but I believe there is a difference between the brave Mujahids of old who fought valiantly against oppressors such as the Russians, the Makkans and Genghis Khan, and today's 'wannabe Mujahids' who blow themselves up and wave AKs like lunatics. The reason I don't like the Taliban goes further than this, but I won't mention it was it will probably lead to a flame war.../QUOTE]
I doubt you are a muslim, ghenghis khan was hardly a muslim not to mention muslim, what russian mujahids (Chechen ??), mekkans (Who Abu Jahl ???), according to you Who is mujahid in this day, Hosny mubarak, King Fahd or Musharaf maybe ???!!!
Reply

Fishman
10-31-2007, 10:00 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by ahsan28
Common sense comes with maturity and mutual respect for each other, not through the use of military muscle in order to occupy other countries :D
:sl:
The only time I've used millitary muscle to occupy another county was on Sid Mier's Civilization IV! What are you on about? :?
:w:
Reply

ahsan28
10-31-2007, 10:00 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Fishman
:sl:
there is a difference between the brave Mujahids of old who fought valiantly against oppressors such as the Russians, the Makkans and Genghis Khan, and today's 'wannabe Mujahids'
They are the same, only Western perceptions and policies have changed :D
Reply

muthenna
10-31-2007, 10:02 PM
The edit doesnt work for me I meant Ghenghis Khan was hardly mulsim not to mention mujahid...
Reply

Fishman
10-31-2007, 10:03 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by muthenna
I doubt you are a muslim, ghenghis khan was hardly a muslim not to mention muslim, what russian mujahids (Chechen ??), mekkans (Who Abu Jahl ???), according to you Who is mujahid in this day, Hosny mubarak, King Fahd or Musharaf maybe ???!!!
I meant that the Mujahids fought the people I mentioned. I certainly have no respect for the evil monster called Genghis, in my mind he was little better than Hitler.
:w:
Reply

wilberhum
10-31-2007, 10:04 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by muthenna
She was foung guilty of the crime and the rule implemented, so if you are against islamic law say it, and dont hide behind taliban bashing
I'm against some of "Islamic Law". Not all, just some.
But that has no part in my stance against the Tailban.

IMHO she was found guilty by what we in the West call a "Kangaroo Court".

But lets not get all tied up on one case. There are many cases of there unIslamic activities.
Reply

ahsan28
10-31-2007, 10:09 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by wilberhum
There are many cases of there unIslamic activities.
Does that justify attacking their country :?
Reply

muthenna
10-31-2007, 10:09 PM
Ok my bad sorry, but you cannot just say that these muslim brothers weather taliban or alqaeda or whatever name they have, that they are all wrong, you can disagree on tactics, but not on the overall aim, at this point what we know for sure is:
American and their allies from the crusaders are our enemies there in those lands and must be fought, that will be achieced only with the right means and that is JIHAD in the Path of Allah, not for the sake of nationalism or anything else
Selam Aleykum
Reply

wilberhum
10-31-2007, 10:12 PM
The crusaders, I knew it was comming. :giggling::giggling::giggling:
The final and full justification for hating the West. :? :?
Yet we should forget the concuest of Spain. :hmm:
Reply

wilberhum
10-31-2007, 10:14 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by ahsan28
Does that justify attacking their country :?
I concider flying planes into buildings unIslamic. Do you?
Reply

ahsan28
11-01-2007, 01:59 AM
format_quote Originally Posted by wilberhum
I concider flying planes into buildings unIslamic. Do you?

Get hold of those responsible, why to kill women and kids in a mindless vengeance, after having failed to catch OBL, who has been the darling of the West during Soviet-Afghan War.
Reply

ahsan28
11-01-2007, 11:26 AM
Afghan, NATO Forces Battle Militants for Control of Southern District


By VOA News
31 October 2007


Villagers are fleeing their homes as Afghan and NATO-led troops battle Taliban militants for control of a district in southern Afghanistan.

This year has been the deadliest in Afghanistan since a U.S.-led invasion ousted the Taliban government in 2001. Taliban militants have established strongholds in the south and east, attacking U.S. and NATO troops and Afghan soldiers in ambushes and suicide bombings.

http://www.voanews.com/english/2007-10-31-voa9.cfm



Taliban Fighters Move in Near Kandahar for First Time Since 2001

31 October 2007


Several hundred Taliban fighters have moved into a strategic area just outside the southern city of Kandahar in recent days and clashed with Afghan and NATO forces, according to Canadian and Afghan officials.

The fighting, which began Tuesday, is the first time large numbers of Taliban have been able to enter the area just north of the city since 2001. Control of the area, known as the Arghandab district, would allow the Taliban to directly threaten Kandahar, southern Afghanistan’s largest city.

By TAIMOOR SHAH, The New York Times


http://www.afghannews.net/index.php?...e=news&id=2475
Reply

MTAFFI
11-01-2007, 02:38 PM
for every negative post there is a positive

Army: 60 militants killed in Pakistan By MUNIR AHMAD, Associated Press Writer
46 minutes ago



ISLAMABAD, Pakistan - Security forces killed as many as 70 militant supporters of a pro-Taliban cleric, the army said Thursday, hours after a suicide attack on an air force bus killed eight and wounded 40.

ADVERTISEMENT

Opposition leader Benazir Bhutto, seen by many supporters as key to a possible return to democratic rule, flew out of Pakistan to visit family in Dubai, United Arab Emirates, two weeks after she was targeted by assassins upon her return from eight years in exile.

Terror attacks and clashes between militants and President Gen. Pervez Musharraf's security forces have deepened the political turmoil ahead of a Supreme Court ruling on whether Musharraf's sweeping Oct. 6 presidential victory was constitutional. There are fears he could impose a state of emergency if judges rule against him, jeopardizing the country's transition to civilian rule.

"She has gone to Dubai to see her ailing mother and children," Bhutto's spokesman Farhatullah Babar said Thursday afternoon after the former prime minister was seen stepping onto an Emirates plane in Karachi. "She will come back on Nov. 8."

Bhutto landed at the Dubai international airport and was welcomed by her husband, then whisked off in a silver Bentley to her family villa in an upscale Dubai neighborhood overlooking a lake and a golf course.

Bhutto, wearing a traditional, rose-colored Pakistani dress and white headscarf, was greeted in the yard of the villa by her daughters and staff.

In Pakistan's northwest district of Swat, the militants attacked law-enforcement posts before dawn Thursday, and security forces responded with fire from mortars, small arms and helicopter gunships.

"According to the information I have from police and Frontier Constabulary, between 60 to 70 miscreants were killed in Swat's areas of Khawaza Khela today," army spokesman Maj. Gen. Waheed Arshad said.

The suicide bombing on the Pakistan Air Force bus occurred at around 7 a.m. near an air base in Sargodha, about 125 miles south of Islamabad, air force spokesman Sarfraz Ahmed said. All the dead were air force employees, said Sahid Malik, an official at the hospital treating the victims.

Musharraf, who seized power in a 1999 coup, has pledged to quit the army before starting a new presidential term, but declined on election night to say whether he would accept a negative verdict from the court.

The doubts over his political future and what course he might take if blocked from a new five-year term has added to the climate of uncertainty.

The Supreme Court, which in recent months has emerged as the main check on Musharraf's dominance, said Thursday that rumors of martial law would have no impact on its decision.

"No threat will have any effect on this bench, whether it is martial law or (state of) emergency," said judge Javed Iqbal before adjourning until Friday. The judge warned the next session after that could be Nov. 12, three days before Musharraf's current term expires.

"Whatever will happen, it will be according to the constitution and rules ... No group should think that it can take the Supreme Court hostage," he said.

With his authority and political clout fading, Musharraf agreed to a corruption amnesty to help Bhutto return to Pakistan. That followed months of talks on a possible pro-Western alliance between them to counter Islamic extremism after parliamentary elections slated for January.

Bhutto's Oct. 18 homecoming was the target of the country's deadliest-ever suicide attack, claiming more than 140 lives. Earlier this week a bomber blew himself up near Musharraf's army office in Rawalpindi, a garrison city just south of the capital, killing seven.

There have been no claims of responsibility for the recent attacks, but most have been blamed on Islamic extremists, who also have engaged in the deadly clashes with the military in the volatile northwest.

Musharraf, a key U.S. ally, is under pressure from Washington to crack down on pro-Taliban and al-Qaida fighters hiding in the country's border regions near Afghanistan.

Early Thursday, militants attacked hilltop positions of security forces in the Khwaza Khela area, triggering a gunbattle, said Ali Rahman, a local police official. He added that troops backed by helicopter gunships and artillery continued targeting militant facilities, killing at least five.

The security forces suffered no casualties, he said.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20071101/...re_as/pakistan

besides you act like 100 taliban outside a town is a big deal, i bet you hear they are dead by tomorrow, obviously their location is known or beoming known


edit to add: did you know that the taliban have only killed 201 US troops this entire year, if that is progress and winning their war than it is no wonder we have such a small number of troops there
Reply

islamirama
11-01-2007, 08:27 PM
I think ramadan has left and this thread is long over due to be closed.
Reply

MTAFFI
11-01-2007, 08:39 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by islamirama
I think ramadan has left and this thread is long over due to be closed.
id agree with that
Reply

wilberhum
11-01-2007, 09:30 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by islamirama
I think ramadan has left and this thread is long over due to be closed.
How can Ramadan be over? The following has not happened yet.

Muslims again ordered to leave the United States, next attack imminentBy Paul L. Williams

& Jeffrey Epstein, America's Truth Forum

Saturday, October 14, 2006

Urgent news from Peshawar. The head of the Islamabad-based Al-Quds Media Center has received a message from a senior Taliban leader who calls upon all Muslims living in the United States to leave the country as soon as possible "because God's punishment will fall upon America in the month of Ramadan."

Jamal Ismail, a senior journalist at Al-Quds, received the call Thursday from Mulla Masoom Afghani. "Afghani said he was speaking from somewhere in the Kandahar province," Ismail said. "He read the message in Arabic, which I recorded. In it he advised Muslim residents of America to get out to escape harm because the United States could face big attacks in the month of Ramadan."

This is the second notice for Muslims to leave America. The first was issued to Hamid Mir, the only journalist to interview Osama bin Laden and Ayman al-Zawahiri in the wake of 9/11. Mir received the warning from Abu Dawood, the newly appointed commander of the al Qaeda forces in Afghanistan, who said:

Final preparations have been made for the American Hiroshima, a major attack on the U. S.

Muslims living in the United States should leave the country without further warning.
(More)
http://canadafreepress.com/2006/paul-williams101406.htm
Reply

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