/* */

PDA

View Full Version : Deliver Iran to the Gates of hell- Republican Candidate



The_Prince
01-14-2008, 01:16 AM
oh man what a sad day if any of these neo-con crusading terrorists become president:

During the Faux News “debate,” actually a tightly scripted soap opera, the Huckster said Iran would see the “gates of Hell” if it dared confront U.S. warships parked off its coastline in the Strait of Hormuz.

Mr. Law and Order, faux good ol’ boy Fred Thompson, agreed whole heartedly. “Mr Huckabee has faced grave doubts about his foreign policy experience, his greatest vulnerability, but got one of the biggest cheers of the night when asked about the incident last week when Iranian boats swarmed US navy ships in the Strait of Hormuz,” reports the Times Online.

Asked whether the American commanders on the scene were right in not attacking the Iranian boats, Mr Huckabee said he backed their decisions, before warning Iran: “Be prepared, first, to put your sights on the American vessel. And then be prepared that the next thing you see will be the gates of Hell, because that is exactly what you will see after that.”

Fred Thompson, the former Tennessee senator and Law & Order star who is banking all on victory in South Carolina to revive his campaign, said of the Iranian boat crews: “I think one more step and they would have been introduced to those virgins that they’re looking forward to seeing.” The crowd cheered.

Rudy Giuliani, the former New York mayor, said: “I think an incident like this reminds us that we shouldn’t be lulled into some false sense of confidence about Iran.”

Mitt Romney, the former Massachusetts governor seeking to become America’s first Mormon president, said: “I believe it was a very serious act.” Indeed, the “crowd cheered,” as they are accustomed to celebrating lies, sort of the same way a well trained monkey dances to an organ grinder.

As Gareth Porter notes for Inter Press Service, the entire incident is little more than a boatload of hooey. “Despite the official and media portrayal of the incident in the Strait of Hormuz early Monday morning as a serious threat to U.S. ships from Iranian speedboats that nearly resulted in a ‘battle at sea’, new information over the past three days suggests that the incident did not involve such a threat and that no U.S. commander was on the verge of firing at the Iranian boats.”

In fact, it appears the neocon propaganda spinners exploited the fact “that in the Persian Gulf, the ‘bridge-to-bridge’ radio channel used to communicate between ships ‘is like a bad CB radio’ with many people using it for ‘hurling racial slurs’ and ‘threats.’” Porter writes that a “veteran U.S. naval officer who had served as a surface warfare officer aboard a U.S. Navy destroyer in the Gulf sent a message to the New York Times” indicating that his “first thought” was that the message “might not have even come from one of the Iranian craft.” Pentagon officials later sheepishly admitted to the New York Times that they could not rule out that the broadcast might have come from another source, not the Revolutionary Guard.

In other words, it is certainly not out of the realm of possibility that the entire affair was made up, as the neocons are infamous for making things up as a pretext for mass murder.

Of course, none of this matters because, thanks to the corporate media, a lot of people now believe Iran was ready to attack our precious warships. All it takes to “catapult the propaganda,” as the neocon tool Bush would have it, is to run a few hours of sensationalistic and bogus sound bites on Faux and CNN, rerun file footage of destroyers and fast boats, and of course ominous images of mullahs and fanatical Revolutionary Guards marching in formation.

Bingo, zingo — you have another Gulf of Tonkin, or something perilously close.

Thus serious catapulting as a matter of course occurred during the “debate,” with the selectees pounding their chests like primates and making not so veiled threats against a country that has done absolutely nothing to the American people, not that any actual threat is the reason the neocons have made so much noise about Iran. It has nothing to do with reality. It has everything to do with the neocon plan to deconstruct the Muslim Middle East by way of bunker buster and cruise missile.

http://www.truthnews.us/?p=1643


the video is in the link....notice how the audience go wild and cheer....yes cheering about killing and sending people to the gates of hell, yes feel the peace and love of these Americans?????????????????

when Iran says they will bomb american bases if america bombs their nation we see so many americans and american media outlets going crazy, yet now we see american politicians running for presidency saying they would blow the iranians to hell if iran did anything and americans cheer it!!!!!!!!!! hypocrisy at its best if you ask me.......basically these neocons and their sheep followers have made it loud and clear, they are allowed to bomb and defend themselves, but other nations such as iran dont have that right, lets even be more specific, muslim nations dont have that right.
Reply

Login/Register to hide ads. Scroll down for more posts
root
01-14-2008, 12:57 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by The_Prince
oh man what a sad day if any of these neo-con crusading terrorists become president:.

Agreed. I don't like Huckabee, and since he is the only candidate to openly declares his support for "Intelligent Design" makes him a candidate nobody should trust.

That said, the US is democratic. Unlike, say Iran that just has an undemocratic puppet religous zealot that simply claims a country should be wiped off the map.

Since the US is democratic, majority opinion win's the day where as in a country like Iran opinion can and is SILENCED.


During the Faux News “debate,” actually a tightly scripted soap opera, the Huckster said Iran would see the “gates of Hell” if it dared confront U.S. warships parked off its coastline in the Strait of Hormuz.
He WAS NOT talking about Iran, he was talking about "Any hostile force"!!!!!! That threatened the US Military, I think his response would be echoed by any other country that had it's military attacked.

The US is a member of the NATO allience, an attack on one member of NATO is an attck on all members so I would expect such a country attacking a NATO signatory to be prepared to see the gates of hell.

Prophet Mohammed united the broken up Arabs in much the same manner.
Reply

AvarAllahNoor
01-14-2008, 02:05 PM
If Rebublicans get in office this time, i'll eat my turban!!

*Clause* Only if it's not rigged!
Reply

The_Prince
01-14-2008, 03:02 PM
He WAS NOT talking about Iran, he was talking about "Any hostile force"!!!!!! That threatened the US Military, I think his response would be echoed by any other country that had it's military attacked.

................

then dont complain when Iran says the exact same thing! as i said hypocrisy!!!!!!!! when Iran says they will unleash a barrage of missiles targetting american bases if america attacks them you all go mad......now when america says it its all good and dandy?
Reply

Welcome, Guest!
Hey there! Looks like you're enjoying the discussion, but you're not signed up for an account.

When you create an account, you can participate in the discussions and share your thoughts. You also get notifications, here and via email, whenever new posts are made. And you can like posts and make new friends.
Sign Up
root
01-14-2008, 03:13 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by The_Prince
then dont complain when Iran says the exact same thing! as i said hypocrisy!!!!!!!! when Iran says they will unleash a barrage of missiles targetting american bases if america attacks them you all go mad......now when america says it its all good and dandy?
Wow, I am amazed how quickly you get off the train of facts and start rambling if, but's and maybe......

No hypocricy here. Besides, one of the points I made was a distinct thread to "Anybody acting aggressively towards the US" where as Iran specifically mentions targetting US bases & wiping Israel off the map. The two are not two of the same.

Quite different.
Reply

NoName55
01-14-2008, 03:15 PM
Deliver Iran to the Gates of hell- Republican Candidate
Not possible until after al-dajjal comes and leads them to try to take over the world( in any case I believe they will both be allies of one another for many year despite them pretending to be at each others throat)
Reply

The_Prince
01-14-2008, 03:25 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by root
Wow, I am amazed how quickly you get off the train of facts and start rambling if, but's and maybe......

No hypocricy here. Besides, one of the points I made was a distinct thread to "Anybody acting aggressively towards the US" where as Iran specifically mentions targetting US bases & wiping Israel off the map. The two are not two of the same.

Quite different.
lol you want to speak about facts? how about you go learn farsi for a start, because the iranian president never said anything about wiping israel off the map, but its ok you can keep spewing that garbage as the silly sheep that you are....

as for iran saying it would target american bases, dang right they said that, but they said they would target the bases ONLY IF america attacked them! funny you missed that part ey? and you just proved your a hypocrite, thanks, when iran says it will destroy american bases if they are attacked you go cry and act like iran is the big bad boy, but right now your saying its ok for you neocons to say you will blow iran to hell if they attack you, or those 'speed' boats.

so no there is nothing quite different between the 2.....
Reply

mohsen1985
01-14-2008, 03:29 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by root
Agreed. I don't like Huckabee, and since he is the only candidate to openly declares his support for "Intelligent Design" makes him a candidate nobody should trust.

That said, the US is democratic. Unlike, say Iran that just has an undemocratic puppet religous zealot that simply claims a country should be wiped off the map.

Since the US is democratic, majority opinion win's the day where as in a country like Iran opinion can and is SILENCED.




He WAS NOT talking about Iran, he was talking about "Any hostile force"!!!!!! That threatened the US Military, I think his response would be echoed by any other country that had it's military attacked.

The US is a member of the NATO allience, an attack on one member of NATO is an attck on all members so I would expect such a country attacking a NATO signatory to be prepared to see the gates of hell.

Prophet Mohammed united the broken up Arabs in much the same manner.

I live in Iran, nothing is silenced here! Everyone can speak freely. The usa can't do crap to Iran. You didn't hear the news of the Iranian military carving their flag on one of the us "naval bases". The naval base that they claim nothing can get anywhere near it? The idiot naval base didn't even notice it, until after the Iranian military told them. Don't underestimate the Iranian military!

The usa is AFRAID of Iran! The minute the usa attacks Iran, they can say goodbye to their beloved israel. We got hidden airbases in all the neighboring countries. We even have missles that can be guided from right here, right in sharon's face (maybe that'll wake him up from his coma?)

If NATO's got the usa's back, Russia's backing Iran, they might not care much about Iran, but a lot of their interests are in Iran. You can be sure if usa makes the smallest move towards Iran, Russia will be here smacking the usa around.

Iran fought the world once before, we will fight again! No intruder can get into the land of Islam! I will fight to the last drop of my blood!

COME ON USA! COME IF YOU DARE! WE'RE READY FOR YOU! you good for nothing terrorists!
Reply

MTAFFI
01-14-2008, 03:35 PM
To me with this issue, I have to say that these politicians went overboard with the comments and the language that they chose, it doesnt help the current situation and only fuels the fire. Iran wasnt right to make threats to the US, these presidential candidates didnt have to threaten Iran, they could have said "If I were in office I would be making more attempts at diplomacy so situations like this are far less likely to occur", and the Iranian government should also be doing the same rather than barking like dogs back and forth.

With that said, any attack on a US ship or soil or on Iranian ships or soil should be done with the expectation of some sort of retaliation. To think otherwise would be foolish... Lets hope for the best and hope for better relations between the two
Reply

root
01-14-2008, 03:53 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by mohsen1985
I live in Iran, nothing is silenced here! Everyone can speak freely.!
The human rights situation deteriorated, with civil society facing increasing restrictions on fundamental freedoms of expression and association. Scores of political prisoners, including prisoners of conscience, continued to serve prison sentences imposed following unfair trials in previous years. Thousands more arrests were made in 2006, mostly during or following demonstrations. Human rights defenders, including journalists, students and lawyers, were among those detained arbitrarily without access to family or legal representation. Torture, especially during periods of pre-trial detention, remained commonplace. At least 177 people were executed, at least four of whom were under 18 at the time of the alleged offence, including one who was under 18 at the time of execution. Two people were reportedly stoned to death. Sentences of flogging, amputation and eye-gouging continued to be passed. The true numbers of those executed or subjected to corporal punishment were probably considerably higher than those reported

Source:http://www.amnesty.org/en/region/mid...east-gulf/iran


The usa can't do crap to Iran. You didn't hear the news of the Iranian military carving their flag on one of the us "naval bases". The naval base that they claim nothing can get anywhere near it? The idiot naval base didn't even notice it, until after the Iranian military told them. Don't underestimate the Iranian military!
I sure hope you are right. Though I doubt ultimately you will be, and I sincerely hope that it is never put to the test.

The usa is AFRAID of Iran! The minute the usa attacks Iran, they can say goodbye to their beloved israel. We got hidden airbases in all the neighboring countries. We even have missles that can be guided from right here, right in sharon's face (maybe that'll wake him up from his coma?)
This would escalate into a full nuclear exchange. Life as we know it will never be the same again.

If NATO's got the usa's back, Russia's backing Iran, they might not care much about Iran, but a lot of their interests are in Iran. You can be sure if usa makes the smallest move towards Iran, Russia will be here smacking the usa around.
Nobody is backing anybody. I doubt very much Russia will come to your aid, seriously. It might kick up a fuss and blow hot ayr, but that would be all.

Iran fought the world once before, we will fight again! No intruder can get into the land of Islam! I will fight to the last drop of my blood!
The Japanese were like that too. They never got to sanction it.

COME ON USA! COME IF YOU DARE! WE'RE READY FOR YOU! you good for nothing terrorists!
I hope not. Truly I do.
Reply

mohsen1985
01-14-2008, 03:53 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by MTAFFI
you are a fool, it is no wonder the world is the way it is :offended:
If loving my country means I'm a fool, then yes I am. If caring about the wellbeing of my mother, sister, father, my family, my neighbors and fellow countrymen means I'm a fool, then I'm the biggest fool there is.

I'll not sit here and let them intrude our contry like they did to Afghanistan and Iraq! I'll not sit here and watch women suffer. I'll fight for my country, like a man!

The world is the way it is because of the usa. The 9/11 attacks were all done by the usa's government. The planning, the hichjacking of the planes, everything. It was just an excuse for starting a war, which they did. Did they find any weapons of mass destruction? nope. Any bio/chemical weapons? nope.

If you didn't know already, the person called "sadam hussein" was a product of the usa. The usa fed him, made him strong, to the point where he became independet and started defying the usa. So they usa came up with an excuse to take him out.

They same thing happened with the Shah of Iran, and the same will happen with israel.

If usa makes the smallest move towards Iran, I guarantee you it will be the next world war!

Read a history book, it's all in there. Know the facts, don't go around calling anyone you want a fool.

I've lived in the usa and seen the people. You people don't know a drop about politics. The government's keeping you busy, so they can do whatever the hell they want.

It's different here in the middle east. The most illiterate person knows more about politics than a college gradute knows in the usa
Reply

The_Prince
01-14-2008, 04:00 PM
mr.root i read that amnesty thing you quoted....

executing criminals isnt a crime, nor is it something evil......nor is amputating a major thiefs hand etc etc, now maybe YOU and some of your people think it is, but just cause you think these type of things are 'evil' 'backward' or 'barbaric' doesnt actually mean or prove they are......

so plz bring some 'real' issues instead of trying to force your way of morality and what is right and wrong on us.....that would help alot.....
Reply

root
01-14-2008, 04:03 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by mohsen1985
If loving my country means I'm a fool, then yes I am. If caring about the wellbeing of my mother, sister, father, my family, my neighbors and fellow countrymen means I'm a fool, then I'm the biggest fool there is.

I'll not sit here and let them intrude our contry like they did to Afghanistan and Iraq! I'll not sit here and watch women suffer. I'll fight for my country, like a man!

The world is the way it is because of the usa. The 9/11 attacks were all done by the usa's government. The planning, the hichjacking of the planes, everything. It was just an excuse for starting a war, which they did. Did they find any weapons of mass destruction? nope. Any bio/chemical weapons? nope.

If you didn't know already, the person called "sadam hussein" was a product of the usa. The usa fed him, made him strong, to the point where he became independet and started defying the usa. So they usa came up with an excuse to take him out.

They same thing happened with the Shah of Iran, and the same will happen with israel.

If usa makes the smallest move towards Iran, I guarantee you it will be the next world war!

Read a history book, it's all in there. Know the facts, don't go around calling anyone you want a fool.

I've lived in the usa and seen the people. You people don't know a drop about politics. The government's keeping you busy, so they can do whatever the hell they want.

It's different here in the middle east. The most illiterate person knows more about politics than a college gradute knows in the usa
Yeah right. Next you will tell us the moon landings were faked, and Iran does not have any homosexuals. :haha:
Reply

mohsen1985
01-14-2008, 04:03 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by root
The human rights situation deteriorated, with civil society facing increasing restrictions on fundamental freedoms of expression and association. Scores of political prisoners, including prisoners of conscience, continued to serve prison sentences imposed following unfair trials in previous years. Thousands more arrests were made in 2006, mostly during or following demonstrations. Human rights defenders, including journalists, students and lawyers, were among those detained arbitrarily without access to family or legal representation. Torture, especially during periods of pre-trial detention, remained commonplace. At least 177 people were executed, at least four of whom were under 18 at the time of the alleged offence, including one who was under 18 at the time of execution. Two people were reportedly stoned to death. Sentences of flogging, amputation and eye-gouging continued to be passed. The true numbers of those executed or subjected to corporal punishment were probably considerably higher than those reported

Source:http://www.amnesty.org/en/region/mid...east-gulf/iran




I sure hope you are right. Though I doubt ultimately you will be, and I sincerely hope that it is never put to the test.



This would escalate into a full nuclear exchange. Life as we know it will never be the same again.



Nobody is backing anybody. I doubt very much Russia will come to your aid, seriously. It might kick up a fuss and blow hot ayr, but that would be all.



The Japanese were like that too. They never got to sanction it.



I hope not. Truly I do.
Oh come on, the media never tells the truth, and you know it. Do I know what's going on in my country or some report that you posted?

First of all, every country has political prisoners, I'm not going to deny that we don't have that here. But the red quote up there, that's all made up. There was a couple of demonstrations by some college students around 4, or 5 years ago. Like 10 people were captured and put into prison, and they were released shortly.

You want to talk about human rights violations? How about bush bombing innocent civilians? Do you know how many people migrated to Iran from Afghanistan and Iraq when usa started attacking them? More than a million from each country! The Iranian government gave them shelter, food, clothing, and provided all their basic needs until they could go back to their own countries. Do you read these articles also? or just some lies that you posted in red?
Reply

The_Prince
01-14-2008, 04:04 PM
but anyway mr root just cause you wanted to act smart by quoting amnesty on iran, lets do the same thing with USA, lol lets use your silly logic, by doing so we will now prove USA is very evil:

Thousands of detainees continued to be held in US custody without charge or trial in Iraq, Afghanistan and the US naval base in Guantánamo Bay, Cuba. In June, the US Supreme Court struck down the military commissions established by President Bush and reversed the presidential decision not to apply Article 3 common to the four Geneva Conventions to detainees suspected of links with the Taleban or al-Qa'ida.

Congress passed the Military Commissions Act stripping the US federal courts of the jurisdiction to hear habeas corpus appeals from such detainees, providing for trials by military commission, and amending the US War Crimes Act. In September, President Bush confirmed the existence of a programme of secret detentions run by the Central Intelligence Agency (CIA).

There were reports of possible extrajudicial executions by US soldiers in Iraq, with a number of soldiers facing prosecution. There was a continued failure to hold senior government officials accountable for torture and other ill-treatment of "war on terror" detainees despite evidence that abuses had been systematic. There were reports of police brutality and ill-treatment in detention facilities in the USA. More than 70 people died after being struck by police tasers. Fifty-three people were executed in 14 states. Hundreds of detainees were held without charge or trial at the US air base in Bagram, Afghanistan, with no provision for judicial review. Some had been detained for more than two years without access to lawyers, their families or the courts. In November, the US authorities said that a "significant percentage" of the Afghan detainees at Bagram might be transferred to the custody of the Afghan government within a year. It also said that some Afghans and other nationals would be kept at Bagram or transferred to Guantánamo.

Thousands of people were held by the US forces in Iraq, including several hundred "security internees" detained since before the handover of power to the interim Iraqi government in June 2004. There were no formal review procedures applying in such cases. Detainees arrested after that date had their detentions reviewed initially by a magistrate (often without the presence of the detainee) and thereafter by a non-judicial body at six-monthly intervals. There were reports of ill-treatment of suspects in jails and police custody, involving abusive use of restraints and electro-shock weapons. More than 70 people died after being shocked with tasers (dart-firing electro-shock weapons), bringing to more than 230 the number of such deaths since 2001.

http://www.amnesty.org/en/region/ame...th-america/usa

do you want me to continue playing your silly game of quoting amnesty?
Reply

ahsan28
01-14-2008, 04:06 PM
The US can't afford to initiate hostilities against Iran, since they are suffering from the dilemma of having pro-Iranian govts in Iraq and Afghanistan and the constant engagement of their army in both the countries, which won't allow them to spare enough troops for another country. Though, they have the capability of air strikes against Iran's weak air defence system, but they will not be able to achieve their aims and objectives.
Reply

The_Prince
01-14-2008, 04:06 PM
oh yeah about executions:

In 2006, 53 people were executed in 14 states..........People with serious mental illness continued to be subjected to the death penalty.

http://www.amnesty.org/en/region/ame...th-america/usa

ah well you wanted to use amnesty!
Reply

root
01-14-2008, 04:06 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by The_Prince
mr.root i read that amnesty thing you quoted....

executing criminals isnt a crime, nor is it something evil......nor is amputating a major thiefs hand etc etc, now maybe YOU and some of your people think it is, but just cause you think these type of things are 'evil' 'backward' or 'barbaric' doesnt actually mean or prove they are......

so plz bring some 'real' issues instead of trying to force your way of morality and what is right and wrong on us.....that would help alot.....
If Iran want's to kill under 18's as a punishment, fine. I really don't care. However, the point I was making is that you said everyone in Iran were free to express thier opinion. Then why did/do you have political prisoners and why is Iran government not democratically elected.

Don't give us bull. If your gonna post, at least be honest with us.
Reply

The_Prince
01-14-2008, 04:10 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by root
If Iran want's to kill under 18's as a punishment, fine. I really don't care. However, the point I was making is that you said everyone in Iran were free to express thier opinion. Then why did/do you have political prisoners and why is Iran government not democratically elected.

Don't give us bull. If your gonna post, at least be honest with us.
i just quoted amnesty showing america is holding many prisoners in afghanistan and iraq without real cause.....and you come preaching freedom to us? HAHAHAHAAH so funny man.......your the one who gives us bull 24-7 not the other way round, would you like me to keep quoting several prisoners held without cause by america????? i could go on forever you know.....
Reply

mohsen1985
01-14-2008, 04:12 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by root
If Iran want's to kill under 18's as a punishment, fine. I really don't care. However, the point I was making is that you said everyone in Iran were free to express thier opinion. Then why did/do you have political prisoners and why is Iran government not democratically elected.

Don't give us bull. If your gonna post, at least be honest with us.
Say what? Our elections are more reliable and democratic than the usa's elections.

Maybe you didn't hear that 78% of the people took part in the presidential elections in Iran? What was the percentage in the usa's rigged elections? 20? 30?

78% means people are happy with the government!
Reply

The_Prince
01-14-2008, 04:15 PM
mr root in all honesty why do you as an american care about iran? why dont you just stick your nose in your own business as your early fore fathers said america should be? lets be honest buddy, majority of americans cant even locate iran on a map.....

so really what do you want from iran? im an iranian myself, what do you want with me and my people? you want to bring us your life-style and all that nonsense? well we dont want it thank you very much....if you want to visit as a tourist and all feel free, but other than that just keep your silly business to yourself instead of acting like you are some hero iran is waiting for, because your not......
Reply

root
01-14-2008, 04:17 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by The_Prince
i just quoted amnesty showing america is holding many prisoners in afghanistan and iraq without real cause.....and you come preaching freedom to us? HAHAHAHAAH so funny man.......your the one who gives us bull 24-7 not the other way round, would you like me to keep quoting several prisoners held without cause by america????? i could go on forever you know.....
I simply assert that your assertion that Iranian individuals are free to express opinion is false. Do you accept this?

I also assert that Iran does not hold fair and free elections?

Thought I would clarify so we can see through your smoke screen, and lies.

PS. I am not an American, never been to america.
Reply

The_Prince
01-14-2008, 04:20 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by root
I simply assert that your assertion that Iranian individuals are free to express opinion is false. Do you accept this?

I also assert that Iran does not hold fair and free elections?

Thought I would clarify so we can see through your smoke screen, and lies.

PS. I am not an American, never been to america.
well if iran has no freedom because of what you quoted, then neither does the USA, so you just dug a hole for yourself here! and remember your the one acting like you have the high moral ground.............:happy:

your not american, your western, same same, the same crimes you find being done by america you find being done by europe!
Reply

The_Prince
01-14-2008, 04:21 PM
either way, from wherever you are, what do you want from iran? because iranains are not asking for your help so what do you want now?
Reply

The_Prince
01-14-2008, 04:24 PM
root lets assumeeeeeeee your 100% right ok? im iranian, and mohsen is iranian, and i can bring so many more iranians for you as well, and we will all say WE DONT WANT YOUR HELP and we dont want anything from you, so now what do you want from us?
Reply

mohsen1985
01-14-2008, 04:26 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by root
I simply assert that your assertion that Iranian individuals are free to express opinion is false. Do you accept this?

I also assert that Iran does not hold fair and free elections?

Thought I would clarify so we can see through your smoke screen, and lies.

PS. I am not an American, never been to america.

On that's just usa's smoke screen and lies, it's refelecting in our mirror of honesty.
Reply

root
01-14-2008, 04:29 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by The_Prince
well if iran has no freedom because of what you quoted, then neither does the USA, so you just dug a hole for yourself here! and remember your the one acting like you have the high moral ground.............:happy:

your not american, your western, same same, the same crimes you find being done by america you find being done by europe!
I never said "Iran" has no freedom, I said individual Iranians are not free to express thier opinions. Do you agree? Yes or no will do.

A also said Iranian elections are not free or fair. Do you agree.
Reply

The_Prince
01-14-2008, 04:31 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by root
I never said "Iran" has no freedom, I said individual Iranians are not free to express thier opinions. Do you agree? Yes or no will do.

A also said Iranian elections are not free or fair. Do you agree.
no i dont agree, because many students have held protests and spoke out against the president, and the elections for president were fair and square, so no i dont agree with you.....

im an inidivual iranian ive been to iran many times and ive spoken my mind, so no i dont agree with you at allllllllllllllllllllllllll.
Reply

mohsen1985
01-14-2008, 04:43 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by root
I never said "Iran" has no freedom, I said individual Iranians are not free to express thier opinions. Do you agree? Yes or no will do.

A also said Iranian elections are not free or fair. Do you agree.
I've never had any problems expressing my opinions. I don't know anyone who has had a problem expressing their opinions.

As I recall it was the usa's presidental elections where the polls were all messed up? they were rigged? was it florida? yea, I think it was.

I was responsible for one of the polls here. I monitored the counting and voting AS A NEUTRAL VOLUNTEER. The same applies to all other polls here!
Reply

root
01-14-2008, 04:48 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by The_Prince
no i dont agree, because many students have held protests and spoke out against the president, .and the elections for president were fair and square, so no i dont agree with you.....

im an inidivual iranian ive been to iran many times and ive spoken my mind, so no i dont agree with you at allllllllllllllllllllllllll.
Freedom to opinion

OK. Mahmoud Salehi was arrested in April 2007 for organizing a peaceful demonstration on May Day 2004 and for his trade union activities. He is still in an Iranian prison cell. What do you think about this?


Free Elections

Ayatollah Sayed ‘Ali Khamenei decides who can and who cannot stand for election. True or false?
Reply

NoName55
01-14-2008, 04:51 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by ahsan28
The US can't afford to initiate hostilities against Iran, since they are suffering from the dilemma of having pro-Iranian govts in Iraq and Afghanistan and the constant engagement of their army in both the countries, which won't allow them to spare enough troops for another country. Though, they have the capability of air strikes against Iran's weak air defence system, but they will not be able to achieve their aims and objectives.
how can you possibly install a more pro-Iranian government in Iraq than the shiite trash that has already been put in power there, short of annexation?
Reply

MTAFFI
01-14-2008, 05:02 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by mohsen1985
If loving my country means I'm a fool, then yes I am. If caring about the wellbeing of my mother, sister, father, my family, my neighbors and fellow countrymen means I'm a fool, then I'm the biggest fool there is.

I'll not sit here and let them intrude our contry like they did to Afghanistan and Iraq! I'll not sit here and watch women suffer. I'll fight for my country, like a man!
And that is an honorable and acceptable thing to say, and I understand that stance completely and agree that if you country is attacked without provocation then you have every right as a man to do just that.

format_quote Originally Posted by mohsen1985
The world is the way it is because of the usa. The 9/11 attacks were all done by the usa's government. The planning, the hichjacking of the planes, everything. It was just an excuse for starting a war, which they did. Did they find any weapons of mass destruction? nope. Any bio/chemical weapons? nope.
It is rather ridiculous that you would claim such nonsense, especially since OBL has admitted to 9/11 on multiple occasions. For you to blame the deaths of all those people on the government based on some bullcrap conspiracy theory that is so easily proven to be false is an injustice to them, and I feel sorry for you if you cannot see through that thin mist of propaganda spread by those who dislike the US.

As far as the war starting, the decisions were rash and not made based on solid evidence and yes I would agree that Iraq was a mistake. However, I feel as though the US has every right to be in Afghanistan and really there should have been 150,000 troops there and none in Iraq to begin with, it may have ended this whole catastrophe much quicker.

format_quote Originally Posted by mohsen1985
If you didn't know already, the person called "sadam hussein" was a product of the usa. The usa fed him, made him strong, to the point where he became independet and started defying the usa. So they usa came up with an excuse to take him out.
I know all about S.H., he was no product of the US, he at times may have had US support, but he made his own bad decision and is 100% responsible for them.

format_quote Originally Posted by mohsen1985
They same thing happened with the Shah of Iran, and the same will happen with israel.
The Shah was toppled by Iran reformists, he was put in place by the US. The Shah is the real reason for tensions between the two countries even today.. (or at least that is where it all started).

format_quote Originally Posted by mohsen1985
If usa makes the smallest move towards Iran, I guarantee you it will be the next world war!
Perhaps so, but who will that benefit? Certainly not Iran, and I would bet the actual USA soil wouldnt even get touched

format_quote Originally Posted by mohsen1985
Read a history book, it's all in there. Know the facts, don't go around calling anyone you want a fool.
I have read plenty in my day

format_quote Originally Posted by mohsen1985
I've lived in the usa and seen the people. You people don't know a drop about politics. The government's keeping you busy, so they can do whatever the hell they want.
How long did you live here? I know plenty of people that know a lot about politics.. I do not deny though that the US has become a nation of entertainment, where the lives of the pop stars mean more than the next president to some, but it is not right to discount everyone. The people that do know about politics and world affairs are typically very knowledgable and are typically the ones who go and vote. Nobody keeps me busy

format_quote Originally Posted by mohsen1985
It's different here in the middle east. The most illiterate person knows more about politics than a college gradute knows in the usa
Yes that is why the Saudi government is the way it is right? Or how about the Iranian government, how is that inflation going? How is that percentage of poor people going? They know so much right? I thought Ahmadinejad was going to fix all that, nope instead what does he do, funnel all you money into a nuclear project that will give power to many but what about when you got to clean up those fuel cells, then what? He is doing nothing but digging a bigger hole for the already strained Iranian nation, but I guess they are perfect and never make a mistake right?

Look I am not trying to talk down to or about the Iranians, I am sure there are many good people there, but they are no better or worse than americans or europeans or martians for that matter. People and governments make mistakes so dont act like the Iranian government and people are innocent. I have seen plenty of US flags burned and military exercises that are directed straight at the US. Imagine if the US held a military exercise showing a sword slashing through the Iranian flag? I wonder how well that would go over????

In the end though, if your country is attacked without provocation you have the right to return fire, and that is all good and fine.. However in this situation the Iranian vessels made suggestive manuevers and threatened US ships with explosions, should one of those explosions of occured the Iranian nation, including yourself, should expect a violent military response. These were international waters, not Iranian, any attack would have been a very grave mistake for Iran, and you shouldnt support an attack like that, that is what I find foolish
Reply

AvarAllahNoor
01-14-2008, 05:13 PM
Root, Iranians elected Amadinajad themselves, so he's democratically elected by the people of Iran.
Reply

aadil77
01-14-2008, 05:14 PM
[QUOTE=mohsen1985;897926]
The usa is AFRAID of Iran! The minute the usa attacks Iran, they can say goodbye to their beloved israel. We got hidden airbases in all the neighboring countries. We even have missles that can be guided from right here, right in sharon's face (maybe that'll wake him up from his coma?)
QUOTE]

Bro I wish you were right, iran doesn't have any nuclear missiles, any other ones are practically useless, irans airforce is pretty crap aswell - they dont have a single decent jet fighter

and if you ask pakistan to help out they'll have to beg u.s to use their nuclear missiles
Reply

mohsen1985
01-14-2008, 05:54 PM
It is rather ridiculous that you would claim such nonsense, especially since OBL has admitted to 9/11 on multiple occasions. For you to blame the deaths of all those people on the government based on some bullcrap conspiracy theory that is so easily proven to be false is an injustice to them, and I feel sorry for you if you cannot see through that thin mist of propaganda spread by those who dislike the US.

As far as the war starting, the decisions were rash and not made based on solid evidence and yes I would agree that Iraq was a mistake. However, I feel as though the US has every right to be in Afghanistan and really there should have been 150,000 troops there and none in Iraq to begin with, it may have ended this whole catastrophe much quicker.
Who is OBL? Is he not another one of bush's friends? his business partner? I could claim responsibility for the 9/11 attacks. Does that mean it's true? There are many evidences proving that 9/11 attacks were all planed by the us government. We can never say for sure who was responsible. We could all be right, as well as wrong.

The usa has NO right to be in Afghanistan. Is Afghanistan OUR neighboring coutry or yours? If that's the case Iran should be there. Since the arrival of us troops the number of drug addicts has gone up like crazy, as well as exports. . .

What gives the usa the right to make a rash decision and take thousands of innocent lives? Who made the usa the boss? All countries can take care of themselves without any help from the usa. A solution for middle east? Middle east doesn't need any if the problem (usa & israel) didn't exist.

I know all about S.H., he was no product of the US, he at times may have had US support, but he made his own bad decision and is 100% responsible for them.
He was in fact a product of the usa. Who was fueling him with weapons in the Iran-Iraq war? If he had any weapons of mass destruction it was all leftovers from usa's support, and also germany, france, etc.

The Shah was toppled by Iran reformists, he was put in place by the US. The Shah is the real reason for tensions between the two countries even today.. (or at least that is where it all started).
There are many theories regarding the shah of Iran. One being that the shah had gained too much power which made the usa fear him. This theory even says that khomeini was working with the usa!

In politics nothing is 100% true, everything is a lie, at the same time the truth!

How long did you live here? I know plenty of people that know a lot about politics.. I do not deny though that the US has become a nation of entertainment, where the lives of the pop stars mean more than the next president to some, but it is not right to discount everyone. The people that do know about politics and world affairs are typically very knowledgable and are typically the ones who go and vote. Nobody keeps me busy
That is exactly my point. They're all lost in entertainment. I didn't say no one knows anything about politics. But when I lived in nyc and was asked where I'm from, after hearing Iran this was the response I got: "Where is that? In Europe somewhere?" Most of the usa's citizens have no clue what's going on in the world. Plus, it's not the people, it's the government! I even met some people who loved Iranians!

The problems are the governments, not the people.

Yes that is why the Saudi government is the way it is right? Or how about the Iranian government, how is that inflation going? How is that percentage of poor people going? They know so much right? I thought Ahmadinejad was going to fix all that, nope instead what does he do, funnel all you money into a nuclear project that will give power to many but what about when you got to clean up those fuel cells, then what? He is doing nothing but digging a bigger hole for the already strained Iranian nation, but I guess they are perfect and never make a mistake right?

Look I am not trying to talk down to or about the Iranians, I am sure there are many good people there, but they are no better or worse than americans or europeans or martians for that matter. People and governments make mistakes so dont act like the Iranian government and people are innocent. I have seen plenty of US flags burned and military exercises that are directed straight at the US. Imagine if the US held a military exercise showing a sword slashing through the Iranian flag? I wonder how well that would go over????

In the end though, if your country is attacked without provocation you have the right to return fire, and that is all good and fine.. However in this situation the Iranian vessels made suggestive manuevers and threatened US ships with explosions, should one of those explosions of occured the Iranian nation, including yourself, should expect a violent military response. These were international waters, not Iranian, any attack would have been a very grave mistake for Iran, and you shouldnt support an attack like that, that is what I find foolish
Oh it's excellent, thanks for asking. How's the recession doing in the usa?
Percentage of poor people, hmmmm, where did you get these percentages? I'm happy with my life here, and we help as many poor people as possible. Even though there aren't many poor people, but our several thousand year old culture teaches us to help the needy.

Ahmadinejad is doing a fantastic job, I'd love to see bush in Ahmadinejad's situation, and compare the results. With all these sanctions and pressure that's on Iran, he's doing a fabulous job.

Number of countries burning Iran's flag: 0
Number of countries burning the usa's flag: lost count after 50.

News hot from the oven: usa naval base commander confesses the explosions weren't from Iran....something called philipine monkey....don't remember exactly, I'm sleepy!

What are the naval bases doing all the way here anyways? Go home to your own country!
Reply

guyabano
01-14-2008, 05:57 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by aadil77
Bro I wish you were right, iran doesn't have any nuclear missiles, any other ones are practically useless, irans airforce is pretty crap aswell - they dont have a single decent jet fighter

and if you ask pakistan to help out they'll have to beg u.s to use their nuclear missiles

ahhh, come on. Iran has some nice Toy Speed boats, where they can threaten heavy armoured US Marine Ships, then quickly run away to hide behind some rocks :D
Reply

mohsen1985
01-14-2008, 05:59 PM
[QUOTE=aadil77;898005]
format_quote Originally Posted by mohsen1985
The usa is AFRAID of Iran! The minute the usa attacks Iran, they can say goodbye to their beloved israel. We got hidden airbases in all the neighboring countries. We even have missles that can be guided from right here, right in sharon's face (maybe that'll wake him up from his coma?)
QUOTE]

Bro I wish you were right, iran doesn't have any nuclear missiles, any other ones are practically useless, irans airforce is pretty crap aswell - they dont have a single decent jet fighter

and if you ask pakistan to help out they'll have to beg u.s to use their nuclear missiles

Do you really think Iran doesn't have nuclear missles?

Iran has one of the top airforces and the best pilots in the world! It's not all about the jet fighters, it's the pilots . . .

ask pakistan for help? what? why would they do that?
Reply

mohsen1985
01-14-2008, 06:02 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by guyabano
ahhh, come on. Iran has some nice Toy Speed boats, where they can threaten heavy armoured US Marine Ships, then quickly run away to hide behind some rocks :D
Get updated on the news......

the us commander confessed it wasn't Iran. it was like 4, or 5 hours ago.

we have more than speed boats. be sure of that :)
Reply

guyabano
01-14-2008, 06:06 PM
[QUOTE=mohsen1985;898027]
format_quote Originally Posted by aadil77


Do you really think Iran doesn't have nuclear missles?

Iran has one of the top airforces and the best pilots in the world! It's not all about the jet fighters, it's the pilots . . .

ask pakistan for help? what? why would they do that?
Might be, but what will the best pilots be able to do, if they have no field to take off? In a war, first actions to be taken are 'Shutting down the enemies Telecommunication and bombing airfields' . Reign over the air space is the most important strike in war tactics. And for this task, US have stealth bombers. Before Iran would even know, what happen, they would already have no more intact airfield. You can ask Iraq what happened ! Not only one single MIG from Iraq's Airforce was able to start. And Iran will be no better, if that would happen.
Reply

guyabano
01-14-2008, 06:07 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by mohsen1985
Get updated on the news......

the us commander confessed it wasn't Iran. it was like 4, or 5 hours ago.

we have more than speed boats. be sure of that :)
Link please ?
Reply

aadil77
01-14-2008, 06:07 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by guyabano
ahhh, come on. Iran has some nice Toy Speed boats, where they can threaten heavy armoured US Marine Ships, then quickly run away to hide behind some rocks :D
yeah well no country can afford to spend crazy amounts of money on defense like the --> USA

How much does the usa spend yearly on defense? Budget $548.9 billion [2] (ranked 1st, 2nd is U.K USD $75.4 billion)!!!!!!!!! nearly half a trillion dollars

how much can iran afford to spend every year on defense?
Dollars: $6.3 billion (2005)
Reply

guyabano
01-14-2008, 06:14 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by aadil77
yeah well no country can afford to spend crazy amounts of money on defense like the --> USA

How much does the usa spend yearly on defense? Budget $548.9 billion [2] (ranked 1st, 2nd is U.K USD $75.4 billion)!!!!!!!!! nearly half a trillion dollars

how much can iran afford to spend every year on defense?
Dollars: $6.3 billion (2005)
Oh sure. I admit that. US can afford it, they have a big country, what can I say. Even I also hate to see them playing Worldpolice, but, they have the technology and the power to do it.
On the other side, someone has to play worldpolice to avoid that some countries start to have too much keen visions of a worldfuture.
USA belongs to the free world, same as West-Europe, and we like that this freedom and peace prevails.
Reply

aadil77
01-14-2008, 06:16 PM
[QUOTE=guyabano;898033]
format_quote Originally Posted by mohsen1985

Might be, but what will the best pilots be able to do, if they have no field to take off? In a war, first actions to be taken are 'Shutting down the enemies Telecommunication and bombing airfields' . Reign over the air space is the most important strike in war tactics. And for this task, US have stealth bombers. Before Iran would even know, what happen, they would alread have no more intact airfield. You can ask Iraq what happeend ? Not only one single MIG from Iraq's Airforce was able to start. And Iran will be no better, if that would happen.
oh yeah I forgot about the MIG 29's
Reply

mohsen1985
01-14-2008, 06:17 PM
[QUOTE=guyabano;898033]
format_quote Originally Posted by mohsen1985

Might be, but what will the best pilots be able to do, if they have no field to take off? In a war, first actions to be taken are 'Shutting down the enemies Telecommunication and bombing airfields' . Reign over the air space is the most important strike in war tactics. And for this task, US have stealth bombers. Before Iran would even know, what happen, they would alread have no more intact airfield. You can ask Iraq what happeend ? Not only one single MIG from Iraq's Airforce was able to start. And Iran will be no better, if that would happen.
I don't think Iran and Iraq are comparable. Iran is monitoring all of usa's moves. You can be sure that the usa cannot surprise Iran by an attack.

I think it was a couple of weeks ago, where Iran published a video tape of a us naval ship. they were monitoring it, the naval base had no clue
Reply

aadil77
01-14-2008, 06:17 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by guyabano
Oh sure. I admit that. US can afford it, they have a big country, what can I say. Even I also hate to see them playing Worldpolice, but, they have the technology and the power to do it.
On the other side, someone has to play worldpolice to avoid that some countries start to have too much keen visions of a worldfuture.
USA belongs to the free world, same as West-Europe, and we like that this freedom and peace prevails.
Well i think everyone will agree that someone needs to police the 'world police'
Reply

mohsen1985
01-14-2008, 06:19 PM
[QUOTE=aadil77;898044]
format_quote Originally Posted by guyabano

oh yeah forget about the MIG 29's
that wasn't my post
Reply

aadil77
01-14-2008, 06:20 PM
[QUOTE=mohsen1985;898045]
format_quote Originally Posted by guyabano

I don't think Iran and Iraq are comparable. Iran is monitoring all of usa's moves. You can be sure that the usa cannot surprise Iran by an attack.

I think it was a couple of weeks ago, where Iran published a video tape of a us naval ship. they were monitoring it, the naval base had no clue
I can believe that, because after all americans are pretty dum:Db, with all their kills from friendly fire :)
Reply

aadil77
01-14-2008, 06:22 PM
[QUOTE=mohsen1985;898050]
format_quote Originally Posted by aadil77

that wasn't my post
mistype
Reply

ahsan28
01-14-2008, 06:52 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by NoName55
how can you possibly install a more pro-Iranian government in Iraq than the shiite trash that has already been put in power there, short of annexation?
Thats why I said, attacking Iran in such unfavourable circumstances seems near to impossible for the US.
Reply

MTAFFI
01-14-2008, 07:24 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by mohsen1985

I don't think Iran and Iraq are comparable. Iran is monitoring all of usa's moves. You can be sure that the usa cannot surprise Iran by an attack.

I think it was a couple of weeks ago, where Iran published a video tape of a us naval ship. they were monitoring it, the naval base had no clue
I am quite positive that Iraq was no "suprise attack", I believe Bush said surrender or fight, or something to that effect. If you honestly think that the Iranian military could win a military fight against the US, you are off your rocker. But hey, you are welcome to have national pride, whether or not it is irrational, who knows unless it happens right? I am a realist however, and if a country like the US was able to strike my soil within an hour and cause the devastation that I think you and I and everyone else knows it has the capability to do, I certainly wouldnt be wanting to wake that beast.
Reply

root
01-14-2008, 07:34 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by AvarAllahNoor
Root, Iranians elected Amadinajad themselves, so he's democratically elected by the people of Iran.
I agree they did. However, they voted from a list of candidates approved by a higher authority. In the last election upto 60 candidates were refused permission to stand for election.

No wonder the current president is nothing more than a puppet.
Reply

root
01-14-2008, 07:36 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by root
Freedom to opinion

OK. Mahmoud Salehi was arrested in April 2007 for organizing a peaceful demonstration on May Day 2004 and for his trade union activities. He is still in an Iranian prison cell. What do you think about this?


Free Elections

Ayatollah Sayed ‘Ali Khamenei decides who can and who cannot stand for election. True or false?
Still waiting for an answer........
Reply

Muezzin
01-14-2008, 07:43 PM
Unless this questioning is some sort of justification to 'Deliver Iran to the Gates o' Helllll!!!11One', I don't see what it really has to do with the topic, folks.
Reply

MTAFFI
01-14-2008, 07:49 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by mohsen1985
Who is OBL? Is he not another one of bush's friends? his business partner? I could claim responsibility for the 9/11 attacks. Does that mean it's true? There are many evidences proving that 9/11 attacks were all planed by the us government. We can never say for sure who was responsible. We could all be right, as well as wrong.
This is all just ridiculous speculation... here have a look at this site
I am sure you will either a) not respond or b) call it some sort of propoganda

format_quote Originally Posted by mohsen1985
The usa has NO right to be in Afghanistan. Is Afghanistan OUR neighboring coutry or yours? If that's the case Iran should be there. Since the arrival of us troops the number of drug addicts has gone up like crazy, as well as exports. . .
They were harboring OBL, they had a choice to hand him over or go to war, they chose war
format_quote Originally Posted by mohsen1985
What gives the usa the right to make a rash decision and take thousands of innocent lives? Who made the usa the boss? All countries can take care of themselves without any help from the usa. A solution for middle east? Middle east doesn't need any if the problem (usa & israel) didn't exist.
As I said before, you cant make an attack on someones soil like OBL did and not expect a military response, plain and simple. The US isnt looking for a solution for the middle east, the US is looking for a security solution for its own grass. Changing your values, etc. means nothing to the US because as you said, most people dont even know or care for that matter.

format_quote Originally Posted by mohsen1985
He was in fact a product of the usa. Who was fueling him with weapons in the Iran-Iraq war? If he had any weapons of mass destruction it was all leftovers from usa's support, and also germany, france, etc.
Iran got weapons from the US as well, the US wasnt supporting either country since they were both a threat to us. The idea was probably more along the lines of let them destroy each other

format_quote Originally Posted by mohsen1985
There are many theories regarding the shah of Iran. One being that the shah had gained too much power which made the usa fear him. This theory even says that khomeini was working with the usa!
What sense does that make? The Shah was dying of cancer, Khomeini wanted him back to put him on trial, the US didnt extradite him, Khomeini allowed the students to take the US embassy, and the whole point was to draw the US into releasing the Shah back to Iran.. If the Shah were a threat to the US why not support Khomeini and avoid the conflict all together?

format_quote Originally Posted by mohsen1985
In politics nothing is 100% true, everything is a lie, at the same time the truth!
Manipulation?

format_quote Originally Posted by mohsen1985
That is exactly my point. They're all lost in entertainment. I didn't say no one knows anything about politics. But when I lived in nyc and was asked where I'm from, after hearing Iran this was the response I got: "Where is that? In Europe somewhere?" Most of the usa's citizens have no clue what's going on in the world. Plus, it's not the people, it's the government! I even met some people who loved Iranians!
Pretty sad, I must agree

format_quote Originally Posted by mohsen1985
The problems are the governments, not the people.
I agree, what to do about it though? I dont know if there is a government in the world anymore that isnt corrupt

format_quote Originally Posted by mohsen1985
Oh it's excellent, thanks for asking. How's the recession doing in the usa?
Percentage of poor people, hmmmm, where did you get these percentages? I'm happy with my life here, and we help as many poor people as possible. Even though there aren't many poor people, but our several thousand year old culture teaches us to help the needy.
Recession? hmmm I guess 4% economy growth could be a recession, if you just figure it is because it isnt 8% anymore, but I would say growth in an economy with a real estate slump and at war time is pretty good wouldnt you? I wonder how Ahmadinejad would handle that???? Not well I would guess.. As far as your figures go, I would say any country with an average GDP per capita of $8900.00 is pretty poor, I make more than that in 1 month. Or I could go with the figure of 40% of people living below the poverty line, or the Iranian government estimate of 15% unemployment, when obviously that is an understatement. (by the way I am sure you will have something to say about the site this is quoted from but the same information can be derived from any other site that you wish to find it on)

format_quote Originally Posted by mohsen1985
Ahmadinejad is doing a fantastic job, I'd love to see bush in Ahmadinejad's situation, and compare the results. With all these sanctions and pressure that's on Iran, he's doing a fabulous job.
I find it amusing you think he is different or better than Bush... By the way have you seen any of that oil money he promised when he was running for president?

format_quote Originally Posted by mohsen1985
Number of countries burning Iran's flag: 0
Number of countries burning the usa's flag: lost count after 50.
You were counting?? :ooh:

format_quote Originally Posted by mohsen1985
News hot from the oven: usa naval base commander confesses the explosions weren't from Iran....something called philipine monkey....don't remember exactly, I'm sleepy!
provide proof (hope it isnt any opiates that are making you sleepy or delusional, since Iran does have the highest number of opiate users in the world...)

format_quote Originally Posted by mohsen1985
What are the naval bases doing all the way here anyways? Go home to your own country!
just looking out for our countries best interests
Reply

MTAFFI
01-14-2008, 07:59 PM
BY the way, I should add that I am not meaning to demean the Iranian people either. I am sure they are great people, I am demeaning their government because with the amount of oil revenues that they have coming in their people could be living much better... I think that they could be a lot like the Sauds in that respect that the government does whatever it wants with the money whether it be to fill their own pockets or whatever. In regards to this thread, I have to say again if the Iranian military wants to strike a US carrier or ship expect a reprucussion. I dont think they are stupid enough to do it, but then again who knows... If they did I would support a US military response, but otherwise I say just leave them alone. The problem is Iran is at much to blame as the US, the harsh rhetoric gets us no where and only fuels the fire. You should be condemning those Iranians who threatened the US ships, they had no right to do that, those ships were in international waters. Think if they attacked, whose fault would that have been? Not the US's, so then what are you fighting for?
Reply

ahsan28
01-14-2008, 08:04 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by mohsen1985
This theory even says that khomeini was working with the usa!
Makes sense :D
Reply

Cognescenti
01-14-2008, 08:48 PM
Moshen;

How old are you?

I live near one of the biggest Persian communities in the US and have several good Persian friends. They are engineers and IT guys and doctors and such. You know what...none of them sound like you.
Reply

Trumble
01-14-2008, 09:10 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by mohsen1985
If NATO's got the usa's back, Russia's backing Iran, they might not care much about Iran, but a lot of their interests are in Iran. You can be sure if usa makes the smallest move towards Iran, Russia will be here smacking the usa around.
I'm not 'sure' of that, because it isn't true. The Russians are pragmatists.. not quite in the same league as the Chinese in that department but pragmatists nonetheless. Their interests in Iran are based partly on a desire to foster (almost) anything or anybody 'anti-American' in the hope that will leave room to expand their own influence back to something like it was in the Soviet era. They are mostly based on generating hard cash. In neither case do the rewards justify attempting to "smack the USA around" which, as a point of interest, they are totally incapable of doing anyway.
Reply

NoName55
01-14-2008, 09:21 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by ahsan28
Originally Posted by NoName55


how can you possibly install a more pro-Iranian government in Iraq than the shiite trash that has already been put in power there, short of annexation?
Thats why I said, attacking Iran in such unfavorable circumstances seems near to impossible for the US.
ok, thank you
Reply

The_Prince
01-14-2008, 09:24 PM
can nato actually be relied on???? i constantly see US generals calling on nato to do more in the war in Afghanistan............

where is nato in iraq?????????? it seems nato has made its stance pretty clear, your all aloneeeeeeee mr USA....off course they will make the odd speech of were all in this together bla bla bla
Reply

Cognescenti
01-14-2008, 11:38 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by The_Prince
can nato actually be relied on???? i constantly see US generals calling on nato to do more in the war in Afghanistan............

where is nato in iraq?????????? it seems nato has made its stance pretty clear, your all aloneeeeeeee mr USA....off course they will make the odd speech of were all in this together bla bla bla
Several NATO members (France and Germany) have not pulled their load in Afghanistan (where the NATO charter of mutual defence was invoked after the 9-11 attacks).

There never was a specific call to invoke the NATO charter in Iraq.

If Iranian forces attacked USN vessels operating in a legal fashion in international waters then the NATO charter would likely be invoked. Of course, the size of the US Navy dwarfs all of the NATO navies combined. The US might call for support from NATO anti-arcraft batteries or radar planes or for help in other areas but it would be mostly symbolic.
Reply

AvarAllahNoor
01-14-2008, 11:50 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Cognescenti
Several NATO members (France and Germany) have not pulled their load in Afghanistan (where the NATO charter of mutual defence was invoked after the 9-11 attacks).

There never was a specific call to invoke the NATO charter in Iraq.

If Iranian forces attacked USN vessels operating in a legal fashion in international waters then the NATO charter would likely be invoked. Of course, the size of the US Navy dwarfs all of the NATO navies combined. The US might call for support from NATO anti-arcraft batteries or radar planes or for help in other areas but it would be mostly symbolic.
Then they shall experience the wrath of the middle east! Be prepared, for there shall be no MERCY!!:Evil:
Reply

NoName55
01-14-2008, 11:53 PM
why is a non-existent situation being discussed?

  • US is NOT going to invade Iran
  • Middle East ran out of wrath a long time ago
Reply

snakelegs
01-15-2008, 12:19 AM
format_quote Originally Posted by AvarAllahNoor
If Rebublicans get in office this time, i'll eat my turban!!

*Clause* Only if it's not rigged!
do you think the mainstream democratic candidates are much better? they too, are itching for yet another war. :unhappy:
Reply

AvarAllahNoor
01-15-2008, 12:26 AM
Obama isn't. And Hillary is keen to clean up dubyas mess
Reply

snakelegs
01-15-2008, 01:47 AM
haven't both obama and clinton said re: iran - military options are not off the table?
obama is somewhat better than clinton - at least he says he would meet with iranian leaders..
Reply

The_Prince
01-15-2008, 01:57 AM
since it was brought up, "the fillipino monkey",,,,this is the most likely cause of the supposed iranian threats against US navy ships:

A threatening radio message at the end of a video showing Iranian patrol boats swarming near U.S. warships in the Persian Gulf may have come from a prankster rather than from the Iranian vessels, the Navy Times newspaper has reported.A video and audio of the Jan. 6 incident in the Strait of Hormuz featured a man in accented English saying "I am coming to you. ... You will explode after ... minutes."

Cmdr. Lydia Robertson, spokeswoman for the Fifth Fleet in Bahrain, said the Navy was still trying to determine the source of the transmission but believed it was related to the Iranian actions.

"The Iranian boats were coming close to the ships, making aggressive maneuvers and objects were being dropped into the water," she told The Associated Press.

However, the Navy Times, a weekly newspaper published by the Gannett company, quoted several veteran sailors as speculating the transmission could have come from a radio heckler, widely known among mariners by the ethnically insulting term "the Filipino Monkey."

The newspaper, which serves the Navy community, said U.S. sailors in the Persian Gulf have heard the prankster — possibly more than one person — transmitting "insults and jabbering vile epithets" on unencrypted frequencies.

"Navy women — a helicopter pilot hailing a tanker, for example — who are overheard on the radio are said to suffer particularly degrading treatment," the newspaper said Sunday. "Several Navy ship drivers interviewed by Navy Times are raising the possibility that the Monkey, or an imitator, was indeed featured in that video."

Filipino Monkey is a name used by mariners around the globe for someone who uses his radio for unnecessary or inappropriate transmissions.

It also is sometimes used by the prankster himself. Two Navy officers said they have personally been aboard ships elsewhere in the world when all of a sudden they've heard someone from another vessel come on the radio and say, "Filipino Monkey, Filipino Monkey" over and over again in a singsong voice.

U.S. Navy officials at Fifth Fleet headquarters in Bahrain could not immediately be reached for comment. However, Navy officials have said they were unsure where the transmission came from.

The threat, however, ratcheted up tensions in the incident, which began when Iranian patrol boats swarmed around three U.S. Navy vessels near Iranian waters in the Strait of Hormuz.

Iran has denied that its boats threatened the U.S. vessels and accused Washington of fabricating video and audio it released. Iran's government has released its own video, which appeared to be shot from a small boat bobbing at least yards from the American warships.

The Navy Times quoted Rick Hoffman, a retired captain, as saying a renegade talker repeatedly harassed ships in the Gulf in the late 1980s.

"For 25 years there's been this mythical guy out there who, hour after hour, shouts obscenities and threats," he said. "He could be tied up pierside somewhere or he could be on the bridge of a merchant ship," Hoffman said.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080114/...IxPzyogQ1vaA8F
Reply

mohsen1985
01-15-2008, 05:09 AM
No MTAFFI, I was sleepy because it was 10 PM, and I'm in the middle of my final exams.

I'll responds to all your posts after my finals. Don't have much free time.

See you all in 9 days
Reply

mohsen1985
01-15-2008, 07:28 AM
I guess I can take 10, 20 minutes to say my final statements and end my discussion. It's like 10 against 1 here. I don't have the energy to argue with 10 people right now. It's better if I put my energy into my studies.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mohsen1985
Who is OBL? Is he not another one of bush's friends? his business partner? I could claim responsibility for the 9/11 attacks. Does that mean it's true? There are many evidences proving that 9/11 attacks were all planed by the us government. We can never say for sure who was responsible. We could all be right, as well as wrong.
This is all just ridiculous speculation... here have a look at this site
I am sure you will either a) not respond or b) call it some sort of propoganda
In politics everything can be called a propaganda. Like I said, no one can say who did it for sure. It could have been saddam hussein, but bin ladan took responsibility. Who knows? Guess we'll have to wait for the day of judgement for all these secrets to be revealed.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mohsen1985
The usa has NO right to be in Afghanistan. Is Afghanistan OUR neighboring coutry or yours? If that's the case Iran should be there. Since the arrival of us troops the number of drug addicts has gone up like crazy, as well as exports. . .
They were harboring OBL, they had a choice to hand him over or go to war, they chose war
Who had a choice? The non-existing governemt? The oppressed women and children?

Quote:
Originally Posted by mohsen1985
What gives the usa the right to make a rash decision and take thousands of innocent lives? Who made the usa the boss? All countries can take care of themselves without any help from the usa. A solution for middle east? Middle east doesn't need any if the problem (usa & israel) didn't exist.
As I said before, you cant make an attack on someones soil like OBL did and not expect a military response, plain and simple. The US isnt looking for a solution for the middle east, the US is looking for a security solution for its own grass. Changing your values, etc. means nothing to the US because as you said, most people dont even know or care for that matter.
I didn't know the us grass grows in the middle of international waters. Very interesting! They started a war on Afghanistan, couldn't capture obl, get out already! Stop stealing their uranium. Maybe that's what you meant? Security solution for its own grass = stealing uranium?

Quote:
Originally Posted by mohsen1985
He was in fact a product of the usa. Who was fueling him with weapons in the Iran-Iraq war? If he had any weapons of mass destruction it was all leftovers from usa's support, and also germany, france, etc.
Iran got weapons from the US as well, the US wasnt supporting either country since they were both a threat to us. The idea was probably more along the lines of let them destroy each other
Iran was buying weapons from anywhere it could. Most countries were supporting Iraq and just giving them the weapons for free. Iran had to purchase most of their weapons from illegal merchants.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mohsen1985
There are many theories regarding the shah of Iran. One being that the shah had gained too much power which made the usa fear him. This theory even says that khomeini was working with the usa!
What sense does that make? The Shah was dying of cancer, Khomeini wanted him back to put him on trial, the US didnt extradite him, Khomeini allowed the students to take the US embassy, and the whole point was to draw the US into releasing the Shah back to Iran.. If the Shah were a threat to the US why not support Khomeini and avoid the conflict all together?
Read a couple of books on the Iranian revolution. As you already know, Iran's revolution was unique, and there are many theories on what started it, what happened, why it happened, etc. That was just one of the theories. I didn't make it up.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mohsen1985
Oh it's excellent, thanks for asking. How's the recession doing in the usa?
Percentage of poor people, hmmmm, where did you get these percentages? I'm happy with my life here, and we help as many poor people as possible. Even though there aren't many poor people, but our several thousand year old culture teaches us to help the needy.
Recession? hmmm I guess 4% economy growth could be a recession, if you just figure it is because it isnt 8% anymore, but I would say growth in an economy with a real estate slump and at war time is pretty good wouldnt you? I wonder how Ahmadinejad would handle that???? Not well I would guess.. As far as your figures go, I would say any country with an average GDP per capita of $8900.00 is pretty poor, I make more than that in 1 month. Or I could go with the figure of 40% of people living below the poverty line, or the Iranian government estimate of 15% unemployment, when obviously that is an understatement. (by the way I am sure you will have something to say about the site this is quoted from but the same information can be derived from any other site that you wish to find it on)
Currencies are different. Everything has a different cost in all countries. Those statistics mean nothing. How much do you pay for 1 liter of gas? We pay less than 20 cents. Iran's government is less than 3 decades old. It is still a child and has not fully grown, it's still in the developing process. With all the pressure from other countries, with the 8 year war at the start of this new government, with all these sanctions imposed on the government, I believe they're still doing a good job.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mohsen1985
Ahmadinejad is doing a fantastic job, I'd love to see bush in Ahmadinejad's situation, and compare the results. With all these sanctions and pressure that's on Iran, he's doing a fabulous job.
I find it amusing you think he is different or better than Bush... By the way have you seen any of that oil money he promised when he was running for president?
Him and bush are both the same idiot.

Yes actually I have. You cannot pass judgement on some place where you don't live. My dad's paycheck was raised by almost 50%. He started a lot of new projects in the city, like tunnels, connecting the entire country by fiber optics, etc . . .These all came from the oil money

Quote:
Originally Posted by mohsen1985
News hot from the oven: usa naval base commander confesses the explosions weren't from Iran....something called philipine monkey....don't remember exactly, I'm sleepy!
provide proof (hope it isnt any opiates that are making you sleepy or delusional, since Iran does have the highest number of opiate users in the world...)
It was on the news last night, I'll post a link if I have the time to look for it.

Again, some useless statistics by people who don't even live here.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mohsen1985
What are the naval bases doing all the way here anyways? Go home to your own country!
just looking out for our countries best interests
Alright, they can keep fishing in international waters. Good job.

BY the way, I should add that I am not meaning to demean the Iranian people either. I am sure they are great people, I am demeaning their government because with the amount of oil revenues that they have coming in their people could be living much better... I think that they could be a lot like the Sauds in that respect that the government does whatever it wants with the money whether it be to fill their own pockets or whatever. In regards to this thread, I have to say again if the Iranian military wants to strike a US carrier or ship expect a reprucussion. I dont think they are stupid enough to do it, but then again who knows... If they did I would support a US military response, but otherwise I say just leave them alone. The problem is Iran is at much to blame as the US, the harsh rhetoric gets us no where and only fuels the fire. You should be condemning those Iranians who threatened the US ships, they had no right to do that, those ships were in international waters. Think if they attacked, whose fault would that have been? Not the US's, so then what are you fighting for?
Again, search for the news. Iran did not threaten those ships in any way.

Every country has its poor as well as rich people. I know all the money from the oil doesnt make it into our pockets, a lot of it is spent in Lebanon and Palestine. As a citizen in Iran, we're not having any financial problems, life is great as it is. We're living cofortably. You cannot judge the living conditions here, since you have never lived here. The statistics given out could be somewhat true, but they're mostly lies to make the government look bad. It's all false advertising against Iran. (Keep in mind that I'm not denying the poverty, but the statistics are mostly exaggerating). You cannot compare your own income with people's income here. Having a $1000 income in Iran is considered somewhat rich. You could even save $300, $400 of that income and still have an easy life.

Moshen;

How old are you?

I live near one of the biggest Persian communities in the US and have several good Persian friends. They are engineers and IT guys and doctors and such. You know what...none of them sound like you.
No two people sound a like. duh! I'm 23 and an engineer. so what?

Well, I've spent enough time with this post.

To sum it up, I'm not saying the government here is 100% honest. No government in the world is free from corruption. But life here isn't as bad as the media shows. Why don't they show the rich neighborhoods for a change? I could do a documentary in Harlem, NYC and claim this is the united states. would that be true?

If the usa wanted to attack Iran, they would have done that a long time ago. You can be sure that usa will never start a war against Iran. Even if Iran doesn't win the war, this "beast" will be heavily wounded, and might not recover so easily, or not recover at all.

Anyways, these discussions will get nowhere. The government never show their true selves. Who knows? Maybe in secret these two government are best of friends and these are all for show?
Reply

aamirsaab
01-15-2008, 10:55 AM
:sl:
TIME OUT
Reply

Hey there! Looks like you're enjoying the discussion, but you're not signed up for an account.

When you create an account, you can participate in the discussions and share your thoughts. You also get notifications, here and via email, whenever new posts are made. And you can like posts and make new friends.
Sign Up

Similar Threads

  1. Replies: 6
    Last Post: 09-13-2013, 03:41 PM
  2. Replies: 6
    Last Post: 01-11-2012, 01:44 AM
  3. Replies: 20
    Last Post: 02-01-2011, 10:45 PM
  4. Replies: 4
    Last Post: 11-03-2007, 08:47 PM
  5. Replies: 0
    Last Post: 03-22-2006, 10:29 AM
British Wholesales - Certified Wholesale Linen & Towels | Holiday in the Maldives

IslamicBoard

Experience a richer experience on our mobile app!