Iraq Prepares "Final" Battle with Al-Qaeda in Iraq

[The_Prince]

BAGHDAD (Reuters) - Iraqi security forces have begun a "decisive" final offensive against al Qaeda in Iraq to push the Sunni Islamist militants out of their last major stronghold in the north, Prime Minister Nuri al-Maliki said on Friday.

He said Iraqi soldiers and police were being sent to Mosul, where a massive blast blamed on al Qaeda killed 40 people and wounded 220 on Wednesday, and an operations room had been set up in the city, 390 km north of Baghdad.

U.S. military commanders say al Qaeda, blamed for most big bombings in Iraq, has regrouped in the northern provinces after being squeezed out of western Anbar province and from around Baghdad during security crackdowns last year.

They describe Mosul, capital of Nineveh province, as al Qaeda's last major urban stronghold in Iraq.

"We have set up an operations room in Nineveh to complete the final battle with al Qaeda along with guerrillas and members of the previous regime," Maliki said, referring to other Sunni militants the Shi'ite-led government says remain loyal to former leader Saddam Hussein.

"Today our forces started moving to Mosul. What we are planning in Nineveh will be decisive," he said during a ceremony for victims of violence in the holy Shi'ite city of Kerbala in southern Iraq, broadcast on state television.

Maliki gave no details of the number of Iraqi troops involved or the scale of the operation. Defense Ministry spokesman Mohammed al-Askari did not have details but said it had been launched at Maliki's request.

"Security is very weak there and the security forces need to be reinforced," Askari said.

Iraqi Interior Ministry spokesman Major-General Abdul-Kareem Khalaf said the Mosul push would include 3,000 extra police. Iraqi security officials in the city said no reinforcements had arrived yet.

BIGGEST THREAT

U.S. and Iraqi troops have launched a series of offensives in northern provinces this year targeting al Qaeda in Iraq.

The U.S. military calls the group, which commanders say is largely foreign-led, the biggest threat to Iraq's security. The military said this week that al Qaeda militants killed 3,870 civilians and wounded almost 18,000 in 4,500 attacks last year.

"We defeated al Qaeda, now there is just Nineveh province where they escaped to, and Kirkuk," Maliki said, referring to another northern city.

During his trip to Kerbala, Maliki met Sheikh Abdul Mehdi al-Karbalai, a representative of Iraq's top Shi'ite cleric Grand Ayatollah Ali al-Sistani. Karbalai was lightly wounded in a bomb attack in the city late on Thursday.

Maliki called the bombing a "criminal act."

U.S. military commanders say al Qaeda's influence in its former strongholds has been greatly diminished but that it remains a dangerous enemy in Mosul and other northern areas.

Despite frequent attacks in northern Iraq, overall violence has fallen sharply across the country, with the number of attacks down 60 percent since last June.

The fall in attacks has been credited to an extra 30,000 U.S. troops that became fully deployed last June, the growth of neighborhood police units after Sunni Arab tribal sheikhs turned against al Qaeda and better Iraqi security forces.

"Now we have a real army. The days when the militants could do anything in front of our armed forces are gone," Maliki said.

U.S. commanders in northern Iraq said Wednesday's massive blast, which left a crater the size of a multi-storey building, was in an unoccupied building they said was used by al Qaeda to store weapons and tons of explosives.

On Thursday, the Nineveh province police director was killed by a suicide bomber as he toured the site of the original blast.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20080125/...tAcR_5zphX6GMA


Now is it just me or does this stooge prime minister sound as stupid or more stupid than Bush? He claims they have 'defeated' Al-Qaeda in Iraq, yet as he says that American Forces right now are still carrying out major operations south, and north of Baghdad against Al-Qaeda in Iraq. so how did they defeat AQI yet at the same time operations and battles are still going on between AQI?!!!!

At the same time just a few days ago AQI carried out major attacks in Diyala province, and Anbar province, so how are they defeated?

I guarentee you his words will backfire against him sooner or later, just as they did for Bush when he announced victory, and told insurgents to bring it on.

[MTAFFI]

Now is it just me or does this stooge prime minister sound as stupid or more stupid than Bush? He claims they have 'defeated' Al-Qaeda in Iraq, yet as he says that American Forces right now are still carrying out major operations south, and north of Baghdad against Al-Qaeda in Iraq. so how did they defeat AQI yet at the same time operations and battles are still going on between AQI?!!!!

At the same time just a few days ago AQI carried out major attacks in Diyala province, and Anbar province, so how are they defeated?

I guarentee you his words will backfire against him sooner or later, just as they did for Bush when he announced victory, and told insurgents to bring it on.

I do think that he is incorrect in that AQI is defeated, as you obviously stated, there are still operations being carried out daily. However, at the same time, they have been drastically reduced to over 70% less than they were, but this is by no means a win.

Lets hope for the Iraqis that the insurgents do not reappear and lets hope that they disappear all together in the interest of peace for the Iraqis. The less of these attacks we see, the less reason US troops have to be there, which means less occupation, more freedom for Iraqis and less violence. Ultimately the Iraqis are the ones who are being killed in extreme numbers by the attacks, not the US troops or anyone else for that matter.

PEACE

[Omar_Mukhtar]

Americans are looking to establish long term bases in Iraq similar to that of Saudi Arabia. What this means for that state and the other state is anyones guess.

[KAding]

Americans are looking to establish long term bases in Iraq similar to that of Saudi Arabia. What this means for that state and the other state is anyones guess.

Are there still bases in Saudi Arabia then? I was under the impression they had all been removed.

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[krypton6]

al-Qaida have never killed civilians in Iraq, they are only after the governments soldiers and the american soldiers, but ofcourse america blaims them for everything and anything that has to do with civilians being killed.

[wilberhum]

al-Qaida have never killed civilians in Iraq, they are only after the governments soldiers and the american soldiers, but ofcourse america blaims them for everything and anything that has to do with civilians being killed.

Is there no end to you denial? :?

[krypton6]

Denial? Its the truth.

[wilberhum]

Denial? Its the truth.

Ya, Abu Musab al-Zarqawi, was really a peace maker. :?

[krypton6]

When did he kill civilians?

[wilberhum]

When did he kill civilians?

OMG is there any thing that you know? (Try Google)

Your lack of knowledge is exceeded only by your denial. :?

[Cognescenti]

Americans are looking to establish long term bases in Iraq similar to that of Saudi Arabia. What this means for that state and the other state is anyones guess.

Unless you mean the American Embassy, there are no American bases in Saudi Arabia. Try reading a Western news source every 10 years or so just for kicks.

[Cognescenti]

al-Qaida have never killed civilians in Iraq, they are only after the governments soldiers and the american soldiers, but ofcourse america blaims them for everything and anything that has to do with civilians being killed.

Oh dear. It really is Krypton then, the 6th planet of the Alfa Centauri system? Welcome! Welcome to Earth. I am sorry we have been poor hosts. Tell us all how long you have been here.

[krypton6]

OMG is there any thing that you know? (Try Google)

Your lack of knowledge is exceeded only by your denial. :?

I know more about him than what you would imagine, and as far as I know, every single one of his attacks were directed to government soldiers, leaders and american soldiers and leaders, a few attacks were on shia areas inside of Iraq where he bombed shiits responsible for drilling of sunni schoolars inside of Iraq.

You only know what your being told by your government.

[Omar_Mukhtar]

:quote:Try reading a Western news source every 10 years or so just for kicks.:


What's it with you and Westerner, this and that? I'm a Westerner too, by the way! :D

P.s, according to "western" news sources, the U.S still has "military trainers" in Saudi Arabia and they moved the troops from Saudi Arabia to Qatar, not out entirely of of the region. Thus the long term presence of US troops in the Middle East continues. Gates hinted that the U.S would attempting to stay in Iraq for a long time to come, albeit with reduction in troop sizes. According to trusted "Western" news sources, most Iraqis want foreign troops out! :coolious:

[chacha_jalebi]

ting ting ting :D

personally ive always doubted the existence of al qaeda honestly lol

but lets all remain on topic yesh

[wilberhum]

I know more about him than what you would imagine, and as far as I know, every single one of his attacks were directed to government soldiers, leaders and american soldiers and leaders, a few attacks were on shia areas inside of Iraq where he bombed shiits responsible for drilling of sunni schoolars inside of Iraq.

You only know what your being told by your government.

BS. Al Jazeera is my main source of ME news.

That just the same old thing that you spread in the fields to make things grow.

[Cognescenti]

What's it with you and Westerner, this and that? I'm a Westerner too, by the way! :D

Cool! You should be able to get the Washington Post of Wall Street Journal or even Mother Jones. :peace:

P.s, according to "western" news sources, the U.S still has "military trainers" in Saudi Arabia and they moved the troops from Saudi Arabia to Qatar, not out entirely of of the region. Thus the long term presence of US troops in the Middle East continues. Gates hinted that the U.S would attempting to stay in Iraq for a long time to come, albeit with reduction in troop sizes. According to trusted "Western" news sources, most Iraqis want foreign troops out! :coolious:

I am sure there are a few instructors in Saudi to show the Saudis how to maintain F-15's and AWACS, but there is no "US base", which is what you claimed.

As for Qatar..yes..and Dubai too (I think) and Yemen...which are not part of Saudi Arabia :D

As for troops in Iraq..it might come to pass that the US would be told to leave. It happened in the Philippines. The US Navy and Air Force just abandoned huge bases. Of course, later the locals regretted their decision as the economy tanked.

[AvarAllahNoor]

Final? is there such a thing? They 'cleaned' Afganistan of Taliban not long ago, only for them to return.

Al Queda isn't going anywhere. (Well not until the ccupation ends)

[krypton6]

BS. Al Jazeera is my main source of ME news.

Al-Jazeera have never ever claimed a attack on civilians in Iraq to be done by Al-Qaida, and nor have they ever called Bin Laden a terrorist.
In fact they always talk anti-israeli not to mention that they never state any of the Hamas attacks to be acts of terrorism.

Clearly Al-Jazeera is not your main news channel.

[wilberhum]

Al-Jazeera have never ever claimed a attack on civilians in Iraq to be done by Al-Qaida, and nor have they ever called Bin Laden a terrorist.
In fact they always talk anti-israeli not to mention that they never state any of the Hamas attacks to be acts of terrorism.

Clearly Al-Jazeera is not your main news channel.

Right, they don't call them terrorists.
The just describe the terrorist acts they do. :-\

Calling someone a terrorist is not objective reporting. A good news source reports news not opinions.

[Fishman]

Al Queda isn't going anywhere. (Well not until the ccupation ends)

:sl:
I don't think they will go anywhere even if the occupation ends. The country is in chaos. Iraq is probably going to be like this for quite a while...
:w:

[aadil77]

holy Shi'ite city of Kerbala

Looll :D,


sorry:embarrass

Why do they call it shiite, it should be shiah

[AvarAllahNoor]

:sl:
I don't think they will go anywhere even if the occupation ends. The country is in chaos. Iraq is probably going to be like this for quite a while...
:w:

Give it time, I'm sure It'l be back to it's original status soon.

[Fishman]

Give it time, I'm sure It'l be back to it's original status soon.

:sl:
Or will it end up a failed state like Somalia, or empoverished like Vietnam?

And how do we know that somebody in the region is not out there to gobble up this broken mess? Iran might feel like paying another visit...
:w:

[AvarAllahNoor]

:sl:
Or will it end up a failed state like Somalia, or empoverished like Vietnam?

And how do we know that somebody in the region is not out there to gobble up this broken mess? Iran might feel like paying another visit...
:w:

You forget silly, Iran are fundng the 'terrorism' there...

[islamirama]

something interesting i came across today - http://www.whatreallyhappened.com/fakealqaeda.html

[Fishman]

You forget silly, Iran are fundng the 'terrorism' there...

:sl:
Maybe the Iranians are funding terrorism not to kick out the Americans, but to make it hard for the Iraqi government to defend Iraq against an Iranian invasion?
Or is this going to conspiracy theory levels?
:w:

[krypton6]

Right, they don't call them terrorists.
The just describe the terrorist acts they do. :-\

In fact they do not even recognize 9/11 as acts terrorism and they have never described 9/11 as acts of terrorism.

There is a reason for why Bin Laden sends his videos directly to Al-Jazeera instead of any other channel.

[krypton6]

:sl:
Maybe the Iranians are funding terrorism not to kick out the Americans, but to make it hard for the Iraqi government to defend Iraq against an Iranian invasion?
Or is this going to conspiracy theory levels?
:w:

Iran is shia, and the Iraqi government is a shia regime who wants a unity between Iran and Iraq, they want Iraq to be 100% shia and the only way Iraq is going to be that way, is if they become one with Iran.

[AvarAllahNoor]

:sl:
Maybe the Iranians are funding terrorism not to kick out the Americans, but to make it hard for the Iraqi government to defend Iraq against an Iranian invasion?
Or is this going to conspiracy theory levels?
:w:

You're way ahead dude!

I doubt they have such ideas. - They support Palestine, even though they are Sunnis. Lets leave the theories to dubya and his cronies. :D

[Cognescenti]

something interesting i came across today - http://www.whatreallyhappened.com/fakealqaeda.html

Yes...go to Google and type in "preposterous 9-11 conspiracies for those who cannot accept that 3000 people were murdered by killers who invoked Islam"

[islamirama]

Yes...go to Google and type in "preposterous 9-11 conspiracies for those who cannot accept that 3000 people were murdered by killers who invoked Islam"

keep believing tall tales. Even lets say if that is true, how does that justify 1 million MURDERED in Iraq who didn't even have anything to do with 9-11.

[wilberhum]

keep believing tall tales. Even lets say if that is true, how does that justify 1 million MURDERED in Iraq who didn't even have anything to do with 9-11.

Yes, keep believing in tall tales. You love any lie that justifies you hate. I had hoped the hajj would get you closer to god and further from hate. Those hopes faded really fast.

Your one million murdered is just your standard distortion to justify your hate.

But what ever the real number is, I find it totally unjustified.

The difference between you and me is that I'm not a bald faced lier who hates my country and every thing that does not suite my beliefs.

[sudais1]

When did he kill civilians?

Al Qaeda or w/e the bloody name is killed thousands of civilians and that is wrong by human law and even greater the law of his majesty Allah SWT. The Prophet pbuh gave strict commands on who to fight if fighting was needed. forget killing civilians were no even allowed to pollute the water or cut trees. We only fight those who also choose to fight. the others are left in peace.

[krypton6]

Al Qaeda or w/e the bloody name is killed thousands of civilians and that is wrong by human law and even greater the law of his majesty Allah SWT. The Prophet pbuh gave strict commands on who to fight if fighting was needed. forget killing civilians were no even allowed to pollute the water or cut trees. We only fight those who also choose to fight. the others are left in peace.

In islam you can fight in self-defence or in order to preach your religion. Bin Laden is fighting purely in self-defence, he isnt the ones constantly attacking and starting new conflicts and wars. The only officially confirmed attack by al-Qaida is the 9/11, but why do you considere those people who died for innocent civilians? Those same people who died were the people who payed their government millions of dollars, money that was later used to kill muslims.
I'm not saying that it justefies the attack, but I'm saying that those 3000 who died were in fact not innocent civilians! They chose to live in america, and therby chose to pay the forces that traumatize every muslims life, they could have simply left america but they chose not to!

They were not innocent civilians, they were the wheels holding and moving the car forward. A civilian is someone who do not support his governments actions in any way, those people clearly did!

The prophet talked at a age were you could chose who to kill and who not to! Today people dont fight with swords, you cant specifically chose who to kill and some times unarmed people will be killed. Now al-Qaida has no army what so ever, so how are they supposed to fight back otherwise?

[krypton6]

Yes, keep believing in tall tales. You love any lie that justifies you hate. I had hoped the hajj would get you closer to god and further from hate. Those hopes faded really fast.

Your one million murdered is just your standard distortion to justify your hate.

But what ever the real number is, I find it totally unjustified.

The difference between you and me is that I'm not a bald faced lier who hates my country and every thing that does not suite my beliefs.

No actually its a confirmed number by the North-Iraqi (Kurdish) government, and sunnis claim very much the same. Only the shiits claim a bit less (600.000-880.000).

[AvarAllahNoor]

But whatever the real number is, I find it totally unjustified.

That's soothing to read. :statisfie

I think certain things are said in the heat of the moment. (I should know look at my last few posts in the Sikh thread) At the end of the day, we all ned to keep our heads over such things. Such conflicts are not new, and sadly it won't be the last.

Gur Fateh

[*Hana*]

In islam you can fight in self-defence or in order to preach your religion. Bin Laden is fighting purely in self-defence, he isnt the ones constantly attacking and starting new conflicts and wars. The only officially confirmed attack by al-Qaida is the 9/11, but why do you considere those people who died for innocent civilians? Those same people who died were the people who payed their government millions of dollars, money that was later used to kill muslims.
I'm not saying that it justefies the attack, but I'm saying that those 3000 who died were in fact not innocent civilians! They chose to live in america, and therby chose to pay the forces that traumatize every muslims life, they could have simply left america but they chose not to!

They were not innocent civilians, they were the wheels holding and moving the car forward. A civilian is someone who do not support his governments actions in any way, those people clearly did!

The prophet talked at a age were you could chose who to kill and who not to! Today people dont fight with swords, you cant specifically chose who to kill and some times unarmed people will be killed. Now al-Qaida has no army what so ever, so how are they supposed to fight back otherwise?

Whoa brother!! Regardless of who is responsible for 911, Muslims, Al-Queda, or green leprechauns, to say these 3000 were NOT innocents in the eyes of Islam is TOTALLY WRONG!! There were babies on those planes, women, elderly and NON COMBATANTS! The same holds true for those inside the buildings and those below it. Islam does NOT permit the killing of innocents and non combatants even if they are ON the battlefield!! Remember the woman that was killed on the battlefield and what Prophet Muhammed, pbuh, said about that?

How can you even attempt to say these people were not innocents!!??!! Nowhere will you find it is ok to target civilians ANYWHERE in Islam!

How dare you try to alter the words of Prophet Muhammed, pbuh, by suggesting his words don't hold true today?? He was chosen and guided directly by God, His word stands the test of time, brother!!

If you want to believe this behavior is justified in Islam that's up to you, but stop twisting text to make it fit or suggesting the word of God does not stand the test of time. MAN does this, NOT God!!!

Astagfurillah

Hana

[krypton6]

Whoa brother!! Regardless of who is responsible for 911, Muslims, Al-Queda, or green leprechauns, to say these 3000 were NOT innocents in the eyes of Islam is TOTALLY WRONG!! There were babies on those planes, women, elderly and NON COMBATANTS! The same holds true for those inside the buildings and those below it. Islam does NOT permit the killing of innocents and non combatants even if they are ON the battlefield!! Remember the woman that was killed on the battlefield and what Prophet Muhammed, pbuh, said about that?

How can you even attempt to say these people were not innocents!!??!! Nowhere will you find it is ok to target civilians ANYWHERE in Islam!

Astagfurillah

Hana

You have no idea if children even were on those planes, nor have you got any idea if children were inside the two trading buildings.
Those people were unarmed but that doesnt mean that they were innocent civilians. Woman are not THAT holy in Islam! Condoleezza Rice, would you not kill her?

The people who died were not armed, but as I just mentioned; that does not mean that they were innocent.

1400 years ago on the battlefield, you had a sword and a army of men in front of you to kill. You had full controle of who you were going to stab with your sword, today you DONT! al-Qaida is not even capeable of fighting with weopens, they did the only thing they could! They couldn't chose who to kill and who not to kill, but the prophet and who ever lived in his age could chose!

How can you call the people who pay the forces that traumatize muslims, innocent civilians? YOU CANT!

[*Hana*]

You have no idea if children even were on those planes, nor have you got any idea if children were inside the two trading buildings.
Those people were unarmed but that doesnt mean that they were innocent civilians. Woman are not THAT holy in Islam! Condoleezza Rice, would you not kill her?

The people who died were not armed, but as I just mentioned; that does not mean that they were innocent.

1400 years ago on the battlefield, you had a sword and a army of men in front of you to kill. You had full controle of who you were going to stab with your sword, today you DONT! al-Qaida is not even capeable of fighting with weopens, they did the only thing they could! They couldn't chose who to kill and who not to kill, the prophet and who ever lived at his age could chose!

How can you call the people who pay the forces that traumatize muslims, innocent civilians? YOU CANT!

I do know there were babies on those planes. And every Muslim living in America paying taxes has contributed to those forces, so by your definition and logic, it's ok that Muslims are killed. UNARMED MEANS NON COMBATANTS!! THEY DID NOT TAKE UP ARMS NOR DID THEY SHOW AGGRESSION TOWARDS ANY ISLAMIC COUNTRY!!

No, I would not systematically kill Rice unless she was attacking me or my people in my land. PERIOD! And, my dear brother, I suggest you look at the status of women in Islam and learn why Prophet Muhammed did not permit the killing of innocent women, children and the elderly. It has nothing to do with them being Holy! The Qur'an was revealed 1400 years ago and still stands true today and to say different is putting you outside the folds of Islam!! Does it mean that I can eat pork now because it is properly raised in clean environments today? Can I, as a woman, be the head of my household because times have changed, according to Islam? Can I stand alone as a witness now that times have changed?

Brother, I will not argue about this with you. I told you what I feel is right and I strongly suggest you look into it deeper on your own.

I hope and pray, Allah, swt, will continue to guide us both. Ameen

Wasalam,
Hana

[krypton6]

And every Muslim living in America paying taxes has contributed to those forces, so by your definition and logic, it's ok that Muslims are killed. UNARMED MEANS NON COMBATANTS!! THEY DID NOT TAKE UP ARMS NOR DID THEY SHOW AGGRESSION TOWARDS ANY ISLAMIC COUNTRY!!

No it is a different with american muslims, because american muslims moved to america in the hope for a better life. Most asians didnt specifically chose america as their home, america was what they could move to at the time that they ran for their lives.

But those muslims who chose to live in america are equal to the americans.
If my mother was killed in tomorrow I would be mad and sad, but I would understand! She would be a victim of the war between the west and east, and I would accept the fact that she had to go.

Those "civilians" did not attack, but they payed and took care of the forces who are killing muslims every single day = They were not civilians!

They DID show agreesion towards islamic nations by supporting the existence of israel, by helping and supporting the terrorist state of israel.

No, I would not systematically kill Rice unless she was attacking me or my people in my land. PERIOD! The Qur'an was revealed 1400 years ago and still stands true today and to say different is putting you outside the folds of Islam!!

Rice has done just as much harm to the middle east as Bush, but then I suppose that you love Bush aswell. Rice is supporting Israel in every single way, she even supports the israeli civilian bombing. How can you say that she havent caused any harm to the middle east! she is directly supporting the people who kill the palestinians and iraqi's eveyr single day! She is a woman, is it against Islam to kill her? I dont think so!

You see your taking a verse and hadith and widing it out as it should not be!

It is haraam to kill a human unless they attacked you. When have Bin Laden ever attacked another country? He is defending his own people, he is not the one starting wars and conflicts.

You cant kill woman and children, but if there is no other way to achieve the better then it is not haraam! And we are talking about civilians! Those people were not innocent civilians!

If you could save the whole middle east if only you would kill 100 children and woman, would you not do it?

[*Hana*]

No it is a different with american muslims, because american muslims moved to america in the hope for a better life. Most asians didnt specifically chose america as their home, america was what they could move to at the time that they ran for their lives.

But those muslims who chose to live in america are equal to the americans.
If my mother was killed in tomorrow I would be mad and sad, but I would understand! She would be a victim of the war between the west and east, and I would accept the fact that she had to go.

Those "civilians" did not attack, but they payed and took care of the forces who are killing muslims every single day = They were not civilians!

They DID show agreesion towards islamic nations by supporting the existence of israel, by helping and supporting the terrorist state of israel.



Rice has done just as much harm to the middle east as Bush, but then I suppose that you love Bush aswell. Rice is supporting Israel in every single way, she even supports the israeli civilian bombing. How can you say that she havent caused any harm to the middle east! she is directly supporting the people who kill the palestinians and iraqi's eveyr single day! She is a woman, is it against Islam to kill her? I dont think so!

You see your taking a verse and hadith and widing it out as it should not be!

It is haraam to kill a human unless they attacked you. When have Bin Laden ever attacked another country? He is defending his own people, he is not the one starting wars and conflicts.

You cant kill woman and children, but if there is no other way to achieve the better then it is not haraam! And we are talking about civilians! Those people were not innocent civilians!

If you could save the whole middle east if only you would kill 100 children and woman, would you not do it?

Brother, I told you, I will not argue with you. I believe your views and understanding are totally outside the folds of Islam. You made accusations about me "loving Bush", so you have turned your hate tactics on to me. Take them somewhere else because I have no time for this and your twisted way of thinking. Believe as you wish.

May Allah,swt, guide you and us all. Ameen

Wasalam,
Hana

[Cognescenti]

Someone's account at LI is going to be sanitized very, very soon. There will be no trace of him (except on an NSA computer of course):thankyou:

BTW...I guess my memory is fading. Where were US forces engaged in active combat in a Muslim country before 9-11?

How about this guy Krypto? What was his rank in the US war machine?

SHABBIR AHMED Fishing Getaways



Shabbir Ahmed had worked as a waiter in his share of swank city restaurants since immigrating from Bangladesh in 1981, but Windows on the World was such a favorite that he stayed 11 years. His son Thanbir, 16, thinks it was because the management and customers treated him the same way he treated them: nicely and politely. Also, he was earning a salary that made his dream in life -- providing a college education for his three children -- a real option; his oldest daughter, 19, attends Brooklyn College.

Fishing excursions to Gerritsen Creek and Sheepshead Bay were his favorite getaways: they reminded him of his boyhood. While he preferred to let his wife, Jeba, and his children clean whatever trout, catfish or bluefish he caught, he did lend a hand with the grilling.

When Mr. Ahmed, 44, was not off fishing in his leisure hours, he was tending to the backyard vegetable garden in Marine Park, Brooklyn, a responsibility he traded with his brother on an annual basis. This summer it was his turn: chilies, squash, eggplant and tomatoes made up this year's crop, but not all of them flourished. It seems he was more vigilant pursuing fish than he was yanking weeds and spreading fertilizer.

[islamirama]

Yes, keep believing in tall tales. You love any lie that justifies you hate. I had hoped the hajj would get you closer to god and further from hate. Those hopes faded really fast.

Your one million murdered is just your standard distortion to justify your hate.

But what ever the real number is, I find it totally unjustified.

The difference between you and me is that I'm not a bald faced lier who hates my country and every thing that does not suite my beliefs.

The hajj inshallah was to make me more humble and better muslim, not a lover and supporter of the oppressors you continue to defend with your lies.

Go look up how many really died in iraq, i'm sure you can do a good job if you have a brain rather then keep showing us those pathetic fake numbers of your terrorists state.

The difference between you and me is that I call it as i see and you continue to defend your terrorist war criminals shamelessly without honor.

[krypton6]

BTW...I guess my memory is fading. Where were US forces engaged in active combat in a Muslim country before 9-11?

Palestine, Iraq, Kuwait, Not to mention that you have removed nearly all muslim governments and replaced them with american allied betraying dictators.

[The_Prince]

Five American soldiers killed in the city of Mosul:

Five American soldiers were killed Monday by a roadside bomb in the northern city of Mosul, described as one of al-Qaida in Iraq's last strongholds, just days after a house explosion and suicide attack killed as many as 60 people there. Insurgents in a nearby mosque opened fire on other soldiers in the patrol after the roadside bombing, prompting a fierce gunbattle as U.S. and Iraqi troops secured the area, the military said. Iraqi soldiers entered the mosque but the gunmen had already fled, according to the statement.

Iraqi army reinforcements have moved into position near the city, 225 miles northwest of Baghdad, ahead of a planned offensive announced by Iraqi Prime Minister Nouri al-Maliki. ` Monday's deaths raised to at least 36 the number of American troop deaths reported this month, an increase from the 23 recorded in December in one of the lowest monthly totals since the war started in March 2003.

Iraqi police in Mosul, the capital of Ninevah province, reported clashes between U.S.-Iraqi forces and gunmen in a middle-class Sunni neighborhood believed to be an insurgent stronghold.

An officer, speaking on condition of anonymity because he was not authorized to release the information, said three civilians were wounded and helicopters had bombarded buildings in the southeastern Sumar neighborhood, which has seen frequent attacks on U.S. and Iraqi forces that have led to a series of raids.

"The insurgents are willing to desecrate a place of worship by using it to attack soldiers to further their agenda," said Maj. Peggy Kageleiry, a U.S. military spokeswoman in northern Iraq.

U.S. commanders describe Mosul as the last major urban center with a significant al-Qaida presence since the terror network has been driven from its strongholds in the capital and Anbar province.

The U.S. military has said Iraqi security forces will take the lead in Mosul — a major test of Washington's plan to, at an undetermined date, shrink the American force and leave it as backup for Iraqi security forces.

The Iraqi Red Crescent Organization, meanwhile, gave a higher death toll than Iraqi officials from Wednesday's devastating house explosion. The U.S. military said the cause of the blast has yet to be determined, although Iraqi officials were quick to blame al-Qaida.

Bolstering that claim, a suicide attacker killed a top police official and two other officers as they toured the wreckage the next day.

The relief organization said more than 60 people were killed and 280 wounded based on estimates from relatives who buried victims without officially registering them. Iraqi officials in Mosul maintain that nearly 40 were killed and more than 200 wounded.


http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080128/ap_on_re_mi_ea/iraq

[krypton6]

Not al-Qaida. If this happend in a sunni area, the shia millits would the the ones to blame and if it happend in a shia area it would be the sunnis that you would have to blaim.

Bin Laden is the leader of Al-Qaida! Look through every single one of his videos and you will always here his appeal to the iraqis to stop killing each other and instead start killing the real enemies.

He is the leader of al-Qaida = this was not done by al-Qaida.

Regarding deaths, us soldiers could easely have killed a bunch of suspected civilians as they usually do on their way, so those 40-100 might aswell have bin killed by the marines.

The Iraqi Body Counter, is a shia iraqi government organization counting the deaths of iraqi's. If this attack was done by shias which is very typical and common, the iraqi shia regime would simply lie and accuse al-Qaida as they usually do.
The shia millits are allied with the iraqi shia regime, at day they are the government and at night they are a group of shia millits causing harm to sunni's.

Your putting me in a sittuation that I dont want to be in, I'm not with al-Qaida! They've done more harm to me than what they have done to you, I'm just telling the truth as I and my people believe it.

[The_Prince]

Car Bomb Targets US patrol in Mosul:

A suicide car bomber targeted a U.S. patrol Tuesday in Mosul, killing at least one Iraqi and wounding as many as 15, the military and police said, a day after a roadside bomb killed five American soldiers in the increasingly lawless northern city.

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At a U.S. base outside Mosul, scores of U.S. troops and an honor guard stood at attention on the airfield tarmac as five coffins of their slain comrades were loaded onto a plane for the journey home.

A cold wind blew as the bleak ceremony began. Five groups of eight pallbearers each took turns unloading a flag-draped coffin from the back of five Humvee ambulances, as about 75 members of the fallen soldiers' unit stood at attention.

At least 100 other soldiers stood erect and silent through the 30-minute ceremony. Even civilian workers at the airport of Forward Operating Base Marez on the outskirts of Mosul formed an honor line as the dead soldiers bodies' were loaded into a gray C-130 transport plane.

Soldiers refused permission to photograph the ceremony, saying the pain of the sudden loss of five comrades was too great, and that not all the families had been notified.

"President Bush should be out here watching this ramp ceremony to see what it is really like," said one soldier, who asked not to be identified.

"The people who created this war need to be thinking about the families of these 18-year-olds who are dying."

In the attack that killed the five Americans, a roadside bomb blew apart a Humvee and gunmen opened fire from a mosque. A fierce gunbattle erupted as U.S. and Iraqi soldiers secured the area, the military said. Iraqi troops entered the mosque but the insurgents had fled, according to a statement.

Monday's attack on the American patrol was the deadliest roadside bombing since Nov. 5, when four soldiers were killed by a blast that destroyed their Humvee in the northern Tamim province.

It was the deadliest single attack since six soldiers perished Jan. 9 in a booby-trapped house north of Baghdad.

With the deaths, the Pentagon is reporting at least 36 U.S. troops killed in January — 56 percent higher than December's 23 U.S. military deaths and the first monthly increase since August. But the figures remain well below monthly death tolls of more than 100 last spring.

There was other fighting in the neighborhood. An Iraqi officer, declining to be identified because he was not authorized to release the information, said three civilians were wounded and helicopters bombarded buildings in the district, the scene of frequent attacks on U.S. and Iraqi forces.

Also Monday, insurgents attacked four policemen heading home from work south of Mosul, killing two and wounding the other two, Nineveh provincial police said.

Iraqi reinforcements, along with helicopters, tanks and armored vehicles, have converged on Mosul for what Prime Minister Nouri al-Maliki pledged would be a decisive battle against al-Qaida in its last major urban stronghold.

In the Tuesday morning suicide attack in Mosul, the bomber detonated his explosives-laden car, killing one civilian and wounding 15 others in a predominantly Sunni area in eastern Mosul, a police officer said, speaking on condition of anonymity because he was not authorized to release the information.

The U.S. military said no American casualties were reported.

Tensions in Mosul, Iraq's third largest city, have spiked after an explosion last week in an abandoned apartment that authorities say was used to stash insurgents' weapons and bombs. As many as 60 were killed and 200 injured.

The unrest in Mosul stands in sharp contrast to a significant decline in bloodshed most elsewhere in Iraq in recent months. The relative calm has been credited to a U.S.-led security crackdown — along with a Sunni revolt against al-Qaida in Iraq and a cease-fire order by radical Shiite cleric Muqtada al-Sadr for his powerful Mahdi Army militia.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080129/ap_on_re_mi_ea/iraq

i found the american soldiers comment towards bush the most interesting part of the article!

[krypton6]

If you want me to read the article, point out the important and cut it so it is not a whole book that I have to read and respond too.

[The_Prince]

If you want me to read the article, point out the important and cut it so it is not a whole book that I have to read and respond too.

erm thats small enough, thats not even the entire article.

[krypton6]

For you it is for me it is not, and since this is for me then you should care about me.

Its only a bit less than the entire article on yahoo.

[The_Prince]

For you it is for me it is not, and since this is for me then you should care about me.

Its only a bit less than the entire article on yahoo.

a suicide car bomber attacked an american patrol, one Iraqi was killed. also the americans burried 5 of their dead who died in yesterday's roadside bombing, and one of the soldiers who was present at the funeral told Bush he should come and see what is happening, and that the people who started the Iraq war need to take responsibility. all of this in Mosul.

[krypton6]

Ok thank you prince, now what's your point with this article?

I'm just wondering if the soldier who said a bit in the interview, is actually against the Iraq war, then how come he chose to fight in Iraq and is chosing to stay?

Its not like he will be executed if he refuses to fight and go out of the base.

[The_Prince]

Ok thank you prince, now what's your point with this article?

I'm just wondering if the soldier who said a bit in the interview, is actually against the Iraq war, then how come he chose to fight in Iraq and is chosing to stay?

Its not like he will be executed if he refuses to fight and go out of the base.

this WHOLE thread which i started is about the 'final' battle in Mosul as Maliki said, hence i am daily updating it with ground events happening in the 'battle' of Mosul.

Yesterday i posted the article showing a road-side bomb killed 5 american soldiers, and another attack killed 2 iraqi soldiers. today i post this attack, all taking place in Mosul.

[krypton6]

ooooooooooooooooooooooooooo I understand now. I had no idea, I'm just talking about al-Qaida's role in Iraq, and the usual iraqi politics.

[The_Prince]

yup, its not been a good start to the battle for al-maliki.

[Ninth_Scribe]

OMG is there any thing that you know? (Try Google)

Don't try Google. And don't believe everything you hear. There was a time when people repeated all sorts of statements they had no way to confirm, like that the Earth was flat. But that doesn't make it so. I was this man's sworn enemy... until I learned that I was lied to... and he wasn't the one who was doing all the lying!

The Ninth Scribe

[Ninth_Scribe]

Ok thank you prince, now what's your point with this article?

I'm just wondering if the soldier who said a bit in the interview, is actually against the Iraq war, then how come he chose to fight in Iraq and is chosing to stay?

Its not like he will be executed if he refuses to fight and go out of the base.

The soldiers don't have a choice. And they don't trust anyone anymore. The ones who signed as National Guard (local service here) were sent to Iraq and one of my daughter's friends was shipped out a month ago. They don't care about the politicians, or who is right or who is wrong. They care about trying to stay alive through it all. Not all of them, but a lot of them... and unfortunately, there's no way the Mujahideen can tell the difference. It's very nasty... but we're stuck with the reality.

I myself tried to join the Air Force back in 1985 because they promised to pay for college tuition if I signed up for a two year deal. Knowing I was a woman competing in a man's field, I wanted to make sure I had a buffet of talents that would blow their minds... but they turned me down because I had children. I was so upset, I actually got mad at God, because there was just no way they could have said no to all that talent. But I've since learned that everything happens for a reason and there isn't a day that goes by now that I don't kiss the ground and thank God for messing that up, because I don't have to follow orders.

The Ninth Scribe

[wilberhum]

Don't try Google. And don't believe everything you hear. There was a time when people repeated all sorts of statements they had no way to confirm, like that the Earth was flat. But that doesn't make it so. I was this man's sworn enemy... until I learned that I was lied to... and he wasn't the one who was doing all the lying!

The Ninth Scribe

OMG you think al-Zarqawi is one of the good guys?

[Ninth_Scribe]

OMG you think al-Zarqawi is one of the good guys?

You knew that!

The Ninth Scribe

[Ninth_Scribe]

Brother, I told you, I will not argue with you. I believe your views and understanding are totally outside the folds of Islam.

Wasalam,
Hana

You two should not do this. Hana Aku, it isn't for you to judge because you're not a soldier and every religion says it's wrong to kill... but they ALL make exceptions for War. This is a very complex issue concerning what it lawful during a time of war. Palestine was invaded and having lost a few battles with the state that is called Israel, does not remove the grounds for the War. Palestinian innocents were killed. Muslim soldiers call it an eye for an eye and American soldiers call it collateral damage... but they each understand the principle.

Anyway, this is a matter for scholars who are well studied in legal warfare. It isn't for any of us to decide.

The Ninth Scribe

[Keltoi]

You two should not do this. Hana Aku, it isn't for you to judge because you're not a soldier and every religion says it's wrong to kill... but they ALL make exceptions for War. This is a very complex issue concerning what it lawful during a time of war. Palestine was invaded and having lost a few battles with the state that is called Israel, does not remove the grounds for the War. Palestinian innocents were killed. Muslim soldiers call it an eye for an eye and American soldiers call it collateral damage... but they each understand the principle.

Anyway, this is a matter for scholars who are well studied in legal warfare. It isn't for any of us to decide.

The Ninth Scribe

It takes a scholar to decide what is right or wrong?

[Ninth_Scribe]

It takes a scholar to decide what is right or wrong?

What, did you think these Muslim armies were run by the soldiers? Who do you think commands them?

The Ninth Scribe

[*Hana*]

You two should not do this. Hana Aku, it isn't for you to judge because you're not a soldier and every religion says it's wrong to kill... but they ALL make exceptions for War. This is a very complex issue concerning what it lawful during a time of war. Palestine was invaded and having lost a few battles with the state that is called Israel, does not remove the grounds for the War. Palestinian innocents were killed. Muslim soldiers call it an eye for an eye and American soldiers call it collateral damage... but they each understand the principle.

Anyway, this is a matter for scholars who are well studied in legal warfare. It isn't for any of us to decide.

The Ninth Scribe

Gimme a break.

[Cognescenti]

.... Muslim soldiers call it an eye for an eye and American soldiers call it collateral damage... but they each understand the principle.

The Ninth Scribe

Everyone knows what an "eye for an eye" means. It's from Exodus. It's translated from Hebrew. The use in this context is, therefore, somewhat amusing. Your equation of that expression with the phrase "collateral damage" is either ignorant or purposely offensive. I am guessing the latter, but I could be wrong.

[MTAFFI]

What, did you think these Muslim armies were run by the soldiers? Who do you think commands them?

The Ninth Scribe

I know that you believe otherwise, but the actions by those fighting in these wars do not appear islamic to me, and I hope you arent saying that Allah is the one commanding them... I know that Allah would never command anyone to commit suicide or kill a single civilian or fellow muslim. It is very simply put in the Quran, to try to decifer it to fit ones own agenda is wrong and against the will of Allah. No sense in arguing though, which is why I agree with Hana_Aku.....we will all know in the end though

Peace

[krypton6]

The soldiers don't have a choice. And they don't trust anyone anymore. The ones who signed as National Guard (local service here) were sent to Iraq and one of my daughter's friends was shipped out a month ago. They don't care about the politicians, or who is right or who is wrong. They care about trying to stay alive through it all. Not all of them, but a lot of them... and unfortunately, there's no way the Mujahideen can tell the difference. It's very nasty... but we're stuck with the reality.

So at the time those soldiers were told that they would be send down to Iraq, would they be forced to if refusing? Are they forced to drive the humvee while holding up the M15? You see I cant agree with you here, for its not like they will be prisoned for 10 years or executed if they refuse to follow their orders.

Back in Iraq you would be executed for the smallest things, but in america and the west your not going to be prisoned for 10 years or executed if you refuse to do as your told to do. The way I see it those soldiers have chosen to fight in Iraq.

I myself tried to join the Air Force back in 1985 because they promised to pay for college tuition if I signed up for a two year deal. Knowing I was a woman competing in a man's field, I wanted to make sure I had a buffet of talents that would blow their minds... but they turned me down because I had children. I was so upset, I actually got mad at God, because there was just no way they could have said no to all that talent. But I've since learned that everything happens for a reason and there isn't a day that goes by now that I don't kiss the ground and thank God for messing that up, because I don't have to follow orders.

The Ninth Scribe

Well regardless of the reasons that one would join the army, your still chosing it. As a human I feel sorry for those good soldiers who die such as some one as you probably, but as a soldier I dont feel sorry at all because you attacked my country and your one of the many wheels driving the Bush vehicle.

[krypton6]

These insurgents, Hamas, al-Qaida and what there may be left are not fighting in the name of god or for the sake of god, they are fighting for the sake of their people, for the sake of muslims, this is political, it has nothing to do with religion other than being 2 worlds with different religions fighting each other.

[MTAFFI]

So at the time those soldiers were told that they would be send down to Iraq, would they be forced to if refusing? Are they forced to drive the humvee while holding up the M15? You see I cant agree with you here, for its not like they will be prisoned for 10 years or executed if they refuse to follow their orders.

Back in Iraq you would be executed for the smallest things, but in america and the west your not going to be prisoned for 10 years or executed if you refuse to do as your told to do. The way I see it those soldiers have chosen to fight in Iraq.

Well regardless of the reasons that one would join the army, your still chosing it. As a human I feel sorry for those good soldiers who die such as some one as you probably, but as a soldier I dont feel sorry at all because you attacked my country and your one of the many wheels driving the Bush vehicle.

What is Al-qaeda doing for the middle east? What are these forces doing other than blowing up market places, desecrating places of worship, forcing the people to live in fear, destroying infrastructure and causing the US troops to stay longer? They certainly arent putting any dent in the American military, you are talking about a military with 2 million active duty personell, whats their death count up to now? 5k maybe? I dont even really keep track because the number is so insignificant, what do we have maybe 20k injured? What is the goal of this terrorist group that you seem to support? To drive the US out of Iraq? To drive them from Afghanistan? To "wipe Israel from the map"? What is their purpose and what have they accomplished? It isnt even a real war, our soldier are policing Iraq to try and protect the innocents from idiots with their hands tied to the wheel of an exploding truck, and how do you police that? You cant, so if victory for these terrorist groups in the M.E. is being able to successfully kill themselves and 50 other non combatants, then congratulations, you win, you are the best I have ever seen at it. If victory is getting rid of Israel, then sorry for your luck, because you arent even fighting in the right place! If victory is controlling Iraq, then sorry for you because the Iraqis join in higher number every day to drive these terrorist morons from their land, and they are fighting on the side of US troops! If victory is taking back Afghanistan, then good luck because there are barely any troops there and they have managed to keep the Taliban away from office.

What is the goal here? I dont support the war in Iraq, I wish the US troops were not there, but those people have to have support and help against this senseless violence, because our country created certain conditions. It is a moral obligation. Again, what is the goal? How is it being attained? Who is being oppressed? By whom are they directly oppressed? If these are too many questions please just say, I am just trying to get some insight into your way of thinking because quite frankly it astonishes me

[Ninth_Scribe]

Well regardless of the reasons that one would join the army, your still chosing it. As a human I feel sorry for those good soldiers who die such as some one as you probably, but as a soldier I dont feel sorry at all because you attacked my country and your one of the many wheels driving the Bush vehicle.

Yes, they would go to prison if they deserted. Personally, I would have chosen prison before attacking Afghanistan and Iraq. Fortunately for me, I was spared all that. No, I don't blame you for the way you feel. I doubt anyone with half a heart would blame you for the way you feel. It is your duty to defend your country, both in the religion and in the political institution, which I'm not sure is really any different. My prayers are with you.

The Ninth Scribe

[krypton6]

What is Al-qaeda doing for the middle east? What are these forces doing other than blowing up market places, desecrating places of worship, forcing the people to live in fear, destroying infrastructure and causing the US troops to stay longer?

al-Qaida have never blown up markets, this is a corrupt thing that the shia government keeps making up when ever a attack takes place in a sunni neighborhood, and ofcourse america agree's on it even though no evidence is found. The shia government blaims al-Qaida for everything in order to save the asses of the shia millits who are fighting and killing sunnis in the middle.

Al-Qaida attacked a shia mosque a few years ago, but nobody ever mentions why they did so. The same shia mosque was home to hundreds of shia millits who weekly broke into sunni mosques in the sunni neighborhoods, kidnap the imam and burn down the mosque, and guess what they do with the sunni imam after having kidnapped him? They have never destroyed any iraqi building in such, they only attack government buildings and military buildings.

People in Iraq are afraid of al-Qaida not because of their name, but because they dont know them. Iraqi's know each other, but they dont know a bunch of foreign fighters, at least the people dont but the millits and insurgents on the other hand know them quite well, especially the sunni millits are in fact supporting al-Qaida, but they have a bit of a conflict today due to the shias in the south.

It is the shia millits who bomb do all this suicide bombing in the middle of the streets, and and as revenge some sunni's do the same, which is ofcourse also wrong. But as I said; Al-Qaida are not the ones to blaim for these civilian suicide killing.

They certainly arent putting any dent in the American military, you are talking about a military with 2 million active duty personell, whats their death count up to now? 5k maybe? I dont even really keep track because the number is so insignificant, what do we have maybe 20k injured? What is the goal of this terrorist group that you seem to support? To drive the US out of Iraq? To drive them from Afghanistan? To "wipe Israel from the map"? What is their purpose and what have they accomplished?

They certainly are killing american soldiers daily and casuing alot of harm to the shia regime and not least america. The american government claims the death count to be just around 5k, but who the hell believes them? Why on earth would they give the real number, if it was lets say 10.000+? Such number being officially recognized will just make the al-Qaida and the insurgents to look stronger and america weaker. Only a fool would give the real number of american deaths.

al-Qaida has offered peace to america and the rest of the west so many times, but each time they have bin ignored.
America are taking over every single anti-israeli nation on this planet, Saddam was against israel what happend to him?

Tell me one arab leader that is strongly against israel today, there arent many left because they have all bin removed and replaces with american and western allies, we call them the betrayers. The leaders that are against israel all happend to be hated by the west and america, and they all rule a country that is awaiting a western or american invasion.

al-Qaida's goal is to kill and harm americans as much as possible til the point of where they have fully left the islamic nations.

I fully support the insurgents in Iraq, but I dont support the 9/11. Not really because of the people who died but because the strike caused much more harm to the muslims than what it did any good for, so I agree with you when you say "what have they acomplished?".

We all have the same dream, but al-Qaida is trying to make that dream reality through a ineffective way that does not seem to be working.

It isnt even a real war, our soldier are policing Iraq to try and protect the innocents from idiots with their hands tied to the wheel of an exploding truck, and how do you police that? You cant, so if victory for these terrorist groups in the M.E. is being able to successfully kill themselves and 50 other non combatants, then congratulations, you win, you are the best I have ever seen at it.

By "our" soldiers do you mean the americans? My friend from my experience and others I know that most soldiers in Iraq are doing absolutely nothing to rebuild the nation and help the people, instead they walk around and cause harm to iraqi civilians while making fun of them.

America has replaced the Saddam regime with a just as barbaric Shia regime who are supporting the civilian suicide bombing in the sunni neighborhoods.
So how can you say that the american soldiers are protecting the iraqi's from civilian suicide bombing, when what they in fact are doing is supporting the people who do so everyday.

You clearly dont know anything about these "terrorist" groups, who you believe to be al-Qaida, believing that they are the ones who keep suicide bombing civilians. You need to know the ideology of these "terrorists", many americans have done so and guess what they are doing now.

If victory is getting rid of Israel, then sorry for your luck, because you arent even fighting in the right place! If victory is controlling Iraq, then sorry for you because the Iraqis join in higher number every day to drive these terrorist morons from their land, and they are fighting on the side of US troops! If victory is taking back Afghanistan, then good luck because there are barely any troops there and they have managed to keep the Taliban away from office.

You arent fighting in the right place but your fighting the right enemy, your fighting the fundamental of israel; America. Remove America and there will be no israel! Not to mention that enough people are already fighting against Israel.

Victory is not to controle Iraq, victory is to stop the american imperialism inside of the islamic nations. Only the shia iraqi's are against al-Qaida, the sunni's arent! But currently as I mentioned above, some sunni millits do currently have a bit of a problem with al-Qaida, because of al-Qaida being the enemies of america, and themselves getting military support from america in order to protect the sunni neighborhoods and prevent shia millits from entering and killing sunni's. (this is a complicated conflict but I can explain if you wish).

The Kurds do not care since they arent iraqi, the shias only support america because america have given Iraq to a shia regime, but the sunni's? The sunni's in Iraq HATE the marines, but thanks to the shia regime the sunni's are in need of american military support in order to protect themselves from the shia millits entering the sunni neighborhoods to kill sunni civilians. This is what makes people believe that sunni's are allied with america, but in fact they arent, they have no other choice as it stands today!

What is the goal here? I dont support the war in Iraq, I wish the US troops were not there, but those people have to have support and help against this senseless violence, because our country created certain conditions. It is a moral obligation. Again, what is the goal? How is it being attained? Who is being oppressed? By whom are they directly oppressed? If these are too many questions please just say, I am just trying to get some insight into your way of thinking because quite frankly it astonishes me

I dont know if I support it or not, what the americans have brought to Iraq is equal to the pain Saddam brought just to give you an idea of how succesful they have bin. I thank america for having removed the Saddam regime but ever since that they have done nothing good to Iraq.

The violence was brought to Iraq, it wasent there before and who do you think brought it to Iraq? No it wasent al-Qaida.

__________________________________________________ __________________________________________________ ______________________________

The goal now for the "terrorists" is to harm the troops and put as much pressur as possible on america, in order to change the mind of the americans back home. In order to make the americans realise that america is not spreading democratism but instead dictatorship.

Make them realise that israel is wrong, make them realise that america's support to israel and not least to the arab dictators is wrong! Make them realise that this is what al-Qaida is against, remove all this and there will be no al-Qaida, no future 9/11's and no future war between the west and the middle east.

If al-Qaida and the insurgents do nothing what will the americans believe? They will start believing that what ever america is doing in the world must be the right thing, they will start supporting israel even more and they will start thinking that america is saving the whole world. Without al-Qaida, people would think that muslims actually support the arab leaders, support israel, and support america, but that is far from the truth.

Make them realise that america is wrong!

[Ninth_Scribe]

Gimme a break.

Hmm... odd kind of peace. So if someone tries to steal your house, you'd let them because... they're willing to fight you for it... and you're not?

Then only the a******* like Bush would rule the world.

The Ninth Scribe