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Ahmed_Yaseen
10-15-2005, 11:17 AM
:sl:

Sounds shocking, but this may be the future that Western Muslims face. Such is the level of hatred towards Islam in parts of the West.


Dutch Unveil the Toughest Face in Europe with a Ban on the Burka
Source: TimesOnline

From Anthony Browne in Brussels

The 'time of cosy tea-drinking' with Muslims is over, says the minister who would ban the burka (ROBERT VOS/EPA)

THE Netherlands is likely to become the first country in Europe to ban the burka, under government proposals that would bring in some of the toughest curbs on Muslim clothing in the world.

The country’s hardline Integration Minister, Rita Verdonk, known as the Iron Lady for her series of tough anti-immigration measures, told Parliament that she was going to investigate where and when the burka should be banned. The burka, traditional clothing in some Islamic societies, covers a woman’s face and body, leaving only a strip of gauze for the eyes.

Mrs Verdonk gave warning that the “time of cosy tea-drinking” with Muslim groups had passed and that natives and immigrants should have the courage to be critical of each other. She recently cancelled a meeting with Muslim leaders who refused to shake her hand because she was a woman.

The proposals are likely to win the support of Parliament because of the expected backing by right-wing parties. But they have caused outrage among Muslim and human rights groups, who say that the Government is pandering to the far Right.

Mrs Verdonk admitted that a complete ban on the garment would be legally tricky because of freedom of religion legislation. However, she said that she would prohibit the garments “in specific situations” on grounds of public safety. The ban is likely to be enforced in shops, public buildings, cinemas, train and bus stations and airports, as well as on trains and buses.

The Netherlands has become preoccupied by Islamic terrorism after the investigation into the murder of the film-maker Theo van Gogh uncovered a network of Muslim extremists dedicated to destroying the country. Attention has turned to the burka because police authorities have become concerned that a terrorist could use one for concealment.

A government spokesman said: “We want to investigate when, how, in which places the burka should be banned. It is a safety measure — you don’t see who is in it.” The Government cites as a precedent existing football legislation, which bans people from entering football grounds covering their faces in scarves.

Yassim Hertog, a vice-president of the Muslim School Boards Union, said: “Can you prohibit someone from wearing a certain type of dress? They are trying to test what a government can forbid, and how far you can go trampling on people’s rights. They want to show all these Dutch citizens who are sick and tired of all these ‘mutant’ citizens, this is where we draw the line — get normal.”

Muslim groups insist that only a few dozen women in the Netherlands wear the burka, and that the ban is a distraction. The Muslims and Government Contact Body said: “Only a handful of Muslims actually wear burkas. Let us focus our energy on what we have in common. This is not a big problem.”

Last year two Muslim women lost a court case against their college that had banned them from wearing burkas during their social work and childcare course. The judge backed the college in its claim that children had to be able to see who was caring for them, prompting the women to drop the course.

Famile Arslan, the women’s lawyer, told The Times:

“Women have a very strong opinion about the burka. If you ban it they won’t leave the house. It is not a good way to integrate and emancipate Muslim women. Everything Muslims do is criticised by Verdonk. She is doing it to get votes. She doesn’t care about Muslims and their problems.”

Mrs Verdonk made the proposals after Geert Wilders, the right-wing MP, requested the ban. Mr Wilders claimed that the garment was unfriendly towards women and a threat to security.

Baroness Sarah Ludford MEP, on the European Parliament’s Civil Liberties Committee, who has been active in opposing bans on the hijab, or scarf, said that there were no arguments for banning the burka. “If there is a genuine belief that someone under a burka is a terrorist, then you invoke stop-and-search laws on the grounds of reasonable suspicion.”

The Netherlands would become the first European country to ban the wearing of the burka in public situations, although there are already some local bans. Last year several Belgian towns, including Antwerp and Ghent, banned the wearing of the burka in public, and recently started issuing £100 spot fines for breaking the municipal ordinance. Several towns in Italy, including Como, have invoked legislation introduced by Mussolini that bans hiding one’s face in public to impose fines on burka-wearers. France and several regions of Germany have followed Turkey and Tunisia in banning the wearing of the hijab, which leaves the face visible, in public buildings, most controversially in schools.


The French ban applies only inside government-owned buildings and was imposed to preserve the secular nature of the state.


SHIFT TO THE RIGHT

How the Netherlands has become less liberal:


* Immigrants must pass an exam on Dutch language and culture before being allowed to move to the Netherlands. That does not apply to immigrants from US, Canada, Australia, Japan and other EU states.

* Legal immigrants already there must take a Dutch language course at their own expense.

* Immigrants guilty of any minor crime, such as shoplifting, during their first three years in the country can be deported.

* People can bring in a husband or wife only once they are 24 years old, and do not depend on welfare benefits. The measures are aimed at curbing international arranged marriages.

* 26,000 illegal immigrants are being deported, some of whom have been in the country for ten years and have established families.

* Clampdown on foreign imams working in mosques. They must show their appreciation of Dutch values.

* Increase in sentences for a range of crimes, and introduction of “zero tolerance” policing to cities such as Rotterdam.


* Tightening of rules on cannabis-selling coffee-shops and zero-tolerance approach to infringements. About half the coffee shops in Amsterdam have closed.

* The Netherlands is still liberal in some ways, however. In 2001, the country became the first in the world to legalise gay marriages. The Netherlands still has liberal rules on euthanasia, recently extending it to severely handicapped babies and children
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S_87
10-15-2005, 12:27 PM
:sl:

poor sisters :'( May Allah Subhana Wa Ta`aala strengthen those sisters who do wear burka there! ameen.

this is opression :mad:

clamping down on foreign imams mean they want to clamp down on this terrorism. but that wont solve the problem

one place less for me to visit :p
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Bint Al Qital
10-15-2005, 12:29 PM
:omg: Ya Allah!

Thats torture...

Ameen, Thuma Ameen 2 your Dua's Sis :'(
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Lina
10-15-2005, 01:40 PM
:sl:

This article isn't completely right, quite over the top.
What Mrs. Verdonk says does not mean it will be taken as a law,
she just likes to make up new rules, nobody really listens to the woman anymore,
she's a bit nutty in a anti-Muslim kind of way,
every now and then she does come up with new 'rules' and no one in the parliament agrees with her (only her anti-Muslim friend 'Wilders') so it's most likely that her made-up rules don't even reach the big 'Law book'

Wasalaam Aleikoem wr wb.
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- Qatada -
10-15-2005, 01:55 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Lina
:sl:

This article isn't completely right, quite over the top.
What Mrs. Verdonk says does not mean it will be taken as a law,
she just likes to make up new rules, nobody really listens to the woman anymore,
she's a bit nutty in a anti-Muslim kind of way,
every now and then she does come up with new 'rules' and no one in the parliament agrees with her (only her anti-Muslim friend 'Wilders') so it's most likely that her made-up rules don't even reach the big 'Law book'

Wasalaam Aleikoem wr wb.

wa 'alykum asalam warahmatulahi wabarakatuh.

insha Allah they wont work.. we just have to remember that this life is nothin compared to the akhirah.. they will get what they deserve in the afterlife - so we should just remain steadfast, patient and have faith in Allah (swt).



wasalam o 'alykum warahmatulahi wabarakatuh.
Reply

Ahmed_Yaseen
10-15-2005, 06:51 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Lina
:sl:

This article isn't completely right, quite over the top.
What Mrs. Verdonk says does not mean it will be taken as a law,
she just likes to make up new rules, nobody really listens to the woman anymore,
she's a bit nutty in a anti-Muslim kind of way,
every now and then she does come up with new 'rules' and no one in the parliament agrees with her (only her anti-Muslim friend 'Wilders') so it's most likely that her made-up rules don't even reach the big 'Law book'

Wasalaam Aleikoem wr wb.
:sl:

JazakAllah for clarifying. I assume you know more about The Netherlands than I do. You see, the article said that "The Netherlands is likely to become the first country in Europe to ban the burka".

InshaAllah the proposal will not become law.

:w:
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Lina
10-15-2005, 08:01 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Ahmed_Yaseen
:sl:

JazakAllah for clarifying. I assume you know more about The Netherlands than I do. You see, the article said that "The Netherlands is likely to become the first country in Europe to ban the burka".

InshaAllah the proposal will not become law.

:w:
:sl:

I go through these issues everyday, that's all they care about in Holland/The Netherlands. Quite a shame but it's also the state of mind in most countries, their wish is to ban everything that has to do with Al Islam and Incha'Allah they won't succeed in their hatred. Islam phobia is what keeps them busy.
I say; let them worry their minds of, they will never succeed and Allah swt knows best (Allah ou a3lam)



format_quote Originally Posted by akhee
wa 'alykum asalam warahmatulahi wabarakatuh.

insha Allah they wont work.. we just have to remember that this life is nothin compared to the akhirah.. they will get what they deserve in the afterlife - so we should just remain steadfast, patient and have faith in Allah (swt).



wasalam o 'alykum warahmatulahi wabarakatuh.

Anas, may Allah be pleased with him, reported:
Allah's Prophet (may peace and blessings be upon him) said: There are three qualities, whoever is characterized by them will relish the sweetness of faith: One to whom Allah and His Messenger are dearer than all else; one who loves a man only for Allah's sake; and one who abhors returning to infidelity after Allah has rescued him from it as he abhors being cast into Hell.

:w:
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afriend2
10-16-2005, 12:09 PM
may Allah give her hidayah or punish her for what she is doing. inshAllah all us muslims and non-muslims will take a stand for this disgusting behaviour!
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Bittersteel
10-16-2005, 03:30 PM
Burka should be made mandatory for Non-Muslim women in Muslim countries.An eye for an eye.

:sl:
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razzzy101
10-16-2005, 03:41 PM
Inshalah they shall not ban this, if so i advice the muslims form the specific area to wear there bhurkha no matter what as the sahaba of the past took great torture for islam, follow or roots!!! Imaan!! strengthen it mulims!!!
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- Qatada -
10-16-2005, 05:45 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by razzzy101
Inshalah they shall not ban this, if so i advice the muslims form the specific area to wear there bhurkha no matter what as the sahaba of the past took great torture for islam, follow or roots!!! Imaan!! strengthen it mulims!!!
insha Allah they wont.. but us brothers need to grow up and become men! we need to be protectors of the sisters instead of running away... may Allah (swt) make us firm in faith and die for Allah (swt)'s sake only! ameen. summa ameen!


wasalam o 'alykum warahmatulahi wabarakatuh.
Reply

Salema
10-16-2005, 05:57 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by razzzy101
Inshalah they shall not ban this, if so i advice the muslims form the specific area to wear there bhurkha no matter what as the sahaba of the past took great torture for islam, follow or roots!!! Imaan!! strengthen it mulims!!!

I AGREE WITH U.. ;)
Reply

Halima
10-16-2005, 09:27 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by akhee
insha Allah they wont.. but us brothers need to grow up and become men! we need to be protectors of the sisters instead of running away... may Allah (swt) make us firm in faith and die for Allah (swt)'s sake only! ameen. summa ameen!


wasalam o 'alykum warahmatulahi wabarakatuh.

It's like they are running away from a golden opportunity by earning more good deeds. :p
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Din-al-Islam
10-17-2005, 02:48 AM
As-salaamu 'alaykum..

i read this in a newspaper on danish.. subhan'Allah i cant understand it.. try to think if they one day say that we can wear our hijab anymore.. subhan'Allah
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eyes_of_mine
10-19-2005, 02:16 AM
Such a proposal would start of with banning the burkha, then pretty soon it owuld be the niqab then hey presto its the hiajb, and then bingo 1 the jilbab, and the oppression will continue unless a strong enough stand is made against these so called politicans.

This article reminded me of the UK home secretary Charles crafty clark, just the other day I was watching him on BBC parliment channel , it was a board meeting about the new proposed terror laws, there was a panel of people , politicans and the likes questioning him about these new proposals.

Upon him being asked how can he justify the detention of 'terror suspects' for 3 months without charge, and certain members of the panel gave him good evidence of to many innocent people being held incorrectly and the possible future problems such a law could create ect ect. do you know what charles clarke line of defence was to this ?

Well firstly he tryed to be smart and blame the police and intelligence services for it, he said these agencys have asked for more time and he believes they are right. when this defence was broken by members of the panel, do you know what he said in absolute rightiousness ?

Charles Clark said WELL, in europe they held terror suspects for just as long and in some places even longer so what we are proposing is nothing unusual.

in conclusion to my point (and Im sorry if it was a bit long) when you look at other places in europe such as france and their hijab ban and potty politicains like this dutch woman trying to ban hijab, if they all continue to suceed before you can know it , we will find such bans like this coming into england and spreading through out the west, because as I just prooved our weak and spinless corrupt goverment here in UK are MORE than willing to use oppresive anti Islami laws in europe as an exscuse to invent and expand their own slimy Agenda of outlawing as much Islamic expression as possible.

glad I got that of my chest !
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Hajar
10-27-2005, 11:04 PM
:sl:

i have to agree what sis Lina said before.. this discussion happend a couple week ago..when Mrs Verdonk was telling about this so called new "rule" of her.
But like Lina said time hast past and nobody is talking about burka ban anymore.. she just like to get in the spotlights now and then.. maybe she gets somekinda kick out of it .. and like to make muslims the discussion of the week.. so that she can intimidate us.. what never gonna happen.

:w:
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Ahmed_Yaseen
10-27-2005, 11:59 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Hajar
:sl:
.. she just like to get in the spotlights now and then.. maybe she gets somekinda kick out of it .. and like to make muslims the discussion of the week.. so that she can intimidate us.. what never gonna happen.
:w:
:w:

I don't think it is about getting some kind of kick out of it.
I think these days the right-of-centre parties in Europe and Australia think they just need to do some Muslim-bashing to win votes. We have become a punchbox for the rightwing parties.

:w:
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