Imam receives death threats for preaching evolution

**Hiroshi** · 03-08-2011

Usama Hasam, an imam who leads the Friday prayers at the Masjid al-Tawhid mosque in Leyton received death threats after preaching that Islam and the theory of evolution are compatible.

The full story is reported here:

http://www.thisislondon.co.uk/standa...g-evolution.do

Leaving aside the question of whether the theory of evolution is right or wrong, I wondered if any members of this forum have observed similar reactions of intolerance from authorities within Islam over this issue. I am surprised that this controversy seems to be so inflammatory. All of the Muslims that I have spoken to tell me that they believe in animal evolution although not in human evolution. But they do not attach much importance to such beliefs whether for or against Darwin's theory.

Is there then a sharp division now between modern thinking Muslims and more traditionally minded ones over the importance of this question? I would appreciate anyone who could comment on this.

**GuestFellow** · 03-08-2011

I personally have no problem with evolution.

Whatever the Imam's views might be, he should not be receiving death threats.

**Zuzubu** · 03-08-2011

That is wrong, and evolution is a teory and it dosn't go against Islam.

**Hiroshi** · 03-08-2011

Originally Posted by Guestfellow

I personally have no problem with evolution.

Whatever the Imam's views might be, he should not be receiving death threats.

I was shocked by the news. But maybe then all of this fuss is being stirred up by only a minority with extreme views and standards?

**Hiroshi** · 03-08-2011

Originally Posted by Zuzubu

That is wrong, and evolution is a teory and it dosn't go against Islam.

As I said, I am not concerned here with whether evolution is right or wrong. I just wonder what the generally accepted Islamic view is on this. And is this a new development or has there always been such violent disagreement?

**Huzzy_786** · 03-08-2011

I am speechless... :S

**جوري** · 03-08-2011

Originally Posted by Hiroshi

Is there then a sharp division now between modern thinking Muslims and more traditionally minded ones over the importance of this question?

It isn't a question of traditional vs. modern-- I don't understand why people such as yourself insist on using such terms? They're pretty vague to Muslims yet you expect us to build a dialogue on an already faulty premise? --
Either way what is an imam doing preaching theories and what are people doing threatening him about it? It is absurd on both grounds and I can't help but think there is so much more to this than what is being reported.. I believe just a great part of this schism that is being deliberately created with one intention in mind..

**aadil77** · 03-08-2011

Why is everyone so shocked? This is a man that has been persistent in his deviant views, he suggested that adam (a.h) had actual parents - who may have evolved from monkeys. Also made comments suggesting hijab is not compulsary.

The only reason he's getting death threats is because he won't leave his masjid even after huge petitions for him to get out. This has been going on for years.

**aadil77** · 03-08-2011

Originally Posted by Hiroshi

As I said, I am not concerned here with whether evolution is right or wrong. I just wonder what the generally accepted Islamic view is on this. And is this a new development or has there always been such violent disagreement?

Islamically his views are deviant and innovations - which makes him no longer fit to lead at a masjid. Such views will not be tolerated, so either he leaves and preaches his views outside of the mosque or he continues for years and ends up facing death threats.

**جوري** · 03-08-2011

Originally Posted by aadil77

Why is everyone so shocked? This is a man that has been persistent in his deviant views, he suggested that adam (a.h) had actual parents - who may have evolved from monkeys. Also made comments suggesting hijab is not compulsary. The only reason he's getting death threats is because he won't leave his masjid even after huge petitions for him to get out. This has been going on for years.

I am not shocked.. I don't know who the hell he is.. the only thing I wanted to comment on was this 'traditional vs. modern' shbeal.. like extremist vs. moderate shbeal.. it is getting tired.. like you either have to be 'modernist' and accept that rocks sprung wings, sprung legs, sprung lungs sprung monkeys, sprung humans or you're a backward traditionalist.. I haven't seen any sane verifiable data based science enter the foyer .. just more meaningless words and alot of hoopla in the background.
I am a scientist, I hold a doctorate and have worked in research I have papers published (I Know how papers get published) I know that I can take the same set of data that I used to prove one thing to prove its exact opposite in a different period of time.. but even here we're not speaking of statistics and palpable variables we're speaking of unverifiable crap.. People don't even specify whether it is macro or micro-evolution they're speaking of before preaching crap or before feeling persecuted for preaching crap.. all they need to do is but spew and divide into categories.. it is baseless and pathetic!

**GuestFellow** · 03-08-2011

Why is everyone so shocked?

Not me. :X

I never heard of him until three hours ago.

Originally Posted by aadil77

Islamically his views are deviant and innovations - which makes him no longer fit to lead at a masjid. Such views will not be tolerated, so either he leaves and preaches his views outside of the mosque or he continues for years and ends up facing death threats.

I suspect there will be more Imams coming and preaching incorrect views. The government is going to be involved. Following David Cameron's speech there will be more attention drawn towards Islam and Muslims. I think Muslims should be careful of Islamic Institutions that receive public funding. This is because these institutions will represent the government views instead of Islamic principles...

Originally Posted by τhε ṿαlε'ṡ lïlÿ

I am not shocked.. I don't know who the hell he is.. the only thing I wanted to comment on was this 'traditional vs. modern' shbeal.. like extremist vs. moderate shbeal.. it is getting tired.. like you either have to be 'modernist' and accept that rocks sprung wings, sprung legs, sprung lungs sprung monkeys, sprung humans or you're a backward traditionalist.. I haven't seen any sane verifiable data based science enter the foyer .. just more meaningless words and alot of hoopla in the background.
I am a scientist, I hold a doctorate and have worked in research I have papers published (I Know how papers get published) I know that I can take the same set of data that I used to prove one thing to prove its exact opposite in a different period of time.. but even here we're not speaking of statistics and palpable variables we're speaking of unverifiable crap.. People don't even specify whether it is macro or micro-evolution they're speaking of before preaching crap or before feeling persecuted for preaching crap.. all they need to do is but spew and divide into categories.. it is baseless and pathetic!

Yes, I'm tired of this "moderate" vs "extremist" approach to these discussions. What do these terms even mean? -_-;;

**MartyrX** · 03-08-2011

I've never heard of him. He shouldn't be getting death threats at all.

**Ummu Sufyaan** · 03-08-2011

i would imagine that that's the same (or similar) treatment that a priest would receive if he were preaching the same thing, no? i mean doesn't evolution go against the main teachings of Christianity and therefore warrant the same reaction. what if it was something else which entailed going against the main beliefs of Christianity that a priest preached, wouldn't that cause a row among the true followers of Christianity? its not unusual that they would be offended. the death threat probably isn't the best and most agreeable (at all) option, though it may be understandable.

doesn't almost anything that goes against a system of belief (be it religious or otherwise) cause a the same reaction from followers? its not really anything new

the subject may change, but the concept generally stays the same.

**CosmicPathos** · 03-09-2011

Not surprised. Usama Hasan is not a biologist, yet he believes what the biologists have to say. And it seems he is convinced by the "evidence of evolution" that does exist. Seems the caliber of evidence required to convince Usama is pretty subclass. I wonder what his father feels about his son: son gone astray? perhaps, who knows.

As the Muslim world prospers economically and financially, and most importantly educationally, the number of ex-Muslim atheists (who happen to be quite educated) will increase. Sort of a scary phenomenon. What's scarier is the authority these atheists will assume in the realm of politics and such. That does seem to be quite an issue for the upcoming generations of humans in Pakistan. There are atheists living in Saudi Arabia (what I naively used to think the Islamic homeland) right now. Seems disbelief in God is as spread across humanity, across all religions and people of all color, as homosexuality is. I just continue to pray that there are no underlying genetic causes for these modes of thinking.

From personal experience, the alarming rate of emergence of atheists among educated Pakistanis did shock me few years ago but it was for my own benefit as it allowed me to read up on it. Recently, a US-educated medical doctor, whom I used to respect a lot for his experience and service in Karachi (Pakistan), told me that hes a "hard boiled egg and an atheist." He used to be quite religious in his prime, memorized parts of Quran, used to partake in religious service. I am not too sure now what to make of my previous emotions about him but it does seem to confirm my previous views regarding atheism in Muslim countries.

I am sure Turkey has something similar or something worse.

And I wonder why is Nature so interested in educational system reform of Pakistan regarding the preaching of evolution and what not. Seems to be an effort by the movers and shakers of scientific research (atheists) to influence the Muslim world. Maybe the works of dajjal. Here is the link to the published study. http://www.nature.com/nature/journal...l/461038a.html

There is this MIT educated atheist "genius" physicist in Pakistan Dr. Pervez Hoodhboy, whose been a leading voice in Pakistan and abroad in this regards. He self-proclaims to be a messiah who has arisen to unveil the religious orthodoxy of Islam and how it has been against science quoting examples of Umar bin alKhattab (ra) in which he apparently throws away books of a conquered nation into the waters.
his article for those interested: http://ptonline.aip.org/journals/doc...ml?bypassSSO=1

criticism of his book: http://www.islamicperspectives.com/R...ezHoodbhoy.htm

**Salafi1407** · 03-09-2011

Originally Posted by aadil77

Why is everyone so shocked? This is a man that has been persistent in his deviant views, he suggested that adam (a.h) had actual parents - who may have evolved from monkeys. Also made comments suggesting hijab is not compulsary.

The only reason he's getting death threats is because he won't leave his masjid even after huge petitions for him to get out. This has been going on for years.

I agree with this, I have heard of this extremely deviant guy. I mean obviously we can't make takfeer upon a person, but if a scholar sat down with him I do wonder what the results will be.

I am offended by the opening poster. He doesn't want to know about the topic itself but he is trying to highlight, or outline or point out that muslims are sending death threats - violent group of people.

**Hiroshi** · 03-09-2011

Originally Posted by aadil77

he suggested that adam (a.h) had actual parents - who may have evolved from monkeys.

Did he? I wasn't aware of that. Usually Muslims only accept animal evolution.

**Hiroshi** · 03-09-2011

Originally Posted by Ruhul

I am offended by the opening poster. He doesn't want to know about the topic itself but he is trying to highlight, or outline or point out that muslims are sending death threats - violent group of people.

Judge me offensive if you will. I am interested in Islamic beliefs since I meet many Muslims in my neighbourhood. I was more or less settled in my mind that Muslims accepted evolution (at least animal evolution) until I read this news. So I wondered if more knowledgeable people could explain things.

Now aadil77 has informed us that the imam was preaching human evolution, we have more light on the issue.

**Hiroshi** · 03-09-2011

Originally Posted by Ummu Sufyaan

doesn't almost anything that goes against a system of belief (be it religious or otherwise) cause a the same reaction from followers?

Yes, but I thought that Muslims, in general, accepted evolution. Now suddenly there are these outspoken ones who show that they do not. The issue must be over human evolution, not animal evolution.

**Hiroshi** · 03-09-2011

Originally Posted by τhε ṿαlε'ṡ lïlÿ

I can't help but think there is so much more to this than what is being reported.. I believe just a great part of this schism that is being deliberately created with one intention in mind..

Please explain more, Vale's Lily.

**Abu Junaid** · 03-09-2011

the issue is rather easy
1)what is the first stage in the evolution theory
2)what then is the first stage of a human being according to islam
if you can differentiate between this then it should be clear the division between theory and the islamic teachings

remember this though :darwin's theory is based on the so-called "Natural Selection"