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Is it permissible for female cousins & male cousins to hang out & direct message each

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  1. #1
    ab_maalik_9's Avatar
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    Is it permissible for female cousins & male cousins to hang out & direct message each

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    My attain talks her dad's side adopted cousins & hang out & direct message them .... I told I didn't like it & it's not permissible but I got told I can't cuts ties on kinship ? Please answer my questions

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    Abz2000's Avatar
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    Re: Is it permissible for female cousins & male cousins to hang out & direct message

    Are they forbidden to marry?
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    Is it permissible for female cousins & male cousins to hang out & direct message each

    Long ago has hope perished, as have our men of honor
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    Re: Is it permissible for female cousins & male cousins to hang out & direct message

    yes since cousins can marry, also adopted cousins are even more far away, theyre not allowed to communicate [other than about Islam] or free-mix

    keeping good kinship with association is amongst mahram members and not non-mahram; you just keep good general relations with non-mahram family members when association is unavoidable, but you keep it proper Islamic, no 'fun chat' etc,
    Last edited by AbdullahAziz; 07-17-2017 at 02:32 PM.
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    Re: Is it permissible for female cousins & male cousins to hang out & direct message

    So no hanging out alone or privately messaging 1 other .... no 1 on 1 outside the family gathering ??? I need the dawud to help out my situation?

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    Re: Is it permissible for female cousins & male cousins to hang out & direct message

    Quote Originally Posted by Abz2000 View Post
    Are they forbidden to marry?
    No they can get married ...
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    Hamza Asadullah's Avatar
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    Re: Is it permissible for female cousins & male cousins to hang out & direct message

    Quote Originally Posted by ab_maalik_9 View Post
    My attain talks her dad's side adopted cousins & hang out & direct message them .... I told I didn't like it & it's not permissible but I got told I can't cuts ties on kinship ? Please answer my questions

    Sent from my SM-J327P using IslamicBoard mobile app


    The following is a fatwa on Cousin interaction:

    Whichever male can marry a female according to the rules of Shariah have to observe the laws of hijaab from each other. It is not permissible for such males and females to freely intermingle with each other as there is a potential of them committing evil and immoral acts. It is permissible for cousins to marry each other.Therefore, male and female cousins must adhere to the laws of hijaab.

    Source:http://islamqa.org/hanafi/askimam/56...asting-as-well

    Therefore my brother it is not permissible to mix, intermingle or interact with cousins of the opposite gender beyond what is necessary and strict hijaab must be maintained between both sexes.

    And Allah knows best in all matters
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    Abz2000's Avatar
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    Re: Is it permissible for female cousins & male cousins to hang out & direct message

    First it's my respected ukhti,
    Then it's ukhti that I really like spending time chatting with,
    Then it's ukhti who I'm beginning to develop strong feelings for,
    Then it's getting to be real heart-warming every time I talk to her,
    Then it's ukhti I "love you for the sake of Allah",
    Then we're both really losing composure and respectability,
    Then it's lucky if we're seperated by a few oceans......

    There comes a time when both realise they have feelings for each other, that's when they have to put the brakes on and start respectable fiance mode, if they feel they can't live without each other, tell mum and dad to be lenient in compatibility comparison.

    Also explain the genetic benefits of marrying a little far due to a good inheritence of diversity and survival qualities (won't apply in this case since they're foster).

    Trying to pull them apart from each other won't usually help if they've developed deep feelings for each other since the sis would be depressed and hate you, and both you cousins will probably develop a sense of hatred, anger, or dislike.

    So see where it's at, and try and bring it back into Allah's limits asap. Don't let your ego get in the way - it may end up injured worse later if you're oppressive.



    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fakhitah_bint_Abi_Talib


    http://saudigazette.com.sa/article/1...Islam-Umm-Hani

    You can get informed by reading up, though Allah knows best the reason why the messenger of Allah later refused to marry her, in other places, it is reported that he said that he felt no desire/need to marry her when she came back and offered herself in marriage. And he was human.
    Last edited by Abz2000; 07-18-2017 at 06:52 AM.
    Is it permissible for female cousins & male cousins to hang out & direct message each

    Long ago has hope perished, as have our men of honor
    M.A



    The limits of tyrants are prescribed by the endurance of those whom they oppress

    Frederick Douglas

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    Re: Is it permissible for female cousins & male cousins to hang out & direct message

    Quote Originally Posted by Abz2000 View Post
    First it's my respected ukhti,
    Then it's ukhti that I really like spending time chatting with,
    Then it's ukhti who I'm beginning to develop strong feelings for,
    Then it's getting to be real heart-warming every time I talk to her,
    Then it's ukhti I "love you for the sake of Allah",
    Then we're both really losing composure and respectability,
    Then it's lucky if we're seperated by a few oceans......

    There comes a time when both realise they have feelings for each other, that's when they have to put the brakes on and start respectable fiance mode, if they feel they can't live without each other, tell mum and dad to be lenient in compatibility comparison.

    Also explain the genetic benefits of marrying a little far due to a good inheritence of diversity and survival qualities (won't apply in this case since they're foster).

    Trying to pull them apart from each other won't usually help if they've developed deep feelings for each other since the sis would be depressed and hate you, and both you cousins will probably develop a sense of hatred, anger, or dislike.

    So see where it's at, and try and bring it back into Allah's limits asap. Don't let your ego get in the way - it may end up injured worse later if you're oppressive.



    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fakhitah_bint_Abi_Talib

    You can get informed by reading up, though Allah knows best the reason why the messenger of Allah later refused to marry her, in other places, it is reported that he said that he felt no desire/need to marry her when she came back and offered herself in marriage. And he was human.
    Shukran

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    Re: Is it permissible for female cousins & male cousins to hang out & direct message

    Quote Originally Posted by ab_maalik_9 View Post
    Shukran
    I come across a little assertive and instructive there instead of advising - I'd just woken up....hope you understand brother.
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    Is it permissible for female cousins & male cousins to hang out & direct message each

    Long ago has hope perished, as have our men of honor
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    The limits of tyrants are prescribed by the endurance of those whom they oppress

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    Re: Is it permissible for female cousins & male cousins to hang out & direct message

    Quote Originally Posted by Abz2000 View Post
    I come across a little assertive and instructive there instead of advising - I'd just woken up....hope you understand brother.
    I want 2 understand but my feeling for the sister is the way but I feel like she betray me by doing this ... we suppose to get married in sept1

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    Re: Is it permissible for female cousins & male cousins to hang out & direct message

    Quote Originally Posted by ab_maalik_9 View Post
    I want 2 understand but my feeling for the sister is the way but I feel like she betray me by doing this ... we suppose to get married in sept1
    I didn't know, I thought attain was a predictive type error for sister,
    You need to think carefully since it's often stress and arguments later - especially if you have children - sometimes no partner wants to let go of the children and you feel stuck together in a mess.
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    Is it permissible for female cousins & male cousins to hang out & direct message each

    Long ago has hope perished, as have our men of honor
    M.A



    The limits of tyrants are prescribed by the endurance of those whom they oppress

    Frederick Douglas

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    Re: Is it permissible for female cousins & male cousins to hang out & direct message

    Nah nothing like that yet Ahki

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    Re: Is it permissible for female cousins & male cousins to hang out & direct message

    Quote Originally Posted by Abz2000 View Post
    I didn't know, I thought attain was a predictive type error for sister,
    You need to think carefully since it's often stress and arguments later - especially if you have children - sometimes no partner wants to let go of the children and you feel stuck together in a mess.
    We r planing on getting married Sept 1 Ahki

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    Re: Is it permissible for female cousins & male cousins to hang out & direct message

    Quote Originally Posted by ab_maalik_9 View Post
    We r planing on getting married Sept 1 Ahki


    As brother Abz has stated you really need to think very carefully about this because marriage is a big thing and we should not be complacent about who we marry regardless of whether they are related to us or not. Many think that if they marry within the family then everything will be ok because the girl is from the same family but this is certainly not the case and any issues with marriages within the family can actually split families apart. I have seen this with my own eyes with close friends of mine.

    So if the sister is freely interacting with strange men be it cousins or not and considers it "acceptable" then surely this is not a good sign. Although your marriage is already set up you really need to carefully consider whether you should marry her or not. This is because we should find spouses whose Deen and character pleases us. She should be shy and bashful in front of strange men not confidently interacting with non Mahrams.

    So give this further thought and talk to your parents and family about it. Make isthikhara and ask of Allah to help and guide you with this.

    I pray whatever is best will happen for you with regards to finding the right spouse for marriage. Ameen
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    Re: Is it permissible for female cousins & male cousins to hang out & direct message

    Quote Originally Posted by Hamza Asadullah View Post


    As brother Abz has stated you really need to think very carefully about this because marriage is a big thing and we should not be complacent about who we marry regardless of whether they are related to us or not. Many think that if they marry within the family then everything will be ok because the girl is from the same family but this is certainly not the case and any issues with marriages within the family can actually split families apart. I have seen this with my own eyes with close friends of mine.

    So if the sister is freely interacting with strange men be it cousins or not and considers it "acceptable" then surely this is not a good sign. Although your marriage is already set up you really need to carefully consider whether you should marry her or not. This is because we should find spouses whose Deen and character pleases us. She should be shy and bashful in front of strange men not confidently interacting with non Mahrams.

    So give this further thought and talk to your parents and family about it. Make isthikhara and ask of Allah to help and guide you with this.

    I pray whatever is best will happen for you with regards to finding the right spouse for marriage. Ameen
    She was freely chillin with her cousin not me .... I just dawud proof so I can tell her bout it & insha'allah it won't happen again

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    Re: Is it permissible for female cousins & male cousins to hang out & direct message

    How... can you even like your cousins? OMG mine are like my brothers / sisters.

    Then again, that's in my culture, you don't marry your cousins unless you want "special" children.
    Is it permissible for female cousins & male cousins to hang out & direct message each

    ต( ິᵒ̴̶̷̤ ﻌ ᵒ̴̶̷̤ )ິ ♬


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    Re: Is it permissible for female cousins & male cousins to hang out & direct message

    Interesting....if Allah had banned it, the deniers and haters would have presented multiple movies and books about how cousins were in love and how they were oppressed by the rules of Islam.


    Ali bin Abi Talhah reported that `Abdullah bin `Abbas commented that Allah's statement,
    ﴿مَثَلاً كَلِمَةً طَيِّبَةً﴾

    (a parable: a goodly word), refers to testifying to La ilaha illallah, (none has the right to be worshipped but Allah) while,
    ﴿كَشَجَرةٍ طَيِّبَةٍ﴾

    (as a goodly tree), refers to the believer, and that,
    ﴿أَصْلُهَا ثَابِتٌ﴾

    (whose root is firmly fixed), indicates that La ilaha illallah, (none has the right to be worshipped but Allah) is firm in the believers' heart,
    ﴿وَفَرْعُهَا فِى السَّمَآءِ﴾

    (and its branches (reach) to the sky.) with which the believer's works are ascended to heaven. Similar is said by Ad-Dahhak, Sa'id bin Jubayr, `Ikrimah, Mujahid and several others. They stated that this parable describes the believer's deeds, good statements and good actions. The believer is just like the beneficial date tree, always having good actions ascending at all times, by day and by night. Al-Bukhari recorded that `Abdullah bin `Umar said, "We were with the Messenger of Allah when he asked,
    «أَخْبِرُونِي عَنْ شَجَرَةٍ تُشْبِهُ أَوْ كَالرَّجُلِ الْمُسْلِمِ لَا يَتَحَاتُّ وَرَقُهَا صَيْفًا وَلَا شِتَاءً، وَتُؤْتِي أُكُلَهَا كُلَّ حِينٍ بِإِذْنِ رَبِّهَا»

    (Tell me about a tree that resembles the Muslim, the leaves of which do not fall in summer or winter and gives its fruit at all times by the leave of its Lord.)'' Ibn `Umar said, "I thought of the date palm tree, but felt shy to answer when I saw that Abu Bakr and `Umar did not talk. When they did not give an answer, the Messenger of Allah said,
    «هِيَ النَّخْلَة»

    (It is the date palm tree.) When we departed, I said to `Umar, `My father, by Allah! I thought that it was the date tree.' He said, `Why did you not speak then' I said, `I saw you were silent and I felt shy to say anything.' `Umar said, `Had you said it, it would have been more precious to me than such things (i.e., would have been very precious to me).''' `Abdullah bin `Abbas said that,
    ﴿كَشَجَرةٍ طَيِّبَةٍ﴾

    (as a goodly tree), is a tree in Paradise. Allah said next,
    ﴿تُؤْتِى أُكُلَهَا كُلَّ حِينٍ﴾

    (Giving its fruit at all times,) It is said that it means by day and by night. And they say that describes the believer as a tree that always has fruits during summer and winter, by night and by day. This is the parable of the believer whose good works ascend to heaven by day and by night and at all times,
    ﴿بِإِذْنِ رَبِّهَا﴾

    (by the leave of its Lord, ) thus earning perfection and becoming beneficial, plentiful, pure and blessed,
    ﴿وَيَضْرِبُ اللَّهُ الأَمْثَالَ لِلنَّاسِ لَعَلَّهُمْ يَتَذَكَّرُونَ﴾

    (and Allah sets forth parables for mankind in order that they may remember.) Allah said next,
    ﴿وَمَثلُ كَلِمَةٍ خَبِيثَةٍ كَشَجَرَةٍ خَبِيثَةٍ﴾

    (And the parable of an evil word is that of an evil tree) describing the disbelief of the disbeliever, for it has no basis or stability. It is similar to the colocynth tree (a very bitter, unscented plant) which is also called, `Ash-Shiryan'. Shu`bah narrated that Mu`awiyah bin Abi Qurrah narrated that Anas bin Malik said that it is the colocynth tree. Allah said,
    ﴿اجْتُثَّتْ﴾

    (uprooted), meaning, was cutoff from the root,
    ﴿مِن فَوْقِ الاٌّرْضِ مَا لَهَا مِن قَرَارٍ﴾

    (from the surface of earth, having no stability.) therefore, existing without basis or stabililty, just like Kufr (disbelief), for it does not have a basis or roots. Surely, the works of the disbelievers will never ascend nor will any of them be accepted.
    ﴿يُثَبِّتُ اللَّهُ الَّذِينَ ءَامَنُواْ بِالْقَوْلِ الثَّابِتِ فِى الْحَيَوةِ الدُّنْيَا وَفِى الاٌّخِرَةِ وَيُضِلُّ اللَّهُ الظَّـلِمِينَ وَيَفْعَلُ اللَّهُ مَا يَشَآءُ ﴾

    (27. Allah will keep firm those who believe, with the word that stands firm in this world, and in the Hereafter. And Allah will cause the wrongdoers to go astray, and Allah does what He wills.)


    Tafseer ibn Katheer, from Quran, Chapter 14.





    16“To what can I compare this generation? They are like children sitting in the marketplaces and calling out to others:

    17“ ‘We played the pipe for you,
    and you did not dance;
    we sang a dirge,
    and you did not mourn.’

    18For John came neither eating nor drinking, and they say, ‘He has a demon (arabic - majnoon, eng. possessed/suffering from neural chemical imbalance/crazy, mad).’
    19The Son of Man came eating and drinking, and they say, ‘Here is a glutton and a drunkard, a friend of tax collectors and sinners.’
    But wisdom is proved right by her deeds.”

    From Matthew 11



    It is truly a blessing that Allah took the tribes through two extremes before sending Muhammad to the whole of humankind with the Quran and justly balanced and smooth path.
    Last edited by Abz2000; 07-27-2017 at 06:18 AM.
    Is it permissible for female cousins & male cousins to hang out & direct message each

    Long ago has hope perished, as have our men of honor
    M.A



    The limits of tyrants are prescribed by the endurance of those whom they oppress

    Frederick Douglas

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    keiv's Avatar
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    Re: Is it permissible for female cousins & male cousins to hang out & direct message

    Quote Originally Posted by Bhabha View Post
    How... can you even like your cousins? OMG mine are like my brothers / sisters.

    Then again, that's in my culture, you don't marry your cousins unless you want "special" children.
    Not sure what culture you're from but, you can get "special" children from anyone. It's up to Allah, not the person you marry. Cousin marriage is probably bigger than you may think and happens from the east to the west, from Muslims to non Muslims.. Not everyone knows their cousins either, so you can't really compare your situation to others. It doesn't bother me either way, just thought I'd point that out.

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    Re: Is it permissible for female cousins & male cousins to hang out & direct message

    Quote Originally Posted by keiv View Post
    Not sure what culture you're from but, you can get "special" children from anyone. It's up to Allah, not the person you marry. Cousin marriage is probably bigger than you may think and happens from the east to the west, from Muslims to non Muslims.. Not everyone knows their cousins either, so you can't really compare your situation to others. It doesn't bother me either way, just thought I'd point that out.
    Let me just point out some studies.

    Here's a study for you in the state of Qatar.

    http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/1...6.00750.x/full

    "The occurrence of asthma, mental retardation, epilepsy and diabetes was significantly more common in offspring of all consanguineous than non-consanguineous couples."

    As well as studies in Dubai / UAE

    http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/1...tb02447.x/full

    Overall, there was statistically significant higher reproductive wastage in consanguineous couples, but when the category of less than second cousins was excluded from the consanguineous group no difference was found in reproductive wastage between consanguineous and non-consanguineous marriages. Children born to consanguineous unions also had significantly higher incidences of illnesses (37.1%) than those of non-consanguineous unions (29%). The occurrence of malignancies, congenital abnormalities, mental retardation and physical handicap was significantly higher in offspring of consanguineous than non-consanguineous marriages. In conclusion, consanguinity did not result in reproductive wastage, but was found to be an important factor in the causation of specific illnesses in offspring.

    ----
    Offspring between first and second cousins is detrimental to the health of the offspring. In my culture, our first cousins are literally like brothers / sisters, they're a complete NO-ZONE when it comes to marriage. These are the children of my mother's sisters / brothers. As well as the children of my dad's brothers / sisters.

    Consanguineous marriages are not good when the genetic make up is not versatile enough, when you have similar genetic make up and marry within a family, you don't provide your offspring with enough diversity to fight off probable illnesses. The amount of children left in orphanages in many countries due to "problems" that could have been avoided by not marrying a "cousin", is enough to warrant that marriage between members of the family should not be happening.

    In the "West"; just to entertain ABZ; there were a LOT of consanguineous marriages between members of the royal houses which lead to MANY problems in the blood line that are still seen today. There are also people that married between cousins in the United States.... and any American knows what they are called.

    You can get "special" children from anyone, but there is a significantly higher risk of producing "special" offspring with blood relatives.
    Is it permissible for female cousins & male cousins to hang out & direct message each

    ต( ິᵒ̴̶̷̤ ﻌ ᵒ̴̶̷̤ )ິ ♬


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    Re: Is it permissible for female cousins & male cousins to hang out & direct message

    I think we've already mentioned the benefits of moderate genetic diversity, it is an allowance and not a command, so that's for people to choose.
    I HATE it when people who go on about east west as if laying claim to one and ignorant of the fact that the human population is scattered all over the place.... it's usually a galvanization attempt of jaahilyyah to pull people on side when people begin to think rationally. Talking about a country is one thing since they are usually governed by certain methods, but ignorance of the fact that "the west" is not a real matrix or cohesive whole is like idolatry in another form to me.

    One thing I have noticed though is that even mother son relationships along with other forms of incest exist in extreme secularist majority countries, and that these stories are often embellished in the press without repercussion.

    Marriage with cousins is not forbidden in most countries regardless of way of life, and the fact that it is more usual in some countries is not anything to do with Islam, but more to do with tight knit tribal factors, india is not a muslim majority country yet the practice is common.

    Just mentioning it in order to cast away some illusions that are at risk of being formed by certain tendencies of some people to make things that aren't appear as if they are.
    Is it permissible for female cousins & male cousins to hang out & direct message each

    Long ago has hope perished, as have our men of honor
    M.A



    The limits of tyrants are prescribed by the endurance of those whom they oppress

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