× Register Login What's New! Contact us
Page 2 of 7 First 1 2 3 4 ... Last
Results 21 to 40 of 123

Thread: Truth seeker

  1. #1
    Array chalks75's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2019
    Gender
    Male
    Religion
    Atheism
    Posts
    188
    Threads
    1
    Reputation
    93
    Rep Power
    2

    Truth seeker (OP)


    Hi , my name is chalky
    I’m not religious , il lay my cards on the table , I’m an atheist , I’m here because I’m curious of why people believe the things they do.
    What convinces people that a particular version of a particular god is real.

  2. #21
    manofIslam's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2015
    Location
    Australia
    Gender
    Male
    Religion
    Islam
    Posts
    51
    Threads
    1
    Reputation
    236
    Rep Power
    24
    Likes (Given)
    319
    Likes (Received)
    45

    Re: Truth seeker

    Report bad ads?

    Dear Chalky,

    What then, do you think will happen to you when you die? You see: I'm too scared to not believe in Allah (God) because I believe that He will punish me for my sins: especially if I don't believe in his existence!!

    I've studied all the religions, and 5 years ago I converted from Christianity to Islam, because once I read The Holy Qur'an I realised that Islam is the ONLY TRUE Religion!!!

    So I suggest that you go and have a really good read of the Holy Qur'an, sonny!
    | Likes Ahmed., HabibUrrehman liked this post
    Truth seeker

    Allahu Akbar!

  3. Report bad ads?
  4. #22
    Physicist's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2015
    Location
    Russia
    Gender
    Male
    Religion
    Islam
    Posts
    314
    Threads
    14
    Reputation
    1128
    Rep Power
    24
    Likes (Given)
    107
    Likes (Received)
    153

    Re: Truth seeker

    Quote Originally Posted by chalks75 View Post
    Beauty is subjective , perfection is also subjective

    And I don’t believe that anything came from nothing , if that’s what you are getting at.

    All the things you mentioned can be demonstrate to be a result of design , the same cannot he said of the universe.
    Your making an equivocation fallacy.
    Beauty is objective and measurable by mathematical means.
    Although often is mistaken for attractiveness, which is of course subjective.

    If you consider design as an effort to increase the beauty of outcome, by whatever means available, then you can apply this to the universe as well.
    | Likes Eric H liked this post

  5. #23
    chalks75's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2019
    Gender
    Male
    Religion
    Atheism
    Posts
    188
    Threads
    1
    Reputation
    93
    Rep Power
    2
    Likes (Given)
    1
    Likes (Received)
    12

    Re: Truth seeker

    Quote Originally Posted by Eric H View Post
    Greetings and peace be with you chalks75;



    The creation of the universe is history, either there is a God who created the universe, or there is no god. Regardless as to what you or I may think, we can't change the past.

    I watched a programme by Stephen Hawkins recently, he tried to explain how the the matter of the universe always existed in both positive matter and negative matter. He demonstrated this by a man digging a hole and making a mountain. The mountain of earth was the positive matter, and the hole it came from was the negative matter, so they balanced each other out. This seemed a really stupid explanation, the mountain of earth already existed, he just shifted it from one place to another.

    Atheism is equally a position of ignorance, you have ruled out the possibility of God with no proof.

    In the spirit of searching for a greatest meaning of 'One God'

    Eric

    You are correct
    Either there is a god or gods , or there is not.

    In my opinion there is not , gods are things people invented in an attempt to explain things that we did not understand.

    I’m not a cosmologist , I don’t pretend to know enough about it to decide if something makes sense or not.

    The problem with using a god as an explanation is that it falls to you to define what a god is.

    Like I said , no one knows how the universe came to be , not you ,not me, not Stephen hawking .
    You have beliefs about it , you believe a particular version of a particular god is responsible .
    While Stephen hawking would believe there is a natural explanation.

    The point is , neither of us know , I don’t claim to know , but you do, it’s a religious claim not a scientific one

  6. #24
    chalks75's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2019
    Gender
    Male
    Religion
    Atheism
    Posts
    188
    Threads
    1
    Reputation
    93
    Rep Power
    2
    Likes (Given)
    1
    Likes (Received)
    12

    Re: Truth seeker

    Quote Originally Posted by manofIslam View Post
    Dear Chalky,

    What then, do you think will happen to you when you die? You see: I'm too scared to not believe in Allah (God) because I believe that He will punish me for my sins: especially if I don't believe in his existence!!

    I've studied all the religions, and 5 years ago I converted from Christianity to Islam, because once I read The Holy Qur'an I realised that Islam is the ONLY TRUE Religion!!!

    So I suggest that you go and have a really good read of the Holy Qur'an, sonny!
    What will happen to me when I die ?
    My heart will stop beating , the activity in my brain will cease, my organ will stop functioning .... I will be dead , I will cease to be aware of anything ( imagine how things were before you were born )

    I will be placed in a hole in the ground , my body will rot , and the universe will repurpose the atoms that I consist of.

    Death is the end , which is why life is precious
    | Likes manofIslam liked this post

  7. Report bad ads?
  8. #25
    chalks75's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2019
    Gender
    Male
    Religion
    Atheism
    Posts
    188
    Threads
    1
    Reputation
    93
    Rep Power
    2
    Likes (Given)
    1
    Likes (Received)
    12

    Re: Truth seeker

    Quote Originally Posted by Physicist View Post
    Beauty is objective and measurable by mathematical means.
    Although often is mistaken for attractiveness, which is of course subjective.

    If you consider design as an effort to increase the beauty of outcome, by whatever means available, then you can apply this to the universe as well.
    Beauty is certainly not objective
    Beauty is in the eye of the beholder.

    Design does not always increase beauty, things can be designed to be ugly .

    But since beauty and ugly are both subjective ... the argument is mute

  9. #26
    chalks75's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2019
    Gender
    Male
    Religion
    Atheism
    Posts
    188
    Threads
    1
    Reputation
    93
    Rep Power
    2
    Likes (Given)
    1
    Likes (Received)
    12

    Re: Truth seeker

    Quote Originally Posted by Eric H View Post
    Greetings and peace be with you chalks75;



    The creation of the universe is history, either there is a God who created the universe, or there is no god. Regardless as to what you or I may think, we can't change the past.

    I watched a programme by Stephen Hawkins recently, he tried to explain how the the matter of the universe always existed in both positive matter and negative matter. He demonstrated this by a man digging a hole and making a mountain. The mountain of earth was the positive matter, and the hole it came from was the negative matter, so they balanced each other out. This seemed a really stupid explanation, the mountain of earth already existed, he just shifted it from one place to another.

    Atheism is equally a position of ignorance, you have ruled out the possibility of God with no proof.

    In the spirit of searching for a greatest meaning of 'One God'

    Eric

    Atheism is not a position of ignorance.

    I am not convinced that your god , or any god is real, therefore I am atheist.

    I have not ruled out the possibility of a god , but I see no reason to include it as a possibility.

  10. #27
    chalks75's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2019
    Gender
    Male
    Religion
    Atheism
    Posts
    188
    Threads
    1
    Reputation
    93
    Rep Power
    2
    Likes (Given)
    1
    Likes (Received)
    12

    Re: Truth seeker

    Quote Originally Posted by manofIslam View Post
    Dear Chalky,

    What then, do you think will happen to you when you die? You see: I'm too scared to not believe in Allah (God) because I believe that He will punish me for my sins: especially if I don't believe in his existence!!

    I've studied all the religions, and 5 years ago I converted from Christianity to Islam, because once I read The Holy Qur'an I realised that Islam is the ONLY TRUE Religion!!!

    So I suggest that you go and have a really good read of the Holy Qur'an, sonny!
    “ one true religion “
    That changes dependant on who you ask.

    You have swapped one man made theology for another one .

  11. #28
    Eric H's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Location
    uk
    Gender
    Male
    Religion
    Christianity
    Posts
    3,383
    Threads
    28
    Reputation
    50180
    Rep Power
    117
    Likes (Given)
    4277
    Likes (Received)
    2590

    Re: Truth seeker

    Greetings and peace be with you chalks75

    Quote Originally Posted by chalks75 View Post
    Atheism is not a position of ignorance.
    Atheism is most definitely a position of ignorance. You have admitted that you do not know how the universe came to be, you are ignoring the possibility of God. This makes you just as ignorant as your claims against theism, your previous claim seems to condemn you by your own standards.

    Gods are not explanations , gods are what people make up when they do not know .
    Gods are how we define or ignorance.
    In the spirit of searching for God,
    Eric
    | Likes manofIslam, happymuslim, Zafran liked this post
    Truth seeker

    You will never look into the eyes of anyone who does not matter to God.

  12. #29
    HabibUrrehman's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2019
    Location
    CA
    Gender
    Male
    Religion
    Islam
    Posts
    246
    Threads
    8
    Reputation
    259
    Rep Power
    2
    Likes (Given)
    86
    Likes (Received)
    109

    Re: Truth seeker

    How do you determine what is right and what is wrong for you? I have also posted another reply yesterday (link below) and seems like you did not get a chance to respond to my post.

    Truth seeker

    Truth seeker
    Hi , my name is chalky I’m not religious , il lay my cards on the table , I’m an atheist , I’m here because I’m curious of why people believe the thing...
    | Likes manofIslam liked this post

  13. Report bad ads?
  14. #30
    manofIslam's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2015
    Location
    Australia
    Gender
    Male
    Religion
    Islam
    Posts
    51
    Threads
    1
    Reputation
    236
    Rep Power
    24
    Likes (Given)
    319
    Likes (Received)
    45

    Re: Truth seeker

    Quote Originally Posted by chalks75 View Post
    what will happen to me when i die ?
    My heart will stop beating , the activity in my brain will cease, my organ will stop functioning .... I will be dead , i will cease to be aware of anything ( imagine how things were before you were born )

    i will be placed in a hole in the ground , my body will rot , and the universe will repurpose the atoms that i consist of.

    Death is the end , which is why life is precious

    chalky! Oh, dear!!!!
    Truth seeker

    Allahu Akbar!

  15. #31
    chalks75's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2019
    Gender
    Male
    Religion
    Atheism
    Posts
    188
    Threads
    1
    Reputation
    93
    Rep Power
    2
    Likes (Given)
    1
    Likes (Received)
    12

    Re: Truth seeker

    Quote Originally Posted by manofIslam View Post
    chalky! Oh, dear!!!!
    Reality may be harsh .... but at least it’s real.

    I would rather face the truth , than believe that after I die I will “ go to the sky to be with my ancestors”, or Valhalla , or heaven , or paradise ... or whatever you believe happens after you die
    | Likes manofIslam liked this post

  16. #32
    HabibUrrehman's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2019
    Location
    CA
    Gender
    Male
    Religion
    Islam
    Posts
    246
    Threads
    8
    Reputation
    259
    Rep Power
    2
    Likes (Given)
    86
    Likes (Received)
    109

    Re: Truth seeker

    With that thinking we are all in trouble. Hitler killed million and he is done when he is dead. Someone did many wonderful and good things in this world and when died also became dust. What's the point? Does it make sense?
    I would also like to know how do you define what is good and what is bad? I mean stealing for example is considered bad but can you prove why it is bad without the concept of life in hereafter?
    | Likes manofIslam liked this post

  17. #33
    Physicist's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2015
    Location
    Russia
    Gender
    Male
    Religion
    Islam
    Posts
    314
    Threads
    14
    Reputation
    1128
    Rep Power
    24
    Likes (Given)
    107
    Likes (Received)
    153

    Re: Truth seeker

    Quote Originally Posted by chalks75 View Post
    Reality may be harsh .... but at least it’s real.

    I would rather face the truth , than believe that after I die I will “ go to the sky to be with my ancestors”, or Valhalla , or heaven , or paradise ... or whatever you believe happens after you die
    But by what criterias do you considers what is truth or not?

    From just a few hundred years ago perspective, things which are common for you now, would be considered as impossible miracles.

    Are you sure that people of the future will be unable to scan the past and make exact copies on molecular level of people before their death?
    | Likes manofIslam liked this post

  18. #34
    manofIslam's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2015
    Location
    Australia
    Gender
    Male
    Religion
    Islam
    Posts
    51
    Threads
    1
    Reputation
    236
    Rep Power
    24
    Likes (Given)
    319
    Likes (Received)
    45

    Re: Truth seeker

    Quote Originally Posted by chalks75 View Post
    Reality may be harsh .... but at least it’s real.

    I would rather face the truth , than believe that after I die I will “ go to the sky to be with my ancestors”, or Valhalla , or heaven , or paradise ... or whatever you believe happens after you die
    Dearest Chalky; But wouldn't you rather believe that Heaven exists, and that you could go there after you die; and be in Paradise forever?!!!
    Truth seeker

    Allahu Akbar!

  19. Report bad ads?
  20. #35
    chalks75's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2019
    Gender
    Male
    Religion
    Atheism
    Posts
    188
    Threads
    1
    Reputation
    93
    Rep Power
    2
    Likes (Given)
    1
    Likes (Received)
    12

    Re: Truth seeker

    Quote Originally Posted by Physicist View Post
    But by what criterias do you considers what is truth or not?

    From just a few hundred years ago perspective, things which are common for you now, would be considered as impossible miracles.

    Are you sure that people of the future will be unable to scan the past and make exact copies on molecular level of people before their death?
    Truth is what the evidence shows is true.

    If you can’t show it , you don’t know it .

    If you cannot demonstrate a claim is true , you should not claim it is true.

    It’s ok to say you believe it’s true.

  21. #36
    chalks75's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2019
    Gender
    Male
    Religion
    Atheism
    Posts
    188
    Threads
    1
    Reputation
    93
    Rep Power
    2
    Likes (Given)
    1
    Likes (Received)
    12

    Re: Truth seeker

    Quote Originally Posted by HabibUrrehman View Post
    With that thinking we are all in trouble. Hitler killed million and he is done when he is dead. Someone did many wonderful and good things in this world and when died also became dust. What's the point? Does it make sense?
    I would also like to know how do you define what is good and what is bad? I mean stealing for example is considered bad but can you prove why it is bad without the concept of life in hereafter?
    Unfortunately there is no cosmic justice,
    Which is why we should do whatever we can to make sure people get justice in this life .
    I do t believe there is an after life.

    As for how I determine good and bad , rational thought , people well being is important to me , the society I live in is important to me, it’s the society my kids and grandkids will true up in , so I try to do as little harm and as much good as I can.

  22. #37
    chalks75's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2019
    Gender
    Male
    Religion
    Atheism
    Posts
    188
    Threads
    1
    Reputation
    93
    Rep Power
    2
    Likes (Given)
    1
    Likes (Received)
    12

    Re: Truth seeker

    Quote Originally Posted by manofIslam View Post
    Dearest Chalky; But wouldn't you rather believe that Heaven exists, and that you could go there after you die; and be in Paradise forever?!!!
    It’s a wonderful thought , it would be fantastic if it were true .,. I don’t believe it is.

    I think the thoughts of an after life was burn out of mankind’s fear of death , of the unknown.

    Death is just a natural part of life , the fact life is so short is what makes it truly special.
    | Likes manofIslam liked this post

  23. #38
    chalks75's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2019
    Gender
    Male
    Religion
    Atheism
    Posts
    188
    Threads
    1
    Reputation
    93
    Rep Power
    2
    Likes (Given)
    1
    Likes (Received)
    12

    Re: Truth seeker

    Quote Originally Posted by HabibUrrehman View Post
    The point I made above was using "Design argument or Teleological argument." Let me give another example, perhaps my last example was not good enough or may be it was too long.
    Suppose I find a watch in a desert and upon opening it, I marvel at the intricate wiring and design. There is never a suggestion of the watch coming into existence by ‘accident,’ therefore how could this intricate and complicated world be brought into existence by an ‘accident?’ A lot of care and attention would be required. Therefore, nothing, including the universe, is brought into existence by accident.

    Several Examples used as Evidence:

    Humans constantly try to change their appearance, whether it is through contact lenses, makeup, fake eyelashes or face lifts, the fact remains that underneath all of that, they still look the same. No one can change their appearance, even through surgery, as the individual cells and DNA of a human being cannot be altered to switch to another specific job. For example, humans can dye their hair another color, such as blonde to brown, but the actual DNA cannot be altered to naturally create brown hair.

    A plant cannot grow on its’ own. People give it food and water, but where does the food and water come from? They are both made on Earth but what makes them grow? Where do the nutrients and minerals required come from? Again and again, the source can be questioned. What makes the leaves green? Chlorophyll and sunlight. But where does the sunlight come from? The Sun. How did the Sun come into existence? The Big Bang Theory? What triggered the explosion?

    Similarly, the Sun and Moon are kept at the correct distance from the Earth to let humans survive. What keeps them at that distance? Gravity? Who created Gravity? What causes the combustions on the surface of the Sun? Muslims believe that the Designer of everything is Allah, who is the creator and controller of the Universe.

    Human beings are another example. We grow from just a blood clot into full adults with various characteristics. Proteins make us grow, but where do the proteins come from? What is the First Cause? Muslims believe this to be Allah. Also, humans breathe mechanically and automatically. If, even for a minute, we concentrated our breathing and tried to breathe, it would become difficult. Muslims believe Allah has made us this way.

    Other than the Design Argument, we can also take into account the argument of moral values (good and bad). Many times in our life, we think that ‘I ought to do this’ or ‘this is wrong.’ This is because of our conscience. Most of the time, we know what is right, yet we don’t do it. Muslims believe that all rights and wrongs come from one source: Allah. If we don’t follow those rights or wrongs, it is our choice and free will kicking in. Therefore, the presence of good and bad and of our conscience suggests that there is a higher power. It works like an alarm system to give us a warning and many times we don't listen to this warning. Instead we take refuge in drugs, alcohol and other things to kill our conscious. Our conscious is the reason why people with all the fame and money are still looking for happiness. Depression and suicidal thoughts are highest in individuals who try to find pleasure in anything other than remembering God. When we hear fire alarm we should run away from source of fire but we do the opposite in case of our conscious. We shut off the alarm and run towards the source of fire and as a result can never find true peace and happiness. Anyways the existence of conscience proves there is a higher being.

    Last point I am mention shortly and this is about death. Death is a reality which ever one accepts and find no escape from it. This also suggests that there is a higher power over which we have no control.

    I agree that if I found a watch I would say it is designed ... but how would I know what design is ?
    I compare it to the things that I know are not designed !

    What in the universe is not designed ?

    My morality comes from rational thought , and the recognition that I share this world with others and my actions have consequences that affect others.

  24. #39
    manofIslam's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2015
    Location
    Australia
    Gender
    Male
    Religion
    Islam
    Posts
    51
    Threads
    1
    Reputation
    236
    Rep Power
    24
    Likes (Given)
    319
    Likes (Received)
    45

    Re: Truth seeker

    Quote Originally Posted by chalks75 View Post
    It’s a wonderful thought , it would be fantastic if it were true .,. I don’t believe it is.

    I think the thoughts of an after life was burn out of mankind’s fear of death , of the unknown.

    Death is just a natural part of life , the fact life is so short is what makes it truly special.


    Dear Chalky,

    Well, who do you think created the Universe? Because we believe that God created the Universe.

    So why don't you believe in God?
    Truth seeker

    Allahu Akbar!

  25. Report bad ads?
  26. #40
    chalks75's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2019
    Gender
    Male
    Religion
    Atheism
    Posts
    188
    Threads
    1
    Reputation
    93
    Rep Power
    2
    Likes (Given)
    1
    Likes (Received)
    12

    Re: Truth seeker

    Quote Originally Posted by manofIslam View Post
    Dear Chalky,

    Well, who do you think created the Universe? Because we believe that God created the Universe.

    So why don't you believe in God?

    I don’t know how the universe came to be , I’ve not seen any evidence that a god is responsible( by the way calling it a creation assumes a creator)

    I don’t believe in gods , because I’ve not seen evidence enough to convince me gods are real.

    What I do see, is 1000s of man made gods and religions all making the same sorts of claims , all based on the same way of thinking.

    We don’t know how the universe came to be ... there must be a god
    We don’t know how life began ... it must be a god
    We are afraid of death ... there’s a god that stops you from truly dying.

    This kind of thinking is seen throughout cultures all over the world
    People invent gods , they build religions around them.

    I think ,
    If you don’t know something , just say you don’t know.

    Admitting you do not know , is the foundation of knowledge


  27. Hide
Page 2 of 7 First 1 2 3 4 ... Last
Hey there! Truth seeker Looks like you're enjoying the discussion, but you're not signed up for an account.

When you create an account, we remember exactly what you've read, so you always come right back where you left off. You also get notifications, here and via email, whenever new posts are made. And you can like posts and share your thoughts. Truth seeker
Sign Up

Similar Threads

  1. A Humble seeker of truth
    By thestalkingwolf in forum Introduce Yourself
    Replies: 4
    Last Post: 06-13-2013, 07:17 AM
  2. A Seeker
    By Nightingale9 in forum Introduce Yourself
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: 01-21-2013, 04:42 AM
  3. For Every Seeker of Knowledge...
    By 'Abd al-Baari in forum Seeking Knowledge
    Replies: 3
    Last Post: 11-03-2008, 04:13 PM
  4. Seeker of knowledge
    By Nick in forum Introduce Yourself
    Replies: 16
    Last Post: 10-01-2008, 09:59 AM
  5. Hi , Im a Truth Seeker , would you like to join ?
    By stefanrosty in forum Introduce Yourself
    Replies: 11
    Last Post: 06-22-2007, 06:23 PM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
create