A very nice read, jazak Allah khair for sharing.
asalam alaikum warahmatulah wabarakatuh
Islam, the Middle Way in ALL aspects.
Let's try to look at the different things which make Islam the middle way from all other ways of life;
Prophet Muhammad came from the Arabian Peninsula, that's in the middle of the world [Middle East.] Not in the west, nor in the far east.
He himself was light skinned, with a slight tinge of a tan. If he was extremely black, some might not have accepted him, and if he was extremely white, others might not have accepted him. But by being in between, he would neutral it out. He had neither curly, nor straight hair, and was of average height and build. He was the middle way in all aspects, with mercy and justice. He was the middle way, outwardly and inwardly.
His companions were of different colours; arab, black (Bilal, Um Ayman), white (Suhayb the Roman, Zunayra [the one who temporary got blind]), brown (Salman the Persian) and male and female, poor and rich. This covers all forms of people, and he was the kindest to all of them, and they testified to this.
The Qur'an is a Criterion, Book of Justice, severe in threat to those who do evil, and merciful to those who are sincere and do good.
The Language that the Qur'an was revealed is both a language based on grammar, and also a phonetic language. (I.e. some languages are just grammar based i.e. Latin, but they might not be as Phonetic. Then there's other languages like Punjabi, or Mandarin Chinese which are phonetic more than they are grammar based.) Arabic is a composition of both. An example of its grammar and phoneticness is for example the word "Aba" - this means father. If i'm correct, Aba also comes from 'Baab' which means 'gate'. And the father is the 'gate' of the family i.e. people only come through him to the family. And the Phoneticness is the concept of other words i.e. forefathers, so if you prolonged the word Aba [father], you would say "Aabaaaa" = your forefathers (i.e. father, grandfather, great grandfather etc.)
Even the writing style of Arabic is the middle way. If you look at chinese/japanese writing, which is from the far east, and compare it to the languages of the West, you see that Arabic is between both. (from my personal perspective) i.e. chinese is written usually through the likes of a paintbrush style, english through the likes of a thin pencil line style, and arabic with a mix of both, forming calligraphy style.
Another concept is the belief in Prophet Jesus son of Mary (peace be upon them.) The Jews reject him and curse him, saying he was an imposter. The Christians raise him to the level of God, or a part of God. We say he is a servant and Messenger of God, and of the greatest of Prophets.
Another factor is that Islam has a balance between science and belief in God. So we believe that science is a pattern of Allah's creation. You'll notice that there isn't much detail about the specifics in science in the Qur'an or Sunnah, simply because Allah has given us senses and tools to understand the universe around us. So if a certain supernatural event does occur, we have an open mind to accept it as something supernatural (i.e. Jinn), or something which might be based on science and explainable in the future through other means.
add yours
A very nice read, jazak Allah khair for sharing.
Since emotions are very powerful tools, some of them can bring about world wars, we are taught to control them. I.e time and place for anger, time and place for love etc.
To take it further; indeed, anger leads to violence, and so we supress that anger to avoid starting a fight/getting into arguments. Note; this is not the same as eliminating the emotion.
So it works something like this:
Left path: ''Remove anger''
Islam: ''Control your anger''
Right path: ''Encourage anger''
Jazaakalahu khayr for sharing..
Cool post. I'm not familiar enough to make any "middle points", but I agree that Arabic is the most amazing language. I compare its beauty only to Latin alone. It's nice to see Muhammad was a real person with real characteristics too, not just an ancient ethereal figure..
Great way of thinking masha'Allah..jazak'Allah khair.
No, it isn't. Why do you consider suppression of anger preferable to it's elimination?format_quote Originally Posted by aamirsaab
To take it further; indeed, anger leads to violence, and so we supress that anger to avoid starting a fight/getting into arguments. Note; this is not the same as eliminating the emotion.
because you don't turn into a pacifist but instead you learn to use your anger when necessary and not in unecessary situationsformat_quote Originally Posted by Trumble
eliminating the anger is of course the best, but it's sometimes impossible to do (we're humans, we sometimes can't prevent ourselves to feel angry), so the best solution (not the bad solution:fight, neither the impossible one:elimination) is to controle our anger and our reaction.format_quote Originally Posted by Trumble
Lol.
Fallacy of the mean (argumentum ad tempernatiam) is the first thing that comes to mind.
'like lol' is your claim to fame a cagey avoidance of any topic and a straight go at what you deem fallacious?.. I understand you paid some cash for a course that by the standards of most is considered worthless and perhaps all it can afford you is a kiosk or a falafel cart and a mediocre writing hobby on some forum.. simply pointing out that something is fallacious isn't enough to make an argument least of which when you are having a solo hearty guffaw on the side.. firstly since the topic isn't pointing out that this extreme is wrong and that extreme is equally wrong, there is actually no moral agenda to the above, rather it is about what made Islam appealing in certain respects.format_quote Originally Posted by Lynx
There is no if Quran were revealed in Japanese it would have been divine error or if the Quran were revealed in English it would have been a divine taking the easy way out and even if it were, you'd have a heck of a time proving that the Arabic revelation was a wrong choice in judgment .. In fact the best you can do is a 'lol' well here is another lol right back at ya!
what exactly is worthless about being able to point out the fallacies in what people say? That's a priceless skill. You go to the weekly khutbah and I presume a lot of the time you feel moved at what the imam says; i go to the weekly khutbah and i can't do anything but pick out fallacy after fallacy. Not so worthless if i say so myself.format_quote Originally Posted by τhε ṿαlε'ṡ lïlÿ
hmm, this is exactly what's wrong with the university system in the west today. People think university is a trade school where you go to get a skill that will get you a job. people have forgotten that the university is where the love for wisdom is cultivated; why are people so money driven today ? mini-capitalists aren't we all. it seems that every other university graduate thinks the only thing that matters is getting a skill that can be sold for money. plato would turn in his grave if he saw what his Academy has evolved into. If you went to university and you did not have your personal beliefs challenged even the slightest then the university failed you.
With a thread title like "Islam, the Middle Way in ALL aspects", how can I resist but pointing out the obvious fallacy?simply pointing out that something is fallacious isn't enough to make an argument least of which when you are having a solo hearty guffaw on the side..
the topic is pointing out virtues in the 'golden mean' (i.e., moderation in all aspects) and how Islam should be praised for figuring out the all-beneficial moderate path that the prophet spoke of. It's a great rule of thumb here and there but it is by no means the best thing for "ALL" aspects. That is why it's fallacious.firstly since the topic isn't pointing out that this extreme is wrong and that extreme is equally wrong, there is actually no moral agenda to the above, rather it is about what made Islam appealing in certain respects.
hmm okay, if you say so.There is no if Quran were revealed in Japanese it would have been divine error or if the Quran were revealed in English it would have been a divine taking the easy way out and even if it were, you'd have a heck of a time proving that the Arabic revelation was a wrong choice in judgment .. In fact the best you can do is a 'lol' well here is another lol right back at ya!
Is it a priceless skill? I have never attended a khutbah in my lifeformat_quote Originally Posted by Lynx
If you feel it is cultivated on a forum then frankly that is a waste!hmm, this is exactly what's wrong with the university system in the west today. People think university is a trade school where you go to get a skill that will get you a job. people have forgotten that the university is where the love for wisdom is cultivated;
No just in the west!why are people so money driven today ? mini-capitalists aren't we all.that would make it 50% --not bad, where do you reckon the other fifty go? in front of the TV I guess living off the tax and well fare of the other half!
it seems that every other university graduate thinks the only thing that matters is getting a skill that can be sold for money.
Maybe.. but going to university is about acquisition of useful skills with which you are to serve humanity, not act as a one party cynic!plato would turn in his grave if he saw what his Academy has evolved into. If you went to university and you did not have your personal beliefs challenged even the slightest then the university failed you.
You have made an assertion but failed to elucidate how they are applicable to what was written (as usual).. there is more to it than a thrill of remonstrating!With a thread title like "Islam, the Middle Way in ALL aspects", how can I resist but pointing out the obvious fallacy?
You are yet to point out how it isn't the 'best thing for ALL aspects' I'll be waiting for your detailed analyses!the topic is pointing out virtues in the 'golden mean' (i.e., moderation in all aspects) and how Islam should be praised for figuring out the all-beneficial moderate path that the prophet spoke of. It's a great rule of thumb here and there but it is by no means the best thing for "ALL" aspects. That is why it's fallacious.
Indeed!
hmm okay, if you say so.
all the best
but that's the very fallacy- to think that the middle path is always the best path. one single counter-example is sufficient to disprove the claim of the OP.You are yet to point out how it isn't the 'best thing for ALL aspects' I'll be waiting for your detailed analyses!
"# A month ago, a tree in Bill's yard was damaged in a storm. His neighbor, Joe, asked him to have the tree cut down so it would not fall on Joes new shed. Bill refused to do this. Two days ago another storm blew the tree onto Joe's new shed. Joe demanded that Joe pay the cost of repairs, which was $250. Bill said that he wasn't going to pay a cent. Obviously, the best solution is to reach a compromise between the two extremes, so Bill should pay Joe $125 dollars. "
You can google more sophisticated examples of the fallacy. Bottom line is that there's no reason to think the middle ground is always the best ground. i'll bet this whole notion of the middle ground is just conventional wisdom passed down by cultures and the OP is taking it way too seriously as if it's the truth of all truths~
AND
if you don't mind me asking, howcome you've never attended a khutbah before?
It isn't, it just exempts you from doing some hard work.. if you enjoy this and clearly I can see that you do, then don't mind me quoting from Islamic hadith:format_quote Originally Posted by Lynx
البزّار في مسنده أن رسول الله صلى الله عليه وسلم قال : " ان الله تعالى يحب أحدكم إذا عَمِلَ عملاً أن يتقنه، قيل وما اتقانه يا رسول الله؟ قال :" يخلصه من الرياء والبدعة ".
''Surely Allah loves when you do a job, that you do it with proficiency and high fidelity and that you free it from pretense and hypocrisy''
Irrelevant in its entirety to this thread!"# A month ago, a tree in Bill's yard was damaged in a storm. His neighbor, Joe, asked him to have the tree cut down so it would not fall on Joes new shed. Bill refused to do this. Two days ago another storm blew the tree onto Joe's new shed. Joe demanded that Joe pay the cost of repairs, which was $250. Bill said that he wasn't going to pay a cent. Obviously, the best solution is to reach a compromise between the two extremes, so Bill should pay Joe $125 dollars. "
We are speaking of specific truths not a catch all sentiments!You can google more sophisticated examples of the fallacy. Bottom line is that there's no reason to think the middle ground is always the best ground. i'll bet this whole notion of the middle ground is just conventional wisdom passed down by cultures and the OP is taking it way too seriously as if it's the truth of all truths~I don't know-- I'd say that I am a private reclusive person who doesn't reach out for community support, and prefer to do my learning and religious duties in a solo fashion!
AND
if you don't mind me asking, howcome you've never attended a khutbah before?
Perhaps I'll attend one this Ramadan or something if chance permits..
all the best
Moderation is most of the times the best decision. Extremes are very risqy and, if you stand in the limit you will not gain the good of every part. For example if you are presenting a lecture and you're standing in front of the audience, you'd better stand in the middle to see the whole people. In physics, the center of gravity is the key point to make an object stable or to move it. If you want to hold a big plank, you have to hold it from the middle. It's a general rule, and if you don't have a fixed method of work, then a moderated decision is the right choice.format_quote Originally Posted by Lynx
Yes you can give exceptions/counter-examples. But these are exceptions caused by new factors (the example you gave is not really representative, one of the friends is a thief, so the situation is not normal).
Nature is generally following a "normal distribution" (gaussian distribution) where the middle part is privileged and the limits are uninteresting zones.
Gaussian distribution
what this thread is about is religion. You certainly agree that moderation in a religion is an important condition. Islam doesn't recommend extremism : we should not be too strict so we make prophets and scholars like Gods or kill every body, and we should not be too loose with our religion so we neglect its basics.
Last edited by marwen; 06-01-2010 at 01:37 AM.
Either this is satire, in which case fair enough... or you're being serious, in which case why reply to a thread you clearly don't understand?format_quote Originally Posted by Lynx
Part of exercising sound judgement is knowing when and where to apply the mean. Lynx, the example you gave was an example of where not to apply the mean. But we can use it as an indication of where to apply the mean: Joe should receive adequate compensation for his shed, either tangible or monetary. By not demanding full compensation, Joe is exercising too little demand. By destroying Bill's shed in retaliation, Joe is exercising too much demand. Here, replacing the shed is the correct application of the mean, which forms the basis of ethical conduct.
Virtue ethics has a long and illustrious history in the East as well as the west. = )
I am chuckling at your brevity in exposing yourself as someone who knows nothing about the matter being discussed and yet who opens mouth the widest and thinks he is the genius.format_quote Originally Posted by Lynx
As is being able to judge when doing so is being constructive rather than merely being a smartass.format_quote Originally Posted by Lynx
Clearly the claim, were it seriously being made, that "Islam is the Middle Way in all aspects" is wrong; simply considering "good" and "evil" in that context is enough to demonstrate that. Here, though, the first post is a discussion piece with an exaggerated heading, not an attempt to support a serious philosophical claim.
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