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Jesus Perfect God and Perfect Man?

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    Jesus Perfect God and Perfect Man? (OP)


    The orthodox doctrine is logically impossible. As Huston Smith, scholar of comparative religion, points out, it would not have been logically impossible if the creed said that Jesus was somewhat divine and somewhat human. But this is expressly what the creed denies. For orthodox Christians, Jesus cannot possess only some human qualities; he must possess all. He must be fully human. At the same time, he cannot possess only some divine qualities; he must have all. He must be fully divine. This is impossible because to be fully divine means one has to be free of human limitations. If he has only one human limitation then he is not God. But according to creed he has every human limitation. How, then, can he be God? Huston Smith calls this a blatant contradiction. In his book The World’s Religions, he writes:

    We may begin with the doctrine of the Incarnation, which took several centuries to fix into place. Holding as it does that in Christ God assumed a human body, it affirms that Christ was God-Man; simultaneously both fully God and fully man. To say that such a contention is paradoxical seems a charitable way to put the matter — it looks more like a blatant contradiction. If the doctrine held that Christ was half human and half divine, or that he was divine in certain respects, while being human in others, our minds would not balk. (The World’s Religions, p. 340).
    Can Jesus be man and God?

    No

    God has his limits in doing Godly thing too.

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    Phil12123's Avatar Full Member
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    Re: Jesus Perfect God and Perfect Man?

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    format_quote Originally Posted by MuslimCONVERT View Post
    The issue is not "is it possible" for God to be a man.... the issue is what does the Christian mean when they say this. To me, it's not that the sentence is good or bad, it's that I have yet to find a Christian in 4 years who can answer the question of what they mean when they say God became man. Is what they mean that God was God, but then He became man and so now He's not God anymore, or is it that they mean God became man but He was still God, in which case I want to know, is He mortal or immortal? Man is mortal, God is immortal, so which one was God if He was man and so on. Because if He was mortal than He's not God, if He was immortal than He wasn't a man. If it is meant that God is a man but still God then what does that mean? Does that mean that when this man (who was also fully God) clipped His fingernails that He was cutting off little pieces of God? Before the Muslim could ever agree that God became a man, first the Christian must clarify what they mean by that sentence... then the conversation can go from there...
    You started a new thread with the above. I believe I answered it at Question for Christians...

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    Re: Jesus Perfect God and Perfect Man?

    format_quote Originally Posted by Phil12123 View Post
    Mark 10:27. Looking upon them, Jesus said, "With men it is impossible, but not with God; for all things are possible with God."

    ... at least, with MY God! Your god must not be all-powerful. You can't put limitations on GOD!

    Peace
    Seeing as their is only one God, why would he take the form of a human and indulge in what man does? He won't! (think that verse applies to other thing sand not to God taking the form of Man) It may be that Jesus had the attributes of God, but he's not God as God is immortal, in order to obtain immortality you can't be born!
    Jesus Perfect God and Perfect Man?

    Ėk Gusā Alhu Mėrā
    The One Lord, the Lord of the World, is my God Allah.

    Dhan Guru Arjan Dev Mahraaj Ji!

    Kal Meh Bėḏ Atharbaṇ Hū Nā Kẖuḏā Alhu Bẖa.
    In the Dark Age of Kali Yuga, the Atharva Veda became prominent; Allah became the Name of God.

    Dhan Guru Nanak Dev Mahraaj Ji!
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    Re: Jesus Perfect God and Perfect Man?

    Anyway the Bible speaks of God as non-Human so how has God taken the form of a human!
    Jesus Perfect God and Perfect Man?

    Ėk Gusā Alhu Mėrā
    The One Lord, the Lord of the World, is my God Allah.

    Dhan Guru Arjan Dev Mahraaj Ji!

    Kal Meh Bėḏ Atharbaṇ Hū Nā Kẖuḏā Alhu Bẖa.
    In the Dark Age of Kali Yuga, the Atharva Veda became prominent; Allah became the Name of God.

    Dhan Guru Nanak Dev Mahraaj Ji!
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    Re: Jesus Perfect God and Perfect Man?

    Greetings:

    The statement should be better read as " God can do anything that He wills to do."
    No God can’t do as he wills….God has his limits in doing Godly thing
    Can God make another God? Can god lie? No god would not do this.

    As the LORD your God is ONE God, this a completely illogical question that does not warrant asking in the first place
    What are you talking about…The guy said God can do anything… can he?

    Can God kick anyone out of His kingdom?
    The question would be better asked " Can God get anyone into His Kingdom?"


    As for being "kicked" out of Gods Kingdom, the actual problem is getting into the Kingdom in the first place. As every one of us has sinned against God, we have all denied ourselves entry into His Kingdom by making ourselves UNCLEAN. And no UNCLEAN person could exist in the Purity of His Kingdom.
    We are in his kingdom… This earth is Gods kingdom not just hell and heaven.

    God will not "kick" anyone out who He has determined to be there, and He is SO detemined that we get there, that He gave us His Son as the Way in.
    For it is only by God forgiving us for our sin, and making us "CLEAN " that we have any right to that which we have denied ourselves.
    God forgives all who beleive that Jesus died for their sin, and CLEANSES them from all uncleaness by "washing" them down with the Blood shed by His Son.
    Only when God has so purified a person, are they CLEAN enough to enter Gods Kingdom.
    And after doing all these things to guarantee our entry, God will in no wise "kick" out anyone.
    Look, I do not understand what all this clean stuff your talking about… However, God cannot kick you out of his kingdom since their is no other place for you to go….

    Can God make a stone so heavy that he cannot pick it up?
    Someone once said that, Yes, God could do that. But by His very own nature He would not do so.
    So it is ungodly...? So god can’t do anything…

    You then stated:
    Answer is NO to all the above because God has his limits in doing Godly thing
    As none of these things could be considered to be Godly in the first place, then how can the answer be NO?

    What?

    Only a fool would say that god can do anything...
    The problem now was that no such man had ever lived. This is why Jesus came to this earth. Having no human father, and an undefiled (virgin) mother, none of the "rotteness" was inherited. His inheritance was pure, for God was His Father.
    You just said he had No human father so God was His Father?

    I mean wants the objective of being a God-man?
    Can you try to answer this question again? I did not comprehend you answer

    And He done this to make possible a way for sinners to have the price of their sins paid for before they have to enter the Court of Final Judgement.
    Are you limiting god by say he need some man to die for him? Why can’t god just do himself?

    These are totally meaningless questions. They are not even question, they are stating a paradox that by definition can not be done, so there is not even a challange being made.
    Try to understand what I am saying brother. The Guy said God can do anything so why can’t he be a god-man? So I said God has his limits in doing Godly thing. So

    Can God make another God?
    Can God make another God?
    Can God make a stone so heavy that he cannot pick it up?

    The answer is no…So god can’t do anything…because the above is ungodly.


    Idris, the cited article’s logic is flawed; does the Bible not say Satan was created perfect (Do you agree that Satan was created perfect)?
    Satan, a being created perfect, developed a flaw.

    If you are kind enough to grant me that much in this discourse, then what would NOT- allow/prevent any other perfect created-being to sin?
    I have no idea what you talking about sorry..
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    Re: Jesus Perfect God and Perfect Man?

    format_quote Originally Posted by Phil12123 View Post
    Mark 10:27. Looking upon them, Jesus said, "With men it is impossible, but not with God; for all things are possible with God."

    ... at least, with MY God! Your god must not be all-powerful. You can't put limitations on GOD!

    Peace
    A problem we as humans have is to play with words and think we are actually saying something. We sometimes think we have made a valid statement and never understand we said nothing.

    Yes, God(swt) can and will do anything he desires. He has no limitations.


    Now if I were to say can God(SWT) make a 4 sided square that only has 2 sides? The answer is no. Not because God(swt) is limited, but because the statement is flawed. We have already stated that the definition of a square, if it only has 2 sides it is not a square. Sort of like if I were to say if you were to call a dog's tail a leg, how many legs would a dog have. If you answer 5 you would be wrong, because we are only calling it a leg, it is not a leg.

    Our misusing concepts of our language, is not setting any limits on God(swt)
    Jesus Perfect God and Perfect Man?

    Herman 1 - Jesus Perfect God and Perfect Man?

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    Re: Jesus Perfect God and Perfect Man?

    format_quote Originally Posted by AvarAllahNoor View Post
    Seeing as there is only one God, why would he take the form of a human and indulge in what man does? He won't!
    He took the form of a human to die for our sins. That "form" was necessary because without it, He obviously could not die. He "indulged in what man does" to live a perfect, sinless life (which man doesn't) and to then offer Himself as the perfect, spotless Lamb of God for our sins.

    John 1:29. The next day John saw Jesus coming toward him, and said, "Behold! The Lamb of God who takes away the sin of the world!

    Hebrews 4:15 For we do not have a High Priest who cannot sympathize with our weaknesses, but was in all points tempted as we are, yet without sin.

    It may be that Jesus had the attributes of God, but he's not God as God is immortal, in order to obtain immortality you can't be born!
    Whose rule is that? Yours or God's? God doesn't go by your rules. He is sovereign. That means He does what HE wants and answers to NO MAN.

    Isaiah 40:13 Who has directed the Spirit of the Lord, or as His counselor has taught Him?

    Romans 11:
    33. Oh, the depth of the riches both of the wisdom and knowledge of God! How unsearchable are His judgments and His ways past finding out!
    34. "For who has known the mind of the Lord? Or who has become His counselor?''
    35. "Or who has first given to Him and it shall be repaid to him?''
    36. For of Him and through Him and to Him are all things, to whom be glory forever. Amen.

    Isaiah 55:
    8. "For My thoughts are not your thoughts, nor are your ways My ways,'' says the Lord.
    9. "For as the heavens are higher than the earth, so are My ways higher than your ways, and My thoughts than your thoughts.

    Don't try to make up rules for God. His ways are way above ours.

    Peace
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    Re: Jesus Perfect God and Perfect Man?

    Salaam

    this thread is funny.

    i remember some one asking to a chrisitan..

    If god can do anything,,be human then die,,then can that god marry and have children?

    Then the chrisitan say NO....

    When asked why,,,they keep quiet.

    LOL...of course it is in reference to da vinci code.

    But reading this thread i would like to ask any christian here,if god in your mind can do anything,then CAN GOD MARRY AND HAVE CHILDREN..

    Also in teh Quran it is written that IF ALLAH SO WILLS<THE ENTIRE OF MANKIND WILL BE MUSLIM<<<BUT ALLAH DOES NOT..

    thus it shows that Allah restrain Himself.
    Allah create's order and laws and follow it
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    Re: Jesus Perfect God and Perfect Man?

    format_quote Originally Posted by AvarAllahNoor View Post
    Anyway the Bible speaks of God as non-Human so how has God taken the form of a human!
    Yes, God is "non-Human" in the sense that God is God, the Creator, not Human, the creature. So yes, God is "non-Human" from standpoint of Deity vs. Humanity. And He is Holy, and therefore separate from sinful Man.

    But there is nothing in the Bible that says God cannot take on flesh and walk around as Jesus did, etc. If you think there is, I would like to know about it. Again, I think that is one of your rules you have made up for God. Correct me if I'm wrong, with a chapter/verse that says otherwise. The closest that I can find anything like that is Numbers 23:19. "God is not a man, that He should lie, nor a son of man, that He should repent. Has He said, and will He not do it? Or has He spoken, and will He not make it good?" But if you understand the context of what that verse is saying, it means that God does not go back on His word, like men do; what HE says, you can count on.

    When God sent His Son, He was sent "in the likeness of sinful flesh":

    Romans 8:
    1. There is therefore now no condemnation to those who are in Christ Jesus, who do not walk according to the flesh, but according to the Spirit.
    2. For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus has made me free from the law of sin and death.
    3. For what the law could not do in that it was weak through the flesh, God did by sending His own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, on account of sin: He condemned sin in the flesh,
    4. that the righteous requirement of the law might be fulfilled in us who do not walk according to the flesh but according to the Spirit.

    Peace
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    Re: Jesus Perfect God and Perfect Man?

    format_quote Originally Posted by Zulkiflim View Post
    this thread is funny.

    i remember some one asking to a chrisitan..

    If god can do anything,,be human then die,,then can that god marry and have children?

    Then the chrisitan say NO....

    When asked why,,,they keep quiet.

    LOL...of course it is in reference to da vinci code.

    But reading this thread i would like to ask any christian here, if god in your mind can do anything,then CAN GOD MARRY AND HAVE CHILDREN..
    My answer to that would be... hmmmm, I suppose Jesus COULD have married and had children, but it is really a moot point, because HE DIDN'T. He was focused on His purpose in coming... to die for our sins, not to marry and raise a family.

    I think it is proper to begin with the Truth that with God all things are possible, meaning He can do anything. He's all-powerful. But we must qualify that with another Truth that He will only DO WHAT is consistent with His WILL and NATURE. So, for example, He will not lie. It is not that HE does not have the POWER to lie; it just goes against His nature to lie, so He won't lie. Marrying and having children is just something, in my opinion, was not according to His WILL and purposes, and therefore not done.

    Peace
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    Re: Jesus Perfect God and Perfect Man?

    It may be that Jesus had the attributes of God, but he's not God as God is immortal, in order to obtain immortality you can't be born!
    Whose rule is that? Yours or God's? God doesn't go by your rules. He is sovereign. That means He does what HE wants and answers to NO MAN
    See woodrow this is why I say God has his limits in doing Godly thing.
    Lying is ungodly
    Make other god is ungodly....ect
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    Re: Jesus Perfect God and Perfect Man?

    Is God(swt) infinite?
    Is a Man infinite?
    Was Jesus(as) Infinite?

    Is God(swt) all knowing?
    Is a Man all Knowing?
    Was Jesus(as) All knowing?

    Was God(swt) born?
    Is a Man born?
    Was Jesus(as) born?

    Does God(swt) have a created soul?
    Does Man have a created Soul?
    Does Jesus(as) have a created soul?
    Jesus Perfect God and Perfect Man?

    Herman 1 - Jesus Perfect God and Perfect Man?

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    Re: Jesus Perfect God and Perfect Man?

    format_quote Originally Posted by Phil12123 View Post
    My answer to that would be... hmmmm, I suppose Jesus COULD have married and had children, but it is really a moot point, because HE DIDN'T. He was focused on His purpose in coming... to die for our sins, not to marry and raise a family.

    I think it is proper to begin with the Truth that with God all things are possible, meaning He can do anything. He's all-powerful. But we must qualify that with another Truth that He will only DO WHAT is consistent with His WILL and NATURE. So, for example, He will not lie. It is not that HE does not have the POWER to lie; it just goes against His nature to lie, so He won't lie. Marrying and having children is just something, in my opinion, was not according to His WILL and purposes, and therefore not done.

    Peace
    Salaam,

    How can it be moot,can you give me one verse in the bible that say HE WAS NEVER MARRIED?

    As you say god will and nature

    Let see...Supposedly the father sent the son to be reborn as a man....thus god has a child..

    So we know that god can have children and the bible uses a very sexual description of how Mary was impreganted.
    thus if the fahter whom chrisitan say is god,,,,then the son whom chrisitan also say is god,,,can this songod have a child?

    Is it in the chrisitan god nature to beget children,,yes..

    So in what way is it alien to god to not have children?


    As you say,he did not lie or mock or anythign bad,,,but he cursed jew,,umm is that good or bad?
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    Idris's Avatar Full Member
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    Re: Jesus Perfect God and Perfect Man?

    Is God(swt) infinite?
    Is a Man infinite?
    Was Jesus(as) Infinite?

    Is God(swt) all knowing?
    Is a Man all Knowing?
    Was Jesus(as) All knowing?

    Was God(swt) born?
    Is a Man born?
    Was Jesus(as) born?

    Does God(swt) have a created soul?
    Does Man have a created Soul?
    Does Jesus(as) have a created soul?
    Well they say God can do anything...So why not a man-god?

    I say God can't do anything. he does godly things... and a man-god is ungodly like making other god or a god that lies...

    But if since we can't agree on this can someone enlighten me on the aim of being a man-god?
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    Re: Questions about Judaism awnsered by a Jew!

    Nothing offensive here at all.... I am going to list the story of a convert who was disenchanted with Christianity for some of the reasons you listed above. You listed the very core of the corruption in Christianity... Jesus didn't finish what he came here to do but shall return to do so....
    The Bible Led Me to Islam

    Abdul Malik LeBlanc tells how he discovered Islam within the pages of Bible

    During my Christian days there were many verses in the Bible that made me question the religion I was following (Christianity). There was one particular verse, 1 Thessalonians 5:17 which says; "pray without ceasing," that lingered heavily in my mind. I often wondered how a person (Christian) was supposed to pray (be in a state of worship) without ceasing? Without any biblical or divine guidance, the only way I thought this to be possible was to always do good deeds and keep the remembrance of God on my tongue and in my heart.

    However, I found this to be impossible to do as a human being. But when I was introduced to Islam in 1987, and began to read and learn more about this way of life, I found that Islam provided divine guidance both from God (Allah) and Prophet Muhammad (SAW) by which a person could pray (be in a state of worship) without ceasing, if it was the Will of God.

    Whether waking up, eating, sleeping, putting on clothes, being in the presence of a woman, looking at a woman, going shopping, going to the bathroom, looking in the mirror, traveling, visiting the sick, sitting in a non-religious meeting, taking a bath, having sexual intercourse with one’s wife, yawning, cutting you nails, sneezing, greeting people, talking, hosting guests at home, walking, exercising, fighting, entering one’s house, praying and many other acts, Islam and the guidance therein of the Quran, and the acts and sayings of Prophet Muhammad (SAW), provided ways in which I could observe 1 Thessalonians 5:17. In addition, it allowed me to be at peace with myself and in submission to the one True God - Allah (SWT).

    This divine guidance of Islam taught me greatly about my duties, responsibilities and birthright to my Creator (Allah), and more about the religion of Christianity as a Muslim, I [By the Will of Allah (SWT)] felt it necessary to share with you how the Bible led me to Islam.

    Christianity

    Given the fact that there has never been in the history of the Torah (Old Testament) the religion of God to be named after a Prophet (i.e. Adaminity, Abrahamity, Mosanity, etc.), I hope to explain that Jesus did not preach the religion of Christianity, but a religion that gives all Praise and Worship to The One God.

    One of the questions I asked myself as I took an objective (second) look at Christianity was; where did the word Christianity come from and was the word ever mentioned to Jesus? Well, I did not find the word Christianity in the Bible, not even in a Bible dictionary. Specifically, I did not find in the Bible where Jesus called himself a Christian.

    The word Christian was first mentioned by a pagan to describe those who followed Jesus. It is mentioned one of three times in the New Testament by a pagan and Jew in Antioch about 43 AD, (Acts 11:26, Acts 26:28 and 1 Peter 4:16) long after Jesus left this earth. To accept the words of pagans as having any value or association with divinity, Jesus or God is contrary to the teachings of all Prophets.

    Jesus prophesied that people would worship him uselessly and believe in doctrines made by men (Matthew 15:9).

    "But in vain they do worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men." This verse, Matthew 15:9, is further supported by these words of the Quran:

    "And (remember) when Allah will say (on the Day of Resurrection): "O Jesus, son of Mary! Did you say unto men: "Worship me and my mother as two gods besides Allah?" He will say: "Glory be to You! It was not for me to say what I had no right (to say). Had I said such a thing, You would surely have known it. You know what is in my inner-self though I do not know what is in Yours, truly, You, only You, are the All-Knower o fall that is hidden and unseen.

    Never did I say to them aught except what You (Allah) did command me to say: ‘Worship Allah, my Lord and your Lord.’ And I was a witness over them while I dwelt amongst them, but when You took me up, You were a Witness to all things. (This is a great admonition and warning to the Christians of the whole world)." (Al-Ma’idah 5:116-117)

    I found that Biblical verses like John 5:30, John 12:49, John 14:28, Isaiah 42:8 and Acts 2:22 support the above mentioned verses of the Quran.

    Before leaving the subject of Christianity, I should mention one small point of observation. If Christians are Christ-like, why are they not greeting each other with the words; Peace be with you (Salamu Alaikum), as Jesus did in Luke 24:36. As you may be aware, the greeting from one Muslim to another Muslim is Assalamu Alaikum; a Christ-like saying.

    Various Holy Bibles
    It is worth mentioning that the Bible references cited might not be exactly as the Bible you are using. There are MANY Bibles on the market that are used by different Christian sects and all of these sects say that their book, though different, is the word of God. Such Bibles are: The Revised Standard Version 1952 & 1971, New American Standard Bible, The Holy Bible; New International Version, the Living Bible, New World Translation of the Holy Scriptures used by Jehovah Witnesses, Roman Catholic Version and the King James Version. A special note: I have not found in any of these Bibles where the "New Testament" calls itself the "New Testament," and nowhere does the "Old Testament" call itself the "Old? Testament." Also, the word "Bible" is unknown within the pages of the Bible.

    In addition to the many different Christian sects and Bibles, I have learned that there are also different men, not Prophets, who founded these sects and are using various interpretations of the Bible and/or man-made doctrines as their creed.

    I would like to share with you some thoughts that you may not have read or known about the Bible being the word of God. Briefly, let me mention that on September 8, 1957, the Jehovah’s witnesses in their "Awake" magazine carried this startling headline - 50,000 Errors in the Bible. If you ask a Jehovah’s witness about this headline, it may be said that today most of those errors have been eliminated. How many have been eliminated, 5,000? Even if 50 remain, would one attribute those errors to God?

    Let me pose another question: if a "Holy" book contained conflicting verses would you still consider it to be Holy? Most likely you will say of course not. Let me share with you some conflicting verses both in the Old and New Testaments:

    II Samuel 8:4 (vs)
    II Samuel 8:9-10
    II Kings 8:26

    II Samuel 6:23
    Genesis 6:3
    John 5:37

    John 5:31
    I Chronicles 18:4
    I Chronicles 18:9-10

    II Chronicles 22:2
    II Samuel 21:8
    Genesis 9:29

    John 14:9
    John 8:14



    Only two contradictions of the New Testament have been mentioned, but others will be referenced when the Trinity, Divinity of Jesus Christ, Divine Sonship of Jesus, Original Sin and Atonement are reviewed.

    How could the "inspired words" of God get the genealogy of Jesus incorrect (See Matthew 1:6-16 where it states 26 forefathers up to Prophet David, and Luke 3:23-31 says 41 in number). Or for that matter, give a genealogy to Jesus who had NO father? See II Kings 19:1-37, now read Isaiah 37:1-38. Why is it that the words of these verse are identical? Yet they have been attributed to two different authors, one unknown and the other is Isaiah, who are centuries apart; and yet, the Christians have claimed these books to be inspired by God.

    I looked up the word Easter in the Nelson Bible dictionary and learned that the word "Easter" (as mentioned in Acts 12:4) is a mistranslation of "pascha," the ordinary Greek word for "Passover." As, you know Passover is a Jewish celebration not a Christian holiday. I think human hands, all to human, had played havoc with the Bible.

    From the brief points mentioned above, and the fact that Biblical scholars themselves have recognized the human nature and human composition of the Bible (Curt Kuhl, The Old Testament: Its Origin and Composition, PP 47, 51, 52), there should exist in the Christian’s mind some acceptance to the fact that maybe every word of the Bible is not God’s word.

    As a side note to this subject, let me mention that some Christians believe that the Bible was dictated to Prophet Muhammad (SAW) by a Christian monk, and that is why some of the biblical accounts are in the Quran. After some research, I found that this could not have happened because there were no Arabic Bible in existence in the 6th century of the Christian era when Muhammad (SAW) lived and preached. Therefore, no Arab, not even Prophet Muhammad (SAW) who was absolutely unlettered and unlearned, would have had the opportunity to examine the written text of the Bible in his own language.

    The Gospels

    If you read Luke 1:2-3, you will learn, as I did, that Luke (who was not one of the 12 disciples and never met Jesus) said that he himself was not an eyewitness, and the knowledge he gathered was from eyewitnesses, and not as words inspired by God. Incidentally, why does every "Gospel" begin with the introduction According to. Why "according to?" the reason for this is because not a single one of the gospels carries its original author’s autograph! Even the internal evidence of Matthew 9:9 proves that Matthew was not the author of the first Gospel which bears his name:

    "And as Jesus passed forth thence, He (Jesus) saw a man, named Matthew, sitting at the receipt of custom: and He (Jesus) saith unto Him (Matthew), follow me (Jesus). And he (Matthew) arose, and followed Him (Jesus)."

    Without any stretch of the imagination, one can see that the He’s and the Him’s of the above narration do not refer to Jesus or Matthew as its author, but a third person writing what he saw or heard - a hearsay account and not words inspired by God.

    It is worth noting, and well known throughout the religious world, that the choice of the present four "gospels" of the New Testament (Matthew, Mark, Luke and John) were imposed in the Council of Nicea 325 CE for political purposes under the auspices of the pagan Emperor Constantine, and not by Jesus. Constantine’s mind had not been enlightened either by study or by inspiration. He was a pagan, a tyrant and criminal who murdered his son, his wife and thousands of innocent individuals because of his lust for political power. Constantine ratified other decisions in the Nicene Creed such as the decision to call Christ "the Son of God, only begotten of the father."

    Literally, hundreds of gospels and religious writings were hidden from the people. Some of those writings were written by Jesus’ disciples, and many of them were eyewitness accounts of Jesus’ actions. The Nicea Council decided to destroy all gospels written in Hebrew, which resulted in the burning of nearly three hundred accounts. If these writings were not more authentic than the four present gospels, they were of equal authenticity. Some of them are still available such as the Gospel of Barnabas and the Shepherd of Hermas which agree with the Quran. The Gospel of Barnabas, until now, is the only eyewitness account of the life and mission of Jesus. Even today, the whole of the Protestant word, Jehovah’s Witnesses, Seventh Day Adventists and other sects and denominations condemn the Roman Catholic version of the Bible because it contains seven "extra" books. The Protestant have bravely expunged seven whole books from their word of God. A few of the outcasts are the Books of Judith, Tobnias, Baruch and Esther.

    Concerning Jesus’ teachings of the Gospel (Injeel), the Gospel writers frequently mentioned Jesus preaching the Gospel: Matthew 9:35, Mark 8:35, and Luke 20:1. The word "gospel" is recurrently used in the Bible. However, in the New Testament Greek edition the word Evangeline is used in place of the word gospel, which is translated to mean good news. My question was: what Gospel did Jesus preach? Of the 27 books of the New Testament, only a small fraction can be accepted as the words of Jesus, and only of the 27 books are known to be attributed as the Gospel of Jesus. The remaining 23 were supposedly written by Paul. Muslims do believe that Jesus was given God’s "Good News." However, they do not recognized the present four Gospels as the utterances of Jesus.

    The earliest Gospel is that of Mark’s which was written about 60-75 AD. Mark was the son of Barnabas’s sister. Matthew was a tax collector, a minor official who did not travel around with Jesus. Luke’s Gospel was written much later, and in fact, drawn from the same sources as Mark’s and Matthew’s. Luke was Paul’s physician, and like Paul, never met Jesus. By the way, did you know that the names Marks and Luke were not included in the 12 appointed disciples of Jesus as mentioned in Matthew 10:2-4?

    Now the names of the twelve apostles are these; the first, Simon, who is called Peter, and Andrew his brother; James the son of Zebedee, and John his brother; Philip, and Bartholomew; Thomas, and Matthew the publican; James the son of Alphaeus, and Lebbaeus, whose surname was Thaddaeus; Simon the Canaanite, and Judas Iscariot, who also betrayed him.

    John’s Gospel is from a different source, and was written in about 100 AD. He (John) should not be confused with John, the disciple, who was beheaded by Agrippa I in the year 44 CE long before this gospel was written. It should be accepted as a reliable account of the life of Jesus, and whether it should be included in the scriptures.

    Christians, as I once did, boast about the Gospels according to Matthew, according to Mark, according to Luke and according to John. However, if we think about it, there is not a single Gospel according to Jesus himself. According to the preface of the KJV (King James Version) new open Bible study edition, the word "Gospel" was added (see below) to the original titles, "According to John, according to Matthew, according to Luke and according to Mark."

    The permission to call "According to" writings the Gospel was not given by Jesus nor by any other divine guidance. These writings; Matthew, Luke, Mark and John, were never originally to be the Gospel. Therefore, Mark 1:1 can not be a true statement that his writing is the gospel of Jesus.

    It should be mentioned that Muslims must believe in all Divine scriptures in their original form, their Prophets and making no distinction between them: The Suhuf (Abraham); Torah (Moses); Psalms (David); Gospel - or the Injeel (Jesus); and the Quran (Muhammad). It is clearly stated in the Quran 3:3 that Allah sent down the Torah and the Gospel. However, none of these scriptures remains in its original form now, except the Quran, which was sent for all mankind everywhere and for all times.

    In addition to other reasons why the Quran was sent to mankind, as mentioned in 18:4-5 it was sent to warn the Christians of a terrible punishment from God if they cease not in saying: "Allah has begotten a son."

    Muslims sincerely believe that everything Jesus (May the peace and blessing of Allah be upon him) preached was from God; the Gospel (Injeel): The "good news" and the guidance of God for the Children of Israel. There is no place mentioned in the present four Gospels that Jesus wrote a single word of his Gospel, nor is it mentioned that Jesus instructed anyone to do so. What passes off, as the "Gospels" today are the works of third party human hands. The Quran 2:79 says:
    "And woe to those who write the book with their own hands and they say: "This is from Allah (God)." To traffic with it for a miserable price! So woe to them for what their hands do write, and woe to them for what they earn thereby!"

    Jesus As the Son of God
    Is Jesus the Son of God? Matthew 3:17 could be used by some Christians to support the divine Sonship of Jesus. If Matthew 3:17, "And Lo a voice for heaven, saying, this is my beloved son in whom I am well pleased," is used to support divine Sonship, then there should be no other verse that contradicts or gives equal divine Sonship to another person or persons in the Old or New Testament. However, many references were found in the Old and New Testaments that mentioned someone other than Jesus as having a divine Sonship to God. See Exodus 4:22:

    "Israel is my son, even my firstborn." II Samuel 7:14 and I Chronicles 22:10: "...and he shall be my son (Solomon)." Jeremiah 31:9: "...and Ephraim is my firstborn." Also, Psalm 2:7.

    The word "Son" must not be accepted literally because God addresses many of his chosen servants as son and sons. The Jews have also claimed Ezra to be the Son of God. The New Testament Greek words used for "son" (pias and paida, which mean servant or son in the sense of servant) are translated as son in reference to Jesus and as servant in reference to others in some translations of the Bible.

    Further, the term "Father" as used by Jesus corresponds more closely to the term Rabb, i.e. One who nourishes and sustains, so that in Jesus’ doctrine, God is "Father" – Nourisher and Sustainer – of all men. The New Testament also interprets "son of God" to be mystical: "For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God." (Romans 8:14). This mystical suggestion is further supported with Jesus being called the only begotten Son of God.

    In Psalm 2:7, the Lord said to David:

    "...Thou art my son: this day have I begotten thee."

    Does this mean that God had two sons? Jesus also said that God is not only his Father but also your Father (Matthew 5:45, 48). Luke 3:38 says:

    "...Seth, which was the son of Adam, which was the Son of God."

    Who is mentioned in Hebrews 7:3 as like unto the Son of God? It is Melchisedec, King of Salem, as mentioned in Hebrews 7:1. He (Melchisedec) is more unique than Jesus or Adam. Why is he not preferred to be the Son of God? Moreover, Adam did not have a mother or father, but was the first human being created by God and in the likeness of God to exist in the Garden of Eden and on earth. Wouldn’t this give more rights to Adam to be called the Son of God in its truest meaning?

    I would like to share with you an obvious contradiction between John 3:16, Luke 10:25-28 and Matthew 19:16-17. John 3:16 reads:

    "For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten, Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life."

    Now let’s read Luke 10:25-28:

    And, behold, a certain lawyer stood up, and tempted him, saying, Master, what shall I do to inherit eternal life? He said unto him, what is written in the law? How readest Thou? And he answering said, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy strength, and with all thy mind; and thy neighbor as thyself. And he said unto him, Thou hast answered right: this do, and Thou shalt live.

    These verses tell us that the inheritance of eternal life is for anyone who believes and worships no other God, but the One True God. Luke 10:25-28 agrees with Matthew 19:16-17 which says;

    "And behold, one came and said to him (Jesus), Good teacher, what good things shall I do that I may have eternal life? So he (Jesus) said to him, ‘Why do you call me good? – No one is good but One that is, God. But if you want to enter into eternal life, keep the commandments."

    There is no commandment that says to worship Jesus, but there that tells us to worship God alone.

    In Luke 4:41, Jesus refused to be called the Son of God by demons. Do you think that Jesus would rebuke the demons, or anyone else for that matter, for telling the truth? Unquestionably, no! Jesus rebuked the demons because they were saying something false by calling him the Son of God. Also, if the demons knew that Jesus was the Christ, for Jesus to shut them up because they called him the Christ is a contradiction to Jesus’ mission.

    In Luke 9:20 & 21, Jesus said unto his disciples:

    "But who say ye that I am? Peter answered saying, "The Christ of God, and Jesus straightly charged them and commanded them to tell no man that thing."

    Furthermore, verses like John 3:2, John 6:14, John 7:40, Matthew 21:11, Luke 7:16 and 24:19 confirm that Jesus accepted the title of teacher, Prophet and called himself the son of man in Matthew 8:20, 12:40, 17:9 & 12, 26:24, Luke 9:26, 22:48, 22:69, and 24:7. The most conclusive verse that says Jesus is the son (servant) of man is Mark 14:26 where Jesus is mentioning the Day of Reckoning. Jesus specifically said we would see the son of man, not the Son of God, sitting in the right hand of power, and coming in the clouds of heaven.

    The act of begetting is a physical act and such act is against God’s nature. The Qur’an 19:35 says:


    "It is not befitting to (the majesty of) Allah that He should beget a son. Glory be to Him! When He determines a matter He only says to it "Be," and it is." (Maryam 19:35)

    The teachings of Jesus as the Son of God were not preached by Jesus nor accepted by Jesus, but were taught by Paul as supported in Acts 9:20:

    "And straightway he preached Christ in the synagogues, that he is the Son of God."

    Did Jesus ever claim to be God or say, "Here am I, your God, worship me"? The answer is no. For there is no single, unequivocal statement in the Bible whereby Jesus himself declares, "I am God, therefore worship me." Virtually all of the more than two thousand verses of the epistles of Paul are his own fabrications to include Romans 9:5 that says, depending upon which Bible you read:

    "...Christ came, who is overall, the eternally blessed God."

    Christians should know that Paul himself mentions his own gospel, not Jesus, in his epistle to the Romans when he says in Romans 2:16:

    "In the day when God will judge the secrets of men by Jesus Christ, according to my gospel."

    In face, the Pauline epistle to the Romans serves as the foundation of today’s Christianity. Thus, it is the Christians whose efforts will be wasted in this life as they think they were acquiring good by their works when they attribute partners to God, as stated in Chapter 18:103-106 of the Qur’an:


    "Say: Shall we tell you of those who lost most in respect of their deeds? Those whose efforts have been wasted in this life, while they thought that they were acquiring good by their works?" they are those who deny the Signs of their Lord and the fact of their having to meet Him (in the Hereafter): vain will be their works, nor shall We, on the Day of judgment, give them any weight. That is their reward, Hell; because they rejected Faith, and took My Signs and My Messengers by way of jest.
    (Al-Kahf 18:103-106)

    Indeed, it is so strange and ironic, knowing that none of Paul’s epistle to the Romans, more than 430 verses, were ever formulated by Jesus. Paul should have made direct reference to the pristine teachings of Jesus, if only the former claim for apostleship by divine inspiration was indeed true. Instead, large parts of his epistles’ Biblical quotations (notably those in the Epistle to the Romans) were taken from the Old Testament – Genesis, Exodus, Leviticus, Deuteronomy, 2 Samuel, 1 Kings, Psalms, Proverbs, Isaiah, Ezekiel and Hosea. His epistles were, indeed a product of tedious efforts, but that does not make Paul far better than any of the other men who authored the Bible, nor does it make him a Prophet.

    Other practices that were adopted under Paul included the following: the Roman sun-day as the Christian Sabbath; the traditional birthday of the Sun-god as the birthday of Jesus; the emblem of the sun-god (the cross of light) to be the emblem of Christians; and, the incorporation of all the ceremonies which were performed at the Sun-god’s birthday celebrations.

    As I come to a close concerning the position of Christ, I would like to ask my Christian reader bow down and pray earnestly to God and ask Him to invoke His curse on you, your wife, your sons, and your daughters if what you believe about Christ (Christ is God, Son of God or part of a trinity of God) are false. Likewise, I have learned that if you asked a Muslim to earnestly pray to God to invoke His curse on him, his wife, his sons, and his daughters if what he is saying about Christ (Prophet, Messenger of God, A Word from God) are false, the Muslims are firm in their faith knowing that Christ is not God, nor the Son of God and nor part of a trinity of God. This exercise of asking God to invoke His curse on you and your family may sound a bit cruel, but it would prove two points: (1) you would know that you are on the wrong path; and, (2) it would put you on the right path.

    The Crucifixion and Atonement
    A very significant event in the Christian doctrine is the Crucifixion of Jesus. Before talking about the many controversies surrounding the Crucifixion, it should be mentioned that it was a gospel of Paul’s which professed the Crucifixion/Resurrection of Jesus (II Timothy 2:8):

    "Remember that Jesus Christ of the seed of David was raised from the dead according to my gospel."

    In addition, the gospel of the resurrection in Mark 16:9-20 was already removed from the text by gospel writers in the 1952 edition of the Revised Standard Version and then, for some reasons, restored in the 1971 edition. In many Bibles, if not removed, it is printed in small print or between two brackets and with commentary (See the Revised Standard Version, New American Bible and New World Translation of the Holy Scriptures).

    The traditional biblical account of Jesus’ Crucifixion is that he was arrested and crucified by the orders and plans of the chief priest and Jewish elders. This account was denied in the 1960’s by the highest Catholic Christian authority, the Pope. He issued a statement in which he said the Jews had nothing to do with Jesus’ Crucifixion.

    Did any one of the disciples or the writers of the Gospel see the Crucifixion or the Resurrection? No! In Mark 14:50, it says the disciples forsook Jesus and fled. Even Peter forsook Jesus after the cock crowed three times as Jesus foretold:

    (Matthew 26:75) And Peter remembered the word of Jesus, which said unto him, Before the cock crow, thou shalt deny me thrice. And he went out, and wept bitterly.

    The most likely persons whom may have witnessed this moment in Jesus’ life were Mary Magdalene, Mary the mother of James and Joses, the mother of Zebedee’s children and other women (Matthew 27:55-56). However, there is no statement or account in the Gospels from those women as to what they saw or heard.

    The disciple(s) found the sepulchre where Jesus was laid down, empty, and made the conclusion that he was resurrected because the disciples and other witnesses saw him alive after the alleged Crucifixion. Nobody saw the moment he was resurrected. Jesus himself stated that he did not die on the cross in Luke 24:36-41, as explained in the following paragraphs.

    Early Sunday morning, Mary Magdalene went to the sepulchre, which was empty. She saw somebody standing who looked like a gardener. She recognized him after a conversation to be Jesus and wanted to touch him. Jesus said (John 20:17):

    "Touch me not; for I am not yet ascended to my Father..."

    Now read Luke 24:36-41:

    "And as they (disciples) thus spoke, Jesus himself stood in the midst of them and saith unto them, Peace be unto you. But they were terrified and frightened, and supposed that they had seen a spirit. And he said unto them, Why are you troubled? And why so thoughts arise in your hearts? Behold my hands and my feet, that it is I myself: handle me end see; for a spirit hath not flesh and bones, as ye see me have. And when he had thus spoken, he showed them his hands and his feet. And while they yet believed not for joy, and wondered, he said unto them, Have ye here any meat? And they gave him a piece of boiled fish and of a honeycomb. And he took it, and did eat before them."

    Does a spiritual or dead body have a need to eat food? Jesus eating of food was to prove to the disciples that he was not a spirit, but rather, he was still alive and not dead.

    Jesus being alive and not dead is further supported in his own prophecy (Matthew 12:40):

    "For as Jonah was three days and three nights in the whale’s belly; so shall the Son of man be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth."

    Did Jesus fulfill this miracle? Christians would say "yes," because Jesus died and rose three days later according to Luke 24:36 and Matthew 20:19, to name a few verses. However, in line with the miracle of Jonah and according to the Bible, Jesus only spent one day and two nights in the sepulchre, and not three days and three nights as he prophesied.

    Jesus was put in the sepulchre just before sunset on Friday (Good Friday) and was found missing before sunrise on Sunday (Easter). If we were to s-t-r-e-t-c-h the time frame a bit, one may say that Jesus spent three days in the earth, but there is no way and I repeat, no way, that Jesus spent three nights in the earth. We must not forget that the Gospels are explicit in telling us that it was "before sunrise" on Sunday morning that Mary Magdalene went to the tomb of Jesus and found it empty.

    Consequently, there are some inconsistencies as to whether Jesus fulfilled his own prophecy. Whether he was actually crucified, or if the day (Good Friday) of his alleged Crucifixion is wrong. Another significant point to mention is that Jonah was alive in the belly of the whale. The Christians says, Jesus was dead in the belly of the earth/tomb, and this contradicts Jesus’ own prophecy. Jesus said (Luke 11:30):

    "As Jonah was...so shall the Son of man be."

    If Jonah was alive, so was Jesus.

    One critical event that took place before the alleged Crucifixion was the prayer of Jesus to God for help. Luke 22:42:

    "Saying Father if thou be willing, remove this cup (of death) from me: nevertheless not my will, but thine be done."

    Jesus’ prayer not to die on the cross was accepted by God according to Luke 22:43 and Hebrews 5:7. Therefore, if all of Jesus’ prayer were accepted by God, including not to die on the cross, how could he have died on the cross?

    In Matthew 27:46, it states that while Jesus was on the cross, he said:

    "Eli, Eli, lama sabachtani (My God, my God, why hast thou forsaken me?).

    If Jesus said these words, it represents a blatant declaration of disbelief according to all theological authorities. This is a great insult as such words could only come from an unbeliever in God. Further, it is incredible that such words should come from a Prophet of God, because God never breaks His promise and His Prophets never complained against His promise, especially when the Prophet’s mission is understood. It could be said that whoever relates that this statement was said by a Prophet (Jesus), is a disbeliever.

    Muslims believe, as the Qur’an states, Jesus was not crucified. It was the intention of his enemies to put him to death on the cross, but Allah saved him from their plot. Qur’an 4:157:

    "That they (Jews) said boasting, "We killed Christ Jesus, the son of Mary, the Messenger of Allah, but they (Jews) killed him not, nor crucified him..."

    (An Nisa 4:157)
    Jesus Perfect God and Perfect Man?

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  20. #35
    Joe98's Avatar
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    Re: Jesus Perfect God and Perfect Man?

    format_quote Originally Posted by Idris
    ...can someone enlighten me on the aim of being a man-god?

    A man can feel pain on the cross. A god cannot.
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    Re: Jesus Perfect God and Perfect Man?

    A man can feel pain on the cross. A god cannot.

    Sorry but can't your god do anythink? why can't he feel pain?
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    Re: Jesus Perfect God and Perfect Man?

    A man can feel pain on the cross. A god cannot.
    format_quote Originally Posted by Idris View Post
    Sorry but can't your god do anything? why can't he feel pain?
    The original question was "...can someone enlighten me on the aim of being a man-god?" I assume you mean the purpose of Jesus' being the God-Man. Joe had the right idea, but I would say, God can't die on the cross and shed blood for our sins, so THE WORD had to be made flesh (John 1:1,14) so He would have a mortal body that could die. When Jesus was "in the form of God" (Phil. 2:6) before taking the "form of a servant," He could not die. Not sure He could "feel pain" either, without a physical body, other than to simply have knowledge of pain, since He's all-knowing. It would be like asking, Does God ever get thirsty? That is a human reaction to dehydration or a lack of drink. How would God get thirsty without having the human body that needs thirst quenching?

    Peace
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    Re: Jesus Perfect God and Perfect Man?

    format_quote Originally Posted by Phil12123 View Post
    Yes, God is "non-Human" in the sense that God is God, the Creator, not Human, the creature. So yes, God is "non-Human" from standpoint of Deity vs. Humanity. And He is Holy, and therefore separate from sinful Man.

    But there is nothing in the Bible that says God cannot take on flesh and walk around as Jesus did, etc. If you think there is, I would like to know about it. Again, I think that is one of your rules you have made up for God. Correct me if I'm wrong, with a chapter/verse that says otherwise. The closest that I can find anything like that is Numbers 23:19. "God is not a man, that He should lie, nor a son of man, that He should repent. Has He said, and will He not do it? Or has He spoken, and will He not make it good?" But if you understand the context of what that verse is saying, it means that God does not go back on His word, like men do; what HE says, you can count on.

    When God sent His Son, He was sent "in the likeness of sinful flesh":

    Romans 8:
    1. There is therefore now no condemnation to those who are in Christ Jesus, who do not walk according to the flesh, but according to the Spirit.
    2. For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus has made me free from the law of sin and death.
    3. For what the law could not do in that it was weak through the flesh, God did by sending His own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, on account of sin: He condemned sin in the flesh,
    4. that the righteous requirement of the law might be fulfilled in us who do not walk according to the flesh but according to the Spirit.

    Peace
    I follow the Sikh religion so i'm going by what my scriptures tell me.

    Jesus never once claimed to be God, that's just Christian followers perceiving him to be. For example Guru Nanak or Mohammed (to my knowledge) never claimed to be God, but were the slaves/servants of the Almighty. Now if Sikhs decided that Guru Nanak WAS God and started making effigies and worshipping him, we'd have gone against what God had preached via Guru Nanak. This is where Christianity falters, you've decided Jesus was God and that's it! You've gone against what Jesus preached! - Did Jesus claim he WAS God? Let's see some verses?
    Last edited by AvarAllahNoor; 08-07-2006 at 09:11 AM.
    Jesus Perfect God and Perfect Man?

    Ėk Gusā Alhu Mėrā
    The One Lord, the Lord of the World, is my God Allah.

    Dhan Guru Arjan Dev Mahraaj Ji!

    Kal Meh Bėḏ Atharbaṇ Hū Nā Kẖuḏā Alhu Bẖa.
    In the Dark Age of Kali Yuga, the Atharva Veda became prominent; Allah became the Name of God.

    Dhan Guru Nanak Dev Mahraaj Ji!
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  24. #39
    AvarAllahNoor's Avatar Full Member
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    Re: Jesus Perfect God and Perfect Man?

    format_quote Originally Posted by Phil12123 View Post
    He took the form of a human to die for our sins. That "form" was necessary because without it, He obviously could not die. He "indulged in what man does" to live a perfect, sinless life (which man doesn't) and to then offer Himself as the perfect, spotless Lamb of God for our sins.

    John 1:29. The next day John saw Jesus coming toward him, and said, "Behold! The Lamb of God who takes away the sin of the world!

    Hebrews 4:15 For we do not have a High Priest who cannot sympathize with our weaknesses, but was in all points tempted as we are, yet without sin.



    Whose rule is that? Yours or God's? God doesn't go by your rules. He is sovereign. That means He does what HE wants and answers to NO MAN.

    Isaiah 40:13 Who has directed the Spirit of the Lord, or as His counselor has taught Him?

    Romans 11:
    33. Oh, the depth of the riches both of the wisdom and knowledge of God! How unsearchable are His judgments and His ways past finding out!
    34. "For who has known the mind of the Lord? Or who has become His counselor?''
    35. "Or who has first given to Him and it shall be repaid to him?''
    36. For of Him and through Him and to Him are all things, to whom be glory forever. Amen.

    Isaiah 55:
    8. "For My thoughts are not your thoughts, nor are your ways My ways,'' says the Lord.
    9. "For as the heavens are higher than the earth, so are My ways higher than your ways, and My thoughts than your thoughts.

    Don't try to make up rules for God. His ways are way above ours.

    Peace
    With all due respect, i think like many folks you've misinterpretted the verses to make them what they're not actually meant to be!
    Jesus Perfect God and Perfect Man?

    Ėk Gusā Alhu Mėrā
    The One Lord, the Lord of the World, is my God Allah.

    Dhan Guru Arjan Dev Mahraaj Ji!

    Kal Meh Bėḏ Atharbaṇ Hū Nā Kẖuḏā Alhu Bẖa.
    In the Dark Age of Kali Yuga, the Atharva Veda became prominent; Allah became the Name of God.

    Dhan Guru Nanak Dev Mahraaj Ji!
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  26. #40
    i_m_tipu's Avatar Full Member
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    Re: Jesus Perfect God and Perfect Man?

    First I must mention it “may Allaah forbid me”


    Re: Jesus Perfect God and Perfect Man?

    How can anyone dream that
    GOD lower himself to became a man in order to establish His law.

    How can anyone dream that
    GOD lower himself to became a man in order to face harsh behave from man

    How can anyone dream
    GOD lower himself to became a man in order to face sectarian punishment from man

    How can anyone dream that
    GOD lower himself to became a man in order to face sectarian punishment from man

    How can anyone dream that
    GOD lower himself to became a man in order to face physically sinful events and ideas

    Why GOD came into a land of children of Israel
    solves only that nation’s problems
    Preaching only to that nation people

    if Jesus (pbuh) is GOD than why he failed to make all convince

    if Jesus (pbuh) is GOD than why he failed to solve all crisis

    list goes on and on…………………



    And it is known to all that man is the best creature and the worst

    History witness lot of man on the era of each Prophets thinks them they are some kind of GOD

    Still now some poor knowledged people in the world in various religion worship various man.

    I wonder
    Why people make a man GOD

    God communicate with man by Prophets in order to established the Law of GOD

    That why GOD send so many Prophets into various nation.

    GOD chose a man (prophet)
    From whom he communicate
    And general people communicate with prophets
    This is the procedure of communicating with GOD to general peoples

    Why there is only one time a prophet become a GOD by some of his follower

    GOD never communicate with people directly
    Only prophet have that honor
    for his super human naturals

    list will goes on and on...........



    Poor people fail to realise who is GOD

    GOD is HE
    WHO created the thing that exits

    HE belong to every where in every single mind

    GOD knows the every single fate of every single livings.
    some of the living have guidance and some not

    GOD is capable of doing everything beyond to our knowledge and thinking

    i have not that much knowledge to describes all of his capabilities
    Jesus Perfect God and Perfect Man?


    Here i am, God! wwwislamicboardcom - Jesus Perfect God and Perfect Man? i'm at your service
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