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    fschmidt's Avatar
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    Intelligence?

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    What is the Islamic view of intelligence? Is intelligence something that should be developed, and if yes, how?

    The dramatic drop in intelligence in the modern world that I have seen in my lifetime greatly concerns me. I believe that one of the main causes of this is electronic entertainment which entertains the brain into passivity and atrophy. It seems to be that children should not be exposed to this mental poison. Instead, children should read and do puzzles and play games like chess or the game of Go.

    Only a religion can promote the proper raising of children on a large scale. Both traditional Anabaptists and Orthodox Jews have the sense to keep modern mental poison out of the home. What is the Muslim position on this?
    Last edited by fschmidt; 07-22-2017 at 04:43 AM.
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    Intelligence?


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    Zafran's Avatar
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    Re: Intelligence?

    salaam

    I agree with you - people also reading less and watching more - its clearly going to have an impact.
    Intelligence?

    Do you think the pious don't sin?

    They merely:
    Veiled themselves and didn't flaunt it
    Sought forgiveness and didn't persist
    Took ownership of it and don't justify it
    And acted with excellence after they had erred - Ibn al-Qayyim

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    Re: Intelligence?

    إِنَّ فِي خَلْقِ السَّمَاوَاتِ وَالأَرْضِ وَاخْتِلاَفِ اللَّيْلِ وَالنَّهَارِ لآيَاتٍ لِّأُوْلِي الألْبَابِ {190
    003:190
    Verily! In the creation of the heavens and the earth, and in the alternation of night and day, there are indeed signs for those who possess intelligence.

    الَّذِينَ يَذْكُرُونَ اللّهَ قِيَامًا وَقُعُودًا وَعَلَىَ جُنُوبِهِمْ وَيَتَفَكَّرُونَ فِي خَلْقِ السَّمَاوَاتِ وَالأَرْضِ رَبَّنَا مَا خَلَقْتَ هَذا بَاطِلاً سُبْحَانَكَ فَقِنَا عَذَابَ النَّارِ {191
    003:191
    Those who remember Allah standing, sitting, and lying down on their sides, and think deeply about the creation of the heavens and the earth, "Our Lord! You have not created this without purpose, glory to You! Give us salvation from the torment of the Fire.

    رَبَّنَا إِنَّكَ مَن تُدْخِلِ النَّارَ فَقَدْ أَخْزَيْتَهُ وَمَا لِلظَّالِمِينَ مِنْ أَنصَارٍ {192
    003:192
    "Our Lord! Verily, whom You admit to the Fire, indeed, You have disgraced him, and never will the Zalimun (polytheists and wrong-doers, unjust) find any helpers.

    رَّبَّنَا إِنَّنَا سَمِعْنَا مُنَادِيًا يُنَادِي لِلإِيمَانِ أَنْ آمِنُواْ بِرَبِّكُمْ فَآمَنَّا رَبَّنَا فَاغْفِرْ لَنَا ذُنُوبَنَا وَكَفِّرْ عَنَّا سَيِّئَاتِنَا وَتَوَفَّنَا مَعَ الأبْرَارِ {193
    003:193
    "Our Lord! Verily, we have heard the call of one calling to Faith: 'Believe in your Lord,' and we have believed. Our Lord! Forgive us our sins and remit from us our evil deeds, and make us die in the state of righteousness along with Al-Abrar (those who are obedient to Allah and follow strictly His Orders).





    فَلَوْلاَ كَانَ مِنَ الْقُرُونِ مِن قَبْلِكُمْ أُوْلُواْ بَقِيَّةٍ يَنْهَوْنَ عَنِ الْفَسَادِ فِي الأَرْضِ إِلاَّ قَلِيلاً مِّمَّنْ أَنجَيْنَا مِنْهُمْ وَاتَّبَعَ الَّذِينَ ظَلَمُواْ مَا أُتْرِفُواْ فِيهِ وَكَانُواْ مُجْرِمِينَ {116

    Why were there not, among the generations before you, persons possessing a remnant (of balanced good sense), prohibiting from mischief in the earth - except a few among them whom We saved? But the wrong-doers pursued the enjoyment of the good things of life which were given them, and persisted in sin.



    تَكَادُ تَمَيَّزُ مِنَ الْغَيْظِ كُلَّمَا أُلْقِيَ فِيهَا فَوْجٌ سَأَلَهُمْ خَزَنَتُهَا أَلَمْ يَأْتِكُمْ نَذِيرٌ {8
    067:008
    It almost bursts up with fury. Every time a group is cast therein, its keeper will ask: "Did no warner come to you?"

    قَالُوا بَلَى قَدْ جَاءنَا نَذِيرٌ فَكَذَّبْنَا وَقُلْنَا مَا نَزَّلَ اللَّهُ مِن شَيْءٍ إِنْ أَنتُمْ إِلَّا فِي ضَلَالٍ كَبِيرٍ {9
    067:009
    They will say: "Yes indeed; a warner did come to us, but we belied him and said: 'Allah never sent down anything (of revelation), you are only in great error.'"

    وَقَالُوا لَوْ كُنَّا نَسْمَعُ أَوْ نَعْقِلُ مَا كُنَّا فِي أَصْحَابِ السَّعِيرِ {10
    067:010
    And they will say: "Had we but listened or used our intellect, we would not have been among the dwellers of the blazing Fire!"



    أَمِ اتَّخَذُوا مِن دُونِ اللَّهِ شُفَعَاء قُلْ أَوَلَوْ كَانُوا لَا يَمْلِكُونَ شَيْئًا وَلَا يَعْقِلُونَ {43
    039:043
    Have they taken others as intercessors besides Allah? Say: "Even if they have power over nothing whatever and have no understanding?



    وَعَادًا وَثَمُودَ وَقَد تَّبَيَّنَ لَكُم مِّن مَّسَاكِنِهِمْ وَزَيَّنَ لَهُمُ الشَّيْطَانُ أَعْمَالَهُمْ فَصَدَّهُمْ عَنِ السَّبِيلِ وَكَانُوا مُسْتَبْصِرِينَ {38
    029:038
    And 'Ad and Thamud! And indeed it is clearly apparent to you from their dwellings. Shaitan (Satan) made their deeds fair-seeming to them, and turned them away from the (Right) Path, though they were seeing.



    قُل لاَّ يَسْتَوِي الْخَبِيثُ وَالطَّيِّبُ وَلَوْ أَعْجَبَكَ كَثْرَةُ الْخَبِيثِ فَاتَّقُواْ اللّهَ يَا أُوْلِي الأَلْبَابِ لَعَلَّكُمْ تُفْلِحُونَ
    005:100
    Say: The evil and the good are not alike even though the plenty of the evil attract you.
    So be mindful of your duty to Allah, O you who possess intelligence that you may succeed.
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    Re: Intelligence?

    I appreciate you for starting this thread. Memorization of Quran increases intelligence and sharp mindedness in children.
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    Intelligence?

    Allah (swt) knows best

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    fschmidt's Avatar
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    Re: Intelligence?

    Memorization increases some kinds of intelligence. Obviously memory is increased and probably the ability to absorb information. But I think this should be balanced by exercises in critical thinking. The obvious examples would include math, puzzles, and strategic games. This kind of thinking is needed for science, engineering, and warfare. Muslim societies haven't done well in these areas recently, so it may be time to start developing this mental strength in Muslim children.

    I have recently decided that I want to seriously support Islam, even though I don't plan to become Muslim. I think Islam offers the best moral framework currently available. But the best way for me to support Islam is to try to strengthen what are its current weaknesses, and I think critical thinking is an obvious choice. I plan to return to attending my local Islamic center regularly in a few weeks and then I will discuss this with the leadership there.

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    Re: Intelligence?

    Quote Originally Posted by Abz2000 View Post
    إِنَّ فِي خَلْقِ السَّمَاوَاتِ وَالأَرْضِ وَاخْتِلاَفِ اللَّيْلِ وَالنَّهَارِ لآيَاتٍ لِّأُوْلِي الألْبَابِ {190
    003:190
    Verily! In the creation of the heavens and the earth, and in the alternation of night and day, there are indeed signs for those who possess intelligence.

    الَّذِينَ يَذْكُرُونَ اللّهَ قِيَامًا وَقُعُودًا وَعَلَىَ جُنُوبِهِمْ وَيَتَفَكَّرُونَ فِي خَلْقِ السَّمَاوَاتِ وَالأَرْضِ رَبَّنَا مَا خَلَقْتَ هَذا بَاطِلاً سُبْحَانَكَ فَقِنَا عَذَابَ النَّارِ {191
    003:191
    Those who remember Allah standing, sitting, and lying down on their sides, and think deeply about the creation of the heavens and the earth, "Our Lord! You have not created this without purpose, glory to You! Give us salvation from the torment of the Fire.

    رَبَّنَا إِنَّكَ مَن تُدْخِلِ النَّارَ فَقَدْ أَخْزَيْتَهُ وَمَا لِلظَّالِمِينَ مِنْ أَنصَارٍ {192
    003:192
    "Our Lord! Verily, whom You admit to the Fire, indeed, You have disgraced him, and never will the Zalimun (polytheists and wrong-doers, unjust) find any helpers.

    رَّبَّنَا إِنَّنَا سَمِعْنَا مُنَادِيًا يُنَادِي لِلإِيمَانِ أَنْ آمِنُواْ بِرَبِّكُمْ فَآمَنَّا رَبَّنَا فَاغْفِرْ لَنَا ذُنُوبَنَا وَكَفِّرْ عَنَّا سَيِّئَاتِنَا وَتَوَفَّنَا مَعَ الأبْرَارِ {193
    003:193
    "Our Lord! Verily, we have heard the call of one calling to Faith: 'Believe in your Lord,' and we have believed. Our Lord! Forgive us our sins and remit from us our evil deeds, and make us die in the state of righteousness along with Al-Abrar (those who are obedient to Allah and follow strictly His Orders).





    فَلَوْلاَ كَانَ مِنَ الْقُرُونِ مِن قَبْلِكُمْ أُوْلُواْ بَقِيَّةٍ يَنْهَوْنَ عَنِ الْفَسَادِ فِي الأَرْضِ إِلاَّ قَلِيلاً مِّمَّنْ أَنجَيْنَا مِنْهُمْ وَاتَّبَعَ الَّذِينَ ظَلَمُواْ مَا أُتْرِفُواْ فِيهِ وَكَانُواْ مُجْرِمِينَ {116

    Why were there not, among the generations before you, persons possessing a remnant (of balanced good sense), prohibiting from mischief in the earth - except a few among them whom We saved? But the wrong-doers pursued the enjoyment of the good things of life which were given them, and persisted in sin.



    تَكَادُ تَمَيَّزُ مِنَ الْغَيْظِ كُلَّمَا أُلْقِيَ فِيهَا فَوْجٌ سَأَلَهُمْ خَزَنَتُهَا أَلَمْ يَأْتِكُمْ نَذِيرٌ {8
    067:008
    It almost bursts up with fury. Every time a group is cast therein, its keeper will ask: "Did no warner come to you?"

    قَالُوا بَلَى قَدْ جَاءنَا نَذِيرٌ فَكَذَّبْنَا وَقُلْنَا مَا نَزَّلَ اللَّهُ مِن شَيْءٍ إِنْ أَنتُمْ إِلَّا فِي ضَلَالٍ كَبِيرٍ {9
    067:009
    They will say: "Yes indeed; a warner did come to us, but we belied him and said: 'Allah never sent down anything (of revelation), you are only in great error.'"

    وَقَالُوا لَوْ كُنَّا نَسْمَعُ أَوْ نَعْقِلُ مَا كُنَّا فِي أَصْحَابِ السَّعِيرِ {10
    067:010
    And they will say: "Had we but listened or used our intellect, we would not have been among the dwellers of the blazing Fire!"



    أَمِ اتَّخَذُوا مِن دُونِ اللَّهِ شُفَعَاء قُلْ أَوَلَوْ كَانُوا لَا يَمْلِكُونَ شَيْئًا وَلَا يَعْقِلُونَ {43
    039:043
    Have they taken others as intercessors besides Allah? Say: "Even if they have power over nothing whatever and have no understanding?



    وَعَادًا وَثَمُودَ وَقَد تَّبَيَّنَ لَكُم مِّن مَّسَاكِنِهِمْ وَزَيَّنَ لَهُمُ الشَّيْطَانُ أَعْمَالَهُمْ فَصَدَّهُمْ عَنِ السَّبِيلِ وَكَانُوا مُسْتَبْصِرِينَ {38
    029:038
    And 'Ad and Thamud! And indeed it is clearly apparent to you from their dwellings. Shaitan (Satan) made their deeds fair-seeming to them, and turned them away from the (Right) Path, though they were seeing.



    قُل لاَّ يَسْتَوِي الْخَبِيثُ وَالطَّيِّبُ وَلَوْ أَعْجَبَكَ كَثْرَةُ الْخَبِيثِ فَاتَّقُواْ اللّهَ يَا أُوْلِي الأَلْبَابِ لَعَلَّكُمْ تُفْلِحُونَ
    005:100
    Say: The evil and the good are not alike even though the plenty of the evil attract you.
    So be mindful of your duty to Allah, O you who possess intelligence that you may succeed.
    Abz,

    Good job on references to help the reader. I guess you are good for something. Intelligence?

    -- Dan Edge
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    Abz2000's Avatar
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    Re: Intelligence?

    Quote Originally Posted by DanEdge View Post
    Abz,

    Good job on references to help the reader. I guess you are good for something. Intelligence?

    -- Dan Edge
    Oh my, thank you, i am over the moon lol, actually i am bursting with pride and grinning like an idiot at the fact that dan edge has commended me,
    Thank God, now i know for certain that i must be good for sumfink coz the dan edge doth say that it is so.
    Last edited by Abz2000; 10-16-2017 at 01:11 PM.
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    Re: Intelligence?

    Quote Originally Posted by fschmidt View Post
    What is the Islamic view of intelligence? Is intelligence something that should be developed, and if yes, how?

    The dramatic drop in intelligence in the modern world that I have seen in my lifetime greatly concerns me. I believe that one of the main causes of this is electronic entertainment which entertains the brain into passivity and atrophy. It seems to be that children should not be exposed to this mental poison. Instead, children should read and do puzzles and play games like chess or the game of Go.

    Only a religion can promote the proper raising of children on a large scale. Both traditional Anabaptists and Orthodox Jews have the sense to keep modern mental poison out of the home. What is the Muslim position on this?
    Its subjective..

    If you are to say that education has some role in our position within society..

    Thats not entirely correct.

    If you say that intellect has some role in out position within society then that is not entirely correct either..

    There is a difference between the two..

    I do not believe..

    That people today are stupid.. Although they may be uneducated..

    Although the opposite also applies.. not all educated people are clever.

    It depends on the situation, the objective.

    I mean, if your talking about nothing.. is nothing said?

    If you can find a translation of surah ya seen.. its informative.

    "Both traditional Anabaptists and Orthodox Jews-have the sense to keep modern mental poison out of the home"

    Depravity of thought counts for much.. i have to wonder what they do with the time they have..

    Keeping bad things out of the home and the community counts for much.

    Although this one stumped me..

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...apartment.html

    I am not keen on chess.. Although i used to play football..

    And iv said it before,

    Iv never seen anyone turn up, week in and week out.. and not get better.

    ..although i quit call of duty when i kept getting 360 noscoped on the regular.

    Now im a businessman and it feels like more is taken than given..

    It makes me feel stupid but all i have is time..

    I dont chase anything because when you cant move..

    Its all brought to you..

    They all look like bruce lee from here..

    Flowing freely like water.

    You would much rather believe in intellect and education i suppose.

    ...but donald trump is still president of the usa.

    I really like how you used the phrase "mental poison" ..i have not yet encountered a beneficial conversation in 3 years..

    I dont have it in me to reply lol.
    Last edited by M.I.A.; 10-16-2017 at 04:52 PM.

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    Eien's Avatar
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    Re: Intelligence?

    Quote Originally Posted by fschmidt View Post
    I have recently decided that I want to seriously support Islam, even though I don't plan to become Muslim. I think Islam offers the best moral framework currently available. But the best way for me to support Islam is to try to strengthen what are its current weaknesses, and I think critical thinking is an obvious choice. I plan to return to attending my local Islamic center regularly in a few weeks and then I will discuss this with the leadership there.
    I am really intrigued by your opinion. When you say you want to support it by addressing its weaknesses, you are suggesting that critical thinking is not encouraged by Islam. I am curious as to what understanding of 'Islam' lead to this idea.

    I agree that critical thinking and reasoning should be supported in all circumstances. Would you be willing to share your plan here?

    Also, you list your religion as other.. would you mind discussing that a bit here?

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    Re: Intelligence?

    Quote Originally Posted by Eien View Post
    I am really intrigued by your opinion. When you say you want to support it by addressing its weaknesses, you are suggesting that critical thinking is not encouraged by Islam. I am curious as to what understanding of 'Islam' lead to this idea.

    I agree that critical thinking and reasoning should be supported in all circumstances. Would you be willing to share your plan here?
    Right now there is no group in the world that encourages critical thinking. The Western classical education of the 1700s and 1800s did encourage critical thinking, but that is dead. Islam stresses memorization, as in memorizing the Quran, but there is no emphasis on exercises in critical thought.

    A related problem is what I would call the inshallah problem. This is blaming God for one's own failures. Of course this wasn't what the Quran was aiming at when it suggested saying inshallah. There are two extremes. One extreme is to ignore God and believe that one can do anything regardless of God's will. This is clearly wrong and is what the Quran was criticizing. But the other extreme is to be passive and then blame God for failure, and this is equally wrong and is common today in Islam. The correct approach is to try as hard as possible. If one fails, it is God's will, but quite possibly because you didn't try hard enough. So one should keep trying until one either succeeds or realizes that the goal is impossible. Instead of "inshallah", it would be better to say "unless God prevents it".

    Good mental puzzles address both these issues, by developing critical thinking and encouraging perseverance. My focus is primarily on children since that is when one's mentality develops. My mosque has a school and I am pushing Singapore Math for the math curriculum.

    http://www.singaporemath.com/Primary_Math_s/21.htm

    I also bought some puzzles for one of the leaders of the mosque for his kids. I got these:

    https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00000DMER/
    https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01G3Q5IY2/

    I plan to discuss organizing a "brain games" activity time for kids of the mosque. I would buy a bunch of puzzles and games for the kids to play.

    I know about these things because I homeschooled my own kids. I would like to apply what I learned to help the kids of the mosque to develop their minds and to learn that perseverance is critical for success.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Eien View Post
    Also, you list your religion as other.. would you mind discussing that a bit here?
    This needs a separate post since it is a different question. I follow the Old Testament. The Quran and the Old Testament have the same values but the means to achieving those values is different. The Quran is based on submission and acceptance of what is taught there. I grew up as an atheist and I am naturally very skeptical and stubborn. I don't think I have ever submitted to anyone or anything in my life, and I have never accepted supernatural beliefs. So the Old Testament is a better fit for me. But I think the Quran is better for most people. I believe that either book works, and that followers of both books are natural allies since the values are the same.

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    anatolian's Avatar
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    Re: Intelligence?

    Quote Originally Posted by fschmidt View Post
    Right now there is no group in the world that encourages critical thinking. The Western classical education of the 1700s and 1800s did encourage critical thinking, but that is dead. Islam stresses memorization, as in memorizing the Quran, but there is no emphasis on exercises in critical thought.
    Quran encourages to think again and again. Read it.
    3 | Likes greenhill, Eien, Abz2000 liked this post
    Intelligence?

    Amantu billahi wa malaikatihi wa kutubihi wa rusulihi wal-yawmil-akhiri wa bil-qadari khayrihi wa sharrihi minallahi taala wal-ba’thu ba’dal-mawti haqqun ashhadu an la ilaha illallah wa ashhadu anna Muhammadan abduhu wa rasuluhu

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    fschmidt's Avatar
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    Re: Intelligence?

    Quote Originally Posted by anatolian View Post
    Quran encourages to think again and again. Read it.
    I have no doubt that it does. The question is, how effectively are today's Muslims doing what the Quran encourages?
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    Intelligence?


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    Re: Intelligence?

    Quote Originally Posted by fschmidt View Post
    I have no doubt that it does. The question is, how effectively are today's Muslims doing what the Quran encourages?
    I thought you blamed Islam with this "Islam stresses memorization, as in memorizing the Quran, but there is no emphasis on exercises in critical thought." Quran itself encourages to think.

    Todays Muslims do not represent Islam. Most of todays Muslims are not understaing and applying Quran. But you fall in the same mistake of anti Islamists by confusing the religion with its followers. Even if all people are doing it wrong you are responsible of doing it right.
    1 | Likes greenhill liked this post
    Intelligence?

    Amantu billahi wa malaikatihi wa kutubihi wa rusulihi wal-yawmil-akhiri wa bil-qadari khayrihi wa sharrihi minallahi taala wal-ba’thu ba’dal-mawti haqqun ashhadu an la ilaha illallah wa ashhadu anna Muhammadan abduhu wa rasuluhu

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    M.I.A.'s Avatar
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    Re: Intelligence?

    "I don't think I have ever submitted to anyone or anything in my life, and I have never accepted supernatural beliefs."


    ...now this..

    Is something you should really think about..

    But you wont.

    This is the covering over the eyes..at the very least.-

    ..And it is there for a reason.-

    You really must be quicker than you think... literally.. to achieve such a feat.

    Amazing.



    "I have no doubt that it does. The question is, how effectively are today's Muslims doing what the Quran encourages?"

    ...depends on the definition of success you adhere to.. maybe they are all like you.

    After all, how much can any one person know? ..and to what end.

    ..i have actually worked with teachers in training..

    Everyone needs a part time job.


    I em.. borrowed this from another place..

    You will never find a more wretched hive of scum and villainy.

    Testing gif..

    https://i.imgur.com/RX3VxDj.gifv
    Last edited by M.I.A.; 10-19-2017 at 01:44 PM.
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    Re: Intelligence?

    Quote Originally Posted by Abz2000 View Post
    Oh my, thank you, i am over the moon lol, actually i am bursting with pride and grinning like an idiot at the fact that dan edge has commended me,
    Thank God, now i know for certain that i must be good for sumfink coz the dan edge doth say that it is so.
    I prefer Mr the dan edge, but in your case I'll let it slide, since yer smert.

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    'Abd-al Latif's Avatar
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    Re: Intelligence?

    Quote Originally Posted by fschmidt View Post
    What is the Islamic view of intelligence? Is intelligence something that should be developed, and if yes, how?
    In summary, the Prophet "Whoever follows a path in the pursuit of knowledge, Allah will make a path to Paradise easy for him." (Bukhari, Kitaab al-'Ilm, 10).

    Ignorance is looked down upon in Islam and being knowledgable is highly praised.
    2 | Likes DyingLight, Abz2000 liked this post
    Intelligence?

    And verily for everything that a slave loses there is a substitute, but the one who loses Allah will never find anything to replace Him.”
    [Related by Ibn al-Qayyim in ad-Dâ' wad-Dawâ Fasl 49]



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    Re: Intelligence?

    The Prophet (peace and blessings of Allah be upon him) told us what was happen in the past and what still not happen in the future until the owners of paradise enter the paradise and fire owners enter the fire. The Prophet (peace and blessings of Allah be upon him) told us what scientists have recently discovered from the stages of fetal growth to the seven heavens and outer space.Everything was told by the Messenger of Allah and yet Allah said "(( And mankind have not been given of knowledge except a little))”surah Al Isra 85

    We must know beyond that even if it is impossible, the prophet (peace and blessings of Allah be upon him) said about knowledge seeker : “[Whoever follows a path in the pursuit of knowledge, Allah will make a path to Paradise easy for him]
    ” (Narrated by al-Bukhaari, Kitaab al-‘Ilm, 10)

    knowledge seeker have a great status in Islam and this is evidenced by the Quranic verses and the many prophetic Ahadeeth that encourage knowledge .
    2 | Likes DyingLight, Abz2000 liked this post

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    'Abd-al Latif's Avatar
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    Re: Intelligence?

    In fact the first verse to be revealed by God to Muhammad was "read". The Muslim scholars say that this verse highlights the status of knowledge in Islam i.e. the first verse ever to be revealed praised the status of knowledge and of those who posses it.

    In case you're wondering about the wording 'first verse to be revealed', the Qur'an wasn't revealed in one go. It was revealed bit by bit during a period of 23 years.
    Last edited by 'Abd-al Latif; 10-19-2017 at 05:02 PM.
    1 | Likes Abz2000 liked this post
    Intelligence?

    And verily for everything that a slave loses there is a substitute, but the one who loses Allah will never find anything to replace Him.”
    [Related by Ibn al-Qayyim in ad-Dâ' wad-Dawâ Fasl 49]



  23. #19
    M.I.A.'s Avatar
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    Re: Intelligence?

    "A related problem is what I would call the inshallah problem. This is blaming God for one's own failures. Of course this wasn't what the Quran was aiming at when it suggested saying inshallah. There are two extremes. One extreme is to ignore God and believe that one can do anything regardless of God's will. This is clearly wrong and is what the Quran was criticizing. But the other extreme is to be passive and then blame God for failure, and this is equally wrong and is common today in Islam. The correct approach is to try as hard as possible. If one fails, it is God's will, but quite possibly because you didn't try hard enough. So one should keep trying until one either succeeds or realizes that the goal is impossible. Instead of "inshallah", it would be better to say "unless God prevents it"."

    ...if you have time then please watch the video, for how the shiek thinks it works..

    The Secret to Islamic Success - Night Prayers (Tahajud) - Shiekh Ahmad Musa Jibril

    It goes on in complexity..

    https://youtu.be/XUgD91WrSFg

    ..we have no idea how we turn up, what we do or how we are percieved..

    Or what the persuit of things costs.

    We are all different..

    But i dont think iv met people who blame god for failure..

    Im just really not very good at making choices.
    Last edited by M.I.A.; 10-19-2017 at 09:46 PM.

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    Re: Intelligence?

    Quote Originally Posted by anatolian View Post
    Todays Muslims do not represent Islam. Most of todays Muslims are not understaing and applying Quran. But you fall in the same mistake of anti Islamists by confusing the religion with its followers. Even if all people are doing it wrong you are responsible of doing it right.
    How do you define Islam? I can't think of how to define a religion other than what the religion's followers do. The scripture of a religion is something different from the religion itself. That is because any scripture needs interpretation.

    In any case, my goal is to encourage thinking in my local mosque, and since that seems in line with the Quran, I hope this will be accepted.

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