Sorry i have a few questions that i have been pondering over and i tried to look some up but i have not gotten very far on it so i thought i would ask here. i mean no disrespect. they are honest questions. I am going to post them separately so that the threads don't blend together :-)
Throughout the centuries many peoples/cultures/countries have had stories about the gates of hell. that it was a tangible place that people could visit assuming they could escape again. most never returned. but there are also many near death experiences where people have "come back" and described hell in such detail and have become deeply religious because of the experience.
So i wanted to know what the islamic standpoint is on the physical gates of hell and if near death experiences are a topic that is covered.
Thank you in advance.
Nobody living could have ever seen the gates of hell because hell doesn't exist yet and neither does Paradise. They won't until Judgment Day. No one who's had a "near death experience" has actually been fully braindead or else there wouldn't have been anything "near" about it. Their brains must have still been functioning, and they were obviously hallucinating.
there's three existence for us:
this world, the barzakh (when we die), akhirah (when we are resurrected, where paradise and hell exist).
there's veil between them, so there's no such thing as "gates of hell on earth".
in barzakh, however, we may get a glimpse of our own fate: paradise or hell.
Last edited by Ramadhan; 01-29-2011 at 02:38 AM.
Agreed with naidmar
Assalaamu Alaykum,
I'm not sure what the basis is for this understanding, but thought I would share the following with you:format_quote Originally Posted by Yahya Sulaiman
The scholars of Ahl al-Sunnah wa’l-Jamaa’ah are agreed that Paradise and Hell are two created things that exist at present. None of them doubt that because of the volume of evidence from the Qur’aan and Sunnah which indicates that...
http://islamqa.com/en/ref/14526
Then why does al-barzakh last until Judgment Day? Come to think of it, why bother with a Judgment Day at all?format_quote Originally Posted by Muhammad
I don't understand... why does the barzakh or Day of Judgement have to negate the present existence of Paradise and Hellfire?
Because one can hardly be in al-barzakh and heaven or hell at the same time. You die, you go into al-barzakh until Judgment Day, then you go to heaven or hell. Each part of the timeline is occupied. If heaven and hell are around now, why do the scriptures speak in multiple places of the fires being lit on Judgment Day? Where are heaven and hell now before the tearing down and restructuring of the universe?
Reward and d-a-m-n-ation do currently exist for those in the grave in some form or other, yes, and if that's what you mean then I agree. But the true and final reward and punishment doesn't come until the world ends, at which point those who were in the grave will think they've tarried only a little while.
Re: A physical hell? Gates of Hell on Earth? Near death experiences?
Asalaamu Alaikum, My brother this is an incorrect belief for Heaven and Hell were created before mankind was. Please read the following:format_quote Originally Posted by Yahya Sulaiman
Paradise and Hell Have Already Been Created
At-Tahhaawi said, in his book on al-'Aqeedah al-Salafiyyah (correct belief in accordance with that of the early generations of Islaam) that is known as al-'Aqeedah al-Tahhaawiyyah.
"Paradise and Hell have already been created. They will never come to an end or cease to exist. Allaah (swt) created Paradise and Hell before the rest of creation, and He (swt) created inhabitants for each of them. Whoever He (swt) wishes (will enter) Paradise by His grace and mercy, and whoever He (swt) wishes (will enter Hell) as a result of His (swt) justice. Every person will behave according to that for which he was created, and his destiny will be that for which he was created; good deeds and evil deeds are foreordained for all men".
Muhammad ibn Muhammad ibn Abul-'Izz al-Hanafi remarked, in his commentary on this text:
"With regard to his saying that Paradise and Hell have already been created, Ahl as-Sunnah agree that Paradise and Hell have been created and are in existence at the present moment. Ahlus-Sunnah continued to hold this view, until some odd ideas of the Mu'tazilah and Qaadariyyah came along, which denied that. These groups said: "Allaah will create them (ie Paradise and Hell) on the Day of Resurrection." They said this because of their false arguments by means of which they seek to improve regulations on what Allaah (swt) should do; (they say) it befits Allaah (swt) to do this, or it does not befit Allaah (swt) to do that. They compare Him to His creation and their actions. This is a kind of anthropomorphism with regard to deeds; they have allowed the ideas of Jahmiyyah (a sect of Mu'tazilah named after the deviant, Jahm ibn Safwan) to creep into their thinking, and have become mu'attalah (those who deny that Allaah can see). They said, "It does not make sense for Paradise to be created before the time of reward, because it will not be used or inhabited for a very long time. They rejected the aayaat and reports that contradict these false notions they seek to project onto Allaah (swt). They misinterpreted the texts and accused those who disagreed with them of going astray and concocting bid'ah".
Proofs from the Qur'aan and Hadeeth in support of this are, for example:
"Race with one another in hastening towards forgiveness from your Lord, and Paradise the width whereof is as the width of the heaven and the earth, prepared for those who believe in Allaah and His Messengers. That is the Grace of Allaah, which He bestows on whom He is pleased with. And Allaah is the Owner of Great Bounty". (57:21)
"...for Paradise as wide as are the heavens and the earth, prepared for al-Muttaqun" (3:133)
"And fear the fire, which is prepared for the disbelievers" (3:131)
"And indeed he (Muhammad) saw him (Jibreel) at a second descent (ie another time), near Sidrat al-Muntahaa (lote tree of the utmost boundary (beyond which none can pass), near it is the Paradise of Abode" (53:13-15)
The Prophet (Sallallahu Alaihi Wasallam) saw Sidrat al-Muntahaa, a tree in Heaven, and near it, Paradise, as is mention in al-Bukhaari, and Muslim in the hadith of Annas (Ra). At the end of this narrative of al-Israa, the Prophet (Sallallahu Alaihi Wasallam) said, "Then Jibreel brought me to Sidrat al-Muntahaa which was veiled in colours indescribable. Then I entered Paradise, and its lights were of pearls and its soil was musk".
Muslim, Abu Dawud and Imaam Ahmad report from Abu Hurayrah (ra) that the Messenger (Sallallahu Alaihi Wasallam) said, "When Allaah (swt) created Paradise and Hell, He sent Jibreel to Paradise, saying "Go and look at it and at what I have prepared therein for its inhabitants". So he went and looked at it and at what Allaah had prepared therein for its inhabitants.... then He sent him to Hellfire saying, "Go and look at it and what I have prepared therein for its inhabitants" So he looked at it and saw that it was in layers, one above the other...."
Muslim reports from Aishah (Ra) that there was a solar eclipse in the time of the Messenger (Sallallahu Alaihi Wasallam) and he said, "Whilst I was standing here I saw everything that you have been promised, I even saw myself picking some of the fruits of Paradise, when you saw me stepping forward. And I saw Hellfire, parts of it consuming other parts, when you saw me stepping backward".
Al-Bukhaari and Muslim report from Ibn 'Abbas the same incident, "I saw Paradise and I tried to take a bunch of its fruit. If I had managed to do so, you would have eaten from it until the end of time. And I saw the Fire of Hell, and I have never seen anything so horrific or terrifying. I saw that the majority of its inhabitants are women."
Muslim also reports from Annas that the Prophet (Sallallahu Alaihi Wasallam) said, "By the One in Whose Hand is my soul, if you had seen what I saw, you would laugh little and cry much." They said, "What did you see, O Messenger of Allaah?", He said, "I saw Paradise and Hell".
The Prophet (Sallallahu Alaihi Wasallam) also ascended into jannah on the night of Mi'raj in his 'Isra (night journey): for example -
* "...I saw four rivers flowing out from beneath Sidrat al-Muntahaa, two visible and two hidden." (Muslim, Kitaab al-Imaan, Baab al-'Israa, 1/150, no.164)
* "Whilst I was walking in Paradise I saw a river whose banks were domes of hollow pearls and I asked, "What is this, O Jibreel?" He said, "This is al-Kawthar which your Rabb has given to you". (from Anas ibn Maalik, Sahih al-Bukhaari, Kitaab ar-Riqaaq, Baab fil-Hawd, Fath al-Baari, 11/464)
Al-Bukhaari and Muslim report from Jaabir that the Messenger of Allaah said, "I entered Paradise where I saw ar-Rumaysa, the wife of Abu Talhah. And I heard footsteps and asked, "Who is that?" He (Jibreel) said, "That is Bilaal". And I saw a palace with women in its courtyard. I asked, "Whose is this?" They said, It is for 'Umar ibn al-Khattab" (Mishkaat al-Masaabih, 3/226)
Imaam Ahmed, Ibn Hibbaan and al-Haakim report from Abu Hurayrah that the Prophet (saw) said, "The children of the believers are in Paradise, being cared for by Ibraahim (as) [and in the narration of Abu Nu'aym, ad-Dawylami, and Ibn Asakir it adds- "and Sarah, until they give them back to their parents on the day of Resurrection"]
Al-Bukhaari and Muslim also report from 'Abdullaah ibn 'Umar (ra) that the Messenger of Allaah (Sallallahu Alaihi Wasallam) said, "When anyone of you dies, he will be shown his position morning and evening. If he is one of the people of Paradise then he will be one of the people of Paradise, and if he is one of the people of Hell, then he will be one of the people of Hell, and he will be told, "This is your position, until Allaah (swt) resurrects you on the Day of Resurrection".
According to al-Muwatta of Imaam Maalik and as-Sunaan, Abu Dawood, "Ka'b ibn Maalik said the Messenger of Allaah (Sallallahu Alaihi Wasallam) said, "Verily the soul of the believer is a bird hanging on to the trees of Paradise, until Allaah Swt returns it to its body on the day of Resurrection"
This makes it clear that souls will enter Paradise before the Day of Resurrection.
As for the specious arguments of those who say that Hell has not been created yet, they say: If it was already created now, then it would of necessity have to come to an end of the Day of Resurrection and everyone in it would have to perish because Allaah says: "Everything will perish save His Face" (28:88) and "Everyone shall taste death.." (3:185)
The response to this is: If you mean that Paradise does not exist until the Trumpet is blown and people are resurrected from their graves, then this is incorrect and is refuted by the evidence quoted above and other proofs which we have not mentioned here. If you mean that Allaah (swt) has not yet completed the creation of everything that He will prepare for the inhabitants of Paradise and that He is still creating more and more things in it, and that when the believers enter Paradise, Allaah (swt) will create even more things in it, then this is true and cannot be refuted, and the evidence that you give can only mean this, but when you use the aayah - "Everything will perish save His Face" - as evidence, your problem is that you misinterpret this aayah. Using it to prove that Paradise and Hell do not yet exist is like your colleagues using it to prove that they will both be destroyed and their inhabitants will all perish! You and your scholars did not understand the aayah properly; only the leaders (great scholars) of Islaam have understood it properly. They say that "everything" for which Allaah (swt) has decreed destruction and oblivion "will perish" but Paradise and Hell have been created to last forever and never pass away, as has the Throne, which forms the roof of Paradise.
"It was suggested that it meant that everything would perish except His dominion, or whatever was done for His sake. Another suggestion was that when Allaah (swt) revealed the word: "Whatever is on it will perish" - the angels said, "The people of earth are doomed", and hoped that they would remain. Allaah said that the people of heaven and earth would perish and said, "And invoke not any other ilaah along with Allaah, Laa ilaaha illaa Huwaa. Everything will perish save His Face" (28:88) because He is the Living and does not die. The angels realise that they too were destined to die. Their words should be taken in the light of and reconciled with other clear and unambiguous reports that prove that both Paradise and Hell are eternal".
(Sharh at-Tahaawiyyah, p.479, see also Siddeeq Hasan Khan, Yaqadhah ula al-'i'tibaar, p. 37 and 'Aqeedah as-Safarini 2/230)
Taken from: AL-JANNAH WA AN-NAR
In The Light of the Qur'aan and Sunnah
Based on the Book by Dr. Umar Sulaiman al-Ashqar
And Allah knows best in all matters
Last edited by Hamza Asadullah; 01-30-2011 at 02:08 AM.
there is something in the quran that says of the dead that they are with allah although we percieve them not.
dont know how this contributes to the discussion.
You need to base your rationalizing on qur'an and sunnah.format_quote Originally Posted by Yahya Sulaiman
and as has been shown by the brothers above, qur'an and sunnah say that paradise and hell already exist, although they may not yet "activated", especially hell.
We don't know where paradise and hell are, but it they are certainly not of this universe (many qur'an verse speak about they beauty of paradise that even our minds cannot comprehend), so your "rationalizing" that paradise and hell cannot exist because this universe is yet to be torn down and rebuilt is illogical at best.
"Not yet activated"? Does it make a difference then?
If they're around now then are the dead there or in al-barzakh?
format_quote Originally Posted by Yahya Sulaiman
There are ahadith to the effect that Windows are opened in the graves to Paradise and Hellfire, whilst the person is in the state of the Barzakh.
Ahmad (10577) narrated that Abu Sa’eed al-Khudri said: I attended a funeral with the Messenger of Allaah (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him). The Messenger of Allaah (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “O people, this ummah will be tested in their graves. When a man is buried and his friends leave him, an angel with a hammer in his hand comes and sits by him and asks, ‘What do you say about this man?’ If he is a believer, he says, ‘I bear witness that there is no god but Allaah and that Muhammad is His slave and Messenger.’ He says, ‘You have spoken the truth.’Then a door to Hell is opened for him and he says, ‘This would have been your place if you had disbelieved in your Lord, but because you believed, this is your place.’ Then a door to Paradise is opened for him and he wants to go there, but the angel says to him, ‘Calm down,’ and his grave is made wide and spacious for him. But if he is a kaafir or a hypocrite, (the angel) says to him, ‘What do you say about this man?’ He says, ‘I do not know, I heard the people saying something.’ The angel says, ‘You did not know and you did not follow those who knew and you were not guided.’ Then a door to Paradise is opened for him and he says, ‘This would have been your position if you had believed in your Lord. But because you disbelieved, Allaah has replaced it for you with this.’ Then a gate to Hell
Ahmad (10577) narrated that Abu Sa’eed al-Khudri said: I attended a funeral with the Messenger of Allaah (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him). The Messenger of Allaah (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “O people, this ummah will be tested in their graves. When a man is buried and his friends leave him, an angel with a hammer in his hand comes and sits by him and asks, ‘What do you say about this man?’ If he is a believer, he says, ‘I bear witness that there is no god but Allaah and that Muhammad is His slave and Messenger.’ He says, ‘You have spoken the truth.’ Then a door to Hell is opened for him and he says, ‘This would have been your place if you had disbelieved in your Lord, but because you believed, this is your place.’ Then a door to Paradise is opened for him and he wants to go there, but the angel says to him, ‘Calm down,’ and his grave is made wide and spacious for him. But if he is a kaafir or a hypocrite, (the angel) says to him, ‘What do you say about this man?’ He says, ‘I do not know, I heard the people saying something.’ The angel says, ‘You did not know and you did not follow those who knew and you were not guided.’ Then a door to Paradise is opened for him and he says, ‘This would have been your position if you had believed in your Lord. But because you disbelieved, Allaah has replaced it for you with this.’ Then a gate to Hell is opened for him, and he strikes him a blow with the hammer which is heard by all of Allaah’s creation apart from the two races (of mankind and the jinn).” Some of the people said, “O Messenger of Allaah, there is no one who would have an angel standing by him holding a hammer but he would dumbfounded.” The Messenger of Allaah (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “Allaah will keep firm those who believe, with the word that stands firm.” [Ibraaheem 14:27 – interpretation of the meaning]Classed as saheeh by al-Albaani in his commentary on Kitaab al-Sunnah by Ibn Abi ‘Aasim, 865
is opened for him, and he strikes him a blow with the hammer which is heard by all of Allaah’s creation apart from the two races (of mankind and the jinn).” Some of the people said, “O Messenger of Allaah, there is no one who would have an angel standing by him holding a hammer but he would dumbfounded.” The Messenger of Allaah (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “Allaah will keep firm those who believe, with the word that stands firm.” [Ibraaheem 14:27 – interpretation of the meaning]
Classed as saheeh by al-Albaani in his commentary on Kitaab al-Sunnah by Ibn Abi ‘Aasim, 865
http://www.islamqa.com/en/ref/8829
i think the same is with hell aswell, that people will walk around it and between it but will only see it after it has become too late.
..cant remember where i read that though.
Paradise and Hell already exist as Brother Hamza and Qatada pointed out. jazak Allah for those Posts.
When people die some remain in Barzakh while some among mankind are sent to Paradise...
Book 14, Number 2514 Abu Dawud
The Prophet (saw) said When your brethren were smitten at the battle of Uhud, Allah put their spirits in the crops of green birds which go down to the rivers of Paradise, eat its fruit and nestle in lamps of gold in the shade of the Throne. Then when they experienced the sweetness of their food, drink and rest, they asked: Who will tell our brethren about us that we are alive in Paradise provided with provision, in order that they might not be disinterested in jihad and recoil in war? Allah Most High said: I shall tell them about you; so Allah sent down; "And do not consider those who have been killed in Allah's path." till the end of the verse.
Its this Verse ..(3:169) Think not of those slain in the way of Allah as dead. Indeed they are living, and with their Lord they have their sustenance
The Martyrs are living in Paradise in the bodies of green birds.
also the Prophet (saw) informed us that 3 types of people go to paradise after they die.
Book 14, Number 2515 Abu Dawud
Prophet (saw) said "Prophets are in Paradise, martyrs are in Paradise, infants are in Paradise and children buried alive are in Paradise."
(2:154) And do not say of those who are slain in the way of Allah, "they are dead." In fact, they are alive but you do not perceive that life.
Sayyidina Abu Hurayrah reported that Allah’s Messenger said, “I saw Jafar flying in
paradise with the angels.”(book on Merits, Tirmizi)
Jafar Ibn Abi Talib (r.a) was martyred during the Battle of Mutah.
Alsalamu Alaikum
Brother Yahya it seems is under the impression that if Heaven and Hell exist now, when we die, we go straight to them. That is not the case. They both exist, as the sources above show.
I would add this hadith to the list;
"We were with the Messenger of Allah (saw) and we heard the sound of something falling. The Prophet (saw) said, "Do you know what that was?" We said, "Allah and His Messenger know best". He said, "That was a stone that was thrown into Hell seventy years ago and it was falling through Hell until now". (Muslim, Kitaab al-Jannah, Baab fi shiddat haar an-naar, 4/2184 no. 2844)
Allah(swt) knows best.
format_quote Originally Posted by Grofica
Salaam hope your doing fine.
could you please tell who was it that experienced. Because Allah (swt) says in the Quran In Surah Al Anaam Verse 61
"And He alone holds sway over His Servants. And He sends forth heavenly forces (Angels) to watch over you until, when death approaches any of you, Our messengers cause him to die: and they do not over look (anyone)."
"....who do not disobey God in whatever He has commanded them, but (always) do what they are bidden to do." (66:06)
So the Angels never make any mistake, not even a slight one, when dealing in giving Death to one of the human beings. Allah (swt) makes it clear that they are never neglectful. So a person if his/her life taken away will not return, once death occurs.
However what i understand from your words is may be you speak of the those who Dream and in their dreams they see horrible suffering of the Hell fire, as Allah (swt) makes them see if He wills to, and then they change themselves and become religious. Allah (swt) knows best.
Just to add a couple more points:
It has been mentioned that the souls of the dead can enter heaven or hell. Then on the Day of Judgement they will enter with both body and soul. For examples/more details of this, you can read the discussion in Tafseer Ibn Katheer here: http://tafsir.com/default.asp?sid=40&tid=46144Because one can hardly be in al-barzakh and heaven or hell at the same time. You die, you go into al-barzakh until Judgment Day, then you go to heaven or hell. Each part of the timeline is occupied.
Also the following link:
http://www.islamqa.com/en/ref/4003/spirit
Perhaps you are referring to the verses about the seas being kindled with fire on the Day of Judgement. Allaah (swt) knows best about that. Note that there is a hadeeth which mentions that, “Hell will be brought on the Day of Judgment, it will have 70,000 ropes, with 70,000 angels pulling on each rope.” (Muslim)If heaven and hell are around now, why do the scriptures speak in multiple places of the fires being lit on Judgment Day?
And Allaah (swt) knows best.
also im sure i have read of when the prophet mohammed pbuh was shown the various levels of hell so they must have existed.
another thing i read is of the angel micheal that he has never smiled since the invention of hell.
if these are dubious please let me know.. i cant remember where i read them.
So is Judgment Day just there for those who are still alive when it happens?
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