is voting really haram?

format_quote Originally Posted by Misbah0411

From the examples of the Rightly Guided Khalifah and further on, there was no mass general election where people would go into voting booths and cast ballots to choose their candidate. The people of influence in the society would be the ones who would make the determination as who would be the next Khalifah. Then the general masses would follow suit once they arrived at a decision. And in the beginning, whoever Medina chose, then rest of the towns and provinces would follow suit with what is called the bai'ah (pledge). Those of the people of influence would directly pledge to the newly appointed leader and the general masses in the rest of the territories would give the bai'ah to his appointed governors. Abu Bakr's appointment came in the courtyard of Sa'ad ibn Ubaadah when Umar impetuously grabbed Abu Bakr's hand and made bai'ah to squash any fitnah that was going to occur. The others of the Ansar followed afterwards. Umar was chosen by Abu Bakr on his deathbed. Uthman was chosen though shura (council) of six potential candidates selected by Umar. As you can see, none of this was the decision of the general masses. When the people of influence made their decision, then the common people obeyed. Lastly and more importantly, all of these people (those appointed and those who made the decision) were Muslims and implemented Shariah, the Law of Allah. They were not participating to establish or keep in place man-made laws. This is kufr. Voting in the political process of the disbelievers suggests that you would rather abide by that law, be complicit in perpetuating that law, are pleased with that law. This is kufr. Democracy is the will of the people. Not the Will of Allah. Muslims better get their affairs in order and stop imitating the disbelievers in their politics. Also, when a Muslim votes like many of them have done with Western candidates who eventually got elected, then those Muslims are complicit with whatever of warfare and oppression that those leaders subject the Muslims around the world. Also, of the evil laws they implement like allowing gay marriage. Let that be on your conscious. You assisted in putting them there with your vote. You suffer the consequences on the Day of Judgement for your participation in that political process. And Allah Knows Best

so you think that accepting man made laws is kufr...?

format_quote Originally Posted by Scimitar

[/snip]...

...I mean, I still find pencils in ballot booths.... I used a pen once and was told, "you must use the pencil provided"... why? so they can rub out my vote and pencil in someone for me instead?

I mean, no one is that stupid, are they?

Oh wait, did I mention ballot box scandals?

That one is a thread on its own.

Scim

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-37845164 Oh boy oh boy...

format_quote Originally Posted by BBC

People could get the choice of a pen as well as a pencil when they go to vote, after fraud fears at the EU referendum.

format_quote Originally Posted by BBC

The Electoral Commission received "almost 200 calls" from voters worried about using a pencil on 23 June.

Lib Dem Lord Rennard has asked the government if it would provide "special ballot pens" instead of pencils.

And the Electoral Commission says it is looking at "alternatives to providing pencils for voters in polling stations which could improve confidence".

format_quote Originally Posted by BBC

The issue of using pencils to vote became an issue on social media for people voting in June's referendum who feared ballot papers filled out in pencil could be rubbed out and changed, leading the hashtag #usepens to gain traction on Twitter.

Meanwhile, the Govt agencies contact China to find pens that can have their marks erased... pencil or pen, your vote aint worth sheeeeeet.

Except, maybe some extra points on your experian/equifax credit rating. LOL. And let's face it. That just promotes the haraam of riba.

Scimi

format_quote Originally Posted by azc

yes, and concept of shura was given by Hz umar :RA:

That didn't last long, only a few generations.

After that, we entered the rule of Kings, instead of justly chosen Khaliphs. Now, we're in the time of Tyrants.

Voting? what difference does it really make when the whole charade is a circus act?

Scimi

A list of notable elections involving voter fraud or procedural challenge

This is a list of notable elections involving accusations of direct voter fraud or in which the results were procedurally contested, extensively protested, or recognized as fraudulent by a reliable international organization.

• United States of America New York gubernatorial election, 1793 - John Jay received more votes than George Clinton, but on technicalities the votes of Otsego, Tioga and Clinton counties were disqualified and not canvassed, giving George Clinton a slight majority in the official result.
• Bleeding Kansas election, March 30, 1855 - An election to decide whether Kansas should be a free state or a slave state involving massive immigration to sway the vote and resulted in post-election violence, including a severe beating of a US Senator by a Congressman. The events it encompasses directly presaged the American Civil War.
• United States presidential election, 1876 - One of the most disputed and controversial presidential elections in American history between Samuel J. Tilden and Rutherford B. Hayes, resolved by the Compromise of 1877.
• New York State Senate election 1891 in Dutchess County
• Romanian general election, 1946
• Bulgarian republic referendum, 1946
• Hungarian parliamentary election, 1947
• United States presidential election, 1960^[1] Some accounts claimed that mobster Sam Giancana and his Chicago crime syndicate played a role in Kennedy's victory in Illinois.^[1]
• Greek legislative election, 1961
• Uruguayan general election, 1971 - the result was extremely tight (the official candidate Juan María Bordaberry won the election by less than 13,000 votes) and there were accusations of fraud in some electoral circuits
• Philippine presidential election, 1986 (see also People Power Revolution)
• Jammu and Kashmir Legislative Assembly Election, 1987-The insurgency in the Indian state of Jammu and Kashmir has been linked to the allegations that the election was rigged in favour of the National Conference Party of Farooq Abdullah.^[2]
• Mexican general election, 1988
• Burmese general election, 1990 (see also 8888 Uprising)
• Algerian legislative election, 1991 (see also Algerian Civil War)
• Serbian general election, 1992
• Serbian parliamentary election, 1993
• Chadian presidential election, 1996
• Russian presidential election, 1996
• Armenian presidential election, 1996
• Serbian general election, 1997
• Serbian presidential election, 1997
• Chadian parliamentary election, 1997
• Armenian presidential election, 1998 ^[3]
• Peruvian general election, 2000^[4][5]
• Yugoslavian general election, 2000 (see also Overthrow of Slobodan Milošević)
• Sri Lankan parliamentary election, 2000
• United States presidential election, 2000
• United Kingdom general election, 2001^[6][7]
• United Kingdom general election, 2005^{[8][9][10][11][12][13]}
• 2002 New Hampshire Senate election phone jamming scandal^[14]
• Armenian presidential election, 2003
• Georgian parliamentary election, 2003 (see also Rose Revolution)
• United States presidential election, 2004
• Romanian general election, 2004
• Philippine general election, 2004 (see also Hello Garci scandal)
• Ukrainian presidential election, 2004 (see also Orange Revolution)
• Washington gubernatorial election, 2004
• Egyptian presidential election, 2005
• Ethiopian general election, 2005
• Palestinian legislative election, 2006
• Ugandan general election, 2006
• Belarusian presidential election, 2006
• Thai general election, 2006 (2005–06 Thai political crisis)
• Mexican general election, 2006
• Italian general election, 2006
• Hong Kong local elections, 2007
• Nigerian general election, 2007
• Kenyan general election, 2007 (see also 2007–08 Kenyan crisis)
• Russian legislative election, 2007^{[15][16][17][18][19]}
• Armenian presidential election, 2008 (2008 Armenian presidential election protests)
• Cambodian general election, 2008
• Zimbabwean general election, 2008^[20][21]
• Algerian presidential election, 2009
• Iranian presidential election, 2009 (see also 2009 Iranian presidential election protests)
• Afghan presidential election, 2009
• Iraqi parliamentary election, 2010
• Ethiopian general election, 2010
• Ivorian presidential election, 2010
• Myanmar general election, 2010
• Haitian general election, 2010–2011
• Hong Kong local elections, 2011
• Ugandan general election, 2011
• Thai general election, 2011
• Canadian federal election, 2011 (Robocall scandal alleging widespread election fraud and voter suppression^{[22][23][24][25][26][27][28]})
• Russian legislative election, 2011 (see also 2011–13 Russian protests)
• Hong Kong legislative election, 2012
• Syrian parliamentary election, 2012 (see also Syrian Civil War)
• Russian presidential election, 2012 (see also 2011–13 Russian protests)
• Ivorian parliamentary election, 2011
• Myanmar by-elections, 2012
• Armenian parliamentary election, 2012
• Mexican general election, 2012 (see also Yo Soy 132)
• Ukrainian parliamentary election, 2012
• Jordanian general election, 2013
• Armenian presidential election, 2013 (2013 Armenian protests)
• Kenyan general election, 2013
• Venezuelan presidential election, 2013^[29]
• Malaysian general election, 2013^[30]
• Bulgarian parliamentary election, 2013
• Cambodian general election, 2013 (2013–14 Cambodian protests)
• Pakistani general election, 2013
• Zimbabwean general election, 2013
• Guinean legislative election, 2013
• Mauritanian parliamentary election, 2013
• Bangladeshi general election, 2014
• Thai general election, 2014 (2013–14 Thai political crisis)
• Libyan Constitutional Assembly election, 2014 (Inter-civil war violence in Libya)
• Turkish local elections, 2014 (2013–14 protests in Turkey)
• Afghan presidential election, 2014
• Hungarian parliamentary election, 2014
• Algerian presidential election, 2014
• Iraqi parliamentary election, 2014
• South African general election, 2014^{[citation needed]}
• Malawian general election, 2014
• Syrian presidential election, 2014 (Syrian Civil War)
• Libyan Council of Deputies election, 2014 (Libyan Civil War (2014–present))
• Brazilian presidential election, 2014
• Ukrainian presidential election, 2014 (Ukrainian crisis)
• Mauritanian presidential election, 2014
• Turkish presidential election, 2014
• Fijian general election, 2014
• Ukrainian parliamentary election, 2014 (Ukrainian crisis)
• Romanian presidential election, 2014 (2012–14 unrest in Romania)
• Bahraini general election, 2014
• Sri Lankan presidential election, 2015
• Zambian presidential election, 2015
• Sudanese general election, 2015
• Togolese presidential election, 2015
• Ethiopian general election, 2015
• Burundian legislative election, 2015 (2015 Burundian unrest)
• Burundian presidential election, 2015 (2015 Burundian unrest)
• Belarusian presidential election, 2015
• Tanzanian general election, 2015
• Azerbaijani parliamentary election, 2015
• Turkish general election, November 2015
• Myanmar general election, 2015
• Armenian constitutional referendum, 2015^[31]
• Ugandan general election, 2016
• Republic of the Congo presidential election, 2016
• Djiboutian presidential election, 2016
• Chadian presidential election, 2016
• Equatorial Guinean presidential election, 2016
• Serbian parliamentary election, 2016 (results disputed by opposition)
• Zambian general election, 2016
• Gabonese presidential election, 2016

SAUCE

Notice something?

The frequency by which the votes are contested increase in the latter years.

Scimi

Forget voting, prepare for the Imaam.

That's the angle I'm playing out.

And Allah knows best.

Scimi

everyone wants a fatwa nowadays ,it does make us look like aliens once again,a fatwa for everything

our wise elder ulema ..if you vote dont criticise those that dont
if you dont vote..dont criticise those that do..
in fact why tell anyone,its your own business
and like much else,between you and allah,no one else

format_quote Originally Posted by AHMED PATEL

everyone wants a fatwa nowadays ,it does make us look like aliens once again,a fatwa for everythingour wise elder ulema ..if you vote dont criticise those that dontif you dont vote..dont criticise those that do..in fact why tell anyone,its your own businessand like much else,between you and allah,no one else

We should see what is good for us and our Muslims society especially if we live in a non Muslim country

format_quote Originally Posted by azc

why do you separate voting and campaign..?

…because I remember reading somewhere that the best man for the job is one who is able to do it (but perhaps shy to actually offer) and not one who actively seeks the post. So, when someone actively 'campaigns' to seek votes is often not because of the task at hand that needs to be done 'properly', but more for the power it wields.. (so effect, the campaigning part often sells lots of untruths).