Soon the river "Euphrates" will disclose the treasure (the mountain) of gold

format_quote Originally Posted by Scimitar

If you're premise was solid, the scholars would not be speaking on the topic either - claiming dhul qarnayn could be x y or z from the historical records.

A plethora of scholars and doctors are all wrong to investigate the truth of the Quran according to you bro.

I told you in my post - Allahu alam. But you are ignorant of this fundamental caveat I place on myself.

Thank you for demonstrating your concern although it is unwarranted

Scimi

I never said nobody should talk about it. Logically speaking if we shouldn't have talked about, then Allah(swt) would not even have revealed some information about it. For example, nothing has been revealed about the soul. So there is nothing to talk about or investigate as you will also not come to know something about it.

So in this case, investigate for sure, but never go in with two feet so to say. 50/50..oke..60/40..oke even 99.9/0.1 oke..but not 100/0..Which will bring us in the same category as that guy who argued that dajjal doesn't exist because he himself didn't explicitly see "dajjal" written somewhere =_=!. He just went 100/0 o_O!..

This same errors atheist also make. They go 100/0, while agnostics keep their option always open which is a more rational and logical way to do. Muslims have gone 100/0 with Islam, but this is based on logic, rationality and reason WITH evidence. So there is no reason to not go 100% in. Every argument against Islam is being refuted every time. So again no reason to not go 100% in.

format_quote Originally Posted by M.I.A.

dont covet your own soul? badly paraphrased.

although make of it what you will.

...dont go nutz over it.. i probably misremembered it anyway.


i have no idea about the thread topic? join the end of the que...

no, im kidding..

no idea.

You know what i mean with "nothing has been revealed about the soul" =_=!.

format_quote Originally Posted by Scimitar

first pascals wager, when that failed due to your realization that you are grasping at straws, you attempted to compare investigating what the soul is (something even science doesn't recognize) to historical truths, based o the Qur'an, with clues in the Torah and the facts in the Histories of old...

...Bro Simple_Person, do one thing.

Think real carefully about what you write next, because you are proving yourself to be not as smart as you think.

Scimi

Hahaha, you really think that i try to "win" this? What will i achieve by "winning" this discussion? Will i get a big medal for it? Or a higher place in paradise? =_=! I do not care about "winning" a discussion because a discussion is not about winning. It is about truth. Sometimes person X might hold the truth, sometimes person Y holds the truth, sometimes it is the balanced combination of both of their perspectives and sometimes a unbalances combination of both of the perspectives.

Funny thing is you hold history in a very high regard. A year or so i saw a documentary series about a historian who went to find out about Prophet Muhammad(saws). He had not even one piece of evidence that Prophet Muhammad really had existed besides people stories and writings such as hadith and Qur'an that TALK about him. That sub'han'Allah gave me even a "sub'han'Allah" moment. Because NOTHING matters about Rasullah(saws) except the Qur'an and his sunnah.

My argument is very simple is to not throw yourself completely in it without proof that gives you 0 doubt that it could be otherwise, however whatever example i use..for you to understand what i am trying to say isn't in my capabilities. It is up to Allah(swt).

So if you want to believe that yajuj and majuj with 100% conviction have already been let lose be my guest. It is that i wouldn't be able to sleep because of it =_=!.

So no more discussion is needed i guess.

Peace

well its just concepts.. probably a few other references to it also.. but its not something that is literal and easy to grasp..or unmistakeably understood.

in most interpretations of it.. is probably some error.

so yeah.. i know what ya meant.

its just as confusing to think about the barrier as a physical entity.. although its specifically described as such..

im suprised its not been a feature point of the world at any time in history.

format_quote Originally Posted by M.I.A.

well its just concepts.. probably a few other references to it also.. but its not something that is literal and easy to grasp..or unmistakeably understood.

in most interpretations of it.. is probably some error.

so yeah.. i know what ya meant.

its just as confusing to think about the barrier as a physical entity.. although its specifically described as such..

im suprised its not been a feature point of the world at any time in history.

Well there was hadith that i have read or heard that a sahabi has seen it with his own eyes and Rasullah(saws) confirmed it that indeed it was the barrier. Correct me if i am wrong and if you guys also have heard about this hadith you sure know where to find this hadith. Me and google = +1 but me and google searching for ahadith = drama.

format_quote Originally Posted by Scimitar

Wait bro, serious questioin. Do you hear voices? I'm asking because I did not make this about winning or losing, but the investigation of truth - why are you all like "Hahaha, you really think that I am trying to win this.." nonsense?

Bro, if you need help with stuff, like stopping those voices in your head - PM me, in sha Allah I can help you.




Indeed.

But I also find your overly afraid nature doesn't let you investigate "truth" as is evident in your weak responses here.

Let me put you in a situation and tell you how you would react, according to what you have written in this thread so far in sha Allah.

A Non Muslim asks you "your Qur'an claims a man called Dhul Qarnayn travelled to the ends of the earth and built a wall out of iron and copper to hold back the nations of Gog and Magog. I have a few questions:

1) Dhul Qarnayn means two horned in the literal sense - does this mean you venerate satan? because satan has two horns"

you will answer "Hello non Muslim, my Qur'an says he is called two horn so we believe it - and do not attempt to know who that was in history because God didn't reveal that to us"

He responds with "Ah, that's probably because you worship the devil.

2) My next question as a non Muslim reading the Qur'an is about this wall of iron. We've managed to map the world with satellites and all sorts of tech today, but where is this wall and where are the billions of Gog Magogs?"

you will respond with "Allahu Alam - some scholars say they are underground in a hollow earth type dwelling while others..." here you lose his interest as he thinks he is talking to a moron.

He doesn't even ask you his third and fourth questions. Instead he goes away with his own bias confirmed because you could not answer him due to your inability to actually follow "truth".

So don't talk to me about truth bro. You compromise your understanding of "truth".

This is who you are Simple_Person - a simpleton who doesn't know how answer the questions of the non Muslims because you claim "we do not know" and that is that.

Bro, honestly speaking with concern leaking my fingers onto this keyboard - get a grip. You aint representing any intellectual discourse with your escapist ideas.

Scimi

I guess digging long enough the arrogance of people if they have some dwelling ..will surface eventually. That might be the reason that you haven't understood my argument whatsoever. I will leave this discussion with this, as sheytan right now is finding it very amusing to create conflict.

May Allah keep us on the straight path. Ameen.

format_quote Originally Posted by M.I.A.

...well it cant JUST be physical can it? if it renews or is forgotten every day.

Well i was thinking about something like lava/ice/snow or something in that direction. As every night in case of ice it would freeze. In case of lava it would become stone again. This is speaking from nature kind of perspective you could say..or you have other things in mind?

format_quote Originally Posted by Scimitar

Bro, this is why you need to study the ologies to know how to understand truths.



You understood nothing about geology.

Scimi

I have heard this barrier was vertical.. i have heard this barrier was horizontal. I have heard that it might be between the Black sea and Caspian sea. I don't know as many claim this and claim that.

In case of things that change overnight so to say, i am aware of ice for sure. or lava when we talk about psychical barriers. Some times we investigate things so deeply, while the answer is right under our noses, but if Allah(swt) doesn't want you to see it..you will not be able to see it.

format_quote Originally Posted by M.I.A.

i dont know? could only speculate..

it not of any benifit..

all praise is due to allah swt..

you know with him is everything.

no idea of noahs ark.

...or how people could lose the best weapon on earth.. in the ark of the covenant?

and god knows how many other things..

its amazing.

seriously we are like ants on the face of the world although we would think otherwise.

under the right conditions anything is possible.

If Allah(swt) doesn't want something, you cannot work against it. I often think about the people of the cave. They tried to stay hidden after they woke up. However Allah(swt) says we caused them to be found. So whatever you do, it is not up to you. Do your best and the rest is up to Allah(swt) if He wills it or not. I mean even the fact of we having technology to investigate this and that..however still much cannot be found. Although i do believe that much is known, but people controlling this and that don't want the masses to know.

Which comes down to..investigate but Allah(swt) grants you whatever He wants to grant you to know and understand.

format_quote Originally Posted by Scimitar

Here you go sister: https://www.islamicboard.com/-ilm-kn...l-qarnayn.html

Scimi

Thank you, this is a very insightful thread. May Allah reward you for sharing your knowledge.

format_quote Originally Posted by IARLG

Asalaam alykum, you listen to imran Hosein too right?

I might not be directly replying to your question but i would like to provide you with new info on Gog and Magog. I will give you links to articles which you can download for free at the bottom of the page and they contain more details on Gog and Magog which are not mainly known and which we wish to make known.

For example we must go through everything the children of Israel went through. Eg Musa left Harun the Khalifa (amr) in his absence and the people broke it up just like how we were left a system of khilafa and we broke it up. Harun and the believers were forced to be in a shirk society and we are also now without a leader forced to be in a shirk society. They stayed in that state for 40 nights and we have to stay in this state since the Prophet's absence for 40 days (of Dajjal). [This is just a sample of the extra info but you got to read the following articles to understand and get more knowledge In Shaa Allah]


http://aljumaareminder.com/reminder/3767/

http://aljumaareminder.com/reminder/...muharram-1438/

http://aljumaareminder.com/reminder/...th-safar-1438/

http://aljumaareminder.com/reminder/...th-safar-1438/

http://aljumaareminder.com/reminder/...th-safar-1438/

http://aljumaareminder.com/reminder/...th-safar-1438/

http://aljumaareminder.com/reminder/...bi-awwal-1438/

Some people say they are let lose already, some say they are not let lose. "The first of them will pass the lake of Tiberius (i.e., the Sea of Galilee) and drink out of it. And when the last of them passes, he will say: There was once water there. ..”

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-4289894/Sea-Galilee-water-level-lowest-century.html

If the last of them passes, means he has already been there out of memory right? It could be off course like me visiting your house and seeing a tree in your garden. 10 years later i visit and i see no more tree, because you have cut it down 5 years earlier. About yajuj and majuj i haven't pondered that much about yet as Imran Hossein himself often is more focused on the alliance between Muslims and rum(which i also agree with him that the chance Russian being rum, instead of the Europeans). Muslims have never really been allied with the Russians as far as i can remember. Because the corrupt Ottomans attacked them and took much from that what did not belong to the Muslims. Then WW1 started, during that era the Muslim world was rather friends with the west. WW2 started and more countries that by majority were Muslims joined western alliance. Back in the 80's with USSR and Afghanistan ..also no alliance with them. Just in the recent 1-2 years countries have seen the face of western countries and slowly are seeking alliance with the Russians. Iran was already allies with them including Syria. However you now also see many Arab countries seek alliance with Russia. This again as far as my memory goes about history i have not known any alliance with the Russians. The Russians are also not really allies with the Zionist, because they have acknowledged that Bolshevik revolution was done by Zionist Jews.

But anyway about the comment.

If the lake is drying up, then logically would one indeed argue that they already have started to drink from it. I haven't read all your links yet, but Jazakallahu khairan very informative and beneficial knowledge.

format_quote Originally Posted by Serinity

What is interesting is that The Prophet prohibited us from taking any of the gold. I wonder, why?

And Allah knows best.

wrwb

Might be this hadith gives a reason here

Bukhari :: Book 4 :: Volume 53 :: Hadith 385

Narrated 'Amr bin 'Auf Al-Ansari:
(who was an ally of Bam 'Amr bin Lu'ai and one of those who had taken part in (the Ghazwa of) Badr): Allah's Apostle sent Abu 'Ubaida bin Al-Jarreh to Bahrain to collect the Jizya. Allah's Apostle had established peace with the people of Bahrain and appointed Al-'Ala' bin Al-Hadrami as their governor. When Abu 'Ubaida came from Bahrain with the money, the Ansar heard of Abu 'Ubaida's arrival which coincided with the time of the morning prayer with the Prophet. When Allah's Apostle led them in the morning prayer and finished, the Ansar approached him, and he looked at them and smiled on seeing them and said, "I feel that you have heard that Abu. 'Ubaida has brought something?" They said, "Yes, O Allah's Apostle' He said, "Rejoice and hope for what will please you! By Allah, I am not afraid of your poverty but I am afraid that you will lead a life of luxury as past nations did, whereupon you will compete with each other for it, as they competed for it, and it will destroy you as it destroyed them."

note

We can also see some get arrogant and go astray only because of TOO MUCH wealth finally will lead to destruction .